(Lombard-mixed) Sicilian GEDmatch from Pietraperzia, Enna, Sicily

[Sikeliot]

I have permission to post this.

Pietraperzia was a Lombard town, i.e. one of several towns settled by Lombards and that has traditionally spoken a Gallo-Italic dialect instead of the Sicilian language. I think that is reflected in the result as well as Greek admixture.

You can still see that there is native Sicilian ancestry but has been eroded twice, once by Greek ancestry and again by Lombard, reflected in some affinity to North Italy/Iberia.

Lombard ancestry on some calculators seems to be read as Iberian, due to the closeness of the two.



MDLP K23:


# Population Percent
1 Caucasian 33.51
2 European_Early_Farmers 28.45
3 European_Hunters_Gatherers 13.96
4 Near_East 9.43
5 North_African 4.65
6 South_Central_Asian 2.89
7 South_Indian 1.89
8 Ancestral_Altaic 1.08


Finished reading population data. 620 populations found.
23 components mode.

--------------------------------

Least-squares method.

Using 1 population approximation:
1 Italian_Abruzzo_ @ 4.368150
2 Sicilian_Trapani_ @ 5.680268
3 Italian_Tuscan_ @ 5.987302
4 Sicilian_Siracusa_ @ 6.411512
5 Sicilian_West_ @ 7.018332
6 Maltese_ @ 7.919598
7 Ashkenazi_Jew_ @ 7.959365
8 Italian_Piedmont_ @ 7.990736
9 Sicilian_Agrigento_ @ 7.992274
10 Ashkenazi_ @ 8.580592
11 Sicilian_East_ @ 8.908251
12 Sicilian_Center_ @ 9.919005
13 Greek_Northwest_ @ 10.028853
14 Greek_Peloponnesos_ @ 10.245040
15 Romanian_Jew_ @ 10.502445
16 Albanian_Tirana_ @ 10.673245
17 Greek_Thessaly_ @ 10.684567
18 Central_Greek_ @ 10.786287
19 Kosovar_ @ 11.011353
20 French_Jew_ @ 11.082963

Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% Italian_Piedmont_ +50% Sicilian_Siracusa_ @ 2.770643


Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Sicilian_Siracusa_ +25% Sicilian_Siracusa_ +25% Spanish_Baleares_IBS_ @ 2.185747



Eurogenes K13 and K15:



# Population Percent
1 East_Med 27.28
2 West_Med 25.19
3 North_Atlantic 20.69
4 West_Asian 11.08
5 Baltic 6.78
6 Red_Sea 4.68
7 South_Asian 2.17
8 Northeast_African 1.98
9 East_Asian 0.15

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 West_Sicilian 3.49
2 Italian_Abruzzo 6.55
3 East_Sicilian 6.76
4 South_Italian 7.02
5 Central_Greek 7.56
6 Tuscan 7.6
7 Greek_Thessaly 9.96
8 Ashkenazi 10.63
9 Italian_Jewish 12.09
10 Algerian_Jewish 12.12
11 Sephardic_Jewish 12.34
12 North_Italian 13.32
13 Tunisian_Jewish 16.46
14 Libyan_Jewish 16.69
15 Bulgarian 18.19
16 Romanian 19.62
17 Cyprian 20.59
18 Spanish_Extremadura 20.61
19 Spanish_Andalucia 21.05
20 Portuguese 21.18

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 92% West_Sicilian + 8% Sardinian @ 2.58
2 76.5% South_Italian + 23.5% Spanish_Andalucia @ 2.86
3 78.4% South_Italian + 21.6% Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha @ 2.88
4 77.6% South_Italian + 22.4% Spanish_Galicia @ 2.88
5 79.9% South_Italian + 20.1% Spanish_Cantabria @ 2.91
6 81% South_Italian + 19% Southwest_French @ 2.95
7 76.2% South_Italian + 23.8% Spanish_Extremadura @ 2.97
8 55.5% Cyprian + 44.5% Spanish_Cantabria @ 3
9 57.1% Cyprian + 42.9% Southwest_French @ 3.02
10 78.4% South_Italian + 21.6% Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon @ 3.03
11 80.2% South_Italian + 19.8% Spanish_Aragon @ 3.03
12 50.6% Cyprian + 49.4% Spanish_Andalucia @ 3.05
13 76.8% South_Italian + 23.2% Portuguese @ 3.07
14 77.9% South_Italian + 22.1% Spanish_Valencia @ 3.08
15 77.4% South_Italian + 22.6% Spanish_Murcia @ 3.11
16 53.2% Cyprian + 46.8% Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha @ 3.12
17 85.6% South_Italian + 14.4% French_Basque @ 3.15
18 67.4% South_Italian + 32.6% North_Italian @ 3.21
19 98.5% West_Sicilian + 1.5% Chamar @ 3.3
20 98.4% West_Sicilian + 1.6% Kol @ 3.3




# Population Percent
1 East_Med 24.17
2 West_Med 19.98
3 Atlantic 15.73
4 North_Sea 13.31
5 West_Asian 12.91
6 Red_Sea 5.5
7 Baltic 4.18
8 Northeast_African 1.96
9 South_Asian 1.95
10 Eastern_Euro 0.32

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Italian_Abruzzo 5.81
2 West_Sicilian 6.02
3 East_Sicilian 6.03
4 Tuscan 6.63
5 Central_Greek 7.15
6 South_Italian 7.42
7 Ashkenazi 9.09
8 Greek_Thessaly 9.29
9 Greek 10.45
10 Italian_Jewish 10.59
11 Sephardic_Jewish 12.19
12 Algerian_Jewish 12.42
13 North_Italian 12.6
14 Tunisian_Jewish 16.26
15 Bulgarian 16.31
16 Libyan_Jewish 16.9
17 Romanian 17.75
18 Spanish_Extremadura 19.03
19 Portuguese 19.24
20 Spanish_Murcia 19.57

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 74.5% South_Italian + 25.5% Spanish_Galicia @ 3.14
2 74.1% South_Italian + 25.9% Portuguese @ 3.34
3 50.3% Cyprian + 49.7% Spanish_Galicia @ 3.58
4 74.2% South_Italian + 25.8% Spanish_Extremadura @ 3.62
5 74.9% Tuscan + 25.1% Libyan_Jewish @ 3.69
6 79.9% East_Sicilian + 20.1% Portuguese @ 3.72
7 50.6% Portuguese + 49.4% Cyprian @ 3.76
8 80.6% East_Sicilian + 19.4% Spanish_Galicia @ 3.78
9 79.9% East_Sicilian + 20.1% Spanish_Extremadura @ 3.78
10 80.4% East_Sicilian + 19.6% Spanish_Murcia @ 3.8
11 76.2% South_Italian + 23.8% Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon @ 3.82
12 53.8% East_Sicilian + 46.2% Tuscan @ 3.84
13 72.1% East_Sicilian + 27.9% North_Italian @ 3.86
14 54% Tuscan + 46% South_Italian @ 3.87
15 83.6% East_Sicilian + 16.4% Spanish_Cantabria @ 3.88
16 75.2% South_Italian + 24.8% Spanish_Murcia @ 3.89
17 80.9% Tuscan + 19.1% Syrian @ 3.9
18 78.9% South_Italian + 21.1% French @ 3.9
19 76.6% South_Italian + 23.4% Spanish_Cataluna @ 3.92
20 82.4% East_Sicilian + 17.6% Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha @ 3.92



Dodecad K12b:



# Population Percent
1 Caucasus 32.92
2 Atlantic_Med 28.2
3 North_European 15.74
4 Southwest_Asian 11.59
5 Northwest_African 4.06
6 Gedrosia 3.65
7 South_Asian 2.84
8 East_African 1.02

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Sicilian (Dodecad) 5.76
2 S_Italian_Sicilian (Dodecad) 6.03
3 Ashkenazi (Dodecad) 6.74
4 Ashkenazy_Jews (Behar) 6.94
5 Greek (Dodecad) 7.28
6 C_Italian (Dodecad) 7.72
7 O_Italian (Dodecad) 10.29
8 Tuscan (HGDP) 11.5
9 Sephardic_Jews (Behar) 11.55
10 TSI30 (Metspalu) 12.55
11 Morocco_Jews (Behar) 13.1
12 N_Italian (Dodecad) 18.21
13 Bulgarian (Dodecad) 19.26
14 Bulgarians (Yunusbayev) 19.43
15 North_Italian (HGDP) 19.47
16 Cypriots (Behar) 20.46
17 Romanians (Behar) 20.47
18 Turkish (Dodecad) 22.14
19 Lebanese (Behar) 24.34
20 Turks (Behar) 24.69

