VLATKO VUKOVIC's autosomal!

[Jana]

Ja živim na granici sa Hrvatskom i znam puno Hrvata.

Hrvati su kulturno potpuno drugačiji narod dok Srbi, Makedonci, Crnogorci su drugačiji

Hrvati su ko Austrijanci nekakav odsutan i letargičan narod... uopste ne razumijem ni njihov humor, ništa ... kao da se nikad ni poznavali nismo.


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Hrvati iz Like i Dalmatinske Zagore pa i Posavine takvi nisu. Makedonci slični Bosancima (sva 3 naroda) mentalitetom ? Baš....

[Jana]

Btw, sve te grupe imaju svoj poseban mentalitet koji nije previše sličan.

[Vlatko Vukovic]

Razlika u mentalitetu je plod politike kroz historiju. Zapadna katolička Evropa i Istočna pravoslavna Evropa moraju imati različite mentalitete kroz svoju populaciju. Međutim, to nema veze sa genetikom niti porijeklom.

[Vlatko Vukovic]

Ja živim na granici sa Hrvatskom i znam puno Hrvata.

Hrvati su kulturno potpuno drugačiji narod dok Srbi, Makedonci, Crnogorci su drugačiji

Hrvati su ko Austrijanci nekakav odsutan i letargičan narod... uopste ne razumijem ni njihov humor, ništa ... kao da se nikad ni poznavali nismo.


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Hrvat će uzeti vino, a Srbin i Balija će sasuti rakiju ili vodku. To se zna i uvijek se znalo. Ali, kako rekoh prije, to nema veze sa porijeklom stanovništva.

[Vlatko Vukovic]

Gencove's results:

https://api.urlbox.io/v1/HHGDoabb0j826zzr/f9c343012816151f6abd27ed0983d4c4a1b6a816/png?url=https%3A%2F%2Fhd-img-ancestry.gencove.com%2F%23%2Fuser%2F67a0af26-079e-41ee-8310-642d5158d8ea%3Fv%3D4%26c%3Dfc04656f&width=2100&height=1440&wait_for=%23url2png-cheese

[Leto]

European Russia is also heavily mongoloid mixed,.
Bro, don't you ever talk about that. You score some Siberian and some South Asian yourself, so shut up. I have copied all your results - Eurogenes, Dodecad, Harappa, etc. You are not Western, even less than the Hungarian reference on Eurogenes. In fact your first population is MOLDOVA, lol.

[Leto]

You are a typical Slavic-Turkish mix you get
See the GEDmatch results, genius. He's nothing like the Turks. He plots between Serbia and Western Ukraine.

[Leto]

Btw, look at your au results - you are not pure, you are a hybrid.
So, what sense it has?

Я русский и северовосточный европеец, а не "гибрид", так что иди в задницу. Национализм не предполагает 100% "расовую чистоту" до 7-го колена, хотя у меня все известные предки русские и белорусы (тоже русские по сути).

[Leto]

On a semi-related sidenote, gotta love how some members literally fawn over northern plotting in calcutardism.


LOOK AT THIS COUNTRYMANE OF MINE HE S SO NORTGERNNN ON GEDFUCK K14-88 WOAH!111
Actually not. We say so because here South Slavs are not even considered as Slavic by some members. And Vlatko's results go to show that he is not really "an assimilated Illyrian" or whatever else.

[Vlatko Vukovic]

Actually not. We say so because here South Slavs are not even considered as Slavic by some members. And Vlatko's results go to show that he is not really "an assimilated Illyrian" or whatever else.

Who cares what fucktards from this forum thinks, since they even don't know how to define Slavs. If all are assimilated Illyrians, how 60% of Balkan is speaking Slavic languages, from the sky maybe.

[Leto]

Mongols settled in Russia, Persia, Anatolia, China, .. pretty much everywhere.

They had hundreds of thousands horse mounted soldiers who moved from location to location (BUT NEVER HAD HOME)

And Yes Russia is full of Mongols (Russians don't deny that)
They didn't settle in Russia. In fact Russian princes (knyaz) had to go to the Horde to obtain a license to rule. If we had a signigicant amount of Mongol admixture, the most common haplogroups in Mongolia - C and O wouldn't be present at such a low level - less than 1%. Another funny thing - the most "mongoloid" ethnic Russians are actually in the North which wasn't affected by the Mongols.

[Kouros]

Vlatko ignore these idiots calling you Turkish or whatever, your results look perfectly fine.

[Vlatko Vukovic]

Vlatko ignore these idiots calling you Turkish or whatever, your results look perfectly fine.

Just 1 guy said that, no one else.

[Vlatko Vukovic]

They didn't settle in Russia. In fact Russian princes (knyaz) had to go to the Horde to obtain a license to rule. If we had a signigicant amount of Mongol admixture, the most common haplogroups in Mongolia - C and O wouldn't be present at such a low level - less than 1%. Another funny thing - the most "mongoloid" ethnic Russians are actually in the North which wasn't affected by the Mongols.

Don't listen Bosniaks about Russian history, they are pretty uneducated about this area. :) They think that Mongols came in Moscow in every house and rape Russians, becouse they read it from some German site.

[Kouros]

Just 1 guy said that, no one else.

My bad, I thought there were people in this thread calling you mongol and shit too.

[Leto]

Who cares what fucktards from this forum thinks, since they even don't know how to define Slavs. If all are assimilated Illyrians, how 60% of Balkan is speaking Slavic languages, from the sky maybe.
To me it's clear that the closer to Central Europe, the more Early Slavic ancestry. Bulgaria seems to have the least, but even they are not just "assimilated".

People in real life usually don't know shit, they just repeat some myths. Russians are mixed with Mongols, Serbs and Bulgarians are mixed with Turks, the Spanish are mixed with Moors/Arabs, etc. Many even believe Southern Europe is darker than Northern because of race-mixing.

[Leto]

Don't listen Bosniaks about Russian history, they are pretty uneducated about this area. :) They think that Mongols came in Moscow in every house and rape Russians, becouse they read it from some German site.
Well, we were told the same by a Communist history teacher. So were my parents.

[Vlatko Vukovic]

My bad, I thought there were people in this thread calling you mongol and shit too.

The only thing which could be related from my results with Mongoloids is 1.65% Siberian. West Asian usually is not Mongoloid.

[Leto]

The only thing which could be related from my results with Mongoloids is 1.65% Siberian. West Asian usually is not Mongoloid.
1-2% mongoloid can be commonly found as far as Central Europe, that's nothing special. For example, Stears is over 2% mongoloid, I've seen Slovaks having the same amount.

[Vlatko Vukovic]

1-2% mongoloid can be commonly found as far as Central Europe, that's nothing special. For example, Stears is over 2% mongoloid, I've seen Slovaks having the same amount.

Stears is claiming that he is 0% mongoloid.

[EdwardS]

I am sure that i am more European than this Russian troll. He would score Kipchak mongoloid admixture if he do the test.

Are you more European? Do you know that Albanians and Bosnians are not classical Europeans? If they are not genetic then the culture and mentality is the heirs of the Ottomans!

[EdwardS]

can't have more Turan than this:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/98/Vladimir_Putin_%282017-07-08%29.jpg

fuck est baltid its not mongoloid! this is an Eastern European Cro-Magnon type! Finno-Ugric types are laзpid, Uralid and other! Some Finno-Ugrians have eastern Baltid but not the base!

[Vlatko Vukovic]

Are you more European? Do you know that Albanians and Bosnians are not classical Europeans? If they are not genetic then the culture and mentality is the heirs of the Ottomans!

Russians Cossacks are East European copy of Turkic horsemen and you Russians are know that, they're based on ancient Turkish riders.


mentality is the heirs of the Ottomans!

Our mentality is totally opposite of Ottomans. You aren't familiar with Balkan reallity.

[EdwardS]

Bro, don't you ever talk about that. You score some Siberian and some South Asian yourself, so shut up. I have copied all your results - Eurogenes, Dodecad, Harappa, etc. You are not Western, even less than the Hungarian reference on Eurogenes. In fact your first population is MOLDOVA, lol.

Товарищ бульбаш какие бы генны не были у балканских недославян они идейные наследники чурок!

[Leto]

Are you more European? Do you know that Albanians and Bosnians are not classical Europeans? If they are not genetic then the culture and mentality is the heirs of the Ottomans!
Neither are we 'classical Europeans'. Only the Romance and Germanic peoples are. But wait, I don't even know where you are from.
I agree though that Islam is the product of Turkish occupation.

[EdwardS]

Russians Cossacks are East European copy of Turkic horsemen and you Russians are know that, they're based on ancient Turkish riders.


Our mentality is totally opposite of Ottomans. You aren't familiar with Balkan reallity.

All My Balkan comrades disagree with you about this! Cossacks are not typical Russians! Deal with it! Incidentally, many Cossacks descended from the Balkans!

[EdwardS]

Neither are we 'classical Europeans'. Only the Romance and Germanic peoples are. But wait, I don't even know where you are from.
I agree though that Islam is the product of Turkish occupation.

It does not matter! Or are you a zmagar and a Westerner?

[Leto]

Товарищ бульбаш какие бы генны не были у балканских недославян они идейные наследники чурок!
Чего? Это разве что к албанцам (вообще не славяне) и боснийцам относится. Сербы и болгары - православные. И терпеть не могут турок.

[Vlatko Vukovic]

Cossacks are not typical Russians!

:rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:

[Leto]

It does not matter! Or are you a zmagar and a Westerner?
I am not a Belorussian 'nationalist' that thinks Belarus has nothing to do with Russia. That's ridiculous. However, I'm not a full-blooded Belorussian, only half and I view us all as the descendants of Rus.

[EdwardS]

:rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:

We all know this! If you live in stereotypes this is your problem

[EdwardS]

I am not a Belorussian 'nationalist' that thinks Belarus has nothing to do with Russia. That's ridiculous. However, I'm not a full-blooded Belorussian, only half and I view us all as the descendants of Rus.

молодец..но ты должен знать что россиянам наплевать на болгар..мы только за сербов..все остальные предатели и недославяне(это не я первый высказал эту мысль)

[Leto]

I hate defending Putin, but he has changed somehow over the past two decades. Some even say he may have doppelgangers, but I don't know. Anyway, this is him in 1998-99:
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/d8/Vladimir_Putin_31_December_1999-3.jpg
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/6f/RIAN_archive_100306_Vladimir_Putin%2C_Federal_Secu rity_Service_Director.jpg/391px-RIAN_archive_100306_Vladimir_Putin%2C_Federal_Secu rity_Service_Director.jpg
Not really mongoloid to me.

[Leto]

молодец..но ты должен знать что россиянам наплевать на болгар..мы только за сербов..все остальные предатели и недославяне(это не я первый высказал эту мысль)
Если честно, мне плевать на то, что "россияне" думают. Я не идентифицируюсь с путинско-кадыровским гражданским "патриотизмом". И вообще, панславянство - ерунда, нас мало что объединяет. Чеху ближе австрийцы и венгры культурно, чем русские.

[EdwardS]

Если честно, мне плевать на то, что "россияне" думают. Я не идентифицируюсь с путинско-кадыровским гражданским "патриотизмом". И вообще, панславянство - ерунда, нас мало что объединяет. Чеху ближе австрийцы и венгры культурно, чем русские.

это будет верно! помнишь что говорил Достоевский?
кстати я не троллировал боснийца, а написал что написал это он уже привязался ко мне

[Leto]

это будет верно! помнишь что говорил Достоевский?
кстати я не троллировал боснийца, а написал что написал это он уже привязался ко мне
Надо было прочитать тему, а потом комментировать. Ислам это не раса, полно голубоглазых светлых чеченцев, аварцев, даже афганцы и таджики попадаются (арийская кровь). Я уж молчу про татар, которые по сути восточные европейцы + монголоидная примесь. Кто здесь о культуре и религии говорит? Я сам против ислама и турок не люблю, но для меня правда и объективность превыше всякой идеологии. Чувак явно севернее генетически, чем те же сербы и болгары.

[Bobby Martnen]

Nah, I'm still your opponent, because you're opposed to ethnonationalism and the very idea that race may be important. Mind you that I'm not a Nazi and not even the most radical ethnonationalist. I support the assimilation of foreigners in small numbers.

I feel the same way.

[EdwardS]

Надо было прочитать тему, а потом комментировать. Ислам это не раса, полно голубоглазых светлых чеченцев, аварцев, даже афганцы и таджики попадаются (арийская кровь). Я уж молчу про татар, которые по сути восточные европейцы + монголоидная примесь. Кто здесь о культуре и религии говорит? Я сам против ислама и турок не люблю, но для меня правда и объективность превыше всякой идеологии. Чувак явно севернее генетически, чем те же сербы и болгары.

мне встречались сербы с подобной схемой!

[Leto]

I feel the same way.
Well, full-blown civic 'nationalism' doesn't make sense. I mean having some foreigners and some assimilation is okay, but saying that a nation can be based solely on some idea or whatever is ridiculous, 'cause you can't put different races, cultures and religions together, give them a constitution and expect them to feel close to each other despite having nothing in common. Race, culture, religion, history are still very important things.

[Kelmendasi]

Are you more European? Do you know that Albanians and Bosnians are not classical Europeans? If they are not genetic then the culture and mentality is the heirs of the Ottomans!
Oh just stop it. Religion isn't the same as culture anyways there are plenty of non-Muslim Albanians and Bosnians

[Leto]

Oh just stop it. Religion isn't the same as culture anyways there are plenty of non-Muslim Albanians and Bosnians
I stand with Orthodox Albanians. There was a fantastic Orthodox Albanian guy called Herr Abubu, too bad he is gone (forever?).

[Kelmendasi]

I stand with Orthodox Albanians. There was a fantastic Orthodox Albanian guy called Herr Abubu, too bad he is gone (forever?).
What about us catholics ;)......I think he got a permanent ban

[Leto]

What about us catholics ;)......
Not bad either, but personally I especially identify with Orthodox people.

I think he got a permanent ban
That's bad news!

[EdwardS]

Oh just stop it. Religion isn't the same as culture anyways there are plenty of non-Muslim Albanians and Bosnians

I saw on some American maps that Albanians and Bosnians are known as non-Europeans!

[Vlatko Vukovic]

I saw on some American maps that Albanians and Bosnians are known as non-Europeans!

Americans are not Europeans. So why you are looking on their maps?

[EdwardS]

Americans are not Europeans. So why you are looking on their maps?

Just interesting opinions how others look at us! xD

[Vlatko Vukovic]

Eurogenes Hunter_Gatherer vs. Farmer Admixture Proportions

Population
Anatolian Farmer 15.27
Baltic Hunter Gatherer 51.09
Middle Eastern Herder 4.73
East Asian Farmer -
South American Hunter Gatherer 0.85
South Asian Hunter Gatherer -
North Eurasian Hunter Gatherer 1.16
East African Pastoralist -
Oceanian Hunter Gatherer -
Mediterranean Farmer 26.56
Pygmy Hunter Gatherer 0.29
Bantu Farmer -

[Stears]

Bro, don't you ever talk about that. You score some Siberian and some South Asian yourself, so shut up. I have copied all your results - Eurogenes, Dodecad, Harappa, etc. You are not Western, even less than the Hungarian reference on Eurogenes. In fact your first population is MOLDOVA, lol.


