DNA of Ancient and Medieval Central Asians

[Hudayar]

Starting with

Scythians (Pazyryk, Aldy_Bel, Zevakino_Chilikta, Scythian_Hungary) Saka (Iranian Central Asian), Sarmatian, Alan, Hun (Tian-Shan), Xiong-nu (Mongolians) ve Wusun (Indo-European) and Nomadic Hun Period.

Note: if you don't like bar charts here have this spreadsheet

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Jb3yzNMPV7I20nWyXDNaB_qmWnbao5eZS4l8ySGxcWE/edit#gid=0

Eurogenes K13
https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-LnOfQ4cu1II/WyzlE1vq9lI/AAAAAAAABno/V11R8F56uwIBR8X-jskhevbJjGGdxy0mACLcBGAs/s1600/Eurogenes%2BK13-2.png

Dodecad K12b
https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-aDinVrEr9Bk/WyzlFxX35CI/AAAAAAAABns/7RuKRiM3uE8diOmUzts-izWaxqZyJvO7gCLcBGAs/s1600/Dodecad%2BK12b-2.png

Puntdnal K12
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-QrnL1OzVWCM/WyzlIyPIgHI/AAAAAAAABnw/NqRjm_vqpUoogJBTYVws_LWpLOTRLRAagCLcBGAs/s1600/PuntDNAL%2BK12-2.png

Kangju, Kipchak, Göktürk, Karluk, Karakhanid, Golden Horde (most likely Mongolian) and Nomad_Medieval (most likely Turkic)

note: Göktürks are coded as "Turk" in the bar charts.

Eurogenes K13
https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-r5ym5iI_680/WyzmLog1TSI/AAAAAAAABoE/3a6wPgoh8BAvmXQdYgIu_C2aHyjkxTIOwCLcBGAs/s1600/Eurogenes%2BK13-3.png

Dodecad K12b
https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-UQlJ4wtG9eY/WyzmNFxQ_mI/AAAAAAAABoI/f7GkfrsDbSgBO30aR1mRPbgkz8ad97NCgCLcBGAs/s1600/Dodecad%2BK12b-3.png

Puntdnal K12
https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-0TKTvYpgjPA/WyzmOQsgSNI/AAAAAAAABoM/cdEJEJ4BJL8ygnoIwpYeCUCXg9G5MLkHQCLcBGAs/s1600/PuntDNAL%2BK12-3.png


Source: https://turkishdna.blogspot.com/2018/06/neolitik-cagdan-orta-caga-avrasyann.html

[Hudayar]

Here are their haplogroups. "Yaş" means "Age"

https://preview.ibb.co/eNzcu8/haplogroups.png

source: https://turkishdna.blogspot.com/2018/06/neolitik-cagdan-orta-caga-avrasyann.html

[Hudayar]

Göktürk samples are from Northern Kazakhstan. Surprisingly, Göktürk samples are mostly Caucasoid (only 32% to 48% Asian).

There's also a great difference between Huns/Xiongnus. Some samples are over 90% mongoloid, some are below even 20%. Which proves that there were Caucasoid people (most likely Iranians) in Xiongnu Khaganate.

Karluk samples are very close to Uzbeks. Well, Uzbeks are Karluk after all. Karakhanid samples are also close to Uzbeks.

[Hudayar]

bump

[LoLeL]

Summary and conclusion? Also where is the original article which published this data (the English source)?

[Hudayar]

Summary and conclusion? Also where is the original article which published this data (the English source)?

No one published an article. The samples were extracted from several studies

here are them

http://science.sciencemag.org/content/sci/suppl/2018/05/08/science.aar7711.DC1/aar7711_de_Barros_Damgaard_SM.pdf

https://www.biorxiv.org/content/biorxiv/suppl/2018/03/31/292581.DC1/292581-1.pdf

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-018-0094-2

https://i.imgur.com/X5TQRlI.png

[Pahli]

Looks like early Turks are something like 60 - 80% Scytho-Sarmatian, the rest is Siberian / East Asian. The Mongols must have doubled the Eurasian admixture among Turkic people in Kirgisistan and Kazakhstan then.

