A question for Men: Have you ever been in a fight?

[SuuT]

I ask as, as corny and cliched as it may sound, I don't think a man can really know himself unless he has be in one. These thoughts of Nietzsche's come to mind - From "beyond Good and Evil":


“-we believe that severity, violence, danger in the streets and in the heart, secrecy, stoicism, tempter’s art and devilery of every kind - that everything wicked, terrible, tyrannical, predatory and serpentine in man, serves as well for the elevation of the species as its opposites:- …and in any case we find ourselves here, both with our speech and our silence at the other extreme of all modern ideology and gregarious desirability…grateful even to distress and the vicissitudes of illness, because they always free us from some rule, and its ‘prejudice,’ grateful to the God, devil, sheep and worm in us; inquisitive to a fault, investigators to the point of cruelty…owing to an excess of ‘free will’.”



As posted on Skadi, on September 26th, my most recent altercation:



I was in a fight today.

One of the power windows in my car stopped working, so I took it in for repair. I left, and missed my turn to head back to where I am staying for the moment (I'm still getting used to this area of South Florida). When I realised I had done so, I took the first left that I thought would lead me back to the correct road; it didn't - it ended in a culdasac. In the culdasac were 4 blacks that immediately started-in with that funny peacock-like thing they do. I began to round the circle, and they started shouting "white mother f***er" etc. etc. I paid no mind and continued in my turn. And then a glass bottle smashed against the back windshield. I stopped the car, pulled up the emergency brake, centered myself, got out of the vehicle, and took off my shirt. Of course, the first thing that they see is a chest-wide tattoo of this: [a black-sun wheel].


One of them says "Oh muthuh f***uh are YOU in the WRONG place!" - another says "dat look like my RIMZ!" (not sure what this means) and started laughing (see: I'm spelling like they talk), and walks toward me, then swings. I back my head away; he misses; and I smack him in the face. Same thing happens a few more times before he tries to tackle me at the waist. Which, you see, is a NO NO, as SuuT's forte is his take-down defence, submissions, and ground and pound. I relaxed my centre of balance, fell into his tackle, and shifted him into a kimora, slid him in and out of various ankle and wrist locks and a rear naked choke just to play. I let him go, and stood up and asked him if he was done. "FUCK YOU!" and another dive at my mid-section was his answer, and I noticed that the others were starting to walk toward me. So I let him eat my knee on his way into my waist, pick him up, and slammed him unconscious on the road. THe others just stopped and stared in seeming disbelief.

I looked at them and said,"you know, I think I was in exactly the right place today". I got in my car, released the break, and drove away.

[Allenson]

Quite the story, SuuT. Remind me not to try to take you on, eh? ;)

Anyway, it's been a looong time since I was in a fight--it was back in high school, so, about twenty years ago.

Involved in arboriculture as I am for part of my living, I do get to wrestle with trees quite often. They're no slouches either. :p

[Æmeric]

It's been over 25-years ago. In the navy. I also had a fight in high school & one in the 8th grade. I discovered that getting into a fight every 2 or 3 years was good for your social standing among your peers (other teenage males). Go figure.:cool:

[Vulpix]

One of them says "Oh muthuh f***uh are YOU in the WRONG place!" - another says "dat look like my RIMZ!" (not sure what this means) and started laughing (see: I'm spelling like they talk)

Rims: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rim_(wheel (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rim_%28wheel)) :p

[SuuT]

[...] I discovered that getting into a fight every 2 or 3 years was good for your social standing among your peers (other teenage males). Go figure.:cool:


Certainly, that is not the only thing that it is good for...? [cf. the revised original post of the thread....]



Call me (and those like me) what one will; but I am confident that "we" will one day be moved from the realm of 'vigilante' to "patriot". :)


I.e, such deeds will, as the Blood recognises, be deemed as necessary.

[SuuT]

Rims: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rim_(wheel (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rim_%28wheel)) :p



Ahhhhhhhhh! it's all clear to me now. :D

[Treffie]

Do you charge by the hour? If so, how much? :D

[stormlord]

been in a couple, but all against other "civilized" people, so no broken bottles/being kicked in the head etc.

