Georgians are genetically equidistant to Balochi and Romanians.

[Tomasso]

Genetic distance to Georgians (global25 calculator)


6.477 Armenian
6.844 Adygei
8.327 Iranian Lor
9.296 Turkish Adana
9.709 Iraqi Jew
11.851 Italian South
14.992 Bedouin_A
15.900 Romanian
16.874 Balochi
18.213 Afghan Pashtun
18.657 Hungarian
18.824 Egyptian
18.873 Yemenite Jew
20.813 Ukrainian
20.868 Sardinian
21.040 Polish
24.673 Latvian

[Tigranes]

So what? :icon_ask:

[FinalFlash]

Genetic distance to Georgians (global25 calculator)


6.477 Armenian
6.844 Adygei
8.327 Iranian Lor
9.296 Turkish Adana
9.709 Iraqi Jew
11.851 Italian South
14.992 Bedouin_A
15.900 Romanian
16.874 Balochi
18.213 Afghan Pashtun
18.657 Hungarian
18.824 Egyptian
18.873 Yemenite Jew
20.813 Ukrainian
20.868 Sardinian
21.040 Polish
24.673 Latvian

Western or Eastern Georgians?

Also, they're still closer to Romanians(relatively speaking)

[Leto]

Western or Eastern Georgians?
Is there a big difference? Abkhazians for example are almost indistinguishable from Northwestern and Western Georgians.

[Tomasso]

So what? :icon_ask:

They look far more like Romanians than Balochi. I thought they would have been more related to Europeans than to South-Central Asians.


Western or Eastern Georgians?

Imereti

[Leto]

They look far more like Romanians than Balochi. I thought they would have been more related to Europeans than to South-Central Asians.
Georgians are the closest to Europeans among the West Asians. North Caucasians may have more Euro HG ancestry but culturally they're very Islamicized and have much more in common with Arabs than Europeans.

[FinalFlash]

Is there a big difference? Abkhazians for example are almost indistinguishable from Northwestern and Western Georgians.

Of course. Quite significant actually. Western Georgians(Imeretians, Megrelians, Svans) mostly descend from Colchians. Whereas eastern Georgians(Kakhetians, Kartlians) descend from Iberians.

On these Gedmatch calculators, they mostly use Western Georgians as a reference for Georgians hence why they plot nearly identical to Abkhazians(who are the most CHG heavy population). This in turn exaggerates the genetic distance of Georgians to their southern neighbors, Armenia.

Check this out. You can translate the page.

http://laz-colchis-dna.blogspot.com/2017/12/mdlp-k23-hesaplayicisi-esliginde-dogu_9.html

[Leto]

Georgian

# Population Percent
1 West_Asian 52.14
2 East_Med 21.85
3 West_Med 10.13
4 North_Atlantic 5.52
5 Baltic 3.72
6 Red_Sea 3.22
7 South_Asian 1.80
8 East_Asian 0.65
9 Amerindian 0.42
10 Siberian 0.37

Abhkasian

# Population Percent
1 West_Asian 54.30
2 East_Med 22.78
3 West_Med 9.81
4 Baltic 4.62
5 South_Asian 1.91
6 Red_Sea 1.84
7 North_Atlantic 1.64
8 East_Asian 1.48
9 Siberian 1.11
10 Amerindian 0.17

[Leto]

Of course. Quite significant actually. Western Georgians(Imeretians, Megrelians, Svans) mostly descend from Colchians. Whereas eastern Georgians(Kakhetians, Kartlians) descend from Iberians.

On these Gedmatch calculators, they mostly use Western Georgians as a reference for Georgians hence why they plot nearly identical to Abkhazians(who are the most CHG heavy population). This in turn exaggerates the genetic distance of Georgians to their southern neighbors, Armenia.

Check this out. You can translate the page.

http://laz-colchis-dna.blogspot.com/2017/12/mdlp-k23-hesaplayicisi-esliginde-dogu_9.html
You think Southern and Southeastern Georgians would have a shorter distance to Armenians? Kvemo Kartli is like 40% Azerbaijani Turkish by the way.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kvemo_Kartli

[Tomasso]

Armenians are mixed with Afro Asiatich. They have 6-8% Red Sea and higher East Med than Georgians.

[Leto]

Armenians are mixed with Afro Asiatich. They have 6-8% Red Sea and higher East Med than Georgians.
Armenians are 5% Red Sea in the K13 and K15 spreadsheets. The East Med is at 35% though, I agree.

[Tigranes]

Armenians are mixed with Afro Asiatich. They have 6-8% Red Sea and higher East Med than Georgians.

Afro Asiatich?


Haber et. al. (2015) (https://www.nature.com/articles/ejhg2015206) for example could not find any traces of admixture among Armenians for at least 4000 years, concluding that:

“Our tests suggest that Armenians had no significant mixture with other populations in their recent history and have thus been genetically isolated since the end of the Bronze Age.”

“The position of the Armenians within the global genetic diversity is unique and appears to mirror the geographical location of Anatolia. Armenians’ adoption of a distinctive culture early in their history resulted in their genetic isolation from their surroundings.”

The same conclusion was reached by Hellenthal et. al. (2014) in their Genetic Atlas of Human Admixture History, published in Science magazine. Because of such findings some scholars have referred to modern Armenians as a “Living Fossil”.


Other studies investigating ancient DNA collected from burial places have revealed genetic similarities between modern Armenians and ancient inhabitants of the Armenian Highlands. Allentoft et al. (2015) for example observed genetic similarities between Bronze Age individuals (ca. 3,500 years BP) and modern Armenians, and Lazaridis et al. (2016) showed similarity between Chalcolithic (ca. 6,000 years BP) and Bronze Age (ca. 3,500 years BP) individuals excavated in Armenia.

Prompted by such findings, the Head of the Laboratory of the Institute of Molecular Biodiversity of the National Academy of Sciences Levon Yepiskoposyan has stated in a press conference that:

“The results of genetic studies have shown that the DNA samples of the Bronze Age individuals that hav\e been found on the territory of Armenia have a genetic portrait that is almost indistinguishable from the genetic portrait of people living today in Armenia”

“Modern Armenians are direct descendants of the people who lived in the territory of Armenia 5000 years ago.”

Similar statements have been made by a famous genetics blogger Dienekes where he confirms Armenian genetic continuity but asks if this continuity extends beyond the Bronze Age:

“Speaking of the Caucasus/Middle East, it seems clear as a first approximation that the Bronze Age Armenians are quite similar to modern Armenians. Whether the genetic continuity of Armenians extends beyond the Bronze Age, or Armenians were formed by mixture in the Bronze Age remains to be seen.”

[FinalFlash]

Armenians are mixed with Afro Asiatich. They have 6-8% Red Sea and higher East Med than Georgians.

Eurogenes k13 isn't accurate for West Asia. It heavily undermines the CHG component and inflates this mythical East Med component. No Northwest Asian ethnic group has anywhere close to having 30-35% Southwest Asian/East Med.

Oh, Armenians average roughly 5% Red Sea whereas Western Georgians average 2-3% on that poor calculator.

puntDNAL K15 is much better for West Asia as well as Eurogenes K12b.

[Tomasso]

Eurogenes k13 isn't accurate for West Asia. It heavily undermines the CHG component and inflates this mythical East Med component. No Northwest Asian ethnic group has anywhere close to having 30-35% Southwest Asian/East Med.

Oh, Armenians average roughly 5% Red Sea whereas Western Georgians average 2-3% on that poor calculator.

puntDNAL K15 is much better for West Asia as well as Eurogenes K12b.

Yes

Distance to Armenians based on global25

3.0275 Assyians
3.0487 Georgian Jew
3.3033 Greek Trabzon
4.4612 Iraqi Jew
4.9647 Druze
5.8941 Cypriot
5.9577 Lebanese Christian
6.4438 Georgian Imer

[FinalFlash]

Yes

Distance to Armenians based on global25

3.0275 Assyians
3.0487 Georgian Jew
3.3033 Greek Trabzon
4.4612 Iraqi Jew
4.9647 Druze
5.8941 Cypriot
5.9577 Lebanese Christian
6.4438 Georgian Imer

Eastern and Western Armenians have genetic differences which these calculators don't highlight. Eastern Georgians and western Georgians have genetic differences which these calculator references, again, don't highlight.

http://laz-colchis-dna.blogspot.com/2017/12/mdlp-k23-hesaplayicisi-esliginde-dogu_9.html

Also, why did you exclude Georgian_Laz and Turkish_Trabzon on this oracle? What was the fit distance anyway?

I will show this to you once I finish compiling my spreadsheet for this custom oracle on puntDNALk15 another user here on TA is currently working on.

[FinalFlash]

You think Southern and Southeastern Georgians would have a shorter distance to Armenians? Kvemo Kartli is like 40% Azerbaijani Turkish by the way.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kvemo_Kartli

Yes. Based off that study and given the fact that they descend from Iberians, they would be significantly closer to Eastern Armenians than Colchians(Western Georgiks/Abkhazians) would be. Nevermind the fact that historically, Armenians have always had a big presence in Eastern Georgia and have incorporated that region into various Armenian kingdoms throughout history. Colchis is a different story entirely.

[Tomasso]

Yes. Based off that study and given the fact that they descend from Iberians, they would be significantly closer to Eastern Armenians than Colchians(Western Georgiks/Abkhazians) would be. Nevermind the fact that historically, Armenians have always had a big presence in Eastern Georgia and have incorporated that region into various Armenian kingdoms throughout history. Colchis is a different story entirely.

Iberians?

[FinalFlash]

Iberians?

The kingdom of Colchis and the kingdom of Iberia.

http://realhistoryww.com/world_history/ancient/Misc/Colchis_East_Iberia/Colchis_and_East_Iberia.htm

[user_]

Yes. Based off that study and given the fact that they descend from Iberians, they would be significantly closer to Eastern Armenians than Colchians(Western Georgiks/Abkhazians) would be. Nevermind the fact that historically, Armenians have always had a big presence in Eastern Georgia and have incorporated that region into various Armenian kingdoms throughout history. Colchis is a different story entirely.

Today 70% of Georgian population are descendants of Colchis and come from west Georgia, Also Eastern Georgia heavily mixed with north Caucasians, much more than with Armenians.

[Leto]

About 30% of all ethnic Georgians live in the capital, Tbilisi. I would assume many of them have mixed origins as in all capitals.

[user_]

About 30% of all ethnic Georgians live in the capital, Tbilisi. I would assume many of them have mixed origins as in all capitals.

Despite of location, today most of Georgians in Tbilisi came from west Imereti and Megrelia due to migration after USSR collapsed.

[Kyp]

Georgians are the closest to Europeans among the West Asians. North Caucasians may have more Euro HG ancestry but culturally they're very Islamicized and have much more in common with Arabs than Europeans.

They only score 14-18%European (northatlantic/baltic/westmed) on these calculators. Even my azeri iranian father scores 17-18%. They are just more purely caucasian/westasian from what it looks like.

[Leto]

They only score 14-18%European (northatlantic/baltic/westmed) on these calculators. Even my azeri iranian father scores 17-18%. They are just more purely caucasian/westasian from what it looks like.
Do you mean Georgians? Or North Caucasians? NCs score 20-25% North European (Dodecad), at least Chechens and Dagestanis.

[Kyp]

Do you mean Georgians? Or North Caucasians? NCs score 20-25% North European (Dodecad), at least Chechens and Dagestanis.

Georgians

[MS85]

Are Georgians closer to the Armenians or to the Kurds? I think that Georgians are closer to the Kurds because Armenians have a lot Levant/Eastern Mediterranean DNA, while Georgians ae mostly CHG and Kurds have a lot Neo_Iran. And CHG and Neo_Iran are very similar to each other.

[MS85]

I found it! Kurds and Georgians are much closer to each other than Armenians and Georgians!

https://i.postimg.cc/v8xkk0dS/nature13673-f2.jpg

According to this chart even Iranians are very close to the Georgians, but it is known that Georgians are closer to Kurds, than Georgians to Iranians.

[Tigranes]

Are Georgians closer to the Armenians or to the Kurds? I think that Georgians are closer to the Kurds because Armenians have a lot Levant/Eastern Mediterranean DNA, while Georgians ae mostly CHG and Kurds have a lot Neo_Iran. And CHG and Neo_Iran are very similar to each other.

Georgians and Kurds literally have nothing to do, Kurds are closer to other peoples of the Levant/Iran than anything else.

https://qph.fs.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-2ae94fd163e404f7379ba14e1675c434

[Tigranes]

http://i58.tinypic.com/dgtr2r.png

[MS85]

Georgians and Kurds literally have nothing to do, Kurds are closer to other peoples of the Levant/Iran than anything else.

https://qph.fs.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-2ae94fd163e404f7379ba14e1675c434No, as you can see genetically speaking Kurds and Georgians are very close to each other. It is actually the Armenians who are close to the people of the Levant. Armenians are genetically very close to the Semitic Assyrians and other Semites from the Levant. Armenians are much more 'western' shifted than Georgians and Kurds

[MS85]

These charts are from the academic paper of David Reich et al.

https://i.postimg.cc/N0fm2C4s/wykres-PCA.png
https://i.postimg.cc/TPw53Ldh/nature13673-f2.jpg

[Tigranes]

No, as you can see genetically speaking Kurds and Georgians are very close to each other. It is actually the Armenians who are close to the people of the Levant. Armenians are genetically very close to the Semitic Assyrians and other Semites from the Levant. Armenians are much more 'western' shifted than Georgians and Kurds

Being "Semitic" is related to the language and culture rather than genetic make-up, some Armenians being closer to Assyrians can be explained by shared ancestors "Hurrians", other than that Armenians have nothing to do with Semites.

[MS85]

Being "Semitic" is related to the language and culture rather than genetic make-up, some Armenians being closer to Assyrians can be explained by shared ancestors "Hurrians", other than that Armenians have nothing to do with Semites.Can be. But in general Armenians have much more eastern Mediterranean ancestry than Kurds or Georgians. Compared to the Kurds or Georgians Armenians don't have much of CHG or Neo_IRN. CHG and Neo_IRN are very similar to each other. That brings Kurds and Georgians very close to each other. Kurds have more than 2 times more Neo_IRN than Armenians. Also, in addition to CHG, there is also a lot Neo_IRN in the Caucasus.

What brings Armenians and Assyrians together is eastern Mediterranean ancestry + SouthWest Asian ancestry in the Armenians and Caucasian ancestry in the Assyrians.

[Leto]

Kurds are more similar to Azeris and Northern Iranians than Armenians.

[Tigranes]

Can be. But in general Armenians have much more eastern Mediterranean ancestry than Kurds or Georgians. Compared to the Kurds or Georgians Armenians don't have much of CHG or Neo_IRN. CHG and Neo_IRN are very similar to each other. That brings Kurds and Georgians very close to each other. Kurds have more than 2 times more Neo_IRN than Armenians. Also, in addition to CHG, there is also a lot Neo_IRN in the Caucasus.

What brings Armenians and Assyrians together is eastern Mediterranean ancestry + SouthWest Asian ancestry in the Armenians and Caucasian ancestry in the Assyrians.

I was researching stuff related to history of Caucasus, I read something like this "Georgians migrated to Caucasus from Iran...", but couldn't find any information later on, do you know anything about this?

[MS85]

Kurds are more similar to Azeris and Northern Iranians than Armenians.Yeah.

1st closest relatives to Kurds are Western Iranians who live around the Caspian Sea. And Persians.
2nd closest relatives to Kurds are Georgians and Adygeans.

[Tomasso]

Being "Semitic" is related to the language and culture rather than genetic make-up, some Armenians being closer to Assyrians can be explained by shared ancestors "Hurrians", other than that Armenians have nothing to do with Semites.

You are closer to Druzes, Iraq Jews, Lebanese than to North Caucasians. It's clear that Armenians have some Levant ancestry.

[Tigranes]

You are closer to Druzes, Iraq Jews, Lebanese than to North Caucasians. It's clear that Armenians have some Levant ancestry.

That's simply not true. We're not closer to North Caucasians, that's a fact. Georgians are not North Caucasians btw. Armenians are closer to other Anatolian populations than anything else, Pontic Greeks, Laz...