[Hudayar]

Looks like early Turks are something like 60 - 80% Scytho-Sarmatian, the rest is Siberian / East Asian. The Mongols must have doubled the Eurasian admixture among Turkic people in Kirgisistan and Kazakhstan then.

Some Scythian samples (Pazyrk) are even more East Eurasian than medieval Turkics. Pazyrk samples are around 60% East Eurasian. But yes, the Turkics were not as mongoloid as people thought. The Gokturk samples are not even above 50% East Eurasian and there's a great difference between Kipchak and Hun samples. Kipchaks are around 20% to 60% mongoloid and Huns/Xiongnus are around 18% to 92% (lol). Only Karluk and Karakhanid samples are balanced. They're around 47-54% mognoloid. They're almost the same as Uzbeks and Uyghurs. And they're the ancestors of these people

[Bosniensis]

Interesting Baltic users don't have East Med and West Med, they have combined 0 East + West Med

While I am 28,79 Baltic and 31,8 Med

Those however with Strong Med have really low Baltic.

It really confirms (even through ancient samples) that we are Native Balkan + Baltic

I wonder whats West Asia reference.

[Pahli]

Some Scythian samples (Pazyrk) are even more East Eurasian than medieval Turkics. Pazyrk samples are around 60% East Eurasian. But yes, the Turkics were not as mongoloid as people thought. The Gokturk samples are not even above 50% East Eurasian and there's a great difference between Kipchak and Hun samples. Kipchaks are around 20% to 60% mongoloid and Huns/Xiongnus are around 18% to 92%. Only Karluk and Karakhanid samples are balanced. They're around 47-54% mognoloid. They're almost the same as Uzbeks and Uyghurs. And they're the ancestors of these people

Seems to me that some of those early Turkic people were very similar to the Saka people of NW China. When I said Scytho-Sarmatian, I am implying the Western ones from Volga to Ukraine. The Eastern Scythians are without doubt heavily admixed with the local Siberian like people. Both Iranians and Turkic people here show a great diversity, but the Mongols did without doubt influence both ethnic groups.


Interesting Baltic users don't have East Med and West Med, they have combined 0 East + West Med

While I am 28,79 Baltic and 31,8 Med

Those however with Strong Med have really low Baltic.

It really confirms (even through ancient samples) that we are Native Balkan + Baltic

I wonder whats West Asia reference.

Because you are Slavic

[Bosniensis]

Seems to me that some of those early Turkic people were very similar to the Saka people of NW China. When I said Scytho-Sarmatian, I am implying the Western ones from Volga to Ukraine. The Eastern Scythians are without doubt heavily admixed with the local Siberian like people. Both Iranians and Turkic people here show a great diversity, but the Mongols did without doubt influence both ethnic groups.



Because you are Slavic

Yeah.

However I got Poles and Ukrainians at 18-20 on Gedmatch results

That's very distant if you agree.

[Pahli]

Yeah.

However I got Poles and Ukrainians at 18-20 on Gedmatch results

That's very distant if you agree.

Pre-Slavic Balkan was more Southern shifted, Slavs changed that and you can also see if you compare even the most Southern Slavs with populations like Greeks for example.

You're obviously not going to be fully East Slavic, but something like 25% Belorussian and rest native Balkan would make sense.

[Bosniensis]

Pre-Slavic Balkan was more Southern shifted, Slavs changed that and you can also see if you compare even the most Southern Slavs with populations like Greeks for example.

I was wrong it's actually 16-17 region:

1 Serbian 3.11
2 Romanian 5.37
3 Moldavian 6.46
4 Bulgarian 7.42
5 Croatian 8.75
6 Hungarian 9.14
7 Austrian 12.48
8 East_German 13.8
9 Ukrainian_Lviv 15.32
10 Greek_Thessaly 15.82
11 South_Polish 15.89
12 Ukrainian 16.48

I hate being mixed... I wish I was either 100% Slavic or 100% Greek/Alb

:(

[Hudayar]

Seems to me that some of those early Turkic people were very similar to the Saka people of NW China. When I said Scytho-Sarmatian, I am implying the Western ones from Volga to Ukraine. The Eastern Scythians are without doubt heavily admixed with the local Siberian like people. Both Iranians and Turkic people here show a great diversity, but the Mongols did without doubt influence both ethnic groups.



