Classify Dutch Duo

[♥ Lily ♥]

Raymond Slijngaard (also a former chef)
https://img.discogs.com/6odm0yL-jEax1wIh7lcbYfAB3rA=/368x547/smart/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():qualit y(90)/discogs-images/A-493426-1190397762.jpeg.jpg
https://rayslijngaard.com/wp-content/uploads/ray-g-800x800.jpg
https://media.nu.nl/m/mezxa93a5mxt_wd640.jpeg
https://www.telegraaf.nl/images/535x301/filters:format(jpeg):quality(50)/cdn-kiosk-api.telegraaf.nl/6ebe2e10-9412-11e7-9bf0-d13f341939fb.png

Anita Doth
http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5161/5261344638_436e07c900.jpg
https://lastfm-img2.akamaized.net/i/u/770x0/8756e6062a314efda76b5df6a1d50fa0.jpg
https://lastfm-img2.akamaized.net/i/u/ar0/3e00b2b8cd8f4c3c875fb8e4b35c7efd.jpg


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RkEXGgdqMz8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_UBnhK7pdIE

[The Lawspeaker]

"Dutch ?" The group may have originated in Amsterdam but they are both from Suriname.

[♥ Lily ♥]

"Dutch ?" The group may have originated in Amsterdam but they are both from Suriname.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anita_Doth

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ray_Slijngaard

[Ülev]

Doth is de dochter van een Surinaamse vader en een Nederlandse moeder.
Slijngaard heeft een Nederlandse moeder en een Surinaamse vader.
https://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anita_Doth
https://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ray_Slijngaard

[The Lawspeaker]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anita_Doth

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ray_Slijngaard

In both cases, they have foreign fathers and they never shown any affiliation with the Dutch themselves. They aren't Dutch.

[Joso]

The woman is very hot, i would say sudanid+CM for the both

[♥ Lily ♥]

In both cases, they have foreign fathers and they never shown any affiliation with the Dutch themselves. They aren't Dutch.

I was referring to their official nationalities (the country of a person's birth, where they're culturally raised, educated, language they speak, where they live and hold citizenship) rather than their mixed racial heritage.


Raymond Slijngaard (born 28 June 1971) is a Dutch rapper and musician best known as the front person of the duo 2 Unlimited.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ray_Slijngaard


Anita Doth (born 28 December 1971) is a Dutch singer and songwriter best known as the front person of the duo 2 Unlimited, along with rapper Ray Slijngaard.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anita_Doth


Would a person be an Australian, Canadian, Brazilian, or American citizen if they were born, culturally raised, live and hold official citizenship on their passport in of one of those nations... if one of their ancestors had a different nationality?

[Norb]

I was referring to their official nationalities (the country of a person's birth, where they're culturally raised, educated, live, and hold citizenship) rather than their mixed racial heritage.





Would a person be an Australian, Canadian, Brazilian, or American citizen if they were born, culturally raised, live and hold official citizenship on their passport in of one of those nations... if one of their ancestors had a different nationality?

it depends on the individual answering the question

[The Lawspeaker]

I was referring to their official nationalities (the country of a person's birth, where they're culturally raised, educated, language they speak, where they live and hold citizenship) rather than their mixed racial heritage.





Would a person be an Australian, Canadian, Brazilian, or American citizen if they were born, culturally raised, live and hold official citizenship on their passport in of one of those nations... if one of their ancestors had a different nationality?

Even the Dutch census would count them as "allochtonen" (foreigners) and no Dutchmen (except for the hardcore lefties) would consider them members of the Dutch ethnic group. A passport is a passport.

[Norb]

Even the Dutch census would count them as "allochtonen" (foreigners) and no Dutchmen (except for the hardcore lefties) would consider them members of the Dutch ethnic group. A passport is a passport.

how do Dutch people see Clarence Seedorf?