When I read "were 4 blacks" at the beginning I thought I was about to hear a very tall tale :D

[SuuT]

Do you charge by the hour? If so, how much? :D

If the request of mine services is just, there is no fee. :)

[SuuT]

[...] When I read "were 4 blacks" at the beginning I thought I was about to hear a very tall tale :D


Out of curiosity, why? I ask, as I have noticed over the years that Americans, in particular, and Brits, secondarily, believe Blacks to have some super/unter-human capacity for (simian) aggression that cannot be dealt with by way of calm and disciplined skill. - which I have always found vexing, if not derogatory toward Blacks (they are, indeed, men - after all).

(?)............

[Loki]

The last time I was in a physical fight was in my school days. I don't consider fighting an adult pastime, unless you are attacked and have to defend yourself. Otherwise you could get into hot water with the authorities, get a criminal record, etc etc. It's not worth it.

[SuuT]

[...] I don't consider fighting an adult pastime, unless you are attacked and have to defend yourself.

I understand, and respect in a very generic way, what you are saying; but, my pre-supposition (and experience - not to mention the thesis put forth by our Nietzsche) implies otherwise. Ergo, do you agree or disagree with the premise that for a man to know himself, he must not only accept, but wantonly accept - willfully - harm's way? If not, what be the premise of Self-knowledge, for you, if not the placement of yourself against the prowess of another man?...


Otherwise you could get into hot water with the authorities, get a criminal record, etc etc.

From Nietzsche's The Gay Science, s. 283 :



...Preparatory human beings. - I welcome all signs that a more virile, [B]warlike; age is about to begin, which will restore honour to courage above all. For this age shall prepare the way for one yet higher, and it shall gather the strength that this higher age will require some day - the age that will carry heroism into the search for knowledge and that will wage wars for the sake of ideas and their consequences. To this end, we now need many preparatory courageous human beings who cannot very well leap out of nothing, any more than out of the sand and slime of present-day civilization and metropolitanism-human beings who know how to be silent, alone, resolute, and content and constant in invisible activities; human beings who are bent on seeking in all things for what in them must be overcome; human beings distinguished as much by cheerfulness, patience, un-pretentiousness, and contempt for all great vanities as by magnanimity in victory and forbearance regarding the small vanities of the vanquished; human beings whose judgment concerning all victors and the share of chance in every victory and fame is sharp and free; human beings with their own festivals, their own working days, and their own periods of mourning, accustomed to command with assurance but instantly ready to obey when that is called for -equally proud, equally in-debeted to their own cause in both cases; more endangered human beings, more fruitful human beings, happier beings! For believe me: the secret for harvesting from existence the greatest fruitfulness and the greatest enjoyment is - to live dangerously. Build your cities on the slopes of Vesuvius! Send your ships into un-charted seas. Live at war with your peers and yourselves! Be robbers and conquerors as long as you cannot be rulers and possessors, you seekers of knowledge! Soon the eon will be past when you could be content to live hidden in forests like shy deer. At long last the search for knowledge will reach out for its due; it will want to rule and possess, and you with it...




It's not worth it.

Is it possible, that this perspective is borne of too safe a place, my brother?

[Beorn]

I've been in a few drunken bluster square ups, but not had a proper fight since school.
Like Loki, I don't see the need to fight unless necessary. I'm quite a happy go lucky person and people get that impression that I am of no bother to them, so I'm left to wander around and be annoying.

[Loki]

I understand, and respect in a very generic way, what you are saying; but, my pre-supposition (and experience - not to mention the thesis put forth by our Nietzsche) implies otherwise. Ergo, do you agree or disagree with the premise that for a man to know himself, he must not only accept, but wantonly accept - willfully - harm's way? If not, what be the premise of Self-knowledge, for you, if not the placement of yourself against the prowess of another man?...


Indeed, for me personally I gained a lot of insight into that as a young man in high school. :) And I do see the point and the significance of self-discovery in this way. A man has to know his limitations and abilities.



Is it possible, that this perspective is borne of too safe a place, my brother?

Well, for the first 27 years of my life I lived in a very unsafe environment in South Africa. I was the victim of violent crime as well, my friend being shot by blacks in front of my eyes in an armed robbery.

[SuuT]

Indeed, for me personally I gained a lot of insight into that as a young man in high school. :) And I do see the point and the significance of self-discovery in this way. A man has to know his limitations and abilities.

But yet, you seem to imply some sophomororic and immature insignificance to the the notion of violence, in general. - This intrigues me; especially given that (you) are a man of Southe African descent.

