Germany vs Poland, who is more blond?

[Septentrion]

Whom do you think is fairer?

[Hrvoje Vukčić Hrvatinić]

I think Germans have more light blonds and more black haired people at the same time compared with Poles.
Also more redheads. Poles are probably more homogenous when it comes to hair colour.

[Satem]

Germans

[Nucerian]

Dunno bout Germoney but i'd say in my vicinity (Greater Poland, albeit very close to the Upper Silesia) most people are more fair than dark, by that i mean more light eyes than dark, majority have light brown, dark blond and medium brown hair. I daresay no ethnic Poles here are black haired, few are dark brown haired. Natural blond is also not that common but can be spotted more often than dark brown. Skin is pretty light. IMO the more southeast you go the darker people are (pontids, gorids, carpathids, few dinarids, mixtures of these types) and the more north and west you go the lighter people are (Baltids, few Faelids and Nordids, mixtures of these types). Major cities contain every types but i would say light pigmented people are the majority.

[Veslan]

Relatively recent statistics on hair colour in Poland:
Light Blond (13.7%)
Dark Blond (44.2%)
Brown (22.6%)
Auburn (1%)
Blond-red (3.9%)
Red (3.8%)
Black (however, they probably included Dark Brown hair too, because purely black hair is rather rare) (10.8%)

source https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1872497312001810
I can't find any recent study on Germany, but maps strongly imply the blond hair colour percentage strongly changes in the South, when it's much less frequent, and because of that, my guess is that Poland might be a bit more blond:
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c3/Eupedia_europe_blondism_map.jpg

[Balrogs & Bagginses]

Similar levels, I would say, though regional areas will vary somewhat.

[visar]

I think Germans are fairer in hair color. Light eyes im not sure. Dark-brown hair is pretty common in Poland. Germanics overall are fairer than Slavs in my opinion.

[Dandelion]

Germany. Poles have a swarthy undertone and embrace multiculturalism more, but under their honest accords only. Germans pretend to be multicultural and are forced to be so from above (which they sheepishly follow).

[Veslan]

Germans pretend to be multicultural and are forced to be so from above (which they sheepishly follow).

https://www.euractiv.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2015/09/refugees_welcome_berlin.jpeg
http://i.hurimg.com/i/hdn/75/0x0/59c90c5445d2a027e83cf954.jpg
https://s.yimg.com/ny/api/res/1.2/O7ucK2xOKlap2ZcpDwx7Lg--~A/YXBwaWQ9aGlnaGxhbmRlcjtzbT0xO3c9ODAwO2lsPXBsYW5l/http://media.zenfs.com/en_us/News/afp.com/3b5224d7e081a7fc074b10db705e14386a0191a2.jpg
https://www.infowars.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/refugees.jpg
https://www.amnesty.org.nz/sites/default/files/styles/main_image_style/public/germany_resettlement.jpg?itok=JPl7E_sz
https://www.gordonwelters.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/51_201509087648.jpg
Yeah, so much "forced to be multicultural" :rotfl:

Also what has an alleged "swarthy undertone" to do with hair colour?

[Dandelion]

https://www.euractiv.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2015/09/refugees_welcome_berlin.jpeg
http://i.hurimg.com/i/hdn/75/0x0/59c90c5445d2a027e83cf954.jpg
https://s.yimg.com/ny/api/res/1.2/O7ucK2xOKlap2ZcpDwx7Lg--~A/YXBwaWQ9aGlnaGxhbmRlcjtzbT0xO3c9ODAwO2lsPXBsYW5l/http://media.zenfs.com/en_us/News/afp.com/3b5224d7e081a7fc074b10db705e14386a0191a2.jpg
https://www.infowars.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/refugees.jpg
https://www.amnesty.org.nz/sites/default/files/styles/main_image_style/public/germany_resettlement.jpg?itok=JPl7E_sz
https://www.gordonwelters.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/51_201509087648.jpg
Yeah, so much "forced to be multicultural" :rotfl:

Also what has an alleged "swarthy undertone" to do with hair colour?

Merkel is boss and the German virtue signals to try to be at the best standing with their leader. Don't be mistaken, they'll turn into nazi nutjobs in a heartbeat.

[Hrvoje Vukčić Hrvatinić]

There's plenty of guys in South Germany and Austria who are not lighter than this guy. He looks fairly typical for region imo.

https://c8.alamy.com/comp/KX7DNY/stuttgart-germany-4th-jan-2018-uwe-gensheimer-player-of-the-german-KX7DNY.jpg
https://www.berliner-zeitung.de/image/25580188/2x1/940/470/21ed7d4c75adebec4b439f2e0f8aeec0/Hr/71-111058291--null--19-01-2017-19-00-28-769-.jpg

[Peterski]

Don't be mistaken, they'll turn into nazi nutjobs in a heartbeat.

Check this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GUlM2a2tsOM#t=3350

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arthur_Szyk#/media/File:Arthur_Szyk_(1894-1951)._Anti-Christ_(1942),_New_York.jpg

^^^ By: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arthur_Szyk#In_reborn_Poland

[Veslan]

German virtue
Error 404: Not found

[michal3141]

In Poland light blond hair are not very common among adults. On the other hand, dark blond or light brown hair are quite common.
I think the percentage of light blond hair might be higher in Germany but the percentage of fair (light blond + dark blond or light brown) is probably higher in Poland.
I agree with a comment by Nato.

[Sandman]

they'll turn into nazi nutjobs in a heartbeat.

Germany, since 1945, are under American occupation. In the 20th century, the Americans crushed the Germans twice. They will do nothing to expose themselves to the wrath of the United States and their Jewish masters.

[Sandman]

Relatively recent statistics on hair colour in Poland:
Light Blond (13.7%)
Dark Blond (44.2%)
Brown (22.6%)
Auburn (1%)
Blond-red (3.9%)
Red (3.8%)
Black (however, they probably included Dark Brown hair too, because purely black hair is rather rare) (10.8%)

source https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1872497312001810
I can't find any recent study on Germany, but maps strongly imply the blond hair colour percentage strongly changes in the South, when it's much less frequent, and because of that, my guess is that Poland might be a bit more blond:
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c3/Eupedia_europe_blondism_map.jpg

If this data is true, then Poles are one of the most fair-haired nations in Europe and in the world.

[Blondie]

Poles have a swarthy undertone and embrace multiculturalism more, but under their honest accords only.

Wut? Poles are 1000000x times more patriotic than germans. Can you image this in Germany?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pDHvwz0jRuw

[Supercomputer]

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c3/Eupedia_europe_blondism_map.jpg

If this data is true, then Poles are one of the most fair-haired nations in Europe and in the world.

Dunno why people keep posting this map from Eupedia. It's just a paste of Coon's map of hair AND EYES mashed together with Peter Frosts map which is wrong (Italy's heel blonder than Normandy) and doesn't have public source.

But other than that, yes Poles don't have many pure darks. Neither in eyes no in hair.

[The Blade]

Polish people are blonder.

[Floralys]

The Germans, but the difference is not that big.
Nevertheless, the Poles are blonder than the South Germans and Austrians.

[Supercomputer]

The Germans, but the difference is not that big.
Nevertheless, the Poles are blonder than the South Germans and Austrians.

