Would Phoenicians and the original Jews have been different genetically?

[Sikeliot]

By this I mean the Hebrew speaking Jews of Israel and Judah, versus the Phoenicians in Lebanon.

I ask because on MyHeritage, I am finding a lot of western Sicilians are scoring large amounts of Jewish, not Ashkenazi but North African and Iraqi/Iranian Jewish, and I am wondering if in addition to the Middle East/North African scored, if some of the Phoenician and Carthaginian ancestry is being misread as Jewish.

[Sp_loa]

https://i.pinimg.com/736x/8c/4b/54/8c4b5425abf4d4351ebb006c91219513--jewish-history-maps-history.jpg - MAP 1

77880 - MAP 2

Geographically speaking The Hebrew Kingdoms (Israel and Judah) were very close to Phoenicia (See map 1) . Moreover The United kingdom of Israel had territories that only later became part of Phoenicia (up to Sidon) so you can roughly say that about 30% of Phoenicia used to be Israeli at one point or another through history.
Usually (But not always), in Such circumstances you would expect the two populations to be very similar genetically speaking. In addition both Phoenician language and Hebrew language were very very similar (Canaanite languages) supporting the theory that both populations were similar.

I do think Phoenicians were a bit North shifted of Judeans but not significantly (like modern day Lebanese are North shifted of Samaritans).
P.s:
When you are talking about North African Jews you need to remember that:
There are 2 different groups-
1. Maghrebi Jews - Jews from Libya and East-South Tunisia (Sousse, Djerba ect), Southernmost Morocco and Central Algeria - Those are almost completely lack of European admix (But Tunisian and Libyan Jews might have some due to mixing with the Jews from Livorno) as they are (for the most) not descendants of Spanish-exiled Jews and are mostly levantine by blood with possible Berber Ancestry (due to conversion of Berber tribes to Judaism prior to the Arab conquest or North Africa).

2. North African Sephardim- Jews from most Morocco, Coastal Algeria and Northern Tunisia (Tunis area). In addition to the Levantine- possible Berber Admix they also have some European blood arriving with Sephardic refugees from Iberia during the 15-16th centuries. The Sephardic Ancestry reaches the maximum in Northern Morocco and is lower southern you go (and in Algeria and Tunisia).

Don't forget than Persian Jews and Iraqi Jews do differ from each-other genetically (at-least on PCA plots) due to mixing with local populations.

To support the theory of Original Jews being close to Phoenicians here are some Gedmatch Modelings from modern Jews:


From Turkish Jewish (I think they are the purest Sephardim):
60% Lebanese_Christian + 40% Spanish_Canarias @ 2.38

From Moroccan Jewish (Me):
64.3% Lebanese + 35.7% Sardinian @ 3.27 (The only Module I could find with Lebanese.)

From Syrian Jewish:
81.8% Lebanese_Christian + 18.2% Spanish_Andalucia @ 2.7 (Probably some Sephardic Ancestry)

From Georgian Jewish:
90.5% Armenian + 9.5% Lebanese_Christian

From Armenian Jewish:
53.3% Abhkasian + 46.7% Lebanese_Christian

Ashkenazi Jewish :
53.1% Albanian + 46.9% Lebanese

I would just add and say that the modellings with Samaritans instead of Lebanese make much more sense.

[Thot Whisperer]

https://i.pinimg.com/736x/8c/4b/54/8c4b5425abf4d4351ebb006c91219513--jewish-history-maps-history.jpg - MAP 1

77880 - MAP 2

Geographically speaking The Hebrew Kingdoms (Israel and Judah) were very close to Phoenicia (See map 1) . Moreover The United kingdom of Israel had territories that only later became part of Phoenicia (up to Sidon) so you can roughly say that about 30% of Phoenicia used to be Israeli at one point or another through history.
Usually (But not always), in Such circumstances you would expect the two populations to be very similar genetically speaking. In addition both Phoenician language and Hebrew language were very very similar (Canaanite languages) supporting the theory that both populations were similar.

I do think Phoenicians were a bit North shifted of Judeans but not significantly (like modern day Lebanese are North shifted of Samaritans).
P.s:
When you are talking about North African Jews you need to remember that:
There are 2 different groups-
1. Maghrebi Jews - Jews from Libya and East-South Tunisia (Sousse, Djerba ect), Southernmost Morocco and Central Algeria - Those are almost completely lack of European admix (But Tunisian and Libyan Jews might have some due to mixing with the Jews from Livorno) as they are (for the most) not descendants of Spanish-exiled Jews and are mostly levantine by blood with possible Berber Ancestry (due to conversion of Berber tribes to Judaism prior to the Arab conquest or North Africa).

2. North African Sephardim- Jews from most Morocco, Coastal Algeria and Northern Tunisia (Tunis area). In addition to the Levantine- possible Berber Admix they also have some European blood arriving with Sephardic refugees from Iberia during the 15-16th centuries. The Sephardic Ancestry reaches the maximum in Northern Morocco and is lower southern you go (and in Algeria and Tunisia).