My greater point is that a man can have many beliefes about himself, and yet be in complete disregard to his principles if he has not, indeed, fought for them (which has the capacity to change one's principles for good or ill, in so far as humans are inherently selfish, to their own - respective - kind...).


Well, for the first 27 years of my life I lived in a very unsafe environment in South Africa. I was the victim of violent crime as well, my friend being shot by blacks in front of my eyes in an armed robbery.

If you will be so kind, open and as noble to share, how did this affect your Weltanschauung...?

[Loki]

But yet, you seem to imply some sophomororic and immature insignificance to the the notion of violence, in general. - This intrigues me; especially given that (you) are a man of Southe African descent.


Violence is certainly significant, as it is still so prevalent all around the globe. I think this fact is lamentable, though. Violence is (was) of great evolutionary importance, but in the modern world its role has been limited to official channels (i.e. military and police), and criminal elements.



My greater point is that a man can have many beliefes about himself, and yet be in complete disregard to his principles if he has not, indeed, fought for them (which has the capacity to change one's principles for good or ill, in so far as humans are inherently selfish, to their own - respective - kind...).


Sure. How does this apply in practice to your average white man? Go into town and beat up some negroes? ;) Or even worse, pick a fight with your racial kin, just to measure your own abilities?



If you will be so kind, open and as noble to share, how did this affect your Weltanschauung...?

Not much to be honest. My Weltanschauung had been firmly established at that point already.

[SuuT]

:)You're a great sport - I would have been banned at this point at - uhhhhhhh...other fora.



Violence is certainly significant, as it is still so prevalent all around the globe.

Do you think that there is differing sorts/kinds of violence? - I.e. some more justified that others, from a European 'preservationist' perspective? And, ought not that perspective be our prime concern?


I think this fact is lamentable, though. Violence is (was) of great evolutionary importance, but in the modern world its role has been limited to official channels (i.e. military and police), and criminal elements.

So, would I be understanding you correctly or incorrectly to say that 'violence' is archaic and parochial in orientation...?


Sure. How does this apply in practice to your average white man? Go into town and beat up some negroes?

Are they problematic to the point that they disrupt the anagenesis and ethogenesis of your own peoples...? Is British 'Law' on your side; or, the side of ambiguity...?


Or even worse, pick a fight with your racial kin, just to measure your own abilities?


Here, I will not be probative: Germanics are, and always have been, a war-like peoples. I must - again - defer to my superior, therefore:


...Preparatory human beings. - I welcome all signs that a more virile, warlike; age is about to begin, which will restore honour to courage above all. For this age shall prepare the way for one yet higher, and it shall gather the strength that this higher age will require some day - the age that will carry heroism into the search for knowledge and that will wage wars for the sake of ideas and their consequences. To this end, we now need many preparatory courageous human beings who cannot very well leap out of nothing, any more than out of the sand and slime of present-day civilization and metropolitanism-human beings who know how to be silent, alone, resolute, and content and constant in invisible activities; human beings who are bent on seeking in all things for what in them must be overcome; human beings distinguished as much by cheerfulness, patience, un-pretentiousness, and contempt for all great vanities as by magnanimity in victory and forbearance regarding the small vanities of the vanquished; human beings whose judgment concerning all victors and the share of chance in every victory and fame is sharp and free; human beings with their own festivals, their own working days, and their own periods of mourning, accustomed to command with assurance but instantly ready to obey when that is called for -equally proud, equally in-debeted to their own cause in both cases; more endangered human beings, more fruitful human beings, happier beings! For believe me: the secret for harvesting from existence the greatest fruitfulness and the greatest enjoyment is - to live dangerously. Build your cities on the slopes of Vesuvius! Send your ships into un-charted seas. Live at war with your peers and yourselves! Be robbers and conquerors as long as you cannot be rulers and possessors, you seekers of knowledge! Soon the eon will be past when you could be content to live hidden in forests like shy deer. At long last the search for knowledge will reach out for its due; it will want to rule and possess, and you with it...

[Loki]

:)You're a great sport - I would have been banned at this point at - uhhhhhhh...other fora.


:wink



Do you think that there is differing sorts/kinds of violence? - I.e. some more justified that others, from a European 'preservationist' perspective? And, ought not that perspective be our prime concern?


Does individual preservationism automatically demand a necessity for violence? I think not. ;)



So, would I be understanding you correctly or incorrectly to say that 'violence' is archaic and parochial in orientation...?


Correct. This is my personal view only though, and I am open to debate.



