Pagan Customs Practiced By Cultures of the Former Yugoslavia

[The Journeyman]

I've heard that the Muslims in Bosnia converted to Islam during Ottoman occupation, in part, so that the Turks would be more lenient towards their practice of pagan customs, and that forms of the pre-christian/islamic religion still live on in some parts of Bosnia. Any of this true?

[Lithium]

I don't know about the Bosnians but the pomaks in Bulgaria still have ancient pagan slavic traditions. Maybe it is the same for the Bosnians too...

[Monolith]

I've heard that the Muslims in Bosnia converted to Islam during Ottoman occupation, in part, so that the Turks would be more lenient towards their practice of pagan customs, and that forms of the pre-christian/islamic religion still live on in some parts of Bosnia. Any of this true?
They converted so they don't have to pay taxes - since Christians were seen as incapable of military service and had to pay to support Muslim armies. Also, even more important reason for their conversion to Islam was Devshirm (tribute in blood).

I'm unaware of any pagan customs practiced by medieval Bosnians, except for those that had already been incorporated into Christianity by the time Bosnia fell to the Ottomans. That's nothing unusual, since other Balkan Slavs also have some pagan customs to this day, not to mention other, more distant Christians (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Day_of_the_Dead).

[Ushtari]

They converted so they don't have to pay taxes - since Christians were seen as incapable of military service and had to pay to support Muslim armies. Also, even more important reason for their conversion to Islam was Devshirm (tribute in blood).

I'm unaware of any pagan customs practiced by medieval Bosnians, except for those that had already been incorporated into Christianity by the time Bosnia fell to the Ottomans. That's nothing unusual, since other Balkan Slavs also have some pagan customs to this day, not to mention other, more distant Christians (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Day_of_the_Dead).
Worth mentioning is that the main enemy of the ottoman empire was the catholic world, and most bosniaks(and albanians) were catholics before conversion. The orthodox church however, was shining and orthodox monkeys also had a own millet.

[lei.talk]

Originally Posted by HomesickSonnets (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Your_Sugar_Sits_Untouched) http://www.theapricity.com/forum/images/jagohan/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?p=372309#post372309) I don't know about the Bosnians
but the pomaks in Bulgaria still have ancient pagan slavic traditions.

Forget Me Not/Cáscara Vacía/Libre/Nacho Libre/Hippaforalkus/E3b like Hitler/Voinstvennyi/Void/Vojn/Yugoslav
might enlighten us:
he was classified as thracian (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pomaks#Alternative_origin_theories)



Originally Posted by artisch http://www.theapricity.com/forum/images/jagohan/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?p=183063#post183063) You look Pomack.
Not an offense but this is exactly the type popular among them.


and self-identified (http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?p=163327#post163327) as such.

[Panopticon]

You're probably thinking of the Bogomils and their heathen form of Christianity. The Bogomil church was far too small for that and little is really known about the Bogomils, other than that they practiced a form of Christianity with strong Pagan influences.

[mymy]

Slavic pagan gods are still celebrated on same way in Serbia. Serbian Ortodox church just gave Christian names to old gods in order that people accept Christianity.

So, we have:

Svetovid > Saint Vitus > Vidovdan
Perun > Saint Elijah > Ilindan
Veles > Saint Nicholas > Nikoljdan
Jarovit, Gerovit > Saint George > Đurđevdan

1.
June 28 is the so called “Vidovdan” day. This day represents Serbian folklore and pagan tradition that has its roots in old Slavic mythology.
According to this mythology “Vid” or “Svetovid” was the god who sees all worlds. The feast day is sacred to ethnic Serbs (Serbian Orthodox Christians), who transformed the pagan Slavic god of war; fertility and abundance Svetivid into the Sicilian martyr St Vitus, who exorcized the evil out of Roman Emperor’s son. This transformation took place at the time of the final Christianisation of the Serb tribes (IX century). On the same day Serbian Orthodox Church is designated as a memorial day to Saint Prince Lazar and the Serbian holy martyrs who gave their lives in defend their faith during the epic Battle of Kosovo against Ottoman Empire on June 28, 1389.

