Scythians were genetically heterogenous

[Borealis]

In this post I will show that the Scythians across many different regions differed genetically using a model first using mostly ancients and comparing them to each other+modern populations, and then I use strictly moderns. Here goes:

http://i65.tinypic.com/bjaa2b.jpg

http://i67.tinypic.com/5vy5b6.jpg

[Borealis]

My mistake, I did not need to have both mongola and han in the second model. only one is necessary

[Coastal Elite]

Thanks for posting this. I ran myself against the different Scythians. I come closest to Scythian_HUN

"sample": "Custom: DacoCeltic_scaled",
"fit": 2.7998,
"Scythian_HUN": 48.33,
"Scythian_MDA": 29.17,
"Scythian_UKR": 19.17,
"Saka_Tian_Shan": 3.33,
"Saka_Kazakh_steppe": 0,
"Scythian_Aldy_Bel_IA": 0,
"Scythian_Zevakino_Chilikta_IA": 0,

"closestDistances": [
"Scythian_HUN: DA195: 4.654376",
"Scythian_HUN: DA197: 4.825711",
"Scythian_UKR:scy010: 5.411110",
"Scythian_HUN: DA194: 6.334399",
"Scythian_HUN: DA191: 6.521269",
"Scythian_MDA:scy305: 6.521794",
"Scythian_MDA:scy311: 6.669490",
"Scythian_MDA:scy301: 6.876655",
"Scythian_MDA:scy197: 7.032101",
"Scythian_UKR:scy009: 7.182825",
"Scythian_MDA:scy192: 7.311287",
"Scythian_MDA:scy300: 7.688812",
"Scythian_HUN: DA198: 7.743548",
"Scythian_UKR:scy011: 9.444964",
"Saka_Tian_Shan: DA53: 14.664605",
"Saka_Tian_Shan: DA51: 16.562142",
"Saka_Tian_Shan: DA58: 16.978126",
"Saka_Tian_Shan: DA47: 18.869046",
"Scythian_Zevakino_Chilikta_IA:IS2: 18.927020",
"Saka_Tian_Shan : DA57: 19.496164",
"Saka_Tian_Shan : DA49: 19.899843",
"Saka_Tian_Shan : DA55: 20.881769",
"Scythian_Aldy_Bel_IA:I0577: 21.712406",
"Saka_Tian_Shan: DA50: 25.256786",
"Saka_Kazakh_steppe: DA14: 26.310504",
"Saka_Kazakh_steppe: DA10: 26.636052",
"Saka_Kazakh_steppe: DA13: 26.816621",
"Saka_Kazakh_steppe: DA16: 27.253731",
"Saka_Kazakh_steppe: DA11: 27.434019",
"Saka_Kazakh_steppe: DA15: 30.180391",
"Scythian_Zevakino_Chilikta_IA:Ze6b: 32.689476",
"Scythian_Aldy_Bel_IA:I0576: 34.119240"

[Dick]

So what does this mean then



"fit": 2.6322,
"Scythian_UKR": 45,
"Scythian_HUN": 31.67,
"Scythian_MDA": 23.33,
"Saka_Kazakh_steppe_o1": 0,
"Saka_Tian_Shan": 0,
"Scythian_Aldy_Bel_IA": 0,
"Scythian_Zevakino_Chilikta_IA": 0,