[MS85]

I was researching stuff related to history of Caucasus, I read something like this "Georgians migrated to Caucasus from Iran...", but couldn't find any information later on, do you know anything about this?Colchians were related to the Iranic Medes. The Iranic Medes called themselves after the Colchian Queen Medea. According to the ancient Greeks, also the Persians evolved from the Colchians (Perses). So, some ancient 'Georgians' were closely related to the ancient Iranic people:
"the Greeks considered the ‘Caucasian’ peoples of this region as relatives of the Iranian tribe of the Medes. ‘Medea’, daughter of Aeëtes is portrayed as an ancestress of the West-Iranian Medes, a fact her ‘magical’ inclinations seem an attempt to reinforce. Aeetes’ parents were portrayed in myths (i.e – Odyssey) as the deified sun, Helios, and the Okeanid nymph, Perseis. His brother was Perses, and they were both portrayed as wizard-kings.

The Titan Perses (‘Destroyer’) was said in Hesiod’s theogony to have wedded Asteria (‘Starry One’) and fathered Hekate (‘the night-wanderer’), whom the Argonaut myths relate as a goddess served by Medea and/or Circe. The ‘Perseid’ names (including that of the other epic hero Perseus) have a convenient linguistic similarity to that of the nations of Persians, whose lands bordered Colchis and Armenia. For Greeks of the (Hellenistic) era of Apollonius of Rhodes, the connection between Persians and destruction would have still been a painful and fairly recent memory of the Greco-Persian Wars. The Caucasus however, is also the scene of the Persian myths of the world’s destructive creation, as I shall go on to examine!" https://atlanticreligion.com/category/ancient-persian-religion/


There was also a Parthian migration into Georgia. Parthians brought Mithraism into Georgia. It has been said that their 'St. Georgi' is a Christianized name for Mithra.


Actually, also the eastern Iranic Ossetians are very close to the Iranians on the Iranian Plateau. Their DNA has been tested and according to academic papers Irani DNA in the Ossetians is from the Iranian Plateau.

[Tomasso]

That's simply not true. We're not closer to North Caucasians, that's a fact. Georgians are not North Caucasians btw. Armenians are closer to other Anatolian populations than anything else, Pontic Greeks, Laz...

Yes, but the closest genetic cousins to Armenians are the Assyrians, Caucasus Jews and Northern Syrians along Pontians and East Anatolian Inc. Kurds and some Iranians.

[Tigranes]

Colchians were related to the Iranic Medes. The Iranic Medes called themselves after the Colchian Queen Medea. According to the ancient Greeks, also the Persians evolved from the Colchians (Perses). So, some ancient 'Georgian' were very closely related to the ancient Iranic people: "the Greeks considered the ‘Caucasian’ peoples of this region as relatives of the Iranian tribe of the Medes. ‘Medea’, daughter of Aeëtes is portrayed as an ancestress of the West-Iranian Medes, a fact her ‘magical’ inclinations seem an attempt to reinforce. Aeetes’ parents were portrayed in myths (i.e – Odyssey) as the deified sun, Helios, and the Okeanid nymph, Perseis. His brother was Perses, and they were both portrayed as wizard-kings.

The Titan Perses (‘Destroyer’) was said in Hesiod’s theogony to have wedded Asteria (‘Starry One’) and fathered Hekate (‘the night-wanderer’), whom the Argonaut myths relate as a goddess served by Medea and/or Circe. The ‘Perseid’ names (including that of the other epic hero Perseus) have a convenient linguistic similarity to that of the nations of Persians, whose lands bordered Colchis and Armenia. For Greeks of the (Hellenistic) era of Apollonius of Rhodes, the connection between Persians and destruction would have still been a painful and fairly recent memory of the Greco-Persian Wars. The Caucasus however, is also the scene of the Persian myths of the world’s destructive creation, as I shall go on to examine!" https://atlanticreligion.com/category/ancient-persian-religion/

There was also a Parthian migration into Georgia. Parthians brought Mithraism into Georgia. It has been said that their 'st. Georgi' is a Christinized name for Mithra.

Actually, also the eastern Iranic Ossetians are very close to the Iranian on the Iranian Plateau

Thanks for the information. How could you explain the huge difference between their appearance despite the genetic affinity?

[MS85]

How could you explain the huge difference between their appearance despite the genetic affinity?I don't know. There was some difference between the ancient CHG and Neo_IRN.

[FinalFlash]

I don't know. There was some difference between the ancient CHG and Neo_IRN.

Armenians have more CHG affinities than any Iranic ethnic group. Iranic groups have more Iran_N affinities than Armenians.

The reason why Armenians shift west relative to Iranics and Georgians is mainly because of elevated EEF in Armenians.

[casedelpapel]

Thanks for the information. How could you explain the huge difference between their appearance despite the genetic affinity?

I have been misindentified as a Georgian ( I was called Gruzin, thats the russian word for Georgian or not ) dozens of times, especially in Russia and Georgia proper, even in Turkey but never never as an Armenian.
There are like 10 to 15 times more Kurds then Georgians, of course there are more differences in between the Kurds while Georgians look more closely to eachother but there s a big amout of Kurds who look like Georgians or better said, Georgians look like a certain part of the kurdish population.

[Tigranes]

I have been misindentified as a Georgian ( I was called Gruzin, thats the russian word for Georgian or not ) dozens of times, especially in Russia and Georgia proper, even in Turkey but never never as an Armenian.
There are like 10 to 15 times more Kurds then Georgians, of course there are more differences in between the Kurds while Georgians look more closely to eachother but there s a big amout of Kurds who look like Georgians or better said, Georgians look like certain part of the kurdish population.

Seriously what are you guys smoking? Hashish? Stop being such a desperate OWD, Georgians and Kurds literally have no resemblance in terms of appearance...

[casedelpapel]

Seriously what are you guys smoking? Hashish? Stop being such a desperate OWD, Georgians and Kurds literally have no resemblance in terms of appearance...


Its my personal experience, some people in Georgia looked even like my own family members.

[Adamastor]

Seriously what are you guys smoking? Hashish? Stop being such a desperate OWD, Georgians and Kurds literally have no resemblance in terms of appearance...

I must agree with you. Most Georgians I've seen look similar to Europeans somehow (despite being far from Euros genetically), Kurds and Iranic peoples in general don't look very Euro, they can easily be spotted in Europe. I've been to Germany and there almost no Kurd passes as ethnic German or even as Balkaner. Many Georgians can pass for Balkan.

It seems that the so called 'West Asian' component doesn't make someone swarthy. Abkhazians are heavily West Asian and they are very light. Ancient Greeks depicted the peoples living in Caucasus region and northeastern Anatolia as very light, lighter than Greeks even.

[FinalFlash]

I must agree with you. Most Georgians I've seen look similar to Europeans somehow (despite being far from Euros genetically), Kurds and Iranic peoples in general don't look very Euro, they can easily be spotted in Europe. I've been to Germany and there almost no Kurd passes as ethnic German or even as Balkaner. Many Georgians can pass for Balkan.

It seems that the so called 'West Asian' component doesn't make someone swarthy. Abkhazians are heavily West Asian and they are very light. Ancient Greeks depicted the peoples living in Caucasus region and northeastern Anatolia as very light, lighter than Greeks even.

CHG component isn't a dark component, you are correct. Hence why Caucasians, while non-european looking on average, are mostly light-skinned.

[FinalFlash]

I have been misindentified as a Georgian ( I was called Gruzin, thats the russian word for Georgian or not ) dozens of times, especially in Russia and Georgia proper, even in Turkey but never never as an Armenian.
There are like 10 to 15 times more Kurds then Georgians, of course there are more differences in between the Kurds while Georgians look more closely to eachother but there s a big amout of Kurds who look like Georgians or better said, Georgians look like a certain part of the kurdish population.

On average,.Kurds don't resemble Georgians or vice versa. If anything, phenotypically, Georgians resemble Armenians far better than Kurds.

[Altaylardan Tunaya]

I traveled to georgia two times. there is a lot of diversity. those who live close to the turkish border often have colored eyes and light skin color. but there are also many georgiers who resemble their armenian and azerbaijani neighbors (swarthy, hairy, big head).

Western georgians and circassians are the most attractive people in the caucasus imo.

[Tigranes]

I must agree with you. Most Georgians I've seen look similar to Europeans somehow (despite being far from Euros genetically), Kurds and Iranic peoples in general don't look very Euro, they can easily be spotted in Europe. I've been to Germany and there almost no Kurd passes as ethnic German or even as Balkaner. Many Georgians can pass for Balkan.

It seems that the so called 'West Asian' component doesn't make someone swarthy. Abkhazians are heavily West Asian and they are very light. Ancient Greeks depicted the peoples living in Caucasus region and northeastern Anatolia as very light, lighter than Greeks even.

It's already known fact, peoples of North Caucasus are lighter than Southern Europeans, Georgians are not North Caucasians though, Georgians are predominantly light people also, and have no resemblance with Kurds in terms of appearance, apparently casedelpapel thinks that Kurds and Georgians look like each other because some people in Georgia looked even like his own family members which is laughable. ;)

Average Georgian look:

https://www.advantour.com/img/georgia/population/georgian-people5.jpg

https://img-s3.onedio.com/id-57a8442e1a9c68c12fd95d59/rev-0/raw/s-51f4560779a80665f7bb87f94b1fac6cbf1381be.jpg

[casedelpapel]

It's already known fact, peoples of North Caucasus are lighter than Southern Europeans, Georgians are not North Caucasians though, Georgians are predominantly light people also, and have no resemblance with Kurds in terms of appearance, apparently casedelpapel thinks that Kurds and Georgians look like each other because some people in Georgia looked even like his own family members which is laughable. ;)

why should i lie, tell me what kind of advantage i gain from it ?

Kurds and Georgians do not live far apart from eachother, they are more or less neighbours
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/80/Kurdish_settlement.jpg
Georgians settled all over Iran and adopted Islam, so there s also a lot of mixing, the same goes for Turkey
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iranian_Georgians

I mean there s also a lot of mixing between Kurds and Armenians, the story may not be so pleasant because of the circumstances in which it happened, but saying that there s nothing in common and no resemblace is like a joke,
the people from Northern Syria, Anatolia, Northern Iran and Southern Caucasus have no big difference, the ethnic origin doesnt matter in this context, you will find red haired and white Arabs in Northern Iraq resembling more people from Turkey or the Caucasus while Arabs in Southern Iraq look totally different.

[XenophobicPrussian]

Seriously what are you guys smoking? Hashish? Stop being such a desperate OWD, Georgians and Kurds literally have no resemblance in terms of appearance...
The fuck are you smoking? No resemblance, really? Maybe to the 200 obscure anthrotards in the world who look at the tiniest most insignificant differences.

There is a pan-West Asian look and then even a pan-Mediterannean/southern Caucasoid look, you can say there are obvious differences between Georgians and Kurds but to say they have "no resemblance" is ridiculous. There is even an extremely close and obvious resemblance between Moroccans, Georgians and Kurds.

Kurds:

https://www.armytimes.com/resizer/cwo2xNRyb6ou8YJ5QuBbxJiOV3A=/1200x0/filters:quality(100)/arc-anglerfish-arc2-prod-mco.s3.amazonaws.com/public/HT3CMSTZ6RH5JPVVVEMOS3LCH4.jpg

https://blogsmedia.lse.ac.uk/blogs.dir/22/files/2019/03/ypg-in-afrin.jpg

https://anfenglish.com/uploads/en/articles/2017/05/20170501-ypg-fighters-tabqafdf92e-image.jpg

http://www.thetower.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/IMG_1074.jpg

Georgians:

http://agenda.ge/files/files/024/mine-invention-inline1.jpg

http://site.rugby.ge/_rugby/images/news/Quick-news/2014/SquadUpdatesaheadtospain_Instory.jpg

https://thumbs.dreamstime.com/z/young-wine-festival-tbilisi-georgian-men-dresses-national-clothes-annual-ethnographic-museum-may-visitors-30938693.jpg

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/44977000/jpg/_44977228_hands_afp.jpg

https://images.haarets.co.il/image/fetch/w_2030,h_1173,x_0,y_4,c_crop,g_north_west/w_609,h_343,q_auto,c_fill,f_auto/fl_any_format.preserve_transparency.progressive:no ne/https://www.haaretz.com/polopoly_fs/1.5719190.1515531553!/image/1018316866.jpg

Kurds are pretty much just more tanned Georgians with less Khadyrov(yes I know he isn't Georgian) looking outliers.

[Tigranes]

;) You've just proved that I was right, did you even look at the pictures you posted? What a junkie? Kurds have robust features, "Proto Iranid", Dolicho- mesocephalic with a straight, mildly leptorrhine nose, chin strong while Georgians have soft features, however they also have prominent aquiline/straight noses similar to Armenians.


The fuck are you smoking? No resemblance, really? Maybe to the 200 obscure anthrotards in the world who look at the tiniest most insignificant differences.

There is a pan-West Asian look and then even a pan-Mediterannean/southern Caucasoid look, you can say there are obvious differences between Georgians and Kurds but to say they have "no resemblance" is ridiculous. There is even an extremely close and obvious resemblance between Moroccans, Georgians and Kurds.

Kurds:

https://www.armytimes.com/resizer/cwo2xNRyb6ou8YJ5QuBbxJiOV3A=/1200x0/filters:quality(100)/arc-anglerfish-arc2-prod-mco.s3.amazonaws.com/public/HT3CMSTZ6RH5JPVVVEMOS3LCH4.jpg

https://blogsmedia.lse.ac.uk/blogs.dir/22/files/2019/03/ypg-in-afrin.jpg

https://anfenglish.com/uploads/en/articles/2017/05/20170501-ypg-fighters-tabqafdf92e-image.jpg

http://www.thetower.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/IMG_1074.jpg

Georgians:

http://agenda.ge/files/files/024/mine-invention-inline1.jpg

http://site.rugby.ge/_rugby/images/news/Quick-news/2014/SquadUpdatesaheadtospain_Instory.jpg

https://thumbs.dreamstime.com/z/young-wine-festival-tbilisi-georgian-men-dresses-national-clothes-annual-ethnographic-museum-may-visitors-30938693.jpg

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/44977000/jpg/_44977228_hands_afp.jpg

https://images.haarets.co.il/image/fetch/w_2030,h_1173,x_0,y_4,c_crop,g_north_west/w_609,h_343,q_auto,c_fill,f_auto/fl_any_format.preserve_transparency.progressive:no ne/https://www.haaretz.com/polopoly_fs/1.5719190.1515531553!/image/1018316866.jpg

Kurds are pretty much just more tanned Georgians with less Khadyrov(yes I know he isn't Georgian) looking outliers.

Kurds
Proto-Iranid(Group: Mediterranid , Orientalid):

http://humanphenotypes.net/protoiranidm.jpg

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/A13S8ykCIAEiHVj.jpg

http://abload.de/img/00e7056ec788d5b42162aowdhf.jpg

Georgians
Mtebid(Group: Alpinid, Armenoid, Dinarid):

http://humanphenotypes.net/mtebidm.jpg

https://cdn.ambebi.ge/media/__thumbs__/thumb/630x415/images/new_photo/sazogadoeba/xalxi/betqil-shukvani-98659.jpg

http://ligamistru-2003-2004.xf.cz/obrazky/fotky/rangers/400x600/shota_arveladze.jpg

[Leto]

There are quite a few Georgians with brown hair and green-blue eyes (even though their North European admixture is smaller than in any Southern European country). Kurds are less light than them.
https://i0.wp.com/escxtra.com/wp-content/uploads/OFFICIAL-OTO-NEMSADZE.jpeg?resize=780%2C405&ssl=1
http://agenda.ge/files/news/031/665d3585817aeae79eb31763b54584ac.jpg

[casedelpapel]

The fuck are you smoking? No resemblance, really? Maybe to the 200 obscure anthrotards in the world who look at the tiniest most insignificant differences.

There is a pan-West Asian look and then even a pan-Mediterannean/southern Caucasoid look, you can say there are obvious differences between Georgians and Kurds but to say they have "no resemblance" is ridiculous. There is even an extremely close and obvious resemblance between Moroccans, Georgians and Kurds.