[♥ Lily ♥]

Even the Dutch census would count them as "allochtonen" (foreigners) and no Dutchmen (except for the hardcore lefties) would consider them members of the Dutch ethnic group. A passport is a passport.

You didn't answer my question.

[The Lawspeaker]

how do Dutch people see Clarence Seedorf?

Not Dutch.

[The Lawspeaker]

You didn't answer my question.

I don't care how Anglo's see it. A foreigner is a foreigner. Here is one more example of the cultural difference that separates both sides of the North Sea. If you have a foreign father and have shown no affiliation whatsoever with the Dutch, you will always be a foreigner. Not just officially (allochtoon) but also in the eyes of the many. These people aren't Dutch. They just hold the passport.

[♥ Lily ♥]

I don't care how Anglo's see it. A foreigner is a foreigner. Here is one more example of the cultural difference that separates both sides of the North Sea.

So any American citizen who is born and culturally raised and has lived and worked all their life in America, but who doesn't have 100% Native American ancestry, isn't an American citizen - but is a foreigner in America according to the Dutch?

[The Lawspeaker]

So any American citizen who doesn't have 100% Native American ancestry isn't an American citizen - but a foreigner according to the Dutch?

America is America. I don't care about America but I do care about people calling obvious foreigners Dutch. These people aren't Dutch. They are both considered, under law even, second generation niet-Westerse allochtoon. They just hold the passport because their father was a Dutch passport holder (as under the pre-1985 nationality law) as Suriname was a part of the legal part Kingdom from 1954 to 1975 (and thus Surinamese became, by law, Dutch citizens) and a lot of those Surinamese used their Dutch passport to quickly move to the Netherlands after, hypocritically, voting in favour of Surinamese independence in 1975.

That is the only reason why these two hold a Dutch passport at all as their mothers slept had with foreigners.

[The Lawspeaker]

In other words: these people were born (both were born in 1971) before the change to the current nationality law (in 1985) to a non-Dutch father who just held a Dutch passport because of a legal technicality dating back to 1954. So, exactly makes them Dutch ?

[♥ Lily ♥]

America is America. I don't care about America but I do care about people calling obvious foreigners Dutch. These people aren't Dutch. They are both considered, under law even, second generation non-Western allochtoon. They just hold the passport because their father was a Dutch passport holder (as under the pre-1985 nationality law) as Suriname was a part of the legal part Kingdom from 1954 to 1975 and a lot of those Surinamese used their Dutch passport to quickly move to the Netherlands after, hypocritically, voting in favour of Surinamese independence.

That is the only reason why these two hold a Dutch passport at all as their mothers slept had wth foreigners.

What about all the people who are born and culturally raised in the same nation as their father, but their mother was born in a different nation before moving and settling in another country?

You said your fiancée is Asian, so if you have a child together who is born and culturally raised in the land of The Netherlands, is taught to speak and understand fluent Dutch like a native, relates to the Dutch foods and culture, etc... what official nationality and legal citizenship would your child have (?) if that child has never visited Asia, doesn't relate to the Asian culture, can't speak Asian languages, etc. I'm not referring to their racial ancestry or whichever piece of land one of their parents once lived, but to the child's native language, accent, citizenship, and cultural upbringing.

[The Lawspeaker]

What about all the people who are born and culturally raised in the same nation as their father, but their mother was born in a different nation before moving and settling in another country?

You said your fiancée is Asian, so if you have a child together who is born and culturally raised in The Netherlands, is taught to speak and understand fluent Dutch, etc... what official nationality and citizenship would your child have (?) if that child has never visited Asia, doesn't relate to the Asian culture, can't speak Asian languages, etc.

1. They will be considered foreign there and I don't blame them.

2. I am Dutch. That means that the child will be Dutch as seen through the old nationality law. Paternal line is what counts. This is why married women adopt their husband's name and why children and unmarried women have their father's name. That's why it is such a big step for people to change their last name (as it is nothing but a complete repudiation of a father who did fulfill his actual function) or why illegitimate children only have their mother's last names and were often not counted as part of the family.