Only in your fantasy. Belorussians have mongoloid markers, and they are closer to the asian nations in the autosomal coordinates: http://dienekes.blogspot.hu/2012/07/hints-of-eastcentral-asian-admixture-in.html

But it is normal, you are eastern people, eastern semi-asian culture (orthodox), eastern balloon heads etc....

[Bosniensis]

Only in your fantasy. Belorussians have mongoloid markers, and they are closer to the asian nations in the autosomal coordinates: http://dienekes.blogspot.hu/2012/07/hints-of-eastcentral-asian-admixture-in.html

But it is normal, you are eastern people, eastern semi-asian culture (orthodox), eastern balloon heads etc....

Are you Stearsolina?

[itilvolga]

Congratz, i bet you are hella proud of your ancestors now :lol:

[SerbianGod]

Only in your fantasy. Belorussians have mongoloid markers, and they are closer to the asian nations in the autosomal coordinates: http://dienekes.blogspot.hu/2012/07/hints-of-eastcentral-asian-admixture-in.html

But it is normal, you are eastern people, eastern semi-asian culture (orthodox), eastern balloon heads etc....

Hungarians more mongol than balkans according to your graph

[Yaglakar]

Congratz, i bet you are hella proud of your ancestors now :lol:

Indeed, this is the zone of eastern forest peoples. He should be proud of Oghuric Avars who spread the language that he speaks in the Balkans as well as later Oghuric Khazars who laid the foundation future Varangian (Viking) Kievan Rus by founding the city of Kiev and accustoming early Slavs to state foundation and political organization.

[Yaglakar]

Turks have not civilized anyone, they were civilized by others lmfao. Even Slavs were more organized and ended up destroying all of them in the Steppes topkek.

You occupy the opposite radical spectrum of Bori. The entire steppe was Turkic since 5 century AD. Slavs eventually overwhelmed Turks with muskets and technology they got from Western Europe. Due to your bias, you constantly refer to Turks as a bunch of nomads failing to acknowledge that Turkic khaganates and smaller polities employed various writing systems, established cities and built fortresses all across the Steppes. Why don't you call Scythians a bunch of pillaging nomads? Early Slavic polities in the East were established by Vikings. The city of Kiev itself was founded by Khazars who built a fortress there. Thus the Greek name Sambatas from Turkic Sambat aka 'high fortress'. State foundation and political organization was brought by Turks to Eastern Europe. Obviously, the culture of Turks was no match for Meditarranean or Chinese ones, but far more advanced than that of Eastern or Northern Europe or that of Scythians who lost the Steppes to Turks and were absorbed by various Turkic groups.

[Pahli]

You occupy the opposite radical spectrum of Bori. The entire steppe was Turkic since 5 century AD. Slavs eventually overwhelmed Turks with muskets and technology they got from Western Europe. Due to your bias, you constantly refer to Turks as a bunch of nomads failing to acknowledge that Turkic khaganates and smaller polities employed various writing systems, established cities and built fortresses all across the Steppes. Why don't you call Scythians a bunch of pillaging nomads? Early Slavic polities in the East were established by Vikings. The city of Kiev itself was founded by Khazars who built a fortress there. Thus the Greek name Sambatas from Turkic Sambat aka 'high fortress'. State foundation and political organization was brought by Turks to Eastern Europe. Obviously, the culture of Turks was no match for Meditarranean or Chinese ones, but far more advanced than that of Eastern or Northern Europe or that of Scythians who lost the Steppes to Turks and were absorbed by various Turkic groups.

Because we're not talking about Scythians here, if it was the case I would have said the same because they were degenerate as fuck culturally compared to Persians. I merely called him out and said he was wrong, and he is. Look up history, slavery was still a thing among Turkic people up til the late 19th century, only abolished by the invading Russians, Turkic "advanced" culture didn't last very long because they didn't modernize, by the time they were conquered by others they were still 500 years behind culturally engaging in mass slavery and raiding. So its not a bias I carry here, its facts.

[The Illyrian Warrior]

Are you more European? Do you know that Albanians and Bosnians are not classical Europeans? If they are not genetic then the culture and mentality is the heirs of the Ottomans!

Genetically we are 0% East Asian or 0% non European, you Russians are 3% East Asian or more, by default we are more European than a Russian, however race itself is a designation made by humans based on religious or culture criteria mostly, I careless what our mentality may look to others to be honest, I think Orthodox religion is most backward religion but you will disagree with it, so the impressions are mutual.

[Yaglakar]

Because we're not talking about Scythians here, if it was the case I would have said the same because they were degenerate as fuck culturally compared to Persians. I merely called him out and said he was wrong, and he is. Look up history, slavery was still a thing among Turkic people up til the late 19th century, only abolished by the invading Russians, Turkic "advanced" culture didn't last very long because they didn't modernize, by the time they were conquered by others they were still 500 years behind culturally engaging in mass slavery and raiding. So its not a bias I carry here, its facts.

Yet another bias. Slavery was rampant all around world except Western Europe. Russian serfdom is a form slavery.

[Pahli]

Yet another bias. Slavery was rampant all around world except Western Europe. Russian serfdom is a form slavery.

I'm giving you examples, it's not a bias. Why do I have to mention the whole world's slavery problem? We're talking about Turks here, fact is; If it wasn't for the Russians the slavery in Central Asia could have continued for longer time when it was already abolished in most parts of the world. Russian serfdom was abolished in 1861 by the way.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_slavery_in_Asia#Central_Asia_and_the_Ca ucasus;

"When the Russian troops took Khiva in 1898 there were 29,300 Persian slaves, captured by Turkoman raiders. According of Josef Wolff (Report of 1843–1845) the population of the Khanate of Bukhara was 1,200,000, of whom 200,000 were Persian slaves.[95]"

Go educate yourself, and stop being offended by facts.

[Yaglakar]

I don't understand why you try to push your agenda as if you are significant or if you have a big impact on the European culture and history...
Even if that's true what you are saying, no one remembers the Avars or the Huns here, but people are identifying as Slavs and are speaking Slavic languages.
Also there is almost no Turkic DNA in these people and on top of that the Russians took over more than a half of your land in Asia...
And by the way the Balkan Slavs got culture from the Byzantines and the Franks not from the Turkics, of course if you don't count the recently islamised Bosnia's.

The message was not for you. It was for Vlatko, Leto and Pahli. You did not get culture from Byzantines. Your ancestors as vassals of Oghuric Avars pillaged Romans. That is how proto-Slavic language spread in the Balkans. Plus you are a Macedonian which is not really Europe. I don't care about DNA.

https://i.imgur.com/yzJhGYq.png

Kurt Jonassohn. 1998. Genocide and Gross Human Rights Violations. Routledge

[MalinBot]

I careless what our mentality may look to others to be honest, I think Orthodox religion is most backward religion but you will disagree with it, so the impressions are mutual.

You can't call backwards orthodox/christians when you come from a muslim country and are most likely muslim.

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/252132842266558464/420575874891382784/1439281673858.jpg
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/252132842266558464/420575880679784458/1447481920691.png
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/252132842266558464/420575884467109908/1447482119187.png
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/252132842266558464/420575885041729536/1447880287359.jpg
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/252132842266558464/420575885750435841/1447482179682.png


When the Muslim population remains under 2% in a country, they will be seen primarily as a peace-loving minority and not as a threat to other citizens. This is the current situation in:

United States — Muslim 0.6%

Australia — Muslim 1.5%

Canada — Muslim 1.9%

China — Muslim 1.8%

Italy — Muslim 1.5%

Norway — Muslim 1.8%

As the Muslim population reaches 2% to 5%, they begin to recruit from ethnic minorities and disaffected groups, within prisons and street gangs. This is happening in:

Denmark — Muslim 2%

Germany — Muslim 3.7%

United Kingdom — Muslim 2.7%

Spain — Muslim 4%

Thailand — Muslim 4.6%

“From 5% on, they exercise an inordinate influence in proportion to their percentage of the population,” Dr. Hammond notes. “For example, they will push for the introduction of halal (clean by Islamic standards) food” and increase pressure on supermarket chains to feature such food on their shelves — along with threats for failure to comply. This is happening in:

France — Muslim 8%

Philippines — 5%

Sweden — Muslim 5%

Switzerland — Muslim 4.3%

The Netherlands — Muslim 5.5%

Trinidad & Tobago — Muslim 5.8%

Soon they begin to apply pressure to allow Sharia law within their own communities (sometimes ghettos).

“When Muslims approach 10% of the population, they tend to increase lawlessness as a means of complaint about their conditions,” Dr. Hammond notes. “In Paris, we are already seeing car-burnings. Any non-Muslim action offends Islam, and results in uprisings and threats, such as in Amsterdam, with opposition to Mohammed cartoons and films about Islam.” These tensions are seen on a regular basis in:

Guyana — Muslim 10%

Riots in Pakistan, 2013
Riots in Pakistan, 2013
India — Muslim 13.4%

Israel — Muslim 16%

Kenya — Muslim 10%

Russia — Muslim 15%

The violence increases when the Muslim population reaches 20%. “After reaching 20%, nations can expect hair-trigger rioting, jihad militia formations, sporadic killings, and the burnings of Christian churches and Jewish synagogues,” such as in:

Ethiopia — Muslim 32.8%

“At 40%, nations experience widespread massacres, chronic terror attacks, and ongoing militia warfare,” such as in:

Bosnia — Muslim 40%

Chad — Muslim 53.1%

Lebanon — Muslim 59.7%

From 60%, persecution of non-believing “infidels” rises significantly, including sporadic ethnic cleansing (genocide), use of Sharia law as a weapon, and Jizya, a tax placed on infidels, such as in:

Albania — Muslim 70%

Malaysia — Muslim 60.4%

Qatar — Muslim 77.5%

Sudan — Muslim 70%

After 80%, expect daily intimidation and violent jihad, some State-run ethnic cleansing, and even some genocide, as these nations drive out “infidels,” and move toward a 100% Muslim society, which has been experienced to some degree in:

Bangladesh — Muslim 83%

Egypt — Muslim 90%

Gaza — Muslim 98.7%

Indonesia — Muslim 86.1%

Iran — Muslim 98%

Iraq — Muslim 97%

Jordan — Muslim 92%

Morocco — Muslim 98.7%

Pakistan — Muslim 97%

Palestine — Muslim 99%

Syria — Muslim 90%

Tajikistan — Muslim 90%

Turkey — Muslim 99.8%

United Arab Emirates — Muslim 96%

A 100% Muslim society will theoretically usher in their version of peace — the peace of ‘Dar-es-Salaam’ — the Islamic House of Peace. “Here there’s supposed to be peace, because everybody is a Muslim, the Madrassas are the only schools, and the Koran is the only word,” such as in:

Afghanistan — Muslim 100%

Saudi Arabia — Muslim 100%

Somalia — Muslim 100%

Yemen — Muslim 100%

[Yaglakar]

I'm giving you examples, it's not a bias. Why do I have to mention the whole world's slavery problem? We're talking about Turks here, fact is; If it wasn't for the Russians the slavery in Central Asia could have continued for longer time when it was already abolished in most parts of the world. Russian serfdom was abolished in 1861 by the way.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_slavery_in_Asia#Central_Asia_and_the_Ca ucasus;

"When the Russian troops took Khiva in 1898 there were 29,300 Persian slaves, captured by Turkoman raiders. According of Josef Wolff (Report of 1843–1845) the population of the Khanate of Bukhara was 1,200,000, of whom 200,000 were Persian slaves.[95]"

Go educate yourself, and stop being offended by facts.

You don't get the point do you? Slavery was rampant everywhere except Europe.

" Consequently, by 1870 the trade in African slaves to Iran through the Indian Ocean had been significantly diminished. Although the diplomatic efforts of the Russians and the British did result in a decline in the trade, slavery was still common in Iran under the Qajar dynasty and it was not until the first half of twentieth century that slavery was officially abolished in Iran under Reza Shah Pahlavi." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavery_in_Iran

"Slavery in China has taken various forms throughout history. Slavery was reportedly abolished as a legally recognized institution, including in a 1909 law[1][2] fully enacted in 1910,[3] although the practice continued until at least 1949.[4]" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavery_in_China

All your arguments are normative. Slavery would have been abolished in early 20th century as was the case throughout the world.

[The Illyrian Warrior]

You can't call backwards orthodox/christians when you come from a muslim country and are most likely muslim.

If anything for sake of argument Orthodoxy is one of the least evolved & most primitive kind of christianity, therefore backward in my book and so are countries whom their people practice this religion, I can attest this better than you in America who barely know more than dozen of Orthodox there.

Stats usually can be misused or ill interpreted on the way you like, so I won't really bother to answer one by one.

[MalinBot]

If anything for sake of argument Orthodoxy is one of the least evolved & most primitive kind of christianity, therefore backward in my book and so are countries whom their people practice this religion, I can attest this better than you in America who barely know more than dozen of Orthodox there.

Stats usually can be misused or ill interpreted on the way you like, so I won't really bother to answer one by one.

The Muslim countries are the least developed, even in Balkans.

[The Illyrian Warrior]

The Muslim countries are the least developed, even in Balkans.

During the Ottomans era it was the opposite, so were Muslims in Spain before reconquista, or Arabs before, the convenient momentum for Christians is not a good measurement to draw a final conclusion or good argument to drop my argument in any way.

[Brás Garcia de Mascarenhas]

During the Ottomans era it was the opposite, so were Muslims in Spain before reconquista, or Arabs before, the convenient momentum for Christians is not a good measurement to draw a final conclusion or good argument to drop my argument in any way.

There is a lot of misconception regarding Islamic Spain due to the Western and Anglo-Saxonic narrative being politcally correct regarding that period and not backing themselves on concrete evidence. I would recommend you to read books written by Iberian scholars regarding that period.

https://images.gr-assets.com/books/1450755182l/20256480.jpg


I have this one in Epub, it is in English and it is a good read. If you are interested I can share it with you.

[MalinBot]

During the Ottomans era it was the opposite, so were Muslims in Spain before reconquista, or Arabs before, the convenient momentum for Christians is not a good measurement to draw a final conclusion or good argument to drop my argument in any way.

Thats because christians were opressed and had to pay jizya among other things.Still the only thing the Ottoman empire and all muslim empires brought is destruction.

[Dibran]

.........................

Upload your file to morely and tell us your YDNA prediction. They are usually pretty accurate give or take some inconsistencies.

[Vlatko Vukovic]

Upload your file to morely and tell us your YDNA prediction. They are usually pretty accurate give or take some inconsistencies.

Unfortunatly i can't. It doesn't work.

[The Illyrian Warrior]

Thats because christians were opressed and had to pay jizya among other things.Still the only thing the Ottoman empire and all muslim empires brought is destruction.