2.
After the arrival of Christianity, the role of Perun was taken over by St. Elijah(Elijah the Thunderer). Perun, as well as the stories about him remained in the folk tradition, but some of them took the form of St Elijah stories, and the others had to change the name of the main character. The Church satanised Perun, probably because of his strong cult and strong influence on people's lives.As far as plants are concerned, the Perun's plant was an oak tree. Even today, the Serbs call a kind of an oak tree 'grm', which originates in the word 'grmeti', which means 'to thunder'. It is thus obvious that grm was dedicated to thunder, i.e. Perun.

3.
After the advent of Christianity, Veles was split into several different characters. As a god of the Underworld and dragons he, of course, became identified with the Devil. His more benevolent sides were transformed to several Christian saints. As a protector of cattle, he became associated with Saint Blaise, popularly known among various Slavic nations as St. Vlaho, St. Blaz, or St. Vlasiy. In many Slavic folk tales, he was replaced by St. Nicholas, probably because the popular stories of the saint describe him as a giver of wealth and a sort of a trickster. Veles, appearing under the Christian guise of St. Nicholas, saves the poor farmer and his cattle from the furious and destructive St. Elias the Thunderer, who, of course, represents the old Perun. The duality and conflict of Perun and Veles does not represent the dualistic clash of good and evil; rather, it is the opposition of the natural principles of earth, water and substance (Veles) against heaven, fire and spirit (Perun).

4.
The worship of this god, however, survived in Slavic folklore for a long time after Christianization. Up until the 19th century in Russia, Belarus and Serbia, folk festivals called Jarilo were celebrated in late spring or early summer. These festivities were completely non-Christian in character, and even early researchers of Slavic mythology easily recognised in them relics of pagan ceremonies in honor of an eponymous spring deity. In Northern Croatia and Southern Slovenia, similar spring festivals were called Jurjevo or Zeleni Juraj or Zeleni Jurij (Green George); nominally, this was a festivity day of Christian St. George, but almost all elements of the celebrations were of pagan origin, and fairly similar to Jarilo festivals of other Slavic nations.

On the day of Saint George here in Serbia, people make wreaths from flowers and leaves and put them on the gates. Young girls and children even wear those wreaths on their heads. There is some believing that on that day you should bath in water with flowers and herbs. At night, many houses stay without gates because guys from the street stole gates from house where unmarried young girl live. Other way is to put color on the gate. This is actually very alive and it is practiced even in towns and cities and not only in villages.

[Hurrem sultana]

Worth mentioning is that the main enemy of the ottoman empire was the catholic world, and most bosniaks(and albanians) were catholics before conversion. The orthodox church however, was shining and orthodox monkeys also had a own millet.

no most bosniaks were members of the bogomils,or the bosnians church

it was heretic and both catholics and orthodox tried to convert us,,,since islam was a lot similar to our old religion we decided to take islam

Our bogomil ancestors had thid great hate for catholicism,an old saying is still alive "better to be ruled by the sultan than the pope from the vatican".So bogomils took refuge in islam,so they did not had to convert to catholic religion

[Hurrem sultana]

this is found all over Bosnia, old bogomil tombstones

http://static.panoramio.com/photos/original/16755597.jpg

[Hurrem sultana]

in bogomilism pork eating was forbidden,they prayed 5 times,they only prayed in nature and they did not believe Jesus was gods son

so those were the similarities with islam that made it easier for them to convert

but they also believed in some kind of "dualism"..good God and evil God

[Hurrem sultana]

and that forms of the pre-christian/islamic religion still live on in some parts of Bosnia. Any of this true?

Yes one example is the "Ajvatovica" every year it gathers over 50 000 muslims,it was a bogomil place of worship,but later converted into islamic

http://www.orbus.be/ramljak/images/ajvatovica03.jpg

http://metro-portal.hr/img/repository/2009/06/web_image/ajvatovica_d_vakuf_crop.jpg


this is actually against islam,and some islamic leaders tried to forbid it

[mymy]

but they also believed in some kind of "dualism"..good God and evil God

Remind me on Belobog-Chernobog in old Slavic mythology.

[Hurrem sultana]

yes it was maybe a slavic influence?

[mymy]

Maybe yes, but anyway, those dichotomies are quite natural and common in many religions. It's eternal fight of good and evil, God and Devil.