Because you are Slavic

Impact of Mongolians on Kazakhstan is correct. Not sure about Kyrgyzes though. Kyrgyzes were in Siberia for centuries. They're recent Central Asians. Even more recent than other Turkics in the area. So the Mongols probably didn't really influence Kyrgyzes a lot.

[Pahli]

I was wrong it's actually 16-17 region:

1 Serbian 3.11
2 Romanian 5.37
3 Moldavian 6.46
4 Bulgarian 7.42
5 Croatian 8.75
6 Hungarian 9.14
7 Austrian 12.48
8 East_German 13.8
9 Ukrainian_Lviv 15.32
10 Greek_Thessaly 15.82
11 South_Polish 15.89
12 Ukrainian 16.48

I hate being mixed... I wish I was either 100% Slavic or 100% Greek/Alb

:(

The thing is there isn't a "typical" Slavic population, Slavs have never really been homogeneous genetically when they spread out, the same goes for many other ethnicities. The only populations that are homogeneous are Baltic people.


Impact of Mongolians on Kazakhstan is correct. Not sure about Kyrgyzes though. Kyrgyzes were in Siberia for centuries. They're recent Central Asians. Even more recent than other Turkics in the area. So the Mongols probably didn't really influence Kyrgyzes a lot.

I thought they inhabited Kyrgyzistan for at least 1000 years or so. I guess I'm mixing up the tribes.

[Marmara]

I would wish to see Central Asian Oghuz samples from Oghuz Yabgu state.

[Aren]

Medieval Ottoman Turk

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 Siberian 31.03
2 West_Asian 22.41
3 Baltic 15.21
4 North_Atlantic 13.01
5 East_Asian 8.76
6 East_Med 4.74
7 West_Med 2.52
8 Amerindian 1.17
9 Red_Sea 0.83
10 Sub-Saharan 0.31

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Afghan_Turkmen 11.78
2 Uzbeki 17.18
3 Kazakh 18.81
4 Shors 19.35
5 Nogay 19.55
6 Aghan_Hazara 20.35
7 Hazara 20.84
8 Kirgiz 21.89
9 Hakas 22.27
10 Uygur 22.77
11 Tatar 26.62
12 Altaian 27.45
13 Mari 29.79
14 Turkmen 30.05
15 Afghan_Tadjik 30.06
16 Tadjik 30.45
17 Chuvash 30.52
18 Mongolian 34.09
19 Kabardin 35.22
20 Balkar 35.56

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 73.4% Nogay + 26.6% Dolgan @ 7.13
2 50.3% Shors + 49.7% Nogay @ 7.23
3 67.7% Shors + 32.3% Chechen @ 7.38
4 68.2% Shors + 31.8% Lezgin @ 7.39
5 68% Shors + 32% Ossetian @ 7.41
6 65.8% Shors + 34.2% Kabardin @ 7.42
7 67.5% Shors + 32.5% North_Ossetian @ 7.45
8 66.9% Nogay + 33.1% Selkup @ 7.45
9 64.5% Hakas + 35.5% Tabassaran @ 7.46
10 65.9% Nogay + 34.1% Ket @ 7.48
11 68.1% Shors + 31.9% Tabassaran @ 7.49
12 66.1% Shors + 33.9% Balkar @ 7.53
13 75.2% Nogay + 24.8% Evenki @ 7.66
14 68.5% Shors + 31.5% Adygei @ 7.68
15 64.8% Hakas + 35.2% Lezgin @ 7.71
16 64.2% Hakas + 35.8% Chechen @ 7.78
17 75.9% Nogay + 24.1% Evens @ 7.79
18 51.8% Tuvinian + 48.2% Tabassaran @ 7.96
19 53.8% Nogay + 46.2% Hakas @ 7.98
20 66.9% Shors + 33.1% Kumyk @ 7.99

[Hudayar]

Medieval Ottoman Turk

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 Siberian 31.03
2 West_Asian 22.41
3 Baltic 15.21
4 North_Atlantic 13.01
5 East_Asian 8.76
6 East_Med 4.74
7 West_Med 2.52
8 Amerindian 1.17
9 Red_Sea 0.83
10 Sub-Saharan 0.31