This

[Lucas]

Relatively recent statistics on hair colour in Poland:
Light Blond (13.7%)
Dark Blond (44.2%)
Brown (22.6%)
Auburn (1%)
Blond-red (3.9%)
Red (3.8%)
Black (however, they probably included Dark Brown hair too, because purely black hair is rather rare) (10.8%)

source https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1872497312001810
I can't find any recent study on Germany, but maps strongly imply the blond hair colour percentage strongly changes in the South, when it's much less frequent, and because of that, my guess is that Poland might be a bit more blond:
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c3/Eupedia_europe_blondism_map.jpg


This study is greatly biased becasue it is partly or mainly based on self-assesment of hair color by study participants. We know how, especially women are biased about their real hair color. Common people especially are useless in dividing between light brown and dark blond category. I'm not sure also how this dermatologist who examined some Polish participants was trained. If he used Martin scale for hair color? I guess not. If it was his observation only it is bullshit, becasue without proper scale to compare he was biased becasue during the day even level of natural light can change color perception.

Only up to date anthropometric journey in Poland was in 1955-1956 when they examined about 13 722 Polish men and 14 043 women form all regions - Górny S., Zdjęcie antropometryczne Polski. Cz. 1: Pomiary ludności dorosłej z lat 1955-56 [w:] Materiały i Prace Antropologiczne, nr 84, 1972

As you see this study wasn't biased to prove great Polish blondness and was made by real anthropologists.

men 17-67 (Martin scale)


light blond (A-L, I, III) 6.74%
dark blond and red (this minimally) (M-Q, II,V-VI ) 23.05%
light brown (R-S) 13.05%
medium brown (T-U) 26.51%
dark brown mainly, pure black minimal (V-Y) 30.65%


women 17-67 (Martin scale)


light blond (A-L, I, III) 6.32%
dark blond and red (this minimally (M-Q, II,V-VI ) 23.8%
light brown (R-S) 14.51%
medium brown (T-U) 26.61%
dark brown mainly, pure black minimal (V-Y) 28.76%



Map is wrong. It is colorized Coon map of both hair and eyes color mixed with Peter Frost map.

[Prinses]

The Germans

[Supercomputer]

You're right. Only small error: scale is Fisher-Saller; Martin is for eye color

[renaissance12]

Relatively recent statistics on hair colour in Poland:
Light Blond (13.7%)
Dark Blond (44.2%)
Brown (22.6%)
Auburn (1%)
Blond-red (3.9%)
Red (3.8%)
Black (however, they probably included Dark Brown hair too, because purely black hair is rather rare) (10.8%)

source https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1872497312001810
I can't find any recent study on Germany, but maps strongly imply the blond hair colour percentage strongly changes in the South, when it's much less frequent, and because of that, my guess is that Poland might be a bit more blond:
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c3/Eupedia_europe_blondism_map.jpg

Again.. England is not a blonde country...The maps about hair color that are around internet are usually very innacurate and created by Americans in the 19 century

[Lucas]

You're right. Only small error: scale is Fisher-Saller; Martin is for eye color

Yes..... True.

[Septentrion]

Relatively recent statistics on hair colour in Poland:
Light Blond (13.7%)
Dark Blond (44.2%)
Brown (22.6%)
Auburn (1%)
Blond-red (3.9%)
Red (3.8%)
Black (however, they probably included Dark Brown hair too, because purely black hair is rather rare) (10.8%)

source https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1872497312001810
I can't find any recent study on Germany, but maps strongly imply the blond hair colour percentage strongly changes in the South, when it's much less frequent, and because of that, my guess is that Poland might be a bit more blond:
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c3/Eupedia_europe_blondism_map.jpg

By this genetic map, most of Germany and Poland are similar, but South Germany seems much darker.
https://unsafeharbour.files.wordpress.com/2012/02/map-europepigmentationgenes.jpg

[Septentrion]

Again.. England is not a blonde country...The maps about hair color that are around internet are usually very innacurate and created by Americans in the 19 century

Idiotic! England is a light-haired country as a whole, not necessarily blond in the Scandinavian sense. It is much more blonde than Italy! No comparison, what is your point? This is another map based on genes for light hair and light eyes, way more precise than the 19th century one. It is based on 21st century study! OK!!! Look at Italy and then England!
https://unsafeharbour.files.wordpress.com/2012/02/map-europepigmentationgenes.jpg

[Septentrion]

This study is greatly biased becasue it is partly or mainly based on self-assesment of hair color by study participants. We know how, especially women are biased about their real hair color. Common people especially are useless in dividing between light brown and dark blond category. I'm not sure also how this dermatologist who examined some Polish participants was trained. If he used Martin scale for hair color? I guess not. If it was his observation only it is bullshit, becasue without proper scale to compare he was biased becasue during the day even level of natural light can change color perception.

Only up to date anthropometric journey in Poland was in 1955-1956 when they examined about 13 722 Polish men and 14 043 women form all regions - Górny S., Zdjęcie antropometryczne Polski. Cz. 1: Pomiary ludności dorosłej z lat 1955-56 [w:] Materiały i Prace Antropologiczne, nr 84, 1972

As you see this study wasn't biased to prove great Polish blondness and was made by real anthropologists.

men 17-67 (Martin scale)


light blond (A-L, I, III) 6.74%
dark blond and red (this minimally) (M-Q, II,V-VI ) 23.05%
light brown (R-S) 13.05%
medium brown (T-U) 26.51%
dark brown mainly, pure black minimal (V-Y) 30.65%


women 17-67 (Martin scale)


light blond (A-L, I, III) 6.32%
dark blond and red (this minimally (M-Q, II,V-VI ) 23.8%
light brown (R-S) 14.51%
medium brown (T-U) 26.61%
dark brown mainly, pure black minimal (V-Y) 28.76%



Map is wrong. It is colorized Coon map of both hair and eyes color mixed with Peter Frost map.

No, regardless, most Poles are light-haired too. So that map is not really wrong. It is showing Poland within the light-haired zone.

[Supercomputer]

Idiotic! England is a light-haired country as a whole, not necessarily blond in the Scandinavian sense. It is much more blonde than Italy! No comparison, what is your point? This is another map based on genes for light hair and light eyes, way more precise than the 19th century one. It is based on 21st century study! OK!!! Look at Italy and then England!
https://unsafeharbour.files.wordpress.com/2012/02/map-europepigmentationgenes.jpg

According to this "map" Bulgarians should be equally blond as Slovenians, Russians blonder than Swedes and Romanians significantly darker than Bulgarians. This map doesn't show blond hair nor light eyes.

[Septentrion]

According to this "map" Bulgarians should be equally blond as Slovenians, Russians blonder than Swedes and Romanians significantly darker than Bulgarians. This map doesn't show blond hair nor light eyes.

No are you blind? Russia? Do you know how big Russia is? No way! It just shows that there is a area in western Russia with a high depigmentation level, a continuation of "Baltic" pigmentation. Only the Black Sea coastal regions of Romania to be darker than most of Bulgaria, while the very northeast and Moldova to be much lighter. The map is based on genes for light hair and light eyes. Are you O.K.? If you don't know much about the genes, ask. Don't say a stupid thing like Renaissance.

[Hrvoje Vukčić Hrvatinić]

Idiotic! England is a light-haired country as a whole, not necessarily blond in the Scandinavian sense. It is much more blonde than Italy! No comparison, what is your point? This is another map based on genes for light hair and light eyes, way more precise than the 19th century one. It is based on 21st century study! OK!!! Look at Italy and then England!
https://unsafeharbour.files.wordpress.com/2012/02/map-europepigmentationgenes.jpg

Absolute bullshit, any many countries weren't even sampled.