"closestDistances": [
"Scythian_HUN: DA195: 3.714780",
"Scythian_HUN: DA197: 5.086025",
"Scythian_UKR:scy010: 6.165073",
"Scythian_MDA:scy305: 6.525821",
"Scythian_HUN: DA191: 6.724042",
"Scythian_MDA:scy197: 6.821055",
"Scythian_UKR:scy009: 6.842449",
"Scythian_HUN: DA194: 7.152032",
"Scythian_MDA:scy192: 7.194610",
"Scythian_MDA:scy301: 7.226881",
"Scythian_MDA:scy300: 7.569487",
"Scythian_MDA:scy311: 7.626475",
"Scythian_HUN: DA198: 7.821479",
"Scythian_UKR:scy011: 9.300049",
"Saka_Kazakh_steppe_o1: DA17: 14.823237",
"Saka_Tian_Shan: DA53: 14.885525",
"Saka_Tian_Shan: DA51: 17.048234",
"Saka_Tian_Shan: DA58: 17.625687",
"Saka_Tian_Shan: DA47: 19.138441",
"Scythian_Zevakino_Chilikta_IA:IS2: 19.681441",
"Saka_Tian_Shan: DA57: 20.035418",
"Saka_Tian_Shan: DA49: 20.140376",
"Saka_Tian_Shan: DA55: 21.362839",
"Scythian_Aldy_Bel_IA:I0577: 22.175810",
"Saka_Tian_Shan: DA50: 25.476244",
"Scythian_Zevakino_Chilikta_IA:Ze6b: 32.820311",
"Scythian_Aldy_Bel_IA:I0576: 34.469949"

[Borealis]

Thanks for posting this. I ran myself against the different Scythians. I come closest to Scythian_HUN

"sample": "Custom: DacoCeltic_scaled",
"fit": 2.7998,
"Scythian_HUN": 48.33,
"Scythian_MDA": 29.17,
"Scythian_UKR": 19.17,
"Saka_Tian_Shan": 3.33,
"Saka_Kazakh_steppe": 0,
"Scythian_Aldy_Bel_IA": 0,
"Scythian_Zevakino_Chilikta_IA": 0,

"closestDistances": [
"Scythian_HUN: DA195: 4.654376",
"Scythian_HUN: DA197: 4.825711",
"Scythian_UKR:scy010: 5.411110",
"Scythian_HUN: DA194: 6.334399",
"Scythian_HUN: DA191: 6.521269",
"Scythian_MDA:scy305: 6.521794",
"Scythian_MDA:scy311: 6.669490",
"Scythian_MDA:scy301: 6.876655",
"Scythian_MDA:scy197: 7.032101",
"Scythian_UKR:scy009: 7.182825",
"Scythian_MDA:scy192: 7.311287",
"Scythian_MDA:scy300: 7.688812",
"Scythian_HUN: DA198: 7.743548",
"Scythian_UKR:scy011: 9.444964",
"Saka_Tian_Shan: DA53: 14.664605",
"Saka_Tian_Shan: DA51: 16.562142",
"Saka_Tian_Shan: DA58: 16.978126",
"Saka_Tian_Shan: DA47: 18.869046",
"Scythian_Zevakino_Chilikta_IA:IS2: 18.927020",
"Saka_Tian_Shan : DA57: 19.496164",
"Saka_Tian_Shan : DA49: 19.899843",
"Saka_Tian_Shan : DA55: 20.881769",
"Scythian_Aldy_Bel_IA:I0577: 21.712406",
"Saka_Tian_Shan: DA50: 25.256786",
"Saka_Kazakh_steppe: DA14: 26.310504",
"Saka_Kazakh_steppe: DA10: 26.636052",
"Saka_Kazakh_steppe: DA13: 26.816621",
"Saka_Kazakh_steppe: DA16: 27.253731",
"Saka_Kazakh_steppe: DA11: 27.434019",
"Saka_Kazakh_steppe: DA15: 30.180391",
"Scythian_Zevakino_Chilikta_IA:Ze6b: 32.689476",
"Scythian_Aldy_Bel_IA:I0576: 34.119240"

Yep, the Scythians in eastern Europe appear to be overwhelmingly European-like with a bit of Central Asian admixture. However they may not originate from the same as the specific Europeans in the area they inhabited, for example Scythians in Moldova seem to be closer to Italians than Moldovans.