The same argument can Muslims use today in Middle East and elsewhere about Christians, what we can conclude today how in past 1000 years power/wealth has gone in to opposite direction, from once Muslim domination in Eurasia to Christian domination, besides, everyone in medieval times were ruthless, what sound Crusades or Inquisition to you? Opposite of Christians, Moors for eg. established quite a progressive and science based society, whereas Christians at that time make ISIS look like a kid from kindergarten.

Today is trendy to scapegoat on Muslims but isn't how you say it.

PS. Sorry for off topic, I won't hijack this thread anymore.

[Dibran]

Unfortunatly i can't. It doesn't work.

Yea, I just noticed :(. That sucks. you should do Y-DNA with Ftdna next. Likely you will be I2a1b-Din, given its high dominance in Bosnia. R1a, and others are also possible.

[Dibran]

He is part Serb from Montenegro and Gorani from Albania iirc

Aren't Gorani basically just a minority slavic tribe that never formed nationhood?

[Vlatko Vukovic]

Yea, I just noticed :(. That sucks. you should do Y-DNA with Ftdna next. Likely you will be I2a1b-Din, given its high dominance in Bosnia. R1a, and others are also possible.

I expect I2a.

[Yaglakar]

I reacted because of the untruth you've said.
Yes, the Byzantines did give part of the Slavs a culture, in both of religion and writing.
That's undeniable fact...
Other Slavs like Croats and Slovenes were influenced by the Franks, hence becoming Catholics and writing in Latin...
And not all the Slavs did come with the Avars, only part of them.
White Croats are Slavs that came later on and annihilated the Avars and took their land...
Also, if you are not interested by genetics than you can not understand the human history and migration that happened during medievals.
Because the language you are speaking doesn't make you necessarily a Turk, a Slav or a Greek...
The culture and the language are just tools for assimilation and the Slavic language in the Balkans was spread not by the Avars, but by the Slavic empires in the Balkans.

Turks are only bound by language and recognition of a common identity. This has been so since the beginning. Congratulations on defeating 20,000 Avars after their century presence in the region. Nothing that I stated is out of limits of academic consensus. Proto-slavs dwelled in dense forests. Turks brought early political organization and principles of state foundation to Eastern Europe and spread proto-Slavic language in the Balkans.

https://i.imgur.com/ijUbDMt.png
J. Brutzkus. 1944. The Khazar Origin of Ancient Kiev. Slavonic and East European Review. American Series

https://i.imgur.com/qEvuP0H.png
Hyun Jin Kim. 2015. The Huns. Routledge

Avars were responsible for the spreading and diffusion of proto-Slavic language in the Balkans and paved the way for later Slavic migrations into the region. This is supported by the bulk of academia.

https://i.imgur.com/15KqFvY.png
Hyun Jin Kim. 2015. The Huns (Peoples of the Ancient World). Routledge

https://i.imgur.com/jUD9h5N.png
T. Kamusella. 2009. The Politics of Language and Nationalism in Modern Central Europe. Palgrave Macmillan

https://i.imgur.com/dM9sLGa.png
Saskia Pronk-Tiethoff. 2013. The Germanic Loanwords in Proto-Slavic. Rodopi

[Vlatko Vukovic]

Congratz, i bet you are hella proud of your ancestors now :lol:

Thank you, and yes, surely i am.

[MalinBot]

The same argument can Muslims use today in Middle East and elsewhere about Christians, what we can conclude today how in past 1000 years power/wealth has gone in to opposite direction, from once Muslim domination in Eurasia to Christian domination, besides, everyone in medieval times were ruthless, what sound Crusades or Inquisition to you? Opposite of Christians, Moors for eg. established quite a progressive and science based society, whereas Christians at that time make ISIS look like a kid from kindergarten.

Today is trendy to scapegoat on Muslims but isn't how you say it.

PS. Sorry for off topic, I won't hijack this thread anymore.

Christians are not opressing Muslims in ME today.
Muslims live today exactly like they lived 1000,2000 years ago.
Muslims were never advanced in their entire history, as for the 300 years of the so called "Islamic Golden Age", it is a myth , stolen technology from Persian, Greek, Egyptian, Byzantine, Syrian, Jewish scholars.Read more https://myislam.dk/articles/en/trifkovic%20t01-the-golden-age-of-islam-is-a-myth.php

https://static2.fjcdn.com/comments/Historically+muslims+have+been+the+aggressive+inva ders+and+historically+christian+_12ab9d7dce9be85ad fc4c23892cf5bee.jpg

[Vlatko Vukovic]

Indeed, this is the zone of eastern forest peoples. He should be proud of Oghuric Avars who spread the language that he speaks in the Balkans as well as later Oghuric Khazars who laid the foundation future Varangian (Viking) Kievan Rus by founding the city of Kiev and accustoming early Slavs to state foundation and political organization.

Where are those Avars? I am still here, and my language speak half Europe. I cognate with Ukrainians genetically which is proof of our autosomal genetical historical relation, and i my results debunked the theory that South Slavs aren't Slavs, but assimilated Thrachians, Illyrians etc..

[Vlatko Vukovic]

You occupy the opposite radical spectrum of Bori. The entire steppe was Turkic since 5 century AD. Slavs eventually overwhelmed Turks with muskets and technology they got from Western Europe. Due to your bias, you constantly refer to Turks as a bunch of nomads failing to acknowledge that Turkic khaganates and smaller polities employed various writing systems, established cities and built fortresses all across the Steppes. Why don't you call Scythians a bunch of pillaging nomads? Early Slavic polities in the East were established by Vikings. The city of Kiev itself was founded by Khazars who built a fortress there. Thus the Greek name Sambatas from Turkic Sambat aka 'high fortress'. State foundation and political organization was brought by Turks to Eastern Europe. Obviously, the culture of Turks was no match for Meditarranean or Chinese ones, but far more advanced than that of Eastern or Northern Europe or that of Scythians who lost the Steppes to Turks and were absorbed by various Turkic groups.

Who cares what somebody establish? Slavs forced their language toward Vikings, toward Finns, toward Turkics and even toward Balts, who lived until Moscow in ancient times. All are assimilated in Russia and speaking Slavic Russian language. Who did it for them? Avars? Vikings?

[Vlatko Vukovic]

Very radical results considering Bosnia's geographical position.

That's normal here. Descedants of Slavic invaders are living there.

[RN97]

What about us catholics ;)......I think he got a permanent ban

You are western, central Europeans. Ask Stears ;)

[Yaglakar]

Where are those Avars? I am still here, and my language speak half Europe. I cognate with Ukrainians genetically which is proof of our autosomal genetical historical relation, and i my results debunked the theory that South Slavs aren't Slavs, but assimilated Thrachians, Illyrians etc..

There you go, Avars and Slavs slaughtered Romans and changed demographics of the region just like I stated earlier. :)

[Vlatko Vukovic]

There you go, Avars and Slavs slaughtered Romans and changed demographics of the region just like I stated earlier. :)

Avars who? Their language dead. The Slavic was lingua franca in Avar Khaganate.

[Dibran]

Christians are not opressing Muslims in ME today.
Muslims live today exactly like they lived 1000,2000 years ago.
Muslims were never advanced in their entire history, as for the 300 years of the so called "Islamic Golden Age", it is a myth , stolen technology from Persian, Greek, Egyptian, Byzantine, Syrian, Jewish scholars.Read more https://myislam.dk/articles/en/trifkovic%20t01-the-golden-age-of-islam-is-a-myth.php

https://static2.fjcdn.com/comments/Historically+muslims+have+been+the+aggressive+inva ders+and+historically+christian+_12ab9d7dce9be85ad fc4c23892cf5bee.jpg

You're actually completely incorrect. The oldest theory of evolution(albeit flawed) was proposed by a Muslim, hundreds if not a thousand years before Darwin. Called the Muhammaden theory of evolution. Also, borrowing from Persian religion is precisely what led to the clusterfuck of all islamic sects today. Most of the "evil muslim boogeyman" beliefs that everyone in the west is so terrified about comes directly from Christian and Persian theology.

If you want to get technical, every major advancement of Christianity was perpetrated by the very people who were against the church and called heretics. Nicholas Copernicus being one. Need I continue?

The advancements of a civilization are owed to its people and culture, not its religious institutions which for most part of human history stood in direct opposition to human advancement.

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/robert-j-asher/did-arabic-scholars-disco_b_11165778.html

[Yaglakar]

Who cares what somebody establish? Slavs forced their language toward Vikings, toward Finns, toward Turkics and even toward Balts, who lived until Moscow in ancient times. All are assimilated in Russia and speaking Slavic Russian language. Who did it for them? Avars? Vikings?

Yes, that happened after the diffusion of superior North-West European civilization and its consequent adoption by Slavs. It happened much later. You are inclining towards 'whataboutism'. We are talking about early history here. Your fellows stated Turks were a bunch of savages. I merely corrected them. :)

[Leto]

Only in your fantasy. Belorussians have mongoloid markers, and they are closer to the asian nations in the autosomal coordinates: http://dienekes.blogspot.hu/2012/07/hints-of-eastcentral-asian-admixture-in.html

But it is normal, you are eastern people, eastern semi-asian culture (orthodox), eastern balloon heads etc....
You're a fucking idiot. I've tried to forgive you somehow, but you're clearly not making any progress. Belorussians are just as white as you and even my mom who is Northern Russian doesn't look any different from an average Eastern European.

Your results:

HarappaWorld

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 NE-Euro 46.67
2 Mediterranean 20.75
3 Caucasian 15.79
4 Baloch 7.97
5 SW-Asian 4.17
6 Siberian 1.28
7 S-Indian 1.2
8 Beringian 1.16
9 American 0.64
10 San 0.38

Lol. Shut the fuck up.

[Vlatko Vukovic]

that happened after the diffusion of superior North-West European

Croats defeated Avars and liberated from their ruling caste, and that's the well-known reallity. Nothing about diffusion of NW Europe...

About Turks they weren't uncivilized, but they were agressive nomadic Horde. What's so weird about it?

[Yaglakar]

Avars who? Their language dead. The Slavic was lingua franca in Avar Khaganate.

Of course it was the lingua-franca in the Khaganate. (although only some scholars support this view) Avars were merely 20,000 men. Under Avar command, Slavic subjects increased their lebenstraum. :)

[MalinBot]

Where are those Avars? I am still here, and my language speak half Europe. I cognate with Ukrainians genetically which is proof of our autosomal genetical historical relation, and i my results debunked the theory that South Slavs aren't Slavs, but assimilated Thrachians, Illyrians etc..

That's normal here. Descedants of Slavic invaders are living there.

Vlatko you are a lot more slavic than the average bosniak,it seems that you have a recent east slav ancestor, the very high caucasus and the high steppe and east asian markers prove it.But it does not matter, because illyrians were indo-europeans and were high in the same 'slavic' admixture.

[Kelmendasi]

I saw on some American maps that Albanians and Bosnians are known as non-Europeans!
I know the map you are talking about, that map shows Albanians and Bosnians under the "Muslim European" category

[Yaglakar]

Croats defeated Avars and liberated from their ruling caste, and that's the well-known reallity. Nothing about diffusion of NW Europe...

About Turks they weren't uncivilized, but they were agressive nomadic Horde. What's so weird about it?

Read posts of academic nature above. Turks who came to Europe were more advanced than Slavs. :)

[MalinBot]

You're actually completely incorrect. The oldest theory of evolution(albeit flawed) was proposed by a Muslim, hundreds if not a thousand years before Darwin. Called the Muhammaden theory of evolution. Also, borrowing from Persian religion is precisely what led to the clusterfuck of all islamic sects today. Most of the "evil muslim boogeyman" beliefs that everyone in the west is so terrified about comes directly from Christian and Persian theology.

If you want to get technical, every major advancement of Christianity was perpetrated by the very people who were against the church and called heretics. Nicholas Copernicus being one. Need I continue?

The advancements of a civilization are owed to its people and culture, not its religious institutions which for most part of human history stood in direct opposition to human advancement.

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/robert-j-asher/did-arabic-scholars-disco_b_11165778.html

Your post is plain irrelevant.Facts are facts.ME countries are alot less advanced than European/East Asian countries because of Islam.Not one Islamic country/Empire achieved anything, all they did is bring war/destruction.For example, even a country like Spain, each year, has more scientific/cultural advancements than all Islamic countries/Empire had in their history, in total.

[Kelmendasi]

Aren't Gorani basically just a minority slavic tribe that never formed nationhood?
There are theories on what their origin is but today they are Slavs and most similar to Macedonians and Bulgarians linguistically iirc. Some theories state that they are Bulgarians whilst others state that they have Albanian roots due to some cultural aspects(some wear the plis/qeleshe for example) but DNA testing will tell us what exactly their origins is

[Stears]

Hungarians more mongol than balkans according to your graph


Open your eyes. In all studies Serbs are both more mongoloid and more MENA, but it is not surprising.

[Leto]

Open your eyes. In all studies Serbs are both more mongoloid and more MENA, but it is not surprising.
Why are you so obsessed with Mongols? You have some Siberian just as lots of other Eastern Europeans. You're not German or English, even your language is originally from Siberia. Needless to say that Hungarians have a lot of Slavic and even Balkan blood (you are literally surrounded by Slavs and Balkan people). As for us, of course Russia has more Asian influence than Central Europe, it's a huge and multiethnic country that spans from the Baltic sea to the Bering sea, but unmixed ethnic Russians even in the North are still over 90% European genetically. We are about 5% East Eurasian on average (including all regions).
By the way, fully mongoloid people like the Japanese, Koreans and Han Chinese have the highest average IQ and create technologically advanced societies.

[Vlatko Vukovic]

Vlatko you are a lot more slavic than the average bosniak,it seems that you have a recent east slav ancestor, the very high caucasus and the high steppe and east asian markers prove it.But it does not matter, because illyrians were indo-europeans and were high in the same 'slavic' admixture.

My "Caucasus" is normal for Balkans. It have average Balkan man, about 18-22%.

I don't have recent East Slavic ancestor for sure. It is just that my ancestors didn't mix a lot with Balkan natives. And that is normal for Bosnia.

[Vlatko Vukovic]

Read posts of academic nature above. Turks who came to Europe were more advanced than Slavs. :)

And Persians were than Steppe Nomads ancestors of Turks? So what? Times are changed. We are now controlling half Europe.

[Leto]

Your post is plain irrelevant.Facts are facts.ME countries are alot less advanced than European/East Asian countries because of Islam.Not one Islamic country/Empire achieved anything, all they did is bring war/destruction.For example, even a country like Spain, each year, has more scientific/cultural advancements than all Islamic countries/Empire had in their history, in total.
Don't argue with Muslim Albanians. They hate Christianity and feel out of place in other European countries. For example, Germans associate Albanians with Islamic people like Turks (not surprising given the amount of fake-ass refugees from Kosovo and Macedonia). They especially hate Serbs and Greeks who happen to be Orthodox Christians. I mean yes Albanians are Europeans genetically but due to the Ottoman cultural influence they were cut off from the rest of Southern Europe (excluding Christian Albanians).

[MercifulServant]

Open your eyes. In all studies Serbs are both more mongoloid and more MENA, but it is not surprising.