[renaissance12]

Idiotic! England is a light-haired country as a whole, not necessarily blond in the Scandinavian sense. It is much more blonde than Italy! No comparison, what is your point? This is another map based on genes for light hair and light eyes, way more precise than the 19th century one. It is based on 21st century study! OK!!! Look at Italy and then England!
https://unsafeharbour.files.wordpress.com/2012/02/map-europepigmentationgenes.jpg

Look at your Italian prime "queens".....

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/c4/Elio_Di_Rupo_PES-Kongress_2014.jpg/242px-Elio_Di_Rupo_PES-Kongress_2014.jpg

https://www.repstatic.it/content/nazionale/img/2018/09/26/113802245-c7bb8890-cd2a-4949-887a-174387c776cc.jpg

[Sandman]

For comparison of pigmentation, here are the Polish and German teams in ski jumping.

German team:
Markus Eisenbichler
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/28/2017-10-03_FIS_SGP_2017_Klingenthal_Markus_Eisenbichler_00 4.jpg

Karl Geiger
http://66.media.tumblr.com/4777e838ecb1f9d494c0194dcb3eaaf3/tumblr_mgfim6BUye1s32dgdo1_500.jpg

Andreas Wellinger
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/5d/20150927_FIS_Summer_Grand_Prix_Hinzenbach_4599.jpg

Stephan Leyhe
https://www.skijumping.pl/newsy/zdjecia/powieksz/leyhe_2015-11-21_11-20-15.jpg

Richard Freitag
http://sportowyraport.pl/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/richard-freitag.jpg

Polish team:
Kamil Stoch
https://d-pt.ppstatic.pl/kadry/k/r/1/e8/be/5a9c28526ba3a_o,size,969x565,q,71,h,5bfc49.jpg

Piotr Żyła
https://www.transfergo.com/en/blog/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/DSC00058-retouched-1024x725.jpg

Dawid Kubacki
http://cdn12.se.smcloud.net/t/photos/t/250455/dawid-kubacki-pakuje_23134928.jpg

Stefan Hula
https://d-pt.ppstatic.pl/k/r/1/d7/b3/531085f00b4f7_p.jpg?1460642567

Jakub Wolny
https://www.skijumping.pl/newsy/zdjecia/powieksz/021_jakub_wolny_2014-07-20_10-36-03.jpg

[Sandman]

As you can see, on the example of these two sports representations, Poles are clearly more fair-haired. There are two blondes in the German squad. In the Polish national team of ski jumpers, three athletes are blond. What is important, all they are ethnic Germans or Poles.

[Roy]

Ethnic Germans are blonder (except for the Southernmost Germany)

[Ülev]

some nations will always try to prove they are better in categories where others have advantage, rather than try to make their features more desirable

[Supercomputer]

As you can see, on the example of these two sports representations, Poles are clearly more fair-haired. There are two blondes in the German squad. In the Polish national team of ski jumpers, three athletes are blond. What is important, all they are ethnic Germans or Poles.

n=5

[Supercomputer]

No are you blind? Russia? Do you know how big Russia is? No way! It just shows that there is a area in western Russia with a high depigmentation level, a continuation of "Baltic" pigmentation. Only the Black Sea coastal regions of Romania to be darker than most of Bulgaria, while the very northeast and Moldova to be much lighter. The map is based on genes for light hair and light eyes. Are you O.K.? If you don't know much about the genes, ask. Don't say a stupid thing like Renaissance.

You are the one is blind mate. Even Northern half of Russia (it isn't just baltic part - the dot is in central Russia very far from the baltics) isn't as blond as Sweden. Only A fool would look at that map with less data points than fingers on a carpenter's hand and think it shows accurate distribution of pigmentation. We have much better data on that and we don't need your silly map that were on the internet in 2005.

[Golden Lining]

Polish people are a lot darker haired. A lot. Not even a comparison and don't post sports teams or something. Not representative.

[Roy]

Polish people are a lot darker haired. A lot. Not even a comparison and don't post sports teams or something. Not representative.

A lot? But doesn't it stay in contrast to that popular notion of Polish people being ''so blond''? Sure it's likely closer to some distorted myth than reality but still ... I doubt that people of my ethnicity are a lot darker haired even if they are likely darked haired.

[Moje ime]

Poland

[Golden Lining]

A lot? But doesn't it stay in contrast to that popular notion of Polish people being ''so blond''? Sure it's likely closer to some distorted myth than reality but still ... I doubt that people of my ethnicity are a lot darker haired even if they are likely darked haired.

There is no "blond stereotype" about Poles here in Germany. Poles are perhaps on par with the darkest regions in Germany, but everything else is just an internet fantasy started 15 years ago by guys like "Polako" (teh East Nordic Poles lol) and people confusing real Germans with Eastern Europeans immigrants when they come here. I have met so many Poles with pitchblack hair, it's not even funny.

[Septentrion]

There is no "blond stereotype" about Poles here in Germany. Poles are perhaps on par with the darkest regions in Germany, but everything else is just an internet fantasy started 15 years ago by guys like "Polako" (teh East Nordic Poles lol) and people confusing real Germans with Eastern Europeans immigrants when they come here. I have met so many Poles with pitchblack hair, it's not even funny.

"On par with the darkest regions" my foot! Is this the reason why the Nazi used to kidnap thousands of blonde, blue-eyed Polish children, right? I don't think so! Poland is that much different than Germany, with the very north of Germany which is fairer-haired due to the proximity to Scandinavia.

[Septentrion]

A lot? But doesn't it stay in contrast to that popular notion of Polish people being ''so blond''? Sure it's likely closer to some distorted myth than reality but still ... I doubt that people of my ethnicity are a lot darker haired even if they are likely darked haired.

Probably a myth. Nevertheless over 50% of Polish folks have blonde to light brown hair and about 69% have light eyes!

Northern East Poland remains within Europe's "lightest-haired zone."

[Bellbeaking]

Poland for sure, Germans are not very Blonde at all except in the north

[Arhat]

Germans. Most Slavs have pigmentation like Central-North Europeans. Even Balts are darker than Scandinavians but on pair with (North) Germans. On the other side North Slavs and especially Balts have much more genetic "northern" ancestry than Germanic people. Actually Light hair and even light eyes were mostly inherited from Neolithic farmers from Central Europe like GAC. So a population with more blondes is not automatically more northern than a population with less blondes

[Bellbeaking]

Germans. Most Slavs have pigmentation like Central Europeans. Even Balts are much darker than Scandinavians but on pair with Germans. On the other side genetically North Slavs and especially Balts have much more "northern" ancestry than Germanic people. Actually Light hair and even light eyes were mostly inherited from Neolithic farmers from Central Europe like GAC. So a population with more blondes is not automatically more northern than a population with less blondes

is this the case?


Some British neolithics had blonde hair interestingly. But it increased rapidly with the Bloody Hell Beakers

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Dx6mI_iXQAAkRev.jpg:large

More blonds definately doesn't equal more northern, look at england vs wales/ireland/scotland, england is the most south by a significant degree due to celitc migrations in the iron age.

[Arhat]

is this the case?