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 81.4% Ashkenazy_Jews (Behar) + 18.6% Galicia (1000Genomes) @ 2.41
2 81.7% Ashkenazy_Jews (Behar) + 18.3% Portuguese (Dodecad) @ 2.45
3 81.7% Ashkenazy_Jews (Behar) + 18.3% Extremadura (1000Genomes) @ 2.51
4 84.1% Ashkenazy_Jews (Behar) + 15.9% French (HGDP) @ 2.56
5 83.7% Ashkenazy_Jews (Behar) + 16.3% Cataluna (1000Genomes) @ 2.61
6 87.1% Ashkenazi (Dodecad) + 12.9% Cornwall (1000Genomes) @ 2.62
7 87.3% Ashkenazi (Dodecad) + 12.7% British (Dodecad) @ 2.65
8 87.7% Ashkenazi (Dodecad) + 12.3% Irish (Dodecad) @ 2.68
9 84.7% Ashkenazi (Dodecad) + 15.3% French (HGDP) @ 2.69
10 86.8% Ashkenazy_Jews (Behar) + 13.2% Cornwall (1000Genomes) @ 2.69
11 87.6% Ashkenazi (Dodecad) + 12.4% Argyll (1000Genomes) @ 2.7
12 87.8% Ashkenazi (Dodecad) + 12.2% Orcadian (HGDP) @ 2.7
13 87% Ashkenazy_Jews (Behar) + 13% British (Dodecad) @ 2.7
14 82.9% Ashkenazy_Jews (Behar) + 17.1% Castilla_Y_Leon (1000Genomes) @ 2.72
15 83.7% Ashkenazy_Jews (Behar) + 16.3% Spanish (Dodecad) @ 2.74
16 86.9% Ashkenazi (Dodecad) + 13.1% Kent (1000Genomes) @ 2.75
17 87.9% Ashkenazi (Dodecad) + 12.1% Orkney (1000Genomes) @ 2.75
18 87.1% Ashkenazi (Dodecad) + 12.9% English (Dodecad) @ 2.77
19 87.1% Ashkenazi (Dodecad) + 12.9% CEU30 (1000Genomes) @ 2.78
20 87.4% Ashkenazy_Jews (Behar) + 12.6% Irish (Dodecad) @ 2.78



HarappaWorld:


# Population Percent
1 Caucasian 30.93
2 Mediterranean 28.29
3 NE-Euro 19.37
4 SW-Asian 12.09
5 Baloch 5.24
6 E-African 2.28
7 S-Indian 1.8

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 ashkenazi (harappa) 5.46
2 ashkenazy-jew (behar) 6.98
3 tuscan (1000genomes) 7.44
4 tuscan (hgdp) 8.08
5 tuscan (hapmap) 8.66
6 sephardic-jew (behar) 12.38
7 morocco-jew (behar) 12.68
8 italian (hgdp) 15.87
9 bulgarian (yunusbayev) 17.16
10 romanian-a (behar) 18.02
11 turk-aydin (hodoglugil) 18.68
12 cypriot (behar) 22.77
13 turk-istanbul (hodoglugil) 24.78
14 romanian-b (behar) 24.96
15 turk-kayseri (hodoglugil) 25.18
16 lebanese (behar) 25.62
17 turk (behar) 26.56
18 spaniard (behar) 26.8
19 spaniard (1000genomes) 27.36
20 turkish (harappa) 27.37

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 80.7% tuscan (1000genomes) + 19.3% palestinian (hgdp) @ 2.04
2 56.4% spaniard (1000genomes) + 43.6% druze (hgdp) @ 2.08
3 80% tuscan (1000genomes) + 20% jordanian (behar) @ 2.17
4 81.8% tuscan (1000genomes) + 18.2% egyptian (behar) @ 2.26
5 70.4% ashkenazy-jew (behar) + 29.6% italian (hgdp) @ 2.31
6 80.8% tuscan (1000genomes) + 19.2% egypt (henn2012) @ 2.46
7 51.8% ashkenazy-jew (behar) + 48.2% tuscan (1000genomes) @ 2.62
8 89.9% ashkenazi (harappa) + 10.1% basque (hgdp) @ 2.68
9 80.6% ashkenazy-jew (behar) + 19.4% spaniard (behar) @ 2.72
10 87.5% ashkenazi (harappa) + 12.5% sardinian (hgdp) @ 2.74
11 80.9% ashkenazy-jew (behar) + 19.1% spaniard (1000genomes) @ 2.74
12 78.7% tuscan (1000genomes) + 21.3% lebanese (behar) @ 2.74
13 89.7% ashkenazi (harappa) + 10.3% spain-basc (henn2012) @ 2.76
14 66.1% italian (hgdp) + 33.9% lebanese-christian (haber) @ 2.76
15 80.2% tuscan (1000genomes) + 19.8% syrian (behar) @ 2.81
16 82.5% tuscan (1000genomes) + 17.5% samaritian (behar) @ 2.87
17 64.3% italian (hgdp) + 35.7% lebanese-muslim (haber) @ 2.88
18 63.7% tuscan (1000genomes) + 36.3% sephardic-jew (behar) @ 2.9
19 62% italian (hgdp) + 38% lebanese (behar) @ 2.91
20 86.9% tuscan (1000genomes) + 13.1% yemen-jew (behar) @ 2.93



PuntDNA:


# Population Percent
1 ENF 46.81
2 WHG 28.36
3 CHG 19.71
4 Sub-Saharan 1.87
5 Siberian 1.53
6 ASI 1.09
7 E_Asian 0.63

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Sicilian 4.95
2 Italian_South 5.84
3 Tuscan 7.3
4 Ashkenazi_Jew 9.87
5 Albanian 10.15
6 Greek 10.6
7 Italian_North 11.56
8 Sephardic_Jew 12.86
9 Spanish_Southwest 14.34
10 Bulgarian 16.43
11 Spanish_Northeast 17.55
12 Cypriot 18.55
13 French 19.93
14 Sardinian 20.36
15 Turkish_Aydin 23.21
16 Lebanese 23.84
17 German_South 24.04
18 Tunisian 24.43
19 Croatian 24.47
20 Jordanian 24.8

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 68.2% Sephardic_Jew + 31.8% Basque_Spanish @ 1.64
2 62.2% German_South + 37.8% BedouinB @ 1.68
3 77.6% Italian_North + 22.4% BedouinB @ 1.79
4 52.8% Sephardic_Jew + 47.2% Spanish_Southwest @ 1.86
5 66.6% French + 33.4% BedouinB @ 1.88
6 53.5% Lebanese + 46.5% Basque_Spanish @ 1.91
7 59.8% Utahn_white + 40.2% BedouinB @ 2.03
8 57.9% Sephardic_Jew + 42.1% Spanish_Northeast @ 2.22
9 55.2% Scottish_West + 44.8% BedouinB @ 2.22
10 86.1% Sicilian + 13.9% Basque_Spanish @ 2.26
11 67.8% Ashkenazi_Jew + 32.2% Sardinian @ 2.3
12 56.5% German_North + 43.5% BedouinB @ 2.3
13 58% English_South + 42% BedouinB @ 2.3
14 56.5% Czech + 43.5% BedouinB @ 2.35
15 76.5% Sicilian + 23.5% Spanish_Southwest @ 2.35
16 51.4% Palestinian + 48.6% Basque_Spanish @ 2.36
17 61.8% Croatian + 38.2% BedouinB @ 2.38
18 62.7% Spanish_Southwest + 37.3% Lebanese @ 2.43
19 53% Norwegian + 47% BedouinB @ 2.49
20 50.5% Basque_Spanish + 49.5% Saudi @ 2.59




# Population Percent
1 SW_Europe 39.8
2 West_Asia 20.52
3 NE_Europe 18.32
4 SW_Asia 16.19
5 East_Africa 2.3
6 South_Asia 2.03
7 SE_Asia 0.63
8 Americas 0.22

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Italian_Abruzzo 4.86
2 Italian_Sicilian 5.04
3 Ashkenazy_Jew 5.32
4 Greek_Central 7.45
5 Sephardic_Jew 8
6 Greek_Thessaly 9.8
7 Albanian 10.1
8 Italian_Tuscan 10.66
9 Kosovar 11.54
10 Italian_Bergamo 15.98
11 Bulgarian 16.04
12 Macedonian 16.14
13 Cypriot 17.44
14 Romanian 18.29
15 Turkish 18.45
16 Montenegrin 19.18
17 Turkish_Aydin 20.66
18 Turkish_Kayseri 20.94
19 Spaniard 21.04
20 Serbian 21.45

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 57.4% Syrian + 42.6% French_Basque @ 1.91
2 55.5% Lebanese_Muslim + 44.5% French_Basque @ 2.63
3 56.4% Lebanese_Druze + 43.6% French_Basque @ 2.73
4 88.8% Italian_Abruzzo + 11.2% Saharawi @ 2.84
5 88.7% Italian_Abruzzo + 11.3% Mozabite @ 2.98
6 87.2% Italian_Abruzzo + 12.8% Algerian @ 2.98
7 56.2% Jordanian + 43.8% French_Basque @ 2.99
8 85.8% Italian_Abruzzo + 14.2% Tunisian @ 3.04
9 83.8% Italian_Sicilian + 16.2% Spaniard @ 3.05
10 57.1% Lebanese_Christian + 42.9% French_Basque @ 3.05
11 88.2% Italian_Abruzzo + 11.8% Moroccan @ 3.08
12 93.9% Italian_Abruzzo + 6.1% Tigray @ 3.24
13 94.2% Italian_Abruzzo + 5.8% Amhara @ 3.29
14 88.4% Italian_Sicilian + 11.6% French_Basque @ 3.3
15 50.9% Spaniard + 49.1% Syrian @ 3.3
16 95.1% Italian_Abruzzo + 4.9% Somali @ 3.34
17 94.8% Italian_Abruzzo + 5.2% Oromo @ 3.35
18 74.1% Sephardic_Jew + 25.9% Spaniard @ 3.36
19 68.3% Sephardic_Jew + 31.7% Italian_Bergamo @ 3.37
20 87.7% Italian_Sicilian + 12.3% French @ 3.43

[Sikeliot]

donriccardo if you see this, these are your results.