Kurds:

https://www.armytimes.com/resizer/cwo2xNRyb6ou8YJ5QuBbxJiOV3A=/1200x0/filters:quality(100)/arc-anglerfish-arc2-prod-mco.s3.amazonaws.com/public/HT3CMSTZ6RH5JPVVVEMOS3LCH4.jpg

https://blogsmedia.lse.ac.uk/blogs.dir/22/files/2019/03/ypg-in-afrin.jpg

https://anfenglish.com/uploads/en/articles/2017/05/20170501-ypg-fighters-tabqafdf92e-image.jpg

http://www.thetower.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/IMG_1074.jpg

Georgians:

http://agenda.ge/files/files/024/mine-invention-inline1.jpg

http://site.rugby.ge/_rugby/images/news/Quick-news/2014/SquadUpdatesaheadtospain_Instory.jpg

https://thumbs.dreamstime.com/z/young-wine-festival-tbilisi-georgian-men-dresses-national-clothes-annual-ethnographic-museum-may-visitors-30938693.jpg

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/44977000/jpg/_44977228_hands_afp.jpg

https://images.haarets.co.il/image/fetch/w_2030,h_1173,x_0,y_4,c_crop,g_north_west/w_609,h_343,q_auto,c_fill,f_auto/fl_any_format.preserve_transparency.progressive:no ne/https://www.haaretz.com/polopoly_fs/1.5719190.1515531553!/image/1018316866.jpg

Kurds are pretty much just more tanned Georgians with less Khadyrov(yes I know he isn't Georgian) looking outliers.


thank you, it destroys their arguments because according to all the people around us, we Kurds are from India or something close to it who stole all of their lands and we are not native to this region, therefore we cannot look close the people around us.
Therefore population groups who live like 50 kilometers apart must look totally different because we Kurds are outsiders, otherwise it will be a shock for them.

Aleppo is a pretty good exemple to showcase the difference, take an arab syrian guy, a turkmen guy and a kurdish man from there, you wont know the difference, compare the arab guy or the kurdish guy with an armenian man and you will not see the difference instantly,
but compare the arab guy from Aleppo with a Bedouin from the deserts and i assure you will recognize the difference instantly, because these people more or less developed agriculture and there s has been a lot of exchange in between the people there while the Bedouins are from the deserts and simply another population which developed seperatly and it more related to Yemenis or Saudis.
The Russians who are Slavs but also settled down in the region are another group and i am sure, a Russian in Armenia will look more closely to a Russian in Sankt Petersburg then to the people around them, who from a racial point of view are the same people, i may be hanged fo this and it may blasphemy for some here but i stand by this.

[Leto]

@casedelpapel, are you a Hadouken sockpuppet?

[Altaylardan Tunaya]

Turkish kurds are phenotype-wise closer to armenians than to georgians.

[MS85]

Armenians have more CHG affinities than any Iranic ethnic group. Iranic groups have more Iran_N affinities than Armenians.

The reason why Armenians shift west relative to Iranics and Georgians is mainly because of elevated EEF in Armenians.Kurds have 50% of the Neolithic_Anatolian farmer or Armenian Copper Age auDNA. And still, Kurds are closer to the 'Hurrian' people. While Armenians are closer to the Greeks and Northwest Semitic people like the Assyrians.

[casedelpapel]

Who is Hadouken ?

[Root]

Who is Hadouken ?





https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=49jKoMbJyEo

[Altaylardan Tunaya]

Old member (alevi kurd from tunceli).

[Tigranes]

Turkish kurds are phenotype-wise closer to armenians than to georgians.

Turkish Kurds look closer to Turks anything else, I know you guys love to promote your "Western Turk" bs, but I'm not buying it...

[MS85]

Turkish Kurds look closer to Turks anything else, I know you guys love to promote your "Western Turk" bs, but I'm not buying it...When you examine the DNA, the (Eastern & Central) Anatolian Turks and Armenians are actually very similar to each other and mostly the very same people. Most Anatolian Armenians became Turks.

[Altaylardan Tunaya]

Turkish Kurds look closer to Turks anything else, I know you guys love to promote your "Western Turk" bs, but I'm not buying it...

I know many kurds. Some have typical 'iranid/exotic' traits (long face, swarthy as an indian, have thick eyebrows). But there are also kurds who resemble armenians and also eastern turks. take a look, you'll find many armenoids, east meds, taurids among turkish kurds. there are also kurds with turanid traits (from maras,urfa,adiyaman). They are a minority tho.

I have no agenda, lol.

[Rgvgjhvv]

I'm the ONLY REAL Georgian on this entire forum. If you have any questions, direct them towards ME.

[Zoro]

I know many kurds. Some have typical 'iranid/exotic' traits (long face, swarthy as an indian, have thick eyebrows). But there are also kurds who resemble armenians and also eastern turks. take a look, you'll find many armenoids, east meds, taurids among turkish kurds. there are also kurds with turanid traits (from maras,urfa,adiyaman). They are a minority tho.

I have no agenda, lol.

I agree with you regarding Kurds from Turkey, but I think us Iraqi Kurds have our own unique look such as these. I haven’t seen Georgians but I don’t think we look like them. If anything we look more like Persians or Pakistanis

http://i.imgur.com/yAPFkoq.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/pww43va.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/fmMxrFq.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/iIeholl.jpg

[casedelpapel]

I'm the ONLY REAL Georgian on this entire forum. If you have any questions, direct them towards ME.

why do you have the best food ? Whats your secret ?

[MS85]

I'm the ONLY REAL Georgian on this entire forum. If you have any questions, direct them towards ME.There are not many of them, but Georgians are good people. Georgians were (are) very honorable toward the Yezidi Kurds in Georgia. Kurds (Kurdistan) couldn't wish the better neighbors.

[casedelpapel]

I agree with you regarding Kurds from Turkey, but I think us Iraqi Kurds have our own unique look such as these. I haven’t seen Georgians but I don’t think we look like them. If anything we look more like Persians or Pakistanis

http://i.imgur.com/yAPFkoq.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/pww43va.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/fmMxrFq.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/iIeholl.jpg


nope, i may be only half iraqi kurd but literally half of the tribes are seperated through the borders, like the Herki, Jaff and probably Zebari,
dont picture some Koshnaw or Baban or Talabanis to promote an unique iraqi kurdish look, thats not true.

[casedelpapel]

I have never had a bad experience with Georgians, welcoming nice people.

[MS85]

I agree with you regarding Kurds from Turkey, but I think us Iraqi Kurds have our own unique look such as these. I haven’t seen Georgians but I don't think we look like them. If anything we look more like Persians or PakistanisI was born and raised in Georgia (Tbilisi).

I have seen many Sorani Kurds who look more Georgian than I do.


There is absolutely NO unique look in Southern Kurds. All Kurds look the same.

[MS85]

I agree with you regarding Kurds from Turkey, but I think us Iraqi Kurds have our own unique look such as these. I haven’t seen Georgians but I don’t think we look like them. If anything we look more like Persians or Pakistanis

http://i.imgur.com/fmMxrFq.jpg
I'm Ezdi Kurmanji Kurd with most of my ancestors from the northern Kurdistan and I have got many relatives who look like these girls. Very mainstream Kurds.

[Rgvgjhvv]

why do you have the best food ? Whats your secret ?

https://media0.giphy.com/media/11zCvCaGnxszYs/giphy.gif


There are not many of them, but Georgians are good people. Georgians were (are) very honorable toward the Yezidi Kurds in Georgia. Kurds (Kurdistan) couldn't wish the better neighbors.

Peace and love brotha

[Leto]

I was born and raised in Georgia (Tbilisi). Many Sorani Kurds who live close to Rojhelat.

I have seen many Sorani Kurds who look more Georgian than I do.


There is absolutely NO unique look in Southern Kurds. All Kurds look the same.
On TA I've read Iraqi Kurds are mixed Ayrabs, therefore not pure.

[casedelpapel]

On TA I've read Iraqi Kurds are mixed Ayrabs, therefore not pure.


thats a rumour promoted by the PKK . There s not such a thing as a Iraqi Kurds, the majority of the kurds are tribally organized and they have never cared about the borders of our enemies.

[Zoro]

On TA I've read Iraqi Kurds are mixed Ayrabs, therefore not pure.

Not true, show me proof.

[MS85]

On TA I've read Iraqi Kurds are mixed Ayrabs, therefore not pure.This in not true. Iraqi Kurds are not mixed with the Arabs.

Of course there are some cases of interracial marriage between the Kurds and Arabs in the big cities like Mosul or Baghdad, but not that much. It is overrated. Kurds have and live in their own region and Arabs have and live in their own region. There are regions in southern Kurdistan (like Qandil) where people never have seen an Arabs in their life.

[MS85]

trhats a rumour promoted by the PKK.PKK have nothing to do it. PKK promotes actually much more pan-Kurdewari (pan-Kurdistanism) than traitors like Barzani who is only interested in Barzanistan.

[Leto]

Not true, show me proof.
Well, you are atypical yourself, what's with your 10 percent mongoloid admixture? Most Kurds are barely 1-3% mongoloid.

[casedelpapel]

some Kurds from Turkey try to portray us this way , the majority of these guys who do not speak kurdish and are to a high degree turkified adopt the turkish arrogance and spread this rumour, mostly PKK supporters from european ghettos, had enough encounters of this kind, i was racially abused by Arabs as they thought i am non iraqi and called me a Christian , i will never forget this. I am a Muslim Shafayi Kurd, not a Christian !

[MS85]

Not true, show me proof.Are you Sorani or Feyli? Or maybe mixed Sorani?

Btw, most Kurdish areas in southern Kurdistan are almost for 100% Kurdish. Heartland of Kurdistan, like the Qandil Mountains are purely Kurdish.

https://i.postimg.cc/sDXByJWF/798-5-800.jpg


There are 0 Arabs in out beloved Zagros Mountains!


https://i.postimg.cc/kgPdwJqj/35522-IRQ20180609-Qandil-1529477793932.jpg
https://i.postimg.cc/sXxF1142/20180610-20180610-20180422-ehit-vedat17-1743472-imaged7dba7-imag.jpg
https://i.postimg.cc/0QBTSxV0/8428259946-0c97e3e4ce-b.jpg
https://i.postimg.cc/CMZ1QKpY/thumbs-b-c-552c7207cdb5f0f9d2dd7185ce2eb50b.jpg

[MS85]

More of Qandil. Arabs don't like the mountains. 100% pure Kurdish with only 100% pure Kurdish villages!

https://i.postimg.cc/qRsmJT97/4a7de1be3df8a1044f3f7b97467f9e33.jpg
https://i.postimg.cc/XqnsXPbk/422463.jpg
https://i.postimg.cc/yxnvRT64/13469376603-dafa81738f-b.jpg
https://i.postimg.cc/3JJLTz9K/kandil-pkk-kuzeyirak.jpg
https://i.postimg.cc/Gh7XhzSv/pkkcamp-777x437.jpg
https://i.postimg.cc/Z5WV9312/qandil-gr.jpg

[MS85]

http://i.imgur.com/pww43va.jpgShe is not an Iraqi Kurd. She is an Ezdi Kurd born in Russia who converted to Christianity, married to a Russian guy and is a popular singer in Russia. Her name is 'Zara'.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zara_(Russian_singer)


Btw, she can't sing.

[MS85]

She is not an Iraqi Kurd. She is an Ezdi Kurd born in Russia who converted to Christianity, married to a Russian guy and is a popular singer in Russia. Her name is 'Zara'.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zara_(Russian_singer)


Btw, she can't sing.You can see her singing here in Kurdish to a Russian public, lol.

IMO she is not really an attractive gold digger.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WCkEMMV6iqA


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Al0uRT4jSE

[Tigranes]

She is not an Iraqi Kurd. She is an Ezdi Kurd born in Russia who converted to Christianity, married to a Russian guy and is a popular singer in Russia. Her name is 'Zara'.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zara_(Russian_singer)


Btw, she can't sing.

What do you mean she can't sing?


https://youtu.be/YBWAHfSrX8I

[Leto]

I remember this Yazidi refugee family from Iraq, the woman looks very spectacular
https://cdn.cnn.com/cnnnext/dam/assets/140817123320-02-jaff-yazidi-faces01-horizontal-large-gallery.jpg
https://cdn.cnn.com/cnnnext/dam/assets/140817123331-03-jaff-yazidi-faces05-horizontal-large-gallery.jpg
https://edition.cnn.com/2014/08/17/world/meast/yazidi-refugees/index.html

Such blue eyes are very rare in non-white countries, even in the majority West Eurasian Middle East. As a GEDmatch nerd I wonder how much Baltic she would score, she MUST have some Aryan blood :D xD

[MS85]

What do you mean she can't sing?Yeah, both of her parents are Ezdi Kurds from Armenia. But she was born in Leningrad. Simply, she just can't sing. She is also a very irritating gold digger. Every time I hear her singing I've to take a shit.

[MS85]

I remember this Yazidi refugee family from Iraq, the woman looks very spectacular

Such blue eyes are very rare in non-white countries, even in the majority West Eurasian Middle East. As a GEDmatch nerd I wonder how much Baltic she would score, she MUST have some Aryan blood :D xDDude, Aryans have nothing to do with the Baltics. Aryan Medes or Persians were just brown as the Kurds.

There are many Ezdi Kurds with 'blue' eyes. It is not very rare among us.


Ezdi family from Shengal:

https://i.postimg.cc/XNFTDMqX/kurds-ezdi.jpg

[Leto]

Don't start this Aryan debate please, most people agree the Bronze Age tribes were racially white and very different from the Persians of today.

The Yazidis are very endogamous, so they have managed to preserve those phenotypic traits in their gene pool. Just like many Haredi Jews have blondish or reddish hair (they have more European in them than Kurds of course but still majority of their DNA is southern).

[MS85]

Don't start this Aryan debate please, most people agree the Bronze Age tribes were racially white and very different from the Persian of today.Whatever. Aryan Medes (Kurdish ancestors) evolved within Kurdistan. The Medes were never of 'white' (European) race. And people in Kurdistan were never European. Kurdistan has always been 'brown'.

But I'm not a dictator of the human mind, you can believe in whatever you want.

[casedelpapel]

PKK have nothing to do it. PKK promotes actually much more pan-Kurdewari (pan-Kurdistanism) than traitors like Barzani who is only interested in Barzanistan.



please stop this nonsense, PKK is promoting fake kurdish militarist leftist propaganda, they dont know what a Kurd is, they use it as a political ideology, since 1992 and after Raparin which i remember very well, they settled there and use the territorry to both attack the KRG and Turkey. There s already a kurdish goverrnment and PKK has to simply obey, believe me, if i would be in a government position and not those weak tribal minded Barzanis, i would have arrested all of the PKK and put them into prison for disrespecting the kurdish government.
PKK undermines the only real kurdish defacto state since its creation, its was even ready to start a new civil war on behalf of Iraq, under the iraqi flag, i dont really care anymore about them, they have undermined the referendum and therefore my greatest dream and those of millions of other Kurds.
PKK had never a problem to work with Iraq and supports iraqi control over our lands instead of our state, Iraq is the biggest, most brutal, most menacing threat to the Kurds but PKK doesnt care and we are forced to live under the iraqi flag because of PKK.
they always cry Turkey but when it suits them, they promote to vote for the CHP, Atatürks party, not Atakürts party.
Bashur needs Turkey to get rid of Iraq and become the first real independent kurdish region, instead they claim that it will change to a turkish colony, bullshit, independence and recognition by other states will open a glorious new chapter in our history and Barzani showed that he does not care about Turkeys opinion, otherwise he would not have dared to upheld the referendum and one day this referendum result will be the key to get rid of Iraq, the results are only freezed, not cancelled, not PKKs Northern Syria or democratic Turkeys project, no only Kurdistan is the solution. Mesut Barzani did it and for this i will respect him.
In what kind of world, PKK dares to take control over freed kurdish lands and face the legimate democratically elected and supported government militarily, because thats what they do, they dont obey Pesmherga order nor the kurdish government and the institutions and impede the whole process forcing Turkey too upon KRG but KRG willl not fight Turkey for the sake of PKK and cantons or democratic Turkey or democratic Syria.

[Leto]

Whatever. Aryan Medes evolved within Kurdistan. And people in Kurdistan were never European. Kurdistan has always been 'brown'.

But I'm not dictator of the human mind, you can believe in whatever you want.
I don't disagree with that, what I mean is that the Bronze Age tribes in the Steppe were much more European than Middle Eastern genetically. Pamiri Tajiks and some Afghans and Pakis have the most of that ancestry. You do realize Pashtuns have more Baltic than Kurds.

