Visas, marriage and screwing over the EU

[Maelstrom]

Hi all,

I want to get back to Germany, perhaps this summer. Would be good to try and earn my keep and travel with what limited money I can make. After looking into a few documents about Visas and Work Visas I have established that it is quite possibly easier (and cheaper) to get married and thus bypass some fees etc.

Here are a few of the documents I have been looking at:

General Visa Requirements (http://www.wellington.diplo.de/Vertretung/wellington/en/01/general__visa__req__download,property=Daten.pdf)

Part B of that document appears to cover what I am after. Does marriage to an EU citizen still require that I need to indicate that I have found emplyment and an employer? Or would I be exempt from this rule?

Permanent residency (http://www.wellington.diplo.de/Vertretung/wellington/en/04/Working_20Holiday_20and_20Visa_20Requirements/Ehegatten__Merkblatt__en,property=Daten.pdf)

Alternatively could I apply for permanent residency? Does that require that I relinquish my New Zealand passport? In such a case it appears I do not even need to be married. How permanent is permanent in this case?

Working Visa (http://www.wellington.diplo.de/Vertretung/wellington/en/01/working__holiday__download,property=Daten.pdf)

Alternatively there is a working visa such as the one above. This would require that I state my employer etc and as of yet I have not organised this.

What are your thoughts on my situation and plans? Am I not reading enough into this? Apart from my visa fee being wavered, are there any other benefits of marrying my friend?

Also, does one need to physically be with their partner to get married? Or can one simply sign a form such as in New Zealand?

I understand that marriage, especially in such a context, is a very controversial topic. Please keep your morals and moral highground far away from this thread, I'm far more concerned about the legal ins and outs.

Many thanks,
Maelstrom

[Maelstrom]

*Bump* for great justice!

[Lenny]

You are right that it is much easier to marry an EU-citizen than to get an "Aufenthaltserlaubnis" (residence permit) as a single foreigner.

I'll share some of what I've learned of this: partly through knowing someone who went the work-permit route {successfully}, partly from my own experience, and partly from hearing things over the years.


Firstly, anyone from the First World can get a tourist visa into the E.U. valid for 90 days every 6 months. These days they don't even require paper visas for the 90-day "tourist" stint anymore. Just arrive, they'll see "New Zealand", nod, stamp your passport, and onward. A little trick I have heard is that some people have turned their 90-day tourist visa into a 180-day one: They asked the Arbeitsamt or Ausländerbehörde -- or some such bureaucratic maze-- for a 90-day extension using the false claim that they "are talking with a company", hammering out a contract with an employer, etc. Beware of doing such things lest you end up on a blacklist and are disallowed entry in the future!


Alternatively could I apply for permanent residency?I really doubt that they would give you one just because you ask them to, just because you say "I want this, please give me it". If you did that, they'd reject you. You have to have a job offer from a company or be married to a citizen, in which case you have near-100% chance of getting it; without those things you have near-0% chance of getting it!


Does that require that I relinquish my New Zealand passport? No not at all; A NZ passport means you are an NZ citizen, the only way to "relinquish" a passport is to take a foreign citizenship. Getting German citizenship is quite hard, takes many many years.


How permanent is permanent in this case?Usually it's for a single year but it could be more, depending.



Alternatively there is a working visa such as the one above. This would require that I state my employer etc and as of yet I have not organised this.
The "Arbeitserlaubnis" (work permit) is notoriously difficult to get for non-E.U.ers, and requires months and months of sitting around, [I]after the company has signed off on you. This stuff is always hard and annoying with any country, but with Germany especially. You'd have to contact an employer very soon if going down this path. But, if you don't have some kind of extremely in-demand skill, you'd probably not find anything. Possibly teaching-English you could (though they'd almost certainly want a university-degree-holder from the English-speaking countries).

There are some programs one can get into, I have always heard, "summer work" programs. Maybe it's worth looking into, but then they'd have no interest in giving you some low-hours-per-month position and have you just frolick about having fun the whole time :D :(


Part B of that document appears to cover what I am after. Does marriage to an EU citizen still require that I need to indicate that I have found emplyment and an employer? Or would I be exempt from this rule?Would you really get married (to an E.U.er) just to dodge some tough work-visa laws? That seems extreme and ill-advised. But if you did, then yes I think you would dodge all the annoying bureacrazy [sic:D]. It'd likely still take a while for them to get your papers in order and have it crawl thru the system, before finally churning out a work permit (which, along with the Aufenthaltserlaubnis would be granted if you're married to a local, possibly excluding if you have AIDS:p). If you have an E.U.-citizen girl who's willing to marry you, even if you got married by month's end here, I'm not sure if all the papers would come through before the Solstice to allow you to work.



The best bet is to just save what money you can now, go on a tourist Visa, and live on the cheap while there. It's not that hard for a young man to live on the cheap in Germany; lots of places you can find a bed for a night for not much over $10USD...and if you're really intrepid you can sleep out in summertime in the more rural areas. Buying food at ALDI, usw.:p would do it too. [Though, if you know a German girl willing to marry you, perhaps you wouldn't even need to live like a hobo, but would be taken care of there?]

The other way to do it is find a way to get into some university in the E.U., then as long as you're registered, even for one course, you have an open-ended "Student Visa". This may be the easiest/best way for you at this juncture.

[Absinthe]

All that remains is that we find you a nice german bride :D

[Maelstrom]

Following Hellason's advice I went to the $4 jug night and am thus quite pissed!

As a matter of fact I have a German-American (ie EU and American citizenship) lined up and she is more than willing to go through with it. She lives in Holland at the moment whilst she has family in Southern Germany.

I have been notified by another member, via rep comment, that I may very well need love letters etc as proof and eligibility for our marrriage. Does anyone know the specifics about this certain aspect?

I am simply trying to evaluate whether or not it is feasable for attempt to marry an EU citizen or not, or whether or not I am better off simple paying the $155NZD and going through the whole work permit thing.... :confused:

[SwordoftheVistula]

Sounds like a hassle. Your best bet, if you know people already there, may be to work 'under the table' to avoid all that nonsense. Getting marriage or any other official certification sounds like a hassle.

[Lenny]

Sounds like a hassle. Your best bet, if you know people already there, may be to work 'under the table' to avoid all that nonsense. Bad idea. If you get caught, you're blacklisted for a long time and might be unable to enter the EU again.


Maelstrom I don't think they would give you a work permit just because you ask them to.

I don't see why you'd need a letter if you have a NZ-govt-authorized marriage certificate in hand. If you aren't even in the same country as the girl in the first place, then this is just a bad idea all around.

Even if you got married, you probably wouldn't get the open-ended work permit before summer.

[Maelstrom]

Thanks for the advice guys and gals :thumb001:

So, as it stands at the moment I've basically established that marriage probably isn't going to be that beneficial and could actually create more problems than what it's worth...

It looks like if I do go over I'll just have to pay the fee and hope like hell that between now and then I'll be able to find someone that will employ me ;)