[Nurzat]

Norway and South Italy aren't relevant proxies for Scythians I think but it's anyway interesting that I get this - it means Moldovan Scythians were quite Neolithic and it's most probably because they mixed into the local post-Neolithic Cucuteni-Tripolie-like remnants?:

"sample": "Scythian_MDA:Average",
"fit": 2.0937,
"Greek": 93.33,
"Belarusian": 3.33,
"Mongolian": 3.33,
"Georgian_Imer": 0,


"sample": "Scythian_MDA:Average",
"fit": 1.7879,
"Greek": 85.83,
"Swedish": 10.83,
"Mongolian": 3.33,
"Ukrainian": 0,

[Borealis]

Norway and South Italy aren't relevant proxies for Scythians I think but it's anyway interesting that I get this - it means Moldovan Scythians were quite Neolithic and it's most probably because they mixed into the local post-Neolithic Cucuteni-Tripolie-like remnants?:

"sample": "Scythian_MDA:Average",
"fit": 2.0937,
"Greek": 93.33,
"Belarusian": 3.33,
"Mongolian": 3.33,
"Georgian_Imer": 0,

Nah, I wasn't trying to model them with those that they may be directly descended from but rather just give an idea of what they're like. So Norwegian=north Europe proxy, Italian=South europe proxy. So you can tell which ones lean toward north europe or south europe, how much to central asia(tajik), east asia(mongola), or Siberia(Udmurt).

[Coastal Elite]

You can do a similar thing with the different Bell Beaker samples on the nMonte. They also seem to have some genetic diversity.

"fit": 1.6209,
"Bell_Beaker_CZE": 53.33,
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria": 35,
"Bell_Beaker_England": 4.17,
"Bell_Beaker_FRA": 2.5,
"Bell_Beaker_ITA": 2.5,
"Bell_Beaker_HUN": 0.83,
"Bell_Beaker_NLD": 0.83,
"Bell_Beaker_Scotland": 0.83,
"Bell_Beaker_CHE": 0,
"Bell_Beaker_Iberia": 0,
"Bell_Beaker_POL": 0,
"Bell_Beaker_Rhine-Main": 0,

[Nurzat]

Nah, I wasn't trying to model them with those that they may be directly descended from but rather just give an idea of what they're like. So Norwegian=north Europe proxy, Italian=South europe proxy. So you can tell which ones lean toward north europe or south europe, how much to central asia(tajik), east asia(mongola), or Siberia(Udmurt).

that's strange nevertheless - for example I live in their territory and I get this result below - so the region seems to be more northern-shifted today than back then? also, Balkan Slavs seem to be closer to Scythian Ukraine than to Scythian Moldova.

"sample": "Custom:Nurzat",
"fit": 4.0864,
"Norwegian": 67.5,
"Italian_South": 24.17,
"Armenian": 6.67,
"Mongolian": 1.67,
"closestDistances": [
"Norwegian:NOR101: 6.640181",
"Norwegian:NOR107: 6.793209",
"Norwegian:NOR106: 6.884820",
"Norwegian:NOR109: 6.964069",
"Norwegian:NOR108: 7.043357",
"Norwegian:NOR152: 7.430917",
"Norwegian:NOR150: 7.592313",
"Italian_South:ITS7: 9.085030",
"Italian_South:ITS2: 9.747251",
"Italian_South:BEL57: 10.325372",
"Italian_South:ITS4: 10.626359",

[Borealis]

that's strange nevertheless - for example I live in their territory and I get this result below - so the region seems to be more northern-shifted today than back then? also, Balkan Slavs seem to be closer to Scythian Ukraine than to Scythian Moldova.

"sample": "Custom:Nurzat",
"fit": 4.0864,
"Norwegian": 67.5,
"Italian_South": 24.17,
"Armenian": 6.67,
"Mongolian": 1.67,
"closestDistances": [
"Norwegian:NOR101: 6.640181",
"Norwegian:NOR107: 6.793209",
"Norwegian:NOR106: 6.884820",
"Norwegian:NOR109: 6.964069",
"Norwegian:NOR108: 7.043357",
"Norwegian:NOR152: 7.430917",
"Norwegian:NOR150: 7.592313",
"Italian_South:ITS7: 9.085030",
"Italian_South:ITS2: 9.747251",
"Italian_South:BEL57: 10.325372",
"Italian_South:ITS4: 10.626359",

Yes pretty much. Those in Ukraine seem more northern shifted.