[MS85]

I don't disagree with that, what I mean is that the Bronze Age tribes in the Steppe were much more European than Middle Eastern genetically. Pamiri Tajiks and some Afghans and Pakis have the most of that ancestry. You do realize Pashtuns have more Baltic than Kurds.Bronze Age tribes in the Steppes were partly European (white), partly Mongoloid and with a lot Neo_Iranian farmer auDNA. They were NOT Iranic.

My people (Ezdi Kurds, the Medes etc.) have nothing to do with the Bronze Age Steppe people at the first place. Kurds are 50% Copper Age Iranians and 50% Copper Age Armenians.

There is a minor link between the Kurds and the Steppes and that is the Iron Age Scythians or Cimmerians who connect Kurds somehow to the Steppes.


We have nothing to do with the Pashtuns. Pashtuns have a very different history compared to the Kurds. Pashtuns are a mixture between BMAC, Scythians and the Dravidian people. Kurds have very different roots to Indo-Aryan (Indic) people in South Central Asia. Kurds are Northwest Iranians and not Indic. There is a reason why we are called NorthWest Iranians


And Tajiks are originally Persians from Iran.

[MS85]

please stop this nonsense, PKK is promoting fake kurdish militarist leftist propaganda, they dont know what a Kurd is, they use it as a political ideology, since 1992 and after Raparin which i remember very well, they settled there and use the territorry to both attack the KRG and Turkey. There s already a kurdish goverrnment and PKK has to simply obey, believe me, if i would be in a government position and not those weak tribal minded Barzanis, i would have arrested all of the PKK and put them into prison for disrespecting the kurdish government.
PKK undermines the only real kurdish defacto state since its creation, its was even ready to start a new civil war on behalf of Iraq, under the iraqi flag, i dont really care anymore about them, they have undermined the referendum and therefore my greatest dream and those of millions of other Kurds.
PKK had never a problem to work with Iraq and supports iraqi control over our lands instead of our state, Iraq is the biggest, most brutal, most menacing threat to the Kurds but PKK doesnt care and we are forced to live under the iraqi flag because of PKK.
they always cry Turkey but when it suits them, they promote to vote for the CHP, Atatürks party, not Atakürts party.
Bashur needs Turkey to get rid of Iraq and become the first real independent kurdish region, instead they claim that it will change to a turkish colony, bullshit, independence and recognition by other states will open a glorious new chapter in our history and Barzani showed that he does not care about Turkeys opinion, otherwise he would not have dared to upheld the referendum and one day this referendum result will be the key to get rid of Iraq, the results are only freezed, not cancelled, not PKKs Northern Syria or democratic Turkeys project, no only Kurdistan is the solution. Mesut Barzani did it and for this i will respect him.
In what kind of world, PKK dares to take control over freed kurdish lands and face the legimate democratically elected and supported government militarily, because thats what they do, they dont obey Pesmherga order nor the kurdish government and the institutions and impede the whole process forcing Turkey too upon KRG but KRG willl not fight Turkey for the sake of PKK and cantons or democratic Turkey or democratic Syria.PKK is the only way to Great Kurdistan! PKK are the Kurdish people, the only PAN-Kurdish organization. In PKK we trust!

[MS85]

Bronze Age tribes in the Steppes were partly European (white), partly Mongoloid and with a lot Neo_Iranian farmer auDNA. They were NOT Iranic.

My people (Ezdi Kurds, the Medes etc.) have nothing to do with the Bronze Age Steppe people at the first place. Kurds are 50% Copper Age Iranians and 50% Copper Age Armenians.

There is a minor link between the Kurds and the Steppes and that is the Iron Age Scythians or Cimmerians who connect Kurds somehow to the Steppes.


We have nothing to do with the Pashtuns. Pashtuns have a very different history compared to the Kurds. Pashtuns are a mixture between BMAC, Scythians and the Dravidian people. Kurds have very different roots to Indo-Aryan (Indic) people in South Central Asia. Kurds are Northwest Iranians and not Indic. There is a reason why we are called NorthWest Iranians


And Tajiks are originally Persians from Iran.+

'Blue' eyes in (Ezdi) Kurds is most likely from the Copper Age people from the Armenian Plateau.

Like those Copper Age people, the Ezdi Kurds have a lot of Y-DNA hg. 'L'. Copper Age Armenians had also Y-DNA haplogroup 'L'

"Three individuals who lived in the Chalcolithic era (c. 5700–6250 years BP), found in the Areni-1 ("Bird's Eye") cave were identified as belonging to haplogroup L1a. One individual's genome indicated that he had red hair and blue eyes."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Areni-1_cave

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4820045/


Most likely those people were related to the people with blue eyes and red hair in Kurdistan. And as evidence we have got Y-DNA haplogroup 'L' in the ancient and modern times.

[MS85]

More about 'blue' eyes: "Anomalous blue-eyed people came to Israel 6,500 years ago from Iran, DNA shows"

https://www.timesofisrael.com/anomalous-blue-eyed-people-came-to-israel-6500-years-ago-from-iran-dna-shows/


That makes blue eyes pretty native to Kurdistan.

[FinalFlash]

Kurds have 50% of the Neolithic_Anatolian farmer or Armenian Copper Age auDNA. And still, Kurds are closer to the 'Hurrian' people. While Armenians are closer to the Greeks and Northwest Semitic people like the Assyrians.

Armenians are closest to Eastern and black sea Turks and Pontians above anyone else. Then comes the East/West subtle genetic divide. It's not hard to grasp.

Kurds have nowhere remotely close to 50% EEF, otherwise known as Anatolia Barcin N. Put the pipe down lol.

[MS85]

Armenians are closest to Eastern and black sea Turks and Pontians above anyone else. Then comes the East/West subtle genetic divide. It's not hard to grasp.

Kurds have nowhere remotely close to 50% EEF, otherwise known as Anatolia Barcin N. Put the pipe down lol.You are right, I made a mistake.

Kurds cluster somewhere within that red circle. They are not really related to the EEF. Also very strange that people from the ancient Anatolia were very different from the people of the ancient Caucasus and Iran. People from the ancient Anatolia clustering closer to the Neo_Levant and even to WHG than to Caucasus/Iran.


https://i.postimg.cc/kgv07Ltw/wykres-PCA.jpg

[FinalFlash]

You are right, I made a mistake.

Kurds cluster somewhere within that red circle. They are not really related to EEF. Also very strange that people from ancient Anatolia were very different from ancient Caucasus and Iran. People from the ancient Anatolia clustering closer to the Neo_Levant and even WHG than to Caucasus/Iran.


https://i.postimg.cc/kgv07Ltw/wykres-PCA.jpg

Levant_N and EEF plot close to one another and both these components peak in Levantines and South Euros respectively. However, the reason why modern day South Euros and Levantines are quite distant from one another is because the former has absorbed a good amount of steppe ancestry. The latter is also not purely Levant_N to begin with.

[Zoro]

You can see her singing here in Kurdish to a Russian public, lol.

IMO she is not really an attractive gold digger.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WCkEMMV6iqA


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Al0uRT4jSE

I like the song but had a hard time understanding it except for sir biland am kecha kurd yam (hold my head high i am daughter of kurd or I’m a kurdish girl) Even though I am fluent in kurmanji

[Zoro]

Are you Sorani or Feyli? Or maybe mixed Sorani?

Btw, most Kurdish areas in southern Kurdistan are almost for 100% Kurdish. Heartland of Kurdistan, like the Qandil Mountains are purely Kurdish.

https://i.postimg.cc/sDXByJWF/798-5-800.jpg


There are 0 Arabs in out beloved Zagros Mountains!


https://i.postimg.cc/kgPdwJqj/35522-IRQ20180609-Qandil-1529477793932.jpg
https://i.postimg.cc/sXxF1142/20180610-20180610-20180422-ehit-vedat17-1743472-imaged7dba7-imag.jpg
https://i.postimg.cc/0QBTSxV0/8428259946-0c97e3e4ce-b.jpg
https://i.postimg.cc/CMZ1QKpY/thumbs-b-c-552c7207cdb5f0f9d2dd7185ce2eb50b.jpg

Kurmanji ( Sindi tribe) and Feyli (Zangana ) and some Turkmen. BTW Some of the kurds that migrated to Baluchistan 500 years ago were from Zangana tribe Some say Sindi tribe is Sindi scythian tribe and some say we are from Sind Pakistan

[Kyp]

MS "WE WUZ" 85

[Tomasso]

Whatever. Aryan Medes (Kurdish ancestors) evolved within Kurdistan. The Medes were never of 'white' (European) race. And people in Kurdistan were never European. Kurdistan has always been 'brown'.

But I'm not a dictator of the human mind, you can believe in whatever you want.

Original Indo Aryans were Yamnaya like and they kept spreading their language as their genes to a lesser extent from Kurdistan to South Asia. Those people are atypical and carry some Yamnaya like admixture from original Indo European speaker founding fathers.

[Zoro]

Double

[Zoro]

Regarding Sindi kurd tribe of N Iraq and other ancestors of Kurds Professor Izady who has taught at Columbia and Harvard states the following: Kurdistanica.com

“
The name ‘Mittani’ survives today in the Kurdish clans of Mattini and Millani/Milli who inhabit the exact same geographical areas of Kurdistan as the ancient Mittani. The name “Mittan,” however, is a Hurrian name rather than Aryan. At the onset of Aryan immigration into Kurdistan, only the aristocracy of the high-ranking warrior groups were Aryans, while the bulk of the people were still Hurrian in all manners.

The Mittani aristocratic house almost certainly was from the immigrant Sindis, who survive today in the populous Kurdish clan of Sindi—again—in the same area where the Mittani kingdom once existed. These ancient Sindi seem to have been an Indic, and not Iranic group of people, and in fact a branch of the better known Sindis of India-Pakistan, that has imparted its name to the River Indus and in fact, India itself. (footnote 8)

While the bulk of the Sindis moved on to India, some wondered into Kurdistan to give rise to the Mittani royal house and the modern Sindi Kurds.Expectedly, the Mittani pantheon includes names like Indra, Varuna, Suriya and Nasatya is typically Indic. The Mittanis could have introduced during this early period some of the Indic/Vedic tradition that appears to be manifest in the Kurdish religion of Yazdanism.

The avalanche of the Indo-European tribes, however, was to come about 1200 BC, raining havoc on the economy and settled culture in the mountains and lowlands alike. The north was settled by the Haigs who are known to us now as the Armenians, while the rest of the mountains became targets of settlement of various Iranic peoples, such as the Medes, Persian, Scythians, Sarmatians, and Sagarthians (whose name survives in the name of the Zagros mountains).By 850 BC, the last Hurrian states had been extinguished by the invading Aryans, whose sheer number of immigrants must have been considerable. These succeeded over time to change the Hurrian language(s) of the people in Kurdistan, as well as their genetic make-up.

By about the 3rd century BC, the Aryanization of the mountain communities was virtually complete.Since the star of the Mittani shown brightest in 1500 BC, Aryan dynasties of various size and influence continued their appearance in various corners of Kurdistan. None, however, was to match, and in fact surpass the Mittanis as the Medians. The rise of the Medes from their capital at Ecbatana (modern Hamadan) in 727 coincided with the fall of the last major Hurrian kingdom: the Mannaeans. Ignoring the proud legacy of the Hurrian states and even the Aryan empire of the Mittanis which can squarely be claimed by on every ground by modern Kurds, it is the Medes that the Kurds have grown most fund of. Medes are claimed regularly by the Kurds and pronounced by others to be the ancestors of them. This is strange, when realizing how many millennia of cultural and ethnic evolution preceded the rise of Medes into Kurdistan. In reality, Medes are no more the ancestors of the modern Kurds as all other Halafian, Hurrian and Mittani who came before them or the legion of other peoples and states that came after them.

Nonetheless, today, even the first Kurdish satellite television transmitter is given the name “Med TV” (Kurdish for “Median TV”). Fascination of the Kurds with the Median Federation (a.k.a., Empire) that ended in 549 BC remains supreme, indeed.”

[MS85]

Original Indo Aryans were Yamnaya like and they kept spreading their language as their genes to a lesser extent from Kurdistan to South Asia. Those people are atypical and carry some Yamnaya like admixture from original Indo European speaker founding fathers.Most likely not. And you mean Indo-IRANIAN. Kurdish is not Indo-Aryan, but simply Aryan (Iranic). The Hittites (close to proto-Anatolians) and the Mycenaeans (proto-Greeks) were not Yamnaya like at all. Yamnaya was just a second stage IE culture that Indo-Europeanised big parts of Europe.
When you follow a Graeco-Aryan group that will lead to a conclusion that Indo-Iranian was derived from Graeco-Aryan around the same place of the Hittites and the Mycenaeans. That makes West Asia the most plausible region where proto-Indo-Iranian is from.

Btw, Yamnaya was almost half West Asian in nature.

[MS85]

Regarding Sindi kurd tribe of N Iraq and other ancestors of Kurds Professor Izady who has taught at Columbia and Harvard states the following: Kurdistanica.comThese views are outdated. People thought this 40 years ago. I'm much more interested what he would think right now.

[Tomasso]

Most likely not.

We're talking about facts not personal opinions. Original Indo Europeans including Indo Iranians were lights apart from Modern Iranians and more genetically resemble Poles or Latvians even.

[MS85]

We're talking about facts not personal opinions. Original Indo Europeans including Indo Iranians were lights apart from Modern Iranians and more genetically resemble Poles or Latvians even.Nothing to do with the personal opinion.

Second stage Indo-Europeans in Yamnaya were dark. There is a study about them. Becasue they were almost for the half West Asian (Iranic) in nature. On average Europeans are only 1/3 Yamnaya.

Modern scientists believe that there were 2 stage of Indo-Europeans. but the original homeland of PIEan is in West Asia. Since they found out that BMAC was also West Asian in nature it was like a nail in the coffin of crazy theories. Also, in the past there was a lot Neo_IRN (Gedrosia) audNA in the Steppes. BMAC (Yaz) is considered as eastern-Iranian/Indo-Aryan and BMAC had nothing to do with the Steppes at all.


https://i.postimg.cc/FHhvLccr/proto-Indo-Europeans.jpg

[Babak]

I have been misindentified as a Georgian ( I was called Gruzin, thats the russian word for Georgian or not ) dozens of times, especially in Russia and Georgia proper, even in Turkey but never never as an Armenian.
There are like 10 to 15 times more Kurds then Georgians, of course there are more differences in between the Kurds while Georgians look more closely to eachother but there s a big amout of Kurds who look like Georgians or better said, Georgians look like a certain part of the kurdish population.

I swear youre a sock of Hadouken. Kurds don't look like Georgians nor do Georgians look like Kurds. Just because you see some degree of resemblance, doesn't mean they look the same. Its like saying Persians look like arabs.

[Tomasso]

Why do Armenians and Kurds want to look like Georgians on this forum? It's really pathetic.

[Babak]

Bronze Age tribes in the Steppes were partly European (white), partly Mongoloid and with a lot Neo_Iranian farmer auDNA. They were NOT Iranic.

My people (Ezdi Kurds, the Medes etc.) have nothing to do with the Bronze Age Steppe people at the first place. Kurds are 50% Copper Age Iranians and 50% Copper Age Armenians.

There is a minor link between the Kurds and the Steppes and that is the Iron Age Scythians or Cimmerians who connect Kurds somehow to the Steppes.


We have nothing to do with the Pashtuns. Pashtuns have a very different history compared to the Kurds. Pashtuns are a mixture between BMAC, Scythians and the Dravidian people. Kurds have very different roots to Indo-Aryan (Indic) people in South Central Asia. Kurds are Northwest Iranians and not Indic. There is a reason why we are called NorthWest Iranians


And Tajiks are originally Persians from Iran.


Tajiks are definitely not from Iran. They are natives who promoted the Persian language, a Western Iranian language.

[Tigranes]

Why do Armenians and Kurds want to look like Georgians on this forum? It's really pathetic.

Get lost troll, no Armenian here want to look like other peoples, I just stated the facts, also just for the record I would pass in Georgia with no problem.

[Crimson Winds]

Yeah.

1st closest relatives to Kurds are Western Iranians who live around the Caspian Sea. And Persians.
2nd closest relatives to Kurds are Georgians and Adygeans.