Are they problematic to the point that they disrupt the anagenesis and ethogenesis of your own peoples...? Is British 'Law' on your side; or, the side of ambiguity...?


They are problematic of course, but beating them up in the street is not going to solve the problem. For starters, the authorities are likely to crack down on you, instead of them. These creatures are only the manifestation of the illness. They are the symptoms, not the disease.



Here, I will not be probative: Germanics are, and always have been, a war-like peoples. I must - again - defer to my superior, therefore:

Yes, and with modern weapons we have warred against our kin, as in WWI and WW2, with disastrous consequences. We need to adapt to our environment. Sometimes violence is not the answer, but the problem.

[Psychonaut]

I don't think a man can really know himself unless he has be in one

I agree. I've not been in a street fight since middle school, but when I was lucky enough to be selected to go to a course last year to become a hand-to-hand combat trainer for my unit. The culmination of the course was three rounds of full contact MMA, where the goal of our instructors was to knock us out. I've trained in martial arts for years now, but that's the closest I've been to a "real" fight in my adult life. I'll tell you this, it was very enlightening to see which of my comrades were cowards and which were men.

[Loddfafner]

Yes, but it is better to leave out the details. More interesting are the fights that almost happened but did not. Generally, the other side was in the wrong, knew it, and backed down. In one key near-fight, one where right and wrong were not so clear, the crew I was running with at the time ran afoul of another. We went through with our business and put on a show of our subculture's signature music. The other team showed up. All was normal, and nothing went down. What was important is what could have happened and so we prepared. I got some training in boxing and in the proper use of knives and other street weaponry. Everyone in our crew knew the score. Some of them showed up and enjoyed the show. Some of them made excuses and never hung out with us again. For all I know, they grew out their hair and exchanged their steelcaps for flip-flops. Later we attended, and enjoyed, the other team's shows.

[Jägerstaffel]

In the words of comedian Daniel Tosh "I'm a man. Not much of one, but a man. I will choke you; if you are younger, smaller and preferably white."

Kidding; personally I've got mixed feelings about fighting. It does seem kind of juvenile and uncivilized, but some people seem to really need to get punched in the face from time to time.

I spent a few years in a cloud of intoxication (suprising, coming from me right?) so there were a few skirmishes with foe and friend alike. Although I lean more towards thin and maybe a bit lanky; I get a wee bit mouthy when I drink.

[Lyfing]

I've been in a bunch of fights..:D

I've always fought with myself..as a little boy I'd beat myself in the head. I still do sometimes. A few months ago I busted my own nose. I'm not afraid of getting hit..:thumb001:

As a little boy I'd hang up 2 liter bottles full of water from my Granny's Plum tree and fight with them.

That being said..

The first fight I remember was when I was in the 5th grade ( I was 9 ) with some dude named Brian. We were outside playing football. I never got along with the dude for whatever reason. He punched me in the ribs, and I roundhouse kicked him in the eye. That is about it. I remember sitting in class crying, because I'm pretty much motivated by emotion more than anything else, and Travis saying stop crying you won. At the time, my Momma had a boyfriend who ran a dojo. He had learned Goju-Ryu in Okinawa while in the Army.

Then there was some guy named Josh Jones. I had never seen the guy. I was with my girlfriend ( Mrs. Lyfing ) over at our friends house, and he rode his bike by. I was laughing at him and said something about his underwear showing. He was about twice my size. He punched me in the eye and I seen stars and fell down. I jumped up with whatever you call it where you lay on your back and put your legs down by it and use them to get on your feet. Like in the Karate movies. Then he punched me in the nose. He broke it. I was done fighting I guess. I don't know what I was thinking. I went into our friends house and washed off and put some salt in my nose. I'm not really proud of that one...I don't think I even hit him. I was 13.

Around that time, I thought I was something of a bad ass...One day I was at school and some coloured guy was messing with my friend. I told him to meet me under the stairs when lunch was over. He did and we fought. It was pretty much even. I remember him picking me up while I beat on his head. Then we went to the principal's office and were suspended. I went to my Granny's and was with Mrs. Lyfing.

There were a few more around then. Some guy thought he knew something and tried to kick me in the hallway. I blocked it and punched him in the stomach. He didn't mess with me anymore.