Some British neolithics had blonde hair interestingly. But it increased rapidly with the Bloody Hell Beakers

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Dx6mI_iXQAAkRev.jpg:large

More blonds definately doesn't equal more northern, look at england vs wales/ireland/scotland, england is the most south by a significant degree due to celitc migrations in the iron age.

Yeah all this stuff about "Black Irish" is quite ironic because Irish and Scots are the most steppe shifted British people. Light hair is so frequent among modern day Germanics because of extreme selection. A similar but lesser extreme selection happened with red hair genes among British people.

[Arhat]

is this the case?


Some British neolithics had blonde hair interestingly. But it increased rapidly with the Bloody Hell Beakers

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Dx6mI_iXQAAkRev.jpg:large

More blonds definately doesn't equal more northern, look at england vs wales/ireland/scotland, england is the most south by a significant degree due to celitc migrations in the iron age.

Bell Beakers were a mix of 50% steppe-like and 50% GAC/Funnelbeaker-like. Steppe people like Early Corded Ware and Yamnaya were almost all dark haired but GAC was almost 100% blonde/light haired. Bell Beakers on the otherside were 50% light haired so it very much looks like Bell Beaker became lighter because of GAC-admixture. But yeah we still not 100% understand the process of depigmentation in Bronze Age Europe.

[Septentrion]

is this the case?


Some British neolithics had blonde hair interestingly. But it increased rapidly with the Bloody Hell Beakers

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Dx6mI_iXQAAkRev.jpg:large

More blonds definately doesn't equal more northern, look at england vs wales/ireland/scotland, england is the most south by a significant degree due to celitc migrations in the iron age.

The British Isles are already in North-West Europe! Being blonde or not, they're already in Northern Europe. Not all Northern Europeans were blondes! Others were gingers and brown-haired, think!

[Septentrion]

Yeah all this stuff about "Black Irish" is quite ironic because Irish and Scots are the most steppe shifted British people. Light hair is so frequent among modern day Germanics because of extreme selection. A similar but lesser extreme selection happened with red hair genes among British people.

"Black Irish" is only a stereotype, nothing to be taken seriously. Ireland is overall the most blue-eyed and fairest-skinned area of the British Isles! It is a "blue eyes haven".

[Septentrion]

Germans. Most Slavs have pigmentation like Central-North Europeans. Even Balts are darker than Scandinavians but on pair with (North) Germans. On the other side North Slavs and especially Balts have much more genetic "northern" ancestry than Germanic people. Actually Light hair and even light eyes were mostly inherited from Neolithic farmers from Central Europe like GAC. So a population with more blondes is not automatically more northern than a population with less blondes

Since when are Balts much darker than Scandinavians? This would apply only to the Lithuanians. Estonia and Latvia are comparable to the blondism of Sweden and Norway. In fact Central Estonia has the highest recorded frequency of blond/light hair in the world to be only equalled by the inland valleys of the South Agder region of South East Norway. Estonians are one of the lightest-eyed people in the world, as many as 89%! Though it is not pure blue, rather grayish-blue or gray eyes are quite common.
http://www.estoniancasting.com/sites/default/files/styles/large/public/pildid/2_34.jpg
http://www.estoniancasting.com/sites/default/files/styles/large/public/pildid/merit_prof.jpg

Germans are never on par with Estonians! Are you O.K.?
http://estonianworld.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/Jaak-Nilson.jpg

[Bellbeaking]

The British Isles are already in North-West Europe! Being blonde or not, they're already in Northern Europe. Not all Northern Europeans were blondes! Others were gingers and brown-haired, think!


what do you mean by this serpent man? The english are the most souther shifted in the British isles yet the most blonde.

[Not a Cop]

Bell Beakers were a mix of 50% steppe-like and 50% GAC/Funnelbeaker-like. Steppe people like Early Corded Ware and Yamnaya were almost all dark haired but GAC was almost 100% blonde/light haired. Bell Beakers on the otherside were 50% light haired so it very much looks like Bell Beaker became lighter because of GAC-admixture. But yeah we still not 100% understand the process of depigmentation in Bronze Age Europe.

But i remember there were some materials on Andronovo and they turned out to be pretty light, i guess they were not mixed with GAC or something like that, so there were most likely some other sourses of depigmentation.

[Arhat]

Since when are Balts much darker than Scandinavians? This would apply only to the Lithuanians. Estonia and Latvia are comparable to the blondism of Sweden and Norway. In fact Central Estonia has the highest recorded frequency of blond/light hair in the world to be only equalled by the inland valleys of the South Agder region of South East Norway. Estonians are one of the lightest-eyed people in the world, as many as 89%! Though it is not pure blue, rather grayish-blue or gray eyes are quite common.
http://www.estoniancasting.com/sites/default/files/styles/large/public/pildid/2_34.jpg
http://www.estoniancasting.com/sites/default/files/styles/large/public/pildid/merit_prof.jpg

Germans are never on par with Estonians! Are you O.K.?
http://estonianworld.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/Jaak-Nilson.jpg

I don't know about Estonians but Latvians and Lithuanians are definitetly not blonder than Swedes. I live in Germany and i was many times in East Europe (originally most of my ancestors are from there). Balts are on pair with North Germans maybe but not more. It is a myth that Lithuanians or Latvians look nordic. Most of them would fit better in Poland, Russia or even Western Ukraine than Sweden.

[Arhat]

But i remember there were some materials on Andronovo and they turned out to be pretty light, i guess they were not mixed with GAC or something like that, so there were most likely some other sourses of depigmentation.


Andronovo had GAC-like admixture. Andronovo is originally derived from Corded Ware too. But yeah depigmentation existed not only among EEFs in Central Europe but also among HGs but muss less frequent as far as i know.

[Dna8]

probably similar rate of blondness

[renaissance12]

Idiotic! England is a light-haired country as a whole, not necessarily blond in the Scandinavian sense. It is much more blonde than Italy! No comparison, what is your point? This is another map based on genes for light hair and light eyes, way more precise than the 19th century one. It is based on 21st century study! OK!!! Look at Italy and then England!
https://unsafeharbour.files.wordpress.com/2012/02/map-europepigmentationgenes.jpg

Listen clown of the forum... you are becoming more and more ridiculus with your fixation with a blonde England that exist only in your dreams... I think you need some psychiatric help... for your menthal health... i hope it is not too late for you to recover and heal..


Italian Queens of Belgium ..( not in North europe and absolutely not a "blonde" country )

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/c4/Elio_Di_Rupo_PES-Kongress_2014.jpg/242px-Elio_Di_Rupo_PES-Kongress_2014.jpg
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/97/HM_Queen_Paola%2C_Princess_of_Belgium.jpg/223px-HM_Queen_Paola%2C_Princess_of_Belgium.jpg

[Mingle]

Dunno why people keep posting this map from Eupedia. It's just a paste of Coon's map of hair AND EYES mashed together with Peter Frosts map which is wrong

Is there a better map?


(Italy's heel blonder than Normandy)

I don't see that.

[Supercomputer]

Is there a better map?



I don't see that.