Lol, are you fucking serious?

[casedelpapel]

I swear youre a sock of Hadouken. Kurds don't look like Georgians nor do Georgians look like Kurds. Just because you see some degree of resemblance, doesn't mean they look the same. Its like saying Persians look like arabs.

I have shared my picture here, judge yourself, I am not him nor do i know him nor do we look the same but we are Kurds, of course we share similiarities in the way we view the world, we are shaped by our environment.

[MS85]

Tajiks are definitely not from Iran. They are natives who promoted the Persian language, a Western Iranian language.Tajiks are from Iran, but they are too much mixed with Central Asiatic people.

[MS85]

Lol, are you fucking serious?These are facts. West Iranians and the Hurrians are very similar to each other and have the same 'Aryan' roots.

https://i.postimg.cc/KvckVWwP/kurds.jpg

https://i.postimg.cc/MTGNgq0k/kurds.jpg

https://i.postimg.cc/nVXcDtyw/basque.jpg

[MS85]

Why do Armenians and Kurds want to look like Georgians on this forum? It's really pathetic.Because Georgians are simply the best!

Kurdish culture and Georgian culture are very similar to each other. Both are West Asian masculine 'warrior' cultures.

[Zoro]

These views are outdated. People thought this 40 years ago. I'm much more interested what he would think right now.

But nothing I have seen in the genetic analysis is inconsistent with Dr Izady’s account below. In fact it’s a great description based on archeology and historical scripts and DNA pretty much supports everything he wrote. I personally appreciate his contributions whether they be writings or maps. Also, DNA by itself doesn’t give us a complete picture. We need archeology, lingustics, and historical scriptures to form a more complete and accurate picture


The name ‘Mittani’ survives today in the Kurdish clans of Mattini and Millani/Milli who inhabit the exact same geographical areas of Kurdistan as the ancient Mittani. The name “Mittan,” however, is a Hurrian name rather than Aryan. At the onset of Aryan immigration into Kurdistan, only the aristocracy of the high-ranking warrior groups were Aryans, while the bulk of the people were still Hurrian in all manners.

The Mittani aristocratic house almost certainly was from the immigrant Sindis, who survive today in the populous Kurdish clan of Sindi—again—in the same area where the Mittani kingdom once existed. These ancient Sindi seem to have been an Indic, and not Iranic group of people, and in fact a branch of the better known Sindis of India-Pakistan, that has imparted its name to the River Indus and in fact, India itself. (footnote 8)

While the bulk of the Sindis moved on to India, some wondered into Kurdistan to give rise to the Mittani royal house and the modern Sindi Kurds.Expectedly, the Mittani pantheon includes names like Indra, Varuna, Suriya and Nasatya is typically Indic. The Mittanis could have introduced during this early period some of the Indic/Vedic tradition that appears to be manifest in the Kurdish religion of Yazdanism.

The avalanche of the Indo-European tribes, however, was to come about 1200 BC, raining havoc on the economy and settled culture in the mountains and lowlands alike. The north was settled by the Haigs who are known to us now as the Armenians, while the rest of the mountains became targets of settlement of various Iranic peoples, such as the Medes, Persian, Scythians, Sarmatians, and Sagarthians (whose name survives in the name of the Zagros mountains).By 850 BC, the last Hurrian states had been extinguished by the invading Aryans, whose sheer number of immigrants must have been considerable. These succeeded over time to change the Hurrian language(s) of the people in Kurdistan, as well as their genetic make-up.

By about the 3rd century BC, the Aryanization of the mountain communities was virtually complete.Since the star of the Mittani shown brightest in 1500 BC, Aryan dynasties of various size and influence continued their appearance in various corners of Kurdistan. None, however, was to match, and in fact surpass the Mittanis as the Medians. The rise of the Medes from their capital at Ecbatana (modern Hamadan) in 727 coincided with the fall of the last major Hurrian kingdom: the Mannaeans. Ignoring the proud legacy of the Hurrian states and even the Aryan empire of the Mittanis which can squarely be claimed by on every ground by modern Kurds, it is the Medes that the Kurds have grown most fund of. Medes are claimed regularly by the Kurds and pronounced by others to be the ancestors of them. This is strange, when realizing how many millennia of cultural and ethnic evolution preceded the rise of Medes into Kurdistan. In reality, Medes are no more the ancestors of the modern Kurds as all other Halafian, Hurrian and Mittani who came before them or the legion of other peoples and states that came after them.

Nonetheless, today, even the first Kurdish satellite television transmitter is given the name “Med TV” (Kurdish for “Median TV”). Fascination of the Kurds with the Median Federation (a.k.a., Empire) that ended in 549 BC remains supreme, indeed.”

[Kyp]

Tajiks are from Iran, but they are too much mixed with Central Asiatic people.

BMAC were iranian farmers -> correct.
Tajiks were originally persians -> wrong.

[MS85]

But nothing I have seen in the genetic analysis is inconsistent with Dr Izady’s account below. In fact it’s a great description based on archeology and historical scripts and DNA pretty much supports everything he wrote. I personally appreciate his contributions whether they be writings or maps. Also, DNA by itself doesn’t give us a complete picture. We need archeology, lingustics, and historical scriptures to form a more complete and accurate pictureAccording to Izady, the Medes came from the BMAC/Yaz culture. But according to some recent papers people in BMAC came actually from Kurdistan/Iran. Yaz was actually related to the ancient Iran/Zagros and people of Yaz came actually from Zagros.

Second error, Mitanni in Kurdistan PREDATE BMAC/Scythian invasion of India.

[MS85]

BMAC were iranian farmers -> correct.
Tajiks were originally persians -> wrong.No, native language of Tajiks is FARSI (Persian). Farsi as a SouthWest Iranic language evolved in Persia. That's why we can be for sure that Tajiks are originally from Persia and were ethnic Persians before they mixed with the Central Asiatic people. Tajiks of TODAY are very mixed people.

[Zoro]

According to Izady, the Medes came from the BMAC/Yaz culture. But according to some recent papers people in BMAC came actually from Kurdistan/Iran. Yaz was actually related to the ancient Iran/Zagros and people of Yaz came actually from Zagros.

Second error, Mitanni in Kurdistan PREDATE BMAC/Scythian invasion of India.

Wrt Mitanni it’s correct that Mitanni predate Scythians/Saka, because Mitanni kingdom was from 1500-1300 BC, https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mitanni

And Indo-Scythian kingdom ran from 200 BC- 400AD https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saka


Wrt BMAC, yes they were farmers from the Kurdistan area who moved there 5000 years ago, but it doesn’t mean there wasn’t movements from there back to Kurdistan later. Parthians for example moved to kurdistan later. I find it interesting that Dilawer was able to find a Gonur BMAC signal in kurds but not other W Asians https://eurasiandna.com/impact-of-the-iron-age-saka-and-scythians-on-south-west-asian-demography/

http://i.imgur.com/W5VcODe.jpg

[Crimson Winds]

These are facts. West Iranians and the Hurrians are very similar to each other and have the same 'Aryan' roots.

https://i.postimg.cc/KvckVWwP/kurds.jpg

https://i.postimg.cc/MTGNgq0k/kurds.jpg

https://i.postimg.cc/nVXcDtyw/basque.jpg

Let's post our pictures and people decide do we look alike.

[MS85]

Wrt Mitanni it’s correct that Mitanni predate Scythians/Saka, because Mitanni kingdom was from 1500-1300 BC,

And Indo-Scythian kingdom ran from 200 BC- 400AD


Wrt BMAC, yes they were farmers from the Kurdistan area who moved there 5000 years ago, but it doesn’t mean there wasn’t movements from there back to Kurdistan later. Parthians for example moved to kurdistan later. I find it interesting that Dilawer was able to find a Gonur BMAC signal in kurds but not other W AsiansMitanni had established their kingdom from 1600BC and that means Mitanni were already much earlier in Kurdistan than 1600BC. Also, Mitanni were not the only 'Iranic' people in Kurdistan. The Iranic Kassites in Zagros Mountains lived at the same time as Mitanni. Kassites were also Iranic. And before the Kassites we have got the Guti/Gutians who were most likely ancestors of the Mitanni/Kassites. That makes Mitanni/Kassite pretty NATIVE to Kurdistan.

Parthians came centuries after the Medes. And there are evidences that the West Iranian Medes were direct descendants of the Mitanni/Matiene/Kassites.

Also, it doesn't make any sense Dilawer was able to find a Gonur BMAC signal in Kurds but not other W Asians like the Azeri people. Since Azeri people (before Turkification) had the same Median ancestors as the Kurds. Don't believe everything what that Dilawer is saying. He is wrong on many fields.

They found out the so called 'Indo-Aryan' invasion of India occurred around 1500BC. It has been said that people from BMAC/Yaz were proto-Eastern-Iranians and even proto-Indo-Aryan (Indic). And there was some 'Eastern' Iranian (Saka) migration into Kurdistan. Mitanni in Kurdistan PREDATE that invasion.



With other words Izady was very wrong on many issues, and I want to know his opinion right now after we have got DNA samples from the BMAC

[casedelpapel]

Let's post our pictures and people decide do we look alike.

why not, start then .

[MS85]

Let's post our pictures and people decide do we look alike.I already posted my picture on this site. Then I deleted it.

And I don't care how your nigger Arab ass looks like. To me all Arabs are the same shiiiiit.


We are talking about the DNA here. And Kurdish DNA clusters very close to other Western Iranian people and people from the Southern Caucasus. This is a fact. Arab DNA is closer to the Levant and Africa. That's why I do consider Arabs as niggers.

[Leto]

I already posted my picture on this site. Then I deleted it.

And I don't care how your nigger Arab ass looks like. To me all Arabs are the same shiiiiit.


We are talking about the DNA here. And Kurdish DNA clusters very close to other Western Iranian people and people from the Southern Caucasus. This is a fact. Arab DNA is closer to the Levant and Africa. That's why I do consider Arabs as niggers.
Send me your photo, I'll tell you if you would be seen as 'black-assed' in Russia. Caucasians and Central Asians are called 'black, black-assed' in Russian-speaking countries ;)

[Leto]

http://i.imgur.com/W5VcODe.jpg
Kurds are ca. 14% Kipchak Turkic?

[FinalFlash]

Why do Armenians and Kurds want to look like Georgians on this forum? It's really pathetic.

Only in your deluded dreams Tomasashvili.

[Leto]

We are talking about the DNA here. And Kurdish DNA clusters very close to other Western Iranian people and people from the Southern Caucasus. This is a fact. Arab DNA is closer to the Levant and Africa. That's why I do consider Arabs as niggers.
Depends on the Arabs. Are Levantine people included? They ain't darker than Kurds.

[Zoro]

Kurds are ca. 14% Kipchak Turkic?

I don’t think he’s saying that they are necessarily 14% Kipchak. Kipchak is just one of many E Asian proxies he used for W. Asians. He used other E Asian proxies also such as Saka and proto turkic Xiongnu. It just means that the qpadm model could not be rejected.

At least it is more realistic than the Han or Dai E Asian proxy people use, because there is no chance that Han or Dai migrated to W. Asia

[MS85]

Depends on the Arabs. Are Levantine people included? They ain't darker than Kurds.I don't care who looks lighter and who looks darker. Levantine people are Semites. And they do look like Semites and their DNA is Semitic. Semitic people don't cluster with the Caucasian/Iranian group.

[Leto]

I don’t think he’s saying that they are necessarily 14% Kipchak. Kipchak is just one of many E Asian proxies he used for W. Asians. He used other E Asian proxies also such as Saka and proto turkic Xiongnu. It just means that the qpadm model could not be rejected.

At least it is more realistic than the Han or Dai E Asian proxy people use, because there is no chance that Han or Dai migrated to W. Asia
Well, the Kipchak Turks were not 100% East Asian.

[Leto]

I don't care who looks lighter and who looks darker. Levantine people are Semites. And they do look like Semites and their DNA is Semitic. Semitic people don't cluster with the Caucasian/Iranian group.
Semitic is a mainly linguistic term. Amharic people and Yemenis do not cluster with Lebanese and Assyrians either.

[Crimson Winds]

I already posted my picture on this site. Then I deleted it.

And I don't care how your nigger Arab ass looks like. To me all Arabs are the same shiiiiit.


We are talking about the DNA here. And Kurdish DNA clusters very close to other Western Iranian people and people from the Southern Caucasus. This is a fact. Arab DNA is closer to the Levant and Africa. That's why I do consider Arabs as niggers.

You say Adygei, idiot,learn some geography. Everybody who is more Arab in both genetic and phenotypical sense. Btw I would prefer to be an Arab rather terrorist lover Kurd.

[Zoro]

Mitanni had established their kingdom from 1600BC and that means Mitanni were already much earlier in Kurdistan than 1600BC. Also, Mitanni were not the only 'Iranic' people in Kurdistan. The Iranic Kassites in Zagros Mountains lived at the same time as Mitanni. Kassites were also Iranic. And before the Kassites we have got the Guti/Gutians who were most likely ancestors of the Mitanni/Kassites. That makes Mitanni/Kassite pretty NATIVE to Kurdistan.

Parthians came centuries after the Medes. And there are evidences that the West Iranian Medes were direct descendants of the Mitanni/Matiene/Kassites.

Also, it doesn't make any sense Dilawer was able to find a Gonur BMAC signal in Kurds but not other W Asians like the Azeri people. Since Azeri people (before Turkification) had the same Median ancestors as the Kurds. Don't believe everything what that Dilawer is saying. He is wrong on many fields.

They found out the so called 'Indo-Aryan' invasion of India occurred around 1500BC. It has been said that people from BMAC/Yaz were proto-Eastern-Iranians and even proto-Indo-Aryan (Indic). And there was some 'Eastern' Iranian (Saka) migration into Kurdistan. Mitanni in Kurdistan PREDATE that invasion.



With other words Izady was very wrong on many issues, and I want to know his opinion right now after we have got DNA samples from the BMAC

But how can he be wrong. You yourself just said that Mitanni predated Saka and you also wrote that’s what he said, so then what’s the problem?

I am one of his project members and am pretty impressed with his research abilities. His articles are 10 times more technical than that polocentric davidski shithead.

[MS85]

Semitic is a mainly linguistic term. Amharic people and Yemenis do not cluster with Lebanese and Assyrians either.Semites are Semites. There are Northern Semites (Levant), there are Southern Semites (Bedouin Arabs) and everything in between and people (like Northern Africans) who are mixed with the Semites.

I think that Semites can be considered as the Levant-SouthWest Asian people. Semites don't cluster with the Caucasian/Iranian groups at all.

[Zoro]

Well, the Kipchak Turks were not 100% East Asian.

Exactly and so were the populations that brought E. Asian to W. Asia

[MS85]

But how can he be wrong. You yourself just said that Mitanni predated Saka and you also wrote that’s what he said, so then what’s the problem?

I am one of his project members and am pretty impressed with his research abilities. His articles are 10 times more technical than that polocentric davidski shithead.According to Izady, Mitanni were 'INDIC' (Indo-Aryan) people. But Indic people didn't exist when Mitanni ruled Kurdistan.

Kassites are the overlooked ancestors of the Kurds/Medes. Kassites were similar to the Mitanni and had also Iranic GODS and their Kings had Iranic names:


Kassites or Cassites (both: kăsˈĪts) [key], ancient people, probably of Indo-European origin. They were first mentioned in historical texts as occupying the W Iranian plateau. In the 18th cent. B.C. they swept down on Babylonia, conquered the region, and ruled there until the 12th cent. B.C., when they returned to the Iranian plateau. They remained more or less independent until the beginning of the Christian era, when they disappeared from history.

http://www.infoplease.com/encyclopedia/history/kassites.html


Kassites & Kossaeans

Several modern historians such as K. Balkan (in 1986, p. 8) and M. Heinz (in 1995, p. 167) have stated that the Kassite rulers of Babylon were members of the Indo-Iranian Kossaean people based in Hamadan-Kermanshah-Luristan area, but whose origins are not mentioned in historical records. The historians make several additional conclusions or assumptions:

First, that the Kossaeans mentioned by Greek writers were the successors of the Babylonian Kassites who were driven out of Babylonia by conquering Elamites (neighbours of the Kossaeans) in the 12th century BCE.

Second, that the Kassites in fleeing to Kossaea were returning to their ancestral lands.