[Dick]

You can do a similar thing with the different Bell Beaker samples on the nMonte. They also seem to have some genetic diversity.

Nice idea. I'm guessing the Bavaria was more southern shifted



"fit": 3.2003,
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria": 55.83,
"Bell_Beaker_CZE": 42.5,
"Bell_Beaker_HUN": 1.67,
"Bell_Beaker_CHE": 0,
"Bell_Beaker_England": 0,
"Bell_Beaker_FRA": 0,
"Bell_Beaker_ITA": 0,
"Bell_Beaker_Iberia": 0,
"Bell_Beaker_NLD": 0,
"Bell_Beaker_POL": 0,
"Bell_Beaker_Rhine-Main": 0,
"Bell_Beaker_Scotland": 0,


"closestDistances": [
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I4945: 4.853887",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I4896: 4.993184",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I4885: 5.200341",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I5529: 5.266629",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I5017: 5.273451",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I6591: 5.415188",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I5524: 5.455823",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I7275: 5.560373",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I4889: 5.780093",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I4886: 5.845404",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I4891: 6.146754",
"Bell_Beaker_POL:I6582: 6.171895",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I4888: 6.197194",
"Bell_Beaker_POL:I4253: 6.244837",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I5666: 6.262548",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I3590: 6.288237",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I5520: 6.380537",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I7213: 6.430599",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:E09569: 6.489188",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I4946: 6.548556",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I5834: 6.572023",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I3588: 6.572737",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I7269: 6.577439",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I3589: 6.606972",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I5025: 6.610386",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I3600: 6.626921",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I7249: 6.684316",
"Bell_Beaker_CHE:I5759: 6.711253",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:E09538: 6.730445",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I6590: 6.799896",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I5379: 6.837769",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I7278: 6.881018",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I6624: 6.909942",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I7214: 6.924327",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I7251: 7.010125",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I7276: 7.011767",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I5531: 7.077382",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I6480: 7.238820",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I7250: 7.291369",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I7212: 7.319110",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I4895: 7.342991",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I7211: 7.404290",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I1767: 7.415181",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I7290: 7.435230",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I5833: 7.600522",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I5382: 7.647855",
"Bell_Beaker_CHE:I5755: 7.722512",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I5525: 7.803930",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I7287: 7.823848",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I7282: 7.829586",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I7281: 7.866223",
"Bell_Beaker_ITA:I2478: 7.891762",
"Bell_Beaker_NLD:I5750: 7.905537",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I5658: 7.909268",
"Bell_Beaker_FRA:I1382: 8.015151",
"Bell_Beaker_POL:I6583: 8.094158",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I5523: 8.100705",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I2445: 8.229476",
"Bell_Beaker_FRA:I1390: 8.247844",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:E09613_d: 8.259568",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I6778: 8.271280",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I6679: 8.278246",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I3256: 8.370365",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I5521: 8.392845",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I6775: 8.429176",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I5514: 8.474666",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I2443: 8.505459",
"Bell_Beaker_POL:I6580: 8.585167",
"Bell_Beaker_Iberia:I6623: 8.722674",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I7286: 8.793316",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I2453: 8.795372",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I5512: 8.798129",
"Bell_Beaker_NLD:I4076: 8.822829",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I5659: 8.848756",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I3601: 8.923384",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I6777: 8.949585",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I2452: 8.957866",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I5023: 8.969603",
"Bell_Beaker_NLD:I4075: 8.995425",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I5519: 9.024396",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I3594: 9.155054",
"Bell_Beaker_Scotland:I5367: 9.180276",
"Bell_Beaker_NLD:I4069: 9.202104",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I5376: 9.249689",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I2447: 9.315605",
"Bell_Beaker_FRA:I1381: 9.350193",
"Bell_Beaker_Scotland:I5385: 9.374240",
"Bell_Beaker_Rhine-Main:I5836: 9.408497",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I5020: 9.471338",
"Bell_Beaker_NLD:I4073: 9.533408",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I2416: 9.542122",
"Bell_Beaker_NLD:I4068: 9.559522",
"Bell_Beaker_HUN:I7045: 9.580742",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I7205: 9.758919",
"Bell_Beaker_NLD:I5748: 9.766856",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I3255: 9.771919",
"Bell_Beaker_Iberia:I6588: 9.777415",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I6774: 9.801548",
"Bell_Beaker_ITA:I1979: 9.873783",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I2455: 9.883184"