[Prinses]

Not to be mean or anything but in the netherlands they would be called indeed ‘allochtonen’ aka foreigners. The fact that they could be born in the netherlands doesn’t make them dutch. They’re only dutch as in citizenship.

[♥ Lily ♥]

They’re only dutch as in citizenship.

I was referring to their official nationality and citizenship.

[The Lawspeaker]

I still think that the 1985 change in the act was a huge mistake: it allows for women to make mistakes without having to pay the price for it (since now any child born from a Dutch mother becomes a citizen, it means that she will get welfare stipends for it): sleeping around and conceiving out of wedlock now no longer carries a legal sanction and is thus rewarded.

[The Lawspeaker]

I was referring to their official nationality and citizenship.

Then you would consider every Paki to be a real Englishman because he has an English passport ? I don't know many Dutch that would consider Surinamese, Turks or Moroccans to be Dutch. Passport or no passport. Even a third generation foreigner is still a foreigner to us.

[♥ Lily ♥]

I still think that the 1985 change in the act was a huge mistake: it allows for women to make mistakes without having to pay the price for it (since now any child born from a Dutch mother becomes a citizen, it means that she will get welfare stipends for it): sleeping around and conceiving out of wedlock now no longer carries a legal sanction and is thus rewarded.

Why is a female 'sleeping around' if she has a loving relationship with a man and they have a child together?! :icon_ask: What if the parents work hard? Given how many marriages end in divorce and that not everyone is religious or requires a piece of paper and a ring to prove their love, why should 'love children' such as Lily Rose Depp and Jack Depp (parents are French supermodel Vanessa Paradis and her long-time former boyfriend Johnny Depp) and Lila Grace Moss (mother is supermodel Kate Moss and her father is Kate's ex boyfriend who is a publicist,) etc, not be happier than children whose parents were married and divorced? I was happy when my parents divorced as my father was abusive.

[The Lawspeaker]

Why is a female 'sleeping around' if she has a loving relationship with a man and they have a child together?! :icon_ask: What if the parents work hard?

Actually: that's what those making the law had in mind but the number of illegitimate births has actually exploded since. Particularly of those young impressionable stupid girls who sleep with migrants and then conceive out of wedlock and have society foot the bill. There are hot spots in this country where this is a real issue: the main cities being one of them, Den Helder and Lelystad (a lot of Caribbeans and Moroccans there) another.

[♥ Lily ♥]

Actually: that's what those making the law had in mind but the number of illegitimate births has actually exploded since. Particularly of those young impressionable stupid girls who sleep with migrants and then conceive out of wedlock and have society foot the bill. There are hot spots in this country where this is a real issue: the main cities being one of them, Den Helder and Lelystad (a lot of Caribbeans and Moroccans there) another.

Some people may sit around all day online judging others, while the people they judge are working hard each day and paying taxes which fund the people sitting around and judging them. How do you not know if one or both of the parents are working and are paying for their child themselves? :icon_ask:

[The Lawspeaker]

Some people may sit around all day online judging others, while the people they judge are working hard each day and paying taxes which fund the people sitting around and judging them.

In other words: you defend such behaviour. I have no problem with you, Lily, but this is a glorious example of why female suffrage was such a bad idea: it undermined society in the long run (by voting for such "liberal ideas" and more "free money") and this is why we are where we are now (with our society in a state of collapse). It's these kind of policies that created the likes of Rotherham and Telford in your own country.

You should not tell foreigners (which is what we are to the English) who is a rightful citizen of their country and who is part of their ethnic group. Only we get to decide that for ourselves. A passport can be torn up, blood, tradition and ancestry cannot.

[♥ Lily ♥]

In other words: you defend such behaviour. I have no problem with you, Lily, but this is exemplary of why female suffrage was such a bad idea: it undermined society in the long run and this is where we are where we are now (with our society in a state of collapse). It's this kind of policies that created the likes of Rotherham and Telford as well.