Third, that the Kassites were originally Indo-Iranian Kossaeans who had settled the Hamadan-Kermanshah-Luristan area prior to the 17th century BCE.

Fourth, that the Indo-Iranian Kossaeans were immigrants to the area since they are not mentioned as being among the peoples who inhabited the central and southern Zagros in Sargonic (2270-2215 BCE) and Ur III / Third Dynasty of Ur era (21st to 20th century BCE) inscriptions. As we shall see below, these assumptions and conclusions are plausible.

Hamadan and Kermanshah, are two provinces with eponymous capital cities that straddle the northern Zagros mountains placing them strategically on the Aryan trade roads - the Silk Roads. Luristan lies to their south and the Iranian province of Elam is found to the west of Luristan. Elam and Kermanshah border modern-day Iraq and what would have been Northern Babylonia (see map). "

http://www.heritageinstitute.com/zoroastrianism/ranghaya/kassites.htm


Mesopotamia witnessed the arrival about 1760 bce of the Kassites, who introduced the horse and the chariot and bore Indo-European names.

https://www.britannica.com/place/India/Early-Vedic-period#ref485125


Thus for example the first Kassite king, Gandash, has a name which is rather obviously reminiscent of the Indian deity Ganesha, whilst other kings such as Abirattash, Kara-indash, and Burnaburish (or Burraburiash) are equally to be placed in the Indo-Iranian family. The name Burraburiash may even be a precise equivalent of the Persian Gobryas. "

http://www.hyksos.org/index.php?title=Kassites_and_Scythians

[user_]

In Georgia we see Kurds as very similar to Armenians, both in appearance or culture.

[MS85]

You say Adygei, idiot,learn some geography. Everybody who is more Arab in both genetic and phenotypical sense. Btw I would prefer to be an Arab rather terrorist lover Kurd.Good for you. But Arabs are the biggest terrorists. Arafat, Bin-Laden etc. were all Arabs.


Adygei are the neighbours of the Georgians. Actually the Adygei are VERY close to the Kurds, since Adygei are related to the MAYKOP people. Maykop people had a lot of Y-DNA hg. 'L'. And there is a lot Y-DNA hg. 'L' in Ezdi Kurds.


On Gedmatch I score very close to the Adygei folks.

[Leto]

Adygei are the neighbours of the Georgians. Actually the Adygei are VERY close to the Kurds, since Adygei are related to the MAYKOP people. Maykop people had a lot of Y-DNA hg. 'L'. And there is a lot Y-DNA hg. 'L' in Ezdi Kurds.


On Gedmatch I score very close to the Adygei folks.
NW Caucasians have more white and Mongoloid DNA than Kurds. They score like this
https://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?295005-Northwest-Caucasian-GEDmatch-results

[FinalFlash]

In Georgia we see Kurds as very similar to Armenians, both in appearance or culture.

Then they probably.view a large chunk of their countrymen as similar to Armenians because a lot of your countrymen are phenotypically indistinguishable from Armenians.

[user_]

Then they probably.view a large chunk of their countrymen as similar to Armenians because a lot of your countrymen are phenotypically indistinguishable from Armenians.

For Georgian it's nothing easier to distinguish Armenian from Georgian.

[Kivan]

Semites are Semites. There are Northern Semites (Levant), there are Southern Semites (Bedouin Arabs) and everything in between and people (like Northern Africans) who are mixed with the Semites.

I think that Semites can be considered as the Levant-SouthWest Asian people. Semites don't cluster with the Caucasian/Iranian groups at all.

lol You are one of the most delusional users i ever see in this forum. You are more closer to Arabs/Mena than anything else, even more than Armenians.
Kurds and Adygheans are worlds apart, both phenotypically and culturally.

Kurds from SE Turkey

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s2yuyCsQZzY

Kabardian Circassians

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=48RL47HyCc4

[Tigranes]

In Georgia we see Kurds as very similar to Armenians, both in appearance or culture.

Well, unlike the Kavkaz cultures both Armenian and Kurdish cultures are unique and distinguishable from each other, as for the appearence I'm not even going to debate with you on that since you're obviously baiting.

[MS85]

NW Caucasians have more white and Mongoloid DNA than Kurds. They score like this
https://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?295005-Northwest-Caucasian-GEDmatch-resultsAdygeians and Abkhazians are also full of Iranic Gedrosia auDNA

https://i.postimg.cc/JnqjWKZt/adygei.png
https://i.postimg.cc/2jtVLPkr/Gedrosian-admixture.gif

[FinalFlash]

For Georgian it's nothing easier to distinguish Armenian from Georgian.

For Western Georgians maybe. Eastern Georgians are an entirely different story :).

http://laz-colchis-dna.blogspot.com/2017/12/mdlp-k23-hesaplayicisi-esliginde-dogu_9.html

[MS85]

lol You are one of the most delusional users i ever see in this forum. You are more closer to Arabs/Mena than anything else, even more than Armenians.
Kurds and Adygheans are worlds apart, both phenotypically and culturally.DNA doesn't lie.

Genes & DNA are all what truly matters.

[FinalFlash]

Well, unlike the Kavkaz cultures both Armenian and Kurdish cultures are unique and distinguishable from each other, as for the appearence I'm not even going to debate with you on this since you're obviously baiting.

He overexaggerated phenotypical differences to the point where you'd think one looks Chinese, the other Russian.

[user_]

Well, unlike the Kavkaz cultures both Armenian and Kurdish cultures are unique and distinguishable from each other, as for the appearence I'm not even going to debate with you on this since you're obviously baiting.

Of course they are unique and distinguishable, but when you see people dancing in the circle to duduk and zurna, if you are not familiar you can't distinguish if they are Armenians, or Kurds.
Same with Caucasus, for you maybe NC culture and Georgian culture is indistinguishable, but for me it's like worlds apart.

[user_]

For Western Georgians maybe. Eastern Georgians are an entirely different story :).

http://laz-colchis-dna.blogspot.com/2017/12/mdlp-k23-hesaplayicisi-esliginde-dogu_9.html

More than 70% of Georgian population is from west part of country.
Cholchians dominate over Iberians.

[FinalFlash]

More than 70% of Georgian population is from west part of country.

I sincerely doubt that number. Unless of course most Georgians from Tbilisi are from the West. Then again, it makes sense considering that Tbilisi had an Armenian majority until the late 1800s.

[Tigranes]

Of course they are unique and distinguishable, but when you see people dancing in the circle to duduk and zurna

People dancing in the circle to duduk? :chin: Pretty interesting, could you tell us more about this?

[FinalFlash]

People dancing in the circle to duduk? :chin: Pretty interesting, could you tell us more about this?

Lol.

[MS85]

Of course they are unique and distinguishable, but when you see people dancing in the circle to duduk and zurna, if you are not familiar you can't distinguish if they are Armenians, or Kurds.
Same with Caucasus, for you maybe NC culture and Georgian culture is indistinguishable, but for me it's like worlds apart.How old are you? From which generation? Because there are not much Ezdi Kurds left in Georgia. Nowadays most young Georgians don't even know who Ezdi Kurds are. Ezdi Kurds lived mostly in Tbilisi. Also the population of Tbilisi changed big time. Many authentic people of Tbilisi (like Ezdi Kurds, Armenians etc.) left the city. Back in the 80ies and 90ies when there were at least 40000 Ezdi Kurds in Georgia.

Tbilisi was much more multicultural in the past. Nowadays it is populated by Georgians who are not even from Tbilisi.


Tbilisi was (and is) such a nice city.

[user_]

I sincerely doubt that number. Unless of course most Georgians from Tbilisi are from the West. Then again, it makes sense considering that Tbilisi had an Armenian majority until the late 1800s.

Imeretins and Megrelians are the majority in Georgia. They are cholchians.
Massive migration from west to Tbilisi started in the 20-th century that changed Tbilisi a lot.

[MS85]

People dancing in the circle to duduk? :chin: Pretty interesting, could you tell us more about this?He means Ezdi Kurds who dance in the circle during the wedding parties.

[user_]

People dancing in the circle to duduk? :chin: Pretty interesting, could you tell us more about this?

okay, maybe it's not duduk, i don't know how you call it, but it really sounds very close to Kurdish music.

[Leto]

I sincerely doubt that number. Unless of course most Georgians from Tbilisi are from the West. Then again, it makes sense considering that Tbilisi had an Armenian majority until the late 1800s.
Ethnic Georgians by province according to the 2014 census

3,224,564 - Georgia
530,288 - Imereti *
328,662 - Samegrelo-Upper Svaneti *
320,742 - Adjara *
271,298 - Kakheti
249,479 - Shida Kartli
217,305 - Kvemo Kartli
111,168 - Guria *
89,343 - Mtskheta-Mtianeti
77,498 - Samtskhe-Javakheti
31,977 - Racha-Lechkhumi and Lower Svaneti *

= 41%

http://ontheworldmap.com/georgia/administrative-map-of-georgia.jpg

[MS85]

Imeretins and Megrelians are the majority in Georgia. They are cholchians.
Massive migration from west to Tbilisi started in the 20-th century that changed Tbilisi a lot.Yeah, Tbilisi changed a lot!

Tbilisi is now populated by other people. Me, my parents and my grandparents were born in Tbilisi (only 1 grandmother was not born in Tbilisi, but in Armenia). We are the true Tbilisi people. We are born and raised in the Sololaki neighborhood, next to the Botanic Gardens.

[FinalFlash]

Imeretins and Megrelians are the majority in Georgia. They are cholchians.
Massive migration from west to Tbilisi started in the 20-th century that changed Tbilisi a lot.

I need to see statistics on this. To my knowledge, Western Georgia is the least populated region of Georgia.

[FinalFlash]

Ethnic Georgians by province according to the 2014 census

3,224,564 - Georgia
530,288 - Imereti *
328,662 - Samegrelo-Upper Svaneti *
320,742 - Adjara *
271,298 - Kakheti
249,479 - Shida Kartli
217,305 - Kvemo Kartli
111,168 - Guria *
89,343 - Mtskheta-Mtianeti
77,498 - Samtskhe-Javakheti
31,977 - Racha-Lechkhumi and Lower Svaneti *

= 41%

So it's not more than 70% like our friend user suggested.

[user_]

How old are you? From which generation? Because there are not much Ezdi Kurds left in Georgia. Nowadays most young Georgians don't even know who Ezdi Kurds are. Ezdi Kurds lived mostly in Tbilisi. Also the population of Tbilisi changed big time. Many authentic people of Tbilisi (like Ezdi Kurds, Armenians etc.) left the city. Back in the 80ies and 90ies when there were at least 40000 Ezdi Kurds in Georgia.

Tbilisi was much more multicultural in the past. Nowadays it is populated by Georgians who are not even from Tbilisi.


Tbilisi was (and is) such a nice city.

I'm 30 and you are right, many young Georgians even don't know that there are such people like Ezids. But i have neighbors who are Kurds, if i'm right they have armenian surnames.

Many armenians and kurds left Tbilisi after Soviet union collapsed, and Georgians mostly from Abkazia, Megrelia and Imereti migrated to Tbilisi.
But anyways Tbilisi is still very multicultural city, tourism is booming and you'll see people from all over the world.

[Leto]

So it's not more than 70% like our friend user suggested.
Well, we don't know how many Tbilisians are of Western extraction. Let's say half of them. Then Western Georgians would make up over 50% of the population.

[user_]

Ethnic Georgians by province according to the 2014 census

3,224,564 - Georgia
530,288 - Imereti *
328,662 - Samegrelo-Upper Svaneti *
320,742 - Adjara *
271,298 - Kakheti
249,479 - Shida Kartli
217,305 - Kvemo Kartli
111,168 - Guria *
89,343 - Mtskheta-Mtianeti
77,498 - Samtskhe-Javakheti
31,977 - Racha-Lechkhumi and Lower Svaneti *

= 41%

http://ontheworldmap.com/georgia/administrative-map-of-georgia.jpg

Tbilisi makes almost 35% of whole population, is located in the east, but it's also mostly populated by Imeretians and Megrelians.
About 300 000 megrelians left Abkazia and majority of them settled in Tbilisi.

[FinalFlash]

I'm 30 and you are right, many young Georgians even don't know that there are such people like Ezids. But i have neighbors who are Kurds, if i'm right they have armenian surnames.

Many armenians and kurds left Tbilisi after Soviet union collapsed, and Georgians mostly from Abkazia, Megrelia and Imereti migrated to Tbilisi.
But anyways Tbilisi is still very multicultural city, tourism is booming and you'll see people from all over the world.

You lot probably mistake your yezdi for Armenians because of their Armenized last name.

Vor v'zakoni ganster Hasan Usoyan was a yezdi for example which you people probably assume him to be Armenian given his pseudo-Armenian sounding last name.

[Altaylardan Tunaya]

I prefer batumi to tbilisi..

[FinalFlash]

Well, we don't know how many Tbilisians are of Western extraction. Let's say half of them. Then Western Georgians would make up over 50% of the population.

They probably constitute 50-60% of the population which is no surprise considering that Armenians formed a majority in Tbilisi until the late 19th, early 20th century.

Still, I imagine around 40% of Georgians, are of Eastern extract

[FinalFlash]

Well, we don't know how many Tbilisians are of Western extraction. Let's say half of them. Then Western Georgians would make up over 50% of the population.

They probably constitute 50-60% of the population which is no surprise considering that Armenians formed a majority in Tbilisi until the late 19th, early 20th century.

Still, I imagine around 40% of Georgians, are of Eastern extract

[MS85]

I'm 30 and you are right, many young Georgians even don't know that there are such people like Ezids. But i have neighbors who are Kurds, if i'm right they have armenian surnames.

Many armenians and kurds left Tbilisi after Soviet union collapsed, and Georgians mostly from Abkazia, Megrelia and Imereti migrated to Tbilisi.
But anyways Tbilisi is still very multicultural city, tourism is booming and you'll see people from all over the world.I think I belong to a generation before you. Tbilisi is not multicultural how it used to be. In Sololaki and Maidan where I was born and raised people spoke all kind of languages, from Azeri, Hebrew, Kurmanji, Russian, all these folks lived together. Later on most Armenians, Kurds, Russians etc. left the city. In Sololaki where I was born and went to school most people are ethnic Georgians from outside Tbilisi now. They changed even the 'old' street names.


Ezdi Kurds build an Ezdi Tempel in Tbilisi not a long time ago. We have seen many people and many races, but Georgians are the best toward the Ezdi Kurds.

https://i.postimg.cc/9f6PcrDw/temple.jpg

[user_]

----------------------

[MS85]

I prefer batumi to tbilisi..Batumi is a village and there is nothing to do there. Tbilisi is a historic city where you can have great parties.

[user_]

Ethnic Georgians by province according to the 2014 census


217,305 - Kvemo Kartli


77,498 - Samtskhe-Javakheti


http://ontheworldmap.com/georgia/administrative-map-of-georgia.jpg

Kvemo Kartli 45% Azeri
Samtskhe Javakheti 50% Armenian.



70% of ethnic Georgians are originally from west.

[Leto]

Kvemo Kartli 45% Azeri
Samtskhe Javakheti 50% Armenian.
Yes, but what I posted is ETHNIC Georgians, no minorities.

By the way, Armenians and especially Azeri Turks barely speak Georgian from what I know. Or maybe that is changing now? They seem to be quite marginalized. Of course both have their ethnostates right across the border where they can live without fear of assimilation.

[Altaylardan Tunaya]

Batumi is a village and there is nothing to do there. Tbilisi is a historic city where you can have great parties.

This doesn't look like a village

http://www.orangesmile.com/common/img_cities_original/batumi-900049585-24.jpg
https://previews.123rf.com/images/atomdruid/atomdruid1804/atomdruid180400079/100327702-modern-urban-center-and-the-old-town-of-batumi-city-georgia-a-famous-resort-town-on-black-sea-coast-.jpg

maybe it was a village when you were still living in georgia idk

[MS85]

This doesn't look like a village

maybe it was a village when you were still living in georgia idkMy brother and his wife were last summer in Tbilisi and Batumi and also in other parts of Georgia. My brother couldn't even stay in Batumi for 2 days, lol.

[Altaylardan Tunaya]

My brother and his wife were last summer in Tbilisi and Batumi and also in other parts of Georgia. My brother couldn't even stay in Batumi for 2 days, lol.

