IF Arabs are Semites, then aren't Iranians, pakistanis, Indians, and afghans, Indo-Europeans?

[Babak]

Or are Indo-european speaking near-easterners just OWD and are Semites instead?

[Astarte]

They are, linguistically.

[TheMaestro]

I think you don't know that term "Indo-European" is actually related to language and not race.

[Babak]

I think you don't know that term "Indo-European" is actually related to language and not race.

That's what I mean though. We always refer to Arabs as semites. Why dont we do the same for these Indo-European speaking countries?

[Kelmendasi]

They are Indo-Europeans

[Kamal900]

Arabs are Afro-Asiatics while Iranians are Indo-Europeans. It's not rocket science, bro.

[Mingle]

That's what I mean though. We always refer to Arabs as semites. Why dont we do the same for these Indo-European speaking countries?

That's because Semite is a smaller and more easily categorizable term compared to Indo-European. IE is a very broad term that includes a lot more diversity.

It would make more sense to compare Indo-European to Afro-Asiatic and to compare Semitic to Iranic/Slavic/Celtic/etc.

[Tauromachos]

That's because Semite is a smaller and more easily categorizable term compared to Indo-European. IE is a very broad term that includes a lot more diversity.

It would make more sense to compare Indo-European to Afro-Asiatic and to compare Semitic to Iranic/Slavic/Celtic/etc.

Semitic is a broad term too

Do you realy think and Assyrian or Iraqi Arab have much in common with a Berber from North Africa

Do you think a Polish or Lithuanian Jew is realy that much similar to StonyArabia or an average Beduin dude from Jordan or Palestine

[Babak]

Semitic is a broad term too

Do you realy think and Assyrian or Iraqi Arab have much in common with a Berber from North Africa

Do you think a Polish or Lithuanian Jew is realy that much similar to StonyArabia or an average Beduin dude from Jordan or Palestine

So what terms are we supposed to use? We can use the same example for greeks too.

[Mingle]

Semitic is a broad term too

Do you realy think and Assyrian or Iraqi Arab have much in common with a Berber from North Africa

Do you think a Polish or Lithuanian Jew is realy that much similar to StonyArabia or an average Beduin dude from Jordan or PalestineSemitic is less broad than IE still. And its mainly a linguistic term not a cultural one.

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[McCloskey]

Being Indo-European racially mean you have at least some ancestry from the original Steppe invaders who carried the languages. The same for Semitic.

But as far as I know there's no consensus about who were the Proto-Semites and the Proto-IEs are almost certainly to be Steppe invaders with Northern European genetic make up.

I consider Jatts, upper caste Hindus and Afghans/Tajiks mixed Indo-Europeans racially (the same for Southern Europeans). But I don't consider Armenians and some Iranians Indo-Europeans, for example. They barely have any true Indo-European ancestry.

[Babak]

Being Indo-European racially mean you have at least some ancestry from the original Steppe invaders who carried the languages. The same for Semitic.

But as far as I know there's no consensus about who were the Proto-Semites and the Proto-IEs are almost certainly to be Steppe invaders with Northern European genetic make up.

I consider Jatts, upper caste Hindus and Afghans/Tajiks mixed Indo-Europeans racially (the same for Southern Europeans). But I don't consider Armenians and some Iranians Indo-Europeans, for example. They barely have any true Indo-European ancestry.

But being Semitic and Indo-European(In this case Iranics) arent racial identifiers. If Arabs arent Semites and Iranians arent Indo europeans, then what are they?

[Antimatter]

Linguistically, Arabs speak Arabic - An Afro-Asiatic language of the Semitic branch. Persian, Urdu and Pashto etc.... Are all Indo-European languages.

Therefore, Arabs are Afro-Asiatics (Semites) and Iranians/Pakistanis/Afghans are Indo-Europeans (Indo-Aryans).

NOTE: This is a linguistic family and also a cultural unit, to some extent. Not a race. Although genetics do seem to have been altered by successive emigrations a specific urheimat like Indo-Europeans: (24.4% of Iranians are R1, 37% of Pakistanis are R1a, 32% of Hazaras are R1b) and same for the Semites (50.6% of Iraqis are J and 8.3% under E1b1b, 43.8% of Jordanians are J and 26% are E1b1b, 46% of Lebanese are J and 16.2% are E1b1b etc...).

For example, in the case of Indo-European languages, it is the Pontic-Caspian steppes. For the Semites', it is the Levant or less likely Arabia. Autosomally though, I think Iranians are much closer to Middle Easterners. Even through paternal lineage through the Y-DNA (which only consists around 1% of your DNA).

Iran: 31.4% J2, 7% E1b1b, 11.7% G2 etc...

Jordan: 17.8% R1b

Oman: 6.7% R1a

And so this continues on to show how our world is so mixed and we are all connected.

[McCloskey]

But being Semitic and Indo-European(In this case Iranics) arent racial identifiers. If Arabs arent Semites and Iranians arent Indo europeans, then what are they?

Assmilated peoples. But there are theories which say proto-Semites or at least Proto-Afro-Asiatics originated in Arabia or Ethiopia.

Armenians and Iranians are mostly assimilated people, they hardly carry a lot of IE blood and even tradition. The Brahmins in India and some Iranic sects in Central Asia/Afghanistan remained mostly Indo-European culturally until some cennturies ago. Persians quickly integrated among Near Eastern civilizations.

[FinalFlash]

Assmilated peoples. But there are theories which say proto-Semites or at least Proto-Afro-Asiatics originated in Arabia or Ethiopia.

Armenians and Iranians are mostly assimilated people, they hardly carry a lot of IE blood and even tradition. The Brahmins in India and some Iranic sects in Central Asia/Afghanistan remained mostly Indo-European culturally until some cennturies ago. Persians quickly integrated among Near Eastern civilizations.

Persians have 20% Yamnaya admixture on the Global25 spreadsheet averages. Granted the sample sizes are limited but that statement is simply very wrong. Even Armenians score a decent amount too. To say we hardly carry a lot of IE blood is a stretch (especially for Persians).

[Smeagol]

These terms are strictly linguistic, not cultural or racial.

[Babak]

Assmilated peoples. But there are theories which say proto-Semites or at least Proto-Afro-Asiatics originated in Arabia or Ethiopia.

Armenians and Iranians are mostly assimilated people, they hardly carry a lot of IE blood and even tradition. The Brahmins in India and some Iranic sects in Central Asia/Afghanistan remained mostly Indo-European culturally until some cennturies ago. Persians quickly integrated among Near Eastern civilizations.

That makes no sense. Most people have been assimilated into various societies and we cant just label them "Assimilated peoples" wtf? If this is the case, then these people shouldnt be identified with any group at all.

[McCloskey]

Persians have 20% Yamnaya admixture on the Global25 spreadsheet averages. Granted the sample sizes are limited but that statement is simply very wrong. Even Armenians score a decent amount too. To say we hardly carry a lot of IE blood is a stretch (especially for Persians).

You guys are almost fully Near Easterners/West Asians. Pashtuns, Jatts and other East Iranic and Indic groups are actually ''mixed race''. Armenians and Persians are just MENAs who speak Indo-European.

[Babak]

These terms are strictly linguistic, not cultural or racial.

Yes thats what im saying.

[Mingle]

Assmilated peoples. But there are theories which say proto-Semites or at least Proto-Afro-Asiatics originated in Arabia or Ethiopia.

Proto-Afro-Asiatics originated in Ethiopia. Proto-Semites originated in the Levant.

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[McCloskey]

That makes no sense. Most people have been assimilated into various societies and we cant just label them "Assimilated peoples" wtf? If this is the case, then these people shouldnt be identified with any group at all.

Northern Europeans are the closest racial descendants of PIEs. That's simple to understand.

[Smeagol]

Proto-Afro-Asiatics originated in Ethiopia.

No they didn't.

[Babak]

Northern Europeans are the closest racial descendants of PIEs. That's simple to understand.

But its not a racial identifier.

[McCloskey]

But its not a racial identifier.

Depends. I associate Indo-European with language and race. The more Steppe you have the more Indo-European you are. That's simple.

[Mingle]

No they didn't.

You're right, it was probably the Levant too. Though a less likely theory about them having an Ethiopian origin also exists.

[cyberlorian]

You guys are almost fully Near Easterners/West Asians. Pashtuns, Jatts and other East Iranic and Indic groups are actually ''mixed race''. Armenians and Persians are just MENAs who speak Indo-European.

MENA is neither a cultural, racial nor a linguistic term. It is just a political term.

[Smeagol]

You're right, it was probably the Levant too. Though a less likely theory about them having an Ethiopian origin also exists.

That's just Christopher Ehret making things up.

[Ryuk]

Proto-Afro-Asiatics originated in Ethiopia. Proto-Semites originated in the Levant.

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Proto afro asiatic originated natufian

Chadic R1b v88 and cushidic T proof of this.

[McCloskey]

You're right, it was probably the Levant too. Though a less likely theory about them having an Ethiopian origin also exists.

I think Horn of Africa was likely fully or at least predominantly Caucasoid at some point, before SSA expansion in Africa.

[Babak]

Depends. I associate Indo-European with language and race. The more Steppe you have the more Indo-European you are. That's simple.

But thats not how it works. You might as well call khazakhs IES too since they score a fair amount of steppe.

[Bosniensis]

Very nice question, of course that Most of Europeans (even before modern migrations) are barbarians from Asia namely Indo-Europeans.

R1 people are all related to each other, Indian R1, Pakistani R1 etc... so Called Aryan Barbarians.

The only true Europeans are I2, J2, G2 and E1b aka Romans

Semites are all J1 while those Askhenazi etc.. those aren't even Jews, those are Khazars.

Jews are meaninglessly few, but they are supported by Aryan Horde who will join them any time soon.

[McCloskey]

But thats not how it works. You might as well call khazakhs IES too since they score a fair amount of steppe.

They are ''mixed race'' imo. But in their case they have been Turkified. Tajiks, on the other hand, still score loads of Steppe and are IE speaking. So they qualify as IE to me.

[Kelmendasi]

Proto-Afro-Asiatics originated in Ethiopia. Proto-Semites originated in the Levant.

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I have seen people link it's origin to the Levant and the fertile crescent rather than Africa. They suggest a migration back into Africa from the middle east during the Neolithic. I'm pretty sure the ancient Egyptian samples showed admixture linked to Neolithic farmers from the near east, though ancient Egyptian was just one branch of Afro-Asiatic

[Ryuk]

There's a simple solution to that.