[Armenian Bishop]

The Scythian People inhabited a huge area of land, so it's not a surprise that they were a "heterogeneous" people. The Greeks (Hellenic People) and Romans (of the Roman Empire) viewed them in a similar fashion to their descriptions of the Gauls and Celts; another words, they grouped and bundled together such People into vast areas, without investing enough interest for subgroups and tribal areas.

[FinalFlash]

Scythians seemed to be more of a meta-ethnicity. Many look mixed-race based off the calculators.

[Pandit]

They were türks.

[sushi]

Thanks for posting this, Disaffection!

[Ayetooey]

Got Y Dna results for these samples?

[Grace O'Malley]

This is my result looking at the different Beakers.

I don't suppose this is a good model because of overfitting.

"sample": "Custom:AGUser_Grace",
"fit": 1.7843,
"Bell_Beaker_CZE": 29.17,
"Bell_Beaker_NLD": 28.33,
"Bell_Beaker_England": 24.17,
"Bell_Beaker_POL": 10,
"Bell_Beaker_Iberia": 4.17,
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria": 1.67,
"Bell_Beaker_Scotland": 1.67,
"Bell_Beaker_ITA": 0.83,
"Bell_Beaker_FRA": 0,
"closestDistances": [
"Bell_Beaker_POL:I6583: 2.840373",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I5379: 3.095986",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I3256: 3.167474",
"Bell_Beaker_NLD:I5750: 3.167937",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I5514: 3.168645",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I4895: 3.209434",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I7249: 3.273542",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I7212: 3.378206",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I5521: 3.382729",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I7269: 3.413063",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I2447: 3.477249",
"Bell_Beaker_Scotland:I5367: 3.527298",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I7251: 3.582633",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I5382: 3.586158",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I4889: 3.669372",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I1767: 3.685582",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I5512: 3.715663",
"Bell_Beaker_NLD:I4073: 3.860518",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I5523: 3.876500",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I2452: 3.956512",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I4946: 3.967879",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I5833: 3.971260",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I7281: 4.003843",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I5658: 4.036573",
"Bell_Beaker_FRA:I1390: 4.103438",
"Bell_Beaker_NLD:I4068: 4.104320",
"Bell_Beaker_NLD:I4069: 4.116700",
"Bell_Beaker_POL:I6580: 4.122347",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:E09569: 4.124499",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I6590: 4.131025",
"Bell_Beaker_NLD:I4076: 4.135140",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I2443: 4.154141",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I5023: 4.155409",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I3255: 4.264102",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I7290: 4.290430",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I4888: 4.292814",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I6777: 4.297242",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I2445: 4.320089",
"Bell_Beaker_Scotland:I5385: 4.377921",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I6679: 4.385257",
"Bell_Beaker_POL:I4253: 4.397955",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I7287: 4.407690",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I2453: 4.418502",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I5525: 4.450664",
"Bell_Beaker_FRA:I1381: 4.461367",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I5531: 4.467049",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I5834: 4.477997",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I5659: 4.592224",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I7278: 4.612652",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I6775: 4.633399",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I5666: 4.652837",
"Bell_Beaker_FRA:I1382: 4.656251",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I7276: 4.658699",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I6480: 4.738408",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I7213: 4.739812",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I2418: 4.781085",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I7205: 4.805800",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I3589: 4.831579",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I6778: 4.831579",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I7211: 4.835876",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I5513: 4.972850",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I7275: 5.014661",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I5519: 5.036138",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I6624: 5.040438",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:E09613_d: 5.072479",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I3600: 5.078397",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I2459: 5.083640",
"Bell_Beaker_NLD:I4075: 5.098423",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I2454: 5.116572",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I5529: 5.120242",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I6774: 5.135961",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I4896: 5.162322",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I7282: 5.196726",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I3601: 5.207657",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I4891: 5.208569",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I7286: 5.220959",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I6591: 5.250588",
"Bell_Beaker_NLD:I4074: 5.252579",
"Bell_Beaker_NLD:I5748: 5.271054",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I7250: 5.371561",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I7214: 5.440746",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I2450: 5.470560",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I4886: 5.719882",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I3588: 5.738551",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I4950: 5.874477",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I2455: 5.922090",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I5376: 5.975593",
"Bell_Beaker_Iberia:I6623: 6.134290",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I5020: 6.168488",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I4945: 6.316068",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I4951: 6.384269",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I2417: 6.492690",
"Bell_Beaker_POL:I6582: 6.733346",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I3590: 6.869195",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I5520: 6.876886",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I4885: 6.881384",
"Bell_Beaker_CZE:I5025: 6.975922",
"Bell_Beaker_England:I2416: 7.417199",
"Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:E09538: 8.411665",
"Bell_Beaker_ITA:I2478: 8.461019"