If i want to party i wouldn't take my wife for obvious reasons :cool:

[Dorian]

:confused:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aIWUz4f4nG0

[user_]

Yes, but what I posted is ETHNIC Georgians, no minorities.

By the way, Armenians and especially Azeri Turks barely speak Georgian from what I know. Or maybe that is changing now? They seem to be quite marginalized. Of course both have their ethnostates right across the border where they can live without fear of assimilation.

You are right, you posted only ethnic Georgians. But again during soviet era there was massive migration from west to east, Beria replaced Imeretians as they were the biggest Georgian group to Samtskhe and Kvemo Kartli to dilute nongeorgian population. We can say that most Georgians in the west are from west, but not all Georgians in the East are from East.


Armenian and Azeri minority were quite marginalized but now it's much much better, young generation speak Georgian language. Today Tbilisi attracts Armenians and Azeris not only from it's countryside but also from Armenia and Azerbaijan itself.

[Arsen_]

For Georgian it's nothing easier to distinguish Armenian from Georgian.

I can also easily distinguish Armenian from Georgian with one exception, there are a lot of Georgians who are actually assimilated Armenians. By the way I saw your photo and you seem to be also a georginized Armenian. In the last couple of centuries Georgians bent over backwards to assimilate Armenians, and they did all possible and impossible for that. Here is interesting video how it was happening:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rJ-Mn9-20dU

[FinalFlash]

I can also easily distinguish Armenian from Georgian with one exception, there are a lot of Georgians who are actually assimilated Armenians. By the way I saw your photo and you seem to be also a georginized Armenian. In the last couple of centuries Georgians bent over backwards to assimilate Armenians, and they did all possible and impossible for that. Here is interesting video how it was happening:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rJ-Mn9-20dU

I'm telling you, western Georgians have been HEAVILY overrepresented in anthrofora and genetic studies. Eastern Georgians would have a very high genetic affinity to Armenians, at least to Eastern Armenians.

[PaleoEuropean]

Armenians are mixed with Afro Asiatich. They have 6-8% Red Sea and higher East Med than Georgians.

The Red Sea includes Arab and Yemeni doesn't = black

[user_]

I'm telling you, western Georgians have been HEAVILY overrepresented in anthrofora and genetic studies. Eastern Georgians would have a very high genetic affinity to Armenians, at least to Eastern Armenians.

They are overrepresented becose as i told you simply westerners make majority:D

When we speak about eastern Georgians who can be genetically close to Armenians this are Kartlis and Kakhetis. Mounatain eastern Georgians are as far, as westerners. Also among Kartlians there are lot's of assiamilated Ossetians , geo-ossetian marriages are more often, than geo-armenian.

[FinalFlash]

They are overrepresented becose as i told you simply westerners make majority:D

When we speak about eastern Georgians who can be genetically close to Armenians this are Kartlis and Kakhetis. Mounatain eastern Georgians are as far, as westerners. Also among Kartlians there are lot's of assiamilated Ossetians , geo-ossetian marriages are more often, than geo-armenian.

Around 40% of Georgians are eastern yet on Gedmatch 99% are western

[user_]

Around 40% of Georgians are eastern yet on Gedmatch 99% are western

Not 40%, 30%. Among this 30% not all of them are originally eastern, as i told there was and still is migration from west to east, because historically west Georgia was overpopulated and eastern Georgia depopulated because of endless wars.

[Leto]

Here's a Georgian:

MDLP K23b Oracle results:

Kit H851571

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 Caucasian 55.39
2 South_Central_Asian 21.19
3 Near_East 7.85
4 European_Hunters_Gatherers 6.65
5 Ancestral_Altaic 4.26
6 European_Early_Farmers 1.36
7 Australoid 1.05
8 East_African 0.75
9 Austronesian 0.47
10 Paleo_Siberian 0.3
11 Archaic_Human 0.27
12 East_Siberian 0.25
13 Tungus-Altaic 0.17

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Kakheti ( ) 4.38
2 Ossetian ( ) 8.27
3 Armenian_Yerevan ( ) 10.01
4 Adygei ( ) 10.28
5 Balkar ( ) 10.3
6 North_Ossetian ( ) 10.52
7 Armenian ( ) 11
8 Abkhasian ( ) 11.09
9 Georgian ( ) 11.72
10 Adjara ( ) 12
11 Assyrian_Arzni ( ) 12.34
12 Turk_Trabzon ( ) 13.11
13 Kabardin ( ) 13.2
14 Circassian ( ) 13.88
15 Chechen ( ) 13.95
16 Georgian_Megrelia ( ) 14.49
17 Georgian_Svan ( ) 14.57
18 Kumyk ( ) 15.7
19 Georgian_Tbilisi ( ) 17.51
20 Jew_Tat ( ) 17.77

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 66.5% Adjara ( ) + 33.5% Baku_WGA ( ) @ 2.7
2 79.1% Kakheti ( ) + 20.9% Kabardin ( ) @ 2.74
3 94.6% Kakheti ( ) + 5.4% Tatar_Mishar ( ) @ 2.77
4 67.4% Adjara ( ) + 32.6% Uzbek_Tashkent ( ) @ 2.82
5 95% Kakheti ( ) + 5% Vepsa ( ) @ 2.83
6 97% Kakheti ( ) + 3% Alorese ( ) @ 2.85
7 93.2% Kakheti ( ) + 6.8% Ain_Touta_WGA ( ) @ 2.86
8 95.2% Kakheti ( ) + 4.8% Karelian ( ) @ 2.87
9 95.4% Kakheti ( ) + 4.6% Saami_Kola ( ) @ 2.87
10 96% Kakheti ( ) + 4% Saami_Finland ( ) @ 2.88
11 96.8% Kakheti ( ) + 3.2% Ethiopian_Jew ( ) @ 2.88
12 97% Kakheti ( ) + 3% Sandawe ( ) @ 2.88
13 96.7% Kakheti ( ) + 3.3% Ethiopian_Tygray ( ) @ 2.89
14 96.8% Kakheti ( ) + 3.2% Afar_WGA ( ) @ 2.89
15 87.6% Kakheti ( ) + 12.4% Baku_WGA ( ) @ 2.89
16 94.5% Kakheti ( ) + 5.5% Russian_Vologda ( ) @ 2.89
17 80.6% Kakheti ( ) + 19.4% Chechen ( ) @ 2.89
18 97.1% Kakheti ( ) + 2.9% Somali ( ) @ 2.9
19 97.1% Kakheti ( ) + 2.9% Datog ( ) @ 2.9
20 97% Kakheti ( ) + 3% Ethiopian_Oromo ( ) @ 2.9

[Arsen_]

Not 40%, 30%. Among this 30% not all of them are originally eastern, as i told there was and still is migration from west to east, because historically west Georgia was overpopulated and eastern Georgia depopulated because of endless wars.

Well western Georgians and eastern Georgians actually are different ethnic groups united for political reasons only, and as far as I know historically western Georgians always were dumb as fuck and sociopathic and eastern Georgians always ruled over them.

[user_]

Well western Georgians and eastern Georgians actually are different ethnic groups united for political reasons only, and as far as I know historically western Georgians always were dumb as fuck and sociopathic and eastern Georgians always ruled over them.

Nope it's not different ethnic group, such differences exists almost among all nations.
Whatever today Georgia is mostly cholchian and nobody complains :))

[FinalFlash]

Here's a Georgian:

MDLP K23b Oracle results:

Kit H851571

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 Caucasian 55.39
2 South_Central_Asian 21.19
3 Near_East 7.85
4 European_Hunters_Gatherers 6.65
5 Ancestral_Altaic 4.26
6 European_Early_Farmers 1.36
7 Australoid 1.05
8 East_African 0.75
9 Austronesian 0.47
10 Paleo_Siberian 0.3
11 Archaic_Human 0.27
12 East_Siberian 0.25
13 Tungus-Altaic 0.17

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Kakheti ( ) 4.38
2 Ossetian ( ) 8.27
3 Armenian_Yerevan ( ) 10.01
4 Adygei ( ) 10.28
5 Balkar ( ) 10.3
6 North_Ossetian ( ) 10.52
7 Armenian ( ) 11
8 Abkhasian ( ) 11.09
9 Georgian ( ) 11.72
10 Adjara ( ) 12
11 Assyrian_Arzni ( ) 12.34
12 Turk_Trabzon ( ) 13.11
13 Kabardin ( ) 13.2
14 Circassian ( ) 13.88
15 Chechen ( ) 13.95
16 Georgian_Megrelia ( ) 14.49
17 Georgian_Svan ( ) 14.57
18 Kumyk ( ) 15.7
19 Georgian_Tbilisi ( ) 17.51
20 Jew_Tat ( ) 17.77

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 66.5% Adjara ( ) + 33.5% Baku_WGA ( ) @ 2.7
2 79.1% Kakheti ( ) + 20.9% Kabardin ( ) @ 2.74
3 94.6% Kakheti ( ) + 5.4% Tatar_Mishar ( ) @ 2.77
4 67.4% Adjara ( ) + 32.6% Uzbek_Tashkent ( ) @ 2.82
5 95% Kakheti ( ) + 5% Vepsa ( ) @ 2.83
6 97% Kakheti ( ) + 3% Alorese ( ) @ 2.85
7 93.2% Kakheti ( ) + 6.8% Ain_Touta_WGA ( ) @ 2.86
8 95.2% Kakheti ( ) + 4.8% Karelian ( ) @ 2.87
9 95.4% Kakheti ( ) + 4.6% Saami_Kola ( ) @ 2.87
10 96% Kakheti ( ) + 4% Saami_Finland ( ) @ 2.88
11 96.8% Kakheti ( ) + 3.2% Ethiopian_Jew ( ) @ 2.88
12 97% Kakheti ( ) + 3% Sandawe ( ) @ 2.88
13 96.7% Kakheti ( ) + 3.3% Ethiopian_Tygray ( ) @ 2.89
14 96.8% Kakheti ( ) + 3.2% Afar_WGA ( ) @ 2.89
15 87.6% Kakheti ( ) + 12.4% Baku_WGA ( ) @ 2.89
16 94.5% Kakheti ( ) + 5.5% Russian_Vologda ( ) @ 2.89
17 80.6% Kakheti ( ) + 19.4% Chechen ( ) @ 2.89
18 97.1% Kakheti ( ) + 2.9% Somali ( ) @ 2.9
19 97.1% Kakheti ( ) + 2.9% Datog ( ) @ 2.9
20 97% Kakheti ( ) + 3% Ethiopian_Oromo ( ) @ 2.9

Closer to Armenian Yerevan than to most other Georgians.

[Arsen_]

Nope it's not different ethnic group, such differences exists almost among all nations.
Whatever today Georgia is mostly cholchian and nobody complains :))

I wonder who today occupy key posts and have the power in Georgia - western or eastern Georgians?

[user_]

I wonder who today occupy key posts and have the power in Georgia - western or eastern Georgians?

Last four rulers after USSR collapsed: Gamsakhurdia (Megrelia), Shevardanadze(Guria), Ivanishvili (Imereti) are definitely from west.
Saakashvili is in between. But he was always proud about his Megrelian mother's side of family, no one knows about his father.

Noe Jordania- president of Georgian republic 1918-1923 was also westerner.

[MS85]

Saakashvili is in between. But he was always proud about his Megrelian mother's side of family, no one knows about his father.There was a rumor that his father was an Armenian. But he did a DNA test and according to a DNA test Saakashvili is 100% ethnic Georgian.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HHwt9rQCpME

[Leto]

Most if not all modern large ethnic groups or nations were formed by merging various smaller tribes and ethnicities, it's really a no-brainer.

[MS85]

Nope it's not different ethnic group, such differences exists almost among all nations.
Whatever today Georgia is mostly cholchian and nobody complains :))And Colchians are Aryans! Colchians were related to the ancient Aryan Medes and Persians. That makes us relatives not only from the Hurrian side, but also from an Iranic side!

[user_]

There was a rumor that his father was an Armenian. But he did a DNA test and according to a DNA test Saakashvili is 100% ethnic Georgian.


If you want to disqualify a politician in Georgia you should start a rumor that he is Armenian. It's a Georgian form of Antisemitism.
I'm pretty sure his father is Armenian, but Saakashvili is one of the greatest rulers Georgia ever had.

[Zoro]

okay, maybe it's not duduk, i don't know how you call it, but it really sounds very close to Kurdish music.

Never heard of duduk. We call it dhol (drum) and sorna/zorna

Pashtuns use it too


https://youtu.be/28haiLR3iwM

https://youtu.be/k0bY9WNx4dA


https://youtu.be/fAg5XPu7WHM

[MS85]

If you want to disqualify a politician in Georgia you should start a rumor that he is Armenian. It's a Georgian form of Antisemitism.
I'm pretty sure his father is Armenian, but Saakashvili is one of the greatest rulers Georgia ever had.That's why I asked you how old you are. Because when I lived in Tbilisi people in general didn't like the chauvinistic Armenians who claimed that they build Tbilisi, Tbilisi belongs to them and that kind of bla bla bla. Azeri Turks were even more hated (looked down) because those backward Tatars couldn't even speak Georgian. Georgians didn't like the Russians for obvious reasons.

Jews were respected because they had money.

But Ezdi Kurds (not the Muslim Kurds) were the most respected ethnic minority in Georgia. Mostly because many Ezdi Kurds were respected 'wori w zakonie'. And like Kurds, Georgians LOVE that tough macho (gangster) culture.

[MS85]

Never heard of duduk. We call it dhol (drum) and sorna/zornaDuduk is Armenian and Zurna is Kurdish. There is a minor difference between those 2 instruments.

[Leto]

Saakashvili is one of the greatest rulers Georgia ever had.
Really? That globalist American puppet whose wife is a foreigner and whose children live in America (the elder son is married to an American). He said himself he was not a nationalist.

[user_]

That's why I asked you how old you are. Because when I lived in Tbilisi people in general didn't like the chauvinistic Armenians who claimed that they build Tbilisi, Tbilisi belongs to them and that kind of bla bla bla. Azeri Turks were even more hated (looked down) because those backward Tatars couldn't even speak Georgian. Georgians didn't like the Russians for obvious reasons.

Jews were respected because they had money.

But Ezdi Kurds (not the Muslim Kurds) were the most respected ethnic minority in Georgia. Mostly because many Ezdi Kurds were respected 'wori w zakonie'. And like Kurds, Georgians LOVE that tough macho (gangster) culture.

Armenians were hated in Georgia for the same reasons why Jews were hated in the world. But never ever in Georgia was ethnic cleansing, armenians and georgians coexisted peacefully. Today it's a shame to be armenophobic, at least people do not speak loud about it. Azeris are still looked down unfortunately, because of very different life style they have.
Ezid minority is too small to make any problem in Georgia, that's why they never had problems together with Jews. Gangster subculture we left in 90-th.

[user_]

Really? That globalist American puppet whose wife is a foreigner and whose children live in America (the elder son is married to an American). He said himself he was not a nationalist.

He can be alien, but he reformed Georgia from failed state in 90th, to a quite attractive country in the region.

[MS85]

Ezid minority is too small to make any problem in Georgia, that's why they never had problems together with Jews. Gangster subculture we left in 90-th.We forgot also about some Greeks and Germans. Parents of my mother had Greek neighbors. After the collapse of the USSR most Greeks went back home to Greece. There is still an underworld in Georgia. Saakashvili tried to destroy it, but he failed.

[user_]

Never heard of duduk. We call it dhol (drum) and sorna/zorna

Pashtuns use it too


https://youtu.be/28haiLR3iwM

https://youtu.be/k0bY9WNx4dA


https://youtu.be/fAg5XPu7WHM

That sounds for me very Armenian.

[FinalFlash]

Duduk is Armenian and Zurna is Kurdish. There is a minor difference between those 2 instruments.

Zurna is not a Kurdish instrument lol.

[user_]

We forgot also about some Greeks and Germans. Parents of my mother had Greek neighbors. After the collapse of the USSR most Greeks went back home to Greece. There is still an underworld in Georgia. Saakashvili tried to destroy it, but he failed.

Of course Georgia is not sterile, but criminal rate is below average European.

[FinalFlash]

That's why I asked you how old you are. Because when I lived in Tbilisi people in general didn't like the chauvinistic Armenians who claimed that they build Tbilisi, Tbilisi belongs to them and that kind of bla bla bla. Azeri Turks were even more hated (looked down) because those backward Tatars couldn't even speak Georgian. Georgians didn't like the Russians for obvious reasons.