You are from one of the areas marked green on the map: Sicilian Lombard communities in dark green, formerly Lombard speaking in light green:

https://banner2.kisspng.com/20180529/lhg/kisspng-novara-di-sicilia-bagheria-gallo-italic-of-sicily-year-of-the-rooster-5b0dd586e12e40.4118877615276332869224.jpg

[Bosniensis]

Italian_(put the region) is just a mask to hide a Lombard and other Germanic Identity.

It's funny but when you check the gedmatch of a Lombard he has a distant Hellenic Ancestry but in fact he is still German who has some Hellenic DNA.

People think that Italian_(put the region) is related to Roman Italy, Annonaria etc.. it certainly isn't.

[Dick]

Italian_(put the region) is just a mask to hide a Lombard and other Germanic Identity.

It's funny but when you check the gedmatch of a Lombard he has a distant Hellenic Ancestry but in fact he is still German who has some Hellenic DNA.

People think that Italian_(put the region) is related to Roman Italy, Annonaria etc.. it certainly isn't.

https://media1.tenor.com/images/ada0ff92ee617af4ccf380c0a5da2b26/tenor.gif?itemid=6230144

[Sikeliot]

Italian_(put the region) is just a mask to hide a Lombard and other Germanic Identity.

It's funny but when you check the gedmatch of a Lombard he has a distant Hellenic Ancestry but in fact he is still German who has some Hellenic DNA.

People think that Italian_(put the region) is related to Roman Italy, Annonaria etc.. it certainly isn't.


He is not shifted toward Germans at all but toward Celtic peoples of Western Europe. Northern Italians are Gallic, not Germanic. There is a reason they are called "Gallo-Italic" languages.

Either way he clearly has both Greek and North Italian admixture.

[Bosniensis]

He is not shifted toward Germans at all but toward Celtic peoples of Western Europe. Northern Italians are Gallic, not Germanic. There is a reason they are called "Gallo-Italic" languages.

Either way he clearly has both Greek and North Italian admixture.

Oh yeah I've seen their Gaulic and Celtic haplogroups, they have a lot of relatives in Scandinavia.

[Sikeliot]

Either way donriccardo it looks to me like you're somewhere between 75-80% indigenous "Sicilian" (with all that comes with it -- ancient Mycenaean, Levantine, Sicanian, etc. admixture) and 20-25% Northern Italian from the Lombard settlements.

[Vid Flumina]

Italian_Piedmont in MDLP seems mislabeled. I get this on K23:

7 57.2% Italian_Piedmont ( ) + 42.8% German-Volga ( ) @ 2.2
17 66.5% Italian_Piedmont ( ) + 33.5% Dutch ( ) @ 2.39

[Sikeliot]

Italian_Piedmont in MDLP seems mislabeled. I get this on K23:

7 57.2% Italian_Piedmont ( ) + 42.8% German-Volga ( ) @ 2.2
17 66.5% Italian_Piedmont ( ) + 33.5% Dutch ( ) @ 2.39


Could be mislabeled actually, yes. Still, I do think this result, with its shift toward Iberia and North Italy in other calculators, shows mixture.

[Alessio]

Compared to 4 of my Neapolitan cousins, the results you posted seem a little bit more northern shifted mainly because of the lower East Med and West Asian score. He has almost double the Iberian the the Oracle but to say he's around 1/5 Northern Italian seems like an exaggeration.

k13 example 1

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 East_Med 31.85
2 West_Med 22.63
3 North_Atlantic 16.56
4 West_Asian 13.35
5 Baltic 9.07
6 Red_Sea 6.14
7 Northeast_African 0.21
8 Oceanian 0.14
9 South_Asian 0.05

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 East_Sicilian 2.62
2 South_Italian 3.46
3 Central_Greek 3.5
4 Ashkenazi 5.75
5 West_Sicilian 5.78
6 Italian_Abruzzo 6.8
7 Italian_Jewish 8.64
8 Algerian_Jewish 8.66
9 Sephardic_Jewish 8.75
10 Greek_Thessaly 9.39
11 Tuscan 11.98
12 Tunisian_Jewish 12.72
13 Libyan_Jewish 13.43
14 Cyprian 15.12
15 Bulgarian 18.24
16 North_Italian 18.36
17 Lebanese_Muslim 19.02
18 Syrian 20.1
19 Romanian 20.37
20 Turkish 21.03

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 73.7% Central_Greek + 26.3% Algerian_Jewish @ 1.76
2 73.9% Central_Greek + 26.1% Italian_Jewish @ 1.83
3 66.5% East_Sicilian + 33.5% South_Italian @ 2.26
4 76% Central_Greek + 24% Sephardic_Jewish @ 2.27
5 86.6% East_Sicilian + 13.4% Italian_Jewish @ 2.28
6 82.9% Central_Greek + 17.1% Tunisian_Jewish @ 2.36
7 54.9% Cyprian + 45.1% North_Italian @ 2.36
8 88.5% East_Sicilian + 11.5% Algerian_Jewish @ 2.38
9 83.9% Central_Greek + 16.1% Libyan_Jewish @ 2.42
10 56% Tuscan + 44% Cyprian @ 2.43
11 78.7% South_Italian + 21.3% Greek_Thessaly @ 2.44
12 97.1% East_Sicilian + 2.9% Sardinian @ 2.45
13 90.4% East_Sicilian + 9.6% Sephardic_Jewish @ 2.46
14 86.7% East_Sicilian + 13.3% Ashkenazi @ 2.49
15 95.1% South_Italian + 4.9% Belorussian @ 2.5
16 95.1% East_Sicilian + 4.9% Cyprian @ 2.5
17 95.1% South_Italian + 4.9% Estonian_Polish @ 2.5
18 95.6% South_Italian + 4.4% Lithuanian @ 2.52
19 50.6% South_Italian + 49.4% Central_Greek @ 2.53
20 95.1% South_Italian + 4.9% Russian_Smolensk @ 2.54

k13 example 2

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 East_Med 28.5
2 West_Med 21.15
3 North_Atlantic 18.17
4 West_Asian 15.09
5 Baltic 7.29
6 Red_Sea 6.14
7 East_Asian 1.72
8 Northeast_African 1.2
9 South_Asian 0.45
10 Oceanian 0.29

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 East_Sicilian 3.24
2 Central_Greek 3.81
3 South_Italian 4.3
4 Italian_Abruzzo 4.5
5 West_Sicilian 5.11
6 Ashkenazi 8.11
7 Greek_Thessaly 9.47
8 Sephardic_Jewish 9.71
9 Italian_Jewish 10.45
10 Algerian_Jewish 10.8
11 Tuscan 10.97
12 Tunisian_Jewish 13.87
13 Libyan_Jewish 14.44
14 Cyprian 16.67
15 North_Italian 17.1
16 Bulgarian 17.79
17 Lebanese_Muslim 19.37
18 Turkish 19.4
19 Romanian 19.59
20 Syrian 20.25

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 80.6% West_Sicilian + 19.4% Turkish @ 2.14
2 85.3% West_Sicilian + 14.7% Georgian_Jewish @ 2.21
3 53.2% North_Italian + 46.8% Lebanese_Muslim @ 2.28
4 85.5% West_Sicilian + 14.5% Armenian @ 2.3
5 89.5% West_Sicilian + 10.5% Abhkasian @ 2.31
6 88.9% West_Sicilian + 11.1% Georgian @ 2.33
7 86.7% West_Sicilian + 13.3% Kurdish @ 2.37
8 84.6% West_Sicilian + 15.4% Azeri @ 2.39
9 63.9% East_Sicilian + 36.1% Italian_Abruzzo @ 2.42
10 85.1% West_Sicilian + 14.9% Assyrian @ 2.58
11 87.4% West_Sicilian + 12.6% Iranian @ 2.62
12 93.8% South_Italian + 6.2% La_Brana-1 @ 2.68
13 51.8% South_Italian + 48.2% Italian_Abruzzo @ 2.7
14 86.5% Italian_Abruzzo + 13.5% Samaritan @ 2.72
15 88.7% West_Sicilian + 11.3% Adygei @ 2.75
16 74.7% Italian_Abruzzo + 25.3% Algerian_Jewish @ 2.77
17 71.2% Tuscan + 28.8% Kurdish_Jewish @ 2.78
18 89.1% West_Sicilian + 10.9% Ossetian @ 2.79
19 70.4% Tuscan + 29.6% Assyrian @ 2.79
20 87.6% West_Sicilian + 12.4% Kumyk @ 2.8

k13 example 3

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 East_Med 30.04
2 West_Med 23.6
3 North_Atlantic 18.12
4 West_Asian 15.3
5 Red_Sea 5.35
6 Baltic 4.58
7 Northeast_African 0.83
8 Oceanian 0.72
9 Amerindian 0.57
10 South_Asian 0.54
11 Siberian 0.28
12 East_Asian 0.06

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 South_Italian 2.61
2 East_Sicilian 5.07
3 West_Sicilian 5.71
4 Central_Greek 5.71
5 Italian_Abruzzo 6.37
6 Sephardic_Jewish 8.56
7 Italian_Jewish 9.08
8 Ashkenazi 9.39
9 Algerian_Jewish 9.52
10 Tuscan 11.81
11 Greek_Thessaly 12
12 Tunisian_Jewish 13
13 Libyan_Jewish 13.62
14 Cyprian 15.69
15 North_Italian 17.99
16 Lebanese_Muslim 19.18
17 Turkish 20.2
18 Syrian 20.31
19 Bulgarian 20.62
20 Romanian 22.41

