Classiffy/place Serbian girl

[Pribislav]

Her origin is from Kopaonik. In the middle age Saxon miners were present in Kopaonik. Maybe she has some Saxon blood https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kopaonik

https://scontent-sea1-1.cdninstagram.com/vp/2ebb423eb77b422cfb1bcb8cf3abe208/5BF75607/t51.2885-15/e35/37182729_222183475157592_3964961628385968128_n.jpg ?ig_cache_key=MTgzNjU0OTcyMjE1ODI4OQ%3D%3D.2
https://scontent-sea1-1.cdninstagram.com/vp/ce562c939fc0ce47e6170fca02b5a3ce/5C1136BE/t51.2885-15/e35/25036029_1760163044058405_7798044361802907648_n.jp g?ig_cache_key=MTY4MjE4NTA5OTM4MTMzNzQxOQ%3D%3D.2
https://scontent-sea1-1.cdninstagram.com/vp/7b22bc92d27ad9052a1f178521c276a9/5C0DD492/t51.2885-15/e35/32212467_253202965253602_3551752011772854272_n.jpg ?ig_cache_key=MTc4MzUyMTA4MjAzMzUzNDYxMA%3D%3D.2

[Crazy W.]

Atlantid + Borreby

[CommonSense]

Nordid. This look is extremely rare.

[Catarinense1998]

Only I noticed a alpines influences?

[Pribislav]

bump

[Kivan]

Subnordid.

[Pribislav]

Subnordid.

I agree.

[Vlatko Vukovic]

Subnordid. Very interesting example. This is uncommon for the Southern Slavs in general.

[Dick]

This is a rural look. Villagers kept Middle Ages phenotypes unlike city dwellers

[Ylla]

Subnordid/baltid.

[Vlatko Vukovic]

This is a rural look. Villagers kept Middle Ages phenotypes unlike city dwellers

She is hot as fuck. rural or not.

But i agree that rural people preserved Middle ages phenotypes. My father is rural man, Baltid as hell! Mother is typical Mediterraen from city. :D

[Dick]

She is hot as fuck. rural or not.

But i agree that rural people preserved Middle ages phenotypes. My father is rural man, Baltid as hell! Mother is typical Mediterraen from city. :D
When I was in Serbia I visited one village where most looked Germanic and freckled let alone Slavic. Went to another village half hour away and they all looked dark. Even some people said the village is gypsy as a joke but it’s not.

[Jana]

Dutch, English, Scottish, Irish or northwestern German.

Subnordid or even Brunn mixed with nordic.

[Pribislav]

Subnordid. Very interesting example. This is uncommon for the Southern Slavs in general.

Saxon miners lived in Kopaonik in the middle age. They were also present in Rudnik (Šumadija), Novo Brdo (Kosovo), Brskovo (Montenegro), Rogozna (Raška), Azbukovica (western Serbia), Osogovo, Kratovo (eastern Macedonia), in Bosnia around Srebrenica and Olovo and in central Bosnia (Kreševo, Fojnica).

Macedonian footballer Martin Bogatinov is from Kratovo, and he has Germanic look https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martin_Bogatinov
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kratovo,_Macedonia#History

I nocited higher presence of red hair in areas of Balkans where Saxon miners lived in the middle age.
Few Serbian families from area around Kopaonik and from Kosovo are I2-M223 and R1b-U106. They are descendants of Saxon miners by male line without doubt.
One Serbian family from Župa (near Kopaonik) which carry I2-M223 match with few German families about 800 years in the past.

[Dick]

Saxon miners lived in Kopaonik in the middle age. They were also present in Rudnik (Šumadija), Novo Brdo (Kosovo), Brskovo (Montenegro), Rogozna (Raška), Azbukovica (western Serbia), Osogovo, Kratovo (eastern Macedonia), in Bosnia around Srebrenica and Olovo and in central Bosnia (Kreševo, Fojnica).