Yes, but It's from an amateur study. Still not very good tough :/

https://i.postimg.cc/Fdcjkvj2/Blonde-hair-Europe.png (https://postimg.cc/Fdcjkvj2)

Here is on the original. It's from Beals & Hoijer 1964 book, but you can't get it online to check the source. Anyway it's incorrect, especially the one showing light eyes.

https://thewaythetruthandthelife.net/index/2_background/2-5_societal/0-000-043-000-bc-to_2-011-ad_2-5-1_peopling-europe/0-000-043-000-bc-to_2-011-ad_2-5-1_x-peopling-europe/Light_hair_coloration_map.png

Ridiculously incorrect:
https://qph.fs.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-afaaac53bf083684bd96e90aef5b02c4.webp

[Lucas]

Yes, but It's from an amateur study. Still not very good tough :/

https://i.postimg.cc/Fdcjkvj2/Blonde-hair-Europe.png (https://postimg.cc/Fdcjkvj2)

Here is on the original. It's from Beals & Hoijer 1964 book, but you can't get it online to check the source. Anyway it's incorrect, especially the one showing light eyes.

https://thewaythetruthandthelife.net/index/2_background/2-5_societal/0-000-043-000-bc-to_2-011-ad_2-5-1_peopling-europe/0-000-043-000-bc-to_2-011-ad_2-5-1_x-peopling-europe/Light_hair_coloration_map.png

Ridiculously incorrect:
https://qph.fs.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-afaaac53bf083684bd96e90aef5b02c4.webp

Yes, especially darker eyes in Frisia comparing to northern Bavaria lol.

[Norb]

Modern Germans are cucks and look nothing like they did in WW2

[Septentrion]

Listen clown of the forum... you are becoming more and more ridiculus with your fixation with a blonde England that exist only in your dreams... I think you need some psychiatric help... for your menthal health... i hope it is not too late for you to recover and heal..


Italian Queens of Belgium ..( not in North europe and absolutely not a "blonde" country )

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/c4/Elio_Di_Rupo_PES-Kongress_2014.jpg/242px-Elio_Di_Rupo_PES-Kongress_2014.jpg
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/97/HM_Queen_Paola%2C_Princess_of_Belgium.jpg/223px-HM_Queen_Paola%2C_Princess_of_Belgium.jpg

Please hush! Your statements are empty! Bye, bye swarthy Roman, we ( Teutonic people) already sacked your empire! Why do you think that Italian migrated to Belgium, because Italy is corrupt to the core!

[Septentrion]

This study is greatly biased becasue it is partly or mainly based on self-assesment of hair color by study participants. We know how, especially women are biased about their real hair color. Common people especially are useless in dividing between light brown and dark blond category. I'm not sure also how this dermatologist who examined some Polish participants was trained. If he used Martin scale for hair color? I guess not. If it was his observation only it is bullshit, becasue without proper scale to compare he was biased becasue during the day even level of natural light can change color perception.

Only up to date anthropometric journey in Poland was in 1955-1956 when they examined about 13 722 Polish men and 14 043 women form all regions - Górny S., Zdjęcie antropometryczne Polski. Cz. 1: Pomiary ludności dorosłej z lat 1955-56 [w:] Materiały i Prace Antropologiczne, nr 84, 1972

As you see this study wasn't biased to prove great Polish blondness and was made by real anthropologists.

men 17-67 (Martin scale)


light blond (A-L, I, III) 6.74%
dark blond and red (this minimally) (M-Q, II,V-VI ) 23.05%
light brown (R-S) 13.05%
medium brown (T-U) 26.51%
dark brown mainly, pure black minimal (V-Y) 30.65%


women 17-67 (Martin scale)


light blond (A-L, I, III) 6.32%
dark blond and red (this minimally (M-Q, II,V-VI ) 23.8%
light brown (R-S) 14.51%
medium brown (T-U) 26.61%
dark brown mainly, pure black minimal (V-Y) 28.76%



Map is wrong. It is colorized Coon map of both hair and eyes color mixed with Peter Frost map.

This is a good study that I am familiar with.

[Radimir]

Poland.

[Rethel]

It is obvious, that the most blond are Polgermans :)

[Radimir]

It is obvious, that the most blond are Polgermans :)

THIS.

[Roy]

Poland.

Germans :coffee: Both per studies and my personal experience.

[billsoncreole26]

Germany has more light types.

Sent from my SM-G770F using Tapatalk

[Rethel]

Germans :coffee: Both per studies and my personal experience.

Only on the north. South is very dark. So on average probably will be the same as in Poland.

[Radimir]

Germans :coffee: Both per studies and my personal experience.

Only Northern Germans like ones from Schleswig-Holstein which was formerly a territory of Denmark, so I don't consider them Germans.

[Supercomputer]

Germany. Two amateur studies give very similar results. Around 30% for Poland and around 40% for Germany.

[Kyp]

Overall pretty similar.
From personal experience (Poles living in Germany) i would say Germans. Although Germans tend to have more variety.

[aynora]

I would say Poles are slightly more blond.

[Rethel]

Germany. Two amateur studies give very similar results. Around 30% for Poland and around 40% for Germany.

Now add all Arabs and Nigroes and you wil have equality between the two, or even Poles would be higher in blondism :laugh:

[Roy]

Only Northern Germans like ones from Schleswig-Holstein which was formerly a territory of Denmark, so I don't consider them Germans.

No, as even Austrians might have higher % of adult blonde people.

[Roy]

Only on the north. South is very dark. So on average probably will be the same as in Poland.

Not really as Southern Germans are lighter than it is portrayed on anthroforas. And it is maybe 20% of Poles that is blonde (absolute max 25%) based on what I see in my neighbourhood or in the streets and it is not sth. like Sanok or Bielsko-Biała but Wrocław or Łódź (I inhabited this city for almost a year).

[Roy]

Bell Beakers were a mix of 50% steppe-like and 50% GAC/Funnelbeaker-like. Steppe people like Early Corded Ware and Yamnaya were almost all dark haired but GAC was almost 100% blonde/light haired. Bell Beakers on the otherside were 50% light haired so it very much looks like Bell Beaker became lighter because of GAC-admixture. But yeah we still not 100% understand the process of depigmentation in Bronze Age Europe.

Do you have any sources to prove that Globular Amphora folk was almost 100% light-haired? I am curious.

[Rethel]

Not really as Southern Germans are lighter than it is portrayed on anthroforas. And it is maybe 20% of Poles that is blonde (absolute max 25%) based on what I see in my neighbourhood or in the streets and it is not sth. like Sanok or Bielsko-Biała but Wrocław or Łódź (I inhabited this city for almost a year).

According to national research from 1955 the 56% had fair hair, half of it blond, and 72% fair eyes.

[Rethel]

Do you have any sources to prove that Globular Amphora folk was almost 100% light-haired? I am curious.

Some incidents influenced by Cordeds similar as SHG influnced by EHG.
It must be remebered, that GACki were living side by side with Cordeds.

[Tooting Carmen]

Germany. Poles are, contrary to stereotype, no blonder than Brits (we have thousands in this country).

[Ülev]

Deutschland

[Roy]

According to national research from 1955 the 56% had fair hair, half of it blond, and 72% fair eyes.


Light hair total + eye colour seems accurate, but blonde hair I am not so sure ...

But don't forget that things like hair colour can change depending on the season (look Stearsolina, her gets lighter in summer).

[Dragoon]

Germans slightly more light hair
Poles slightly more light eyes.

