Is Alpine a Germanic or a Celtic phenotype?

[Joso]

Alpine=Germanic or Celtic? Maybe the two? Or neither?

[Regnera]

Neither

[Papastratosels26]

Celtic

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[Jana]

Common among Celtic admixed people (French, Swiss, Southern Germans, Austrians, Czechs...) and almost absent among pure Germanic areas (southern Scandinavia, northern Netherlands & northwestern Germany).
However it is most likely not original Celtic phenotype as central Europeans have substantial neolithic/med non IE ancestry. Proto-Celts were probably nordics in great numbers.
Insular Celts with more steppe IE ancestry compared to continental European Celtic admixed people have significantly less alpinids and it should tell you something. It's a mixed phenotype.

[cyberlorian]

I think it will be very confusing to relate phenotypes with ethno-cultural groups such as Germanic, Celtic, Iranic, Semitic, Turkic, Hispanic and etc.

Alpinids are cohabitants of Dinarids and both types are not so uncommon among Central Europeans and Southern Europeans. They also extend towards West Asian populations such as Turks, Caucasians, Northern Levatines, Western Levantines and Northern Iranians.

[Blondie]

Alpine is ancient r1b (germanic, italian, celtic) subrace.

[Joso]

Alpine is ancient r1b (germanic, italian, celtic) subrace.

So the both?

[Joso]

Common among Celtic admixed people (French, Swiss, Southern Germans, Austrians, Czechs...) and almost absent among pure Germanic areas (southern Scandinavia, northern Netherlands & northwestern Germany).
However it is most likely not original Celtic phenotype as central Europeans have substantial neolithic/med non IE ancestry. Proto-Celts were probably nordics in great numbers.
Insular Celts with more steppe IE ancestry compared to continental European Celtic admixed people have significantly less alpinids and it should tell you something. It's a mixed phenotype.

By "mixed" do you mean modern mix or ancient mix?

[Veslan]

Neither. Alpine race predates both "Germanics" and "Celts".

[Jana]

By "mixed" do you mean modern mix or ancient mix?

Ancient mix of steppe and neolithic ancestry.

[Tauromachos]

Can appear among both groups

[Visage pâle]

Neither, there are even many Alpine in Turkey according to Coon.

[Joso]

Ancient mix of steppe and neolithic ancestry.

What Steppe and Neolithic means in terms of phenotypes? I don't want to bother you which these questions, i still don't know much about these genetics things but at the final of the next ear, i promise i will know a lot( i wish, at least xD )

[Joso]

bump

[Andromega123]

Neither, there are even many Alpine in Turkey according to Coon.

Actually, there were Galatians (Celts) before in Anatolia but we can't explain their population in India etc for sure.

[Proto-Shaman]

Turkic

[Ülev]

Turkic

+1

[Joso]

Turkic

It can be too, is not the "Alföldi" type a mix of alpine+turanid?

[Joso]

Turkic


It can be too, is not the "Alföldi" type a mix of alpine+turanid?

http://i50.tinypic.com/2q3vmsm.png

[Proto-Shaman]

Alpine race in Europe
https://i.imgur.com/aCOzSRY.jpg

[Joso]

Alpine race in Europe
https://i.imgur.com/aCOzSRY.jpg

I cannot understand this map, he seens incomplete

[Joso]

Alpine race in Europe
https://i.imgur.com/aCOzSRY.jpg

The darker regions in the map are where there are more brachycephalics?

[Proto-Shaman]

I cannot understand this map, he seens incomplete
You don't need the complete map. This is enough.

[Joso]

You don't need the complete map. This is enough.

So the darker regions are brachycephalic and Turkic or Turkic related, according to the map?

[Silver Lining]

Ancient Germanics weren't Alpine, Celts had some. Today Germany has a lot and the so-called Celtic nations don't.

That's the story.

But keep in mind that Alpines were a minor thing two thousand years ago, not even remotely as common as today.

[Joso]

Ancient Germanics weren't Alpine, Celts had some. Today Germany has a lot and the so-called Celtic nations don't.