Macedonian footballer Martin Bogatinov is from Kratovo, and he has Germanic look https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martin_Bogatinov
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kratovo,_Macedonia#History

I nocited higher presence of red hair in areas of Balkans where Saxon miners lived in the middle age.
Few Serbian families from area around Kopaonik and from Kosovo are I2-M223 and R1b-U106. They are descendants of Saxon miners by male line without doubt.
One Serbian family from Župa (near Kopaonik) which carry I2-M223 match with few German families about 800 years in the past.

I read that the ottomans killed most of them in novo brdo, they called it neuberg I think, and took the women and children as slaves

[CommonSense]

I read that the ottomans killed most of them in novo brdo, they called it neuberg I think, and took the women and children as slaves

Obviously their descendants still live on as evidenced by the y-dna results.

[Sally the first]

a very interesting unusual Slav however I strongly see some proto Nordid influence

[Dick]

Obviously their descendants still live on as evidenced by the y-dna results.

I’m talking about the town novo brdo. The ransacked it because it was a rich Mining town

[Mingle]

Looks British to me.

[Pribislav]

I read that the ottomans killed most of them in novo brdo, they called it neuberg I think, and took the women and children as slaves

Somebody survived in Novo Brdo for sure.
Serbian family Stanković from Ranilug near Kosovska Kamenica is R1b-U106 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ranilug
Ranilug is located 30 km southeastern from Novo Brdo.
Many Saxon comunities survived in early Ottoman period because they needed to Ottomans to be miners for them. Saxons from Brskovo in Montenegro moved from Brskovo in year 1438. Saxon cumunities in Kopaonik and eastern Macedonia were mentioned in 16th and 17th century, they were probably Catholics until mid of late 17th century and than they converted to Orthodoxy is lost their identity.
Part of Saxons in central Bosnia probably converted to Islam, and some stayes Catholics and became Croatians later.

[Dick]

Somebody survived in Novo Brdo for sure.
Serbian family Stanković from Ranilug near Kosovska Kamenica is R1b-U106 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ranilug
Ranilug is located 30 km southeastern from Novo Brdo.
Many Saxon comunities survived in early Ottoman period because they needed to Ottomans to be miners for them. Saxons from Brskovo in Montenegro moved from Brskovo in year 1438. Saxon cumunities in Kopaonik and eastern Macedonia were mentioned in 16th and 17th century, they were probably Catholics until mid of late 17th century and than they converted to Orthodoxy is lost their identity.
Part of Saxons in central Bosnia probably converted to Islam, and some stayes Catholics and became Croatians later.

Well ya they probably lived in surrounding villages too. I wonder what their total population was before being assimilated

[Pribislav]

Well ya they probably lived in surrounding villages too. I wonder what their total population was before being assimilated

They lived around mining centers. In medieval charters of Serbian rulers from second half of 13th to 15th century Saxon miners were always mentioned. They were some kind of miner caste with special privileges, similar as vlachs/Vlachs (both Slavic vlachs and vulgar latin speaking ones) were sheperd caste with own duties and rights.
Number of Saxon probably we'll never find out.
Saxon miners arrived to Serbia in mid of 13th century https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saxons_in_medieval_Serbia

Bro, you might have Saxon origin by direct male line.
Until now is confirmed that I2-M223 and R1b-U106 among Serbs are from Saxon miners. But they also probably brought some branch of I1, maybe your branch. Z63 and P109 among Serbs have nothing to do with Saxon miners, first one is from Goths and second one is from Normans, but your branch realy might be from Saxon miners.

[Nurzat]

doesn't strike me as Northern Euro looking. mostly an Alpino-Dinarid with light eyes. I am surprised Serbs say it is a rare look there. she looks Balkan Slav and can also pass as Romanian and I think as Bulgarian as well

[CommonSense]

doesn't strike me as Northern Euro looking. mostly an Alpino-Dinarid with light eyes. I am surprised Serbs say it is a rare look there. she looks Balkan Slav and can also pass as Romanian and I think as Bulgarian as well

I pesonally don't know anyone who looks like that and I rarely see such women around town. Even in Bosnia this look is very atypical according to Vlatko.