I had a safety pin that had been in Mrs. Lyfing's mouth that I kept in my mouth and one day I laid it on the lunch table and said if anyone messed with it I was gonna kick their ass. I went away for I don't remember what..maybe my lunch, and when I came back the other fellows said "whatever his name is" moved it. I caught him under the stairs and punched him a few times in the head. He didn't fight back and said that was all bull-shit and he hadn't messed with my safety pin...in the principal's office.

Another time school had let out and I was fighting with some dude out by the bike racks. I remember some kid saying while we were fighting..he knows ( me ) Muay Thai.

I was real into the martial arts thing then. All the books and magazines I could find.

About the next year I was sent off to the nut house for "re-education". I fought with some dude named Micheal. We fought pretty hard and both of us were all messed up. At the same place I fought with some coloured dude named Reggie..we were both pretty beat up then too..:D

...

..Then I was 22 and I got in a fight over a woman. Me and Robby fought one night while we were both drunk. I rushed him and clothslined/headlocked him and threw him on the ground. Some dude named Bob was there and said "hit him".. I was on top of him and started hitting him. Some other day not long after that he was out for revenge. I wasn't drinking. He was around and ( we lived in a trailer park in Georgia ) me and him smoked a joint. ( This part has been omitted for harmony's sake ) He siad "well she can move in the you and you can take care of her". I said "ok". he said "well let's go tell her". We went. He punched me while I wasn't looking and I hit the ground. I got up and got on top of him and he started beating me in the head. I had hold of his parts/ hit him in his parts/ hurt his parts, and told him "hit me again".."hit me again"..she broke us up and when he listened I smashed his nose. I went over to the neighbors house and asked her to call my Momma. She said my eye was hanging out. I went to hospital and they said my eye socket was broke and sewed it up and said that side of my face would droop cause of nerve damage.

Then I was in jail. There was some dude named Joe. Me and some other dude with White Power tattooed on his arms were spades partners playing against Joe and his coloured buddy. I had just washed and had my very long hair down. We were winning and he punched me. We stood up and he said "you want some of me" we went off in the corner room where the cameras couldn't see. He had hold of my hair. I palm fisted him as hard as I could in the nose and we started to fight. He pulled my head down and started kneeing me. His little buddy said.."don't let him up" I got up..assumed the standard boxing position and started punching him.. he was about knocked out..I could see it in his eyes...he still had hold of my hair and we was one tough dude..our blood was everywhere..it was over..

I went and washed up and called him out and he wouldn't come and fight with me...we went to the hole for over a month..

Another time I was living on the streets of Panama City and there was this guy called "Georgia Boy"..he was obviously in a bad mood and I was messing with him. He swung at me and I blocked it. I had my fist on my side and jerked it, and it scared him. He pulled a big fit with an empty quart bottle and then went his way..

I think that's about it..:D

Later,
-Lyfing

[Atlas]

I won every rare fight I ever had with assholes in the past. I don't really like violence but the guys were pissing me off, they just got what they deserved.;)

[Lady L]

As a little boy I'd hang up 2 liter bottles full of water from my Granny's Plum tree and fight with them.


Can I just lighten up the mood in this thread...;) and say I remember this and I remember admiring you as I would walk down the street ( toward your way :D ) this was at age 10...11...12...

I was intrigued, and wondered what it was all about...

:fgift: :85563001: :love_4:

P.S. I'm glad I was born a girl....;)

[Stegura]

Honestly, I'm about as docile, mild-mannered, and passive-aggressive as they come. I've never been in a fight before. Hell, I've never even shoved anyone or been shoved by anyone else in my entire life. I guess I'm just good at keeping out of trouble.

[Sarmata]

So now I'm calm father to my son, and husband to my wife and I have try to stay out from the troubles(last fight were about 4 months ago:rolleyes:). But when I was younger and I haven't got family there were a fights and they were rather often becouse my friends - footbal hooligans, and skinheads just looked for the troubles(well specific district of my city;)). When I have thinked about those times, it was just wonder that Police didn't arrest my any time(by the way my friend ex-skinhead is a cop now:D).
Well I think that adult men should be able to protect him self and his familly...even if it's "barbaric" punch and/or kick...And question for Suut...Didn't you feared that some of negroes may have a gun? I know that sometimes people didn't think too much in such moments, but?

[Hilding]

Yes I have been in fights. Some I have won, some I have lost, some I have been convicted for, some ended with friendship. I do not like it very much but things happen and one should fight with a sharp mind and not let the beast within take over too much. Otherwise it can get really ugly...

