About “west Asian” component in Eurogenes

[Ahaddad]

I see a lot of middle eastern people from Fertile Crescent share up to 20% to West Asian component, Lebanese Muslim around 22-26%, Lebanese Christian-19-22%, Syrian-20-28%, Iraqi arabs-25-30%, Iraqi Christians 30-36%, Kurds around 37-40%, Armenians 38-40%, Kurd Jews and Iranian Jews around 30%.

I know that have people from Caucasus like Georgians have more than 50%, but I think west Asian it’s very present in Mesopotamia, south to north and all ethnicities from Iraq have up than 28% of West Asian component. I see the Assyrians (indigenous people from Iraq), all of them have around 34-35%. My question is if this componente can be a Mesopotamian component?

[Kyp]

I see a lot of middle eastern people from Fertile Crescent share up to 20% to West Asian component, Lebanese Muslim around 22-26%, Lebanese Christian-19-22%, Syrian-20-28%, Iraqi arabs-25-30%, Iraqi Christians 30-36%, Kurds around 37-40%, Armenians 38-40%, Kurd Jews and Iranian Jews around 30%.

I know that have people from Caucasus like Georgians have more than 50%, but I think west Asian it’s very present in Mesopotamia, south to north and all ethnicities from Iraq have up than 28% of West Asian component. I see the Assyrians (indigenous people from Iraq), all of them have around 34-35%. My question is if this componente can be a Mesopotamian component?

It's a caucasus component. Main Haplogroup of arabs (J1) is from the Caucasus originally. Arabs are a mix of Caucasus population mixed with a Natufian/Proto-Semitic population. This migration likely happened in the Neolithic. Mesopotamians are obviously less semitic than peninsula arabs.


I see the Assyrians (indigenous people from Iraq), all of them have around 34-35%

Makes sense since Assyrians are a native northern middle eastern population.

[Ahaddad]

It's a caucasus component. Main Haplogroup of arabs (J1) is from the Caucasus originally. Arabs are a mix of Caucasus population mixed with a Natufian/Proto-Semitic population. This migration likely happened in the Neolithic. Mesopotamians are obviously less semitic than peninsula arabs.



Makes sense since Assyrians are a native northern middle eastern population.





That’s right but west Asian it’s more middle eastern component than east med that are majority from Cyprus and Levant?

[Rgvgjhvv]

That’s right but west Asian it’s more middle eastern component than east med that are majority from Cyprus and Levant?

Basically

[Kyp]

That’s right but west Asian it’s more middle eastern component than east med that are majority from Cyprus and Levant?


Basically

it's a bit more complicated than that. Red_sea and eastmed are more associated with Natufian and Anatolian_Neolithic while westasian is more with Iranics,Assyrians and Caucasus people. I would say both are equally middle-eastern. Just because westasian is also high in centralasia does not make it non-middleeastern same with east_med and europe.
In my opinion Red_Sea is the true semitic marker though.

[Jana]

That’s right but west Asian it’s more middle eastern component than east med that are majority from Cyprus and Levant?

No. I score 10% West Asian for example, and I cluster in Central Europe. It's CHG component. Yamnaya was half west asian.

[Rgvgjhvv]

I thought Red Sea is mostly Arabs?

[Rgvgjhvv]

No. I score 10% West Asian for example, and I cluster in Central Europe. It's CHG component. Yamnaya was half west asian.

That seems really high for your ancestry, no?

[Jana]

That seems really high for your ancestry, no?

Above average, yes. But my east med is very below average. I also score 0% red sea.

[Kaspias]

West Asian = CHG + Middle East
East_Med = ENF + Middle East

Basically.

[Kyp]

East_Med peaks in Yemenite Jews
West_asian peaks in Caucasus populations.
Red_sea in Saudis, Bedouins and Yemenite Jews also high in North & East africa

Make of it what you want.