If a people has a component of the language of the proto people,they are the heirs of the proto people.(turks,iranian,slavs)

If a people does not have the genetic component of the proto people of the language they speak, they are assimilated(full blood afro american,sardinian,Pontic greeks and turks)

[Babak]

They are ''mixed race'' imo. But in their case they have been Turkified. Tajiks, on the other hand, still score loads of Steppe and are IE speaking. So they qualify as IE to me.

But ethnic turks(Northeastern turks for example) are so called "mixed race" too. Are they not turks? They barely have central asian ancestry but yet proudly identify as Turkic.

[FinalFlash]

You guys are almost fully Near Easterners/West Asians. Pashtuns, Jatts and other East Iranic and Indic groups are actually ''mixed race''. Armenians and Persians are just MENAs who speak Indo-European.

Armenians aren't "MENAS" who speak a European language. Our Steppe admixture aside, Armenians also score a very large amount of Barcin_N which is Neolithic Anatolian. This is a European component which peaks in Sardinians as well as other Italic and Hellenic peoples. I seriously think you're misinformed or simply have very little idea about our genetics or the genetics of people in West Asia altogether.

[Babak]

Armenians aren't "MENAS" who speak a European language. Our Steppe admixture aside, Armenians also score a very large amount of Barcin_N which is Neolithic Anatolian. This is a European component which peaks in Sardinians as well as other Italic and Hellenic peoples. I seriously think you're misinformed or simply have very little idea about our genetics or the genetics of people in West Asia altogether.

Yea he doesnt understand that Indo-European is simy a linguistic identifier, not a racial one.

[McCloskey]

But ethnic turks(Northeastern turks for example) are so called "mixed race" too. Are they not turks? They barely have central asian ancestry but yet proudly identify as Turkic.

Yeah, most Turks from Anatolia are assimilated Anatolians imo. If Greece had won the war in 1919-1922 a lot of Turks would start to identify as Greeks or whatever they were before Turkish raids into Anatolia. In the case of Persians it's more difficult, because the linguistic assimilation is very ancient and Persians are very proud of their language.

I think ancient Persians, at least the aristocracy, was Northern European in genetics and appearence.

[McCloskey]

Armenians aren't "MENAS" who speak a European language. Our Steppe admixture aside, Armenians also score a very large amount of Barcin_N which is Neolithic Anatolian. This is a European component which peaks in Sardinians as well as other Italic and Hellenic peoples. I seriously think you're misinformed or simply have very little idea about our genetics or the genetics of people in West Asia altogether.

European =/= Indo-European. Sardinians are assimilated Neolithics.

[FinalFlash]

Yea he doesnt understand that Indo-European is simy a linguistic identifier, not a racial one.

That's true. But sometimes it's used interchangeably here with Yamnaya or Steppe. Which in your case(Iranians), 1/5 of your ancestry is basically Steppe according to Global25. However, the sample sizes are limited on their spreadsheet so it might be prone to a little change.

[Gangrel]

Very nice question, of course that Most of Europeans (even before modern migrations) are barbarians from Asia namely Indo-Europeans.

R1 people are all related to each other, Indian R1, Pakistani R1 etc... so Called Aryan Barbarians.

The only true Europeans are J2, G2 and E1b aka Romans

Semites are all J1 while those Askhenazi etc.. those aren't even Jews, those are Khazars.

Jews are meaninglessly few, but they are supported by Aryan Horde who will join them any time soon.
Fixed, I2 is Slavic.

[Ryuk]

Yeah, most Turks from Anatolia are assimilated Anatolians imo. If Greece had won the war in 1919-1922 a lot of Turks would start to identify as Greeks or whatever they were before Turkish raids into Anatolia. In the case of Persians it's more difficult, because the linguistic assimilation is very ancient and Persians are very proud of their language.

I think ancient Persians, at least the aristocracy, was Northern European in genetics and appearence.

No,except northeastern turks,all turks in Anatolia and Balkan have significant Siberian+East asian admixture.

https://turkishdna.blogspot.com/2018/09/eurogenes-k13-otozomal-il-ortalamalar.html?m=1

[Babak]

Yeah, most Turks from Anatolia are assimilated Anatolians imo. If Greece had won the war in 1919-1922 a lot of Turks would start to identify as Greeks or whatever they were before Turkish raids into Anatolia. In the case of Persians it's more difficult, because the linguistic assimilation is very ancient and Persians are very proud of their language.

I think ancient Persians, at least the aristocracy, was Northern European in genetics and appearence.

But youre still having a hard time understanding that Indo european(Iranic, Indo-aryan), are linguistic identifiers. Persians are persians and Turks and Turks. No one identifies themselves as "Assimilated" or "Mixed race". It makes no sense at all.

[FinalFlash]

European =/= Indo-European. Sardinians are assimilated Neolithics.

And it's a European component is my point. That's their bread and butter by far and guess what, they cluster with Europeans and look European. If it wasn't a European component, theyd cluster firmly with West Asia. Yet, they clearly don't. Steppe admixture isn't the only European component my friend lol

[zarzian]

That's because Semite is a smaller and more easily categorizable term compared to Indo-European. IE is a very broad term that includes a lot more diversity.

It would make more sense to compare Indo-European to Afro-Asiatic and to compare Semitic to Iranic/Slavic/Celtic/etc.

This sums it up nicely

[Kelmendasi]

Yeah, most Turks from Anatolia are assimilated Anatolians imo. If Greece had won the war in 1919-1922 a lot of Turks would start to identify as Greeks or whatever they were before Turkish raids into Anatolia. In the case of Persians it's more difficult, because the linguistic assimilation is very ancient and Persians are very proud of their language.

I think ancient Persians, at least the aristocracy, was Northern European in genetics and appearence.
The Sintasha, usually linked to Proto-Indo-Iranic, did cluster with the Corded ware peoples so they were pretty northern shifted in terms of genetics. If we looked at the pigmentation of cultures linked to Indo-Iranic speakers, such as Srubnaya, we can assume that they mainly had darker hair and eyes but light skin https://genetiker.wordpress.com/pigmentation/. The ancient Persian aristocracy themselves were probably more southern shifted due to inter-mixture with locals of Iran and west Asia.

[zarzian]

Or are Indo-european speaking near-easterners just OWD and are Semites instead?

You’re making the mistake of assuming IE is originally a European language. Lets see here, the first attested IE language is Hittite, in Asia. Half of the ancestry of the supposed PIE Yamnaya is Asian, Indo-Iranian has no roots in europe and started somehwrre in west or central Asia. So get a hold of yoursef

[Babak]

You’re making the mistake of assuming IE is originally a European language. Lets see here, the first attested IE language is Hittite, in Asia. Half of the ancestry of the supposed PIE Yamnaya is Asian, Indo-Iranian has no roots in europe and started somehwrre in west or central Asia. So get a hold of yoursef

But im not even talking about genetics here. Im merely talking about identifying with these specific terms. As you can see from the recent posts, hadn't I said "IE", i would've been called OWD and trolled out.

[FinalFlash]

You’re making the mistake of assuming IE is originally a European language. Lets see here, the first attested IE language is Hittite, in Asia. Half of the ancestry of the supposed PIE Yamnaya is Asian, Indo-Iranian has no roots in europe and started somehwrre in west or central Asia. So get a hold of yoursef

This^. I'm having a hard time believing in this so-called Kurgan hypothesis because of this. This Steppe admixture couldve just as easily been spread by the Hittites who as you mentioned were the first attested IE speakers.

[McCloskey]

And it's a European component is my point. That's their bread and butter by far and guess what, they cluster with Europeans and look European. If it wasn't a European component, theyd cluster firmly with West Asia. Yet, they clearly don't. Steppe admixture isn't the only European component my friend lol

Well, the point here is Indo-European ancestry not just European. European is a modern construct uniting many different populations. Indo-European can be located in a specific population and only Northern Europeans are predominantly Indo-European. All the others are mixed race.

Armenians don't even qualify as mixed since you guys are fully MENA/West Asiatic.

[zarzian]

You guys are almost fully Near Easterners/West Asians. Pashtuns, Jatts and other East Iranic and Indic groups are actually ''mixed race''. Armenians and Persians are just MENAs who speak Indo-European.

You are thinking wishfully idiot, The oldest proven IE cultures such as the Hittite, Myceneans and early Iron Age Iranians that had their DNA sequenced so far have shown minor or virtually non existent “steppe” ancestry that was also shown to exist in Lebanese Iron Age Semetic samples. The most prestigious DNA labs such as the Reich, Max Planck and countless others have stated the PIE started in south of the Caucasus in Northern Iran - Armenian highlands. IE is an invasive Asian language that took over Europe.

[Kelmendasi]

This^. I'm having a hard time believing in this so-called Kurgan hypothesis because of this. This Steppe admixture couldve just as easily been spread by the Hittites who as you mentioned were the first attested IE speakers.
It wouldn't make sense for it to have been spread by the Hittites, they were only really present in Anatolia and some areas of the Levant. Steppe admixture has shown up among multiple ancient cultures on the steppe. The Yamna, likely PIE speakers, are far older than the Hittites. It's possible that the oldest form of PIE was spoken somewhere in west Asia, west Iran possibly, though it is basically certain that the PIE languages had their greatest expansions from the steppe

[Babak]

Well, the point here is Indo-European ancestry not just European. European is a modern construct uniting many different populations. Indo-European can be located in a specific population and only Northern Europeans are predominantly Indo-European. All the others are mixed race.

Armenians don't even qualify as mixed since you guys are fully MENA/West Asiatic.

What a crock of shit. All populations are mixed, including Europeans themselves.

[McCloskey]

You are thinking wishfully idiot, The oldest proven IE cultures such as the Hittite, Myceneans and early Iron Age Iranians that had their DNA sequenced so far have shown minor or virtually non existent “steppe” ancestry that was also shown to exist in Lebanese Iron Age Semetic samples. The most prestigious DNA labs such as the Reich, Max Planck and countless others have stated the PIE started in south of the Caucasus in Northern Iran - Armenian highlands. IE is an invasive Asian language that took over Europe.

You can dream, but that's all you can, haha. Indo-Europeans were racially Northern Europeans and we already have their genetic results. It's proven even that East Iranics and Northwestern Indics score Northern European in a good amount, that's because Indo-Europeans were genetically like modern Northern Europeans.

Iranians and Armenians are just assimilated MENAs.