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Afghan_Turkmen 11.78
2 Uzbeki 17.18
3 Kazakh 18.81
4 Shors 19.35
5 Nogay 19.55
6 Aghan_Hazara 20.35
7 Hazara 20.84
8 Kirgiz 21.89
9 Hakas 22.27
10 Uygur 22.77
11 Tatar 26.62
12 Altaian 27.45
13 Mari 29.79
14 Turkmen 30.05
15 Afghan_Tadjik 30.06
16 Tadjik 30.45
17 Chuvash 30.52
18 Mongolian 34.09
19 Kabardin 35.22
20 Balkar 35.56

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 73.4% Nogay + 26.6% Dolgan @ 7.13
2 50.3% Shors + 49.7% Nogay @ 7.23
3 67.7% Shors + 32.3% Chechen @ 7.38
4 68.2% Shors + 31.8% Lezgin @ 7.39
5 68% Shors + 32% Ossetian @ 7.41
6 65.8% Shors + 34.2% Kabardin @ 7.42
7 67.5% Shors + 32.5% North_Ossetian @ 7.45
8 66.9% Nogay + 33.1% Selkup @ 7.45
9 64.5% Hakas + 35.5% Tabassaran @ 7.46
10 65.9% Nogay + 34.1% Ket @ 7.48
11 68.1% Shors + 31.9% Tabassaran @ 7.49
12 66.1% Shors + 33.9% Balkar @ 7.53
13 75.2% Nogay + 24.8% Evenki @ 7.66
14 68.5% Shors + 31.5% Adygei @ 7.68
15 64.8% Hakas + 35.2% Lezgin @ 7.71
16 64.2% Hakas + 35.8% Chechen @ 7.78
17 75.9% Nogay + 24.1% Evens @ 7.79
18 51.8% Tuvinian + 48.2% Tabassaran @ 7.96
19 53.8% Nogay + 46.2% Hakas @ 7.98
20 66.9% Shors + 33.1% Kumyk @ 7.99

yeah there were 2 Ottoman samples. One was 40% the other one was 20% mongoloid.

[Thracian]

I was wrong it's actually 16-17 region:

1 Serbian 3.11
2 Romanian 5.37
3 Moldavian 6.46
4 Bulgarian 7.42
5 Croatian 8.75
6 Hungarian 9.14
7 Austrian 12.48
8 East_German 13.8
9 Ukrainian_Lviv 15.32
10 Greek_Thessaly 15.82
11 South_Polish 15.89
12 Ukrainian 16.48

I hate being mixed... I wish I was either 100% Slavic or 100% Greek/Alb

:(

At least you are half Balkan Native and half Slavic. I generally modelling in 4 Ancestors Oracle like 50%Greek/Italian (or Balkan native)+ 25%Iranian (due to I have less Mongoloid than other Turks), Turk or Turkmen and 25% Slav (Ukraine and Russia or Hungaria) or Scandinavian (Norwegian or Swedish) or English or Irish.

[Watson]

Medieval Ottoman Turk

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 Siberian 31.03
2 West_Asian 22.41
3 Baltic 15.21
4 North_Atlantic 13.01
5 East_Asian 8.76
6 East_Med 4.74
7 West_Med 2.52
8 Amerindian 1.17
9 Red_Sea 0.83
10 Sub-Saharan 0.31

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Afghan_Turkmen 11.78
2 Uzbeki 17.18
3 Kazakh 18.81
4 Shors 19.35
5 Nogay 19.55
6 Aghan_Hazara 20.35
7 Hazara 20.84
8 Kirgiz 21.89
9 Hakas 22.27
10 Uygur 22.77
11 Tatar 26.62
12 Altaian 27.45
13 Mari 29.79
14 Turkmen 30.05
15 Afghan_Tadjik 30.06
16 Tadjik 30.45
17 Chuvash 30.52
18 Mongolian 34.09
19 Kabardin 35.22
20 Balkar 35.56