Don't forget than Persian Jews and Iraqi Jews do differ from each-other genetically (at-least on PCA plots) due to mixing with local populations.

To support the theory of Original Jews being close to Phoenicians here are some Gedmatch Modelings from modern Jews:


From Turkish Jewish (I think they are the purest Sephardim):
60% Lebanese_Christian + 40% Spanish_Canarias @ 2.38

From Moroccan Jewish (Me):
64.3% Lebanese + 35.7% Sardinian @ 3.27 (The only Module I could find with Lebanese.)

From Syrian Jewish:
81.8% Lebanese_Christian + 18.2% Spanish_Andalucia @ 2.7 (Probably some Sephardic Ancestry)

From Georgian Jewish:
90.5% Armenian + 9.5% Lebanese_Christian

From Armenian Jewish:
53.3% Abhkasian + 46.7% Lebanese_Christian

Ashkenazi Jewish :
53.1% Albanian + 46.9% Lebanese

I would just add and say that the modellings with Samaritans instead of Lebanese make much more sense.

The purest Sephardic Jews are the Bnei Anusim of Mallorca, it’s sad they are not really recognized.

[Sp_loa]

The purest Sephardic Jews are the Bnei Anusim of Mallorca, it’s sad they are not really recognized.

I find it very hard to believe that coversos are purer than Jews that left Spain in 1492 and never converted....

[Thot Whisperer]

I find it very hard to believe that coversos are purer than Jews that left Spain in 1492 and never converted....

I don’t think they identify as conversos, there called the Chueta and they practice endogamy.

[Sp_loa]

I don’t think they identify as conversos, there called the Chueta and they practice endogamy.

Genetically they are less levantine and more Iberian than other Sephardi groups.

[Florstadt]

Genetically they are less levantine and more Iberian than other Sephardi groups.

Those Chuetas look quite Jewish to me:

https://i.imgur.com/sxkMdZ8.png
https://i.imgur.com/BCszNU9.png

[marco]

https://i.pinimg.com/736x/8c/4b/54/8c4b5425abf4d4351ebb006c91219513--jewish-history-maps-history.jpg - MAP 1

77880 - MAP 2

Geographically speaking The Hebrew Kingdoms (Israel and Judah) were very close to Phoenicia (See map 1) . Moreover The United kingdom of Israel had territories that only later became part of Phoenicia (up to Sidon) so you can roughly say that about 30% of Phoenicia used to be Israeli at one point or another through history.
Usually (But not always), in Such circumstances you would expect the two populations to be very similar genetically speaking. In addition both Phoenician language and Hebrew language were very very similar (Canaanite languages) supporting the theory that both populations were similar.

I do think Phoenicians were a bit North shifted of Judeans but not significantly (like modern day Lebanese are North shifted of Samaritans).
P.s:
When you are talking about North African Jews you need to remember that:
There are 2 different groups-
1. Maghrebi Jews - Jews from Libya and East-South Tunisia (Sousse, Djerba ect), Southernmost Morocco and Central Algeria - Those are almost completely lack of European admix (But Tunisian and Libyan Jews might have some due to mixing with the Jews from Livorno) as they are (for the most) not descendants of Spanish-exiled Jews and are mostly levantine by blood with possible Berber Ancestry (due to conversion of Berber tribes to Judaism prior to the Arab conquest or North Africa).

2. North African Sephardim- Jews from most Morocco, Coastal Algeria and Northern Tunisia (Tunis area). In addition to the Levantine- possible Berber Admix they also have some European blood arriving with Sephardic refugees from Iberia during the 15-16th centuries. The Sephardic Ancestry reaches the maximum in Northern Morocco and is lower southern you go (and in Algeria and Tunisia).

Don't forget than Persian Jews and Iraqi Jews do differ from each-other genetically (at-least on PCA plots) due to mixing with local populations.

To support the theory of Original Jews being close to Phoenicians here are some Gedmatch Modelings from modern Jews:


From Turkish Jewish (I think they are the purest Sephardim):
60% Lebanese_Christian + 40% Spanish_Canarias @ 2.38

From Moroccan Jewish (Me):
64.3% Lebanese + 35.7% Sardinian @ 3.27 (The only Module I could find with Lebanese.)

From Syrian Jewish:
81.8% Lebanese_Christian + 18.2% Spanish_Andalucia @ 2.7 (Probably some Sephardic Ancestry)

From Georgian Jewish:
90.5% Armenian + 9.5% Lebanese_Christian

From Armenian Jewish:
53.3% Abhkasian + 46.7% Lebanese_Christian

Ashkenazi Jewish :
53.1% Albanian + 46.9% Lebanese

I would just add and say that the modellings with Samaritans instead of Lebanese make much more sense.

I’m a little bit confused about what you are saying with North African Jews this is what I get

125500

[Leto]

I’m a little bit confused about what you are saying with North African Jews this is what I get

125500
What do Ashkenazi Jews get with that model?