The difference among kurds

[Kurd123]

Hey everyone, first post though I have been following the forum for a long time..
so my question is:
Are there genetic differences among kurds from different religions? (jews, muslims etc..)

[palawanaman]

Hey everyone, first post though I have been following the forum for a long time..
so my question is:
Are there genetic differences among kurds from different religions? (jews, muslims etc..)

Kurds are the closest to persians, but are the darkest because they are mixed with saudis i have heard and also mixed with indians if im not mistaken.

[Pahli]

Kurds are the closest to persians, but are the darkest because they are mixed with saudis i have heard and also mixed with indians if im not mistaken.

I've never heard of Kurds mixing with Saudis or Indians xD

There are some intermarriages with Iraqi and Syrian Arabs which could explain the darker ones

[palawanaman]

I've never heard of Kurds mixing with Saudis or Indians xD

There are some intermarriages with Iraqi and Syrian Arabs which could explain the darker ones

Very true, arent the iraqis or syrian arabs quite dark becuase of being saudi in blood? And btw yes they have 10-20 percent south asian in them, specifically the gene LM20 found in punjabis and sindh groups.

[Marmara]

I've never heard of Kurds mixing with Saudis or Indians xD

There are some intermarriages with Iraqi and Syrian Arabs which could explain the darker ones

Neolithic farmers. We have those dark Kurds, they don't resemble Arabs.

[Pahli]

Neolithic farmers. We have those dark Kurds, they don't resemble Arabs.

Yep, I've seen Turks as well that were very dark which surprised me but they were from Sivas and Şanlıurfa, its just genetics I guess.

[Kivan]

Kurds are the closest to persians, but are the darkest because they are mixed with saudis i have heard and also mixed with indians if im not mistaken.

It's taking too long to some mod ban you again

[palawanaman]

Neolithic farmers. We have those dark Kurds, they don't resemble Arabs.

Maybe the turkish kurds are different in genetics. I have seen that the turkish kurds have 10 percent South asian ancestry and the rest being west asian and very litle caucasus. The west asian aspect can explain the arab looking kurds i see everywhere.

[Böri]

Maybe the turkish kurds are different in genetics. I have seen that the turkish kurds have 10 percent South asian ancestry and the rest being west asian and very litle caucasus. The west asian aspect can explain the arab looking kurds i see everywhere.

Georgians and Abaza people are purely West Asian Component yet they aren't that dark on average. Dark Kurds are dark more because of other components. They are 13-20% SW Asian and 5-10% South Asian. An average between 20-30% combined. That results in more darker skin complexion on average among Kurds or Armenians compared to Georgians or Abazas.

[Marmara]

Yep, I've seen Turks as well that were very dark which surprised me but they were from Sivas and Şanlıurfa, its just genetics I guess.

I'm from Şanlıurfa :D Şanlıurfa is the darkest province of Turkey, about 50% of population is Kurdish, 10% of it is Zaza, 25% is Arab and 15% is Turkish. People you've seen could be Arabs or Kurds. Kurds and Turks from this province are also really dark due to Semitic influence I guess, meanwhile Arabs are very, very Arabian influenced (they have Bedouin ancestry)

Arabs from Urfa:
https://youtu.be/0MBzlg8xuOI

[palawanaman]

Georgians and Abaza people are purely West Asian Component yet they aren't that dark on average. Dark Kurds are dark more because of other components. They are 13-20% SW Asian and 5-10% South Asian. An average between 20-30% combined. That results in more darker skin complexion on average among Kurds or Armenians compared to Georgians or Abazas.

Interesting, but it could at least explain the arab look that i see on most kurds, that being the west asain components dont u agree?

[palawanaman]

I'm from Şanlıurfa :D Şanlıurfa is the darkest province of Turkey, about 50% of population is Kurdish, 10% of it is Zaza, 25% is Arab and 15% is Turkish. People you've seen could be Arabs or Kurds. Kurds and Turks from this province are also really dark due to Semitic influence I guess, meanwhile Arabs are very, very Arabian influenced (they have Bedouin ancestry)

Arabs from Urfa:
https://youtu.be/0MBzlg8xuOI

Oh yes they are very darrk compared to the rest of turks dont you think?

[Pahli]

Arabs from Urfa:
https://youtu.be/0MBzlg8xuOI

Well, I met a Kurd from there too but he was slightly lighter and more average looking Kurd, the other guy identified as Turkish but I suspect he is assimilated because he was quite dark.

[palawanaman]

Georgians and Abaza people are purely West Asian Component yet they aren't that dark on average. Dark Kurds are dark more because of other components. They are 13-20% SW Asian and 5-10% South Asian. An average between 20-30% combined. That results in more darker skin complexion on average among Kurds or Armenians compared to Georgians or Abazas.

Armenians are quite light in complexion, atleast compared to the kurds dont you think?

[Pahli]

Georgians and Abaza people are purely West Asian Component yet they aren't that dark on average. Dark Kurds are dark more because of other components. They are 13-20% SW Asian and 5-10% South Asian. An average between 20-30% combined. That results in more darker skin complexion on average among Kurds or Armenians compared to Georgians or Abazas.

You are right but the difference is that Georgians and Abaza have more CHG and more NE_Euro, but they still also have some SW Asian and little South Asian, less than Kurds and Armenians obviously.

[palawanaman]

Georgians and Abaza people are purely West Asian Component yet they aren't that dark on average. Dark Kurds are dark more because of other components. They are 13-20% SW Asian and 5-10% South Asian. An average between 20-30% combined. That results in more darker skin complexion on average among Kurds or Armenians compared to Georgians or Abazas.

Were are the georgians found?

[Böri]

Armenians are quite light in complexion, atleast compared to the kurds dont you think?

Slightly lighter maybe on average yet Armenians mingled a lot with Assyrians who are also dark in complexion. Armenians also have high Southwest Asian + South Asian components when combined. Around 20%.

[palawanaman]

Slightly lighter maybe on average yet Armenians mingled a lot with Assyrians who are also dark in complexion. Armenians also have high Southwest Asian + South Asian components when combined. Around 20%.

Wow, where did all the south asian component come from? I am surprised because the distance between the south asians and the kurds is very far. The south asians must have migrated out of india into iranian and turkish as well as some central asian territories ?

[Aren]

Georgians and Abaza people are purely West Asian Component yet they aren't that dark on average. Dark Kurds are dark more because of other components. They are 13-20% SW Asian and 5-10% South Asian. An average between 20-30% combined. That results in more darker skin complexion on average among Kurds or Armenians compared to Georgians or Abazas.

What proof is there that auDNA effects looks in that degree you're describing it? Are Ukrainians lighter cause they have more of the North European component than Scandinavians? Why is there blonde Greeks and darkhaired Finns?
Most of the phenotypical differences exist because of sexual selection and adaptation.

[palawanaman]

What proof is there that auDNA effects looks in that degree you're describing it? Are Ukrainians lighter cause they have more of the North European component than Scandinavians? Why is there blonde Greeks and darkhaired Finns?
Most of the phenotypical differences exist because of sexual selection and adaptation.

Comparing kurds with turkish people is silly in my opinion, they are much darker than turks, because turks have very little impact from south asians. Overall kurds are 30 percent south asian, which is a lot.

[Pahli]

What proof is there that auDNA effects looks in that degree you're describing it? Are Ukrainians lighter cause they have more of the North European component than Scandinavians? Why is there blonde Greeks and darkhaired Finns?
Most of the phenotypical differences exist because of sexual selection and adaptation.

Depends on what kind of alleles for skin colour, hair colour and etc you carry from your parents, I've seen Assyrians that are lighter than me lol and can pass in Europe


Comparing kurds with turkish people is silly in my opinion, they are much darker than turks, because turks have very little impact from south asians. Overall kurds are 30 percent south asian, which is a lot.

Dude stop being autistic xD

[Aren]

Depends on what kind of alleles for skin colour, hair colour and etc you carry from your parents, I've seen Assyrians that are lighter than me lol and can pass in Europe



Dude stop being autistic xD

Exactly SNP:s that determine looks are not nearly as numerous as what is being tested in various DNA companies. Usually it's a handful that determine eye color, skin color etc. I mean WHG was pred dark, Yamnaya was pred dark, ENF was pred dark etc. Somehow we ended up with a pred light population like Scandinavians. It's almost exclusively sexual selection.

[Marmara]

Well, I met a Kurd from there too but he was slightly lighter and more average looking Kurd, the other guy identified as Turkish but I suspect he is assimilated because he was quite dark.


Kurds(Zazas) from Şanlıurfa:


https://youtu.be/RUxOGi-uz7c

Turks are dark too, but Arabs are darkest. This province is the darkest province in Turkey, it's next to Syria with many Bedouins.

[palawanaman]

Depends on what kind of alleles for skin colour, hair colour and etc you carry from your parents, I've seen Assyrians that are lighter than me lol and can pass in Europe



Dude stop being autistic xD

im sorry but bori said "hey are 13-20% SW Asian and 5-10% South Asian. An average between 20-30% combined"

[Kamal900]

Depends on what kind of alleles for skin colour, hair colour and etc you carry from your parents, I've seen Assyrians that are lighter than me lol and can pass in Europe



Dude stop being autistic xD

Emirati Arabs are around 25% South Asians genetically on average due to extensive admixture between the natives and South Asians and even Iranians as well back in the day. Saudis are less than 10% South Asians on average and they cluster more closer to us Palestinians than Yemeni Arabs do.

