R1a-z92

[StevenJac]

How does this find it's way to Poland? As far as I can tell my ancestry is from Ludzmierz and my dad's surname leads to Klosow in Silesia.

Could R1a-z92 be Rusyn in this case?

[StevenJac]

bump

[Dragoon]

Well apparently z92 is low minority in Poland and more common is m458.
Maybe z92 is East or South Slavic, Baltic, or Turkic (Tatar).

Here they say its East Slavic/Balto-Slav...

Polish R1a

Z280>CTS1211 = 23% average (Common Slavic)
M458 = 28% average (West Slavic)
Z280>Z92 =5% average (Eastern Slavs/Balto-Slavs)

http://blog.vayda.pl/en/haplogroup-r1a-statistic-02-2018-14-new/

Russians, Belorussians, Ukraine and Lithuania have higher percentage than Poland.

[StevenJac]

I just wonder how it gets to Podhale-Silesia region. I show up closest to East Slovaks and Zakarpattia on GEDmatch so I guess maybe it is something "Ukrainian" like in me.

[Artek]

R1a-Z92 is not frequent in southern regions of Poland but it is found even as far as Austria or Italy/Greece. As far as I know, it can be connected with Rusyn people but I have seen no data that confirmed higher frequency among Rusyns. For now it seems as uncommon as among their Polish-catholic neighbours, numbering maybe 3%, maybe even not that. One definitely Rusyn sample I've found had a surname Senyshyn.

Anyway, many depends on a subclade of Z92. Origins of that branch most probably lie within early Baltic Bronze Age cultures. After that it spread within both Baltic (Western and Eastern Baltic) and Slavic people - probably through assimilation of less frequent Baltic groups or just as a part of variety of R1a branches taking part in their ethnogenesis, in my opinion likely a combination of both factors.

This is why Z92 is so common in such countries as Belarus (especially YP569: https://yfull.com/tree/R-YP569/ - numbering ~20% of male lineages) or in the regions of Russia that are adjacent to the Baltic countries (CTS9551: https://yfull.com/tree/R-CTS9551/.

On the other hand - some clades with more limited distribution seem to be more connected with Western Balts/Ancient Prussians https://yfull.com/tree/R-YP351/) and/or with Yatviagians/Galindians/Sudovians : https://yfull.com/tree/R-CTS4648/.

YP617 is now found quite to the South, for example in Bulgaria and Romania: https://yfull.com/tree/R-YP617. Some of it may be picked up by Goths on their way.

Z92 is definitely interesting and there is still much to discover here.

[Proto-Shaman]

Z92 loks like a Cossack-Tatar cluster, mostly of Tümen origins: http://suyun.info/userfiles/bulletin/2016-1/Tyumentcevs-2_3_20160103_1_[1_2]_3_BEHPS_2016_1.pdf

[Dick]

How does this find it's way to Poland? As far as I can tell my ancestry is from Ludzmierz and my dad's surname leads to Klosow in Silesia.

Could R1a-z92 be Rusyn in this case?

It is obviously Slavic. You are probably not Z93* but a subclade downstream. Who did you test with? 23andme is not a good company for haplogroups for example.




YP617 is now found quite to the South, for example in Bulgaria and Romania: https://yfull.com/tree/R-YP617. Some of it may be picked up by Goths on their way.

Z92 is definitely interesting and there is still much to discover here.
More like spread with Sclaveni and Antes to the Balkans judging by the yfull country matches that are Z93 and downstream from it



The Antes or Antae (Greek: Áνται) were an early Slavic tribal polity which existed in the 6th century lower Danube and northwestern Black Sea region (modern-day Moldova and central Ukraine)

[Babak]

How does this find it's way to Poland? As far as I can tell my ancestry is from Ludzmierz and my dad's surname leads to Klosow in Silesia.

Could R1a-z92 be Rusyn in this case?

According to geneticist kipchak hakan, youre turkic.

[NSXD60]

You got cream-P.I.E.'d.

[Proto-Shaman]

According to geneticist kipchak hakan, youre inferiorcomplexed.
https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/776/703/08a.gif

[Babak]

https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/776/703/08a.gif

lol

[Artek]

It is obviously Slavic. You are probably not Z93* but a subclade downstream. Who did you test with? 23andme is not a good company for haplogroups for example.