The fit for Scythians is too large so not really a good fit for me.

"sample": "Custom:AGUser_Grace",
"fit": 5.0595,
"Scythian_HUN": 52.5,
"Scythian_UKR": 38.33,
"Scythian_MDA": 5,
"Saka_Tian_Shan": 3.33,
"Scythian_Zevakino_Chilikta_IA": 0.83,

[Grace O'Malley]

Got Y Dna results for these samples?

All the Bell Beakers are R1b.

Here's the Scythians

Scythian Hungary - YDNA R1,G-PF3378
Scythian_MDA - YDNA R1b1a1a2
Scythian_UKR - YDNA R1b1a1a2
Saka_Tian_Shan - YDNA R1a1, R1, (I don't know if they're really sure on this one?)

[Dick]

This is my result looking at the different Beakers.

I don't suppose this is a good model because of overfitting.



The fit for Scythians is too large so not really a good fit for me.

"

what's a good fit %? i dont understand

[Pahli]

They were türks.

No.

Scythians were diverse, most Scythians from Western Kazakhstan to Europe were dominantly Caucasian with minor East Eurasian admix.

The more East you go, the more East Asian admixed they became.

Samples from Volga Scythians / Sarmatians show that they descent from Sintashta with some Central Asian farmer and Asian admixture.

[Pandit]

No.

Scythians were diverse, most Scythians from Western Kazakhstan to Europe were dominantly Caucasian with minor East Eurasian admix.

The more East you go, the more East Asian admixed they became.

Samples from Volga Scythians / Sarmatians show that they descent from Sintashta with some Central Asian farmer and Asian admixture.

I know, i was waiting for pan turkic nuts to take my bait lol.

[Grace O'Malley]

what's a good fit %? i dont understand

Under 2 is obviously a good fit whereas 5 isn't. So I'm much closer to Bell Beakers than Scythians which I guess me being West European isn't too surprising. :)

[Pahli]

I know, i was waiting for pan turkic nuts to take my bait lol.

Give it a day or two, and they might be flooding this thread :rolleyes:

[Borealis]

Got Y Dna results for these samples?

Hold on, I think they’re there I’ll check again soon.

[Coastal Elite]

This is my result looking at the different Beakers.

I don't suppose this is a good model because of overfitting.

"sample": "Custom:AGUser_Grace",
"fit": 1.7843,
"Bell_Beaker_CZE": 29.17,
,

Long live the Czech Republic Beakers! You did get a fair amount of Bell Beaker England. Pretty cool.