[palawanaman]

Emirati Arabs are around 25% South Asians genetically on average due to extensive admixture between the natives and South Asians and even Iranians as well back in the day. Saudis are less than 10% South Asians on average and they cluster more closer to us Palestinians than Yemeni Arabs do.

Saudis have a lot of black in them though thats why their nose is so big and wide?

[Pahli]

Exactly SNP:s that determine looks are not nearly as much as being tested in various DNA companies. Usually it's a handful that determine eye color, skin color etc. I mean WHG was pred dark, Yamnaya was pred dark, ENF was pred dark etc. Somehow we ended up with a pred light population like Scandinavians. It's almost exclusively sexual selection.

AFAIK Yamnaya wasn't dark, but thats a different story now. Its been said that light skin colour and light hair originated in ANE which made out 50% of CHG and 75% of EHG, those alleles were passed down on West Asians that originated in the Caucasus and Eastern European hunter gatherers. That's why Finland and the Baltics are more light haired than Scandinavia because they have more alleles from ANE (supposedly).

[StonyArabia]

Kurds are the closest to persians, but are the darkest because they are mixed with saudis i have heard and also mixed with indians if im not mistaken.

LOL, no Kurds are not that dark, actually Persians on average are darker than Kurds. Some Kurds have intermarried with Iraqi Arabs, who indeed in turn are an Arabian subset population, however some Assyrians were probably Kurdized. I don't think they have much Indian, and the South Asian they have is ancient not recent. Kurds are not that dark, some of them can even be blond, which is more rare in ethnic Persians, plus the North Iranian groups like Gilaki, Mazandrani, are much closer to Kurds than they are to Persians.

[palawanaman]

LOL, no Kurds are not that dark, actually Persians on average are darker than Kurds. Some Kurds have intermarried with Iraqi Arabs, who indeed in turn are an Arabian subset population, however some Assyrians were probably Kurdized. I don't think they have much Indian, and the South Asian they have is ancient not recent. Kurds are not that dark, some of them can even be blond, which is more rare in ethnic Persians, plus the North Iranian groups like Gilaki, Mazandrani, are much closer to Kurds than they are to Persians.

Oh ok. Dont the northern kurds look like northern afghans? They have blonde hair and blue eyes and stuff like the nooristani, afghan pamirids and the gilzai pashtuns as well as some tajiks (blonde hair is very common among turkic pashtuns and tajiks)

[Kamal900]

Saudis have a lot of black in them though thats why their nose is so big and wide?

Fuck no. They're far less SSA than North Africans even. Yemeni Arabs though score similar SSA percentage as them though which is why they're more divergent than Saudis.

[palawanaman]

Fuck no. They're far less SSA than North Africans even. Yemeni Arabs though score similar SSA percentage as them though which is why they're more divergent than Saudis.

Oh ok. But arent the saudis quite dark? If they score close to palestinians how comes most of them are dark? Some of them look a bit indian as well?

[Kamal900]

Oh ok. But arent the saudis quite dark? If they score close to palestinians how comes most of them are dark? Some of them look a bit indian as well?

Due to the climate really. Being dark doesn't necessarily means that you need to have Black ancestry. The Arabid race does have some similarities with Northern Indians.

[StonyArabia]

Oh ok. But arent the saudis quite dark? If they score close to palestinians how comes most of them are dark? Some of them look a bit indian as well?

Adaptation to the harsh Desert climate. If you were light, you would get skin cancer. Actually Iraqis are pretty dark especially Southern Iraqis, but once you go more North they get lighter, but Kurds are the lightest group in Iraq actually. Iraq also has very harsh climate, and the sunlight is very strong down there.

[palawanaman]

Adaptation to the harsh Desert climate. If you were light, you would get skin cancer. Actually Iraqis are pretty dark especially Southern Iraqis, but once you go more North they get lighter, but Kurds are the lightest group in Iraq actually. Iraq also has very harsh climate, and the sunlight is very strong down there.

Ok thanks. So if the saudis were born in some place like england would they be light as iranian kurds?

[Aren]

AFAIK Yamnaya wasn't dark, but thats a different story now. Its been said that light skin colour and light hair originated in ANE which made out 50% of CHG and 75% of EHG, those alleles were passed down on West Asians that originated in the Caucasus and Eastern European hunter gatherers. That's why Finland and the Baltics are more light haired than Scandinavia because they have more alleles from ANE (supposedly).

No that's not completely right. Check genetikers blog. Yamnaya was pred dark, or atleast majority dark haired and mixed with both light and dark eyes. Blondism has been found among Scandinavian-HG and some EHG. Also in the Narva-Lithuania foragers but not in majority. First time I hear it's related to ANE, where did you hear it? And no Balts are significantly darker than Scandinavians. Finns are on par.

[StonyArabia]

Ok thanks. So if the saudis were born in some place like england would they be light as iranian kurds?

No, but they would lose the extra tan, which might make them darker than they already are. Plus that would take generations for such adaptation to happen. Iranians are not that light, Kurds are light because they live in the mountains, less sun there.

[Böri]

Genetic components influence the skin complexion and racial type though there isnt a 100% correlation. There is nothing such as adaptation. You have Anglo-Saxons in Australia but they don't become Australoid through time because of the environment around Sydney. Genes dont change by climate or environment effects.

[palawanaman]

No, but they would lose the extra tan, which might make them darker than they already are. Plus that would take generations for such adaptation to happen. Iranians are not that light, Kurds are light because they live in the mountains, less sun there.

The people of the mountains of afghanistan are actually lighter than kurdish people and have more european tendancies did u know that? Even some people in gilgit pakistan.

[palawanaman]

Genetic components influence the skin complexion and racial type though there isnt a 100% correlation. There is nothing such as adaptation. You have Anglo-Saxons in Australia but they don't become Australoid through time because of the environment around Sydney. Genes dont change by climate or environment effects.

Epigenetics reacts to climate change. This epigenetics idea might have sped up evolution slightly.

[Aren]

Genetic components influence the skin complexion and racial type though there isnt a 100% correlation. There is nothing such as adaptation. You have Anglo-Saxons in Australia but they don't become Australoid through time because of the environment around Sydney. Genes dont change by climate or environment effects.

Yeah sure compare the 21st century to ancient times. It's not like Anglo-Australians got sunscream, or need to work in bright sunlight out in the fields to not die of hunger, why would they need to adapt in the 21st century? Tell me why you can find blonde Greeks and darkhaired Finns then?

[Pahli]

No that's not completely right. Check genetikers blog. Yamnaya was pred dark, or atleast majority dark haired and mixed with both light and dark eyes. Blondism has been found among Scandinavian-HG and some EHG. Also in the Narva-Lithuania foragers but not in majority. First time I hear it's related to ANE, where did you hear it? And no Balts are significantly darker than Scandinavians. Finns are on par.

Scandinavian HG is EHG admixed WHG, if they were pure WHG they would've been darker, anyways here is a link, I read it somewhere else but cannot find the thread:

http://eurogenes.blogspot.dk/2017/05/european-blond-hair-may-have-originated.html

North East Balts and Finns are the most blond if I'm not mistaken, idk about the other Baltic groups but I thought they were as well.

[StonyArabia]

The people of the mountains of afghanistan are actually lighter than kurdish people and have more european tendancies did u know that? Even some people in gilgit pakistan.

Yes, but Kurds on average are lighter than Pashtuns. Pashtuns have way more South Asian admixture than Kurds

[Marmara]

Oh yes they are very darrk compared to the rest of turks dont you think?

People would simply assume them be Syrian refugees if people see them elsewhere, which is not stupid to assume.

[palawanaman]

Yes, but Kurds on average are lighter than Pashtuns. Pashtuns have way more South Asian admixture than Kurds

Yes true. But on average i think the northern ones are the lighter because they have some South asian influence but even more r1a1. Secondly the south asian influence of afghans is mainly because of Kalasha group who are actually white anyways (if broken down) so thats why afghans have sharper features than kurds i think.

[palawanaman]

People would simply assume them be Syrian refugees if people see them elsewhere, which is not stupid to assume.

Yes true, they do resemble syrians for the most part.

[Aren]

Scandinavian HG is EHG admixed WHG, if they were pure WHG they would've been darker, anyways here is a link, I read it somewhere else but cannot find the thread:

http://eurogenes.blogspot.dk/2017/05/european-blond-hair-may-have-originated.html

North East Balts and Finns are the most blond if I'm not mistaken, idk about the other Baltic groups but I thought they were as well.

Not all WHG that has been found was dark/bronze skinned. The WHG from Switzerland had light skin and blue eyes. Also SHG is more like WHG + some ANE. Closer to WHG than to EHG. But I guess it makes sense that it came from ANE, but still it doesn't change the fact that only few of the EHG/SHG/Narva-foragers were blonde. I think it strongly suggest sexual selection in the case of Northern Europeans.