[hussein khan]

I see a lot of middle eastern people from Fertile Crescent share up to 20% to West Asian component, Lebanese Muslim around 22-26%, Lebanese Christian-19-22%, Syrian-20-28%, Iraqi arabs-25-30%, Iraqi Christians 30-36%, Kurds around 37-40%, Armenians 38-40%, Kurd Jews and Iranian Jews around 30%.

I know that have people from Caucasus like Georgians have more than 50%, but I think west Asian it’s very present in Mesopotamia, south to north and all ethnicities from Iraq have up than 28% of West Asian component. I see the Assyrians (indigenous people from Iraq), all of them have around 34-35%. My question is if this componente can be a Mesopotamian component?


Thing about west asian is as the turkish member said, heavily CHG-shifted. Kurds and iranians are more CHG shifted than lebanese are, hence why the higher "west asian". But that doesnt mean theyre more caucasus-shifted. Its just the fact that groups like lebanese get less "wast asian" due to their fact that their caucasus component goes to other components, such as east med. '

CHG/gedrosia is also peaked in groups like balochs(theyre an ethnicity from south east iran to south west pakistan....no, theyre not punjabis or indians. Theyre iranics and different from rest of the pakis). I can demonstrate it for you:

Here is k13 eurogenes. It has the component called "west asian". This is what happens when both the baloch, lebanese and iranian runs their kit:

Kurd/west iranian:

Population
North_Atlantic 4.43 Pct
Baltic 4.43 Pct
West_Med 8.77 Pct
West_Asian 37.04 Pct
East_Med 30.42 Pct
Red_Sea 3.01 Pct
South_Asian 4.77 Pct
East_Asian 2.66 Pct
Siberian 1.46 Pct
Amerindian 1.22 Pct
Oceanian 0.48 Pct
Northeast_African -
Sub-Saharan 1.31 Pc


A lebanese christian:


Population
North_Atlantic 4.43 Pct
Baltic -
West_Med 12.16 Pct
West_Asian 19.82 Pct
East_Med 48.94 Pct
Red_Sea 11.53 Pct
South_Asian 1.83 Pct
East_Asian 1.08 Pct
Siberian -
Amerindian -
Oceanian 0.21 Pct
Northeast_African -
Sub-Saharan


And a pak baloch:

Population
North_Atlantic -
Baltic 0.79 Pct
West_Med -
West_Asian 57.35 Pct
East_Med 6.55 Pct
Red_Sea 5.25 Pct
South_Asian 25.15 Pct
East_Asian -
Siberian -
Amerindian 0.88 Pct
Oceanian 0.34 Pct
Northeast_African 0.62 Pct
Sub-Saharan 3.07 P

Now, it seems like the most west asian shifted group here is the pak baloch, although the formers are actually west asians. But as told before, west asian is heavily gedrosia/CHG-shifted.

Now, lets try with a calc that doesnt has the component "west asian", but instead divided it to "baloch"(just called baloch, because it peaks the most in balochs) and "caucasian".

Lets try harrappaworld:

PAK-Baloch:

# Population Percent
1 Baloch 61.79
2 SW-Asian 14.05
3 Caucasian 12.23
4 S-Indian 6.97
5 W-African 2.3
6 Papuan 1.09
7 San 0.75
8 Beringian 0.4
9 American 0.32
10 E-African 0.09


the kurd/west iranian:

Population
S-Indian 0.60 Pct
Baloch 23.64 Pct
Caucasian 41.09 Pct
NE-Euro 6.75 Pct
SE-Asian 0.09 Pct
Siberian 1.11 Pct
NE-Asian 3.60 Pct
Papuan 0.26 Pct
American 0.07 Pct
Beringian 1.01 Pct
Mediterranean 9.96 Pct
SW-Asian 10.68 Pct
San -
E-African -
Pygmy 1.13 Pct
W-African -


The lebanese christian:


Population
S-Indian 0.54 Pct
Baloch 13.40 Pct
Caucasian 41.92 Pct
NE-Euro 1.68 Pct
SE-Asian 0.80 Pct
Siberian -
NE-Asian -
Papuan 0.58 Pct
American -
Beringian -
Mediterranean 15.18 Pct
SW-Asian 25.91 Pct
San -
E-African -
Pygmy -
W-African

As it shows in harrappaworld, baloch is no longer the most west asian-shifted group. Lebanese(although they can even get up to 50% caucasian, which i never seen for west iranians/kurds) is the most caucasian-shifted one and the kurd is almost equally as caucasian-shifted. The kurd here is just more baloch/gedrosia/CHG-shifted.
Its the same case with other calcs, that are doing the same thing: putting CHG with caucasus and label it as west asian.