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 62.1% Cyprian + 37.9% Spanish_Andalucia @ 1.7
2 72.8% Cyprian + 27.2% French_Basque @ 1.72
3 95.8% South_Italian + 4.2% French_Basque @ 1.85
4 64.2% Cyprian + 35.8% Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha @ 1.94
5 93.8% South_Italian + 6.2% Spanish_Andalucia @ 1.99
6 94.8% South_Italian + 5.2% Spanish_Aragon @ 2
7 94.4% South_Italian + 5.6% Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha @ 2.03
8 66.1% Cyprian + 33.9% Spanish_Aragon @ 2.06
9 94.1% South_Italian + 5.9% Spanish_Extremadura @ 2.08
10 66% Cyprian + 34% Spanish_Cantabria @ 2.08
11 95% South_Italian + 5% Spanish_Cantabria @ 2.08
12 94.4% South_Italian + 5.6% Spanish_Murcia @ 2.11
13 95.5% South_Italian + 4.5% Southwest_French @ 2.13
14 94.9% South_Italian + 5.1% Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon @ 2.13
15 94.8% South_Italian + 5.2% Spanish_Valencia @ 2.15
16 94.6% South_Italian + 5.4% Portuguese @ 2.16
17 94.9% South_Italian + 5.1% Spanish_Galicia @ 2.17
18 95.1% South_Italian + 4.9% Spanish_Cataluna @ 2.17
19 93.1% South_Italian + 6.9% North_Italian @ 2.25
20 95.9% South_Italian + 4.1% Sardinian @ 2.27

k13 example 4

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 East_Med 28.78
2 West_Med 24.51
3 North_Atlantic 19.7
4 West_Asian 15.19
5 Red_Sea 6.03
6 Baltic 3.86
7 Amerindian 0.87
8 Sub-Saharan 0.46
9 Siberian 0.38
10 Northeast_African 0.21

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 South_Italian 4.55
2 West_Sicilian 5.75
3 Italian_Abruzzo 6.38
4 East_Sicilian 6.54
5 Central_Greek 7.01
6 Sephardic_Jewish 9.76
7 Italian_Jewish 10.54
8 Algerian_Jewish 10.91
9 Tuscan 10.92
10 Ashkenazi 11.02
11 Greek_Thessaly 12.53
12 Tunisian_Jewish 14.37
13 Libyan_Jewish 15
14 North_Italian 16.84
15 Cyprian 17.37
16 Lebanese_Muslim 20.79
17 Bulgarian 20.89
18 Turkish 21.43
19 Syrian 21.75
20 Romanian 22.46

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 69.8% Cyprian + 30.2% French_Basque @ 1.64
2 58.3% Cyprian + 41.7% Spanish_Andalucia @ 2.6
3 62.6% Cyprian + 37.4% Spanish_Aragon @ 2.68
4 91.7% South_Italian + 8.3% French_Basque @ 2.77
5 60.6% Cyprian + 39.4% Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha @ 2.77
6 62.6% Cyprian + 37.4% Spanish_Cantabria @ 3.03
7 89.6% South_Italian + 10.4% Spanish_Aragon @ 3.09
8 87.9% South_Italian + 12.1% Spanish_Andalucia @ 3.11
9 88.9% South_Italian + 11.1% Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha @ 3.15
10 58% Cyprian + 42% Spanish_Extremadura @ 3.2
11 88% South_Italian + 12% Spanish_Extremadura @ 3.22
12 64.1% Cyprian + 35.9% Southwest_French @ 3.26
13 90% South_Italian + 10% Spanish_Cantabria @ 3.26
14 88.8% South_Italian + 11.2% Spanish_Murcia @ 3.31
15 90.8% South_Italian + 9.2% Southwest_French @ 3.34
16 89.7% South_Italian + 10.3% Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon @ 3.38
17 89.5% South_Italian + 10.5% Spanish_Valencia @ 3.41
18 89.6% South_Italian + 10.4% Spanish_Galicia @ 3.44
19 89.2% South_Italian + 10.8% Portuguese @ 3.47
20 90.1% South_Italian + 9.9% Spanish_Cataluna @ 3.47

[Sikeliot]

Compared to 4 of my Neapolitan cousins, the results you posted seem a little bit more northern shifted mainly because of the lower East Med and West Asian score.

k13 example 1

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 East_Med 31.85
2 West_Med 22.63
3 North_Atlantic 16.56
4 West_Asian 13.35
5 Baltic 9.07
6 Red_Sea 6.14
7 Northeast_African 0.21
8 Oceanian 0.14
9 South_Asian 0.05

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 East_Sicilian 2.62
2 South_Italian 3.46
3 Central_Greek 3.5
4 Ashkenazi 5.75
5 West_Sicilian 5.78
6 Italian_Abruzzo 6.8
7 Italian_Jewish 8.64
8 Algerian_Jewish 8.66
9 Sephardic_Jewish 8.75
10 Greek_Thessaly 9.39
11 Tuscan 11.98
12 Tunisian_Jewish 12.72
13 Libyan_Jewish 13.43
14 Cyprian 15.12
15 Bulgarian 18.24
16 North_Italian 18.36
17 Lebanese_Muslim 19.02
18 Syrian 20.1
19 Romanian 20.37
20 Turkish 21.03

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 73.7% Central_Greek + 26.3% Algerian_Jewish @ 1.76
2 73.9% Central_Greek + 26.1% Italian_Jewish @ 1.83
3 66.5% East_Sicilian + 33.5% South_Italian @ 2.26
4 76% Central_Greek + 24% Sephardic_Jewish @ 2.27
5 86.6% East_Sicilian + 13.4% Italian_Jewish @ 2.28
6 82.9% Central_Greek + 17.1% Tunisian_Jewish @ 2.36
7 54.9% Cyprian + 45.1% North_Italian @ 2.36
8 88.5% East_Sicilian + 11.5% Algerian_Jewish @ 2.38
9 83.9% Central_Greek + 16.1% Libyan_Jewish @ 2.42
10 56% Tuscan + 44% Cyprian @ 2.43
11 78.7% South_Italian + 21.3% Greek_Thessaly @ 2.44
12 97.1% East_Sicilian + 2.9% Sardinian @ 2.45
13 90.4% East_Sicilian + 9.6% Sephardic_Jewish @ 2.46
14 86.7% East_Sicilian + 13.3% Ashkenazi @ 2.49
15 95.1% South_Italian + 4.9% Belorussian @ 2.5
16 95.1% East_Sicilian + 4.9% Cyprian @ 2.5
17 95.1% South_Italian + 4.9% Estonian_Polish @ 2.5
18 95.6% South_Italian + 4.4% Lithuanian @ 2.52
19 50.6% South_Italian + 49.4% Central_Greek @ 2.53
20 95.1% South_Italian + 4.9% Russian_Smolensk @ 2.54

k13 example 2

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 East_Med 28.5
2 West_Med 21.15
3 North_Atlantic 18.17
4 West_Asian 15.09
5 Baltic 7.29
6 Red_Sea 6.14
7 East_Asian 1.72
8 Northeast_African 1.2
9 South_Asian 0.45
10 Oceanian 0.29

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 East_Sicilian 3.24
2 Central_Greek 3.81
3 South_Italian 4.3
4 Italian_Abruzzo 4.5
5 West_Sicilian 5.11
6 Ashkenazi 8.11
7 Greek_Thessaly 9.47
8 Sephardic_Jewish 9.71
9 Italian_Jewish 10.45
10 Algerian_Jewish 10.8
11 Tuscan 10.97
12 Tunisian_Jewish 13.87
13 Libyan_Jewish 14.44
14 Cyprian 16.67
15 North_Italian 17.1
16 Bulgarian 17.79
17 Lebanese_Muslim 19.37
18 Turkish 19.4
19 Romanian 19.59
20 Syrian 20.25

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 80.6% West_Sicilian + 19.4% Turkish @ 2.14
2 85.3% West_Sicilian + 14.7% Georgian_Jewish @ 2.21
3 53.2% North_Italian + 46.8% Lebanese_Muslim @ 2.28
4 85.5% West_Sicilian + 14.5% Armenian @ 2.3
5 89.5% West_Sicilian + 10.5% Abhkasian @ 2.31
6 88.9% West_Sicilian + 11.1% Georgian @ 2.33
7 86.7% West_Sicilian + 13.3% Kurdish @ 2.37
8 84.6% West_Sicilian + 15.4% Azeri @ 2.39
9 63.9% East_Sicilian + 36.1% Italian_Abruzzo @ 2.42
10 85.1% West_Sicilian + 14.9% Assyrian @ 2.58
11 87.4% West_Sicilian + 12.6% Iranian @ 2.62
12 93.8% South_Italian + 6.2% La_Brana-1 @ 2.68
13 51.8% South_Italian + 48.2% Italian_Abruzzo @ 2.7
14 86.5% Italian_Abruzzo + 13.5% Samaritan @ 2.72
15 88.7% West_Sicilian + 11.3% Adygei @ 2.75
16 74.7% Italian_Abruzzo + 25.3% Algerian_Jewish @ 2.77
17 71.2% Tuscan + 28.8% Kurdish_Jewish @ 2.78
18 89.1% West_Sicilian + 10.9% Ossetian @ 2.79
19 70.4% Tuscan + 29.6% Assyrian @ 2.79
20 87.6% West_Sicilian + 12.4% Kumyk @ 2.8

k13 example 3

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 East_Med 30.04
2 West_Med 23.6
3 North_Atlantic 18.12
4 West_Asian 15.3
5 Red_Sea 5.35
6 Baltic 4.58
7 Northeast_African 0.83
8 Oceanian 0.72
9 Amerindian 0.57
10 South_Asian 0.54
11 Siberian 0.28
12 East_Asian 0.06