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 73.4% Nogay + 26.6% Dolgan @ 7.13
2 50.3% Shors + 49.7% Nogay @ 7.23
3 67.7% Shors + 32.3% Chechen @ 7.38
4 68.2% Shors + 31.8% Lezgin @ 7.39
5 68% Shors + 32% Ossetian @ 7.41
6 65.8% Shors + 34.2% Kabardin @ 7.42
7 67.5% Shors + 32.5% North_Ossetian @ 7.45
8 66.9% Nogay + 33.1% Selkup @ 7.45
9 64.5% Hakas + 35.5% Tabassaran @ 7.46
10 65.9% Nogay + 34.1% Ket @ 7.48
11 68.1% Shors + 31.9% Tabassaran @ 7.49
12 66.1% Shors + 33.9% Balkar @ 7.53
13 75.2% Nogay + 24.8% Evenki @ 7.66
14 68.5% Shors + 31.5% Adygei @ 7.68
15 64.8% Hakas + 35.2% Lezgin @ 7.71
16 64.2% Hakas + 35.8% Chechen @ 7.78
17 75.9% Nogay + 24.1% Evens @ 7.79
18 51.8% Tuvinian + 48.2% Tabassaran @ 7.96
19 53.8% Nogay + 46.2% Hakas @ 7.98
20 66.9% Shors + 33.1% Kumyk @ 7.99

modern turks are mongoloid influenced middle easterners (erabs).

[Thracian]

modern turks are mongoloid influenced middle easterners (erabs).

Nah.

[Marmara]

Medieval Ottoman Turk

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 Siberian 31.03
2 West_Asian 22.41
3 Baltic 15.21
4 North_Atlantic 13.01
5 East_Asian 8.76
6 East_Med 4.74
7 West_Med 2.52
8 Amerindian 1.17
9 Red_Sea 0.83
10 Sub-Saharan 0.31

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Afghan_Turkmen 11.78
2 Uzbeki 17.18
3 Kazakh 18.81
4 Shors 19.35
5 Nogay 19.55
6 Aghan_Hazara 20.35
7 Hazara 20.84
8 Kirgiz 21.89
9 Hakas 22.27
10 Uygur 22.77
11 Tatar 26.62
12 Altaian 27.45
13 Mari 29.79
14 Turkmen 30.05
15 Afghan_Tadjik 30.06
16 Tadjik 30.45
17 Chuvash 30.52
18 Mongolian 34.09
19 Kabardin 35.22
20 Balkar 35.56

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 73.4% Nogay + 26.6% Dolgan @ 7.13
2 50.3% Shors + 49.7% Nogay @ 7.23
3 67.7% Shors + 32.3% Chechen @ 7.38
4 68.2% Shors + 31.8% Lezgin @ 7.39
5 68% Shors + 32% Ossetian @ 7.41
6 65.8% Shors + 34.2% Kabardin @ 7.42
7 67.5% Shors + 32.5% North_Ossetian @ 7.45
8 66.9% Nogay + 33.1% Selkup @ 7.45
9 64.5% Hakas + 35.5% Tabassaran @ 7.46
10 65.9% Nogay + 34.1% Ket @ 7.48
11 68.1% Shors + 31.9% Tabassaran @ 7.49
12 66.1% Shors + 33.9% Balkar @ 7.53
13 75.2% Nogay + 24.8% Evenki @ 7.66
14 68.5% Shors + 31.5% Adygei @ 7.68
15 64.8% Hakas + 35.2% Lezgin @ 7.71
16 64.2% Hakas + 35.8% Chechen @ 7.78
17 75.9% Nogay + 24.1% Evens @ 7.79
18 51.8% Tuvinian + 48.2% Tabassaran @ 7.96
19 53.8% Nogay + 46.2% Hakas @ 7.98
20 66.9% Shors + 33.1% Kumyk @ 7.99

Why don't you post the other sample :rolleyes:

[Aren]

Why don't you post the other sample :rolleyes:

Cause it hasn't been uploaded to Gedmatch :rolleyes:

[Yaglakar]

Antatolian Turks at it again. "Karluk" Turks, "Kipchak" Turks, "Oghuz" Turks. Maybe Turkic people living in Siberia (nominal Siberian Turkic languages) called themselves Siberian Turks? xD

These language denominations are a 20th century development, where linguists simply took medieval tribal names applied them to modern languages to simplify a very complex pattern. These are just linguistic allocations nothing to do with settlement patterns and ethnogenesis. There is no memory of Qarluqs neither in Uzbek nor Uyghur folk memory. Can anyone show me where Turkic authors such as Kashgari or Balasaguni called themselves "Karluks"?