Your more mongoloid then me

[Kelmendasi]

Don't argue with Muslim Albanians. They hate Christianity and feel out of place in other European countries. For example, Germans associate Albanians with Islamic people like Turks (not surprising given the amount of fake-ass refugees from Kosovo and Macedonia). They especially hate Serbs and Greeks who happen to be Orthodox Christians. I mean yes Albanians are Europeans genetically but due to the Ottoman cultural influence they were cut off from the rest of Southern Europe (excluding Christian Albanians).
Muslim Albanians don't hate Christianity, Albanians don't care about religion as a whole. Albanians weren't "cut off" from the rest of southern Europe, there are cultural similarities with Albanians and other Balkan countries, people exaggerate how cut off Albanians were.

[MercifulServant]

Where are those Avars? I am still here, and my language speak half Europe. I cognate with Ukrainians genetically which is proof of our autosomal genetical historical relation, and i my results debunked the theory that South Slavs aren't Slavs, but assimilated Thrachians, Illyrians etc..


Your results are very Northern more than the average south slav. In general south slavs are more balkan then slavic

[Jana]

Vlatko you are a lot more slavic than the average bosniak,it seems that you have a recent east slav ancestor, the very high caucasus and the high steppe and east asian markers prove it.But it does not matter, because illyrians were indo-europeans and were high in the same 'slavic' admixture.

What drugs are you on ? His results are typical for Bosnia, it is Vlach influenced Bosniensis that is out of norm, not Vlatko.

[Vlatko Vukovic]

Your results are very Northern more than the average south slav. In general south slavs are more balkan then slavic

Bosniaks are massively more northern shifted becouse Vlachs didn't settle very in Bosnia. Just in some parts. I don't know why is that so hard to understand.

By the way i am not a lot more northern shifted than you. It is not very significant.

[MercifulServant]

Croats, Slovenes and Bosniaks are the exception but other south slavs are more balkan

[MercifulServant]

Bosniaks are massively more northern shifted becouse Vlachs didn't settle very in Bosnia. Just in some parts. I don't know why is that so hard to understand.

By the way i am not a lot more northern shifted than you. It is not very significant.

It is a pretty signifigant difference I score 39.83 North European on dodecad k12b Much more simalar to Bosniensis's score while you score almost 45

[Jana]

Croats, Slovenes and Bosniaks are the exception but other south slavs are more balkan

These is difference between western and eastern Serbs though. I am not sure how typical is your result.

[Leto]

Muslim Albanians don't hate Christianity, Albanians don't care about religion as a whole. Albanians weren't "cut off" from the rest of southern Europe, there are cultural similarities with Albanians and other Balkan countries, people exaggerate how cut off Albanians were.
Bro, I have no anti-Albanian sentiments, I simply judge by the opinions of Albanian nationalists in this forum. I mean people say "well, you're Albanian which means Muslim" and that freaks some Albanians out, so they turn against Christian Europeans and start defending Islam. They can practice whatever they want in Albania or Kosovo, but I hate it when pro-Islamic people (not necessarily Albanians) try to tell us that Islam is just as European as Christianity or that "we used to be violent too".

[MercifulServant]

What drugs are you on ? His results are typical for Bosnia, it is Vlach influenced Bosniensis that is out of norm, not Vlatko.

Bosniensis is not that southern for a south slav. hes just southern compared to croats and bosniaks

[Vlatko Vukovic]

Croats, Slovenes and Bosniaks are the exception but other south slavs are more balkan

"Exception", that is almost the half of South Slavs.

And who are others? Serbs, Bulgarians and Macedonians. Montenegrins are very small nation.

[MercifulServant]

These is difference between western and eastern Serbs though. I am not sure how typical is your result.

I probably have some ancestors from Montenegro. Im even related to Kelmendasi (according to GEDmatch) 7 generations ago

[Vlatko Vukovic]

These is difference between western and eastern Serbs though. I am not sure how typical is your result.

Not really. I asked Serbian members on Serbian DNA project and they said that my results are not common in Serbia, in any region, but in Bosnia it is.

[Vlatko Vukovic]

I probably have some ancestors from Montenegro. Im even related to Kelmendasi (according to GEDmatch) 7 generations ago

My paternal line is probably from Montenegro (Y-DNA will confirm or refute it), but why is that important for genetics?

[Porn Master]

Vlatko Vukovic are you buddist? xD

[Vlatko Vukovic]

Vlatko Vukovic are you buddist? xD

Yes bro.

[MercifulServant]

My paternal line is probably from Montenegro (Y-DNA will confirm or refute it), but why is that important for genetics?

I probably have some signifigant ancestry from there, due to my results being very southern for serbs from croatia

[Kelmendasi]

Bro, I have no anti-Albanian sentiments, I simply judge by the opinions of Albanian nationalists in this forum. I mean people say "well, you're Albanian which means Muslim" and that freaks some Albanians out, so they turn against Christian Europeans and start defending Islam. They can practice whatever they want in Albania or Kosovo, but I hate it when pro-Islamic people (not necessarily Albanians) try to tell us that Islam is just as European as Christianity or that "we used to be violent too".
I know you don't but you can't come to such a conclusion based on forum members. Albanians are just trying to defend themselves when people try and accuse them of something just because of religion. I don't think religions today can belong to any group such as "European". Albanians are known for being one of the most religious tolerant people and that we have no care for what religion a person belongs to

[Leto]

I know you don't but you can't come to such a conclusion based on forum members. Albanians are just trying to defend themselves when people try and accuse them of something just because of religion. I don't think religions today can belong to any group such as "European". Albanians are known for being one of the most religious tolerant people and that we have no care for what religion a person belongs to
Well, I would find it hard to accept a man whose name is Ahmad and who has a mullah beard as a culturally European person. Maybe you think different because Albanians can be both Muslim and Christian, but in other countries people who convert to Islam usually discard their culture and embrace some pseudo-Arabic identity.

[Vlatko Vukovic]

Well, I would find it hard to accept a man whose name is Ahmad and who has a mullah beard as a culturally European person. Maybe you think different because Albanians can be both Muslim and Christian, but in other countries people who convert to Islam usually discard their culture and embrace some pseudo-Arabic identity.

Our muslim names in Bosnia are usually unique. They're from Arab or Persian origin but still unique. Ahmed, Muhammed is not very usual name here. Most of our names doesn't exist in Arabia or even Turkey. :)

[Kelmendasi]

Well, I would find it hard to accept a man whose name is Ahmad and who has a mullah beard as a culturally European person. Maybe you think different because Albanians can be both Muslim and Christian, but in other countries people who convert to Islam usually discard their culture and embrace some pseudo-Arabic identity.
Albanians though don't have those beards and especially don't assume an Islamic identitiy, a muslim Albanian is just as culturally Albanian as a christian Albanian.

[Marmara]

Well, I would find it hard to accept a man whose name is Ahmad and who has a mullah beard as a culturally European person. Maybe you think different because Albanians can be both Muslim and Christian, but in other countries people who convert to Islam usually discard their culture and embrace some pseudo-Arabic identity.

It seems you haven't met much Albanians. Those i've seen (muslims) were far from being religious.

[Vlatko Vukovic]

There is nothing to congratulate me.
I am not a Croat, I am just passionate about history and genetics.
Also there is no pan-slavism and what bounds most of the modern Slavs today is the language only.
The pan-slavism was favoured in the past, but not anymore, there are simply too many differences between us.
My involvement in this discussion was because of your exaggerated influence of Turkics on Slavs.
In fact, the Turkics had much more contact with Germanics than Slavs.

I am Balkanite and i have relation with East Slavs. Your theory falls down.

[Jana]

You are western, central Europeans. Ask Stears ;)

Albania was never Catholic state, it had more orthodox belivers before Ottomans arrived and it was in Byzantine sphere of influence.

Wrong parallel.

[Vlatko Vukovic]

That's simply not true.
I don't know why you are trying to push this agenda but that's not true.
Slovenes, Croats and Bosniaks are definitely more Slavic.
Even Serbs, I've seen many results of them and most of them are under fifty percent "South Eastern Europe" on FTDNA's MyOrigins.
Also you plot closer to Moldavians and you are rather closer to Ukrainians than to Greeks.

Serbs are usually (not at all) North-West influenced. I am North East, Balto-Slavica area.

[Jana]

Aren't Gorani basically just a minority slavic tribe that never formed nationhood?

They might be muslim Bulgarians/Macedonians or southern Serbs with distinct identity. But many are culturally albanized and have albanian surnames (those from Kosovo), despite they don't speak Albanian language.

[MercifulServant]

That's simply not true.
I don't know why you are trying to push this agenda but that's not true.
Slovenes, Croats and Bosniaks are definitely more Slavic.
Even Serbs, I've seen many results of them and most of them are under fifty percent "South Eastern Europe" on FTDNA's MyOrigins.
Also you plot closer to Moldavians and you are rather closer to Ukrainians than to Greeks.

False, I plot with serbs from Serbia.

[Kelmendasi]

Albania was never Catholic state, it had more orthodox belivers before Ottomans arrived and it was in Byzantine sphere of influence.

Wrong parallel.
Under Skanderbeg and the League of Lezhe Albania was a Catholic state and was supported by the pope on many occasions. In the north there were more Catholics than Orthodox Christians

[Jana]

Under Skanderbeg and the League of Lezhe Albania was a Catholic state and was supported by the pope on many occasions. In the north there were more Catholics than Orthodox Christians

Only in the north which was more isolated from southern orthodox Albania.

Do you have gothic and romanesque architecture there, or Byzantine ? That's trademark of all Catholic states

PS :
During the moment of schism (1054) Albanians were attached to the Eastern Orthodox Church and were all Orthodox Christians.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eastern_Orthodoxy_in_Albania

[Böri]

A member's genetic test results thread is being drifted from its purpose to be, but just as a sidenote, North Albania under Scanderberg wasn't a state or sort of a kingdom. It was a Venetian dependency. Albanians were in the Orthodox, Byzantine, Eastern side during the 1054 West-East schism. However to this day, northern Albania has Catholic population. They aren't culturally western tho. A bit like Ukrainian Catholics.

[Kelmendasi]

Only in the north which was more isolated from southern orthodox Albania.

Do you have gothic and romanesque architecture there, or Byzantine ? That's trademark of all Catholic states

PS :
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eastern_Orthodoxy_in_Albania
Still though Skanderbeg's Albania was a Catholic one. The northerners converted in order to resist the Orthodox Slavs. Albania probably does have some of those architectural type somewhere although most of the old architecture is Ottoman or Byzantine like as Albania was under that sphere of influence regardless of religious affiliation. I never said that Albanians weren't Orthodox at first

[Kelmendasi]

A member's genetic test results thread is being drifted from its purpose to be, but just as a sidenote, North Albania under Scanderberg wasn't a state or sort of a kingdom. It was a Venetian dependency. Albanians were in the Orthodox, Byzantine, Eastern side during the 1054 West-East schism.
It was a state and was independent from Venice, true that it was at first Orthodox but many began converting into Catholicism

[Leto]

It seems you haven't met much Albanians. Those i've seen (muslims) were far from being religious.
My post wasn't about them being religious. Nevermind.

[Böri]

It was a state and was independent from Venice, true that it was at first Orthodox but many began converting into Catholicism

League Lezhe etc wasn't an independent Albanian kingdom. It was Venetian dependency. Later Skanderberg himself entered under Naples sphere of influence going to Italy to fight wars there etc. Skanderberg was never a king. He was leader of Albanian landlords and local nobles who were dispossessed by Turks.

[Vlatko Vukovic]

What part of my theory fall's down?
If you read carefully, I was writing about all Slavic countries, not specifically for you...

Yes, but the fact that Macedonians and South Serbs aren't related with other Slavs, doesn't make Slavs just as "linguistic group". South Slavs, East Slavs and West Slavs are genetically connected with each other, which make them ethnic group. ;)

[Kelmendasi]

League Lezhe etc wasn't an independent Albanian kingdom. It was Venetian dependency. Later Skanderberg himself entered under Naples sphere of influence going to Italy to fight wars there etc. Skanderberg was never a king. He was leader of Albanian landlords and local nobles who were dispossessed by Turks.
The League was independent from the Venetians and was a union of Albanian principalities, the Venetians had territories in Albania but the League wasn't a vassal or dependency of the Venetians all the Venetians did was support it as a patron. True Skanderbeg couldn't fully become the king of Albania but he was the leader of the League which as I said before was a union or alliance of Albanian principalities

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/d3/Eastern_Mediterranean_1450.svg/1024px-Eastern_Mediterranean_1450.svg.png

[MalinBot]

What drugs are you on ? His results are typical for Bosnia, it is Vlach influenced Bosniensis that is out of norm, not Vlatko.

From where did Vlatko's high eastern input and asian markers come from, if not from a recent russian ancestor?6th slavic immigrant heritage is out of the question, that was 1500 years ago.

[Leto]

From where did Vlatko's high eastern input and asian markers come from, if not from a recent russian ancestor?6th slavic immigrant heritage is out of the question, that was 1500 years ago.
They are simply more Northern than Serbs. The same goes for Croats and Slovenians. If he had a Russian grandparent, he most likely would've known him. There's no Russians in Bosnia, for God's sake.

[Vlatko Vukovic]

They are simply more Northern than Serbs. The same goes for Croats and Slovenians. If he had a Russian grandparent, he most likely would've known him. There's no Russians in Bosnia, for God's sake.

Asian marker comes from Middle East.

My Eastern Input is from 6th century immigrants.

"Caucasian" isn't asiatic. This is special calculator. My asian marker is West Asian, about 6%. And Siberian 1.6%. Everything other is European.

[RN97]

Only in the north which was more isolated from southern orthodox Albania.

Do you have gothic and romanesque architecture there, or Byzantine ? That's trademark of all Catholic states

PS :
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eastern_Orthodoxy_in_Albania

wrong and misleading. The north became catholic while the south not.

[MalinBot]

They are simply more Northern than Serbs. The same goes for Croats and Slovenians. If he had a Russian grandparent, he most likely would've known him. There's no Russians in Bosnia, for God's sake.

I saw the gedmatch of the 2 bosnians you posted and neither had this asian and lower steppe, also he tested at ftdna not 23andme/ancestry and i saw on this forum people who tested at both got quite different gedmatch results as if they were different people.

[Leto]

he tested at ftdna not 23andme/ancestry and i saw on this forum people who tested at both got quite different gedmatch results as if they were different people.
That's not true. Usually the difference is within 1 percent or so.

[MalinBot]

Asian marker comes from Middle East.

My Eastern Input is from 6th century immigrants.

"Caucasian" isn't asiatic. This is special calculator. My asian marker is West Asian, about 6%. And Siberian 1.6%. Everything other is European.

i am talking about normal euro calculators ,like k13/k15/mldplh world etc..caucasus is not asian but having a high caucasus and asian is a north-eastern thing.
This 'my ancestors did not mix/It is mixture from centuries ago' is a false argument,the same one user Stears pulls when people call him out on his very high caucasus/asian score as if his parents were inbred since the magyar conquest so only he got these results, and people mixed with their countrymen for hundreds and thousands of years, in both you and his case its most likely a recent result.