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 South_Italian 2.61
2 East_Sicilian 5.07
3 West_Sicilian 5.71
4 Central_Greek 5.71
5 Italian_Abruzzo 6.37
6 Sephardic_Jewish 8.56
7 Italian_Jewish 9.08
8 Ashkenazi 9.39
9 Algerian_Jewish 9.52
10 Tuscan 11.81
11 Greek_Thessaly 12
12 Tunisian_Jewish 13
13 Libyan_Jewish 13.62
14 Cyprian 15.69
15 North_Italian 17.99
16 Lebanese_Muslim 19.18
17 Turkish 20.2
18 Syrian 20.31
19 Bulgarian 20.62
20 Romanian 22.41

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 62.1% Cyprian + 37.9% Spanish_Andalucia @ 1.7
2 72.8% Cyprian + 27.2% French_Basque @ 1.72
3 95.8% South_Italian + 4.2% French_Basque @ 1.85
4 64.2% Cyprian + 35.8% Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha @ 1.94
5 93.8% South_Italian + 6.2% Spanish_Andalucia @ 1.99
6 94.8% South_Italian + 5.2% Spanish_Aragon @ 2
7 94.4% South_Italian + 5.6% Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha @ 2.03
8 66.1% Cyprian + 33.9% Spanish_Aragon @ 2.06
9 94.1% South_Italian + 5.9% Spanish_Extremadura @ 2.08
10 66% Cyprian + 34% Spanish_Cantabria @ 2.08
11 95% South_Italian + 5% Spanish_Cantabria @ 2.08
12 94.4% South_Italian + 5.6% Spanish_Murcia @ 2.11
13 95.5% South_Italian + 4.5% Southwest_French @ 2.13
14 94.9% South_Italian + 5.1% Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon @ 2.13
15 94.8% South_Italian + 5.2% Spanish_Valencia @ 2.15
16 94.6% South_Italian + 5.4% Portuguese @ 2.16
17 94.9% South_Italian + 5.1% Spanish_Galicia @ 2.17
18 95.1% South_Italian + 4.9% Spanish_Cataluna @ 2.17
19 93.1% South_Italian + 6.9% North_Italian @ 2.25
20 95.9% South_Italian + 4.1% Sardinian @ 2.27

k13 example 4

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 East_Med 28.78
2 West_Med 24.51
3 North_Atlantic 19.7
4 West_Asian 15.19
5 Red_Sea 6.03
6 Baltic 3.86
7 Amerindian 0.87
8 Sub-Saharan 0.46
9 Siberian 0.38
10 Northeast_African 0.21

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 South_Italian 4.55
2 West_Sicilian 5.75
3 Italian_Abruzzo 6.38
4 East_Sicilian 6.54
5 Central_Greek 7.01
6 Sephardic_Jewish 9.76
7 Italian_Jewish 10.54
8 Algerian_Jewish 10.91
9 Tuscan 10.92
10 Ashkenazi 11.02
11 Greek_Thessaly 12.53
12 Tunisian_Jewish 14.37
13 Libyan_Jewish 15
14 North_Italian 16.84
15 Cyprian 17.37
16 Lebanese_Muslim 20.79
17 Bulgarian 20.89
18 Turkish 21.43
19 Syrian 21.75
20 Romanian 22.46

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 69.8% Cyprian + 30.2% French_Basque @ 1.64
2 58.3% Cyprian + 41.7% Spanish_Andalucia @ 2.6
3 62.6% Cyprian + 37.4% Spanish_Aragon @ 2.68
4 91.7% South_Italian + 8.3% French_Basque @ 2.77
5 60.6% Cyprian + 39.4% Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha @ 2.77
6 62.6% Cyprian + 37.4% Spanish_Cantabria @ 3.03
7 89.6% South_Italian + 10.4% Spanish_Aragon @ 3.09
8 87.9% South_Italian + 12.1% Spanish_Andalucia @ 3.11
9 88.9% South_Italian + 11.1% Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha @ 3.15
10 58% Cyprian + 42% Spanish_Extremadura @ 3.2
11 88% South_Italian + 12% Spanish_Extremadura @ 3.22
12 64.1% Cyprian + 35.9% Southwest_French @ 3.26
13 90% South_Italian + 10% Spanish_Cantabria @ 3.26
14 88.8% South_Italian + 11.2% Spanish_Murcia @ 3.31
15 90.8% South_Italian + 9.2% Southwest_French @ 3.34
16 89.7% South_Italian + 10.3% Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon @ 3.38
17 89.5% South_Italian + 10.5% Spanish_Valencia @ 3.41
18 89.6% South_Italian + 10.4% Spanish_Galicia @ 3.44
19 89.2% South_Italian + 10.8% Portuguese @ 3.47
20 90.1% South_Italian + 9.9% Spanish_Cataluna @ 3.47


These aren't even as Near Eastern as the average Sicilian, either, but they plot south of the person I post.

I am glad to see the result, because I had always wondered if the Gallo-Italic languages came to Sicily via a significant number of settlers, or if it was just a linguistic shift. Apparently, there was settlement.

[donriccardo]

Thank you for the informations. This supports my idea about all genealogical researches I did before about my family name. Someday I will ask my dad and mom to take a DNA test as well, so I can identify from which side these results mostly come from.

[Sikeliot]

Thank you for the informations. This supports my idea about all genealogical researches I did before about my family name. Someday I will ask my dad and mom to take a DNA test as well, so I can identify from which side these results mostly come from.


If you want to see what an unmixed person from Enna province looks like genetically I can show you one from Villarosa. I don't think they have ever been linguistically Gallo-Italic.

[Raizen]

He is not shifted toward Germans at all but toward Celtic peoples of Western Europe. Northern Italians are Gallic, not Germanic. There is a reason they are called "Gallo-Italic" languages.

Either way he clearly has both Greek and North Italian admixture.

what about venetians, they don't speak gallo-italic but italo-dalmatian and are genetically more northern than lombards

[Sikeliot]

what about venetians, they don't speak gallo-italic but italo-dalmatian and are genetically more northern than lombards

They didn't settle in Sicily. But genetically they are similar to other north Italians, I would imagine.

[Raizen]

They didn't settle in Sicily. But genetically they are similar to other north Italians, I would imagine.

What about normans there, did they had any distinguishable genetic impact?

[donriccardo]

If you want to see what an unmixed person from Enna province looks like genetically I can show you one from Villarosa. I don't think they have ever been linguistically Gallo-Italic.

Yes I would like to see the other guy from Enna. Can you also post the other from Catania?

[Sikeliot]

Yes I would like to see the other guy from Enna. Can you also post the other from Catania?

I do not have the Catania result on GEDMatch. But this is how a "pure" Ennese would score. I am putting Eurogenes K15 and Dodecad K12b to compare to you.

Eurogenes K15:



# Population Percent
1 East_Med 27.11
2 Atlantic 17.58
3 West_Asian 16.91
4 West_Med 16.22
5 Baltic 6.9
6 Red_Sea 6.19
7 North_Sea 4.95
8 Northeast_African 2.26
9 Southeast_Asian 0.77
10 Sub-Saharan 0.55
11 Oceanian 0.46
12 Siberian 0.1

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 South_Italian 6.02
2 East_Sicilian 6.43
3 Central_Greek 7.15
4 Italian_Abruzzo 7.43
5 West_Sicilian 7.84
6 Sephardic_Jewish 8.94
7 Ashkenazi 9.45
8 Italian_Jewish 9.93
9 Greek 10.3
10 Algerian_Jewish 10.69
11 Tuscan 12.47
12 Tunisian_Jewish 12.51
13 Greek_Thessaly 13
14 Cyprian 15.32
15 Libyan_Jewish 16.48
16 Bulgarian 17.51
17 Turkish 17.64
18 Lebanese_Muslim 17.9
19 North_Italian 18.56
20 Syrian 18.94

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 68.2% Lebanese_Muslim + 31.8% French_Basque @ 5.11
2 58% Lebanese_Muslim + 42% Spanish_Andalucia @ 5.21
3 63.2% Lebanese_Muslim + 36.8% Southwest_French @ 5.4
4 87.4% West_Sicilian + 12.6% Abhkasian @ 5.42
5 86.5% West_Sicilian + 13.5% Georgian @ 5.48
6 94% South_Italian + 6% North_Ossetian @ 5.56
7 96.9% South_Italian + 3.1% Somali @ 5.58
8 97.5% South_Italian + 2.5% Ethiopian_Ari_cultivator @ 5.59
9 97% South_Italian + 3% Ethiopian_Wolayta @ 5.59
10 93.8% South_Italian + 6.2% Kabardin @ 5.61
11 72.1% Cyprian + 27.9% French_Basque @ 5.61
12 96.9% South_Italian + 3.1% Ethiopian_Oromo @ 5.62
13 94% South_Italian + 6% Balkar @ 5.62
14 75.4% West_Sicilian + 24.6% Turkish @ 5.63
15 81.2% West_Sicilian + 18.8% Georgian_Jewish @ 5.63
16 94.1% South_Italian + 5.9% Adygei @ 5.64
17 97.3% South_Italian + 2.7% Maasai @ 5.64
18 97.7% South_Italian + 2.3% Ethiopian_Gumuz @ 5.65
19 94.7% South_Italian + 5.3% French_Basque @ 5.65
20 96.7% South_Italian + 3.3% Ethiopian_Amhara @ 5.65