[Pribislav]

doesn't strike me as Northern Euro looking. mostly an Alpino-Dinarid with light eyes. I am surprised Serbs say it is a rare look there. she looks Balkan Slav and can also pass as Romanian and I think as Bulgarian as well

Her facial feature is not common among south Slavs. Also he gives me German or west Slavic vibe.
Light pigmented south Slavic women have ussualy different features than this girl.

[Moje ime]

Subnordid Baltid.

Idk she doesn't look that unusual to me. Her face shape looks common.

[Nurzat]

I pesonally don't know anyone who looks like that and I rarely see such women around town. Even in Bosnia this look is very atypical according to Vlatko.

this is my university class, some ten years ago, excuse the clothes. would some pass in ex-Yugoslavia? it's in northeast Romania (Moldova region) and all students are from the region. names removed. a very young me at number one (ten years ago)

https://image.ibb.co/mD5x2Q/021b.jpg

[CommonSense]

this is my university class, some ten years ago, excuse the clothes. would some pass in ex-Yugoslavia? it's in northeast Romania (Moldova region) and all students are from the region. names removed. a very young me at number one (ten years ago)

https://image.ibb.co/mD5x2Q/021b.jpg

They could pass, but only as atypical

[Pribislav]

this is my university class, some ten years ago, excuse the clothes. would some pass in ex-Yugoslavia? it's in northeast Romania (Moldova region) and all students are from the region. names removed. a very young me at number one (ten years ago)

https://image.ibb.co/mD5x2Q/021b.jpg

Mostly Baltids and North Pontids.

I think same as CommonSense.

[Moje ime]

this is my university class, some ten years ago, excuse the clothes. would some pass in ex-Yugoslavia? it's in northeast Romania (Moldova region) and all students are from the region. names removed. a very young me at number one

They as a group look more east Slavic than Serbs. I see lot of Baltids but individualy many can pass.

[Blinddignity]

Could pass as your average British female urbanite.

Atlantid + Subnordid

[Nurzat]

They as a group look more east Slavic than Serbs. I see lot of Baltids but individualy many can pass.

genetically Romanians in Moldova region are very similar to Bosnians, Croats and even Hungarians. a guy in that photo (#20) clusters with Bulgarians (he tested with me back in 2011). ok, sorry for the offtopic

[Pribislav]

genetically Romanians in Moldova region are very similar to Bosnians, Croats and even Hungarians. a guy in that photo (#20) clusters with Bulgarians (he tested with me back in 2011). ok, sorry for the offtopic

Moldovans are similar as Bosnians at K12b, but they shifted more eastern than Bosnians and that can be seen on the other autosomal calculators.

At k12b Romanians have similar values as Montenegrins on average. On the other calculators Romanians shifted more eastern than Montenegrins.

[Moje ime]

genetically Romanians in Moldova region are very similar to Bosnians, Croats and even Hungarians. a guy in that photo (#20) clusters with Bulgarians (he tested with me back in 2011). ok, sorry for the offtopic

Many Serbs including me get north Romania as high match, don't know which calculator exactly it was. But your photo people lack dinarid features, that is main difference of Serbs.

[Nurzat]

Many Serbs including me get north Romania as high match, don't know which calculator exactly it was. But your photo people lack dinarid features, that is main difference of Serbs.

yes, Moldova region is very low on Dinarid, but southwest Romania (Banat) and in general the Carpathian Mountains, up to northern Romania, are very Dinarid-influenced, although you will mostly find it mixed with Alpinid and Pontid, so people may still look a bit different as a group. mountain people in Romania have a smaller percentage of light eyes and hair than the steppe/plain people. Carpathians are a natural barrier for Dinarid I think. in Moldova region you see the inflow from the Ukrainian steppe more than elsewhere in the Balkans. southern Romanians aren't much Dinarid either, they are very Pontic and are identical to Bulgarians genetically and in phenotypes (although there are Romanians that cluster with Bulgarians up to Moldova, like my friend at #20, who is a blue-eyed brunet)