[Kelmendasi]

You are thinking wishfully idiot, The oldest proven IE cultures such as the Hittite, Myceneans and early Iron Age Iranians that had their DNA sequenced so far have shown minor or virtually non existent “steppe” ancestry that was also shown to exist in Lebanese Iron Age Semetic samples. The most prestigious DNA labs such as the Reich, Max Planck and countless others have stated the PIE started in south of the Caucasus in Northern Iran - Armenian highlands. IE is an invasive Asian language that took over Europe.
It is likely that PIE did originate somewhere in west Asia based on recent genetic evidence, though linguistic backing is needed. But I think we can safely say that it was steppe cultures such as the Yamna which helped spread IE languages the most and that they can be responsible for it's modern distribution

[FinalFlash]

Well, the point here is Indo-European ancestry not just European. European is a modern construct uniting many different populations. Indo-European can be located in a specific population and only Northern Europeans are predominantly Indo-European. All the others are mixed race.

Armenians don't even qualify as mixed since you guys are fully MENA/West Asiatic.

Armenians aren't a mixed race group of people, yes. But 1/3 of our ancestry is most definitely European as far as admixture is concerned. Only 10% of our ancestry is really "MENA", the Levant_N component. Just because over half our ancestry is CHG/Chalcolitic Iran doesnt make us "MENA". You do realize that the latter components are quite removed from any MENA component right? Being non-European=/=MENA

And for the last time, certain components are labeled as "European" because said components peak in Europeans, including neolithic Anatolia. Also, don't you think it's kinda silly to categorize people east of the bosphorus under one silly umbrella term like "MENA"? Especially when some of these people are in fact genetically closer to some European populations as opposed to other "MENAS"?

[Babak]

You can dream, but that's all you can, haha. Indo-Europeans were racially Northern Europeans and we already have their genetic results. It's proven even that East Iranics and Northwestern Indics score Northern European in a good amount, that's because Indo-Europeans were genetically like modern Northern Europeans.

Iranians and Armenians are just assimilated MENAs.

Assimilated or not, they are STILL Indo-Iranians, just as much as Arabs being Afro-Asiatic. There is no way out of this.

[zarzian]

They are ''mixed race'' imo. But in their case they have been Turkified. Tajiks, on the other hand, still score loads of Steppe and are IE speaking. So they qualify as IE to me.

This is hillarious, an octoroon mongrel nigger boy thinks that “steppe” admixture is a sign of IE’ness, then by your idiotic logic the Uralic speakers score the most pure IE’s because their the ones scoring the most “steppe” .

[McCloskey]

Indo-European hierarchy:

Northern Europeans (60-50%)
East Iranics (like Tajiks) and Russian mixed populations (like the Mari) (60-20%)
Southern Europeans (35-15%)
Pashtuns, Upper caste Hindus, Jatts (30-10%)
Armenians, Iranians, Kurds etc. (10-0%)

[FinalFlash]

It wouldn't make sense for it to have been spread by the Hittites, they were only really present in Anatolia and some areas of the Levant. Steppe admixture has shown up among multiple ancient cultures on the steppe. The Yamna, likely PIE speakers, are far older than the Hittites. It's possible that the oldest form of PIE was spoken somewhere in west Asia, west Iran possibly, though it is basically certain that the PIE languages had their greatest expansions from the steppe

Ok but "Barcin_N" admixture is just as widespread as Steppe admixture. Not only this, but theres no proof that this Steppe admix couldnt have been spread by the Hittites either as they likely carried a sizable amount of it themselves.

[Babak]

Armenians aren't a mixed race group of people, yes. But 1/3 of our ancestry is most definitely European as far as admixture is concerned. Only 10% of our ancestry is really "MENA", the Levant_N component. Just because over half our ancestry is CHG/Chalcolitic Iran doesnt make us "MENA". You do realize that the latter components are quite removed from any MENA component right? Being non-European=/=MENA

And for the last time, certain components are labeled as "European" because said components peak in Europeans, including neolithic Anatolia. Also, don't you think it's kinda silly to categorize people east of the bosphorus under one silly umbrella term like "MENA"? Especially when some of these people are in fact genetically closer to some European populations as opposed to other "MENAS"?

He doesn't get it dude. You're just an assimilated neolithic hunter gatherer and you have no identity.

[Aren]

You are thinking wishfully idiot, The oldest proven IE cultures such as the Hittite, Myceneans and early Iron Age Iranians that had their DNA sequenced so far have shown minor or virtually non existent “steppe” ancestry that was also shown to exist in Lebanese Iron Age Semetic samples. The most prestigious DNA labs such as the Reich, Max Planck and countless others have stated the PIE started in south of the Caucasus in Northern Iran - Armenian highlands. IE is an invasive Asian language that took over Europe.

Yet Reich is still holding onto the fact that Indo-Iranian was brought to Iran and South Asia via Steppe people(Sintashta, Srubnaya) through the Kazakhi steppe and not from Armenia or NW Iran. Which obviously makes sense considering that the typical Indo-Iranian marker R1a-Z93 has not been found in any the countless pre-Bronze Age samples from Iran or Armenia, aswell as that Iranians and Kurds have around 15% Sintastha related admixture.
So whether pre-proto IE was brought to Eastern Europe from CHG women or not doesn't really matter at this point since the early Iranians were undoubtedly very rich in Steppe admixture and arrived from the northeast, not Armenia.

[McCloskey]

This is hillarious, an octoroon mongrel nigger boy thinks that “steppe” admixture is a sign of IE’ness, then by your idiotic logic the Uralic speakers score the most pure IE’s because their the ones scoring the most “steppe” .

They are more Indo-European than you, inferior colored. As a colored MENA you should bow and accept your white master.

[FinalFlash]

Indo-European hierarchy:

Northern Europeans (60-50%)
East Iranics (like Tajiks) and Russian mixed populations (like the Mari) (60-20%)
Southern Europeans (35-15%)
Pashtuns, Upper caste Hindus, Jatts (30-10%)
Armenians, Iranians, Kurds etc. (10-0%)

Kurds and Iranians are closer to 20%

Armenians are somewhere between 10-15%

Kid, these ^ aren't negligible numbers no matter how hard you try to make it seem as they are

[Aren]

Indo-European hierarchy:

Northern Europeans (60-50%)
East Iranics (like Tajiks) and Russian mixed populations (like the Mari) (60-20%)
Southern Europeans (35-15%)
Pashtuns, Upper caste Hindus, Jatts (30-10%)
Armenians, Iranians, Kurds etc. (10-0%)

False. No Asian ethnicity raches up to 60% Steppe(as in Yamnaya related).

[Kelmendasi]

Ok but "Barcin_N" admixture is just as widespread as Steppe admixture. Not only this, but theres no proof that this Steppe admix couldnt have been spread by the Hittites either as they likely carried a sizable amount of it themselves.
Yes Barcin_N is usually just as widespread in west Eurasia, though Barcin_N itself iirc was a mix of WHG and Neolithic component. The steppe admix couldn't have been spread by the Hittites as older cultures that had nothing to do with them or contact with them already had this admixture. Steppe admix is basically just EHG+CHG, if anything the Hittites probably were low on this component

[Babak]

Kurds and Iranians are closer to 20%

Armenians are somewhere between 10-15%

Kid, these ^ aren't negligible numbers no matter how hard you try to make it seem as they are

Zoroastrians score up to 35%, but it doesn't matter because were simply talking about linguistics.

[Aren]

This is hillarious, an octoroon mongrel nigger boy thinks that “steppe” admixture is a sign of IE’ness, then by your idiotic logic the Uralic speakers score the most pure IE’s because their the ones scoring the most “steppe” .

LOL, Steppe peaks in South-Central Scandinavia followed by adjacent areas of NW Europe(Britain, Netherlands, Germany). Uralics have lower Steppe admixture than all Northern Euros.

Zoroastrians score up to 35%, but it doesn't matter because were simply talking about linguistics.
And where are you getting this from? Zoroastrians are only slightly more Steppe shifted than other Iranians.

[McCloskey]

False. No Asian ethnicity raches up to 60% Steppe(as in Yamnaya related).

Maybe 50% is more accurate as a peak, but I've seen some Mari almost reaching 60%.

[McCloskey]

LOL, Steppe peaks in South-Central Scandinavia followed by adjacent areas of NW Europe(Britain, Netherlands, Germany). Uralics have lower Steppe admixture than all Northern Euros.

Yeah, you're totally right, it seems Assyrians have more brain than Iranians and Armenians.

[Kelmendasi]

Kurds and Iranians are closer to 20%

Armenians are somewhere between 10-15%

Kid, these ^ aren't negligible numbers no matter how hard you try to make it seem as they are
Based on G25 Yamna admix, Kurds are 12.8%, Iranians are 13% and Armenians are 4.4%. Though Yamna may not represent all of the steppe admixture, so there may be more

[Babak]

LOL, Steppe peaks in South-Central Scandinavia followed by adjacent areas of NW Europe(Britain, Netherlands, Germany). Uralics have lower Steppe admixture than all Northern Euros.

And where are you getting this from? Zoroastrians are only slightly more Steppe shifted than other Iranians.

DMXX posted some results last year on AG, don't remember where it exactly was.

[zarzian]

Indo-European hierarchy:

Northern Europeans (60-50%)
East Iranics (like Tajiks) and Russian mixed populations (like the Mari) (60-20%)
Southern Europeans (35-15%)
Pashtuns, Upper caste Hindus, Jatts (30-10%)
Armenians, Iranians, Kurds etc. (10-0%)

What about Brazilian Octoroon niggers (0% - 0%)

The fact of the matter is IE is originally of West Asian origin and as they moved North they Assimilated European farmers, that is why the Late PIE groups such as the Yamnaya might cluster close to Europeans because they were assimilated EEF farmers and became the Corded Ware.

[Babak]

Here we go :picard2:

[Aren]

Based on G25 Yamna admix, Kurds are 12.8%, Iranians are 13% and Armenians are 4.4%. Though Yamna may not represent all of the steppe admixture, so there may be more

The Kurdish sample is very inaccurate, David is using Kurds from Armenia who are clearly admixed with the locals. Kurds and other Western Iranians(except SW Iranians) seem to be around 16-17% Sintastha related(meaning maybe 11-12% Yamnaya).
Also I have a feeling the academic Armenian average is quite bad aswell just by looking through Gedmatch of some Armenians who have gotten tested and their Northern Euro scores in the various calculators.

[Kelmendasi]

What about Brazilian Octoroon niggers (0% - 0%)

The fact of the matter is IE is originally of West Asian origin and as they moved North they Assimilated European farmers, that is why the Late PIE groups such as the Yamnaya might cluster close to Europeans because they were assimilated EEF farmers and became the Corded Ware.
PIE speaking groups actually plot north because of EHG admixture, EEF admixture would've plotted them towards southern Europe and west Asia.