Dodecad K12b:


# Population Percent
1 Caucasus 32.7
2 Atlantic_Med 24.63
3 North_European 13.74
4 Southwest_Asian 12.48
5 Gedrosia 7.76
6 Northwest_African 7.06
7 East_Asian 1.05
8 East_African 0.53
9 South_Asian 0.04

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Sicilian (Dodecad) 7.59
2 Ashkenazi (Dodecad) 7.82
3 Ashkenazy_Jews (Behar) 7.86
4 S_Italian_Sicilian (Dodecad) 7.88
5 Sephardic_Jews (Behar) 9.62
6 Morocco_Jews (Behar) 10.66
7 Greek (Dodecad) 11
8 C_Italian (Dodecad) 11.89
9 O_Italian (Dodecad) 13.84
10 Tuscan (HGDP) 15.89
11 TSI30 (Metspalu) 16.69
12 Cypriots (Behar) 18.81
13 Turkish (Dodecad) 19.1
14 Lebanese (Behar) 20.36
15 Turks (Behar) 21.16
16 Bulgarian (Dodecad) 21.59
17 N_Italian (Dodecad) 21.86
18 Bulgarians (Yunusbayev) 22.25
19 Romanians (Behar) 23.11
20 Syrians (Behar) 23.29

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 68% Morocco_Jews (Behar) + 32% Bulgarian (Dodecad) @ 3.57
2 85.7% Sephardic_Jews (Behar) + 14.3% Mordovians (Yunusbayev) @ 3.73
3 69.6% Morocco_Jews (Behar) + 30.4% Romanians (Behar) @ 3.82
4 86% Sephardic_Jews (Behar) + 14% Russian (Dodecad) @ 3.84
5 87.9% Sephardic_Jews (Behar) + 12.1% FIN30 (1000Genomes) @ 3.9
6 86.2% Sephardic_Jews (Behar) + 13.8% Russian (HGDP) @ 3.91
7 85.2% Sephardic_Jews (Behar) + 14.8% Swedish (Dodecad) @ 3.91
8 80.7% Sephardic_Jews (Behar) + 19.3% Hungarians (Behar) @ 3.91
9 88.2% Sephardic_Jews (Behar) + 11.8% Finnish (Dodecad) @ 3.97
10 85.5% Sephardic_Jews (Behar) + 14.5% Mixed_Slav (Dodecad) @ 4
11 88.1% Sephardic_Jews (Behar) + 11.9% Lithuanians (Behar) @ 4.02
12 84.3% Morocco_Jews (Behar) + 15.7% Mordovians (Yunusbayev) @ 4.02
13 82.1% Sephardic_Jews (Behar) + 17.9% German (Dodecad) @ 4.04
14 86.1% Sephardic_Jews (Behar) + 13.9% Russian_B (Behar) @ 4.06
15 85.3% Sephardic_Jews (Behar) + 14.7% Polish (Dodecad) @ 4.06
16 87.5% Sephardic_Jews (Behar) + 12.5% Lithuanian (Dodecad) @ 4.07
17 69% Morocco_Jews (Behar) + 31% Bulgarians (Yunusbayev) @ 4.1
18 86.3% Sephardic_Jews (Behar) + 13.7% Belorussian (Behar) @ 4.14
19 84.7% Morocco_Jews (Behar) + 15.3% Russian_B (Behar) @ 4.18
20 85.3% Sephardic_Jews (Behar) + 14.7% Norwegian (Dodecad) @ 4.18

[Sikeliot]

What about normans there, did they had any distinguishable genetic impact?

In Trapani.

[Bobby Martnen]

...

I think my great-grandfather was partially Lombard. He had green-grey eyes and light skin, and my mom said he didn't necessarily look Italian and looked like he could have been German.

[Sikeliot]

I think my great-grandfather was partially Lombard. He had green-grey eyes and light skin, and my mom said he didn't necessarily look Italian and looked like he could have been German.


The only Lombard communities in Palermo province were Corleone and Vicari. Unless you have ancestry from either of these, then it is unlikely.

[Bobby Martnen]

The only Lombard communities in Palermo province were Corleone and Vicari. Unless you have ancestry from either of these, then it is unlikely.

I don't think I do (a cursory look through my ancestry.com, I have dozens if not hundreds of direct Sicilian ancestors documented, so I don't have time to check them all), but I do have an ancestor surnamed "di Genova", which implies the family is Genoese.

[donriccardo]

Why are some part of the results highlighted in red, while others are not?

[Raizen]

For some reason, i come out as part Swedish and part Sicilian on Gedmatch. I don't have any ancestors from these fckin strange places

[Sikeliot]

Why are some part of the results highlighted in red, while others are not?

I was emphasizing how the result differs from yours.

[donriccardo]

ok

[donriccardo]

donriccardo if you see this, these are your results.

You are from one of the areas marked green on the map: Sicilian Lombard communities in dark green, formerly Lombard speaking in light green:

https://banner2.kisspng.com/20180529/lhg/kisspng-novara-di-sicilia-bagheria-gallo-italic-of-sicily-year-of-the-rooster-5b0dd586e12e40.4118877615276332869224.jpg

Consider also the fact that my earliest ancestor from Pietraperzia, Giuseppe Blandino, was the child of Silvester Blandino, a man from Modica (Ragusa), South-East Sicily. I was not able to find the birth record of this man born around 1630 in Modica, but I found another man Silvester Paladino (his mother had the same name of Silvester Blandino), born in 1632. I don't know how this coincidence must be taken under consideration but a couple of years later (1614), a man named Filippo Paladino (very popular family name in Tuscany) from Tuscany was living in Modica and he was commissioned to make a painting in a cathedral there. Few years later I find the same Filippo Paladino (sometimes called Paladini) in Pietraperzia making another painting for another church there. A coincidence? Coincidence or not, it seems my ancestor Silvester "Blandino" (and all his four brothers and parents) never existed in Modica even though the church record in Pietraperzia says "he was from Modica". In my family we are all painters. Another coincidence? :confused:

[Lauχum]

The sampling for Italy is very poorly done, and it is actually very irritating. For such a genetically diverse region there is little formal representation. Italian_Tuscan isn't representative of Tuscany aside from the far south of the region. "North_Italian" doesn't represent Piedmontese, Venetians or Friulians. Italian_South is a vague af sample and is only a good representative of north Calabria and Campania. Sicilian_West is vague and isn't representative of Palermo, Agrigento and Caltanissetta. Sicilian_East is vague and doesn't represent Syracuse or Messina.

Geneticists really need to overhaul sampling for Italy. Sarno et al 2017 was a good start and their labelling was on point, stating the region AND the province. I can't stand these stupid vague labelings: "North", "South", "East", "West", it provides very little insight.

[Lauχum]

But anyway, very interesting results.

[donriccardo]

The sampling for Italy is very poorly done, and it is actually very irritating. For such a genetically diverse region there is little formal representation. Italian_Tuscan isn't representative of Tuscany aside from the far south of the region. "North_Italian" doesn't represent Piedmontese, Venetians or Friulians. Italian_South is a vague af sample and is only a good representative of north Calabria and Campania. Sicilian_West is vague and isn't representative of Palermo, Agrigento and Caltanissetta. Sicilian_East is vague and doesn't represent Syracuse or Messina.

Geneticists really need to overhaul sampling for Italy. Sarno et al 2017 was a good start and their labelling was on point, stating the region AND the province. I can't stand these stupid vague labelings: "North", "South", "East", "West", it provides very little insight.

Italians are very diverse. I am not expert in genetics but I think it's very hard for them to make further breakdowns of italian regions. The admixture is too deep and too ancient.

[Bobby Martnen]

The sampling for Italy is very poorly done, and it is actually very irritating. For such a genetically diverse region there is little formal representation. Italian_Tuscan isn't representative of Tuscany aside from the far south of the region. "North_Italian" doesn't represent Piedmontese, Venetians or Friulians. Italian_South is a vague af sample and is only a good representative of north Calabria and Campania. Sicilian_West is vague and isn't representative of Palermo, Agrigento and Caltanissetta. Sicilian_East is vague and doesn't represent Syracuse or Messina.

Geneticists really need to overhaul sampling for Italy. Sarno et al 2017 was a good start and their labelling was on point, stating the region AND the province. I can't stand these stupid vague labelings: "North", "South", "East", "West", it provides very little insight.

Yet interestingly enough, there is no Italian who clusters anywhere near Germanic people, despite the linguistic border between Austrians/Tyroleans and Venetians.

Interesting how there is very little genetic overlap between the two despite years of interaction.

(Compare this to Eastern Germans and Western Poles, or Western Germans and Northeastern Frenchmen)

[Lauχum]

Yet interestingly enough, there is no Italian who clusters anywhere near Germanic people, despite the linguistic border between Austrians/Tyroleans and Venetians.

Interesting how there is very little genetic overlap between the two despite years of interaction.