[Galloglaich]

When I was younger I used to get in fights a lot. It was fun, just something to pass the time. If my friends and I didn't have someone else to fight we'd get in fistfights with each other. I have to admit I liked the feeling of testing myself against other people and just feeling the wild abandonment of the fray.

It's funny because I'm way too easy going to routinely engage in that kind of thing now. People who have gotten to know me since those days have trouble even thinking of me like that. I'm known as somewhat of a peacemaker/moderator in my circle now. I guess that it was just something I had to do in my youth to test my mettle. Having proven myself, I guess I just don't feel a need to anymore.

That's not to say that I'm against all violence. The right to defend oneself is SACRED. If necessary, one should fight with all means necessary to ensure survival and victory. I still stay sharp by practicing martial arts and maintaining weapons practice when I can. I often carry a gun nowadays, and I guess that's another prohibition against allowing myself to engage in meaningless or trivial altercation. I'm prepared to go the distance if absolutely necessary, but I'm not as willing to engage in violence for inconsequential means anymore.

[Birka]

Only 1 or 2 fights in grade school and only 1 real fight in high school. Most of my aggression was expended in sports. From 9th grade until graduation, I was in a sport for the whole school year. Then even in college I wrestled for almost 2 years until injuries ended my very mediocre career.

As an adult, not any real fights. But do have a license to carry a handgun concealed, and I have several handguns and rifles for defense and hunting. I grew up on a farm and have been around guns since a young boy. I now live out in the more rural area, and even my neighbors are all hunters and expert shots, so I pity the thief who tries to commit crime in this neighborhood.

So, in summation, I don't get into fights, but I think I am well positioned to protect myself, family and friends if necessary.

[MarcvSS]

No never...

Far to chicken for that!

[Sarmata]

No never...

Far to chicken for that!

Ah yes... and have you got a badge with sign of peace as each skinhead ?:D

[MarcvSS]

Ah yes... and have you got a badge with sign of peace as each skinhead ?:DYes I'm one of the few hippieSkins...

We paint lovely flowers on our COMBATboots, use brass knuckles purely for opening bottles of beer and when its cold we wear nice heavy COMBATgloves and COMBATjackets...

Make peace, NOT fights (you may loose):p

[Vargtand]

Yes I'm one of the few hippieSkins...

We paint lovely flowers on our COMBATboots, use brass knuckles purely for opening bottles of beer and when its cold we wear nice heavy COMBATgloves and COMBATjackets...

Make peace, NOT fights (you may loose):p

I knew it!!


As for me, a few not to many.

[Brynhild]

Can I just lighten up the mood in this thread...;) and say I remember this and I remember admiring you as I would walk down the street ( toward your way :D ) this was at age 10...11...12...

I was intrigued, and wondered what it was all about...

:fgift: :85563001: :love_4:

P.S. I'm glad I was born a girl....;)

Where I grew up, there was no distinction. You learned to fight, otherwise you were a target for bullies. That, and my immediate neighbourhood being mostly boys, what choice did a girl have? :D

[SuuT]

Does individual preservationism automatically demand a necessity for violence? I think not.

Does individual preservationism automatically demand a necessity for peace? This seems counterintuitive to me.


They are problematic of course, but beating them up in the street is not going to solve the problem.

Not that I am advocating it, as it would be illegal to do so, and we, here, are all good law-abiding citizens; however, history shows us that it has - indeed - worked before (something to consider as a mental exercise).

But more direct to Nietzsche's thesis, which harkens back to Heraklitus' axiom of war being the father of all things, we (considered as a meta-ethncity with a loose [and, unfortunately, ever loosening] group-consciousness), appear to be just spent insofar as we are willing to explore the Self, by way of danger.


[...]These creatures are only the manifestation of the illness. They are the symptoms, not the disease.

That's a very interesting way of putting it...I'll have to think about that.


Yes, and with modern weapons we have warred against our kin, as in WWI and WW2, with disastrous consequences. We need to adapt to our environment. Sometimes violence is not the answer, but the problem.