[Leto]

i am talking about normal euro calculators ,like k13/k15/mldplh world etc..caucasus is not asian but having a high caucasus and asian is a north-eastern thing.
Lol, since when? It is the highest in Southeastern Europe.

[MercifulServant]

Yes, and Serbs in general plot close to Moldavians.
You can share with us your eurogenes k15 admix oracle and the PCA plot based on eurogenes k15 so we can see how do you plot?

I plot with the Serbian sample on K15.

[Vlatko Vukovic]

i am talking about normal euro calculators ,like k13/k15/mldplh world etc..caucasus is not asian but having a high caucasus and asian is a north-eastern thing.
This 'my ancestors did not mix/It is mixture from centuries ago' is a false argument,the same one user Stears pulls when people call him out on his very high caucasus/asian score as if his parents were inbred since the magyar conquest so only he got these results, and people mixed with their countrymen for hundreds and thousands of years, in both you and his case its most likely a recent result.

I am sorry for you, but i didn't have East Slavic ancestors. That is what you wish, but reallity is different. It's just reallity that me (an massively my compatriots) have still genetic results from our ancient Urhemeit. That is what everybody have seen, that is what you see but just pretending to have some other explanation.

For the last time: I don't have any East Slavic nor ANY non-balkanite recent ancestors. Deal with it.

[MalinBot]

That's not true. Usually the difference is within 1 percent or so.
i saw an albanian user complain he had quite different results and they were more than a percent


Lol, since when? It is the highest in Southeastern Europe.
maybe i saw wrong, it was a steppe on a calculator that peaks on russians, nevertheless he has atypical asian stuff and he's been told he has very high slavic for a south slav here even by Stearsolina at the beginning of the thread, so he is atypical, having some east slavic ancestry is not out of the question

[Leto]

i saw an albanian user complain he had quite different results and they were more than a percent


maybe i saw wrong, it was a steppe on a calculator that peaks on russians, nevertheless he has atypical asian stuff and he's been told he has very high slavic for a south slav here even by Stearsolina at the beginning of the thread, so he is atypical, having some east slavic ancestry is not out of the question
He doesn't have any atypical Asian stuff, stop making shit up. 1-2% mongoloid is normal in every Slavic country.

[Vlatko Vukovic]

i saw an albanian user complain he had quite different results and they were more than a percent


maybe i saw wrong, it was a steppe on a calculator that peaks on russians, nevertheless he has atypical asian stuff and he's been told he has very high slavic for a south slav here even by Stearsolina at the beginning of the thread, so he is atypical, having some east slavic ancestry is not out of the question

And if i have to say it; My (father) ancestors lived in a village which is totally unsettled, less than 50 settlers in this time, now less than 100. And they were isolated from Vlach influence or any other native for a long time.

[Leto]

And if i have to say it; My (father) ancestors lived in a village which is totally unsettled, less than 50 settlers in this time, now less than 100. And they were isolated from Vlach influence or any other native for a long time.
By the way, which part of Bosnia are you from?

[Vlatko Vukovic]

By the way, which part of Bosnia are you from?

I am from capital Sarajevo. But my grandparents (from both sides) are from various Bosnian ancestry.

Father paternal line is Central-East Bosnia ( very rural place), father maternal line is East Bosnia (rural place), mother's paternal Central Bosnia (urban place), and mother's maternal southern = Herzegowina. (urban place).

[MalinBot]

He doesn't have any atypical Asian stuff, stop making shit up. 1-2% mongoloid is normal in every Slavic country.

He does, neither serbs,nor hungarians,romanians and hungarians score amerindian and stuff like this,only some siberian if they have.
Also ,you said he is typical and gave these 2 bosniak samples

These are Bosniaks:
A095922
M893654

Now i have done the k15 map on the first one who has very high baltic and this is were he plots
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/252132842266558464/420649589759279125/unknown.png
Bosnian my ass, he is more atypical than Bosniensis, if Bosniensis has asimilited ''''vlah'''' as Stearsolina says then this bosniak has assimiliated russian

And here is the map with both, second one with M has much less baltic ~15.5, compared to 23.7 on the first one which is extremely high...
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/252132842266558464/420651066166607874/unknown.png

[Leto]

He does, neither serbs,nor hungarians,romanians and hungarians score amerindian and stuff like this,only some siberian if they have.
Also ,you said he is typical and gave these 2 bosniak samples


Now i have done the k15 map on the first one who has very high baltic and this is were he plots
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/252132842266558464/420649589759279125/unknown.png
Bosnian my ass, he is more atypical than Bosniensis, if Bosniensis has asimilited ''''vlah'''' as Stearsolina says then this bosniak has assimiliated russian

And here is the map with both, second one with M has much less baltic ~15.5, compared to 23.7 on the first one which is extremely high...
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/252132842266558464/420651066166607874/unknown.png
Oh c'mon, just get the fuck out. You literally know shit, ignoramus. Literally every European can score some "Amerindian" (NO ONE in Europe has actual Amerindian ancestry, that's just noise or misinterpreted Siberian or God knows what else).

[Vlatko Vukovic]

Oh c'mon, just get the fuck out. You literally know shit, ignoramus. Literally every European can score some "Amerindian" (NO ONE in Europe has actual Amerindian ancestry, that's just noise or misinterpreted Siberian or God knows what else).

Who knows from who this guy is sockpuppet.

[MalinBot]

Oh c'mon, just get the fuck out. You literally know shit, ignoramus. Literally every European can score some "Amerindian" (NO ONE in Europe has actual Amerindian ancestry, that's just noise or misinterpreted Siberian or God knows what else).

ignore k15 results and change the subject to fit you, shithead.
I never said you cant score amerindian, however the total score on the typical k13/k15/mldpk he has is noticeable higger than average,i clearly said its not atypical to score some siberian or amerindian but its usually only 1 or 2 components and they are low.
Now vlatko can be bosnian/bosniak,its fine, but neither you nor stearsolina call him typical,he is not and if he is than Bosniensis is too.

[Vlatko Vukovic]

ignore k15 results and change the subject to fit you, shithead.
I never said you cant score amerindian, however the total score on the typical k13/k15/mldpk he has is noticeable higger than average,i clearly said its not atypical to score some siberian or amerindian but its usually only 1 or 2 components and they are low.
Now vlatko can be bosnian/bosniak,its fine, but neither you nor stearsolina call him typical,he is not and if he is than Bosniensis is too.

We don't have many Bosniak samples so we don't have average. One thing is sure: My all recent ancestors are from Balkan.

I scored just 1.65 Siberian and some Amerindian about 0.55. That's all from Mongoloids.

[Leto]

ignore k15 results and change the subject to fit you, shithead.
I never said you cant score amerindian, however the total score on the typical k13/k15/mldpk he has is noticeable higger than average,i clearly said its not atypical to score some siberian or amerindian but its usually only 1 or 2 components and they are low.
Now vlatko can be bosnian/bosniak,its fine, but neither you nor stearsolina call him typical,he is not and if he is than Bosniensis is too.
How many Bosnians have you seen? 2-3? What if those people aren't typical? And why can't there be any diversity among the Bosnians? You see variations in places like Sicily or Greece, why should all Bosnians be the same?

[MalinBot]

How many Bosnians have you seen? 2-3? What if those people aren't typical? And why can't there be any diversity among the Bosnians? You see variations in places like Sicily or Greece, why should all Bosnians be the same?

you posted those bosniaks , not me and you called vlatko typical.Now those arent typical?
Btw i think the second bosniak has typical bosnian plot on k15 and baltic score,the first one has very high baltic and plot very east,more eastern than a moldovian!..therefore atypical.

[Leto]

you posted those bosniaks , not me and you called vlatko typical.Now those arent typical?
Btw i think the second bosniak has typical bosnian plot on k15 and baltic score,the first one has very high baltic and plot very east,more eastern than a moldovian!..therefore atypical.
I never used the word typical to begin with.

[Jana]

wrong and misleading. The north became catholic while the south not.

Albania was eastern in times of schism. It was never part of western sphere (but it had influences). What's not clear to you ?

[MalinBot]

I never used the word typical to begin with.

i called him atypical ,you and Stearsolina contradicted me.

[Jana]

From where did Vlatko's high eastern input and asian markers come from, if not from a recent russian ancestor?6th slavic immigrant heritage is out of the question, that was 1500 years ago.

Minimal asian input is usual in southeastern Europe. Btw, his eastern European score isn't nothing strange for ethnic Bosniak, I have sample of northwestern Croat who scored 100% eastern European on FTDNA, and who doesn't have any known foreign ancestry.

[Jana]

I saw the gedmatch of the 2 bosnians you posted and neither had this asian and lower steppe, also he tested at ftdna not 23andme/ancestry and i saw on this forum people who tested at both got quite different gedmatch results as if they were different people.

Two Bosnians he posted could be anything, he only knows their surname sounds Bosniak. If Bosniak cluster with Bulgarians, that is very atypical and sign of some other ancestry (except for people in Sandžak)

[Leto]

i called him atypical ,you and Stearsolina contradicted me.

MDLP World Oracle results:

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 South_and_West_European 41.7
2 North_and_East_European 38.67
3 Caucaus_Parsia 11.13
4 Middle_East 6.65
5 Arctic_Amerind 0.76
6 Mesoamerican 0.7
7 Paleo_African 0.29
8 North_Asian 0.11

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Bosnian 2.51
2 Croatian 2.6
3 Hungarian 3.39
4 Slovenian 5.28
5 Austrian 5.55
6 Croatian_V 5.8
7 German_V 5.87
8 Czech 7
9 Serbian 7.02
10 German 7.02
11 CEU_V 7.43
12 Slovakian 8.01
13 German-North 8.14
14 Latvian_V 8.48
15 German-South 8.82
16 CEU 9.14
17 Macedonian 9.56
18 Norwegian_V 9.58
19 Montenegrin 9.72
20 Welsh 9.79

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 78.5% Bosnian + 21.5% Latvian_V @ 0.98
2 89.6% Bosnian + 10.4% Mordovian @ 1.11
3 86.2% German-North + 13.8% Druze @ 1.14
4 83% Swedish + 17% Jew_Georgia @ 1.19
5 86.7% German-North + 13.3% Jew_Georgia @ 1.19
6 61.5% Macedonian + 38.5% Russian_South @ 1.23
7 84.9% Bosnian + 15.1% Ukrainian-Center @ 1.23
8 56.1% Montenegrin + 43.9% Ukrainian-Center @ 1.25
9 83.1% Bosnian + 16.9% Ukrainian_V @ 1.25
10 86.6% Bosnian + 13.4% Ukrainian-East @ 1.26
11 87.5% Bosnian + 12.5% Russian_South @ 1.27
12 82.4% Czech + 17.6% Greek_Azov @ 1.28
13 88.5% Bosnian + 11.5% Russian_V @ 1.29
14 92.2% Bosnian + 7.8% Inkeri @ 1.29
15 56.5% Macedonian + 43.5% Ukrainian-Center @ 1.29
16 91.8% Bosnian + 8.2% Russian_North @ 1.3
17 85.9% German-North + 14.1% Lebanese @ 1.31
18 82.5% Bosnian + 17.5% Ukrainian-West @ 1.32
19 83.7% Swedish + 16.3% Jew-Iraqi @ 1.32
20 94.1% Bosnian + 5.9% Vepsa @ 1.32


Very small distance.

[MalinBot]

Minimal asian input is usual in southeastern Europe. Btw, his eastern European score isn't nothing strange for ethnic Bosniak, I have sample of northwestern Croat who scored 100% eastern European on FTDNA, and who doesn't have any known foreign ancestry.

ethnic croat with russian score? Give me a break.And how can you call that result typical when the context you say it implies its atypical !? Weres your logic?

On a sidenote, ftdna,myheritage and its kind are crap, take 23andme where only russians and their kind get stuff like 100% east european.

[MalinBot]

MDLP World Oracle results:

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 South_and_West_European 41.7
2 North_and_East_European 38.67
3 Caucaus_Parsia 11.13
4 Middle_East 6.65
5 Arctic_Amerind 0.76
6 Mesoamerican 0.7
7 Paleo_African 0.29
8 North_Asian 0.11

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Bosnian 2.51
2 Croatian 2.6
3 Hungarian 3.39
4 Slovenian 5.28
5 Austrian 5.55
6 Croatian_V 5.8
7 German_V 5.87
8 Czech 7
9 Serbian 7.02
10 German 7.02
11 CEU_V 7.43
12 Slovakian 8.01
13 German-North 8.14
14 Latvian_V 8.48
15 German-South 8.82
16 CEU 9.14
17 Macedonian 9.56
18 Norwegian_V 9.58
19 Montenegrin 9.72
20 Welsh 9.79

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 78.5% Bosnian + 21.5% Latvian_V @ 0.98
2 89.6% Bosnian + 10.4% Mordovian @ 1.11
3 86.2% German-North + 13.8% Druze @ 1.14
4 83% Swedish + 17% Jew_Georgia @ 1.19
5 86.7% German-North + 13.3% Jew_Georgia @ 1.19
6 61.5% Macedonian + 38.5% Russian_South @ 1.23
7 84.9% Bosnian + 15.1% Ukrainian-Center @ 1.23
8 56.1% Montenegrin + 43.9% Ukrainian-Center @ 1.25
9 83.1% Bosnian + 16.9% Ukrainian_V @ 1.25
10 86.6% Bosnian + 13.4% Ukrainian-East @ 1.26
11 87.5% Bosnian + 12.5% Russian_South @ 1.27
12 82.4% Czech + 17.6% Greek_Azov @ 1.28
13 88.5% Bosnian + 11.5% Russian_V @ 1.29
14 92.2% Bosnian + 7.8% Inkeri @ 1.29
15 56.5% Macedonian + 43.5% Ukrainian-Center @ 1.29
16 91.8% Bosnian + 8.2% Russian_North @ 1.3
17 85.9% German-North + 14.1% Lebanese @ 1.31
18 82.5% Bosnian + 17.5% Ukrainian-West @ 1.32
19 83.7% Swedish + 16.3% Jew-Iraqi @ 1.32
20 94.1% Bosnian + 5.9% Vepsa @ 1.32


Very small distance.

its irrelevant, mixed people can score that too, that does not make him typical bosnian, having that baltic score with an atypical asian score can't make him a typical bosniak.

[Jana]

ethnic croat with russian score? Give me a break.And how can you call that result typical when the context you say it implies its atypical !? Weres your logic?

On a sidenote, ftdna,myheritage and its kind are crap, take 23andme where only russians and their kind get stuff like 100% east european.

No wrong. Russians get less EE than that. Polish user explained me Czechs are used as reference in FTDNA easten european cluster and that is why this Croat gets 100% percent, he is genetically very close to west slavs.

He gets quite different results on DNA land though.

And he doesn't cluster with Russians, but close to Slovenes, Hungarians and Slovaks like other north-west Croats.