Nothing is astonishing about the fact that Köktürks score high Caucasoid, they were not fully Turkic afterall. Contrary to common layman's opinion propagated here (Köktürk origin - Altai), they were migrants from northern Xinjiang and Gansu to Altai. The areas they came from had heavy Indo-European urban presence, hence their urban smiths skills. These same areas were later dominated by Basmyls which literally means "mixed". Oghuz/Toquz Oghuz/old Uighur steles clearly state that Türks are imposters, who sporadically emerge to claim Kaghanal status which does not belong to them.

[Sora]

Interesting! Also it's the kicker on anti-Turks's faces! :cool:

[Sora]

Also aren't Golden Horde ancestor of Kazakhs? Why they were more Mongoloid than Kazakhs?

[Ajeje Brazorf]

DA111, Hallstatt-Bylany (Czech Republic), 850-700 BC
1 Spanish_Valencia_IBS 6.03
1 54.2% Norwegian_West + 45.8% Sardinian @ 4.89
1 Spanish_Cataluna_IBS_ @ 9.298597
1 50% Austrian + 50% Basque_Spanish @ 6.217017
1 50% Norwegian_West + 25% Sardinian + 25% Spanish_Pais_Vasco_IBS @ 5.338625
1 Basque_Spanish + Sardinian + Swede + Swede @ 4.889539

DA198, Hungarian Scythian, 750-350 BC
1 Italian_Bergamo 9.89
1 57.5% Sardinian + 42.5% Gagauz @ 3
1 Spanish_Baleares_IBS @ 9.507701
1 50% Kosovar + 50% Sardinian @ 4.135782
1 50% Italian_Bergamo + 25% Italian_Bergamo +25% Sardinian @ 3.956344
1 Albanian_Tirana + Sardinian + Sardinian + Serb_Serbia_ @ 3.311352

[Maguzanci]

Can anyone post the Gedmatch kits for these results?

[Hudayar]

Also aren't Golden Horde ancestor of Kazakhs? Why they were more Mongoloid than Kazakhs?

Golden Horde was Mongolian. Not Turkic.

[Ajeje Brazorf]

Can anyone post the Gedmatch kits for these results?

I couldn't find some of the kits he used, and this makes me very nervous.