[Kelmendasi]

The Kurdish sample is very inaccurate, David is using Kurds from Armenia who are clearly admixed with the locals. Kurds and other Western Iranians(except SW Iranians) seem to be around 16-17% Sintastha related(meaning maybe 11-12% Yamnaya).
Also I have a feeling the academic Armenian average is quite bad aswell just by looking through Gedmatch of some Armenians who have gotten tested and their Northern Euro scores in the various calculators.
What would you say is the average steppe input in Armenians, I would think under 20%

[FinalFlash]

Yes Barcin_N is usually just as widespread in west Eurasia, though Barcin_N itself iirc was a mix of WHG and Neolithic component. The steppe admix couldn't have been spread by the Hittites as older cultures that had nothing to do with them or contact with them already had this admixture. Steppe admix is basically just EHG+CHG, if anything the Hittites probably were low on this component

Afghan Pashtuns score 11% of this component so right there we can conclude that this component isnt restricted to West Eurasia. Besides, as far as I'm aware, the Anatolian hypothesis does not interfere with the Kurgan one. I dont see how both migration waves couldnt have taken place 2000 years apart.

[McCloskey]

What about Brazilian Octoroon niggers (0% - 0%)

The fact of the matter is IE is originally of West Asian origin and as they moved North they Assimilated European farmers, that is why the Late PIE groups such as the Yamnaya might cluster close to Europeans because they were assimilated EEF farmers and became the Corded Ware.

Brazilian is not an ''ethnnicity'', it's a nationality and I'm fully European.

But you're right, even many Brazilian pardos are more Indo-European than Iranians, Armenians and Kurds. And they look whiter as well when compared to your people.

[FinalFlash]

Based on G25 Yamna admix, Kurds are 12.8%, Iranians are 13% and Armenians are 4.4%. Though Yamna may not represent all of the steppe admixture, so there may be more

I got something much higher than those numbers for all 3 populations. The component was Yamnaya_Kalmykia

[Haider]

Semitic is a broad term too

Do you realy think and Assyrian or Iraqi Arab have much in common with a Berber from North Africa

Do you think a Polish or Lithuanian Jew is realy that much similar to StonyArabia or an average Beduin dude from Jordan or Palestine

Berbers are not Semites tho, they are their own category. Euro-Jews are Indo-European, obviously.

[McCloskey]

Swarthy MENAs trying to cope is really funny:

https://i.imgur.com/XKn0z3p.png

[McCloskey]

Get over it, Indo-Europeans were Nordic.

[Aren]

What would you say is the average steppe input in Armenians, I would think under 20%

Def, probably lower than Kurds aswell, but possibly around 8-9% Yamnaya related. However I wonder what the people who brought the proto-Armenian language to Armenia were like genetically speaking, I don't think they were as Steppe shifted as say the Sintashta samples.

[Babak]

Def, probably lower than Kurds aswell, but possibly around 8-9% Yamnaya related. However I wonder what the people who brought the proto-Armenian language to Armenia were like genetically speaking, I don't think they were as Steppe shifted as say the Sintashta samples.

Why are we using Yamnaya and not Andronovo?

[zarzian]

PIE speaking groups actually plot north because of EHG admixture, EEF admixture would've plotted them towards southern Europe and west Asia.

You are right as well, but if we subtract the EEF then Uralics will score more EMBA Steppe because Fino-Uralics are more EHG rich then orher Europeans, it is the EEF mixture (and slight Siberian) that seperates Northern European IE’s from Northern European FU Speakers.

[Kelmendasi]

Afghan Pashtuns score 11% of this component so right there we can conclude that this component isnt restricted to West Eurasia. Besides, as far as I'm aware, the Anatolian hypothesis does not interfere with the Kurgan one. I dont see how both migration waves couldnt have taken place 2000 years apart.
Barcin_N admix in groups such as the Pashtuns may have originally arrived with Indo-Iranic speakers or maybe some related Neolithic group. The component itself is more of a west Eurasian one based on what it is made up of. The Anatolian hypothesis does interfere with the steppe one, this is because it suggests and earlier expansion of the PIE languages than the steppe ones does, and suggests that cultures like the Starcevo were PIE speakers. Ancient DNA is suggesting that the IE languages in Asia came from the steppe.

[McCloskey]

Def, probably lower than Kurds aswell, but possibly around 8-9% Yamnaya related. However I wonder what the people who brought the proto-Armenian language to Armenia were like genetically speaking, I don't think they were as Steppe shifted as say the Sintashta samples.

Yeah, probably they were considerably affected by Near Easterner or Caucasian genetics; the reason East-Iranics are the most Indo-European shifted in Asia is precisely because they absorbed Sintashta and maybe even Tocharian blood.

[Mingle]

Why are we using Yamnaya and not Andronovo?Because the Yamnaya Culture is where IEs originated.

Sent from my SM-G925T using Tapatalk

[Kelmendasi]

Def, probably lower than Kurds aswell, but possibly around 8-9% Yamnaya related. However I wonder what the people who brought the proto-Armenian language to Armenia were like genetically speaking, I don't think they were as Steppe shifted as say the Sintashta samples.
Isn't it suggested that Proto-Armenian came from the Balkans?

[Kelmendasi]

Why are we using Yamnaya and not Andronovo?
Andronovo is later

[Babak]

Because the Yamnaya Culture is where IEs originated.

Sent from my SM-G925T using Tapatalk

But yamnaya doesn't represent early iranics.

[Haider]

You are thinking wishfully idiot, The oldest proven IE cultures such as the Hittite, Myceneans and early Iron Age Iranians that had their DNA sequenced so far have shown minor or virtually non existent “steppe” ancestry that was also shown to exist in Lebanese Iron Age Semetic samples. The most prestigious DNA labs such as the Reich, Max Planck and countless others have stated the PIE started in south of the Caucasus in Northern Iran - Armenian highlands. IE is an invasive Asian language that took over Europe.

The Canaanites had no Steppe input actually, that's why they could be modeled as 75% Samaritan 25% Saudi. That's the main difference between them and modern day Lebanese, who have very minor (1-5%) Norman which is enough to shift them closer to other Steppe influenced populations.

[IncelSlayer]

The more Steppe you have the more you will resemble this guy https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/001/340/720/c57.jpg

I agree.

[Aren]

DMXX posted some results last year on AG, don't remember where it exactly was.

With more recent samples I get around 16-17% Sintastha related for Zoroastrians

"distance%=1.844"

Iranian_Zoroastrian

Hajji_Firuz_ChL,54.6
Gonur1_BA,25
Sintashta_MLBA,16.2
Turk_Medieval,4.2

[Aren]

Isn't it suggested that Proto-Armenian came from the Balkans?

I belive that too. However we don't seem to have a lot of high quality Late Bronze Age/Early Iron Age samples from Southern Balkans. Or maybe I've missed them?

[Token]

All Indo-Europeans share descent from the Bronze Age steppes, all Semites share descent from the Chalcolithic Southern Levant. These are not just linguistic identifiers.

[Mingle]

But yamnaya doesn't represent early iranics.

We're talking about Proto-IE when we say "Steppe" not the early Iranics.

[zarzian]

Swarthy MENAs trying to cope is really funny:

https://i.imgur.com/XKn0z3p.png


All this proves is that Iranian assimilated alot of European Farmers and foragers in the north Steppe zones.

[Babak]

With more recent samples I get around 16-17% Sintastha related for Zoroastrians

"distance%=1.844"

Iranian_Zoroastrian

Hajji_Firuz_ChL,54.6
Gonur1_BA,25
Sintashta_MLBA,16.2
Turk_Medieval,4.2

Then idk, I even saw some with 22 and 25.

[Aren]

All Indo-Europeans share descent from the Bronze Age steppes, all Semites share descent from the Chalcolithic Southern Levant. These are not just linguistic identifiers.

Exactly. Although for Semitic speakers I would say more so that the Bronze Age samples from Jordan and Lebanon are more relevant since the Chalcolithic samples we have so far from Israel are considered a dead end.

[zarzian]

The Canaanites had no Steppe input actually, that's why they could be modeled as 75% Samaritan 25% Saudi. That's the main difference between them and modern day Lebanese, who have very minor (1-5%) Norman which is enough to shift them closer to other Steppe influenced populations.

Im not talking about Bronze Age Canaanites, I’ll find the study but im talking about late Iron Age Levant DNA which showed Pre Roman and definitely pre Norman Steppe influence.

[Babak]

We're talking about Proto-IE when we say "Steppe" not the early Iranics.

This thread wasn't intended to be about Proto-IEs or genetics. It was simply about Identification. This is why i hesitate to post threads like these because it gets derailed and trolled rather quickly.

[zarzian]

With more recent samples I get around 16-17% Sintastha related for Zoroastrians

"distance%=1.844"

Iranian_Zoroastrian

Hajji_Firuz_ChL,54.6
Gonur1_BA,25
Sintashta_MLBA,16.2
Turk_Medieval,4.2


This mean absolutely nothing, those samples have different components that the nMonte program hides or inflates depending on the outgroups, it is very easily manipulatable.

[IncelSlayer]

What about Brazilian Octoroon niggers (0% - 0%)

The fact of the matter is IE is originally of West Asian origin and as they moved North they Assimilated European farmers, that is why the Late PIE groups such as the Yamnaya might cluster close to Europeans because they were assimilated EEF farmers and became the Corded Ware.

Wouldn't bother spending time talking sense into those "white" brazilians,today that baboon Token even called jatts europeans, because of their high steppe admixture :lol: :lol:

[Aren]

This mean absolutely nothing, those samples have different components that the nMonte program hides or inflates depending on the outgroups, it is very easily manipulatable.

What it shows is undoubtedly Steppe_MLBA input in Iranic speakers, which is confirmed by uniparental markers that also match with Steppe cultures such as Sintastha and Srubnaya.
You mentioned Reich and the Max Planck insitute who both favor a Steppe origin of Indo-Iranian in either of the two cultures I mentioned above. So I really don't understand why it would matter if pre-Proto IE was spoken in some CHG related group in Armenia prior to advancing to the European steppes.

[FinalFlash]

Wouldn't bother spending time talking sense into those "white" brazilians,today that baboon Token even called jatts europeans, because of their high steppe admixture :lol: :lol:

I guess it's true what they said about them being complexed pardos.

[zarzian]

What it shows is undoubtedly Steppe_MLBA input in Iranic speakers, which is confirmed by uniparental markers that also match with Steppe cultures such as Sintastha and Srubnaya.
You mentioned Reich and the Max Planck insitute who both favor a Steppe origin of Indo-Iranian in either of the two cultures I mentioned above. So I really don't understand why it would matter if pre-Proto IE was spoken in some CHG related group in Armenia prior to advancing to the European steppes.