That's the story.

But keep in mind that Alpines were a minor thing two thousand years ago, not even remotely as common as today.

True Celtic places like France, Northern Italy, southern Germany, Austria and Switzerland have a lot of alpines. And in the past there were a lot of alpines, of course, specially among Gauls probably

[Smeagol]

Neither. It's a pre-Aryan type.

[Silver Lining]

True Celtic places like France, Northern Italy, southern Germany, Austria and Switzerland have a lot of alpines. And in the past there were a lot of alpines, of course, specially among Gauls probably

Those aren't cultural and linguistical Celtic places anymore. And no, Alpines are relatively new.

[Joso]

Those aren't cultural and linguistical Celtic places anymore. And no, Alpines are relatively new.

Why can u not accept alpines as your niggas? Do you think alpines are too ugly to deserve respect? I don't think they are new also

[Mr. Anybody]

http://i50.tinypic.com/2q3vmsm.png

He looks like a moustached baby :D My favourite is alpine. Alpine women are so cute.

[Rieder]

Mass brachyocephalicism in central Europe is only relatively recent.

Lappanoid brachyocephalicism is for example much older.

The alpine type is neither associated with Central European Celts, nor Germanics.

It can not be easily traced to migrations and does not appear to be spread that way.

[Joso]

Mass brachyocephalicism in central Europe is only relatively recent.

Lappanoid brachyocephalicism is for example much older.

The alpine type is neither associated with Central European Celts, nor Germanics.

It can not be easily traced to migrations and does not appear to be spread that way.

As far as i know, these are just theories. But thanks for the help anyways

[Freeroostah]

Alpine expansion in Europe has an identical pattern with G and E-V13 haplogroups (check the distributions maps) so IMO it was the main Neolithic phenotype of Central Europe (coming from Anatolia.)
Pelasgians who also belonged to these haplogroups were probably Alpine too.
It is said that Celtic people were predominant Alpine (pre-indoeuropeans) with a Nordic warrior and noble class (Indoeuropean newcomers)
Later on the same Alpine people became Germanized and up to this day they occupy South Germany, Switzerland, parts of Austria, and Burgundy (East France)

[Joso]

Alpine expansion in Europe has an identical pattern with G and E-V13 haplogroups (check the distributions maps) so IMO it was the main Neolithic phenotype of Central Europe (coming from Anatolia.)
Pelasgians who also belonged to these haplogroups were probably Alpine too.
It is said that Celtic people were predominant Alpine (pre-indoeuropeans) with a Nordic warrior and noble class (Indoeuropean newcomers)
Later on the same Alpine people became Germanized and up to this day they occupy South Germany, Switzerland, parts of Austria, and Burgundy (East France)

So the both? Or neither?

[Freeroostah]

So the both? Or neither?

I voted both

[Joso]

I voted both

Ok

[Iloko]

More Germanic/Eastern-Euro due to that genetic and phenotypic shift towards Mongoloids I suppose

[Latinus]

Both. Why? Because it's present in both populations.

[Silver Lining]

Why can u not accept alpines as your niggas? Do you think alpines are too ugly to deserve respect? I don't think they are new also

The Alpine trait combination wasn't widespread until 1000 years ago. That's a fact.

[Joso]

The Alpine trait combination wasn't widespread until 1000 years ago. That's a fact.

why

[Silver Lining]

why

???

Because it wasn't.

[Joso]

???

Because it wasn't.

But why it wasn't?

[Joso]

bump

[Joso]

bump

[Knight Slayer]

Neither. It's Mediterranean.

[Joso]

Neither. It's Mediterranean.

How?

[Knight Slayer]

How?

A made a post about it ages ago, it was one of my comprehensive replies where I gave some insight into the Alpine type and the theories of it's development. But basically I view it to be a Reduced Cro-Magnon type mixed with Mediterranean. There were theories that it came from Central Asia as well. Then some say that it's a brachycephalized Mediterranean, just like the Dinaric, to an extent, that's true as well.

[guezet]

Both.