Who are more Germanic -- African Americans, Iberians, or Sicilians?

[Sikeliot]

African Americans are on average 80-85% SSA, and the rest European, most of which is English, Scottish, and Irish.

I would imagine that unless Sicilians or Iberians are 10% or so Germanic, African Americans have to be the most actually descended from Germanic Europeans of the bunch.

[Token]

Probably about the same, if we are to isolate Iron Age Germanic admixture.

[Leto]

This woman is very Germanic, she has known Scottish roots

https://youtu.be/GSNZOxwyi44

69% SSA
31% Europe (28% England, Wales & Northwestern Europe, 2% Ireland & Scotland, 1% Germanic Europe)

[Ruggery]

The African Americans only if they have British descent, the Iberians continue with 5% of Germanic genetics and finally the Sicilians of the latter only come up with the possible genetics of the Normans.

[J. Ketch]

Iberians, they share the most blood in common with Germanic people.

[Token]

Iberians, they share the most blood in common with Germanic people.

He is probably talking about actual ancestry from Germanic people.

[Farrukh Hormizd]

germanic isolated, its afram > sicilian > iberian, but if we're measuring which has more genetic affinity with germanic peoples then the list would be the exact opposite sequence.

[Ruggery]

germanic isolated, its afram > sicilian > iberian, but if we're measuring which has more genetic affinity with germanic peoples then the list would be the exact opposite sequence.

The Sicilians have no more Germanic blood than the Iberians.

[Sikeliot]

He is probably talking about actual ancestry from Germanic people.

Yes, correct.

[Ibericus]

obviously iberians have the most, then follows the Aframs who are about 15-20% colonial admixed, then sicilians

[J. Ketch]

He is probably talking about actual ancestry from Germanic people.
OK, but I would consider most direct Germanic ancestry and most 'Germanic' two different things.

[Damião de Góis]

Considering "Germanic" as having ancestry from any germanic speaking country, then i would say African-Americans. I would say they are also more germanic than most non-germanic europeans, nevermind iberians or sicilians.

[Asheffar]

Iberians. Think about catalan/basque or asturians

[Ayetooey]

The African Americans.

[Latinus]

Direct:Germanic.
Non-direct:Iberians, I think.

[Sikeliot]

Considering "Germanic" as having ancestry from any germanic speaking country, then i would say African-Americans. I would say they are also more germanic than most non-germanic europeans, nevermind iberians or sicilians.

African Americans have all of the types of Germanic input in the British Isles (Danish Viking, Norse, Angles, Saxons, etc) mixed with Celtic for their European ancestry.

[Avgvstvs]

African Americans have all of the types of Germanic input in the British Isles (Danish Viking, Norse, Angles, Saxons, etc) mixed with Celtic for their European ancestry.They're black though

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[Token]

African Americans have all of the types of Germanic input in the British Isles (Danish Viking, Norse, Angles, Saxons, etc) mixed with Celtic for their European ancestry.

The problem is, considering that Brits are around 30% Germanic, if African-Americans are 20% British on average they would be only 6% Iron Age Germanic. I'm pretty sure Iberians and Sicilians would have more than that.

[Peterski]

considering that Brits are around 30% Germanic

Slaveowners could be more Germanic than average, though.

[Token]

Slaveowners could be more Germanic than average, though.

What makes you think so?

[Smeagol]

Slaveowners could be more Germanic than average, though.

No they weren't. Many of the slaveowners were even free blacks.

[Peterski]

What makes you think so?

Weren't they descended from the Norman* ruling class of Britain?

BTW on this forum we have user SvartVarg who is such "Germanic British":

https://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?197687-Do-quot-pure-Anglo-Saxons-quot-still-exist-in-modern-England-(challenge)&p=5104040#post5104040

She told me she knows some English people with very Germanic results.

And they are from old Anglo-Saxon or Norman families which didn't mix.

=====

*Okay I guess Normans were probably heavily mixed with Gallic Celts?

[Peterski]

She told me she knows some English people with very Germanic results.

And they are from old Anglo-Saxon or Norman families which didn't mix.