Not true, they only admitted that Indo-Aryans most likey entered India via the Inner Asian Mountain Corridor, they did not state that Indo-Iranians originated in the steppes.

[StonyArabia]

I believe that the proto-Semities were Saudi/Bedouin like

[Marmara]

Proto-Afro-Asiatics originated in Ethiopia. Proto-Semites originated in the Levant.

Sent from my SM-G925T using Tapatalk

There is absolutely no proof of that, Afro-Asiatic languages more likely originated somewhere around Transcaucasus/North-Iran by the original J carriers whom invaded southwards, conquered and assimilated E1b1 farmers.

[McCloskey]

I guess it's true what they said about them being complexed pardos.

An Armenian, an Iranian and a guy I don't know what the fuck he is (seems to be Gypsy/Romanian from what I gather from posts against him) calling us pardos is the epitome of ridiculous. Btw, I'm pretty sure you certainly look more pardo than me. Armenians pass easily as balanced pardos and look darker than Euro-shifted ones;

This is a Brazilian woman who identify as ''Afro-Brazilian'':

https://www.abola.pt//img/fotos/ABOLA2015/BRASIL/adrili.jpg

Looks whiter than 99% of Armenians, a bunch of hooked nosed brownoids.

[StonyArabia]

There is absolutely no proof of that, Afro-Asiatic languages more likely originated somewhere around Transcaucasus/North-Iran by the original J carriers whom invaded southwards, conquered and assimilated E1b1 farmers.

No Yemen is better origin for Afro-Asiatic people than Transcaucasus/North Iran.

[FinalFlash]

An Armenian, an Iranian and a guy I don't know what the fuck he is (seems to be Gypsy/Romanian from what I gather from posts against him) calling us pardos is the epitome of ridiculous. Btw, I'm pretty sure you certainly look more pardo than me. Armenians pass easily as balanced pardos and look darker than Euro-shifted ones;

This is a Brazilian women who identify as ''Afro-Brazilian'':

https://www.abola.pt//img/fotos/ABOLA2015/BRASIL/adrili.jpg

Looks whiter than 99% of Armenians, a bunch of hooked nosed brownoids.

It's always funny how mixed-race mongrels love to berate others in a feeble attempt to mask their insecurities. Kid, the darkest of Armenians would still look convincingly "whiter" than the average denizen of that genetic cesspit you call Braaaassiiiiiiiiiiwwwwwww

[Aren]

Not true, they only admitted that Indo-Aryans most likey entered India via the Inner Asian Mountain Corridor, they did not state that Indo-Iranians originated in the steppes.

Ofc they did. Sintastha is widely regarded as the Proto-Indo-Iranian culture.

[Mingle]

There is absolutely no proof of that, Afro-Asiatic languages more likely originated somewhere around Transcaucasus/North-Iran by the original J carriers whom invaded southwards, conquered and assimilated E1b1 farmers.That was an uninformed post. Afterwards I said it was probably the Levant instead. Haven't heard of Transcaucasia being proposed as their urheimat until now.

Sent from my SM-G925T using Tapatalk

[zarzian]

There is absolutely no proof of that, Afro-Asiatic languages more likely originated somewhere around Transcaucasus/North-Iran by the original J carriers whom invaded southwards, conquered and assimilated E1b1 farmers.

LMFAO!!!! So you are saying the J speakers, whome only expanded through the southern levant in the Bronze age, were the original Afro-Asiatic speakers that expanded as fas as Central Africa i! Such a short amount of time? Your a cool guy but please stay out of Genetic and Linguistic questions.

[Kelmendasi]

There is absolutely no proof of that, Afro-Asiatic languages more likely originated somewhere around Transcaucasus/North-Iran by the original J carriers whom invaded southwards, conquered and assimilated E1b1 farmers.
I highly doubt that J can be linked to Afro-Asiatic. Going by it's highest diversity and historical background of the area I would say that the Caucasian languages are a better link. No theory links Afro-Asiatic to the Transcaucasus region, in the near east they are linked to the Levant and fertile crescent area. Most scholars agree with a Levantine/Natufian origin or link, suggesting E1b was their "original" haplogroup.

[McCloskey]

It's always funny how mixed-race mongrels love to berate others in a feeble attempt to mask their insecurities. Kid, the darkest of Armenians would still look convincingly "whiter" than the average denizen of that genetic cesspit you call Braaaassiiiiiiiiiiwwwwwww

You are the mixed race here, son. Armenia is a land devastated by thousands of rapists conquerors for millions of years. I descend mostly from Anglo-Americans and Irish with a bit of North Italian.

Armenians definitely don't pass as White here, most of you guys qwould be taken for (dark) pardos. A lighter parda, like the one I posted above, is much more white looking than 99% of Armenians. You guys are brownoids, accept it, MENA boy.

[Kelmendasi]

No Yemen is better origin for Afro-Asiatic people than Transcaucasus/North Iran.
Yemen? In my opinion it originated in the Levant, I think the Natufians could be linked to them

[StonyArabia]

That was an uninformed post. Afterwards I said it was probably the Levant instead. Haven't heard of Transcaucasia being proposed as their urheimat until now.

Sent from my SM-G925T using Tapatalk

Unlikely it's Yemen or an area between Yemen and Jordan so clearly Arabian peninsula, Ethiopia is even more likely lol but for sure Yemen or Saudi.

[FinalFlash]

J1 I believe originated in the northeast Caucasus. Their subclades are probably different to the semitic speakers.

[Babak]

Unlikely it's Yemen or an area between Yemen and Jordan so clearly Arabian peninsula, Ethiopia is even more likely lol but for sure Yemen or Saudi.

Its widely proposed that it seems to be the Levant. We already have enough samples showing it dude.

[Aren]

I highly doubt that J can be linked to Afro-Asiatic. Going by it's highest diversity and historical background of the area I would say that the Caucasian languages are a better link. No theory links Afro-Asiatic to the Transcaucasus region, in the near east they are linked to the Levant and fertile crescent area. Most scholars agree with a Levantine/Natufian origin or link, suggesting E1b was their "original" haplogroup.

J is almost 50k years old, to equate it with just one language group today is crazy. Several subclades under J1-P58 and J2 were present in the Levant during the period of proto-Semitic, I'm pretty sure of it.

[Kelmendasi]

J1 I believe originated in the northeast Caucasus. Their subclades are probably different to the semitic speakers.
I agree that it was in the Caucasus or eastern Anatolia region based on diversity. If it was in the Caucasus I would say it came from the western part, maybe Georgia. This is based on the fact that eastern Anatolia also shares very high J1 diversity as well as the Caucasus and the oldest J1 sample is from Paleolithic Georgia. I have read that some J1 in places like Dagestan may have arrived with the Kura-araxes

[FinalFlash]

You are the mixed race here, son. Armenia is a land devastated by thousands of rapists conquerors for millions of years. I descend mostly from Anglo-Americans and Irish with a bit of North Italian.

Armenians definitely don't pass as White here, most of you guys qwould be taken for (dark) pardos. A lighter parda, like the one I posted above, is much more white looking than 99% of Armenians. You guys are brownoids, accept it, MENA boy.

In your warped dreams kid. Genetically homogeneous for millenias my friend. You, on the other hand are a new creation and your ethnogenesis is still forming that contains a mix of everything and anything under the sun. Also, the fact that you lot look like complete nignogs to neighboring Argentina and Uruguay obviously plays a massive role in your racial insecurities.

I provide facts, you provide non-sensical ad hominem attacks that once again, stems from your insecurities.

[zarzian]

J is almost 50k years old, to equate it with just one language group today is crazy. Several subclades under J1-P58 and J2 were present in the Levant during the period of proto-Semitic, I'm pretty sure of it.

They were definitely not AA speakers, there is a way bigger chance that they were IE speakers.

[StonyArabia]

Yemen? In my opinion it originated in the Levant, I think the Natufians could be linked to them


Yemenis have a lot of basal J*. It's possible but Transcaucasia no way

[Kelmendasi]

J is almost 50k years old, to equate it with just one language group today is crazy. Several subclades under J1-P58 and J2 were present in the Levant during the period of proto-Semitic, I'm pretty sure of it.
Yh, though I would say that the Caucasian languages may be linked to it. Though even that may be pushing it. For J1, you can clearly link YSC234 to the Proto-Semites going by how long ago it was formed. P58 itself probably came from the eastern Anatolia region. YSC234 and it's downstreams can be called "Semitic" as they took part in the formation of the Semites.

[McCloskey]

In your warped dreams kid. Genetically homogeneous for millenias my friend. You, on the other hand are a new creation and your ethnogenesis is still forming that contains a mix of everything and anything under the sun. Also, the fact that you lot look like complete nignogs to neighboring Argentina and Uruguay obviously plays a massive role in your racial insecurities.

I provide facts, you provide non-sensical ad hominem attacks that once again, stems from your insecurities.

Well, Brazil is diverse. People here range from Northern European to Negroid. We are the Ark of the World and when we finnish to get rid of all the traitors/corrupts no one would be able to stop us. Especially if Bolsonaro really apply some Eugenic program. No Brazilian cares about Argentina and Uruguay (or any other Latin American country), we consider them failed Republics and Uruguay is just a rebel Brazilian state which will be incorporated again in the next 100 years, like most of Latin America.

I'm the one providing facts, the fact you are coping for being assmilated in an IA language is not my problem. You barely have steppe ancestry, boy.

Accept it: Armenians are not Indo-Europeans. You are assimilated Assyrians mixed with Georgians and Arabs.

[Token]

Not true, they only admitted that Indo-Aryans most likey entered India via the Inner Asian Mountain Corridor, they did not state that Indo-Iranians originated in the steppes.

https://fs.blog/wp-content/uploads/2017/05/Confirmation-Bias.png

[Babak]

An Armenian, an Iranian and a guy I don't know what the fuck he is (seems to be Gypsy/Romanian from what I gather from posts against him) calling us pardos is the epitome of ridiculous. Btw, I'm pretty sure you certainly look more pardo than me. Armenians pass easily as balanced pardos and look darker than Euro-shifted ones;

This is a Brazilian woman who identify as ''Afro-Brazilian'':

https://www.abola.pt//img/fotos/ABOLA2015/BRASIL/adrili.jpg

Looks whiter than 99% of Armenians, a bunch of hooked nosed brownoids.

Massive OWD for sure.