Also as much as David is knowledeable let's not forget he has some bias. ANE btw is equally high in Scots as it is in Scandinavians, but Scots are significantly darker haired imo. I don't wanna go into a discussion about what population is lighter since it's nearly impossible to know, but general stereotypes give us atleast a hint. And although Balts are considered to be quite blonde, often times it's Scandinavians and Finns that are heavily stereotyped as blonde.

[palawanaman]

Yes, but Kurds on average are lighter than Pashtuns. Pashtuns have way more South Asian admixture than Kurds

are u sure they are lighter?
here is a documentary about afghans
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WcbHMv6jTpE
here is one about kurds
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tmbo9lBfE58
Afghans are much lighter it may seem

[Marmara]

Oh ok. Dont the northern kurds look like northern afghans? They have blonde hair and blue eyes and stuff like the nooristani, afghan pamirids and the gilzai pashtuns as well as some tajiks (blonde hair is very common among turkic pashtuns and tajiks)

What the hell is a Turkic pashtun?


Adaptation to the harsh Desert climate. If you were light, you would get skin cancer. Actually Iraqis are pretty dark especially Southern Iraqis, but once you go more North they get lighter, but Kurds are the lightest group in Iraq actually. Iraq also has very harsh climate, and the sunlight is very strong down there.

Adoptations ended after last ice age, people were smart enough and had technology to overcome natural obscures. Arabia used to be darker than today.


Scandinavian HG is EHG admixed WHG, if they were pure WHG they would've been darker, anyways here is a link, I read it somewhere else but cannot find the thread:

http://eurogenes.blogspot.dk/2017/05/european-blond-hair-may-have-originated.html

North East Balts and Finns are the most blond if I'm not mistaken, idk about the other Baltic groups but I thought they were as well.

ANE was dark skinned and mongoloid, close to Amerindians, Inuits. Yamnaya people were originally swarthy, they mixed with North European farming populations who were mostly blonde blue eyed.

[Pahli]

Not all WHG that has been found was dark/bronze skinned. The WHG from Switzerland had light skin and blue eyes. Also SHG is more like WHG + some ANE. Closer to WHG than to EHG. But I guess it makes sense that it came from ANE, but still it doesn't change the fact that only few of the EHG/SHG/Narva-foragers were blonde. I think it strongly suggest sexual selection in the case of Northern Europeans.

Also as much as David is knowledeable let's not forget he has some bias. ANE btw is equally high in Scots as it is in Scandinavians, but Scots are significantly darker haired imo. I don't wanna go into a discussion about what population is lighter since it's nearly impossible to know, but general stereotypes give us atleast a hint. And although Balts are considered to be quite blonde, often times it's Scandinavians and Finns that are heavily stereotyped as blonde.

I don't disagree at all, and I made a typo, was meant to say that SHG was WHG with EHG admix.

[palawanaman]

What the hell is a Turkic pashtun?



Adoptations ended after last ice age, people were smart enough and had technology to overcome natural obscures. Arabia used to be darker than today.



ANE was dark skinned and mongoloid. Yamnaya people were originally swarthy, they mixed with North European farming populations who were mostly blonde blue eyed.

Ghilzai pashtuns are a tribe of pashtuns that have an affinity with the pamirids of afghanistan and tajikstan. They have nearly as much turkic in them as tajiks

[Pahli]

What the hell is a Turkic pashtun?



Adoptations ended after last ice age, people were smart enough and had technology to overcome natural obscures. Arabia used to be darker than today.



ANE was dark skinned and mongoloid. Yamnaya people were originally swarthy, they mixed with North European farming populations who were mostly blonde blue eyed.

Samples from ANE has proven it to be Caucasoid, especially the Afontova Gora samples show affinity towards EHG and is actually situated close to Yamnaya, only Mal'ta comes out partially Mongoloid, later ANE is dominantly Caucasoid;

https://s16.postimg.org/d5v0tx1et/PCA_described.png

ANE mixed with WHG and became EHG which is 25% WHG + 75% ANE. Yamnaya is something like 2/3 EHG and 1/3 CHG.

https://s32.postimg.org/t2tko9xx1/Light_skin.png

Alleles for light skin colour also found in EHG and CHG. Doesn't make sense for EHG and CHG to be light skinned if both ANE and WHG were dark skinned right? So those alleles are most likely derived from ANE admixture.

[Marmara]

Ghilzai pashtuns are a tribe of pashtuns that have an affinity with the pamirids of afghanistan and tajikstan. They have nearly as much turkic in them as tajiks

Do you mean Mongoloid? If they don't speak Turkic languages they aren't Turkic. Only Turkics i know in Afghanistan are Turkmens.

[Yaglakar]

https://media1.giphy.com/media/O5NyCibf93upy/giphy.gif

LOL this guy. Created several accounts Tajik, Pashtun, Punjabi and now Kurd. What's next? Hazara? :)

At least capitalize proper nouns. It's so damn obvious. :dielaughing:

[Marmara]

Samples from ANE has proven it to be Caucasoid, especially the Afontova Gora samples show affinity towards EHG and is actually situated close to Yamnaya, only Mal'ta comes out partially Mongoloid, later ANE is dominantly Caucasoid;

https://s16.postimg.org/d5v0tx1et/PCA_described.png

Okay, but Yamnaya people had direct genetic affinity to Mal'ta boy. All Europeans have genetics partially derived from Mal'ta boy.

[Pahli]

Okay, but Yamnaya people had direct genetic affinity to Mal'ta boy. All Europeans have genetics partially derived from Mal'ta boy.

I updated my post, but its not only Europeans that have genetics from Mal'ta boy, almost all Eurasians have some ANE admixture, the question is just if they use the Mal'ta or the Afontova Gora sample to measure it since they both are ANE.

Mal'ta is too old to have impacted Yamnaya by the way, it would have been Afontova Gora since its geographically closer to Yamnya and younger than Mal'ta. By the time Yamnaya was formed, ANE didn't exist, it was basically EHG + CHG.

[Mingle]

Do you mean Mongoloid? If they don't speak Turkic languages they aren't Turkic. Only Turkics i know in Afghanistan are Turkmens.

There are no Mongoloid Pashtun tribes or Pashtun tribes of Turkic origin.

He's spreading BS. I debunked him here: https://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?237968-Who-is-whiter-tajiks-or-iranians&p=5018225#post5018225

Turkmens aren't the only Turks in Afghanistan. There are way more Uzbeks than Turkmens there.

[Marmara]

I updated my post, but its not only Europeans that have genetics from Mal'ta boy, almost all Eurasians have some ANE admixture, the question is just if they use the Mal'ta or the Afontova Gora sample to measure it since they both are ANE.

Mal'ta is too old to have impacted Yamnaya by the way, it would have been Afontova Gora since its geographically closer to Yamnya and younger than Mal'ta.

But didn't the genetic research has proven Yamnaya had impact from Mal'ta boy or people like him? And according to Wiki, Afontova Gora also had genetic affinity to Mal'ta boy. Maybe Mal'ta boy genetically affected Yamnaya and later Europeans through these people?

[Pahli]

But didn't the genetic research has proven Yamnaya had impact from Mal'ta boy or people like him? And according to Wiki, Afontova Gora also had genetic affinity to Mal'ta boy. Maybe Mal'ta boy genetically affected Yamnaya and later Europeans through these people?

You aren't wrong, but you are right about Mal'ta having an impact on Yamnaya although not directly as I was trying to explain. The reason why Yamnaya has affinity with Mal'ta / Afontova Gora is because both CHG and EHG are heavily ANE admixed. But they are most likely admixed through Afontova Gora which is dominantly Caucasoid and less Mongoloid than Mal'ta, although it bears like you said, affinity to Mal'ta.

The haplogroup R can be traced back to Mal'ta and there's no doubt about the origins of it.

[Aren]

You aren't wrong, but you are right about Mal'ta having an impact on Yamnaya although not directly as I was trying to explain. The reason why Yamnaya has affinity with Mal'ta / Afontova Gora is because both CHG and EHG are heavily ANE admixed. But they are most likely admixed through Afontova Gora which is dominantly Caucasoid and less Mongoloid than Mal'ta, although it bears like you said, affinity to Mal'ta.

The haplogroup R can be traced back to Mal'ta and there's no doubt about the origins of it.

Pretty much. EHG is equally close to AG3 as to MA1 but modelling it with AG3 works better

"1. CLOSEST SINGLE ITEM DISTANCE%"
AfontovaGora3 WHG Loschbour
14.63977 32.66264 35.34696
"distance%=6.2446"

EHG

AfontovaGora3,70.8
WHG,29.2


"1. CLOSEST SINGLE ITEM DISTANCE%"
MA1 WHG
14.57563 32.66264
"distance%=9.2787"

EHG

MA1,73.6
WHG,26.4

[Kurd123]

LOL.. Thanks everyone for sharing your knowledge though the original question of this post was about the genetical differences within the kurdish population.
For example, if kurdish-muslims and kurdish-jews are different, and if so how?

[Mingle]

LOL.. Thanks everyone for sharing your knowledge though the original question of this post was about the genetical differences within the kurdish population.
For example, if kurdish-muslims and kurdish-jews are different, and if so how?