[aherne]

Bell Beakers were a mix of 50% steppe-like and 50% GAC/Funnelbeaker-like. Steppe people like Early Corded Ware and Yamnaya were almost all dark haired but GAC was almost 100% blonde/light haired. Bell Beakers on the otherside were 50% light haired so it very much looks like Bell Beaker became lighter because of GAC-admixture. But yeah we still not 100% understand the process of depigmentation in Bronze Age Europe.

This is once again genetic crap repeated on this forum contradicted by factual evidence: take mummies from Tarim basin, some as old as 4000 years ago, and blonde hair is more like rule than accident. How come people that had Yamnaya origin ended up being blonde in East Turkestan? Why same pattern repeats all over ancient "Indo-European" Eurasia?

Equally stupid is the belief that indigenous CMs in Europe were dark skinned and blue eyed. Why is that today people showing same phenotypes are very light skinned, brown/blond haired and hazel/light eyed? Why is that in Scandinavia blondness STRONGLY correlates with CM features, much more so than with those showing Corded features (where darker hair dominates among adults). All of this is enough for me to speculate that Aryans not only did not introduce lightness to Scandinavia, they actually REDUCED it

Racial anthropology is excellent to

[Norb]

This is once again genetic crap repeated on this forum contradicted by factual evidence: take mummies from Tarim basin, some as old as 4000 years ago, and blonde hair is more like rule than accident. How come people that had Yamnaya origin ended up being blonde in East Turkestan? Why same pattern repeats all over ancient "Indo-European" Eurasia?

Equally stupid is the belief that indigenous CMs in Europe were dark skinned and blue eyed. Why is that today people showing same phenotypes are very light skinned, brown/blond haired and hazel/light eyed? Why is that in Scandinavia blondness STRONGLY correlates with CM features, much more so than with those showing Corded features (where darker hair dominates among adults). All of this is enough for me to speculate that Aryans not only did not introduce lightness to Scandinavia, they actually REDUCED it

Racial anthropology is excellent to
classify him
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c4/H%C3%B6r%C3%B0ur_Bj%C3%B6rgvin_Magn%C3%BAsson.jpg
https://ssl.c.photoshelter.com/img-get2/I0000T1ymiEwPA3s/fit=1000x750/g=G0000YfG1vB_OluA/Hordur-Magnusson-01.jpg

[Septentrion]

This is once again genetic crap repeated on this forum contradicted by factual evidence: take mummies from Tarim basin, some as old as 4000 years ago, and blonde hair is more like rule than accident. How come people that had Yamnaya origin ended up being blonde in East Turkestan? Why same pattern repeats all over ancient "Indo-European" Eurasia?

Equally stupid is the belief that indigenous CMs in Europe were dark skinned and blue eyed. Why is that today people showing same phenotypes are very light skinned, brown/blond haired and hazel/light eyed? Why is that in Scandinavia blondness STRONGLY correlates with CM features, much more so than with those showing Corded features (where darker hair dominates among adults). All of this is enough for me to speculate that Aryans not only did not introduce lightness to Scandinavia, they actually REDUCED it

Racial anthropology is excellent to

I am not sure about that dude! CMs are not all blond by the way. Scandinavia blondness correlates well with the Corded element also ( Indo - Europeans).

[XenophobicPrussian]

This is once again genetic crap repeated on this forum contradicted by factual evidence: take mummies from Tarim basin, some as old as 4000 years ago, and blonde hair is more like rule than accident. How come people that had Yamnaya origin ended up being blonde in East Turkestan? Why same pattern repeats all over ancient "Indo-European" Eurasia?

Equally stupid is the belief that indigenous CMs in Europe were dark skinned and blue eyed. Why is that today people showing same phenotypes are very light skinned, brown/blond haired and hazel/light eyed? Why is that in Scandinavia blondness STRONGLY correlates with CM features, much more so than with those showing Corded features (where darker hair dominates among adults). All of this is enough for me to speculate that Aryans not only did not introduce lightness to Scandinavia, they actually REDUCED it

Racial anthropology is excellent to
LOL, what a load of crap.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/6f/Loulan_beauty_closeup.jpg/220px-Loulan_beauty_closeup.jpg

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/33/c5/77/33c5774f1519cbb1348be12d2a70fe2e.jpg

https://c8.alamy.com/comp/2B017KX/the-tarim-mummies-are-a-series-of-mummies-discovered-in-the-tarim-basin-in-present-day-xinjiang-china-which-date-from-1800-bce-to-200-ce-some-of-the-mummies-are-thought-to-be-associated-with-the-presence-of-the-indo-european-tocharian-languages-in-the-tarim-basin-although-the-evidence-is-not-totally-conclusive-working-with-dna-samples-victor-h-mair-has-concluded-that-the-mummies-are-caucasoid-likely-speakers-of-an-indo-european-language-that-east-asian-peoples-began-settling-in-the-eastern-portions-of-the-tarim-basin-about-3000-years-ago-while-the-uighur-peoples-arrived-after-the-2B017KX.jpg

https://static01.nyt.com/images/2008/11/19/world/19mummy_600.JPG

https://www.penn.museum/sites/expedition/files/2017/05/mair_1.jpg

Wow, one blonde mummy in extreme lighting. Even that lone blonde one is irrelevant because it's very well known that mummification can cause loss of pigment. Do you think ancient Egyptians were blonde too, or all Danish bog bodies were redheads?

Also, there's little chance Tarim people were even pure Yamnaya, you have pure Yamnaya samples in the Altai region(Afanasievo) but we're talking like 3000-2000 BC, the mummies are from much later. Even with "muh craniometrics":


B. E. Hemphill's biodistance analysis of cranial metrics (as cited in Larsen 2002 and Schurr 2001) has questioned the identification of the Tarim Basin population as European, noting that the earlier population has close affinities to the Indus Valley population, and the later population with the Oxus River valley population.
(The earlier population is supposed to be the "European" one, Caucasoid sure, but like a modern Swedish "Corded Nordid"? :laugh:)

The only thing you said right is "Aryans" reduced lightness in Scandinavia, because Corded Ware samples had less SLC45A2 than Scandinavian Hunter Gatherers and a far lower rate of light eyes, and I agree there's no evidence that indigenous CMs were dark skinned, but I don't base ancient pigmentation on the silly pigmentation predictions(yes, this is a flawed and early science), I base them on their overall autosomal genetic profile(not a flawed and early science). Yamnaya cluster closest to Volga Tatars(unsurprising since they're from the same reason, ofc missing recent Mongoloid) and based on that they definitely were a predominantly dark population, while it's reasonable to assume WHGs were not dark skinned because populations that have the most WHG are the lightest skinned. It is kind of reasonable to assume they had dark hair, as IRF4(a very WHG specific gene) peaks in Ireland and they're very dark haired, they also have a high amount of WHG-related phenotypes or phenotypes "furthest from other races". Lithuania is also very dark haired for their latitude(especially compared to Scandinavia) yet they are genetically(and probably phenotypically) more WHG/CM than Scandinavians. Btw, "Corded Nordid" is the largest joke of a phenotype of the planet, as a random guy from German Corded Ware will pass far better as some dark Ukrainian from the Crimea than Max von Sydow. The thinnest, pencil thin, low T Swedish Nordid is extremely related to the most CM, square jawed Swedish Borreby, while some Balkan Borreby isn't. Racial anthropology is garbage.

[Benyzero]

Who is more gay, Serpentrion or ...?

[Benyzero]

bitchass foo IDK which one of you is more lame

[Rethel]

WHGs were not dark skinned because populations that have the most WHG are the lightest skinned.