Okunevo_RISE674 T948730
BOT14_Botai T619388
BOT15_Botai T742380
Afanasievo_RISE511 M828784
Afanasievo_RISE509 F999942
Yamnaya_I0231 M655536
Yamnaya_I0443 M343758
Yamnaya_Rise548 F999968
Andronovo_Rise505 M608028/F999953
Andronovo_Rise500 F999947
Andronovo_Rise503 F999961
Karasuk_Rise493 F999950
Karasuk_Rise495 F999958
Sintashta_Rise386 M690970
Sintashta_Rise395 M277797/F999949
Srubnaya_I0354 M235073
Srubnaya_I0232 M472767
Srubnaya_I0430 M217196
Srubnaya_I0423 M328175
West_Siberia_I5766 Z816953
Shamanka_EN_DA249 T960967
Shamanka_EBA_DA337 T854665
Ust_Ida_LN_DA342 T161521
Kurma_EBA_DA358 T739688
Hajji_Firuz_BA_I4243 Z063604
Shahr_I_Sokhta_BA2_S8726.E1.L1 Z599794
Shahr_I_Sokhta_BA3_S8728.E1.L1 Z690575
Saidu Sharif_S7722.E1.L1 Z146444
Swat_S2270 Z639605
Kashkarchi_BA_I4153 Z669441
Kashkarchi_BA_I4255 Z596095
Turkmenistan_IA_DA382 Z936555
Namazga_DA381 T075567
Gonur_outlier_I1783 Z620055
Dzharkutan2_BA_I4901 Z126798
Kok_Mardan_DA123 T434853
Tagar_DA2 Z511676
Tagar_DA4 Z382195
Tagar_DA8 Z330228
Central_Saka_DA13 Z150104
Tian_Shan_Saka_DA47 Z232502
Out_Tian_Shan_Saka_DA56 Z042473
Tian_Shan_Saka_DA57 Z789153
Tian_Shan_Saka_DA58 Z871644
Tian_Shan_Saka_DA59 Z959198
Alan_DA162 Z285172
Alan_DA243 Z548193
Nomad_IA_DA129 Z189658
Nomad_IA_DA221 Z697149
Aldy_Bel_IA_A10 Z107375
Early_Sarmatian_IA_PR3 Z831915
Sarmatian_DA30 Z032016
Pazyryk_IA_Be9 Z851044
Zevakino_Chilikta_IA_IS2
Hungarian_Scythian_DA198 Z569316/Z923991
Xiong-Nu_WE_DA38 Z777394
Xiong-Nu_DA39 Z780597
Xiong-Nu_WE_DA41 Z877352
Xiong-Nu_DA43 Z368948
Xiong-Nu_DA45 Z802252/Z031856
Tian_Shan_Hun_DA65 Z019511
Tian_Shan_Hun_DA74 Z384293
Tian_Shan_Hun_DA81 Z855800
Tian_Shan_Hun_DA85 Z710382
Tian_Shan_Hun_DA100 Z906895
Tian_Shan_Hun_DA385 Z610860
Nomad_Hun-Sarmatian_DA27 Z419959
Nomad_Hun_Period_DA95 Z423957
Nomad_Hun_Period_DA177 Z035582
Wusun_DA223 Z698544
Kangju_DA206 Z547295
Kipchak_DA23 Z577705
Kipchak_DA179 Z682973
Turk_DA89 M853162
Turk_DA228 Z845678
Karluk_DA222 Z342597
Karluk_DA230 Z710694
Karakhanid_DA204 Z637314
Nomad_Medieval_DA93 Z436842
Nomad_Medieval_DA126 Z580575
Nomad_Medieval_DA142 Z759882
Golden_Horde_Asian_DA28 Z027433

[Hudayar]

I couldn't find some of the kits he used, and this makes me very nervous.

Okunevo_RISE674 T948730
BOT14_Botai T619388
BOT15_Botai T742380
Afanasievo_RISE511 M828784
Afanasievo_RISE509 F999942
Yamnaya_I0231 M655536
Yamnaya_I0443 M343758
Yamnaya_Rise548 F999968
Andronovo_Rise505 M608028/F999953
Andronovo_Rise500 F999947
Andronovo_Rise503 F999961
Karasuk_Rise493 F999950
Karasuk_Rise495 F999958
Sintashta_Rise386 M690970
Sintashta_Rise395 M277797/F999949
Srubnaya_I0354 M235073
Srubnaya_I0232 M472767
Srubnaya_I0430 M217196
Srubnaya_I0423 M328175
West_Siberia_I5766 Z816953
Shamanka_EN_DA249 T960967
Shamanka_EBA_DA337 T854665
Ust_Ida_LN_DA342 T161521
Kurma_EBA_DA358 T739688
Hajji_Firuz_BA_I4243 Z063604
Shahr_I_Sokhta_BA2_S8726.E1.L1 Z599794
Shahr_I_Sokhta_BA3_S8728.E1.L1 Z690575
Saidu Sharif_S7722.E1.L1 Z146444
Swat_S2270 Z639605
Kashkarchi_BA_I4153 Z669441
Kashkarchi_BA_I4255 Z596095
Turkmenistan_IA_DA382 Z936555
Namazga_DA381 T075567
Gonur_outlier_I1783 Z620055
Dzharkutan2_BA_I4901 Z126798
Kok_Mardan_DA123 T434853
Tagar_DA2 Z511676
Tagar_DA4 Z382195
Tagar_DA8 Z330228
Central_Saka_DA13 Z150104
Tian_Shan_Saka_DA47 Z232502
Out_Tian_Shan_Saka_DA56 Z042473
Tian_Shan_Saka_DA57 Z789153
Tian_Shan_Saka_DA58 Z871644
Tian_Shan_Saka_DA59 Z959198
Alan_DA162 Z285172
Alan_DA243 Z548193
Nomad_IA_DA129 Z189658
Nomad_IA_DA221 Z697149
Aldy_Bel_IA_A10 Z107375
Early_Sarmatian_IA_PR3 Z831915
Sarmatian_DA30 Z032016
Pazyryk_IA_Be9 Z851044
Zevakino_Chilikta_IA_IS2
Hungarian_Scythian_DA198 Z569316/Z923991
Xiong-Nu_WE_DA38 Z777394
Xiong-Nu_DA39 Z780597
Xiong-Nu_WE_DA41 Z877352
Xiong-Nu_DA43 Z368948
Xiong-Nu_DA45 Z802252/Z031856
Tian_Shan_Hun_DA65 Z019511
Tian_Shan_Hun_DA74 Z384293
Tian_Shan_Hun_DA81 Z855800
Tian_Shan_Hun_DA85 Z710382
Tian_Shan_Hun_DA100 Z906895
Tian_Shan_Hun_DA385 Z610860
Nomad_Hun-Sarmatian_DA27 Z419959
Nomad_Hun_Period_DA95 Z423957
Nomad_Hun_Period_DA177 Z035582
Wusun_DA223 Z698544
Kangju_DA206 Z547295
Kipchak_DA23 Z577705
Kipchak_DA179 Z682973
Turk_DA89 M853162
Turk_DA228 Z845678
Karluk_DA222 Z342597
Karluk_DA230 Z710694
Karakhanid_DA204 Z637314
Nomad_Medieval_DA93 Z436842
Nomad_Medieval_DA126 Z580575
Nomad_Medieval_DA142 Z759882
Golden_Horde_Asian_DA28 Z027433