They're probably closer to Assyrians. Jews from Iran tend to cluster with Assyrians, so Kurdish Jews probably wouldn't be much different. They have significant Levantine ancestry so they'd plot south of Kurds.

[Aren]

LOL.. Thanks everyone for sharing your knowledge though the original question of this post was about the genetical differences within the kurdish population.
For example, if kurdish-muslims and kurdish-jews are different, and if so how?

Calling them Kurdish Jews is not correct. They are very close genetically to us Assyrians and from what I've heard from my grandmother and great-grandmother the Jews of Arbel actually used to speak East Aramaic just like us Assyrians. Same with "Iranian" Jews. Yezidis seem to be no different than other Kurds though.

[Hadouken]

I can not quote you all . it would be too much of a mess. I was banned for 3 days and couldnt post in the thread so I will just post this long ass reply and you have to find the relation to your post(s) yourself in my answer here

@OP

the autosomal differences between kurds from different areas is not that big . all kurds score similar on calculators . but yes there are some differences too .

Iraqi Kurds for example seem to have arab admix . and score less european and less mediterranean

look at this geneplaza comparison of my own results with 2 iraqi kurds

you have to click on the link and then click on the pic itself to enlarge it . the script is a bit small

https://postimg.org/image/yrdabq3yd/

or here you can also compare gencove

Iraqi Kurd

http://up.picr.de/32079850sy.jpg


my result :

http://up.picr.de/31534766ir.jpg

-

the "Kurd_C" reference on the gedmatch calculators are based on those same iraqi kurds too . they do have some differences to us and on some calcs I dont even get them on my top 10 oracle list which is weird .

this is a population approximation of a kurd from my homeplace . he gets modelled as more than 1/4 balkan and even 1/4 french when Kurd_C is taken as primary population reference (neolithic k13 calculator)

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance

1 71.6% Kurd_C + 28.4% Bulgarian @ 3.22
2 73.5% Kurd_C + 26.5% Romanian @ 3.34

9 77% Kurd_C + 23% French @ 3.57
10 76% Kurd_C + 24% Croatian @ 3.61

--

so there are some differences for sure genetically among kurds . but that is normal for all ethnicities . even in europe you have differences between people of the same ethnicity in a north/south or east/west comparison for example . and lookwise I have to say that many of the kurds outside turkey often look different from turkey kurds .

the question is how many of those "kurds" are full kurds etc. or if they just mixed with other people there or that maybe environmental influences are the reason etc. etc. .of course many kurds from there will also fit among turkey kurds perfectly well too . I could post such people myself but I dont like to post kurds outside of turkey because I am not knowledged enough and dont know if the person could be mixed etc.

and I do think that some kurds in places like syria and iraq have integrated foreigners and that probably many half kurds are also just identifiyng as kurdish there etc.. I even think that some people who say they are kurdish are not even kurdish at all . here where I live a guy who was in the same school of a friend of mine said he is iraqi kurd and in the end it came out that he is domari gypsy . I already told this story a couple of times . and it made me even more suspicious . this is one of the main reasons why I stick to turkey kurds who I am more familiar with

I know/see a couple of iraqi kurds here where I live and they do look different to turkey kurds too. I noticed that back then many years ago already when I met them before I joined these forums but didnt think much about it . I would need to see and know more kurds outside of turkey to get a better picture though . and I would need to know if those "kurds" are not some frauds too .

but in any case you can be sure that people can not base off their knowledge about us with random images flying around on the web . trust me it doesnt work and leads to people raising an eyebrow when they see representative kurdish galleries because they just dont know reality and base their knowledge on some inaccurate media tools floating around . several members of different forums have been surprised by how we look when I posted pics of kurds . some where literally mindfucked no joke ....I am amazed how much certain trolls and ignorance of people have distorted reality . on one hand I am smiling because it is funny and on the other hand I would like to punch the wall when . I mean wtf ....

btw in turkey there are also some mixed people such as half kurds who identify more as kurdish or even are known as primarily kurdish and get posted as kurdish examples in threads even xD . an example would be the famous singer ibrahim tatlises who has an arab father and also looks more arab but identifies more with his kurdish side :) ....

..he is from Urfa . and I think that there are probably also other kurds from urfa who likely have arab admix . and just so you know ... a lot of the arabs in turkey are not like member Toppo900 or other levantines that are often spammed here . a lot of turkey arabs are very exotic and among the most exotic people you can find in turkey. they can look similar to south levantines and certain iraqi arabs etc. not all of course . some you cant even tell that they are arabs or mixed. but yeah you get the point . I dont see that as a bad thing dont get me wrong . and I dont dislike them either (especially not for something as trivial as this) . I see them as my compariots too and they are humans like everybody else and I dont give a fuck . but I am just stating the facts . member Marmara showed a video from Urfa already and some of the kurds look a little mixed to me too . and yes Marmara is right urfa and surrounding like hatay etc. those areas are the most exotic areas for turkey . and you see that even our most exotic provinces in turkey are maybe on par with central iran - syria - jordan at maximum when it comes to exoticness/darkness . if you take out the arabs then even less .

needless to say that of course people from there are also naturally suntanned because of high temperatures and the harsh sun shining over them for hours daily . and many people there (and of course in other places of turkey) are working their ass off under the sun to feed their families . they dont have the time or nerves to be as light or groomed as possible for the tastes of TA dumbfucks....

but anyway here are Kurds from my own province :


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JTEKrKXV_dA

(even though this video is about our children you see adults in the background)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qk619YwQi9o


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dd0IjpeNXWU



my province + our neighbor province Bingöl wedding


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-zmu7qmXUA8

I am mentioning/talking about these phenotypical things only because other people as usual talk about the darkness/lightness shit again : I also didnt cherrypick in my gallery and involved enough "darkies" . there is nothing wrong with being dark but we are extremely darkwashed it is ridiculous .. wtf. .but darker than what you see in my gallery is either extremely atypical or extremely suntanned (and I even included tanned people too . we dont have anything to "hide" :picard1:) . some people even said to me "you dont look typical kurd imo" "I wouldnt have thought you are a kurd" etc. and tried to say that I am lighter than average kurd and more north/west looking xD what a joke . I am very average for my ethnicity and even on the darker side of average for my province. I just said above how people are surprised when I post kurds. it is just ridiculous really . I am a fucking greasy kebab wog and some people even see me as atypical ? lol . even though on the other hand it also happened that people placed me a lot more "northern/western" before knowing that I am kurdish and when I revealed my ethnicity they placed me a lot further south/east all of a sudden :D and then again after people saw my gallery and genetic results etc. they all of a sudden stopped with those far placings too and became more like before/unbiased again . so stupid ...

the most common phenotypes for us is East Med ( Cappadocian Med ) , Armenid , a mix of those both so Anatolid , Alpine/Asiatic Alpine , west-Iranid (however the iranid thing confuses me since many of the supposedly iranid people from iran etc. dont fit among us well and what is iranid and what not seems to be very blurry) , IranoCromagnid , Taurid/Dinaric , and Pontid . sometimes you can also find NorthPontids , IranoNordoids , Orientalids . but they are less typical . as a group we are darker than europeans of course but for non european standards we are not a dark people tbh. . especially not as dark as wrongly thought . and we are overlaping mostly with our neighbors ..

but as I already said before. if anybody wants to have a realistic and honest gallery of kurdish people from turkey where there is no effect of trolls or ignorants involved he/she has to view this thread - http://w11.zetaboards.com/anthroworld/topic/30258444/1/#new .

there is nothing to discuss anymore . the fact that people are surprised that we dont look the way they have/had in mind . well thats the point of such forums ...to learn something about other peoples . of course this applies only if you are really interested . if you only want to troll or talk nonsense then there is nothing I can do . I also bet I look like a fucking idiot to even reply to this thread with this long ass text ...