Z93 is something totally different than Z92 with a different distribution and story. I agree that 23andMe is not good for Y-DNA and mtDNA testing anyway.


More like spread with Sclaveni and Antes to the Balkans judging by the yfull country matches that are Z93 and downstream from it

Some of Z92 definitely spread with Slavic speakers but I am open for a possibility that some Baltic speakers were absorbed by Goths and migrated with them. We also find interesting Z280 subclades in Spain and Italy. Those subclades are too rare to be typically connected with migrating Slavs.

[StevenJac]

According to geneticist kipchak hakan, youre turkic.

I honestly wouldn't have a problem with that, were it the case.

[StevenJac]

Z93 is something totally different than Z92 with a different distribution and story. I agree that 23andMe is not good for Y-DNA and mtDNA testing anyway.



Some of Z92 definitely spread with Slavic speakers but I am open for a possibility that some Baltic speakers were absorbed by Goths and migrated with them. We also find interesting Z280 subclades in Spain and Italy. Those subclades are too rare to be typically connected with migrating Slavs.

Anyone here know where I can get a better Y-DNA and mtDNA reading? 23andme didn't even give me any clade below z92.

While I'm at it, is H15a1 a normal result?

[Vlatko Vukovic]

It is obviously Slavic. You are probably not Z93* but a subclade downstream. Who did you test with? 23andme is not a good company for haplogroups for example.


More like spread with Sclaveni and Antes to the Balkans judging by the yfull country matches that are Z93 and downstream from it

Z92 in most of cases is purely Baltic. And most likely that Slavs of Z92 origins are Slavicized Balts.

R1a-M558 is most likely East Slavic.

[StevenJac]

I don't even cluster that closely with Balts on GEDmatch though, and being in the south of Poland makes it even weirder.

[StevenJac]

Anyone care to help a newb read this? https://imgur.com/a/GgU6YmD

[LecomtsevAlexander]

I don't even cluster that closely with Balts on GEDmatch though, and being in the south of Poland makes it even weirder.

do not go in cycles in Balts, my male relatives have ancestors, like my supposedly from the culture of mesh ceramics. https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%9A%D1%83%D0%BB%D1%8C%D1%82%D1%83%D1%80%D0%B0_% D1%81%D0%B5%D1%82%D1%87%D0%B0%D1%82%D0%BE%D0%B9_%D 0%BA%D0%B5%D1%80%D0%B0%D0%BC%D0%B8%D0%BA%D0%B8 this is the ancestral culture of the Volga and Baltic Finns. it has a matriarchy, so in it the male contribution to the population is not important.

[StevenJac]

do not go in cycles in Balts, my male relatives have ancestors, like my supposedly from the culture of mesh ceramics. https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%9A%D1%83%D0%BB%D1%8C%D1%82%D1%83%D1%80%D0%B0_% D1%81%D0%B5%D1%82%D1%87%D0%B0%D1%82%D0%BE%D0%B9_%D 0%BA%D0%B5%D1%80%D0%B0%D0%BC%D0%B8%D0%BA%D0%B8 this is the ancestral culture of the Volga and Baltic Finns. it has a matriarchy, so in it the male contribution to the population is not important.

Interesting, but how does that help explain my haplogroup?

[LecomtsevAlexander]

Interesting, but how does that help explain my haplogroup?

in my opinion, Artek has already explained everything to you. I know that many yp569 dys 464 is 12-14-14-16. my Russian branch cts9551 determines the dys 568 is equal to 12 or more. if you do not, then you most likely are you. yp270. But this is not accurate.
I have not seen your STR

[StevenJac]

in my opinion, Artek has already explained everything to you. I know that many yp569 dys 464 is 12-14-14-16. my Russian branch cts9551 determines the dys 568 is equal to 12 or more. if you do not, then you most likely are you. yp270. But this is not accurate.
I have not seen your STR

Most of what you posted there is jargon to me.

As for the latter part, I'm not sure of my striations. I tested with 23andme so my haplogroup info was very vague. I posted on ISOGG and got this https://imgur.com/a/GgU6YmD. From there, I guess Z660 is most likely? I'm not sure if there's some other site or tool I could use to get a clear answer.

[LecomtsevAlexander]

you can check the snps in YSEQ, Germany. http://www.yseq.net/ http://www.yseq.net/images/trees/R1a-Z280_tree.pdf