It is absolutly fase reasoning, as:

1. WHG probably had EHG admixture, so from this they had in final term some lighter eyes.
2. Next WHGeans were farmerized, i.e. became lighter, swarthy-like, more or even less like Ötzi.
3. Then they became indoeuropeanized, so, they could become light.
4. SHG in Scnadinavia what you mentioned was a hybryd of EHG and WHG.
5. Even before genetic era, you had clear evidences, that blondims and gingerism were always
in those places, where IEs arrived, from Greenland to Srilanka, from Azores to Ordos.
6. everywhere were supposedly WHG is high, Yamnaya is much, much higher.
7. There where is low Yamnaya (the more EHG), the people are usually darker.

You are wrong on all sides, as you were with Ugrofins.
You just from ununderstandable reason sticked in some early genetic
mindless racial mythology, which was debunked many, many times.

Whyyy? Because of some weird paraphilia to ugly borrebies? :scratch:

[aherne]

I am not sure about that dude! CMs are not all blond by the way. Scandinavia blondness correlates well with the Corded element also ( Indo - Europeans).

Then how come it peaks among people that barely show any "Indo-European" features? In Scandinavia, CMs are super blonde, but in other parts of Europe they are not. Even in Southern Europe, however, they are lighter by any measurement compared to far more numerous neolithic-inspired people... Even in Maghreb, CM looking people are the lightest! How come this pattern is global throughout Europe and North West Africa without taking the assumption it is a reflection of previous realities?

[LostSoul]

I'm from Poland and I'm dark-haired. So, don't believe in that stereotype that Poles are more light-haired than Germans. I have never seen such amount of dark hair in Poland, as I saw in Germany (I haven't travelled to Germany yet, but I know some German).

[Supercomputer]

German footballers are more blond than Polish footballers.

[Septentrion]

Then how come it peaks among people that barely show any "Indo-European" features? In Scandinavia, CMs are super blonde, but in other parts of Europe they are not. Even in Southern Europe, however, they are lighter by any measurement compared to far more numerous neolithic-inspired people... Even in Maghreb, CM looking people are the lightest! How come this pattern is global throughout Europe and North West Africa without taking the assumption it is a reflection of previous realities?

Super blonde? No. The Hallstatt Nordid is blonder than most CM types. Most of the dark - haired types in Scandinavia are of course of CM derivation (Borreby, Brunn, Paleo Atlantid, Strandid). The difference is that some CM might be lighter - eyed though.

[aherne]

Super blonde? No. The Hallstatt Nordid is blonder than most CM types. Most of the dark - haired types in Scandinavia are of course of CM derivation (Borreby, Brunn, Paleo Atlantid, Strandid). The difference is that some CM might be lighter - eyed though.

If by "Halstatt Nordid" you mean Germanic version of Corded, then it is mostly brown haired in adulthood. Search for "Swedish blondes" in Google:

https://www.google.com/search?q=swedish+blondes&sxsrf=ALeKk02-IEq8LVnU1sFqSu5t0613hHAgsQ:1614236218856&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiw5aHDuoTvAhUpiYsKHV-KCX8Q_AUoAXoECCEQAw&biw=1848&bih=981

All are native CMs. On the opposite side look at their national football team, where Corded element is extremely over-represented:

https://sportshub.cbsistatic.com/i/r/2018/05/24/2f16ba3e-984f-49a4-a4f9-c5f019d59ee4/thumbnail/1200x675/e5aa6baec1da819f9d5dbccaa0cdc40b/sweden.jpg

Medium to light brown haired, definitely darker than Swedish average. To see a more average crowd, take a look at their female football team:

https://www.thelocal.se/userdata/images/article/f676a8be489bee2a6a81a5a75ef8900afca8178456ae062228 2702c2cf11ade4.jpg

The more CM they are, the blonder. Darkest are those in left and right corners, who look mainly Corded (brown haired, as usual). Conclusion:

Unlike in other areas in Europe, Aryans introduced "brunet"-ness in Scandinavia (for native standards)...

[Roy]

It is absolutly fase reasoning, as:

1. WHG probably had EHG admixture, so from this they had in final term some lighter eyes.
2. Next WHGeans were farmerized, i.e. became lighter, swarthy-like, more or even less like Ötzi.
3. Then they became indoeuropeanized, so, they could become light.
4. SHG in Scnadinavia what you mentioned was a hybryd of EHG and WHG.
5. Even before genetic era, you had clear evidences, that blondims and gingerism were always
in those places, where IEs arrived, from Greenland to Srilanka, from Azores to Ordos.
6. everywhere were supposedly WHG is high, Yamnaya is much, much higher.
7. There where is low Yamnaya (the more EHG), the people are usually darker.

You are wrong on all sides, as you were with Ugrofins.
You just from ununderstandable reason sticked in some early genetic
mindless racial mythology, which was debunked many, many times.

Whyyy? Because of some weird paraphilia to ugly borrebies? :scratch:

Pure "WHG" specimen, this is - Loschbour Man, had blue eyes so I disagree.

[Roy]

It is absolutly fase reasoning, as:

1. WHG probably had EHG admixture, so from this they had in final term some lighter eyes.
2. Next WHGeans were farmerized, i.e. became lighter, swarthy-like, more or even less like Ötzi.
3. Then they became indoeuropeanized, so, they could become light.
4. SHG in Scnadinavia what you mentioned was a hybryd of EHG and WHG.
5. Even before genetic era, you had clear evidences, that blondims and gingerism were always
in those places, where IEs arrived, from Greenland to Srilanka, from Azores to Ordos.
6. everywhere were supposedly WHG is high, Yamnaya is much, much higher.
7. There where is low Yamnaya (the more EHG), the people are usually darker.

You are wrong on all sides, as you were with Ugrofins.
You just from ununderstandable reason sticked in some early genetic
mindless racial mythology, which was debunked many, many times.

Whyyy? Because of some weird paraphilia to ugly borrebies? :scratch:

Pure "WHG" specimen, this is - Loschbour Man, had blue eyes so I disagree.

[Supercomputer]

If by "Halstatt Nordid" you mean Germanic version of Corded, then it is mostly brown haired in adulthood. Search for "Swedish blondes" in Google:

https://www.google.com/search?q=swedish+blondes&sxsrf=ALeKk02-IEq8LVnU1sFqSu5t0613hHAgsQ:1614236218856&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiw5aHDuoTvAhUpiYsKHV-KCX8Q_AUoAXoECCEQAw&biw=1848&bih=981

All are native CMs. On the opposite side look at their national football team, where Corded element is extremely over-represented:

https://sportshub.cbsistatic.com/i/r/2018/05/24/2f16ba3e-984f-49a4-a4f9-c5f019d59ee4/thumbnail/1200x675/e5aa6baec1da819f9d5dbccaa0cdc40b/sweden.jpg

Medium to light brown haired, definitely darker than Swedish average. To see a more average crowd, take a look at their female football team:

https://www.thelocal.se/userdata/images/article/f676a8be489bee2a6a81a5a75ef8900afca8178456ae062228 2702c2cf11ade4.jpg

The more CM they are, the blonder. Darkest are those in left and right corners, who look mainly Corded (brown haired, as usual). Conclusion:

Unlike in other areas in Europe, Aryans introduced "brunet"-ness in Scandinavia (for native standards)...