------

and now regarding what member Böri said . you brought up our southwest asian and south asian component compared to Georgians . here I made a comparison for you using my result comparing to a georgian

http://up.picr.de/32080048lt.jpg

http://up.picr.de/32080049at.jpg

http://up.picr.de/32080051ax.jpg

http://up.picr.de/32080052ar.jpg


it is that georgians score some more of the "northern" components and yes a little less sw-asian . but the difference is not dramatically high as you see. the few percentages in several components does probably have some effect on why georgians are lighter but one of the main reasons is that they are habitating more northern lands (temperature etc.) . georgians are the most european looking west asian population . you could also argue that they are southeasteuropeans even (at least borderline) and they often overlap with balkans and south europe lookwise (we can too but not as much as them of course) . however ...the issue is not that georgians are "dark too" but that we are not as dark as thought ...that way it is ...we are the ones who are darkwashed and people are ignorant about . and even though as I said georgians are lighter than us it is not that you are comparing swedes and papuans or something . they are right next door to us and they also have overlap with us and other west asians too . I dont understand why georgians were brought up to begin with though . seems random

regarding the south asian you talk about . most of us score less than 10% south asian . I score 6% on average on gedmatch and 1.86% ASI. Böri you yourself score similar to me . you score only 2% less on some calculators and even a bit more on some calcs . so I dont know why you talk like that . turks score only little south asian and/but kurds score only 3% more than turks ...oh woooow lol ... :D

SOME kurds on SOME calcs can score something like 10-12% (again ...WITH the west eurasian in it and not broken down) but thats the extreme maximum and not typical . and even that is not a big amount tbh. if you would count up our european like NE_Euro + Atlantic etc. you would get to 20% or so but of course nobody would do that ...only caring about the darkie components hehe ;)

and as you see georgians also score noticable sw-asian too btw. . and you yourself score 7-11% too . it is less than my 14-16% but you make it sound like it is such a huge difference ....

a lot of sw-asian is actually masked east med on some calcs. . if you want to take the "pure" bedouin component aka red sea then of course that is also a lot less in us (and other west asians too) like 5-6% for eurogenes k13 . dont mix them up

and no Armenians are not lighter than us. maybe sligthly if so . they are very similar looking people . even more so than I used to think . also in our province we have some armenians and they are indistinguishable from us in most cases too


as I said before already and proved it with my own results 1000 times : we are mostly (like 75-80% ) a mix of CHG and NeolithicFarmer/Med . with the rest being central asian iranic roots . like we can be modelled as 75-80% Georgian Jewish / Armenian / Tat Jews etc. + 20-25% Pashtun / Tajik . and that 20-25% part also is to break down into components and a big part of that 20-25% ancestry is IranNeolithic (and Caucasus too) because that is one of the main component in modern pashtuns and tajiks . what I say here is also visible on my gencove result as I showed above . and of course gedmatch too

I am not refering to anybody of you in particular but I dont know how many more times I have to explain and prove things ...but people still talk nonsense . not sure how much more it takes to people to learn it . it sometimes feels as if I am talking to chimpanzees :D but even they would have understood by now ...I mean I posted already 10000 people including myself and also genetic results and explained things carefully and I am a very honest person (without trying to pad my own shoulder but you cant deny that I am honest with all I am doing) . what else can one do ?

sometimes it feels like this lol :


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mHz4O3gFQ7s

you can accuse me of caring . you could say "well just ignore it . it doesnt matter why do you even care" . yes thats true ....but why shouldnt I as a kurd have the right to say something ? I mean seriously ... I noticed that people have to accept everything that idiots say without the right to "defend" themselves because otherwise we are "sensitive" or insecure or whatever . yeah right . so if I would start to troll and claim that south europeans are 25% ssa and look quadroon or that north europeans look like half chinese and are 30% mongoloid then if people would correct me I can say "aaaw why so sensitive why do you even care lol" to them ? . :D

A : you suck . you talked shit about me you are a bad person

B : huh what dude ? I didnt !

A : lol dont be so insecure . you are too sensitive . I am just joking

B : wtf ..

dont worry the forum is mostly dead anyway because of such behaviours . the activity is going down more and more and many good members have left already (unfortunately) . if nothing will be done against it then the forum will castrate itself until it will become a nomansland

@OP if you REALLY are a Kurd and not the sockaccount of that troll then you could take a test and post your results . would be interesting to see your results

just my 2 cents

----

[StonyArabia]

They're probably closer to Assyrians. Jews from Iran tend to cluster with Assyrians, so Kurdish Jews probably wouldn't be much different. They have significant Levantine ancestry so they'd plot south of Kurds.

Kurdish Jews cluster with Assyrians, and so do I, but I think my Caucasian ancestry pushes me toward them.

[Kurd123]

I can not quote you all . it would be too much of a mess. I was banned for 3 days and couldnt post in the thread so I will just post this long ass reply and you have to find the relation to your post(s) yourself in my answer here

@OP

the autosomal differences between kurds from different areas is not that big . all kurds score similar on calculators . but yes there are some differences too .

Iraqi Kurds for example seem to have arab admix . and score less european and less mediterranean

look at this geneplaza comparison of my own results with 2 iraqi kurds

you have to click on the link and then click on the pic itself to enlarge it . the script is a bit small

https://postimg.org/image/yrdabq3yd/

or here you can also compare gencove

Iraqi Kurd

http://up.picr.de/32079850sy.jpg


my result :

http://up.picr.de/31534766ir.jpg

-

the "Kurd_C" reference on the gedmatch calculators are based on those same iraqi kurds too . they do have some differences to us and on some calcs I dont even get them on my top 10 oracle list which is weird .

this is a population approximation of a kurd from my homeplace . he gets modelled as more than 1/4 balkan and even 1/4 french when Kurd_C is taken as primary population reference (neolithic k13 calculator)

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance

1 71.6% Kurd_C + 28.4% Bulgarian @ 3.22
2 73.5% Kurd_C + 26.5% Romanian @ 3.34

9 77% Kurd_C + 23% French @ 3.57
10 76% Kurd_C + 24% Croatian @ 3.61

--

so there are some differences for sure genetically among kurds . but that is normal for all ethnicities . even in europe you have differences between people of the same ethnicity in a north/south or east/west comparison for example . and lookwise I have to say that many of the kurds outside turkey often look different from turkey kurds .

the question is how many of those "kurds" are full kurds etc. or if they just mixed with other people there or that maybe environmental influences are the reason etc. etc. .of course many kurds from there will also fit among turkey kurds perfectly well too . I could post such people myself but I dont like to post kurds outside of turkey because I am not knowledged enough and dont know if the person could be mixed etc.

and I do think that some kurds in places like syria and iraq have integrated foreigners and that probably many half kurds are also just identifiyng as kurdish there etc.. I even think that some people who say they are kurdish are not even kurdish at all . here where I live a guy who was in the same school of a friend of mine said he is iraqi kurd and in the end it came out that he is domari gypsy . I already told this story a couple of times . and it made me even more suspicious . this is one of the main reasons why I stick to turkey kurds who I am more familiar with

I know/see a couple of iraqi kurds here where I live and they do look different to turkey kurds too. I noticed that back then many years ago already when I met them before I joined these forums but didnt think much about it . I would need to see and know more kurds outside of turkey to get a better picture though . and I would need to know if those "kurds" are not some frauds too .

but in any case you can be sure that people can not base off their knowledge about us with random images flying around on the web . trust me it doesnt work and leads to people raising an eyebrow when they see representative kurdish galleries because they just dont know reality and base their knowledge on some inaccurate media tools floating around . several members of different forums have been surprised by how we look when I posted pics of kurds . some where literally mindfucked no joke ....I am amazed how much certain trolls and ignorance of people have distorted reality . on one hand I am smiling because it is funny and on the other hand I would like to punch the wall when . I mean wtf ....

btw in turkey there are also some mixed people such as half kurds who identify more as kurdish or even are known as primarily kurdish and get posted as kurdish examples in threads even xD . an example would be the famous singer ibrahim tatlises who has an arab father and also looks more arab but identifies more with his kurdish side :) ....

..he is from Urfa . and I think that there are probably also other kurds from urfa who likely have arab admix . and just so you know ... a lot of the arabs in turkey are not like member Toppo900 or other levantines that are often spammed here . a lot of turkey arabs are very exotic and among the most exotic people you can find in turkey. they can look similar to south levantines and certain iraqi arabs etc. not all of course . some you cant even tell that they are arabs or mixed. but yeah you get the point . I dont see that as a bad thing dont get me wrong . and I dont dislike them either (especially not for something as trivial as this) . I see them as my compariots too and they are humans like everybody else and I dont give a fuck . but I am just stating the facts . member Marmara showed a video from Urfa already and some of the kurds look a little mixed to me too . and yes Marmara is right urfa and surrounding like hatay etc. those areas are the most exotic areas for turkey . and you see that even our most exotic provinces in turkey are maybe on par with central iran - syria - jordan at maximum when it comes to exoticness/darkness . if you take out the arabs then even less .

needless to say that of course people from there are also naturally suntanned because of high temperatures and the harsh sun shining over them for hours daily . and many people there (and of course in other places of turkey) are working their ass off under the sun to feed their families . they dont have the time or nerves to be as light or groomed as possible for the tastes of TA dumbfucks....

but anyway here are Kurds from my own province :


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JTEKrKXV_dA

(even though this video is about our children you see adults in the background)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qk619YwQi9o


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dd0IjpeNXWU



my province + our neighbor province Bingöl wedding


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-zmu7qmXUA8

I am mentioning/talking about these phenotypical things only because other people as usual talk about the darkness/lightness shit again : I also didnt cherrypick in my gallery and involved enough "darkies" . there is nothing wrong with being dark but we are extremely darkwashed it is ridiculous .. wtf. .but darker than what you see in my gallery is either extremely atypical or extremely suntanned (and I even included tanned people too . we dont have anything to "hide" :picard1:) . some people even said to me "you dont look typical kurd imo" "I wouldnt have thought you are a kurd" etc. and tried to say that I am lighter than average kurd and more north/west looking xD what a joke . I am very average for my ethnicity and even on the darker side of average for my province. I just said above how people are surprised when I post kurds. it is just ridiculous really . I am a fucking greasy kebab wog and some people even see me as atypical ? lol . even though on the other hand it also happened that people placed me a lot more "northern/western" before knowing that I am kurdish and when I revealed my ethnicity they placed me a lot further south/east all of a sudden :D and then again after people saw my gallery and genetic results etc. they all of a sudden stopped with those far placings too and became more like before/unbiased again . so stupid ...