An expected (and quite legitimate!) response (i.e. WWI/II). However, might not the answer to this lie in your own statement? - that is, "We need to adapt to our environment"? In other words, if, as a meta-ethnicity, we can come to an accord by way of understanding - and therefore not repeating - historical travesties as it is in our best interests to sublimate (perhaps by way of sport, which is long considered [philosophically] sublimated warfare, anyway) inter-meta-ethnic squabbles due to the dangers we face from without? So, if one's consideration is the cure, and not the symptoms; and the slow-to-life cure that has been envisioned, thus far, for the preservation of Germanic/European culture, etc, continues at a pace that does not keep up with the spread of the disease - is it rational to say that sometimes violence is the answer, and not the problem?

Would that be a justifiable cure then, and not a counter-symptom?




[...] I guess I'm just good at keeping out of trouble.

Do you disagree with Nietzsche's thesis, then - in so far as it may get you into trouble?


[...] And question for Suut...Didn't you feared that some of negroes may have a gun? I know that sometimes people didn't think too much in such moments, but?

No. I understand the psyche of the Negro, and I think we should all explore it ('...keep one's friends close; one's enemies closer...'). Which leads, full circle, back to what can be gleaned from the practical application of Nietzsche's thesis. What I know from its practical application is that if there is anything that defaltes the Negro, it is a display comprised of the fewest words possible (if any) coupled with complete domination. The lack of bolster and bluster confuses them at the start (so long as it doesn't come from fear, which has a stentch to it). The physical act is little more than the coup de grace.

In short, if any of them did have guns, their spirit to use them was robbed, psychologically, by affect and demeanor alone.


[...]things happen and one should fight with a sharp mind and not let the beast within take over too much. Otherwise it can get really ugly...

And yet, there seems times when the Beast is the most glorious, and beautiful, creature within our natures.

[Loki]

Does individual preservationism automatically demand a necessity for peace? This seems counterintuitive to me.


Not automatically, but as the first consideration.



Not that I am advocating it, as it would be illegal to do so, and we, here, are all good law-abiding citizens; however, history shows us that it has - indeed - worked before (something to consider as a mental exercise).


Ahem (http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2075) ... suuure. :p



But more direct to Nietzsche's thesis, which harkens back to Heraklitus' axiom of war being the father of all things, we (considered as a meta-ethncity with a loose [and, unfortunately, ever loosening] group-consciousness), appear to be just spent insofar as we are willing to explore the Self, by way of danger.


Ok. I think my main reservation about the whole idea, is the randomness of application of this thought. Where/how would this be exercised in practice? Can you give some more concrete examples?



An expected (and quite legitimate!) response (i.e. WWI/II). However, might not the answer to this lie in your own statement? - that is, "We need to adapt to our environment"? In other words, if, as a meta-ethnicity, we can come to an accord by way of understanding - and therefore not repeating - historical travesties as it is in our best interests to sublimate (perhaps by way of sport, which is long considered [philosophically] sublimated warfare, anyway) inter-meta-ethnic squabbles due to the dangers we face from without? So, if one's consideration is the cure, and not the symptoms; and the slow-to-life cure that has been envisioned, thus far, for the preservation of Germanic/European culture, etc, continues at a pace that does not keep up with the spread of the disease - is it rational to say that sometimes violence is the answer, and not the problem?


Of course. Sometimes, yes. As necessity dictates. All options need to be considered. Violence seen in isolation is not always the answer though. But I see your point.

[Stossy]

Yes I'm one of the few hippieSkins...

We paint lovely flowers on our COMBATboots, use brass knuckles purely for opening bottles of beer and when its cold we wear nice heavy COMBATgloves and COMBATjackets...

Make peace, NOT fights (you may loose):p

Indeed, you are pretty good at opening those bottles of beer.



Well hmm had some fights at high school but mostly those are a show-off. When I am going out to drink something, tentions can rise. But never had a real fight when I was out to drink something, mostly my friends keep me calm or the other person just leaves.

[Barreldriver]

I reckon I've had my fair share of physical altercation, luckily each time I got into one my opponents wisely opted to drop any charges considering that I was provoked and all and they knew that if charges were pressed I'd seek em out.

[SuuT]

Ahem (http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2075) ... suuure. :p

Don't change the subject. :D


Ok. I think my main reservation about the whole idea, is the randomness of application of this thought.