These people have wet hair, that's why it appears darker

[Rethel]

Pure "WHG" specimen, this is - Loschbour Man, had blue eyes so I disagree.

In mesolithic so called WHG had EHG admixture.
The one of the last pure WHGeans is Bichon man.
Original WHG had no blue eyes. They had just in
the last years before Farmerian arrived, and was
it because of EHG admix in different degree...

[Jana]

In mesolithic so called WHG had EHG admixture.
The one of the last pure WHGeans is Bichon man.
Original WHG had no blue eyes. They had just in
the last years before Farmerian arrived, and was
it because of EHG admix in different degree...

Not at all. EHG had much more brown eyes than WHG did.

[Aldaris]

Who is more gay, Serpentrion or ...?

Yes.

[Rethel]

Not at all. EHG had much more brown eyes than WHG did.

Sure, and blue eyed people from India, Manchuria, Egypt, Morocco, have it, because WHGans did colonize them... especially after being 90-98% farmerianized, and then "browneyed" yamnayanized... Sure... :picard2:

[Norb]

If by "Halstatt Nordid" you mean Germanic version of Corded, then it is mostly brown haired in adulthood. Search for "Swedish blondes" in Google:

https://www.google.com/search?q=swedish+blondes&sxsrf=ALeKk02-IEq8LVnU1sFqSu5t0613hHAgsQ:1614236218856&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiw5aHDuoTvAhUpiYsKHV-KCX8Q_AUoAXoECCEQAw&biw=1848&bih=981

All are native CMs. On the opposite side look at their national football team, where Corded element is extremely over-represented:

https://sportshub.cbsistatic.com/i/r/2018/05/24/2f16ba3e-984f-49a4-a4f9-c5f019d59ee4/thumbnail/1200x675/e5aa6baec1da819f9d5dbccaa0cdc40b/sweden.jpg

Medium to light brown haired, definitely darker than Swedish average. To see a more average crowd, take a look at their female football team:

https://www.thelocal.se/userdata/images/article/f676a8be489bee2a6a81a5a75ef8900afca8178456ae062228 2702c2cf11ade4.jpg

The more CM they are, the blonder. Darkest are those in left and right corners, who look mainly Corded (brown haired, as usual). Conclusion:

Unlike in other areas in Europe, Aryans introduced "brunet"-ness in Scandinavia (for native standards)...

I'm Hallstatt Nordid (Gracile Nordic) - Germanic Nordic (no CM)

[Norb]

If by "Halstatt Nordid" you mean Germanic version of Corded, then it is mostly brown haired in adulthood. Search for "Swedish blondes" in Google:

https://www.google.com/search?q=swedish+blondes&sxsrf=ALeKk02-IEq8LVnU1sFqSu5t0613hHAgsQ:1614236218856&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiw5aHDuoTvAhUpiYsKHV-KCX8Q_AUoAXoECCEQAw&biw=1848&bih=981

All are native CMs. On the opposite side look at their national football team, where Corded element is extremely over-represented:

https://sportshub.cbsistatic.com/i/r/2018/05/24/2f16ba3e-984f-49a4-a4f9-c5f019d59ee4/thumbnail/1200x675/e5aa6baec1da819f9d5dbccaa0cdc40b/sweden.jpg

Medium to light brown haired, definitely darker than Swedish average. To see a more average crowd, take a look at their female football team:

https://www.thelocal.se/userdata/images/article/f676a8be489bee2a6a81a5a75ef8900afca8178456ae062228 2702c2cf11ade4.jpg

The more CM they are, the blonder. Darkest are those in left and right corners, who look mainly Corded (brown haired, as usual). Conclusion:

Unlike in other areas in Europe, Aryans introduced "brunet"-ness in Scandinavia (for native standards)...

from the mens football team only number 6, 10 and 1 appear to be Nordid/Corded...10 and 6 appear more Gracile than 1

[Immanenz]

I'm Hallstatt Nordid (Gracile Nordic) - Germanic Nordic (no CM)


from the mens football team only number 6, 10 and 1 appear to be Nordid/Corded...10 and 6 appear more Gracile than 1

ironically Forsberg is the result of this recombing of traits- looks more like his father (sm that you would classify as Paleo perhabs) but has the pigmentation of mother. (Borreby)


https://static-cdn.esmg.se/3/images/uploads/2018/01/bb880313bb057-640x430.jpg

[Universe]

In mesolithic so called WHG had EHG admixture.
The one of the last pure WHGeans is Bichon man.
Original WHG had no blue eyes. They had just in
the last years before Farmerian arrived, and was
it because of EHG admix in different degree...
How do you know they had EHG admixture? Is there a study or anything to back that notion?
There's this spreadsheet from 2015 : https://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?155723-K8-All-Populations-Spreadsheet
at the bottom there's ancestry breakdown of Loscbour man, it has 0% ANE, so he couldn't be EHG admixed.
La Brana also had 0% ANE but had blue eyes.

[Chocolate_Hound]

Germany but only slightly. Poland has more brunettes but they are on the fairer end of Europeans.

[Septentrion]

If by "Halstatt Nordid" you mean Germanic version of Corded, then it is mostly brown haired in adulthood. Search for "Swedish blondes" in Google:

https://www.google.com/search?q=swedish+blondes&sxsrf=ALeKk02-IEq8LVnU1sFqSu5t0613hHAgsQ:1614236218856&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiw5aHDuoTvAhUpiYsKHV-KCX8Q_AUoAXoECCEQAw&biw=1848&bih=981

All are native CMs. On the opposite side look at their national football team, where Corded element is extremely over-represented:

https://sportshub.cbsistatic.com/i/r/2018/05/24/2f16ba3e-984f-49a4-a4f9-c5f019d59ee4/thumbnail/1200x675/e5aa6baec1da819f9d5dbccaa0cdc40b/sweden.jpg

Medium to light brown haired, definitely darker than Swedish average. To see a more average crowd, take a look at their female football team:

https://www.thelocal.se/userdata/images/article/f676a8be489bee2a6a81a5a75ef8900afca8178456ae062228 2702c2cf11ade4.jpg

The more CM they are, the blonder. Darkest are those in left and right corners, who look mainly Corded (brown haired, as usual). Conclusion:

Unlike in other areas in Europe, Aryans introduced "brunet"-ness in Scandinavia (for native standards)...

No, they aren’t all CMs. What’s up with you? You seem not to be able to classify. No CM phenotype is blonder - haired than the original Nordic phenotype. OK, there are CM types, that could be almost as blond but not more blonde - haired. The HN is almost an exclusively blonde phenotype, with a small brunet minority. You are posting a team of Swedes where not all are ethnic Swedish and not all are HN either. Put that in your head, that the HN is par excellence a blond type. CM types vary and show a much stronger correlation of brown hair and light eyes ( Borreby for example) much more so than the HN.

[Roy]

Germany but only slightly. Poland has more brunettes but they are on the fairer end of Europeans.

Yup.

[Odelia]

It's the Spaniards you troll!

[Gallop]

It's hard to say, it could be the Poles. Maybe when I visited Germany I thought they were going to look more Scandinavian, but they didn't, they didn't look like the actors in American Nazi movies either, and there are a lot of American Nazi movies.

[Ellethwyn]

I assume Germany has more blondes than Poland.

[Ezio Auditore]

Iberians and italians are far more blonde.