Jews were respected because they had money.

But Ezdi Kurds (not the Muslim Kurds) were the most respected ethnic minority in Georgia. Mostly because many Ezdi Kurds were respected 'wori w zakonie'. And like Kurds, Georgians LOVE that tough macho (gangster) culture.

Armenians formed a majority in Tbilisi until the late 19th and earlier 20th century. It's not that insane to think that they contributed heavily to the culture of the city.

[Leto]

We forgot also about some Greeks and Germans. Parents of my mother had Greek neighbors. After the collapse of the USSR most Greeks went back home to Greece. There is still an underworld in Georgia. Saakashvili tried to destroy it, but he failed.
Georgia nowadays is majority Georgian and the only significant minorities are Azeri Turks and Armenians, the others are small and insignificant/assimilated.

Population by native language in 2014 (5 years ago)

грузинский[2] 3254852 87,64%
азербайджанский 231436 6,23%
армянский 144812 3,90%
русский 45920 1,24%
осетинский 5698 0,15%
другие 31014 0,84%
не указали 72 0,00%
всё население страны 3713804 100,00%
https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%AF%D0%B7%D1%8B%D0%BA%D0%B8_%D0%93%D1%80%D1%83% D0%B7%D0%B8%D0%B8

[MS85]

Zurna is not a Kurdish instrument lol.Zurna is pure Kurdish. It was one of the first instruments together with 'daf'/dohol used in the Zagros mountains!

[Leto]

Of course Georgia is not sterile, but criminal rate is below average European.
Depends on the type of crime. In Russia Georgians are vastly overrepresented in burglary and home invasion statistics. A lot of Georgian organized crime in Russia. Especially given that there's like 300-500,000 Georgians in Russia or so (in a country of like 145 million).

[user_]

Armenians formed a majority in Tbilisi until the late 19th and earlier 20th century. It's not that insane to think that they contributed heavily to the culture of the city.

They contributed a lot to Tbilisi. Georgia gave shelter to hundred thousand Armenians who run from Ottoman Empire.
Tbilisi always was Georgian city, but in 16-17th centuries when Armenians had lost their nationhood long time ago, Georgians still fight for it. Persians cleansed Tbilisi from Georgians and gave advantages to Armenians and Azeris who were very good at trading and were not fighting against Persian Empire. That how Georgians became a minority in their own city.

[user_]

Depends on the type of crime. In Russia Georgians are vastly overrepresented in burglary and home invasion statistics. A lot of Georgian organized crime in Russia. Especially given that there's like 300-500,000 Georgians in Russia or so (in a country of like 145 million).

Russia is a shelter for the criminals who run from Georgia during Saakashvili's repressions. There are 145 000 ethnic Georgians in Russia, rest are probably "non georgian georgians". Georgians do not go to Russia this days.

[FinalFlash]

Zurna is pure Kurdish. It was one of the first instruments together with 'daf'/dohol used in the Zagros mountains!

Zurna and tsiranapogh(duduk) are Armenian instruments. Whether Kurds have adopted it as part of their culture is irrelevant.

[Leto]

Russia is a shelter for the criminals who run from Georgia during Saakashvili's repressions. There are 145 000 ethnic Georgians in Russia, rest are probably "non georgian georgians". Georgians do not go to Russia this days.
Well, I personally have met some Georgians in Russia, in church for example. I generally don't mind them, they're not Muzzrats (most problematic communities in the world tend to be Muslim, I wonder why :rolleyes: ), they tend to assimilate well and you're right, the diaspora is less prominent and less vocal than Azerbaijani and especially Armenian, though unofficial numbers are higher than 150k. I've seen estimates as high as 800,000 but that sounds totally unrealistic to me.

[FinalFlash]

They contributed a lot to Tbilisi. Georgia gave shelter to hundred thousand Armenians who run from Ottoman Empire.
Tbilisi always was Georgian city, but in 16-17th centuries when Armenians had lost their nationhood long time ago, Georgians still fight for it. Persians cleansed Tbilisi from Georgians and gave advantages to Armenians and Azeris who were very good at trading and were not fighting against Persian Empire. That how Georgians became a minority in their own city.

During the 16th-17th century, both modern day Armenian and Georgia were part of various Persian dynasties. The Persians, notably Shah Abbas cleansed Yerevan of Armenians and infested the city with Azeris and Kurds as well. It's a huge part of why there is an existing Armenian diaspora in Iran till this day.

[FinalFlash]

Well, I personally have met some Georgians in Russia, in church for example. I generally don't mind them, they're not Muzzrats (most problematic communities in the world tend to be Muslim, I wonder why :rolleyes: ), they tend to assimilate well and you're right, the diaspora is less prominent and less vocal than Azerbaijani and especially Armenian, though unofficial numbers are higher than 150k. I've seen estimates as high as 800,000 but that sounds totally unrealistic to me.

Georgians probably assimilate easier than Armenians do mostly because Georgians opt to emigrate to the EU and the west in general. Russia still accepts guest workers from Armenia.

[Leto]

Kurds are/were nomadic people in the recent past, at least Arabs and Turks often say so.

[Leto]

Georgians probably assimilate easier than Armenians do mostly because Georgians opt to emigrate to the EU and the west in general. Russia still accepts guest workers from Armenia.
Assimilation is barely possible with large numbers of people, even of they're generally not bad. See Mexicans in the SW US, Chinese in Canada, etc. Or even Russians in the Baltics. It only works with small/moderate numbers and also willingness to assimilate.

[user_]

Well, I personally have met some Georgians in Russia, in church for example. I generally don't mind them, they're not Muzzrats (most problematic communities in the world tend to be Muslim, I wonder why :rolleyes: ), they tend to assimilate well and you're right, the diaspora is less prominent and less vocal than Azerbaijani and especially Armenian, though unofficial numbers are higher than 150k. I've seen estimates as high as 800,000 but that sounds totally unrealistic to me.

That's just propaganda. You can check how many citizens of Georgia got Russian visa, and most of them are not even Georgians but Azeris and Armenians from Georgia. I hope that you don't think that Georgians who can go to Norway or Sweden without visa, go illegally to Russia crossing Caucasian mountains lol :D

Georgians don't have diasporas, second generation of Georgians assimilate with the local population.

[FinalFlash]

Assimilation is barely possible with large numbers of people, even of they're generally not bad. See Mexicans in the SW US, Chinese in Canada, etc. Or even Russians in the Baltics. It only works with small/moderate numbers and also willingness to assimilate.

Exactly. To be fair, there are lots of us that are already heavily Rusified. I'm talking people who can barely speak a lick of the native language and are culturally more similar to Russians.

[FinalFlash]

That's just propaganda. You can check how many citizens of Georgia got Russian visa, and most of them are not even Georgians but Azeris and Armenians from Georgia. I hope that you don't think that Georgians who can go to Norway or Sweden without visa, go illegally to Russia crossing Caucasian mountains lol :D

Georgians don't have diasporas, second generation of Georgians assimilate with the local population.

Russia couldn't have received a significant number of ethnic Armenians from Georgia because the number of Armenians in Georgia has heavily dwindled since the fall of the USSR. I wouldn't be surprised if there are no more than 200K Armenians left there.

[Leto]

Exactly. To be fair, there are lots of us that are already heavily Rusified. I'm talking people who can barely speak a lick of the native language and are culturally more similar to Russians.
Second generation yes, they can't write or read Armenian which requires learning. Mixed marriages are common too.

[MS85]

Zurna and tsiranapogh(duduk) are Armenian instruments. Whether Kurds have adopted it as part of their culture is irrelevant.This is a crazy Armenian speaking in you. 1st ever Zurna was made in Kurdistan/Zagros, period!

[Leto]

That's just propaganda. You can check how many citizens of Georgia got Russian visa, and most of them are not even Georgians but Azeris and Armenians from Georgia. I hope that you don't think that Georgians who can go to Norway or Sweden without visa, go illegally to Russia crossing Caucasian mountains lol :D

Georgians don't have diasporas, second generation of Georgians assimilate with the local population.
Thousands of Georgians come to Germany as asylum seekers, even though there's no war or persecution going on in Georgia. That's hilarious.

[MS85]

Kurds are/were nomadic people in the recent past, at least Arabs and Turks often say so.Some Kurdish tribes were semi-nomadic in the past because they went to places looking for grass land where their cattle could eat (like proto-cowboys). But those tribes always stayed inside Kurdistan borders and within Zagros Mountains.

[user_]

Russia couldn't have received a significant number of ethnic Armenians from Georgia because the number of Armenians in Georgia has heavily dwindled since the fall of the USSR. I wouldn't be surprised if there are no more than 200K Armenians left there.

Most of Armenians and Azeris who left Georgia in the crisis of 90th went to Russia.

[Leto]

Some Kurdish tribes were semi-nomadic in the past because they went to places looking for grass land where their cattle could eat (like proto-cowboys). But those tribes always stayed inside Kurdistan borders and within Zagros Mountains.
What are your thoughts on Syrian Kurds? Arabs say they're illegal settlers. Are they genetically any different?

[MS85]

Most of Armenians and Azeris who left Georgia in the crisis of 90th went to Russia.Not only the Armenians. 1/2 of Ezdi Kurds who left Georgia went to Russia, other 1/2 that left Georgia went to the Western countries.

I was born in the USSR. I don't live in Russia, but If I want I can get a Russian nationality because I was born in the USSR. Back then Georgia/Tbilisi was part of the USSR.

[FinalFlash]

Most of Armenians and Azeris who left Georgia in the crisis of 90th went to Russia.

I beg to differ. The US received a ton of immigrants from Georgia. I personally know a family from Georgia.

[FinalFlash]

Tjis is a crazy Armenian speaking in you. 1st ever Zurna was made in Kurdistan/Zagros, period!

I disagree. Zurna is not an Iranian instrument period. It's native to the Armenian Highlands. Kurds adopting this instrument has no bearing on the origins of the instrument.

[user_]

Thousands of Georgians come to Germany as asylum seekers, even though there's no war or persecution going on in Georgia. That's hilarious.

West Balkan countries do the same. They are looking for easier life. But now that number is decreasing, that was an affect of visa liberalization, people thought that they will get German citizenship in the airport of Berlin as soon as they arrive :D

[FinalFlash]

Second generation yes, they can't write or read Armenian which requires learning. Mixed marriages are common too.

How common are mixed marriages among Armenians and Russians? I have heard stories of guest workers starting second families with Russian women lmao but I don't know if its all too common.

[MS85]

What are your thoughts on Syrian Kurds? Arabs say they're illegal settlers. Are they genetically any different?Native to their homeland. Iranic people always lived in Northern Syria. The thing is that 100 years ago there were only 3.5 million Kurds. Today, there are 50 million Kurds. Kurdish population simply has grown.

Arabs are Bedouin settles who came very recently to Northern Syria. Father of Assad who was part of the Bath regime ethnic cleansed many Kurdish areas and tried to Arabize Kurdistan. Arabs are actually the illegal settlers in Rojava

[Zoro]

Zurna and tsiranapogh(duduk) are Armenian instruments. Whether Kurds have adopted it as part of their culture is irrelevant.

It’s highly unlikely it originated in Armenians because Kurds and Pashtuns and other Central Asians, Chinese, and Indians use it. Likely it originated in central Asia and perhaps Turkics or some others spread it east, west, and south

http://www.socalfolkdance.org/articles/mysterious_age_old_zurna_ozkok.htm

[Leto]

How common are mixed marriages among Armenians and Russians? I have heard stories of guest workers starting second families with Russian women lmao but I don't know if its all too common.
It is relatively common (prolly 25-30% or so) but most Armenians in Russia are not guest workers, they're naturalized. At least 70-80% or so. Though there are workers too, road builders for example. The largest waves were in the 90s and early 00s. Baku Armenians, Karabakh Armenians among others.

[MS85]

How common are mixed marriages among Armenians and Russians? I have heard stories of guest workers starting second families with Russian women lmao but I don't know if its all too common.Russian women love 'cherna zopix' from Caucasus. Especially the Georgians.

[FinalFlash]

It’s highly unlikely it originated in Armenians because Kurds and Pashtuns and other Central Asians, Chinese, and Indians use it. Likely it originated in central Asia and perhaps Turkics or some others spread it east, west, and south

http://www.socalfolkdance.org/articles/mysterious_age_old_zurna_ozkok.htm

We are talking about zurna right? Possibly, though I still doubt it. As far as the tziranapogh(duduk), that's all grade A Armenian baby.

[FinalFlash]

It is relatively common (prolly 25-30% or so) but most Armenians in Russia are not guest workers, they're naturalized. At least 70-80% or so. Though there are workers too, road builders for example. The largest waves were in the 90s and early 00s. Baku Armenians, Karabakh Armenians among others.

I wouldn't blame them. Ukrainian and Russian women are delicious ;). You'd have to be a moron or queer to want anything else if you have access to such women.

[MS85]

We are talking about zurna right? Possibly, though I still doubt it. As far as the tziranapogh(duduk), that's all grade A Armenian baby.Like Aram Khachaturian once said: duduk is Armenian, but Zurna is Kurdish!

[Leto]

I wouldn't blame them. Ukrainian and Russian women are delicious ;). You'd have to be a moron or queer to want anything else if you have access to such women.
Well, if you guys don't mind assimilating and losing your language, culture, religion and becoming mongrels, then go ahead. I personally think Russian women are overrated, after 30 they often don't look so attractive. White Americans are no less attractive, unless they're fat of course.

[Cumansky]

I wouldn't blame them. Ukrainian and Russian women are delicious ;). You'd have to be a moron or queer to want anything else if you have access to such women.

I can tell you get no pussy, especially Ukrainian.

[user_]

How common are mixed marriages among Armenians and Russians? I have heard stories of guest workers starting second families with Russian women lmao but I don't know if its all too common.

Not very common. About 70% of Armenians in Russia marry Armenians and only 25% Russians.
For example Georgians in Russia marry mostly Russians 57%, and only 30% marry Georgians.

[Cumansky]

Why you Kurds naming flute after me anyways??

[FinalFlash]

Well, if you guys don't mind assimilating and losing your language, culture, religion and becoming mongrels, then go ahead. I personally think Russian women are overrated, after 30 they often don't look so attractive. White Americans are no less attractive, unless they're fat of course.

I do mind assimilating, it's just that I can understand why an immigrant group would opt to assimilate to fit better into their host societies. Keep in mind that we are talking about Diasporans. It's another story if we are talking about Armenians from Armenia. I don't think there are many Russians in the republic other than Ruski Molokans so we aren't in danger of that yet. Russian women may be overrated a bit but I think Ukrainian are better.

[Leto]

Let's not derail the thread too much, Russian women have nothing to do with the subject, especially given it's about to turn into a degenerate discussion.

[FinalFlash]

I can tell you get no pussy, especially Ukrainian.

There are hardly any Ukrainians out here in LA, real ones at least so you are right about that. But as far as getting pussy, pah bitch please. You must be a real Hugh Hefner lol

[MS85]

Why you Kurds naming flute after me anyways??The name is derived from Kurdish/Persian سرنای surnāy composed of سور sūr 'banquet feast' and نای nāy 'reed pipe'

https://www.definitions.net/definition/a+multinational+outdoor+wind+instrument+usually+ac companied+by+a+davul+in+Anatolian+folk+music+The+n ame+is+derived+from+Persian+سرنای+surnāy+composed+ of+سور+sūr+“banquet+feast”+and+نای+nāy+“reed+pip e”

[Cumansky]

There are hardly any Ukrainians out here in LA, real ones at least so you are right about that. But as far as getting pussy, pah bitch please. You must be a real Hugh Hefner lol

Hugh Hefner I been, now I am family man. Lol..

[Cumansky]

The name is derived from Kurdish/Persian سرنای surnāy composed of سور sūr 'banquet feast' and نای nāy 'reed pipe'

https://www.definitions.net/definition/a+multinational+outdoor+wind+instrument+usually+ac companied+by+a+davul+in+Anatolian+folk+music+The+n ame+is+derived+from+Persian+سرنای+surnāy+composed+ of+سور+sūr+“banquet+feast”+and+نای+nāy+“reed+pip e”

Sound like root of my surname.