You should not tell foreigners (which is what we are to the English) who is a rightful citizen of their country and who is part of their ethnic group. Only we get to decide that for ourselves. A passport can be torn up, blood, tradition and ancestry cannot.

I'm not defending people who are lazy and who don't bother to work. (I can't stand lazy people.) I'm simply asking why you're accusing all people with a biracial child of having parents who are not working? :dunno:

I drew an analogy by asking some questions which went unanswered... and I was referring to their official nationality/citizenship.

Given that these singers have earned a lot of money, I assume they've also paid a lot in tax contributions to The Netherlands too.

[The Lawspeaker]

I'm not defending people who are lazy and who don't bother to work. I'm simply asking why you're accusing all people with a biracial child of having parents who are not working? :dunno:

I am pointing out the problem as what can be seen in towns like Den Helder (have you ever been there ?) where there are a lot of women who just conceive out of wedlock with a Carribbean (mostly women from the lower classes), the guy disappears without a trace and the State (thus the taxpayer) gets to pick up the tab because the child, unfortunately, by law is Dutch - and this for a child .. which.. frankly.. isn't even Dutch. A situation that could not have existed if it wasn't for the 1985 nationality law and the 1954 Kingdom Charter which were written, by the Dutch Left who, funny enough, receives most votes from Dutch women in the cities (again: a problem that started in 1919). And I have shown this process with maps before and I am more than willing to show it again.

[♥ Lily ♥]

I am pointing out the problem as what can be seen in towns like Den Helder (have you ever been there ?) where there are a lot of women who just conceive out of wedlock with a Carribbean (mostly women from the lower classes), the guy disappears without a trace and the State (thus the taxpayer) gets to pick up the tab because the child, unfortunately, by law is Dutch - and this for a child .. which.. frankly.. isn't even Dutch. A situation that could not have existed if it wasn't for the 1985 nationality law and the 1954 Kingdom Charter which were written, by the Dutch Left who, funny enough, receives most votes from Dutch women in the cities (again: a problem that started in 1919). And I have shown this process with maps before and I am more than willing to show it again.

There are unfortunate circumstances where there's single mothers with absent fathers who have no contact with their child - (men of any nationality and of any race and social class for that matter.) In the UK, there's compulsory laws for the absent parent to pay child maintenance support towards their child. In other cases, there's single mothers who receive help from their relatives and who find work once their child is in school. There's also single fathers too. There's many different situations, such as cases where one parent has fallen very sick or who has suddenly died, or parents who are no longer living together and are no longer in a relationship, but who both support a child.

[The Lawspeaker]

There are unfortunate circumstances where there's single mothers with absent fathers who have no contact with their child - (men of any nationality and of any race and social class for that matter.) In the UK, there's compulsory laws for the absent parent to pay child maintenance support towards their child. In other cases, there's single mothers who receive help from their relatives and who find work once their child is in school. There's also single fathers too.

Here, we have the same laws - however: those are usually only applied to Dutch fathers after a divorce. Caribbeans have the tendency to hop from woman to woman (doing their thing and leaving again). Single fathers do exist but are rare as the courts usually award children to the mother. Here, most help for single mothers comes from the State. So, in a lot of cases, it's the State paying for non-Dutch children.

[♥ Lily ♥]

Here, we have the same laws - however: those are usually only applied to Dutch fathers after a divorce. Caribbeans have the tendency to hop from woman to woman (doing their thing and leaving again). Single fathers do exist but are rare as the courts usually award children to the mother. Here, most help for single mothers comes from the State. So, in a lot of cases, it's the State paying for non-Dutch children.