[StonyArabia]

Well, Brazil is diverse. People here range from Northern European to Negroid. We are the Ark of the World and when we finnish to get rid of all the traitors/corrupts no one would be able to stop us. Especially if Bolsonaro really apply some Eugenic program. No Brazilian cares about Argentina and Uruguay (or any other Latin American country), we consider them failed Republics and Uruguay is just a rebel Brazilian state which will be incorporated again in the next 100 years, like most of Latin America.

I'm the one providing facts, the fact you are coping for being assmilated in an IA language is not my problem. You barely have steppe ancestry, boy.

Accept it: Armenians are not Indo-Europeans. You are assimilated Assyrians mixed with Georgians and Arabs.

Armenians have nothing to do with us.

[Marmara]

That was an uninformed post. Afterwards I said it was probably the Levant instead. Haven't heard of Transcaucasia being proposed as their urheimat until now.

Sent from my SM-G925T using Tapatalk


No Yemen is better origin for Afro-Asiatic people than Transcaucasus/North Iran.


LMFAO!!!! So you are saying the J speakers, whome only expanded through the southern levant in the Bronze age, were the original Afro-Asiatic speakers that expanded as fas as Central Africa i! Such a short amount of time? Your a cool guy but please stay out of Genetic and Linguistic questions.


I highly doubt that J can be linked to Afro-Asiatic. Going by it's highest diversity and historical background of the area I would say that the Caucasian languages are a better link. No theory links Afro-Asiatic to the Transcaucasus region, in the near east they are linked to the Levant and fertile crescent area. Most scholars agree with a Levantine/Natufian origin or link, suggesting E1b was their "original" haplogroup.

J is the most common haplogroup in the Middle-East, it even peaks in Yemen area. Whom brought this haplogroup here? Persians? Turks? Middle-East was not invaded much other people.

Is it also a concidence that Ethiopia and Somali also has J Y-DNA?


Unlikely it's Yemen or an area between Yemen and Jordan so clearly Arabian peninsula, Ethiopia is even more likely lol but for sure Yemen or Saudi.

Arabia despite having most J frequency has least diversity of its branches, it can't originate there unless E1b1 "original afro-asiatics" imported some J bulls to impregnate their women and spread their Y-DNA.

[Token]

In your warped dreams kid. Genetically homogeneous for millenias my friend. You, on the other hand are a new creation and your ethnogenesis is still forming that contains a mix of everything and anything under the sun. Also, the fact that you lot look like complete nignogs to neighboring Argentina and Uruguay obviously plays a massive role in your racial insecurities.

I provide facts, you provide non-sensical ad hominem attacks that once again, stems from your insecurities.

Dude, you speak a full-blown Indo-European language while being genetically barely 5% Indo-European, at least Brazilians speak the language of most of their ancestors. You, on the other hand, had your entire culture and language imposed over your people by some Gopnik cowboys from the north via elite dominance.

[FinalFlash]

Well, Brazil is diverse. People here range from Northern European to Negroid. We are the Ark of the World and when we finnish to get rid of all the traitors/corrupts no one would be able to stop us. Especially if Bolsonaro really apply some Eugenic program. No Brazilian cares about Argentina and Uruguay (or any other Latin American country), we consider them failed Republics and Uruguay is just a rebel Brazilian state which will be incorporated again in the next 100 years, like most of Latin America.

I'm the one providing facts, the fact you are coping for being assmilated in an IA language is not my problem. You barely have steppe ancestry, boy.

Accept it: Armenians are not Indo-Europeans. You are assimilated Assyrians mixed with Georgians and Arabs.

Brazil is diverse in a sense that it's a genetic cesspit. Finding a northern European looking person in Brazil is like finding a needle in a haystack. Even then, Amerindian features are obvious :)

Its actually quite a contrast to the convincingly more European looking Argies and Uruguayans tbh. Your average Georgian and Assyrian are still noticeably whiter and more European looking on average compared to the Braaaasiwwww Pardos.

[Kelmendasi]

J is the most common haplogroup in the Middle-East, it even peaks in Yemen area. Whom brought this haplogroup here? Persians? Turks? Middle-East was not invaded much other people.

Is it also a concidence that Ethiopia and Somali also has J Y-DNA?



Arabia despite having most J frequency has least diversity of its branches, it can't originate there unless E1b1 "original afro-asiatics" brought some J Bulls to impregnate their women and spread their Y-DNA.
Going by the subclades in the Middle east, it was spread by the Arabs or other Semitic speaking peoples. The subclades of J1 in Ethiopia and Somalia show that they are of Arab/Semitic origin. J carriers participated among the formation of the Semites in large numbers and not among other Afro-Asiatic speakers, which is why Semitic speakers have so much J whilst other Afro-Asiatic speakers don't.

[zarzian]

J is the most common haplogroup in the Middle-East, it even peaks in Yemen area. Whom brought this haplogroup here? Persians? Turks? Middle-East was not invaded much other people.

Is it also a concidence that Ethiopia and Somali also has J Y-DNA?



Arabia despite having most J frequency has least diversity of its branches, it can't originate there unless E1b1 "original afro-asiatics" imported some J bulls to impregnate their women and spread their Y-DNA.

Well they didn’t import them but the J’s were warlike and expanded through the middle east and took the language of their new Semetic brides.

[McCloskey]

Massive OWD for sure.

You cannot be ''OWD'' when you are white yourself.

This term seems to be invented to describe MENA people (like Iranians, Armenians, Pakis etc.) who think they are White.

[Babak]

Dude, you speak a full-blown Indo-European language while being genetically barely 5% Indo-European, at least Brazilians speak the language of most of their ancestors. You, on the other hand, had your entire culture and language imposed over your people by some Gopnik cowboys from the north via elite dominance.

The majority of populations have been assimilated over time by different groups of people who barely have any genetic relationship with the people who conquered them.

[FinalFlash]

Dude, you speak a full-blown Indo-European language while being genetically barely 5% Indo-European, at least Brazilians speak the language of most of their ancestors. You, on the other hand, had your entire culture and language imposed over your people by some Gopnik cowboys from the north via elite dominance.

So that's the theory yes. It's actually more in the 10-15% range btw. But sometimes it not about what you have, but about what you don't. Sorry my friend but Armenians have nil Amerinidan or Negroid admixture that's seemingly the dominant admixture in the overwhelming majority of Brazilians. Even our West Asian/CHG component which makes the bulk of our DNA is about a million and one times more related to any Euro component than the stuff most Brazilians carry.

[McCloskey]

Brazil is diverse in a sense that it's a genetic cesspit. Finding a northern European looking person in Brazil is like finding a needle in a haystack. Even then, Amerindian features are obvious :)

Its actually quite a contrast to the convincingly more European looking Argies and Uruguayans tbh. Your average Georgian and Assyrian are still noticeably whiter and more European looking on average compared to the Braaaasiwwww Pardos.

Keep dreaming, Armenian Nigga:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KYXeSSrOcMc

There are many other cities like this one here. You would only pass as a slave there.

[Babak]

You cannot be ''OWD'' when you are white yourself.

This term seems to be invented to describe MENA people (like Iranians, Armenians, Pakis etc.) who think they are White.

But you're not white and it isn't restricted to people who are wannabes. Your posts describe typical OWDness.

[FinalFlash]

You cannot be ''OWD'' when you are white yourself.

This term seems to be invented to describe MENA people (like Iranians, Armenians, Pakis etc.) who think they are White.

The term was coined by a now-banned Somalid who had his own insecurities who also tried to mask them by berating those that were ironically far closer to Euros than to himself.

[Marmara]

Going by the subclades in the Middle east, it was spread by the Arabs or other Semitic speaking peoples. The subclades of J1 in Ethiopia and Somalia show that they are of Arab/Semitic origin. J carriers participated among the formation of the Semites in large numbers and not among other Afro-Asiatic speakers, which is why Semitic speakers have so much J whilst other Afro-Asiatic speakers don't.

That makes sense actually.

[FinalFlash]

Keep dreaming, Armenian Nigga:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KYXeSSrOcMc

There are many other cities like this one here. You would only pass as a slave there.

Nice try. The reality is people like your Pardos would work for people like me. Who are you trying to fool other than yourself?

[McCloskey]

So that's the theory yes. It's actually more in the 10-15% range btw. But sometimes it not about what you have, but about what you don't. Sorry my friend but Armenians have nil Amerinidan or Negroid admixture that's seemingly the dominant admixture in the overwhelming majority of Brazilians. Even our West Asian/CHG component which makes the bulk of our DNA is about a million and one times more related to any Euro component than the stuff most Brazilians carry.

False. I would go as far as to say most Brazilians carry more Steppe ancestry than any Armenian. Deal with it, assimilated Assyrian.

Look at any genetic study.

[Aren]

Well they didn’t import them but the J’s were warlike and expanded through the middle east and took the language of their new Semetic brides.

xD You are funny.
J was present in the Levant before the emergence of Semitic.

[FinalFlash]

False. I would go as far as to say most Brazilians carry more Steppe ancestry than any Armenian. Deal with it, assimilated Assyrian.

Look at any genetic study.

Still coping? Your people are mixed race. Having less or more(still not sure about this) Steppe admix isnt going to transform you into a Nord that you so desperately fantasize about.

[happycow]

:ranger

[Token]

So that's the theory yes. It's actually more in the 10-15% range btw. But sometimes it not about what you have, but about what you don't. Sorry my friend but Armenians have nil Amerinidan or Negroid admixture that's seemingly the dominant admixture in the overwhelming majority of Brazilians. Even our West Asian/CHG component which makes the bulk of our DNA is about a million and one times more related to any Euro component than the stuff most Brazilians carry.
LMAO, 10-15% my ass, Armenians are the least Indo-Europeans among Indo-European speakers, even freakin Northern Han Chinese have as much IE admixture. Amerindian and African admixture are obviously not dominant in Brazil, don't let your anger affect your capacity of judgement - every study have Brazilians over 70% European on average and even Black Brazilians are well over 35% European. Yeah, even the mixed-race mongrel nignogs - as you call them - are predominantly European.

Anyway, Amerindian and African are certainly two very important components in the Brazilian ethnogenesis and genetic make-up, and there is nothing wrong with that. The ones that deny this obvious fact - who are in their vast majority associal otaku anthrotards - are the real complexed ones.

[Babak]

Still coping? Your people are mixed race. Having less or more(still not sure about this) Steppe admix isnt going to transform you into a Nord that you so desperately fantasize about.

The hilarious thing is, is that hes confusing "Mixed race" with having different genetic components. In reality, mixed race is Caucasoid+Negroid for example. Most Armenians (And other west asian groups) are 95-98% Caucasoid.