(Compare this to Eastern Germans and Western Poles, or Western Germans and Northeastern Frenchmen)

Northern Italy and Austria are more genetically transitional than people think. Venetians and Friulians can get stuff like:
3 60.9% North_Italian + 39.1% Austrian @ 2.95 (Udine)
and
2 66.9% North_Italian + 33.1% Hungarian @ 4.19 (Treviso)

And lets not forget Tyroleans/Alpine Austrians and Swiss Germans are more south-shifted than the Austrian reference samples (which is probably sampled from some transalpine part of Austria). So when you take that into account, you do start to see a cline. Which may be even more apparent if we ever get results from Belluno or Alpine Udine (who may be transitional between lowland Venetians/Friulians and Tyrolese).

[Dick]

Northern Italy and Austria are more genetically transitional than people think. Venetians and Friulians can get stuff like:
3 60.9% North_Italian + 39.1% Austrian @ 2.95 (Udine)
and
2 66.9% North_Italian + 33.1% Hungarian @ 4.19 (Treviso)

And lets not forget Tyroleans/Alpine Austrians and Swiss Germans are more south-shifted than the Austrian reference samples (which is probably sampled from some transalpine part of Austria). So when you take that into account, you do start to see a cline. Which may be even more apparent if we ever get results from Belluno or Alpine Udine (who may be transitional between lowland Venetians/Friulians and Tyrolese).

Why not say that these samples are poorly done?


The sampling for Italy is very poorly done, and it is actually very irritating.

[Lauχum]

Why not say that these samples are poorly done?

What do you mean? Both of these people have 4 grandparents from their respective province.

[Dick]

What do you mean? Both of these people have 4 grandparents from their respective province.

You said it.


The sampling for Italy is very poorly done, and it is actually very irritating. For such a genetically diverse region there is little formal representation. Italian_Tuscan isn't representative of Tuscany aside from the far south of the region. "North_Italian" doesn't represent Piedmontese, Venetians or Friulians. Italian_South is a vague af sample and is only a good representative of north Calabria and Campania. Sicilian_West is vague and isn't representative of Palermo, Agrigento and Caltanissetta. Sicilian_East is vague and doesn't represent Syracuse or Messina.

[Lauχum]

You said it.

Whats your point? Sampling of Italy is poorly done because the labelling is vague, there aren't samples from enough regions and in the case of Tuscany and West Sicily samples are taken from the peripheries of the region (far south Tuscany and Trapani) and don't accurately represent Tuscans and Western Sicilians as a whole.

I've seen quite a few NE Italians score stuff like this and they aren't from German speaking towns, they don't have recent foreign ancestry and they aren't from border towns right next to Austria or Slovenia.

[Haider]

Northern Italy and Austria are more genetically transitional than people think. Venetians and Friulians can get stuff like:
3 60.9% North_Italian + 39.1% Austrian @ 2.95 (Udine)
and
2 66.9% North_Italian + 33.1% Hungarian @ 4.19 (Treviso)

And lets not forget Tyroleans/Alpine Austrians and Swiss Germans are more south-shifted than the Austrian reference samples (which is probably sampled from some transalpine part of Austria). So when you take that into account, you do start to see a cline. Which may be even more apparent if we ever get results from Belluno or Alpine Udine (who may be transitional between lowland Venetians/Friulians and Tyrolese).

Venetians tend to plot a lot with Serbs for instance, who are just a step from plotting with Croatians, who in turn plot with Germans. From the way I see it, Northwest Italians are transitional to Southern French/Occitan people while Northeast Italians are transitional to Allemanic people.

[Dick]

Whats your point? Sampling of Italy is poorly done because the labelling is vague, there aren't samples from enough regions and in the case of Tuscany and West Sicily samples are taken from the peripheries of the region (far south Tuscany and Trapani) and don't accurately represent Tuscans and Western Sicilians as a whole.

I've seen quite a few NE Italians score stuff like this and they aren't from German speaking towns, they don't have recent foreign ancestry and they aren't from border towns right next to Austria or Slovenia.

What's my point? Re-read what you wrote. So are these samples representative or not?

"North_Italian" doesn't represent Piedmontese, Venetians or Friulians.

Northern Italy and Austria are more genetically transitional than people think. Venetians and Friulians can get stuff like:
3 60.9% North_Italian + 39.1% Austrian @ 2.95 (Udine)
and
2 66.9% North_Italian + 33.1% Hungarian @ 4.19 (Treviso)

[Lauχum]

What's my point? Re-read what you wrote. So are these samples representative or not?

"North_Italian" doesn't represent Piedmontese, Venetians or Friulians.

Northern Italy and Austria are more genetically transitional than people think. Venetians and Friulians can get stuff like:
3 60.9% North_Italian + 39.1% Austrian @ 2.95 (Udine)
and
2 66.9% North_Italian + 33.1% Hungarian @ 4.19 (Treviso)

Well I do think the 2 samples I posted are representative of the genetic makeup of Venetians and Friulians. However North_Italian (Lombard) samples are not representative of NE Italians because they cluster North-East towards Central Europe and the upper Balkans. So North-Easterners will form a separate cluster to Lombards.

[renaissance12]

He is not shifted toward Germans at all but toward Celtic peoples of Western Europe. Northern Italians are Gallic, not Germanic. There is a reason they are called "Gallo-Italic" languages.

Either way he clearly has both Greek and North Italian admixture.


Do you consider alpinids as gallic people ?

[Sikeliot]

Whats your point? Sampling of Italy is poorly done because the labelling is vague, there aren't samples from enough regions and in the case of Tuscany and West Sicily samples are taken from the peripheries of the region (far south Tuscany and Trapani) and don't accurately represent Tuscans and Western Sicilians as a whole.

I've seen quite a few NE Italians score stuff like this and they aren't from German speaking towns, they don't have recent foreign ancestry and they aren't from border towns right next to Austria or Slovenia.


On MDLP K23, eastern Palermo province area is instead "Central Sicily" whereas western Palermo province is "West Sicily" and then Trapani and Agrigento are separate. This way makes a bit more sense to me but is still not perfect. And overall I do not think that is a great calculator but it is definitely a better method than applying Trapani to all West Sicily.

[Bobby Martnen]

Northern Italy and Austria are more genetically transitional than people think. Venetians and Friulians can get stuff like:
3 60.9% North_Italian + 39.1% Austrian @ 2.95 (Udine)
and
2 66.9% North_Italian + 33.1% Hungarian @ 4.19 (Treviso)

And lets not forget Tyroleans/Alpine Austrians and Swiss Germans are more south-shifted than the Austrian reference samples (which is probably sampled from some transalpine part of Austria). So when you take that into account, you do start to see a cline. Which may be even more apparent if we ever get results from Belluno or Alpine Udine (who may be transitional between lowland Venetians/Friulians and Tyrolese).

but there's still not nearly as much overlap as with Germans and French or Poles and Germans, etc...

[Bobby Martnen]

Northeastern Italians do have a northeastern shift, but they're a far way from Central Europeans or Balkanites, genetically.

https://i.imgur.com/zTSJTLx.jpg

[Token]

but there's still not nearly as much overlap as with Germans and French or Poles and Germans, etc...

There is a lot of overlap with Austrians though. Venetians and Friulians are closer to Austrian Tyroleans and Swiss than to Lombards, as crazy as it might sounds to the layman. It also depends on the region: Venetians from Verona will plot close to Northwestern Italians, but i'm talking about the average here.

https://i.imgur.com/Z2nQ8zl.png

[Lauχum]

There is a lot of overlap with Austrians though. Venetians and Friulians are closer to Austrian Tyroleans and Swiss than to Lombards, as crazy as it might sounds to the layman. It also depends on the region: Venetians from Verona will plot close to Northwestern Italians, but i'm talking about the average here.

https://i.imgur.com/Z2nQ8zl.png

Thanks for posting this. BTW could you post the full PCA plot?

[AphroditeWorshiper]

Northeastern Italians do have a northeastern shift, but they're a far way from Central Europeans or Balkanites, genetically.

https://i.imgur.com/zTSJTLx.jpg

What??

Aragon and Cantabria next to Southwest France than Catalans? how? :eek:

[Sikeliot]

What??

Aragon and Cantabria next to Southwest France than Catalans? how? :eek:

Catalans may have absorbed a very minimal amount of eastern Mediterranean admixture, being closer to the coast.

[Aren]

Why not say that these samples are poorly done?

Cause agenda. Academic samples are poorly sampled, but carefully selected Gedmatch kits of outliers are representative.

[Lauχum]

Cause agenda. Academic samples are poorly sampled, but carefully selected Gedmatch kits of outliers are representative.

Suggesting that not every part of Northern Italy is represented by some province in Lombardy doesn't mean I have an agenda. No need to make snarky and passive-agressive accusations.

[Aren]

There is a lot of overlap with Austrians though. Venetians and Friulians are closer to Austrian Tyroleans and Swiss than to Lombards, as crazy as it might sounds to the layman. It also depends on the region: Venetians from Verona will plot close to Northwestern Italians, but i'm talking about the average here.

https://i.imgur.com/Z2nQ8zl.png

Doesn't seem like a great overlap. Some Venetians are closer but some are also plotting with Lombards.
Also keep in mind this was an amateur plot of a guy who accepted samples from random members on Anthrogenica without questioning. There's a lot of Southern Euros(and this includes Northern Italians ofc) who carefully select northern shifted people of their own ethnicities as more representative than others. All of the Venetian samples were posted by a Northern Italian member. And at the same time the same people try to make neighbouring regions seem more Southern, such as Austrians or Swiss Germans/French in the case of Northern Italians. So you have to keep in mind personal bias and agendas.