Also the reason why i prefer harrappaworld over many other calcs-

[Cumansky]

No. I score 10% West Asian for example, and I cluster in Central Europe. It's CHG component. Yamnaya was half west asian.

You got all your West Asian from Yamnaya?

[Cumansky]

West Asian a Gedrosian component, Moroccan won't score West Asian where do you see it:

Population Percent
1 West_Med 28.58
2 East_Med 20.8
3 Red_Sea 18.17
4 Sub-Saharan 12.17
5 Northeast_African 11.18
6 North_Atlantic 9.09

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Moroccan 6.36
2 Mozabite_Berber 6.83
3 Algerian 9.17
4 Tunisian 10.92
5 Egyptian 24.69
6 Algerian_Jewish 25.41
7 Libyan_Jewish 25.88
8 Tunisian_Jewish 27.08
9 West_Sicilian 27.41
10 East_Sicilian 27.63
11 Sephardic_Jewish 27.92
12 Italian_Jewish 28.3
13 South_Italian 28.55
14 Bedouin 28.7
15 Ashkenazi 28.97
16 Central_Greek 29.81
17 Tuscan 30.2
18 Italian_Abruzzo 30.52
19 Greek_Thessaly 31.19
20 Jordanian 31.48

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 96.5% Moroccan + 3.5% Yoruban @ 5.13
2 96.2% Moroccan + 3.8% Mandenka @ 5.16
3 96.2% Moroccan + 3.8% Bantu_S.W. @ 5.21
4 96.1% Moroccan + 3.9% Bantu_S.E. @ 5.23
5 96.1% Moroccan + 3.9% Biaka_Pygmy @ 5.31
6 95.9% Moroccan + 4.1% Luhya @ 5.39
7 95.9% Moroccan + 4.1% Bantu_N.E. @ 5.41
8 96.1% Moroccan + 3.9% Mbuti_Pygmy @ 5.54
9 96.3% Moroccan + 3.7% San @ 5.72
10 63.7% Moroccan + 36.3% Mozabite_Berber @ 6.11
11 97.8% Moroccan + 2.2% Sudanese @ 6.15
12 95.9% Moroccan + 4.1% Sardinian @ 6.2
13 97.7% Moroccan + 2.3% Sandawe @ 6.21
14 98.2% Moroccan + 1.8% Ethiopian_Anuak @ 6.22
15 97.5% Moroccan + 2.5% French_Basque @ 6.23
16 98.1% Moroccan + 1.9% Maasai @ 6.25
17 98.6% Moroccan + 1.4% Hadza @ 6.28
18 98.3% Moroccan + 1.7% Southwest_French @ 6.32
19 98.4% Moroccan + 1.6% Spanish_Cantabria @ 6.32
20 98.9% Moroccan + 1.1% Spanish_Aragon @ 6.34

Turks will score West Asian ofcourse even if they are Levantine shifted, West Asian is ancestral to them:

Population Percent
1 East_Med 24.62
2 West_Asian 20.61
3 South_Asian 9.82
4 West_Med 8.97
5 Red_Sea 8.19
6 North_Atlantic 8.02
7 Baltic 6.37
8 Siberian 4.46
9 Northeast_African 4.16
10 East_Asian 3.2
11 Oceanian 0.94
12 Sub-Saharan 0.65