Thanks dude

[MercifulServant]

Pre-Slavic Balkan was more Southern shifted, Slavs changed that and you can also see if you compare even the most Southern Slavs with populations like Greeks for example.

You're obviously not going to be fully East Slavic, but something like 25% Belorussian and rest native Balkan would make sense.

It’s more than 25% slavic. The average south slav is probably 40-55% slavic or something like that. It really depends on region though for example Slovenians are far more slavic then Macedonians

[İrle]

Antatolian Turks at it again. "Karluk" Turks, "Kipchak" Turks, "Oghuz" Turks. Maybe Turkic people living in Siberia (nominal Siberian Turkic languages) called themselves Siberian Turks? xD

These language denominations are a 20th century development, where linguists simply took medieval tribal names applied them to modern languages to simplify a very complex pattern. These are just linguistic allocations nothing to do with settlement patterns and ethnogenesis. There is no memory of Qarluqs neither in Uzbek nor Uyghur folk memory. Can anyone show me where Turkic authors such as Kashgari or Balasaguni called themselves "Karluks"?

Nothing is astonishing about the fact that Köktürks score high Caucasoid, they were not fully Turkic afterall. Contrary to common layman's opinion propagated here (Köktürk origin - Altai), they were migrants from northern Xinjiang and Gansu to Altai. The areas they came from had heavy Indo-European urban presence, hence their urban smiths skills. These same areas were later dominated by Basmyls which literally means "mixed". Oghuz/Toquz Oghuz/old Uighur steles clearly state that Türks are imposters, who sporadically emerge to claim Kaghanal status which does not belong to them.

The Göktürk results there are not the results of Ashina clan. They were laballed as Turk/Gokturk because of the date of the samples, implying they are from the Göktürk period. What are you blabbering about exactly?

[Kaspias]

My DNA could be Kipchak example lol. Very similar.

[Yaglakar]

The Göktürk results there are not the results of Ashina clan. They were laballed as Turk/Gokturk because of the date of the samples, implying they are from the Göktürk period. What are you blabbering about exactly?

Do you require a more thorough enlightenment?

[oszkar07]

I was wrong it's actually 16-17 region:

1 Serbian 3.11
2 Romanian 5.37
3 Moldavian 6.46
4 Bulgarian 7.42
5 Croatian 8.75
6 Hungarian 9.14
7 Austrian 12.48
8 East_German 13.8
9 Ukrainian_Lviv 15.32
10 Greek_Thessaly 15.82
11 South_Polish 15.89
12 Ukrainian 16.48

I hate being mixed... I wish I was either 100% Slavic or 100% Greek/Alb

:(

Is this oracle from K13 ?

[Bosniensis]

Is this oracle from K13 ?

I can’t remember


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