[Jana]

its irrelevant, mixed people can score that too, that does not make him typical bosnian, having that baltic score with an atypical asian score can't make him a typical bosniak.

Which sockpuppet are you and what the hell do you know about Bosniak genetics ?

Bosniaks are closest to Croats, and Vlatko clusters bit more southeastern than Croatian average on K15, and he is as typical as it gets.

[Leto]

its irrelevant, mixed people can score that too, that does not make him typical bosnian, having that baltic score with an atypical asian score can't make him a typical bosniak.
Yeah, but K15 results (they have no Bosnian reference) are somehow "relevant". :rolleyes:
Why are you so preoccupied with his results? Typical or not, why do you care? He is what he is, a Bosnian just as his parents and grandparents.

[Jana]

Yeah, but K15 results (they have no Bosnian reference) are somehow "relevant". :rolleyes:
Why are you so preoccupied with his results? Typical or not, why do you care? He is what he is, a Bosnian just as his parents and grandparents.

I think it is sock account of formerly banned user.

[MalinBot]

Two Bosnians he posted could be anything, he only knows their surname sounds Bosniak. If Bosniak cluster with Bulgarians, that is very atypical and sign of some other ancestry (except for people in Sandžak)

Now they arent bosniak? pathetic attempt.
Did they you this at college?
What about bosniak scoring east of Moldova?
The second one scores between serb and croat and very close on calculators to bosnians 1.50 or so and small distances,he is much less slavic and more balkan which is as expected, MUCH more typical than vlatko, adding the fact that as you say his name sounds bosniak.

[Jana]

Now they arent bosniak? pathetic attempt.
Did they you this at college?
What about bosniak scoring east of Moldova?
The second one scores between serb and croat and very close on calculators to bosnians 1.50 or so and small distances,he is much less slavic and more balkan which is as expected, MUCH more typical than vlatko, adding the fact that as you say his name sounds bosniak.

Deymark, why does it bother you Bosniaks are less Balkan than you imagine ?

I know, you are mad because average Bosniak clusters more northern than average Romanian.

Deal with it.

[Vlatko Vukovic]

Why are you so preoccupied with his results?

Becouse he is sockpuppet of Serb/Bosniak from this forum. Even possible Romanian or Macedonian.

[Leto]

Becouse he is sockpuppet of Serb/Bosniak from this forum. Even possible Romanian or Macedonian.
I have zero tolerance to fucking sock puppets. If I was in charge, they would be banned immediately and with no excuses.

[Vlatko Vukovic]

What about bosniak scoring east of Moldova?

Deymark just stop. You can't change the reallity.

Actually, the Romanians wants to prove that Bosniaks are their relatives - Vlachs, who are just speaking Slavic language, and my results proved otherwise. Now, he wants to impose me some East Slavic recent ancestry which i don't have.

[MalinBot]

No wrong. Russians get less EE than that. Polish user explained me Czechs are used as reference in FTDNA easten european cluster and that is why this Croat gets 100% percent, he is genetically very close to west slavs.

He gets quite different results on DNA land though.

And he doesn't cluster with Russians, but close to Slovenes, Hungarians and Slovaks like other north-west Croats.

and your point? do i have to ask you this everytime?
If 100% is what czechs score than the croatian guy is atypical or the test is shit, nevertheless the only thing it proves is to not do FTDNA on the future.

[Tommie]

Actually, the Romanians wants to prove that Bosniaks are their relatives - Vlachs, who are just speaking Slavic language, and my results proved otherwise. Now, he wants to impose me some East Slavic recent ancestry which i don't have.
Which Romanians? I haven't noticed any claiming that.

[The Illyrian Warrior]

Don't argue with Muslim Albanians. They hate Christianity and feel out of place in other European countries. For example, Germans associate Albanians with Islamic people like Turks (not surprising given the amount of fake-ass refugees from Kosovo and Macedonia). They especially hate Serbs and Greeks who happen to be Orthodox Christians. I mean yes Albanians are Europeans genetically but due to the Ottoman cultural influence they were cut off from the rest of Southern Europe (excluding Christian Albanians).

You are trying to separate people deliberately here I think, if you followed me from beginning or heard any Albanian and not hear your gopnik instincts you'd know that Albanians have no problem with Christians esp. not with Albanians of Christian religion, we are blood brothers and more attached one with another than you russians would think of, however I can't stand hypocrisy being played over by few western or eastern christians here.

[MalinBot]

Yeah, but K15 results (they have no Bosnian reference) are somehow "relevant". :rolleyes:
Why are you so preoccupied with his results? Typical or not, why do you care? He is what he is, a Bosnian just as his parents and grandparents.

YOU have used K15/mdpl as a way to prove Vlatko is typical for Bosnia.
Its game over for you ,stop replying, you are embarassing yourself at this point.

YOU have posted the bosniak samples, one of them scores perfectly fine bosnian between croat and serb as Stearsolin above says ,the other one has VERY HIGH baltic score and plots very far, EAST of Moldovia, a country who is a russified Romania

[MalinBot]

This Stearsolina simply does not want Bosniaks to cluster closer to serbs, because her grandfather is bosniak, so she tries to pass this east slav admixed vlatko, or that fake gedmatch of leto, as typical bosniak, she has a deep hatred for serbs which she shows when she is not faking her personality.

[Vlatko Vukovic]

Which Romanians? I haven't noticed any claiming that.

This guy "MalinBot" is Romanian sockpuppet of Deymark. He always claimed that we are balkanite vlach genetically, and he can't accept my Eastern Euro high results as real.

[Vlatko Vukovic]

This Stearsolina simply does not want Bosniaks to cluster closer to serbs, because her grandfather is bosniak, so she tries to pass this east slav admixed vlatko, or that fake gedmatch of leto, as typical bosniak.

I give the code to Leto myself.

[Leto]

You are trying to separate people deliberately here I think, if you followed me from beginning or heard any Albanian and not hear your gopnik instincts you'd know that Albanians have no problem with Christians esp. not with Albanians of Christian religion, we are blood brothers and more attached one with another than you russians would think of, however I can't stand hypocrisy being played over by few western or eastern christians here.
You are the gopnik here. You attack us because we don't wanna live with Muzzies. Seriously, dude, do you feel close to Arabs, Turks, Afghans, Pakis, etc.? I don't think you would like them to flood Albania, even if most Albanians share their religion. And with us they don't share anything. So you are the hypocrit here.

[Vlatko Vukovic]

You are the gopnik here. You attack us because we don't wanna live with Muzzies. Seriously, dude, do you feel close to Arabs, Turks, Afghans, Pakis, etc.? I don't think you would like them to flood Albania, even if most Albanians share their religion. And with us they don't share anything. So you are the hypocrit here.

Bro, there is no need to relate them with Pakis and Arabs. Albanians are ancient Balkanites and Europeans. Nothing in common they have with Arabs and Pakis, from language until the genetics and history. Only religion is their connection.

[MalinBot]

Typical attempt at changing the subject when confronted with arguments they cant argue with.



Deymark, why does it bother you Bosniaks are less Balkan than you imagine ?

I know, you are mad because average Bosniak clusters more northern than average Romanian.

Deal with it.


Becouse he is sockpuppet of Serb/Bosniak from this forum. Even possible Romanian or Macedonian.


I have zero tolerance to fucking sock puppets. If I was in charge, they would be banned immediately and with no excuses.


This guy "MalinBot" is Romanian sockpuppet of Deymark. He always claimed that we are balkanite vlach genetically, and he can't accept my Eastern Euro high results as real.

[Leto]

YOU have used K15/mdpl as a way to prove Vlatko is typical for Bosnia.
Its game over for you ,stop replying, you are embarassing yourself at this point.

YOU have posted the bosniak samples, one of them scores perfectly fine bosnian between croat and serb as Stearsolin above says ,the other one has VERY HIGH baltic score and plots very far, EAST of Moldovia, a country who is a russified Romania
Wrong. I simply placed him on the map. And I gave the only Bosnian kit numbers I have. I wasn't trying to prove anything.

[MalinBot]

Wrong. I simply placed him on the map. And I gave the only Bosnian kit numbers I have. I wasn't trying to prove anything.

Then who made your last pages posts?Are you retarded?
You have no arguments to reply because IF you had you would posted them , that now you act the 'I am insane' card?

[Leto]

Bro, there is no need to relate them with Pakis and Arabs. Albanians are ancient Balkanites and Europeans. Nothing in common they have with Arabs and Pakis, from language until the genetics and history. Only religion is their connection.
I know the Illyrian Warrior. He is an Albanian nationalist himself and puts his ethnic group first, but just because he has anti-Christian, anti-Slavic (and anti-Russian by the way) sentiments and comes from a Muslim background, he always says Islam is better than Christianity and that the West should accept Muslims. Basically he denies other people what he wishes for his own people - preserving their identity.

[Vlatko Vukovic]

I know the Illyrian Warrior. He is an Albanian nationalist himself and puts his ethnic group first, but just because he has anti-Christian, anti-Slavic (and anti-Russian by the way) sentiments and comes from a Muslim background, he always says Islam is better than Christianity and that the West should accept Muslims. Basically he denies other people what he wishes for his own people - preserving their identity.

He is primarly anti-Serb.

And.. he is just one example. Average Albanians are not religious :)

[brasilianthor]

If anything for sake of argument Orthodoxy is one of the least evolved & most primitive kind of christianity, therefore backward in my book and so are countries whom their people practice this religion, I can attest this better than you in America who barely know more than dozen of Orthodox there.

Stats usually can be misused or ill interpreted on the way you like, so I won't really bother to answer one by one.

the least evolved christianity is still more evolved than turkish faith albanians took from their masters.

[Kelmendasi]

the least evolved christianity is still more evolved than turkish faith albanians took from their masters.
Explain how

[Leto]

He is primarly anti-Serb.

And.. he is just one example. Average Albanians are not religious :)
I never said he or they were religious or anything like that. Yet he clearly defends Islam because it is practiced by a majority of Albanians and because he lives in another country where people associate Albanians with Muslims. Otherwise why would a non-Muslim ethnic nationalist defend a foreign religion/ideology?

[Vlatko Vukovic]

I never said he or they were religious or anything like that. Yet he clearly defends Islam because it is practiced by a majority of Albanians and because he lives in another country where people associate Albanians with Muslims. Otherwise why would a non-Muslim ethnic nationalist defend a foreign religion/ideology?

No, no. I didn't speak about him. But about Albanians objectively. They are not very religious people, and they are united in Albanian nationalism (muslims,chatolics, orthodox). They are not Islamic oriented.

[Jana]

This Stearsolina simply does not want Bosniaks to cluster closer to serbs, because her grandfather is bosniak, so she tries to pass this east slav admixed vlatko, or that fake gedmatch of leto, as typical bosniak, she has a deep hatred for serbs which she shows when she is not faking her personality.

The fact you hate Bosniaks and have unsound mind doens't make me like you. You even claimed Bosniaks are Albanians :lol:
And genetics clearly show how Bosnia is closer to Croatia, than to Serbia. And Bosnian Serbs can get similar results like Vlatko, because there is not much genetic difference between 3 nations in BiH.
http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article/figure/image?size=large&id=10.1371/journal.pone.0135820.g002
http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article/figure/image?size=large&id=10.1371/journal.pone.0135820.g003
https://i.imgur.com/mRpfIqS.png

[RN97]

Albania was eastern in times of schism. It was never part of western sphere (but it had influences). What's not clear to you ?

No, the northern part did actually become catholic and was sort of a catholic outpost in the region. I mean, seriously, do you think that Venetian rule is the reason for Catholicism being so wide-spread in Albania? If you didn't know, there is even a ethnic Romanian here that's a catholic. Catholicism is not as limited as you'd like to think, but I just am trolling you since you sorta act like there is something special with orthodox Christianity just because of "muh schism" when you're basically ignoring so many splits and wars after the schism. Listen, you might know I'm not the biggest fan of Christianity, but Orthodox Christianity is basically the same as Catholicism in the grander scheme of things. Cultural differences are mostly from other sources.

[Jana]

No, the northern part did actually become catholic and was sort of a catholic outpost in the region. I mean, seriously, do you think that Venetian rule is the reason for Catholicism being so wide-spread in Albania? If you didn't know, there is even a ethnic Romanian here that's a catholic. Catholicism is not as limited as you'd like to think, but I just am trolling you since you sorta act like there is something special with orthodox Christianity just because of "muh schism" when you're basically ignoring so many splits and wars after the schism. Listen, you might know I'm not the biggest fan of Christianity, but Orthodox Christianity is basically the same as Catholicism in the grander scheme of things. Cultural differences are mostly from other sources.

Didn't you read Kelmendasi post ? North became Catholic to resist orthodox Serbs.

I said Albania was never truly part of western Catholic world, and didn't have such development. That's all. They had much closer ties with Byzantine Empire.

[MalinBot]

The fact you hate Bosniaks and have unsound mind doens't make me like you. You even claimed Bosniaks are Albanians :lol:
And genetics clearly show how Bosnia is closer to Croatia, than to Serbia. And Bosnian Serbs can get similar results like Vlatko, because there is not much genetic difference between 3 nations in BiH.
http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article/figure/image?size=large&id=10.1371/journal.pone.0135820.g002
http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article/figure/image?size=large&id=10.1371/journal.pone.0135820.g003
https://i.imgur.com/mRpfIqS.png

I have never said this and why are you switching the subject?Except a small percentage who are muslim import, bosniaks are just recent muslimized and brainwashed croats and serbs, i never claimed they are close to albanians and i don't care about your graphs, i had already stated what my argument to both you and Leto.

[Jana]

I have never said this and why are you switching the subject?Except a small percentage who are muslim import, bosniaks are just recent muslimized and brainwashed croats and serbs, i never claimed they are close to albanians and i don't care about your graphs, i had already stated what my argument to both you and Leto.

They are Bosniaks and they have distinct identity and Bosnia was distinct Kingdom in middle ages. Croat and Serb national identity developed in 19th century, and Bosniaks didn't take part in it.

They share ancestry with both, yes, but they are something unique for many centuries already. And you claimed my grandpa was Albanian, because he is part Bosniak.

[Vlatko Vukovic]

They are Bosniaks and they have distinct identity and Bosnia was distinct Kingdom in middle ages. Croat and Serb national idenity developed in 19th century, and Bosniaks didn't take part in it.

They share ancestry with both, yes, but they are something unique for many centuries already. And you claimed my grandpa was Albanian, because he is part Bosniak.

"Nationality" and "identity" are not clear terms for Romanians. According to his fucktard logic, Americans are Englishmen and should be represented as they.

[Leto]

They are Bosniaks and they have distinct identity and Bosnia was distinct Kingdom in middle ages. Croat and Serb national idenity developed in 19th century, and Bosniaks didn't take part in it.

They share ancestry with both, yes, but they are something unique for many centuries already. And you claimed my grandpa was Albanian, because he is part Bosniak.
I always thought the Bosniak identity was kind of meaningless without Islam. I mean if a Bosniak converts to Christianity, is he not another Serbo-Croat-speaking Yugoslav?