[Coastal Elite]

These are the 5 closest modern groups to Scythians according to MyTrueAncestry.

Bosnian - *Scythian (6.055)
Romanian - *Scythian (6.169)
Croatian - *Scythian (7.508)
Ukrainian - Scythian (7.537)
Macedonian - *Scythian (8.193)

[Token]

These are the 5 closest modern groups to Scythians according to MyTrueAncestry.

Bosnian - *Scythian (6.055)
Romanian - *Scythian (6.169)
Croatian - *Scythian (7.508)
Ukrainian - Scythian (7.537)
Macedonian - *Scythian (8.193)

Lol.

[Coastal Elite]

Lol.

Funny results? They are kind of random. I posted it because this is one of the few calculators that actually includes Scythian samples.

[Token]

Funny results? They are kind of random. I posted it because this is one of the few calculators that actually includes Scythian samples.

Totally dishonest results, i believe they used the Hungarian Scythian sample that comes closest to Europeans and is in all likelihood an assimilated native, just to please their European audience. Scythians were very heterogeneous but the ones from the Scythian core in the Samara region had more steppe IE admixture than Bell Beakers. This is how Iron Age Iranic nomads looked like before expanding in all directions.

[Coastal Elite]

Totally dishonest results, i believe they used the Hungarian Scythian sample that comes closest to Europeans and is in all likelihood an assimilated native, just to please their European audience. Scythians were very heterogeneous but the ones from the Scythian core in the Samara region had more steppe IE admixture than Bell Beakers. This is how Iron Age Iranic nomads looked like before expanding in all directions.

I think you are probably right that it was an assimilated native sample. One big problem is the labels (like Scythian) given to these samples can be inaccurate and misleading.

[Dick]

Totally dishonest results, i believe they used the Hungarian Scythian sample that comes closest to Europeans and is in all likelihood an assimilated native, just to please their European audience. Scythians were very heterogeneous but the ones from the Scythian core in the Samara region had more steppe IE admixture than Bell Beakers. This is how Iron Age Iranic nomads looked like before expanding in all directions.

Makes sense. So who was that assimilated native from present day Hungary? I come closest to him now with the updated spreadsheet.