Some of them really didn't mix (only few inbred families, but still there is such a class of people):


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LJZIBx1fpUU

[Avgvstvs]

Some of them really didn't mix (only few inbred families, but still there is such a class of people):


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LJZIBx1fpUUI like that movie

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[Tauromachos]

Mainland Greeks

[Marolinepint]

I don't know about Afro-Americans, but why do people vote for Iberians over Sicilians? Is it because they look ''whiter'' and you associate white with Germanic? Are you mentally challenged?

https://i.imgur.com/41qSBB9.gif

[Teutonski]

I don't know about Afro-Americans, but why do people vote for Iberians over Sicilians? Is it because they look ''whiter'' and you associate white with Germanic? Are you mentally challenged?

https://i.imgur.com/41qSBB9.gif
https://www.kinderweltreise.de/fileadmin/_processed_/c/e/csm_portugal_sueben-reich_bb79ecf879.jpg

[Marolinepint]

https://www.kinderweltreise.de/fileadmin/_processed_/c/e/csm_portugal_sueben-reich_bb79ecf879.jpg

Yeah, not gonna beat this:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norman_conquest_of_southern_Italy

[Avgvstvs]

https://www.kinderweltreise.de/fileadmin/_processed_/c/e/csm_portugal_sueben-reich_bb79ecf879.jpgSicily was conquered by the Normans thoughhttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190106/e4da945f640c7b3e148dbbfe8c3fa426.jpg

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[Wanderer]

I don't know about Afro-Americans, but why do people vote for Iberians over Sicilians? Is it because they look ''whiter'' and you associate white with Germanic? Are you mentally challenged?

https://i.imgur.com/41qSBB9.gif
That map is nonsense.

No proud, self-respecting Italian wants Germanic blood in his veins. Acknowledge it, of course, if it happens to be present. But it's pathetic how some Italians seem to pine for it.

[Sikeliot]

The problem is, considering that Brits are around 30% Germanic, if African-Americans are 20% British on average they would be only 6% Iron Age Germanic. I'm pretty sure Iberians and Sicilians would have more than that.

Doubtful that Sicilians would. Not sure about Iberians.

[Sikeliot]

That map is nonsense.

No proud, self-respecting Italian wants Germanic blood in his veins. Acknowledge it, of course, if it happens to be present. But it's pathetic how some Italians seem to pine for it.

Also that is y-dna, whereas my question is about autosomal DNA. Sicilians have marginal if any Germanic autosomal DNA because by the time Normans arrived in Sicily they had been heavily mixed with Gallic peoples.

[Token]

Doubtful that Sicilians would. Not sure about Iberians.

Western Sicilians certainly would.

[Sikeliot]

Western Sicilians certainly would.

Not Palermo, Agrigento, etc. Trapani is another story, they're an outlier and don't plot with the rest of Sicily but closer to people from Abruzzo.

[Phenix]

Are not Afro-Americans more mixed with Irish rather than Germanics?

[Token]

Not Palermo, Agrigento, etc. Trapani is another story, they're an outlier and don't plot with the rest of Sicily but closer to people from Abruzzo.

Do we have any formal samples from Palermo and Agrigento?

[Sikeliot]

Do we have any formal samples from Palermo and Agrigento?

None have been academically sampled but from those I personally have of almost 50 samples, they are the same as the Maltese. They do not have any sign of excess North European.

[Sikeliot]

I actually do not think Sicilians require any Germanic input to be modeled using nMonte or GEDmatch or anything. I think you can capture them solely with North Italy Bell Beaker, Minoan, Levantine, and North African.

[Avgvstvs]

I actually do not think Sicilians require any Germanic input to be modeled using nMonte or GEDmatch or anything. I think you can capture them solely with North Italy Bell Beaker, Minoan, Levantine, and North African.You really like this Sicilian Levantine thing

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[Sikeliot]

You really like this Sicilian Levantine thing

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It's a proven genetic fact. Germanic admixture on the other hand on an autosomal level (i.e. something that can be quantified in percentages of total genome) is not. No study has shown on an autosomal level that Sicilians have Norman DNA. It is likely only reflected in the y-dna but autosomally has been reduced to nothing.

[Avgvstvs]

It's a proven genetic fact. Germanic admixture on the other hand on an autosomal level (i.e. something that can be quantified in percentages of total genome) is not. No study has shown on an autosomal level that Sicilians have Norman DNA. It is likely only reflected in the y-dna but autosomally has been reduced to nothing.I was not necessarely talking about genetics....i noticed you like comparing Sicilians to Levantines.....you also said you're lighter for Sicily...is that you in your avatar?