[MalinBot]

They are Bosniaks and they have distinct identity and Bosnia was distinct Kingdom in middle ages. Croat and Serb national idenity developed in 19th century, and Bosniaks didn't take part in it.

They share ancestry with both, yes, but they are something unique for many centuries already. And you claimed my grandpa was Albanian, because he is part Bosniak.

"Bosniaks" did not take part in it because there's no such thing as bosniak.Bosniak = muslim bosnian

[Jana]

I always thought the Bosniak identity was kind of meaningless without Islam. I mean if a Bosniak converts to Christianity, is he not another Serbo-Croat-speaking Yugoslav?

Not necessary, I think. Depend on individual :)

[Vlatko Vukovic]

I always thought the Bosniak identity was kind of meaningless without Islam. I mean if a Bosniak converts to Christianity, is he not another Serbo-Croat-speaking Yugoslav?

You know that modern meaning of nationality is established after French revolution, when the modern ethnicities are established. Before that, ethnicities on Balkans were mainly even illiterate. And then we have among Serbs for example Vuk Karadzic who born nationalist idea and establish Serbian Cyrillic as national writing. That was example. Under the Turks, for example, people mainly identified by religion- Muslim, Christian and that was for long period, becouse it was long conflict of 2 different civilisations.

Some Croats are of Serbian origin today, and some Serbs of Croatian origin (from the ancient history) but they're today what they're.

[The Illyrian Warrior]

You are the gopnik here. You attack us because we don't wanna live with Muzzies. Seriously, dude, do you feel close to Arabs, Turks, Afghans, Pakis, etc.? I don't think you would like them to flood Albania, even if most Albanians share their religion. And with us they don't share anything. So you are the hypocrit here.

You change one subject matter to another, no I don't blame you for not wanting Muslim immigrants in, I wouldn't want immigrants either, but I have another good reason why but I wouldn't go into details now, also the problem with you was not of cultural preservation nature, the problem with you was how you separate and ridicule Albanians deliberately from religious background without even knowing our mentality in the first place, if this is not hypocrisy from you I know the ignorance has alot to do with it.

[Leto]

You change one subject matter to another, no I don't blame you for not wanting Muslim immigrants in, I wouldn't want immigrants either, but I have another good reason why but I wouldn't go into details now, also the problem with you was not of cultural preservation nature, the problem with you was how you separate and ridicule Albanians deliberately from religious background without even knowing our mentality in the first place, if this is not hypocrisy from you I know the ignorance has alot to do with it.
I don't ridicule Albanians, don't strawman. I merely said I personally more closely identify with Orthodox people.

[MalinBot]

Were is your DNA.Land?I am interested how much slavic you are there, it takes a few hours at most.I see it is accepted by ftdna family finder.
(pic is from their FAQ)
https://dna.land/static/img/familytree/upload/step6.png

[Vlatko Vukovic]

Were is your DNA.Land?I am interested how much slavic you are there, it takes a few hours at most.I see it is accepted by ftdna family finder.
(pic is from their FAQ)
https://dna.land/static/img/familytree/upload/step6.png

will be done

[SerbianGod]

Open your eyes. In all studies Serbs are both more mongoloid and more MENA, but it is not surprising.

the MENA is from Kosovo Albanians that are over 2 millions. And wrong Hungary has more (Asiatic) R1a than Serbia.

Hungarians arent much whiter than indigenous Serbs except Szekely who were surprisingly white in your pics.

When I drive through Hun-gary I see no difference to Vojvodina.

[The Illyrian Warrior]

I don't ridicule Albanians, don't strawman. I merely said I personally more closely identify with Orthodox people.


Don't argue with Muslim Albanians. They hate Christianity and feel out of place in other European countries.

You shouldn't back down so fast when you clearly have something against Muslim Albanians, a prejudice, ignorance or both, anyways, I said that you're wrong, you shouldn't be victimized like all of the sudden I'm forcing Russians to accept immigrants, lol chill man, no one is pushing for immigration here, we can tolerate things if you're uninformed, but don't change subject when your caught tight and lie about it after.

You should clear things up and not create more confusion and less understanding in your comments.

[Kelmendasi]

the MENA is from Kosovo Albanians that are over 2 millions. And wrong Hungary has more (Asiatic) R1a than Serbia.

Hungarians arent much whiter than indigenous Serbs except Szekely who were surprisingly white in your pics.

When I drive through Hun-gary I see no difference to Vojvodina.
Lol, Albanians are the ones scoring 90-100% SE European on autosomal

[Leto]

You shouldn't back down so fast when you clearly have something against Muslim Albanians, an prejudice, ignorance or both, anyways, I said that you're wrong, you shouldn't be victimized like all of the sudden I'm forcing Russians to accept immigrants, lol chill man, no one is pushing for immigration here, we can tolerate things if you're uninformed, but don't change subject when your caught tight and lie about it after.

You should clear things up and not create more confusion and less understanding in your comments.
I'm negative toward Islam in general, regardless of who practices it. But Albanians don't bother me personally in the slightest. Actually I never say Albanians are non-white or Turks or anything like that. Many Westerners think so because of Islam and the refugee influx. That's obviously BS when you look at genetic data.

I apologize if I put words in your mouth or strawmanned.

[The Illyrian Warrior]

Lol, Albanians are the ones scoring 90-100% SE European on autosomal

She sound just like moje ime, is her alter ego by any chance? :D Because I find impossible to keep track of new serb members that pop out lately.

[Kelmendasi]

She sound just like moje ime, is her alter ego by any chance? :D Because I find impossible to keep track of new serb members that pop out lately.
High chance lol, I think there is also a chance that "she" is Novi Pazar or some other banned Serb

[The Illyrian Warrior]

I'm negative toward Islam in general, regardless of who practices it. But Albanians don't bother me personally in the slightest. Actually I never say Albanians are non-white or Turks or anything like that. Many Westerners think so because of Islam and the refugee influx. That's obviously BS when you look at genetic data.

I apologize if I put words in your mouth or strawmanned.

Personally you're ok, you're a polite member but I find unimaginable for a person to speak on behalf of others or separate people who were inseparable on religious basis, but whoever that may be I can't tolerate people to speak on my behalf or put words in my mouth when Albanians overall have great respect for another.

To have negative feeling toward Islam or negative feeling toward immigrants, is your basic right that no one can take you away.

[SerbianGod]

Lol, Albanians are the ones scoring 90-100% SE European on autosomal

Albanians arent considered white people. You are treated like 3rd world peasants

[Kelmendasi]

Albanians arent considered white people. You are treated like 3rd world peasants
Ok

[Dibran]

Albanians arent considered white people. You are treated like 3rd world peasants

Serbian girls are nothing but cum dumpsters, and thats lower than a peasant.

[MalinBot]

Serbian girls are nothing but cum dumpsters, and thats lower than a peasant.

https://www.rferl.org/a/kosovo-wartime-rape-victims-kept-secret/25403115.html

Look, your mom made it on the news bro, is that how you got your serbian ydna?To think that you payed hundreds of $ for genetic tests, when I uncovered your origins with 1 google search.

[Dick]

Serbian girls are nothing but cum dumpsters, and thats lower than a peasant.

Insulting an entire group of women for being part of a specific ethnicity is lower than a peasant. Actually peasants are great people, humble and kind. If you get that triggered like a little girl by some obvious troll on the internet then maybe you should log off and do something better with your time.

[MercifulServant]

Edited

[Vlatko Vukovic]

Were is your DNA.Land?I am interested how much slavic you are there, it takes a few hours at most.I see it is accepted by ftdna family finder.

DNALand here:

http://i65.tinypic.com/2vbpvet.png

On every calculator i got high Northeast European score. Even on this DNALand, i got 0 Middle Eastern and all is added in Balkan :)

[Dibran]

Insulting an entire group of women for being part of a specific ethnicity is lower than a peasant. Actually peasants are great people, humble and kind. If you get that triggered like a little girl by some obvious troll on the internet then maybe you should log off and do something better with your time.

Says the guy 10,000 posts deep.

[Dick]

Says the guy 10,000 posts deep.

What does my post count have to do with you acting like a little triggered girl?

[Leto]

DNALand here:

http://i65.tinypic.com/2vbpvet.png

On every calculator i got high Northeast European score. Even on this DNALand, i got 0 Middle Eastern and all is added in Balkan :)
Basically half Southern, half Northern.

[Dibran]

What does my post count have to do with you acting like a little triggered girl?

"maybe you should log off and do something better with your time."

Most of your time is spent on here. Don't instruct others on how to utilize their time. I am barely on this forum to begin with.

No one is a triggered girl but you. You saw Serb and Slut in the same sentence and couldnt keep yourself from a witty response.|

The truth is, your compatriot invited herself to insult when she chose to insult all my people. Instead of you instructing your own against "broadly generalizing a people", you decided to jump on the band wagon. Bravo, little girl.

[Stears]

the MENA is from Kosovo Albanians that are over 2 millions. And wrong Hungary has more (Asiatic) R1a than Serbia.

Hungarians arent much whiter than indigenous Serbs except Szekely who were surprisingly white in your pics.

When I drive through Hun-gary I see no difference to Vojvodina.

R1A and R1B are the main and determinant haplogroups on the European continent. (Deal with it) Serbs (similar to other balkanites) are genetically anthropologically less European

[Stears]

Basically half Southern, half Northern.

You have high ratio of mongoloid like your nation's average. East baltid is also the most mongoloid looking phenotype in Europe.

[ЛыSSый]

Eurohohol Pavlo Petel

http://trinixy.ru/pics5/20140519/pavel_petel_27.jpg

[Leto]

You have high ratio of mongoloid like your nation's average
Get back to the hole you crawled out from, you fucking loser!

[Leto]

R1A and R1B are the main and determinant haplogroups on the European continent. (Deal with it) Serbs (similar to other balkanites) are genetically anthropologically less European
Hungary has a high ratio of R1a, like 25-30% of all men, you idiot. And autosomally it has a lot of Slavic ancestry obviously, since it's been next to Slovaks, Croats and Ukrainians for CENTURIES.
Listen, buddy. Feiichy told me you were not serious. Maybe it's time to stop trolling and insulting other people, especially those being barely different from you racially?

[Vlatko Vukovic]

Eurohohol Pavlo Petel

http://trinixy.ru/pics5/20140519/pavel_petel_27.jpg

This guy is Turanid as fuck.

[Leto]

The following information is inferred from 433 Hungarian samples from the Hungarian Magyar Y-DNA Project in Family Tree (29 May 2017):

26.1% R1a (15% Z280, 6.5% M458, 0.9% Z93=>S23201 "Altai/Tian Shan", 3.7% unknown)
19.2% R1b (6% L11-P312/U106, 5.3% P312, 4.2% L23/Z2103, 3.7% U106)
16.9% I2 (15.2% CTS10228, 1.4% M223, 0.5% L38)
8.3% I1
8.1% J2 (5.3% M410, 2.8% M102)
6.9% E1b1b1 (6% V13, 0.3% V22, 0.3% M123, 0.3% M81)
6.9% G2a
3.2% N (1.4% Z9136 "Ugric/Proto-Magyar", 0.5% M2019/VL67 "Siberia and Baykal", 0.5% Y7310 "Central Europe", 0.9% Z16981 "Baltic")- note: only unrelated males are sampled
2.3% Q (1.2% YP789 "Huns/Turkmens", 0.9% M346 "Siberia", 0.2% M242 "Xiongnu")
0.9% T
0.5% J1
0.2% L
0.2% C

[Vlatko Vukovic]

Hungary has a high ratio of R1a, like 25-30% of all men, you idiot. And autosomally it has a lot of Slavic ancestry obviously, since it's been next to Slovaks, Croats and Ukrainians for CENTURIES.
Listen, buddy. Feiichy told me you were not serious. Maybe it's time to stop trolling and insulting other people, especially those being barely different from you racially?

He claimed before 2 months that Belarus is the purest Slavic country together with Poland, now he claims that Belarus is mongoloid same as Russia is.

[Leto]

This guy is Turanid as fuck.
Lyssy is trolling as always. Have you ever seen him doing otherwise?

[Leto]

He claimed before 2 months that Belarus is the purest Slavic country together with Poland, now he claims that Belarus is mongoloid same as Russia is.
He claims to be Western, although he clusters with Moldovans and Croats, lol. And genetically he scores some amounts of both Siberian and South Asian. I think he is part Tsigan.

[Vlatko Vukovic]

Serbs (similar to other balkanites) are genetically anthropologically less European

Bosnia is Balkan Stears, don't you forgot this fact?

[Stears]

He claims to be Western, although he clusters with Moldovans and Croats, lol. And genetically he scores some amounts of both Siberian and South Asian. I think he is part Tsigan.

South Asian admixture in Belarussia is around 5-10 %, and unlike in Hungary, the Siberian is also relevant in your country. A don't forget your primitive semi-asian orthodox culture, and close to zero achievements in science and technology during your history.

[Leto]

Bosnia is Balkan Stears, don't you forgot this fact?
Compare him with yourself:

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 Baltic 31.22
2 North_Atlantic 28.2
3 West_Med 12.91
4 West_Asian 10.92
5 East_Med 10.62
6 South_Asian 2.02
7 Siberian 1.89
8 Red_Sea 0.76
9 Amerindian 0.76
10 Northeast_African 0.47
11 East_Asian 0.25

Single Population Sharing:

1 Moldavian 4.71
2 Hungarian 5
3 Croatian 5.78
4 Serbian 6.88
5 Austrian 9.2
6 East_German 9.96
7 Romanian 10.29
8 Ukrainian_Lviv 11.15
9 South_Polish 11.4
10 Ukrainian 12.53
11 Bulgarian 12.86
12 Polish 15.14
13 Southwest_Russian 15.81
14 West_German 15.83
15 Ukrainian_Belgorod 15.88
16 South_Dutch 17.33
17 Russian_Smolensk 17.41
18 Estonian_Polish 18.15
19 North_German 18.21
20 Belorussian 18.59


Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

1 89.6% Hungarian + 10.4% Kabardin @ 2.29
2 90.1% Hungarian + 9.9% Balkar @ 2.38
3 90.3% Hungarian + 9.7% Adygei @ 2.42
4 89.5% Hungarian + 10.5% Kumyk @ 2.42
5 90.6% Hungarian + 9.4% North_Ossetian @ 2.43
6 89.9% Hungarian + 10.1% Chechen @ 2.58
7 90.5% Hungarian + 9.5% Afghan_Tadjik @ 2.63
8 92.3% Hungarian + 7.7% Abhkasian @ 2.66
9 91.1% Hungarian + 8.9% Ossetian @ 2.66
10 90.2% Hungarian + 9.8% Lezgin @ 2.71
11 92% Hungarian + 8% Georgian @ 2.73
12 88.9% Hungarian + 11.1% Nogay @ 2.73
13 93% Hungarian + 7% Makrani @ 2.78
14 90% Hungarian + 10% Tadjik @ 2.79
15 93.3% Hungarian + 6.7% Brahui @ 2.8
16 91.2% Hungarian + 8.8% Afghan_Pashtun @ 2.8
17 93.2% Hungarian + 6.8% Balochi @ 2.83
18 90.1% Hungarian + 9.9% Tabassaran @ 2.84
19 82.8% Moldavian + 17.2% North_German @ 2.85
20 90.5% Hungarian + 9.5% Turkmen @ 2.86

Western people like Germans and French score over 40% North Atlantic, he scores only 28%. Plus high amount of West Asian and East Med, higher than an average Russian for example. He is actually more Caucasian than the Hungarian reference on Eurogenes.