the most common phenotypes for us is East Med ( Cappadocian Med ) , Armenid , a mix of those both so Anatolid , Alpine/Asiatic Alpine , west-Iranid (however the iranid thing confuses me since many of the supposedly iranid people from iran etc. dont fit among us well and what is iranid and what not seems to be very blurry) , IranoCromagnid , Taurid/Dinaric , and Pontid . sometimes you can also find NorthPontids , IranoNordoids , Orientalids . but they are less typical . as a group we are darker than europeans of course but for non european standards we are not a dark people tbh. . especially not as dark as wrongly thought . and we are overlaping mostly with our neighbors ..

but as I already said before. if anybody wants to have a realistic and honest gallery of kurdish people from turkey where there is no effect of trolls or ignorants involved he/she has to view this thread - http://w11.zetaboards.com/anthroworld/topic/30258444/1/#new .

there is nothing to discuss anymore . the fact that people are surprised that we dont look the way they have/had in mind . well thats the point of such forums ...to learn something about other peoples . of course this applies only if you are really interested . if you only want to troll or talk nonsense then there is nothing I can do . I also bet I look like a fucking idiot to even reply to this thread with this long ass text ...

------

and now regarding what member Böri said . you brought up our southwest asian and south asian component compared to Georgians . here I made a comparison for you using my result comparing to a georgian

http://up.picr.de/32080048lt.jpg

http://up.picr.de/32080049at.jpg

http://up.picr.de/32080051ax.jpg

http://up.picr.de/32080052ar.jpg


it is that georgians score some more of the "northern" components and yes a little less sw-asian . but the difference is not dramatically high as you see. the few percentages in several components does probably have some effect on why georgians are lighter but one of the main reasons is that they are habitating more northern lands (temperature etc.) . georgians are the most european looking west asian population . you could also argue that they are southeasteuropeans even (at least borderline) and they often overlap with balkans and south europe lookwise (we can too but not as much as them of course) . however ...the issue is not that georgians are "dark too" but that we are not as dark as thought ...that way it is ...we are the ones who are darkwashed and people are ignorant about . and even though as I said georgians are lighter than us it is not that you are comparing swedes and papuans or something . they are right next door to us and they also have overlap with us and other west asians too . I dont understand why georgians were brought up to begin with though . seems random

regarding the south asian you talk about . most of us score less than 10% south asian . I score 6% on average on gedmatch and 1.86% ASI. Böri you yourself score similar to me . you score only 2% less on some calculators and even a bit more on some calcs . so I dont know why you talk like that . turks score only little south asian and/but kurds score only 3% more than turks ...oh woooow lol ... :D

SOME kurds on SOME calcs can score something like 10-12% (again ...WITH the west eurasian in it and not broken down) but thats the extreme maximum and not typical . and even that is not a big amount tbh. if you would count up our european like NE_Euro + Atlantic etc. you would get to 20% or so but of course nobody would do that ...only caring about the darkie components hehe ;)

and as you see georgians also score noticable sw-asian too btw. . and you yourself score 7-11% too . it is less than my 14-16% but you make it sound like it is such a huge difference ....

a lot of sw-asian is actually masked east med on some calcs. . if you want to take the "pure" bedouin component aka red sea then of course that is also a lot less in us (and other west asians too) like 5-6% for eurogenes k13 . dont mix them up

and no Armenians are not lighter than us. maybe sligthly if so . they are very similar looking people . even more so than I used to think . also in our province we have some armenians and they are indistinguishable from us in most cases too


as I said before already and proved it with my own results 1000 times : we are mostly (like 75-80% ) a mix of CHG and NeolithicFarmer/Med . with the rest being central asian iranic roots . like we can be modelled as 75-80% Georgian Jewish / Armenian / Tat Jews etc. + 20-25% Pashtun / Tajik . and that 20-25% part also is to break down into components and a big part of that 20-25% ancestry is IranNeolithic (and Caucasus too) because that is one of the main component in modern pashtuns and tajiks . what I say here is also visible on my gencove result as I showed above . and of course gedmatch too

I am not refering to anybody of you in particular but I dont know how many more times I have to explain and prove things ...but people still talk nonsense . not sure how much more it takes to people to learn it . it sometimes feels as if I am talking to chimpanzees :D but even they would have understood by now ...I mean I posted already 10000 people including myself and also genetic results and explained things carefully and I am a very honest person (without trying to pad my own shoulder but you cant deny that I am honest with all I am doing) . what else can one do ?

sometimes it feels like this lol :


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mHz4O3gFQ7s

you can accuse me of caring . you could say "well just ignore it . it doesnt matter why do you even care" . yes thats true ....but why shouldnt I as a kurd have the right to say something ? I mean seriously ... I noticed that people have to accept everything that idiots say without the right to "defend" themselves because otherwise we are "sensitive" or insecure or whatever . yeah right . so if I would start to troll and claim that south europeans are 25% ssa and look quadroon or that north europeans look like half chinese and are 30% mongoloid then if people would correct me I can say "aaaw why so sensitive why do you even care lol" to them ? . :D

A : you suck . you talked shit about me you are a bad person

B : huh what dude ? I didnt !

A : lol dont be so insecure . you are too sensitive . I am just joking

B : wtf ..

dont worry the forum is mostly dead anyway because of such behaviours . the activity is going down more and more and many good members have left already (unfortunately) . if nothing will be done against it then the forum will castrate itself until it will become a nomansland

@OP if you REALLY are a Kurd and not the sockaccount of that troll then you could take a test and post your results . would be interesting to see your results

just my 2 cents

----


Wow wonderfull answer! Thanks!!

Do you agree with the claim that kurdish jews cluster with assyrians? Why do they speak aramic?
Do kurdish jews and muslims cluster closely?

Yes I am a third generation jewish-kurd (Zakho, Iraq) from israel.

[Hadouken]

Wow wonderfull answer! Thanks!!

Do you agree with the claim that kurdish jews cluster with assyrians? Why do they speak aramic?
Do kurdish jews and muslims cluster closely?

Yes I am a third generation jewish-kurd (Zakho, Iraq) from israel.

kurdish jews shift more towards the levant and assyria I think that is correct. I dont have a kit number of a kurdish jew and havent seen their results posted but their components drift more towards levant than non jewish kurds

I wouldnt say we cluster "closely" but yes we are not far either . I always get them in my oracle . but I am closer to Caucasus Jews and Uzbekistan Jews than to Kurdish Jews ironically :lol:

---


Single Population Sharing:

1 Azeri 4.05
2 Kurdish 4.87
3 Iranian 6.25
4 Armenian 7.54
5 Turkish 7.58
6 Georgian_Jewish 7.94
7 Assyrian 9.88
8 Iranian_Jewish 12.29
9 Kurdish_Jewish 12.78
10 Kumyk 15.67
11 Lebanese_Muslim 15.98
12 Turkmen 17.02
13 Georgian 17.02
14 Syrian 17.03
15 Adygei 18.28
16 Abhkasian 18.51
17 Balkar 19.44
18 Ossetian 19.85
19 Cyprian 20.27
20 Kabardin 20.71

-----


1 Kurd_North ( ) 3.93
2 Azeri ( ) 5.38
3 Uzbekistani_Jew ( ) 6.37
4 Uzbek_Tashkent ( ) 6.66
5 Kurd ( ) 7.07
6 Kurd_East ( ) 7.21
7 Iraqi_Mandean ( ) 7.32
8 Turk_Adana ( ) 7.33
9 Kurd_Jew ( ) 7.83
10 Iraqi_Chaldean ( ) 8.02
11 Kurd_South ( ) 8.1
12 Baku_WGA ( ) 8.35
13 Georgian_Jew ( ) 8.66
14 Iranian_Jew ( ) 9.56
15 Assyrian_Iraqi ( ) 9.76
16 Turk_Kayseri ( ) 9.82
17 Turk ( ) 10.15
18 Turk_Istanbul ( ) 12.36
19 Jew_Tat ( ) 13.39
20 Iraqi_Jew ( ) 13.53


----

1 Turk (derived) 5.73
2 Azeri (derived) 7.42
3 Kurd (derived) 7.51
4 Jew-Uzbekistan (derived) 8.5
5 Armenian (derived) 9.5
6 Iranian (derived) 9.51
7 Jew_Azerbaijan (derived) 9.9
8 Jew_Tat (derived) 10.09
9 Jew_Kurd (derived) 10.83
10 Iraqi (derived) 11
11 Jew_Iraqi (derived) 12.03
12 Jew_Georgia (derived) 12.41
13 Jew-Iraqi (derived) 13.09
14 Jew-Iran (derived) 13.36
15 Lebanese (derived) 13.9
16 Syrian (derived) 14.26
17 Druze (derived) 14.61
18 Georgian_Laz (derived) 14.61
19 Kumyk (derived) 15.23
20 Georgian (derived) 15.54


--

1 Azeri @ 5,006858
2 Uzbekistani_Jewish @ 5,057274
3 Kurd @ 6,042609
4 iranian @ 6,632842
5 Armenian @ 7,859859
6 Turks @ 7,86421
7 Assyrian @ 9,85635
8 Azerbaijani_Jews @ 10,120489
9 KurdJew @ 10,654333
10 Georgian_Jews @ 10,656236
303 iterations.