[Aren]

Suggesting that not every part of Northern Italy is represented by some province in Lombardy doesn't mean I have an agenda. No need to make snarky and passive-agressive accusations.

Not passive agressive at all. It's true many Southern Euros have this agenda I described. I only trust academic averages. Not carefully selected individuals.

I highly doubt Venetians are closer to Austrians than to Lombards though, and if some invdividuals are indeed closer to the latter then they are outliers and probably have semi-recent Austrian or Slovenian ancestry.

[Lauχum]

Not passive agressive at all. It's true many Southern Euros have this agenda I described. I only trust academic averages. Not carefully selected individuals.

I highly doubt Venetians are closer to Austrians than to Lombards though, and if some invdividuals are indeed closer to the latter then they are outliers and probably have semi-recent Austrian or Slovenian ancestry.

I never claimed Venetians are closer to Austrians than Lombards. I claimed they are north-shifted towards Austrians relative to Lombards, and most samples I have seen from the TriVeneto area show this.
And there you go again with these stupid stereotypes and accusations. If Venetian GEDmatch results were mostly Tuscan shifted and I stated this observation no one would be whining and claiming foul play.

[Lauχum]

What??

Aragon and Cantabria next to Southwest France than Catalans? how? :eek:

IIRC those Southern French samples are from Gascon. They cluster with Basques when I rune the Global 25 samples through Past3. Aragon and Cantabria are close to the Basque country and thus have a higher Basque affinity, though in the Global 25 cluster chart they're still grouped with Iberians and North Italians over Basques and Southern French.
78752

[Aren]

I never claimed Venetians are closer to Austrians than Lombards. I claimed they are north-shifted towards Austrians relative to Lombards, and most samples I have seen from the TriVeneto area show this.
And there you go again with these stupid stereotypes and accusations. If Venetian GEDmatch results were mostly Tuscan shifted and I stated this observation no one would be whining and claiming foul play.

Some probably are but some aren't.

Venetian from the Alpine project

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 Atlantic 24.78
2 West_Med 18.81
3 East_Med 13.91
4 North_Sea 13.36
5 Baltic 9.59
6 West_Asian 8.42
7 Eastern_Euro 7.71
8 Red_Sea 2.27
9 South_Asian 0.77
10 Sub-Saharan 0.26
11 Oceanian 0.12

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 North_Italian 6.25
2 Tuscan 9.1
3 Spanish_Andalucia 10.11
4 Spanish_Extremadura 10.65
5 Spanish_Valencia 10.86
6 Spanish_Murcia 10.95
7 Spanish_Cataluna 10.97
8 Portuguese 11.07
9 Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon 11.35
10 Bulgarian 11.37
11 Romanian 11.72
12 Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha 11.98
13 Spanish_Galicia 12.12
14 Serbian 12.18
15 Greek 12.76
16 Southwest_French 13.32
17 Spanish_Cantabria 13.36
18 Spanish_Aragon 13.77
19 Greek_Thessaly 14.09
20 Italian_Abruzzo 14.32

1 53.1% Spanish_Andalucia + 46.9% Bulgarian @ 2.37

No French or Austrian in top 20. Close to the Bergamo average as one would expect, as Bergamo lies in the heart of Northern Italy. It's safe to presume Venetians and Friulians from the edges of their respective regions who deviate towards Austria/Croatia do so because of ancestry from such areas

[Lauχum]

Some probably are but some aren't.

Venetian from the Alpine project

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 Atlantic 24.78
2 West_Med 18.81
3 East_Med 13.91
4 North_Sea 13.36
5 Baltic 9.59
6 West_Asian 8.42
7 Eastern_Euro 7.71
8 Red_Sea 2.27
9 South_Asian 0.77
10 Sub-Saharan 0.26
11 Oceanian 0.12

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 North_Italian 6.25
2 Tuscan 9.1
3 Spanish_Andalucia 10.11
4 Spanish_Extremadura 10.65
5 Spanish_Valencia 10.86
6 Spanish_Murcia 10.95
7 Spanish_Cataluna 10.97
8 Portuguese 11.07
9 Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon 11.35
10 Bulgarian 11.37
11 Romanian 11.72
12 Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha 11.98
13 Spanish_Galicia 12.12
14 Serbian 12.18
15 Greek 12.76
16 Southwest_French 13.32
17 Spanish_Cantabria 13.36
18 Spanish_Aragon 13.77
19 Greek_Thessaly 14.09
20 Italian_Abruzzo 14.32

1 53.1% Spanish_Andalucia + 46.9% Bulgarian @ 2.37

No French or Austrian in top 20. Close to the Bergamo average as one would expect, as Bergamo lies in the heart of Northern Italy. It's safe to presume Venetians and Friulians from the edges of their respective regions who deviate towards Austria/Croatia do so because of ancestry from such areas

That guy was one of 3 pure non-Cimbrian North-Easterners from the Alpine project (which I made 2 threads about). The other 2 were the ones I posted. This guy still shifts towards Bulgarians and Romanians compared to Lombards though, so my point still stands about genetic heterogeneity in Northern Italy. The other 2 samples were not from peripheral areas either, one was from lowland Udine and the other was from Treviso like this guy.

Here they are plotted: 78754

[Lauχum]

Threads I made:

https://anthrogenica.com/showthread.php?14645-North-East-Italian-GEDmatch-results

https://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?252083-Veneto-Friuli-Venezia-Giulia-GEDmatch-results-(Including-a-German-speaker-from-the-Sette-Comuni)

[Lauχum]

Now I find it funny how you are accusing people of agendas and cherrypicking. Yet the guy who made that PCA obviously wasn't afraid to plot those 3 Lombard like Venetians and I wasn't afraid to show that less north shifted but Balkan shifted Venetian from Vincenza in my threads. However, you cherrypick this one guy without actually looking into his genetic structure to try and prove that Bergamo is 10/10 representative of every region in Northern Italy.

[Aren]

Now I find it funny how you are accusing people of agendas and cherrypicking. Yet the guy who made that PCA obviously wasn't afraid to plot those 3 Lombard like Venetians and I wasn't afraid to show that less north shifted but Balkan shifted Venetian from Vincenza in my threads. However, you cherrypick this one guy without actually looking into his genetic structure to try and prove that Bergamo is 10/10 representative of every region in Northern Italy.

Nah, some other guy posted the Lombard shifted Venetians, whilst the North Italian guy only posted the Northern shifted ones.

I didn't cherry pick, I said there are also Venetians who are not particularly Northern shifted in comparison with the Bergamo average after you posted "I claimed they are north-shifted towards Austrians relative to Lombards, and most samples I have seen from the TriVeneto area show this". And then I posted that guy as an example. There are probably many others.
But like I said, I don't trust single kits who are brought forward on forums like these. I'd rather make a conclusion based on an academic averages.

[Lauχum]

Nah, some other guy posted the Lombard shifted Venetians, whilst the North Italian guy(maybe you?) only posted the Northern shifted ones.

I didn't cherry pick, I said there are also Venetians who are not particularly Northern shifted in comparison with the Bergamo average after you posted "I claimed they are north-shifted towards Austrians relative to Lombards, and most samples I have seen from the TriVeneto area show this". And then I posted that guy as an example. There are probably many others.
But like I said, I don't trust single kits who are brought forward on forums like these. I'd rather make a conclusion based on an academic averages.

It wasn't me. The only kits I have are the 4 from the Alpine project, but nice sly attempt to accuse me of being biased/OND'd.

[Lauχum]

Though you seem to know quite a lot about this PCA and the thread in which these results were posted. Could I have a link to the thread and to the datasheet/full image of the plot?

[Aren]

Though you seem to know quite a lot about this PCA and the thread in which these results were posted. Could I have a link to the thread and to the datasheet/full image of the plot?

https://anthrogenica.com/showthread.php?14675-Eurogenes-EUtest-V2-K15-samples-for-megaplot

https://www.dropbox.com/s/z0afw85ftwhhgw4/k15Iter3.jpg?dl=0

You're welcome

[Lauχum]

https://anthrogenica.com/showthread.php?14675-Eurogenes-EUtest-V2-K15-samples-for-megaplot

https://www.dropbox.com/s/z0afw85ftwhhgw4/k15Iter3.jpg?dl=0

You're welcome

Thankyou, though this is different to the one Token posted. But I found the K13 thread as well.

[Aren]

Thankyou, though this is different to the one Token posted. But I found the K13 thread as well.

This was the last plot with the most samples added.

[donriccardo]

Just to add about my Lombard mixed results...my paternal great grandmother carried a family name (very popular in Sicily) which is reported as typical "Venetian" during the Middle Ages. I tried to look in GedMatch for people with the same family name from Venice and I have match with them. I also noticed that with most of calculators in Gedmatch I score "Bergamo" as well.

[Tauromachos]

Either way donriccardo it looks to me like you're somewhere between 75-80% indigenous "Sicilian" (with all that comes with it -- ancient Mycenaean, Levantine, Sicanian, etc. admixture) and 20-25% Northern Italian from the Lombard settlements.

He is certainly more native Sicilian than you are and plots South of you in a PCA