I don't think Nietzsche is advocating randomness (unless this be a vehicle to the Self, which by default, requires experimentation...However, Nietzsche was Aristocratic in orientation not Anarchic, so I think we can toss that aside). And, I know that I am certainly not advocating "random acts of violence". What I am suggesting, and Nietzsche asserts, is that struggle and strife in general strengthen any given type in accordance with their nature. For example, I could just as easily drove away after the large bottle of bier hit my car, but I didn't. Even though my mettle in such situations had long been established to, and for, myself - I willfully chose harm's way. I did so exactly because of the stereotype that we have allowed to prevail in the Black psyche that White men are are tits to be bullied, and will shrink and lay down at the first sign that they might encounter the slightest bit of pain.

It was a bit of psychological warefare (which we helped invent, and have subsequently abdicated our right to because it is 'unenlightened' or 'uncivilised':rolleyes:): these men will now not only think twice about such a random act of provocation againsta White; but will be forever mindful of what they saw (and what one had to feel).


Where/how would this be exercised in practice? Can you give some more concrete examples?

Anywhere! Everywhere! For me to give concrete examples would be, in essence, asking someone to emmulate me in so far as my concrete examples would be mine. I don't seek clones: what I seek is for each of us to enter uncomfortable realms of experience - be they of the mind, the body or the spirit - that test who each of us think that we are. And this is dangerous: and this is Nietzsche's "secret to Life".

More specific to the thread title, I know that some secrets of one's Self can only remain hidden unless they have been in at least one physical altercation as a grown man.

He was so kind to share it with us; and we have been rude to reject it.

[Loki]

Anywhere! Everywhere! For me to give concrete examples would be, in essence, asking someone to emmulate me in so far as my concrete examples would be mine. I don't seek clones: what I seek is for each of us to enter uncomfortable realms of experience - be they of the mind, the body or the spirit - that test who each of us think that we are. And this is dangerous: and this is Nietzsche's "secret to Life".


In more simple terms: Does this mean I have to go into town now and beat someone up for the heck of it, just to find out how much of a man I am?

[MarcvSS]

In more simple terms: Does this mean I have to go into town now and beat someone up for the heck of it, just to find out how much of a man I am?Yes it does...

So please head into town now, and report to us how many, and wich bones where broken or even shattered, how many teeth you kicked out and please the exact amount of blood spilled in cl's please.:p

Better yet... Film the fun!!!

[SuuT]

In more simple terms: Does this mean I have to go into town now and beat someone up for the heck of it, just to find out how much of a man I am?

That would be random, though. So, given your caveat (emboldened), I would say no.

And the qualifier used, "just" (underlined) demeans the quest of manhood.:(

[MarcvSS]

That would be random, though. So, given your caveat (emboldened), I would say no.

And the qualifier used, "just" (underlined) demeans the quest of manhood.:(Don't tell me your still "questing" for manhood...

[SuuT]

Don't tell me your still "questing" for manhood...


:DLol. You and Loki need to switch usernames - I think it's you that are the trickster:).

But to answer, indeed I am. I would not be so naive to assume, or assert, that I have reached the apex of manhood.


Let the perfect man step forward.

[Sarmata]

No. I understand the psyche of the Negro, and I think we should all explore it ('...keep one's friends close; one's enemies closer...'). Which leads, full circle, back to what can be gleaned from the practical application of Nietzsche's thesis. What I know from its practical application is that if there is anything that defaltes the Negro, it is a display comprised of the fewest words possible (if any) coupled with complete domination. The lack of bolster and bluster confuses them at the start (so long as it doesn't come from fear, which has a stentch to it). The physical act is little more than the coup de grace.

In short, if any of them did have guns, their spirit to use them was robbed, psychologically, by affect and demeanor alone.


So you are like taser with animals but from that I know those people are violent creatures. Its rather hard to understand such chaotic psyche...Well I know what is fight but I don't know how to name your action was it act of heroism or just foolishness ?

[SuuT]

[...]how to name your action was it act of heroism or just foolishness ?


I guess that depends on perspective.


I would name it justice.

[Loki]

That would be random, though. So, given your caveat (emboldened), I would say no.

And the qualifier used, "just" (underlined) demeans the quest of manhood.:(

Fair enough.

I still don't understand what exactly you are proposing though. :shrug:

[SuuT]

Fair enough.

I still don't understand what exactly you are proposing though. :shrug:

To put it as simply as I can think, the restoration of honour to courage above all.

What this means, is up to you.

[Thorum]

The last one I was in was 2001. I ended up in the hospital with 19 stiches on my forehead. I was very drunk. Also, I must add, the brick wall won.

[Manifest Destiny]

I've been in quite a few fights in my life, but none since my high school days.