In the UK it doesn't matter if people were married or not... or if they're a male or a female... or if they're working or not... the absent parent is tracked down and made to pay child maintenance support for their child. (Unless there's a very unfortunate situation where one of the parents is deceased, or if the mother was a victim or rape and the rapist father is in jail, or one parent has left the country, or a situation where the father is not known.... e.g; the female wasn't in a relationship with the man but had a drunken one night stand with a stranger. :dunno:)

[The Lawspeaker]

In the UK it doesn't matter if people were married or not... or if they're a male or a female... or if they're working or not... the absent parent is tracked down and made to pay child maintenance support.

Here they don't really care much. A lot of Caribbeans here use fake names and fake phone numbers so they run - never to be found again.

[♥ Lily ♥]

Here they don't really care much. A lot of Caribbeans here use fake names and fake phone numbers so they run - never to be found again.

There used to be a poster called YeminiAntillean who had a white Dutch father and his mother was of black Caribbean (West Indie) descent... and I think he had some other ancestry too. He publicly said in a thread he made that his father was a bad person and that his mother and maternal relatives supported him.

[The Lawspeaker]

There used to be a poster called YeminiAntillean who had a white Dutch father and his mother was of black Caribbean (West Indie) descent... and I think he had some other ancestry too. He publicly said in a thread he made that his father was a bad person and that his mother and maternal relatives supported him.
Actually: his father wasn't Dutch (as he said later) but American. In either case: there is no reason why he should have a Dutch passport and why he should be allowed to live here. Plus: I doubt that his mother's relatives do any kind of supporting since they are the nation's biggest (or now second biggest - Morrocans !) welfare recipients (https://www.cbs.nl/nl-nl/achtergrond/2016/47/uitkeringen).

[♥ Lily ♥]

Actually: his father wasn't Dutch (as he said later) but American. In either case: there is no reason why he should have a Dutch passport and why he should be allowed to live here.

That's an issue for the Dutch authorities and the law makers to decide.

[The Lawspeaker]

That's an issue for the Dutch authorities to decide.

Wrong. As for the authorities only lend their ear to Leftist extremists while they should listen to the Dutch public. In fact - as the CBS figures I included in my other post showed, without them and their like-minded non-Dutch groups, we could scrap much of the welfare state. And.. much of our police force (https://www.cbs.nl/nl-nl/achtergrond/2016/47/criminaliteit).

[♥ Lily ♥]

Wrong. As for the authorities only lend their ear to Leftist extremists while they should listen to the Dutch public.

But it's the Dutch public who voted for their government.

[The Lawspeaker]

But it's the Dutch public who voted for their government.

Not really. It's the cities that vote for the government and the cities are 1) majority non-Dutch, 2) have a large surplus of both female and left-wing voters. We use a proportional representation system without electoral college.

[♥ Lily ♥]

Anyway, back on topic... I think they're both cool and beautiful people.

[♥ Lily ♥]

Not really. It's the cities that vote for the government and the cities are 1) majority non-Dutch, 2) have a large surplus of both female and left-wing voters.

People living in the countryside can't vote too?! How many men do you have living in The Netherlands?

Ethnic groups of The Netherlands (2017) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Netherlands

77.39% Dutch
9.88% Other Europeans
2.34% Turks
2.29% Moroccans
2.13% Indonesians
2.05% Surinamese
0.90% Dutch Caribbeans
0.23% Other Americans
2.80% Other

[The Lawspeaker]

Anyway, back on topic... I think they're both cool and beautiful people.

They sure are. Great musicians too (I listened to their music in my early 10s) but they aren't Dutch.

[The Lawspeaker]

People living in the countryside can't vote too?! How many men do you have living in The Netherlands?

Of course they can - but their vote doesn't count because of a PR voting system without an electoral college. You need 60.000 votes for a single seat in an area and most regions don't produce 60.000 votes. Most politicians also come from the main conurbation and thus the countryside (particularly the North-East and South aren't represented in any conceivable way). On top of that comes a coalition system which nullifies anything more conservative voices (and those representing local interests) would want to achieve.