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[Grace O'Malley]

Are not Afro-Americans more mixed with Irish rather than Germanics?

You think Irish Catholics owned the plantations and were the main slave-holders? Most Irish Catholics didn't arrive in the US till the potato famine approx 1850s. They weren't the main population mixing with slaves. Plantation owners were overwhelmingly Protestants of English and Scots-Irish descent.

[Token]

I actually do not think Sicilians require any Germanic input to be modeled using nMonte or GEDmatch or anything. I think you can capture them solely with North Italy Bell Beaker, Minoan, Levantine, and North African.

There is no way to differentiate Germanic admixture from Bell Beaker and other Northwestern Europe related stuff with ADMIXTURE. We will only know for sure after a lot of samples from Italy across space and time. Unfortunately, scholars are more interested in locating the theoretical, ethereal PIE homeland.

[Sikeliot]

I was not necessarely talking about genetics....i noticed you like comparing Sicilians to Levantines.....you also said you're lighter for Sicily...is that you in your avatar?

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I am mixed with Polish.

[Avgvstvs]

I am mixed with Polish.I've been to Sicily many times and trust me,you wouldn't stand out among Sicilians.....at least that's what i think looking at your avatar.....

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[Licantropo]

I don't know about Afro-Americans, but why do people vote for Iberians over Sicilians? Is it because they look ''whiter'' and you associate white with Germanic? Are you mentally challenged?

https://i.imgur.com/41qSBB9.gif

I was about tho post the same map. Don't know why people suddenly assume Iberians. Must be Anthrotardism.

[Tauromachos]

I've been to Sicily many times and trust me,you wouldn't stand out among Sicilians.....at least that's what i think looking at your avatar.....

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Its not him in the avatar

He is actually darker than that dude in his avatar

[Avgvstvs]

Its not him in the avatar

He is actually darker than that dude in his avatarOh ok i've never seen him actually

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[Tauromachos]

Oh ok i've never seen him actually

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He is 1/4 Polish or something from his mother's side but he doesn't look it at all
he looks like a normal Med type either Portugese or Italian with zero Slavic.

[Sikeliot]

He is 1/4 Polish or something from his mother's side but he doesn't look it at all
he looks like a normal Med type either Portugese or Italian with zero Slavic.

I don't look very Iberian. There is a sharpness to my facial structure which stands out.

[Sikeliot]

I was about tho post the same map. Don't know why people suddenly assume Iberians. Must be Anthrotardism.

Again that is haplogroups not autosomal. I am speaking of autosomal input. The Germanic input in Sicily on an autosomal level is reduced down to nothing.

[Avgvstvs]

He is 1/4 Polish or something from his mother's side but he doesn't look it at all
he looks like a normal Med type either Portugese or Italian with zero Slavic.I looked for threads on him but there's nothing here....deleted?

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[Licantropo]

Again that is haplogroups not autosomal. I am speaking of autosomal input. The Germanic input in Sicily on an autosomal level is reduced down to nothing.

So autosomally how much Germanic input Iberians have?

[Sikeliot]

So autosomally how much Germanic input Iberians have?

Very little.

I think both Sicilians and Iberians, if they have any Germanic autosomal admixture is in the single digits. I think some people probably have none.

[Marolinepint]

Again that is haplogroups not autosomal. I am speaking of autosomal input. The Germanic input in Sicily on an autosomal level is reduced down to nothing.

One can imagine how little Germanic aDNA Iberians must have then, their showing even less Germanic y-haplogroups than Sicilians. So why do you seem to suggest Iberians have more? Are you that anthrotard to not realize the Iberian ''northern''-shift is due to Beaker and Celtic people? Do you also think that pre-Anglo-Saxon Iron Age Britons were northern-shifted compared to modern Sicilians because of Germanic DNA?

[Sikeliot]

One can imagine how little Germanic aDNA Iberians must have then, their showing even less Germanic y-haplogroups than Sicilians. So why do you seem to suggest Iberians have more? Are you that anthrotard to not realize the Iberian ''northern''-shift is due to Beaker and Celtic people? Do you also think that pre-Anglo-Saxon Iron Age Britons were northern-shifted because of Germanic DNA?

Sicilians do not have a northern shift. So their Germanic input autosomally is reduced to almost nothing. Autosomal DNA matters more than haplogroups. That Norman ancestor with haplogroup I1 has likely been dissolved into the gene pool by mixing first with Gallic people in France and then with Italic, Greek, Levantine and North african mixed Sicilians. It's almost nothing.