"1. CLOSEST SINGLE ITEM DISTANCE%"
Scythian_HUN DEU_MA_ACD
0.3842554 0.4025673
HUN_MA BGR_Varna_En3
0.4413373 0.4437283
HUN_MA_Szolad Scythian_UKR
0.4692019 0.4914398
Iberia_Northeast_c.6CE_PL Bell_Beaker_HUN_EBA
0.4938503 0.4941633
ITA_Collegno_MA CZE_Early_Slav
0.5206024 0.5484033
Scythian_MDA Bell_Beaker_Bavaria
0.5551244 0.5848841
HUN_LBA Levant_LBN_MA_Euro
0.5869962 0.5935922
Bell_Beaker_CZE Bell_Beaker_CHE
0.5998941 0.6025211
HUN_MA_Szolad_o2 DEU_Alberstedt_LN
0.6061649 0.6303287
SVK_Poprad_MA CZE_Hallstatt_Bylany
0.6364461 0.6437610
Bell_Beaker_POL Iberia_Northeast_c.6-8CE_ES
0.6455530 0.6462095
DEU_MA Yamnaya_BGR
0.6479693 0.6527212
HUN_Avar_Szolad RUS_Sunghir_MA
0.6564863 0.6689830
HRV_MBA Bell_Beaker_FRA_C
0.6704497 0.6884231
HRV_Early_IA DEU_Roman
0.6885392 0.6963024
CZE_Unetice_EBA Iberia_Northeast_c.8-12CE
0.6971740 0.7008471
Bell_Beaker_Mittelelbe-Saale England_IA
0.7012928 0.7024133
USA_colonial_period England_Roman
0.7057444 0.7177379
Iberia_Northeast_Empuries1 DEU_Halberstadt_LBA
0.7248958 0.7250710
SWE_IA HRV_Starcevo_N_o
0.7271882 0.7306113
Nordic_BA SWE_Viking_Age_Sigtuna
0.7398034 0.7493538
HUN_BA POL_Unetice_EBA
0.7540655 0.7551265
HUN_Prescythian_IA DEU_Unetice_EBA
0.7578585 0.7603748
England_Saxon Scotland_LBA
0.7763672 0.7828692
Nordic_LN England_MBA
0.7868758 0.7900851
Wales_CA_EBA Scotland_MBA
0.7917272 0.7951539
Iberia_Central_CA_Stp England_CA_EBA
0.7954389 0.7961680
TZA_Zanzibar_First_Millenium Scythian_MDA_o2
0.7978918 0.8046253
Scotland_CA_EBA England_LBA
0.8050352 0.8065119
Bell_Beaker_FRA Iberia_North_IA
0.8200875 0.8206670
CZE_EBA IRL_BA
0.8230285 0.8261753
SWE_Battle-Axe Iberia_Northeast_RomP
0.8298693 0.8318637
Levant_LBN_MA_Mixed Nordic_MN_B
0.8345489 0.8429073
England_EMBA Bell_Beaker_England
0.8469063 0.8497583
HUN_Mako_EBA POL_Chopice_Wesele_Culture
0.8616732 0.8653407
KAZ_Golden_Horde_Euro DEU_BenzigerodeHeimburg_LN
0.8679102 0.8707407
NLD_BA Bell_Beaker_NLD
0.8796458 0.8913556
Corded_Ware_Proto-Unetice_POL Bell_Beaker_Scotland
0.9038933 0.9087757
Iberia_East_IA BGR_EBA
0.9179589 0.9257755
Bell_Beaker_Rhine-Main Iberia_Southeast_c.10-16CE
0.9408497 0.9429589
Anatolia_IA_low_res KAZ_Maitan_MLBA_Alakul
0.9432173 0.9432428
Iberia_Northwest_CA_Stp UKR_Sredny_Stog_II_En
0.9506069 0.9527639
KAZ_Ak_Moustafa_MLBA1 KAZ_Kairan_MLBA
0.9531224 0.9542329
Bell_Beaker_HUN Corded_Ware_POL
0.9641000 0.9666149
Bell_Beaker_England_EBA Ostrogothic_Crimea_ACD
0.9755174 0.9856279
RUS_Sintashta_MLBA POL_EBA
0.9868954 0.9892986
BGR_IA RUS_Petrovka_MLBA
0.9953081 1.0023307
KAZ_Aktogai_MLBA Iberia_Southeast_c.5-8CE
1.0085997 1.0122154
Corded_Ware_CZE Corded_Ware_Baltic
1.0127276 1.0161115
KAZ_Lisakovskiy_MLBA_Alakul RUS_Poltavka_o
1.0188355 1.0216316


"distance%=1.073"



KAZ_Golden_Horde_Euro,28.2
HUN_MA_Szolad_o1,16
Anatolia_Kaman-Kalehoyuk_MLBA_low_res,10.6
USA_colonial_period,8.6
Baltic_LVA_BA,7.6
MKD_N,5.2
UKR_Trypillia,5.2
Baltic_LTU_Late_Antiquity_low_res,4.4
KAZ_Oy_Dzhaylau_MLBA_o2,3.2
HUN_MA,2.6
Anatolia_N_Kumtepe_low_res,1.6
RUS_Kubano-Tersk,1.6
TKM_Parkhai_MBA,1.6
Anatolia_Isparta_EBA,1.2
DEU_MA_o,0.6
RUS_Karasuk_o,0.6
Baltic_EST_BA,0.4
HUN_Prescythian_IA,0.4
Kura-Araxes_ARM_Talin,0.2
RUS_Poltavka,0.2

[Token]

Makes sense. So who was that assimilated native from present day Hungary? I come closest to him now with the updated spreadsheet.

Only God knows.