[McCloskey]

Still coping? Your people are mixed race. Having less or more(still not sure about this) Steppe admix isnt going to transform you into a Nord that you so desperately fantasize about.

I don't need to transform myself in a Nordic because 1) I'm not nordicist 2) I'm already part Nordic since I'm mostly of British stock. But the fact is that your people speak a language imposed by conquerors upon you. And ''Brazilian'' is not ethnicity, retard. It's a nationality. Everyone can be Brazilian, even Armeniggers.

But the most important is that you don't try to escape from the debate making it about Brazilians. It's about Armenians, Iranians, Afghans, Pakis, Indians and related people.

[FinalFlash]

LMAO, 10-15% my ass, Armenians are the least Indo-Europeans among Indo-European speakers, even freakin Northern Han Chinese have as much IE admixture. Amerindian and African admixture is obviously not dominant in Brazil, don't let your anger affect your capacity of judgement - every study have Brazilians over 70% European on average and even Black Brazilians are well over 35% European. Yeah, even the mixed-race mongrel nignogs - as you call them - are predominantly European.

Anyway, Amerindian and African are certainly two very important components in the Brazilian ethnogenesis and genetic make-up, and there is nothing wrong with that. The ones that deny this obvious fact - who are in their vast majority associal otaku anthrotards - are the real complexed ones.

10-15% isn't a huge amount to begin so let's maybe chill on the theatrics a little bit? Once again, it's not about what you score, it's also about what you don't score. Is this really that difficult of a concept to grasp? Why do you people put so much stock into Steppe admix while also ignoring another European component in Barcin_N?

[FinalFlash]

I don't need to transform myself in a Nordic because 1) I'm not nordicist 2) I'm already part Nordic since I'm mostly of British stock. But the fact is that your people speak a language imposed by conquerors upon you. And ''Brazilian'' is not ethnicity, retard. It's a nationality. Everyone can be Brazilian, even Armeniggers.

But the most important is that you don't try to escape from the debate making it about Brazilians. It's about Armenians, Iranians, Afghans, Pakis, Indians and related people.

And the majority of your population is a mix of every and any component under the sun. Yet you choose to focus on an exaggerate the steppe aspect. It's really telling and confirms to me that you are a complex Pardo.

[McCloskey]

10-15% isn't a huge amount to begin so let's maybe chill on the theatrics a little bit? Once again, it's not about what you score, it's also about what you don't score. Is this really that difficult of a concept to grasp? Why do you people put so much stock into Steppe admix while also ignoring another European component in Barcin_N?

THE DEBATE IS NOT ABOUT WHO IS MORE EUROPEAN (EVEN IF ARMENIANS ARE STILL LESS THAN MOST BRAZILIANS, what is irrelevant anyway since being ''European'' doesn't make you better). [the caps lock is to make your brain assimilate if faster]

We are discussing about Indo-Europeans.

[FinalFlash]

The hilarious thing is, is that hes confusing "Mixed race" with having different genetic components. In reality, mixed race is Caucasoid+Negroid for example. Most Armenians (And other west asian groups) are 95-98% Caucasoid.

Most Armenians are in fact 100% Caucasoid which baffles me when he called us "Armeniggers" considering that they've absorbed the semen of every race on this planet. Really telling when racial mongrels attack one of the more homogeneous groups of people on the planet, Iranians included.

[Token]

10-15% isn't a huge amount to begin so let's maybe chill on the theatrics a little bit? Once again, it's not about what you score, it's also about what you don't score. Is this really that difficult of a concept to grasp? Why do you people put so much stock into Steppe admix while also ignoring another European component in Barcin_N?
We are talking about Indo-Europeans here, not about Tyrsenian speakers. The vast majority of the Anatolian admixture in Armenia have no relation whatsoever to its Indo-European language and culture.

[FinalFlash]

THE DEBATE IS NOT ABOUT WHO IS MORE EUROPEAN (EVEN IF ARMENIANS ARE STILL LESS THAN MOST BRAZILIANS, what is irrelevant anyway since being ''European'' doesn't make you better). [the caps lock is to make your brain assimilate if faster]

We are discussing about Indo-Europeans.

You transformed this topic from an honest debate about genetics into ad hominem attacks like "brownoids" and "armeniggers". Kid, don't you dare try to take the high road in this argument here.

[McCloskey]

You transformed this topic from an honest debate about genetics into ad hominem attacks like "brownoids" and "armeniggers". Kid, don't you dare try to take the high road in this argument here.

Your comrade Zarzian started with ad hominem attacks some pages ago, check it out. I'm just responding to your attacks.

What I think is funny thing is seeing MENA's calling any Brazilian ''pardo'' even if most MENAs would pass exactly as pardos here. And a substantial portion of Brazilian population is whiter than 99,9% of MENAs. You guys are the true ''OWD'.

[Token]

You transformed this topic from an honest debate about genetics into ad hominem attacks like "brownoids" and "armeniggers". Kid, don't you dare try to take the high road in this argument here.

Let's be fair here, you are the one who began with the ad hominem against Brazilians.

[FinalFlash]

We are talking about Indo-Europeans here, not about Tyrsenian speakers. The vast majority of the Anatolian admixture in Armenia have no relation whatsoever to its Indo-European language and culture.

Yes, agreed. 10-15%(slightly more or less won't make a difference) isnt anywhere near the majority of our DNA. This is well established. My arguments were simply geared to show those who make claims that "Armenians dont have indo European DNA" that they're well, simply put, factually wrong. That's it. I didn't derail this discussion like that other complexed user.

[FinalFlash]

Your comrade Zarzian started with ad hominem attacks some pages ago, check it out. I'm just responding to your attacks.

What I think is funny thing is seeing MENA's calling any Brazilian ''pardo'' even if most MENAs would pass exactly as pardos here. And a substantial portion of Brazilian population is whiter than 99,9% of MENAs. You guys are the true ''OWD'.

And I keep correcting you why we aren't "MENAS"(bullshit term) using genetic facts based off of the newer, and quite frankly better nMonte Global25 calc. Yet you simply still persist on it and make ridiculous claims of how mixed-raced people are "whiter" than "MENAS"(again bullshit term that encompasses many different groups of people who are often times unrelated). If you don't like it, then the solution is quite simple, stop.

[Babak]

Your comrade Zarzian started with ad hominem attacks some pages ago, check it out. I'm just responding to your attacks.

What I think is funny thing is seeing MENA's calling any Brazilian ''pardo'' even if most MENAs would pass exactly as pardos here. And a substantial portion of Brazilian population is whiter than 99,9% of MENAs. You guys are the true ''OWD'.


^ That's what OWD is. No one cares whose whiter than who, in fact, you're the one that said IE=white. Nobody in this thread mentioned being more white except for you. But anyway, the fact of the matter is, is that Brazil is racially more mixed than any west asian country.

[McCloskey]

And I keep correcting you why we aren't "MENAS"(bullshit term) using genetic facts based off of the newer, and quite frankly better nMonte Global25 calc. Yet you simply still persist on it and make ridiculous claims of how mixed-raced people are "whiter" than "MENAS"(again bullshit term that encompasses many different groups of people who are often times unrelated). If you don't like it, then the solution is quite simple, stop.

Well, if someone is 80% German or Portuguese and 20% Amerindian that person is going to look closer to a German or Portuguese than an Armenian would. It's not hard to understand.

Anyway, even if being mixed isn't exactly a derogatory thing not all Brazilians are ''mixed race''. So you don't know what the fuck you're talking about.

You and other Near Easterners (better than MENA, right?) started to attack me with ad hominem for being Brazilian (even if you don't know how I look like, since a Brazilian can look like anything) because I said Northern Europeans are closer to Indo-Europeans. That's it. And that's what I find ironic because being mostly of British and Irish stock I probably look ''whiter'' than all of you guys calling me ''pardo''.

You started with the attacks, don't play the good boy.

[Token]

Still coping? Your people are mixed race. Having less or more(still not sure about this) Steppe admix isnt going to transform you into a Nord that you so desperately fantasize about.
Here is the Global25 of a pardo Brazilian member of this forum:

[1] "distance%=1.8558"

Beaker_Northern_Italy_no_steppe,49.8
Yamnaya_Samara,27
SSA,13.6
Iberomaurusian,3.6
Karitiana,3.6
CHG,2.2
Nganassan,0.4

[FinalFlash]

Well, if someone is 80% German or Portuguese and 20% Amerindian that person is going to look closer to a German or Portuguese than an Armenian would. It's not hard to understand.

Anyway, even if being mixed isn't exactly a derogatory thing not all Brazilians are ''mixed race''. So you don't know what the fuck you're talking about.

You and other Near Easterners (better than MENA, right?) started to attack me with ad hominem for being Brazilian (even if you don't know how I look like, since a Brazilian can look like anything) because I said Northern Europeans are closer to Indo-Europeans. That's it. And that's what I find ironic because being mostly of British and Irish stock I probably look ''whiter'' than all of you guys calling me ''pardo''.

You started with the attacks, don't play the good boy.

You're right. I did take a jab at you guys based on what you were implying about us. For that I apologize but that doesnt give you an excuse either to call us derogitary names either like brownoids. Which is funny considering the majority of us arent even actually brown skinned.

[FinalFlash]

Here is the Global25 of a pardo Brazilian member of this forum:

[1] "distance%=1.8558"

Beaker_Northern_Italy_no_steppe,49.8
Yamnaya_Samara,27
SSA,13.6
Iberomaurusian,3.6
Karitiana,3.6
CHG,2.2
Nganassan,0.4

Interesting. What is Karitiana, Iberomaurisian, and Nganassan? Also, is this result typical?

[McCloskey]

You're right. I did take a jab at you guys based on what you were implying about us. For that I apologize but that doesnt give you an excuse either to call us derogitary names either like brownoids. Which is funny considering the majority of us arent even actually brown skinned.

Fine for me, things are settled now.

[McCloskey]

Interesting. What is Karitiana, Iberomaurisian, and Nganassan? Also, is this result typical?

Karitiana is Amerindian, an Amerindian tribe that is 40% ANE and 60% Mongoloid. Nganassan is Siberian and Iberomaurisian is an ancient culture in North Africa from which some Iberians and North Africans carry admixture.

[Token]

Interesting. What is Karitiana, Iberomaurisian, and Nganassan? Also, is this result typical?

Karitiana is Amerindian, Nganassan is Siberian. Iberomaurusian is proportional to his Iberian ancestry. I don't know how typical these results are.