As for Iberians, they aren't mixed with Germanic either.

[Tauromachos]

I looked for threads on him but there's nothing here....deleted?

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He posts his pictures once in a while but after he deletes them

[Phenix]

You think Irish Catholics owned the plantations and were the main slave-holders? Most Irish Catholics didn't arrive in the US till the potato famine approx 1850s. They weren't the main population mixing with slaves. Plantation owners were overwhelmingly Protestants of English and Scots-Irish descent.

You misinterpreted my question, I thought Irish immigrants in late 19th century and Aframs had closer relation and cohabitation because of their poor social condition than for example Scandinavians, of course most of the plantations were owned by WASP.
Irish people were in fact more of a victim of forced labor in Caribbeans alongside Africans, hence why I thought Aframs could have mixed more with them rather than Germanics.

[Latinus]

Oh ok i've never seen him actually

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Sikeliot has posted his pics before, he looks more Italian than Portuguese or Polish, my opinion.

[Avgvstvs]

Sikeliot has posted his pics before, he looks more Italian than Portuguese or Polish, my opinion.Never seem him.....now i'm getting curious

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[Tauromachos]

I don't look very Iberian. There is a sharpness to my facial structure which stands out.

I think you pass as Portugese without problem

You are basicly a Gracile Med i believe, this type is common for both Italy and Iberia

Filho for example is Gracile Med too and looks a bit similar to you

Like an older version of you

[Sikeliot]

I think you pass as Portugese without problem

You are basicly a Gracile Med i believe, this type is common for both Italy and Iberia

Filho for example is Gracile Med too and looks a bit similar to you

Like an older version of you

He is younger than me i am pretty sure? Also his facial structure is very different than mine.

[Tauromachos]

He is younger than me i am pretty sure? Also his facial structure is very different than mine.

Yes he looks more robust

You look younger than him

[Avgvstvs]

Next he'll post his pics just tell me: i'm very curious

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[Sikeliot]

Next he'll post his pics just tell me: i'm very curious

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My avatar photo is close to how I look but I am darker.

[Tauromachos]

Next he'll post his pics just tell me: i'm very curious

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Well maybe try and ask him in PM

Just say you want to see how he looks like
so that you can classify or place him

I think he might send you his pics

He is always interested to see what people think about his look

[Avgvstvs]

My avatar photo is close to how I look but I am darker.Ok

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[Cristiano viejo]

Iberians. Think about catalan/basque or asturians

Basques are for sure the Iberians that less contact with Germanics had, and less Germanic ancestry have.

[Bogdan]

African American > Sicilian > Iberian

[Ruggery]

Very little.

I think both Sicilians and Iberians, if they have any Germanic autosomal admixture is in the single digits. I think some people probably have none.

The Iberians have a maximum of 5% Germanic genetics with the Sicilians I have no idea how much they have.

[Grace O'Malley]

You misinterpreted my question, I thought Irish immigrants in late 19th century and Aframs had closer relation and cohabitation because of their poor social condition than for example Scandinavians, of course most of the plantations were owned by WASP.
Irish people were in fact more of a victim of forced labor in Caribbeans alongside Africans, hence why I thought Aframs could have mixed more with them rather than Germanics.

Irish immigrants didn't mix with Aframs particularly. Most Aframs got their white admixture from the slave days and looking at 23andMe and Ancestry results their British admixture is British in the majority which makes sense i.e. on 23andMe most have Great Britain under their British & Irish category when an area is listed because they usually don't get a very large amount anyway. Not sure what you mean by "Germanics" either?

I hope my tone is okay. I'm don't want to come across as rude. :) Historically most Irish went to the urban areas especially places on the Eastern seaboard and Chicago.

The facts of the matter is that the Irish and whites on the lower socioeconomic ladder in the US were mostly in competition with African-Americans. There was a lot of antagonism between these groups. People tend to romanticise things but unfortunately people didn't always treat each other well. It was not only Irish at that time that were in competition for these jobs but also Germans and other poor whites. These people were antagonistic against black Americans.

https://www.loc.gov/teachers/classroommaterials/presentationsandactivities/presentations/immigration/irish6.html

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicago_race_riot_of_1919

[FilhoV]

Definitely African Americans especially the ones in the Northeast they usually tend to be 30% European and usually British.