[Stears]

Compare him with yourself:

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 Baltic 31.22
2 North_Atlantic 28.2
3 West_Med 12.91
4 West_Asian 10.92
5 East_Med 10.62
6 South_Asian 2.02
7 Siberian 1.89
8 Red_Sea 0.76
9 Amerindian 0.76
10 Northeast_African 0.47
11 East_Asian 0.25

Single Population Sharing:

1 Moldavian 4.71
2 Hungarian 5
3 Croatian 5.78
4 Serbian 6.88
5 Austrian 9.2
6 East_German 9.96
7 Romanian 10.29
8 Ukrainian_Lviv 11.15
9 South_Polish 11.4
10 Ukrainian 12.53
11 Bulgarian 12.86
12 Polish 15.14
13 Southwest_Russian 15.81
14 West_German 15.83
15 Ukrainian_Belgorod 15.88
16 South_Dutch 17.33
17 Russian_Smolensk 17.41
18 Estonian_Polish 18.15
19 North_German 18.21
20 Belorussian 18.59


Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

1 89.6% Hungarian + 10.4% Kabardin @ 2.29
2 90.1% Hungarian + 9.9% Balkar @ 2.38
3 90.3% Hungarian + 9.7% Adygei @ 2.42
4 89.5% Hungarian + 10.5% Kumyk @ 2.42
5 90.6% Hungarian + 9.4% North_Ossetian @ 2.43
6 89.9% Hungarian + 10.1% Chechen @ 2.58
7 90.5% Hungarian + 9.5% Afghan_Tadjik @ 2.63
8 92.3% Hungarian + 7.7% Abhkasian @ 2.66
9 91.1% Hungarian + 8.9% Ossetian @ 2.66
10 90.2% Hungarian + 9.8% Lezgin @ 2.71
11 92% Hungarian + 8% Georgian @ 2.73
12 88.9% Hungarian + 11.1% Nogay @ 2.73
13 93% Hungarian + 7% Makrani @ 2.78
14 90% Hungarian + 10% Tadjik @ 2.79
15 93.3% Hungarian + 6.7% Brahui @ 2.8
16 91.2% Hungarian + 8.8% Afghan_Pashtun @ 2.8
17 93.2% Hungarian + 6.8% Balochi @ 2.83
18 90.1% Hungarian + 9.9% Tabassaran @ 2.84
19 82.8% Moldavian + 17.2% North_German @ 2.85
20 90.5% Hungarian + 9.5% Turkmen @ 2.86

Western people like Germans and French score over 40% North Atlantic, he scores only 28%. Plus high amount of West Asian and East Med, higher than an average Russian for example. He is actually more Caucasian than the Hungarian reference on Eurogenes.


Of course I far from Belorussian samples, because I am not enough mongoloid to be similar to belarussians.

[Jana]

Of course I far from Belorussian samples, because I am not enough mongoloid to be similar to belarussians.

You aren't northern enough to be close to Belarusians :)

[Jana]

Stears is a troll"!!

[Vlatko Vukovic]

Compare him with yourself:

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 Baltic 31.22
2 North_Atlantic 28.2
3 West_Med 12.91
4 West_Asian 10.92
5 East_Med 10.62
6 South_Asian 2.02
7 Siberian 1.89
8 Red_Sea 0.76
9 Amerindian 0.76
10 Northeast_African 0.47
11 East_Asian 0.25

Single Population Sharing:

1 Moldavian 4.71
2 Hungarian 5
3 Croatian 5.78
4 Serbian 6.88
5 Austrian 9.2
6 East_German 9.96
7 Romanian 10.29
8 Ukrainian_Lviv 11.15
9 South_Polish 11.4
10 Ukrainian 12.53
11 Bulgarian 12.86
12 Polish 15.14
13 Southwest_Russian 15.81
14 West_German 15.83
15 Ukrainian_Belgorod 15.88
16 South_Dutch 17.33
17 Russian_Smolensk 17.41
18 Estonian_Polish 18.15
19 North_German 18.21
20 Belorussian 18.59


Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

1 89.6% Hungarian + 10.4% Kabardin @ 2.29
2 90.1% Hungarian + 9.9% Balkar @ 2.38
3 90.3% Hungarian + 9.7% Adygei @ 2.42
4 89.5% Hungarian + 10.5% Kumyk @ 2.42
5 90.6% Hungarian + 9.4% North_Ossetian @ 2.43
6 89.9% Hungarian + 10.1% Chechen @ 2.58
7 90.5% Hungarian + 9.5% Afghan_Tadjik @ 2.63
8 92.3% Hungarian + 7.7% Abhkasian @ 2.66
9 91.1% Hungarian + 8.9% Ossetian @ 2.66
10 90.2% Hungarian + 9.8% Lezgin @ 2.71
11 92% Hungarian + 8% Georgian @ 2.73
12 88.9% Hungarian + 11.1% Nogay @ 2.73
13 93% Hungarian + 7% Makrani @ 2.78
14 90% Hungarian + 10% Tadjik @ 2.79
15 93.3% Hungarian + 6.7% Brahui @ 2.8
16 91.2% Hungarian + 8.8% Afghan_Pashtun @ 2.8
17 93.2% Hungarian + 6.8% Balochi @ 2.83
18 90.1% Hungarian + 9.9% Tabassaran @ 2.84
19 82.8% Moldavian + 17.2% North_German @ 2.85
20 90.5% Hungarian + 9.5% Turkmen @ 2.86

Western people like Germans and French score over 40% North Atlantic, he scores only 28%. Plus high amount of West Asian and East Med, higher than an average Russian for example. He is actually more Caucasian than the Hungarian reference on Eurogenes.

Mine and his Single populations plots similar, also i am more Baltic and West Med influenced, while he is more North Atlantic, East Med and bit more Asiatic than me. That is what these calulators show.

[Leto]

South Asian admixture in Belarussia is around 5-10 %
Lol, what? It's 1% at best.


and unlike in Hungary, the Siberian is also relevant in your country.
2-3% on average (maximum). I've never seen a full Belorussian scoring over 3-4% on GEDmatch.

A don't forget your primitive semi-asian orthodox culture.
Asian? Lol. Greece is Asian? Bulgaria, Romania are Asian to you?
Is this primitive to you?
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/7d/Naval_Cathedral_of_St_Nicholas_in_Kronstadt_01.jpg/1200px-Naval_Cathedral_of_St_Nicholas_in_Kronstadt_01.jpg
https://img-fotki.yandex.ru/get/6700/67700761.1cb/0_f37fb_d8dcf4d5_orig.jpg
Orthodox Christianity is the true way to follow the teaching of Jesus Christ.

[The Illyrian Warrior]

Stears is a troll"!!

Congrats I didn't know you were engaged, now I see through newest forum update.

[Porn Master]

@Stearsolina


Stears left you alone?

[Stears]

Hungary has a high ratio of R1a, like 25-30% of all men, you idiot. And autosomally it has a lot of Slavic ancestry obviously, since it's been next to Slovaks, Croats and Ukrainians for CENTURIES.
Listen, buddy. Feiichy told me you were not serious. Maybe it's time to stop trolling and insulting other people, especially those being barely different from you racially?

I have never heard about the existence of Ukrainians in Kingdom of Hungary. Slovaks were culturally different, they had eastern culture instead of Central European. Read Carleton S. Coon about that.

[Jana]

Congrats I didn't know you were engaged, now I see through newest forum update.

Thanks :)

[Stears]

You aren't northern enough to be close to Belarusians :)


If mongoloid admixture means northern I don't want to be. Northern Germanic nations are not really northern in genetic sense. Northern means = orthodox north-eastern, with lower culture and less European genetically. You confuse it with the magic term Western.

[Leto]

Of course I far from Belorussian samples, because I am not enough mongoloid to be similar to belarussians.
If you were intelligent enough, you would look at the spreadsheets before posting such nonsense. And who is comparing Hungary and Belarus? You could engage in a normal and civil discussion without making stupid and ludicrous statements. Especially given that we already know your genetic make up. You're not even the most Western Hungarian. I bet there are Czechs who are more Western than you. DEAL WITH IT as you say.

[Jana]

@Stearsolina


Stears left you alone?

:confused:

[Stears]

Lol, what? It's 1% at best.

2-3% on average (maximum). I've never seen a full Belorussian scoring over 3-4% on GEDmatch.

Asian? Lol. Greece is Asian? Bulgaria, Romania are Asian to you?
Is this primitive to you?
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/7d/Naval_Cathedral_of_St_Nicholas_in_Kronstadt_01.jpg/1200px-Naval_Cathedral_of_St_Nicholas_in_Kronstadt_01.jpg
https://img-fotki.yandex.ru/get/6700/67700761.1cb/0_f37fb_d8dcf4d5_orig.jpg
Orthodox Christianity is the true way to follow the teaching of Jesus Christ.


Culturally, both islam and the semi-asian orthodox countries were traditionally west-hater civilizations.


THE WESTERN (Catholic-protestant) WORLD is depicted in dark blue on the map of prof. S. Huntington:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/2f/Clash_of_Civilizations_map.png


What is Western Civilization?
The earliest mention of Western civilization “Occidental civilis”
After the Great Schism (The East-West Schism /formally in 1054/, between Western Roman Catholic and Eastern Orthodox Christianity.) Hungary determined itself as the easternmost bastion of Western civilisation (This statement was affirmed later by Pope Pius II who wrote that to Emperor Friedrich III, “Hungary is the shield of Christianity and the protector of Western civilization”)


It is not a secret in history, that countries civilizations are/were not in the same level of development.
It is well-known that Western and Central Europe, ( the so-called Western civilization) was always more developed than Orthodox Slavic or Eastern European civilization.
The differences in culture (material and verbal), legal constitutional, societal, political, economical, infrastructural, technological and scientific development, between Orthodox countries and Western Christian (Catholic-Protestant) countries were similar great, as the differences between Northern America (USA Canada) and Southern- (Latino) America.




MEMENTO:
Western things which were not existed in orthodox world:




1. POLITICAL AND CONSTITUTIONAL development: Medieval appearance of parliaments (The parliament is a legislative body(!), DO NOT CONFUSE with the “councils of monarchs” which existed since the very beginnings of human history), the estates of the realm, the clergy, the nobility, and the commoners,


2. Local SELF GOVERNMENT status of big royal/imperial cities, which are the direct ancestors (the continuity) of modern local self governmental systems. Do not confuse the local self governments with the so-called city states. Sovereign city states were the earliest form of states in Human history ( For example: Sumerian city states), and that legal concept has nothing common with the self-governments/local governments of cities within a country or within an Empire.

3. ECONOMY: The medieval appearance of banking systems and social effects and status of urban bourgeoisie, the absolute dominance of money-economy (when the vast majority of trade based on money and the taxes customs duties were collected in money) from the 12th -13th century, instead of the former primitive bartel-based commerce (barter dominated the economies orthodox world until the 17-18th centuries.)


4. HIGHER EDUCATION: The medieval appearance of universities and the medieval appearance of SECULAR intellectuals,


5. CULTURE: Knights, the knight-culture, chivalric code, (and the technological effects of crusades from the Holy Land,)
Music and literature: courtly love, troubadours, Gregorian chant, Ars nova, Organum, Motet, Madrigal, Canon and Ballata, Liturgical drama, Novellas,
medieval western THEATER: Mystery or cycle plays, morality and passion plays, which developed into the renaissance theater, the direct ancestor of modern theaters.
Philosophy: Scholasticism and humanist philosophy,


6. The medieval usage of Latin alphabet and medieval spread of movable type printing,


7. TECHNOLOGY: The guild system is an association of artisans or merchants, which organized the training education, and directed master's exam system for artisians. Due to the compulsory foreign studies of the artisian master's candidates, the guilds played key role in the fast spread of technologies and industrial knowledge in the medieval Western World.


8. The defence systems & fortifications: The spread of stone/brick castle defense -systems, the town-walls of western cities from the 11th century. (In the orthodox world, only the capital cities had such a walls . The countries of the Balkan region and the territory of Russian states fell under Ottoman/Mongolian rule very rapidly - with a
single decesive open-field battle - due to the lack of the networks of stone/brick castles and fortresses in these countries. The only exception was the greek inhabited Byzantine territories which were well fortified.)


9. FINEARTS and ARCHITECTURE: western architecture, sculpture paintings and fine-arts: the Romanesque style, the Gothic style and the Renaissance style.
The orthodox church buildings and „palaces(?)” were very little, they had primitive structure and poor decorations, their style were influenced by oriental non-European arabic, persian and Syrian influenced Byzantine ornamentics.


10.The renaissance & humanism , the reformation and the enlightenment did not influenced/affected the Orthodox (Eastern European) countries.


11. Before 1870, the industrialization that had developed in Western and Central Europe and the United States did not extend in any significant way to the rest of the world. In Eastern Europe, industrialization lagged far behind, and started only in the 20th century. Their infrastructural and economic development was also very very slow, and many determinant factors of modern civilization - as we called them as civilized way of life - (railways, the electrification of cities, drain & sewer systems, water pipe systems, spread of tap water and bathrooms, telecommuncations etc... spread many-many decades (60-80 years) later.


It is no wonder that their contribution in science technology and innovations are completely negligible in Human history by the WESTERN standards.

[Leto]

I have never heard about the existence of Ukrainians in Kingdom of Hungary. Slovaks were culturally different, they had eastern culture instead of Central European. Read Carleton S. Coon about that.
Lol, Hungary fucking borders on Ukraine and there's like 150-200k fucking Hungarians over there in Ukraine. What the fuck are you talking about? Culturally different, lmao. The only difference is their language which is Indo-European, by the way, not Uralic. Race, religion, etc. are all the same.

[Jana]

If you were intelligent enough, you would look at the spreadsheets before posting such nonsense. And who is comparing Hungary and Belarus? You could engage in a normal and civil discussion without making stupid and ludicrous statements. Especially given that we already know your genetic make up. You're not even the most Western Hungarian. I bet there are Czechs who are more Western than you. DEAL WITH IT as you say.

I am too more north-western shifted than he :) I cluster between Hungary and Austria on K15.

Stears is angry, because he has a Hunnic name :P

[Leto]

Stears is a troll"!!
Please remove that asshole from this place. I mean I seriously suggest that Stears be banned for trolling.

[Vlatko Vukovic]

Stears is angry, because he has a Hunnic name :P

Attila Balamber Balimber Bleda Dengizich Edeco
Hormidac Mundzuc Octar Oebarsius Onulph Roua
Ruga
Blaedla

Tuldila Uldin

Some of those