[FinalFlash]

Karitiana is Amerindian, Nganassan is Siberian. Iberomaurusian is proportional to his Iberian ancestry. I don't know how typical these results are.

Global 25 should have individual samples that you can run on nMonte. Just run them individually and post them here.

[Token]

Global 25 should have individual samples that you can run on nMonte. Just run them individually and post them here.

Global25 has no Brazilian samples. By the way, here are some Armenians for you:

Cluster 1

[1] "distance%=2.982"

Armenian:armenia102

Armenia_EBA,39.4
Levant_BA_North,29.8
Armenia_MLBA,26.4
Anatolia_BA,4.4

[1] "distance%=2.8713"

Armenian:armenia86

Armenia_EBA,43.8
Levant_BA_North,20
Anatolia_BA,19.6
Armenia_MLBA,15.2
Sintashta_MLBA,1.4

[1] "distance%=3.0493"

Armenian:GS000035124

Levant_BA_North,31.8
Armenia_EBA,31.4
Armenia_MLBA,26.6
Anatolia_BA,10.2

Cluster 2

[1] "distance%=2.0478"

Armenian:armenia139

Armenia_EBA,41.8
Levant_BA_North,38.4
Anatolia_BA,16
Armenia_MLBA,3.8

[1] "distance%=2.2812"

Armenian:armenia176

Armenia_EBA,63.6
Anatolia_BA,18.8
Levant_BA_South,17.4
Sintashta_MLBA,0.2

[1] "distance%=1.422"

Armenian:armenia279

Armenia_EBA,48.2
Levant_BA_North,37.4
Anatolia_BA,12.4
Armenia_MLBA,2

[1] "distance%=2.6575"

Armenian:GS000035125

Armenia_EBA,53.2
Levant_BA_North,43.4
Anatolia_BA,1.8
Sintashta_MLBA,1.6

F4-stats of Armenia MLBA.

Yoruba Sintashta Armenia_EBA Armenia_MLBA f4 0.000676 Z 1.395
Yoruba Potapovka Armenia_EBA Armenia_MLBA f4 0.000459 Z 1.275
Yoruba Corded_Ware_CE Armenia_EBA Armenia_MLBA f4 0.000383 Z 0.933
Yoruba Poltavka Armenia_EBA Armenia_MLBA f4 0.000373 Z 0.814
Yoruba Andronovo Armenia_EBA Armenia_MLBA f4 0.000214 Z 0.486

Like in Brazil, there seems to be a strong regional sub-structure in Armenia so your claims of a homogeneous genetic group doesn't seems to hold ground in light of genomics. Cluster 2 seems to have very tiny to no steppe admixture. Armenia_MLBA are in all likelihood your Indo-European ancestors.

[Babak]

Global 25 should have individual samples that you can run on nMonte. Just run them individually and post them here.

Lol dude dont suck up to these guys man. They're simply using steppe as the only indicator for your ancestry. The point of this thread is to show that these groups, despite lacking steppe admixture, are still Indo-europeans.

[FinalFlash]

Lol dude dont suck up to these guys man. They're simply using steppe as the only indicator for your ancestry.

No sucking up, just genuine interest in genetics.

[FinalFlash]

Global25 has no Brazilian samples. By the way, here are some Armenians for you:

Cluster 1

[1] "distance%=2.982"

Armenian:armenia102

Armenia_EBA,39.4
Levant_BA_North,29.8
Armenia_MLBA,26.4
Anatolia_BA,4.4

[1] "distance%=2.8713"

Armenian:armenia86

Armenia_EBA,43.8
Levant_BA_North,20
Anatolia_BA,19.6
Armenia_MLBA,15.2
Sintashta_MLBA,1.4

[1] "distance%=3.0493"

Armenian:GS000035124

Levant_BA_North,31.8
Armenia_EBA,31.4
Armenia_MLBA,26.6
Anatolia_BA,10.2

Cluster 2

[1] "distance%=2.0478"

Armenian:armenia139

Armenia_EBA,41.8
Levant_BA_North,38.4
Anatolia_BA,16
Armenia_MLBA,3.8

[1] "distance%=2.2812"

Armenian:armenia176

Armenia_EBA,63.6
Anatolia_BA,18.8
Levant_BA_South,17.4
Sintashta_MLBA,0.2

[1] "distance%=1.422"

Armenian:armenia279

Armenia_EBA,48.2
Levant_BA_North,37.4
Anatolia_BA,12.4
Armenia_MLBA,2

[1] "distance%=2.6575"

Armenian:GS000035125

Armenia_EBA,53.2
Levant_BA_North,43.4
Anatolia_BA,1.8
Sintashta_MLBA,1.6

F4-stats of Armenia MLBA.

Yoruba Sintashta Armenia_EBA Armenia_MLBA f4 0.000676 Z 1.395
Yoruba Potapovka Armenia_EBA Armenia_MLBA f4 0.000459 Z 1.275
Yoruba Corded_Ware_CE Armenia_EBA Armenia_MLBA f4 0.000383 Z 0.933
Yoruba Poltavka Armenia_EBA Armenia_MLBA f4 0.000373 Z 0.814
Yoruba Andronovo Armenia_EBA Armenia_MLBA f4 0.000214 Z 0.486

Like in Brazil, there seems to be a strong regional sub-structure in Armenia so your claims of a homogeneous genetic group doesn't seems to hold ground in light of genomics. Cluster 2 seems to have very tiny to no steppe admixture. Armenia_MLBA are in all likelihood your Indo-European ancestors.

I meant genetic homogeneity in a racial context. Btw, our genetic diversity is the reason why I feel we arent being represented as accurately as we should be. It's the reason why I messaged you, remember?

[FinalFlash]

Global25 has no Brazilian samples. By the way, here are some Armenians for you:

Cluster 1

[1] "distance%=2.982"

Armenian:armenia102

Armenia_EBA,39.4
Levant_BA_North,29.8
Armenia_MLBA,26.4
Anatolia_BA,4.4

[1] "distance%=2.8713"

Armenian:armenia86

Armenia_EBA,43.8
Levant_BA_North,20
Anatolia_BA,19.6
Armenia_MLBA,15.2
Sintashta_MLBA,1.4

[1] "distance%=3.0493"

Armenian:GS000035124

Levant_BA_North,31.8
Armenia_EBA,31.4
Armenia_MLBA,26.6
Anatolia_BA,10.2

Cluster 2

[1] "distance%=2.0478"

Armenian:armenia139

Armenia_EBA,41.8
Levant_BA_North,38.4
Anatolia_BA,16
Armenia_MLBA,3.8

[1] "distance%=2.2812"

Armenian:armenia176

Armenia_EBA,63.6
Anatolia_BA,18.8
Levant_BA_South,17.4
Sintashta_MLBA,0.2

[1] "distance%=1.422"

Armenian:armenia279

Armenia_EBA,48.2
Levant_BA_North,37.4
Anatolia_BA,12.4
Armenia_MLBA,2

[1] "distance%=2.6575"

Armenian:GS000035125

Armenia_EBA,53.2
Levant_BA_North,43.4
Anatolia_BA,1.8
Sintashta_MLBA,1.6

F4-stats of Armenia MLBA.

Yoruba Sintashta Armenia_EBA Armenia_MLBA f4 0.000676 Z 1.395
Yoruba Potapovka Armenia_EBA Armenia_MLBA f4 0.000459 Z 1.275
Yoruba Corded_Ware_CE Armenia_EBA Armenia_MLBA f4 0.000383 Z 0.933
Yoruba Poltavka Armenia_EBA Armenia_MLBA f4 0.000373 Z 0.814
Yoruba Andronovo Armenia_EBA Armenia_MLBA f4 0.000214 Z 0.486

Like in Brazil, there seems to be a strong regional sub-structure in Armenia so your claims of a homogeneous genetic group doesn't seems to hold ground in light of genomics. Cluster 2 seems to have very tiny to no steppe admixture. Armenia_MLBA are in all likelihood your Indo-European ancestors.

Can you give me the individual admixture averages based off these components?

CHG,
Barcin_N,
Seh_Gabi_ChL,
Levant_N,
Yamnaya_Kalmykia,

[Gangrel]

https://qph.fs.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-48936f14ef85e36e9a55c8aaf640d430

[Tauromachos]

Or are Indo-european speaking near-easterners just OWD and are Semites instead?

They are tradionaly seen as Indo European

Only genetically people might think so because at least recently many people have the notion that Indo Europeans originaly were only light people
who invaded these countries and imposed their language on a local pre Indoeuropean population.

I don't know if anyone can realy prove or disprove this notion

Even Hitler viewed Iranians as Indoeuropeans despited that he was a Nordicist and thought of blond
Nordics as Indoeuropeans in their purest ancient form he accepted that Indoeuropean can have also other phenotypes


In the Bible Japhet had 3 sons
Shem,Japhet and Ham

The Semitic speaking people are descended from Sem and the Indoeupean speaking ones from Japhet

[Tauromachos]

delete

[Tauromachos]

delete

[Tauromachos]

delete

[Arsen_]

Armenians definitely don't pass as White here, most of you guys qwould be taken for (dark) pardos. A lighter parda, like the one I posted above, is much more white looking than 99% of Armenians. You guys are brownoids, accept it, MENA boy.

Armenians do not care about passing white and there is nothing bad to be brown or MENA.

MENA are proud people and they are children of decent parents, unlike multi-generation nordo-negroid whore's abortions of Brazilian monkeys. If there were no MENA people you guys were still jumping on trees.

[Tauromachos]

Armenians do not care about passing white and

Armenian range in my experience from being white skinned same with general Europeans
till light brown




there is nothing bad to be brown or MENA.

Of course not
In regions with alot UV its even good

[Arsen_]

We are talking about Indo-Europeans here, not about Tyrsenian speakers. The vast majority of the Anatolian admixture in Armenia have no relation whatsoever to its Indo-European language and culture.

You'd better not talk like you are a speaker of truth of last instance. There are many different hypotheses about the origin of Indo-Europeans and their language. And recently by the way a large international group of scientists lead by Dr. Quentin Atkinson from the University of Auckland in New Zealand finally proved the so-called Anatolian (ancient Armenian Highlands) hypothesis i.e. theory of the ancestral home of the Indo-European language.

As for steppe hypotheses to me it's obviously wrong. It was especially ridiculous when your nordo-negroid fellow mentioned Mari people of Russia like epitome of Indo-Europeans. Mari is utterly undeveloped partly mongoloid finno-ugrics tribe living in Russia who untill the 20th century worshiped stones and trees, lived in deep forests like african pigmeys and in terms of contribution to the world history are right next to african pigmeys.