---

1 UzbekistaniJewish @ 5.326202
2 Azeri @ 5.479857
3 Kurd @ 5.572712
4 Iranian_Lor @ 6.800421
5 Iranian @ 6.968614
6 Iranian_Fars @ 8.4154
7 Turkey_Anatolia @ 8.447696
8 AzerbaijaniJewish @ 8.612954
9 Armenia @ 8.621078
10 GeorgianJew @ 8.675962
11 KurdishJewish @ 8.747406
12 Assyrian @ 8.998042
13 TR_Kayseri @ 9.14339
14 IranianJewish @ 9.574156
15 GeorgJewtat @ 9.590327
16 TR_Adana @ 9.71145
17 IranianJew @ 10.154417
18 TR_Izmir @ 11.201021
19 IraqiJewish @ 12.199226
20 IraqiJew @ 12.365508
424 iterations.



I dont have any knowledge about kurdish jews though

[Kurd123]

kurdish jews shift more towards the levant and assyria I think that is correct. I dont have a kit number of a kurdish jew and havent seen their results posted but their components drift more towards levant than non jewish kurds

I wouldnt say we cluster "closely" but yes we are not far either . I always get them in my oracle . but I am closer to Caucasus Jews and Uzbekistan Jews than to Kurdish Jews ironically :lol:

---


Single Population Sharing:

1 Azeri 4.05
2 Kurdish 4.87
3 Iranian 6.25
4 Armenian 7.54
5 Turkish 7.58
6 Georgian_Jewish 7.94
7 Assyrian 9.88
8 Iranian_Jewish 12.29
9 Kurdish_Jewish 12.78
10 Kumyk 15.67
11 Lebanese_Muslim 15.98
12 Turkmen 17.02
13 Georgian 17.02
14 Syrian 17.03
15 Adygei 18.28
16 Abhkasian 18.51
17 Balkar 19.44
18 Ossetian 19.85
19 Cyprian 20.27
20 Kabardin 20.71

-----


1 Kurd_North ( ) 3.93
2 Azeri ( ) 5.38
3 Uzbekistani_Jew ( ) 6.37
4 Uzbek_Tashkent ( ) 6.66
5 Kurd ( ) 7.07
6 Kurd_East ( ) 7.21
7 Iraqi_Mandean ( ) 7.32
8 Turk_Adana ( ) 7.33
9 Kurd_Jew ( ) 7.83
10 Iraqi_Chaldean ( ) 8.02
11 Kurd_South ( ) 8.1
12 Baku_WGA ( ) 8.35
13 Georgian_Jew ( ) 8.66
14 Iranian_Jew ( ) 9.56
15 Assyrian_Iraqi ( ) 9.76
16 Turk_Kayseri ( ) 9.82
17 Turk ( ) 10.15
18 Turk_Istanbul ( ) 12.36
19 Jew_Tat ( ) 13.39
20 Iraqi_Jew ( ) 13.53


----

1 Turk (derived) 5.73
2 Azeri (derived) 7.42
3 Kurd (derived) 7.51
4 Jew-Uzbekistan (derived) 8.5
5 Armenian (derived) 9.5
6 Iranian (derived) 9.51
7 Jew_Azerbaijan (derived) 9.9
8 Jew_Tat (derived) 10.09
9 Jew_Kurd (derived) 10.83
10 Iraqi (derived) 11
11 Jew_Iraqi (derived) 12.03
12 Jew_Georgia (derived) 12.41
13 Jew-Iraqi (derived) 13.09
14 Jew-Iran (derived) 13.36
15 Lebanese (derived) 13.9
16 Syrian (derived) 14.26
17 Druze (derived) 14.61
18 Georgian_Laz (derived) 14.61
19 Kumyk (derived) 15.23
20 Georgian (derived) 15.54


--

1 Azeri @ 5,006858
2 Uzbekistani_Jewish @ 5,057274
3 Kurd @ 6,042609
4 iranian @ 6,632842
5 Armenian @ 7,859859
6 Turks @ 7,86421
7 Assyrian @ 9,85635
8 Azerbaijani_Jews @ 10,120489
9 KurdJew @ 10,654333
10 Georgian_Jews @ 10,656236
303 iterations.

---

1 UzbekistaniJewish @ 5.326202
2 Azeri @ 5.479857
3 Kurd @ 5.572712
4 Iranian_Lor @ 6.800421
5 Iranian @ 6.968614
6 Iranian_Fars @ 8.4154
7 Turkey_Anatolia @ 8.447696
8 AzerbaijaniJewish @ 8.612954
9 Armenia @ 8.621078
10 GeorgianJew @ 8.675962
11 KurdishJewish @ 8.747406
12 Assyrian @ 8.998042
13 TR_Kayseri @ 9.14339
14 IranianJewish @ 9.574156
15 GeorgJewtat @ 9.590327
16 TR_Adana @ 9.71145
17 IranianJew @ 10.154417
18 TR_Izmir @ 11.201021
19 IraqiJewish @ 12.199226
20 IraqiJew @ 12.365508
424 iterations.



I dont have any knowledge about kurdish jews though



Thanks for your reply. very intresting. My curiosity derives from the fact I have never met any kurd who is non-jew and therefore I don't know the similarities- differences.
I guess there are more cultural similarities than genetical. Though there must be also genetical. It is known here that in iraq many kurd-jews women married muslim men (iraqi and kurdish). I think the other way around barely ever happend.

[Gangrel]

Thanks for your reply. very intresting. My curiosity derives from the fact I have never met any kurd who is non-jew and therefore I don't know the similarities- differences.
I guess there are more cultural similarities than genetical. Though there must be also genetical. It is known here that in iraq many kurd-jews women married muslim men (iraqi and kurdish). I think the other way around barely ever happend.

You've only met Jewish Kurds?

[Kurd123]

You've only met Jewish Kurds?

Yep, There are no muslim kurds in Israel and I haven't met kurds when I was aboard

[StarDS9]

LOL.. Thanks everyone for sharing your knowledge though the original question of this post was about the genetical differences within the kurdish population.
For example, if kurdish-muslims and kurdish-jews are different, and if so how?

The answer is not much. I am Kurd from Turkey, yet I cluster with Iraqi and Iranian Kurds and half the time closer to Iranians on calculators.

[StarDS9]

Heres a example

Dodecad k12b


# Population Percent
1 Caucasus 43.67
2 Gedrosia 26.46
3 Southwest_Asian 10.01
4 North_European 7.71
5 Atlantic_Med 5.75
6 South_Asian 1.91
7 East_Asian 1.52
8 Siberian 1.5
9 Northwest_African 0.88
10 East_African 0.6

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Iranian (Dodecad) 5.15
2 Kurds (Yunusbayev) 5.2
3 Kurd (Dodecad) 5.6
4 Iranians (Behar) 9.37
5 Uzbekistan_Jews (Behar) 10.74
6 Turks (Behar) 11.7
7 Kumyks (Yunusbayev) 14.33
8 Turkish (Dodecad) 14.39
9 Azerbaijan_Jews (Behar) 14.72
10 Armenians_15 (Yunusbayev) 14.75
11 Georgia_Jews (Behar) 15.09
12 Assyrian (Dodecad) 15.64
13 Armenian (Dodecad) 15.97
14 Iranian_Jews (Behar) 16.52
15 Turkmens (Yunusbayev) 16.71
16 Lezgins (Behar) 18.19
17 Armenians (Behar) 18.19
18 Iraq_Jews (Behar) 18.76
19 Chechens (Yunusbayev) 19.65
20 Adygei (HGDP) 20.98

Eurogenes K12b



# Population Percent
1 West_Asian 40.65
2 East_Med 25.59
3 South_Asian 8.65
4 West_Med 6.72
5 Baltic 5.81
6 North_Atlantic 5.21
7 Red_Sea 3.56
8 Siberian 1.07
9 East_Asian 1.06
10 Northeast_African 1.05
11 Amerindian 0.65

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Kurdish 4.9
2 Azeri 6.63
3 Iranian 7.26
4 Kumyk 10.28
5 Turkish 11.71
6 Armenian 12.15
7 Adygei 12.35
8 Georgian 12.58
9 Georgian_Jewish 13.58
10 Balkar 14.16
11 Abhkasian 14.24
12 Ossetian 14.31
13 Turkmen 14.91
14 North_Ossetian 15
15 Kabardin 15.17
16 Lezgin 16
17 Chechen 16.12
18 Assyrian 16.43
19 Tabassaran 18.17
20 Iranian_Jewish 18.98

[Hadouken]

^ post your 2 population mode when Iranian is primary population . then you will see .....

[StarDS9]

^ post your 2 population mode when Iranian is primary population . then you will see .....

Huh?