[Dick]

Bro, you might have Saxon origin by direct male line.
Until now is confirmed that I2-M223 and R1b-U106 among Serbs are from Saxon miners. But they also probably brought some branch of I1, maybe your branch. Z63 and P109 among Serbs have nothing to do with Saxon miners, first one is from Goths and second one is from Normans, but your branch realy might be from Saxon miners.




No. It's the other way around. Saxons descend from Serbs

[CommonSense]

No. It's the other way around. Saxons descend from Serbs


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U0ZuQaKWaKQ

[Dick]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U0ZuQaKWaKQ

He is correct. my paternal line is living proof. those Saxons are downstream from me. I am their "father"


https://i.imgur.com/okh30F3.jpg

[Pribislav]

No. It's the other way around. Saxons descend from Serbs

I heard theory than Saxon miners which arrived to Serbia in 13th century were mostly Sorbs/Serby, and they understand Serbian language very well.
Might be that some Sorbs were among Saxon miners. Lusatia homeland of Sorbs occupied part of Saxony. In 13th century a lot of Sorbs were already germanized.

[Dick]

I heard theory than Saxon miners which arrived to Serbia in 13th century were mostly Sorbs/Serby, and they understand Serbian language very well.
Might be that some Sorbs were among Saxon miners. Lusatia homeland of Sorbs occupied part of Saxony. In 13th century a lot of Sorbs were already germanized.

Half of Germany is germanized.

Plus I have no matches from east europe or ex-yugoslavia. i should have some matches even from Romania/transylvania if its from Saxons but i dont

[Pribislav]

Half of Germany is germanized.

True. :thumb001:

If Saxon miners were partly of Sorbian/Slavic origin that they probably brought some R1a-M458 and I2-CTS10228 (not only I2-M233, I1 and R1b-U106).
There is some indication that some I2-CTS10228 among Serbs is from Saxon miners, and in this case that Saxons wit I2-CTS10228 were just germanized Sorbs or some other Slavic people from present days eastern Germany.

[Nurzat]

Half of Germany is germanized.

Plus I have no matches from east europe or ex-yugoslavia. i should have some matches even from Romania/transylvania if its from Saxons but i dont

haplogroups don't say anything about the actual composition of one's DNA. for example you've got 4 male great-grandparents, you've got about 12.5% genes from each of them and you've got the haplogroup of only one of them. you are equally descended from all the 4, and you don't know what haplogroups were the other ones. so if in one's region let's say I2 is most common, it's most likely he has most male ancestors I2, even though he is a J1 let's say. so haplogroups are not that relevant for the individual but for the population genetic history only.

one ancestor in 1850, say 6 generations ago, means 1.5% of the DNA of one of his direct descendants today

[Dick]

True. :thumb001:

If Saxon miners were partly of Sorbian/Slavic origin that they probably brought some R1a-M458 and I2-CTS10228 (not only I2-M233, I1 and R1b-U106).
There is some indication that some I2-CTS10228 among Serbs is from Saxon miners, and in this case that Saxons wit I2-CTS10228 were just germanized Sorbs or some other Slavic people from present days eastern Germany.

Even J and G and E as well

[Dick]

haplogroups don't say anything about the actual composition of one's DNA. for example you've got 4 male great-grandparents, you've got about 12.5% genes from each of them and you've got the haplogroup of only one of them. you are equally descended from all the 4, and you don't know what haplogroups were the other ones. so if in one's region let's say I2 is most common, it's most likely he has most male ancestors I2, even though he is a J1 let's say. so haplogroups are not that relevant for the individual but for the population genetic history only

I didnt say that it did. Arent you some J?

[StonyArabia]

Looks German or British