You mean this

Dodecad K12b


Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% Iranians_Behar +50% Kumyks_Yunusbayev @ 4.994976

Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Iranians_Behar +25% Kurds_Yunusbayev +25% North_Ossetians_Yunusbayev @ 1.943509


Using 4 populations approximation:
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
1 Adygei_HGDP + Iranians_Behar + Kurd_Dodecad + Kurd_Dodecad @ 1.768577
2 Balkars_Yunusbayev + Iranians_Behar + Kurd_Dodecad + Kurd_Dodecad @ 1.801047
3 Balkars_Yunusbayev + Iranians_Behar + Iranians_Behar + Kurds_Yunusbayev @ 1.869847
4 Iranians_Behar + Kurd_Dodecad + Kurd_Dodecad + North_Ossetians_Yunusbayev @ 1.881589
5 Adygei_HGDP + Iranian_Dodecad + Iranians_Behar + Kurd_Dodecad @ 1.934860
6 Balkars_Yunusbayev + Iranian_Dodecad + Iranians_Behar + Kurd_Dodecad @ 1.935322
7 Iranians_Behar + Iranians_Behar + Kurds_Yunusbayev + North_Ossetians_Yunusbayev @ 1.943509
8 Balkars_Yunusbayev + Iranians_Behar + Iranians_Behar + Kurd_Dodecad @ 1.949061
9 Armenians_Behar + Balkars_Yunusbayev + Georgia_Jews_Behar + Makrani_HGDP @ 1.992655
10 Iranian_Dodecad + Iranians_Behar + Kurd_Dodecad + North_Ossetians_Yunusbayev @ 1.996951
11 Abhkasians_Yunusbayev + Druze_HGDP + Kumyks_Yunusbayev + Makrani_HGDP @ 2.024230
12 Iranians_Behar + Iranians_Behar + Kurd_Dodecad + North_Ossetians_Yunusbayev @ 2.039160
13 Balkars_Yunusbayev + Iranians_Behar + Kurd_Dodecad + Kurds_Yunusbayev @ 2.045758
14 Druze_HGDP + Georgians_Behar + Kumyks_Yunusbayev + Makrani_HGDP @ 2.046372
15 Adygei_HGDP + Iranians_Behar + Iranians_Behar + Kurd_Dodecad @ 2.066216
16 Armenian_Dodecad + Iranians_Behar + Iranians_Behar + Lezgins_Behar @ 2.069423
17 Adygei_HGDP + Iranians_Behar + Iranians_Behar + Kurds_Yunusbayev @ 2.081798
18 Iranians_Behar + Kurd_Dodecad + Kurds_Yunusbayev + North_Ossetians_Yunusbayev @ 2.089440
19 Adygei_HGDP + Iranians_Behar + Kurd_Dodecad + Kurds_Yunusbayev @ 2.107013
20 Armenians_Behar + Georgia_Jews_Behar + Makrani_HGDP + North_Ossetians_Yunusbayev @ 2.139171


Eurogenes K12b did not provide oracle for some reason, will try again later.

[Hadouken]

Huh?

You mean this

Dodecad K12b



Eurogenes K12b did not provide oracle for some reason, will try again later.

no I mean like this :

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 71.7% Iranians (Behar) + 28.3% S_Italian_Sicilian (Dodecad) @ 1.9

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 74.8% Iranian_Shirazi + 25.2% Italian_South @ 3.54

71.5% Iranian (Dodecad) + 28.5% Cypriots (Behar) @ 1.63

80.8% Iranian + 19.2% Greek @ 2.62

50% Iran_Mazandarani +25% Cypriot +25% Greek @ 3.903663



you should get similar stuff

we get iranians high in oracle lists because their score in components are similar however as you see we shift a lot more west or north .

iranians score often almost double amount of south asian compared to us and less west med , atlantic etc. and less whg too . if I am not wrong they often also score more red sea but I will have to check that again


https://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?232161-West-Asian-Gedmatch-Results

iranian k13


1 West_Asian 47.9
2 East_Med 24.57
3 South_Asian 12.19
4 Red_Sea 5.74
5 West_Med 3.26
6 Baltic 3.1
7 Sub-Saharan 1.78
8 North_Atlantic 0.78
9 Amerindian 0.68

my k13


1 West_Asian 36.06
2 East_Med 30.76
3 West_Med 8.27
4 South_Asian 6.84
5 Red_Sea 6.06
6 North_Atlantic 4.67
7 Baltic 2.74
8 Sub-Saharan 1.29
9 Siberian 1.29
10 East_Asian 1.21
11 Amerindian 0.82

[StarDS9]

I don't see option to that on Gedmatch

But heres my K13

# Population Percent
1 West_Asian 40.65
2 East_Med 25.59
3 South_Asian 8.65
4 West_Med 6.72
5 Baltic 5.81
6 North_Atlantic 5.21
7 Red_Sea 3.56
8 Siberian 1.07
9 East_Asian 1.06
10 Northeast_African 1.05
11 Amerindian 0.65

[Hadouken]

lol how ? you just have to click on "oracle" and then it lists it

you will probably get 80% Iranian + 20% north caucasus

[StarDS9]

oh ok this


# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 79.9% Kurd (Dodecad) + 20.1% Adygei (HGDP) @ 1.93
2 80.4% Kurd (Dodecad) + 19.6% Balkars (Yunusbayev) @ 1.98
3 80.4% Kurd (Dodecad) + 19.6% North_Ossetians (Yunusbayev) @ 2.03
4 70.2% Iranians (Behar) + 29.8% Balkars (Yunusbayev) @ 2.23
5 82.2% Iranian (Dodecad) + 17.8% Balkars (Yunusbayev) @ 2.25
6 81.8% Iranian (Dodecad) + 18.2% Adygei (HGDP) @ 2.26
7 82.2% Iranian (Dodecad) + 17.8% North_Ossetians (Yunusbayev) @ 2.29
8 70.1% Iranians (Behar) + 29.9% North_Ossetians (Yunusbayev) @ 2.32
9 69.7% Iranians (Behar) + 30.3% Adygei (HGDP) @ 2.36
10 86% Iranian (Dodecad) + 14% Abhkasians (Yunusbayev) @ 2.64
11 79.9% Kurd (Dodecad) + 20.1% Chechens (Yunusbayev) @ 2.7
12 74.2% Kurd (Dodecad) + 25.8% Kumyks (Yunusbayev) @ 2.71
13 84.9% Kurd (Dodecad) + 15.1% Abhkasians (Yunusbayev) @ 2.79
14 87.6% Iranian (Dodecad) + 12.4% Georgians (Behar) @ 2.83
15 76.7% Iranian (Dodecad) + 23.3% Kumyks (Yunusbayev) @ 2.91
16 83.3% Kurds (Yunusbayev) + 16.7% Balkars (Yunusbayev) @ 2.94
17 76.6% Kurds (Yunusbayev) + 23.4% Kumyks (Yunusbayev) @ 2.94
18 83.2% Kurds (Yunusbayev) + 16.8% North_Ossetians (Yunusbayev) @ 2.94
19 82.3% Iranian (Dodecad) + 17.7% Chechens (Yunusbayev) @ 3.04
20 86.6% Kurd (Dodecad) + 13.4% Georgians (Behar) @ 3.09

[Hadouken]

see ? I told you you will get 80 iranian + 20 north caucasus

which is true roughly as you see

81.8% Iranian (Dodecad) + 18.2% Adygei (HGDP) @ 2.26
76.7% Iranian (Dodecad) + 23.3% Kumyks (Yunusbayev) @ 2.91
70.1% Iranians (Behar) + 29.9% North_Ossetians (Yunusbayev) @ 2.32

[StarDS9]

see ? I told you you will get 80 iranian + 20 north caucasus

which is true roughly as you see

81.8% Iranian (Dodecad) + 18.2% Adygei (HGDP) @ 2.26
76.7% Iranian (Dodecad) + 23.3% Kumyks (Yunusbayev) @ 2.91
70.1% Iranians (Behar) + 29.9% North_Ossetians (Yunusbayev) @ 2.32

Thats the thing every calculator gives me different oracle results. Also I am 1/8 Circassian, so it is close on some calculators.

[Hadouken]

Thats the thing every calculator gives me different oracle results. Also I am 1/8 Circassian, so it is close on some calculators.

yes but either way as I said most of us will shift noticably north/west when iranian is taken as primary population source

[StarDS9]

yes but either way as I said most of us will shift noticably north/west when iranian is taken as primary population source

Well it is expected as Kurds live closer to the North, where as Iranians will have higher South Asian/Gedrosia because they are closer to those populations that peak in it.

[Hadouken]

Well it is expected as Kurds live closer to the North, where as Iranians will have higher South Asian/Gedrosia because they are closer to those populations that peak in it.

iranians dont score a huge amount either but noticably higher than we do yes . but as I said there are also some other components which we score more of such as med , atlantic etc. . isnt that awesome ? we wuz whiter n shiet omg

[StarDS9]

iranians dont score a huge amount either but noticably higher than we do yes . but as I said there are also some other components which we score more of such as med , atlantic etc. . isnt that awesome ? we wuz whiter n shiet omg

Na bra, dont wana be wyte, I likez me olive/yellow skin :D