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Turkish 12.42
2 Azeri 14.26
3 Syrian 16.58
4 Turkmen 16.61
5 Lebanese_Muslim 17.41
6 Iranian 18.38
7 East_Sicilian 18.6
8 Central_Greek 19.07
9 Ashkenazi 19.27
10 Jordanian 19.44
11 Kurdish 19.48
12 South_Italian 19.86
13 Iranian_Jewish 19.96
14 Assyrian 19.99
15 Sephardic_Jewish 20.25
16 Italian_Abruzzo 20.49
17 Georgian_Jewish 20.51
18 Cyprian 20.58
19 Libyan_Jewish 20.8
20 Tunisian_Jewish 20.88

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 53% Libyan_Jewish + 47% Afghan_Tadjik @ 4.17
2 54% Libyan_Jewish + 46% Tadjik @ 4.71
3 52.9% Tunisian_Jewish + 47.1% Afghan_Tadjik @ 4.74
4 51.4% Tadjik + 48.6% Egyptian @ 5.26
5 53.9% Tunisian_Jewish + 46.1% Tadjik @ 5.3
6 53.3% Palestinian + 46.7% Tadjik @ 5.82
7 55.9% Jordanian + 44.1% Tadjik @ 5.84
8 64.8% Tunisian_Jewish + 35.2% Burusho @ 6
9 52.4% Afghan_Tadjik + 47.6% Egyptian @ 6.07
10 58.8% Libyan_Jewish + 41.2% Afghan_Pashtun @ 6.07
11 64.9% Libyan_Jewish + 35.1% Burusho @ 6.09
12 65.7% Turkmen + 34.3% Moroccan @ 6.11
13 53.2% Bedouin + 46.8% Tadjik @ 6.12
14 64.6% Turkmen + 35.4% Algerian @ 6.16
15 64.1% Turkmen + 35.9% Tunisian @ 6.19
16 58.8% Tunisian_Jewish + 41.2% Afghan_Pashtun @ 6.39
17 52.1% Algerian_Jewish + 47.9% Afghan_Tadjik @ 6.44
18 52.3% Palestinian + 47.7% Afghan_Tadjik @ 6.47
19 53.9% Sephardic_Jewish + 46.1% Afghan_Tadjik @ 6.53
20 55% Jordanian + 45% Afghan_Tadjik @ 6.59

Slavs who withstand medieval Ottoman incursions, they don't score much West Asian even if they are Levantine shifted, Davidski has us over 50% Yamnaya derived and 1.7% West Asian:

Population Percent
1 Baltic 45.95
2 North_Atlantic 24.29
3 East_Med 11.25
4 West_Med 10.66
5 Sub-Saharan 3.08
6 West_Asian 1.7
7 Siberian 1.67
8 Red_Sea 0.72
9 Northeast_African 0.6
10 Oceanian 0.09

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Southwest_Russian 7.64
2 Ukrainian 8.21
3 Estonian_Polish 8.47
4 Belorussian 9.04
5 Ukrainian_Belgorod 9.11
6 Ukrainian_Lviv 9.22
7 Russian_Smolensk 9.39
8 South_Polish 9.55
9 Polish 9.7
10 Kargopol_Russian 11.8
11 Croatian 11.88
12 Lithuanian 12.74
13 Erzya 12.89
14 Estonian 13.73
15 Moldavian 14.05
16 East_Finnish 14.99
17 Finnish 15.08
18 Hungarian 15.87
19 Southwest_Finnish 16.28
20 East_German 18.34

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 88.4% Estonian_Polish + 11.6% Tunisian @ 5.43
2 87.4% Belorussian + 12.6% Tunisian @ 5.56
3 81.2% Lithuanian + 18.8% Tunisian @ 5.63
4 80.4% Lithuanian + 19.6% Algerian_Jewish @ 5.67
5 88.7% Estonian_Polish + 11.3% Algerian @ 5.68
6 88.9% Estonian_Polish + 11.1% Mozabite_Berber @ 5.7
7 88.2% Estonian_Polish + 11.8% Algerian_Jewish @ 5.71
8 89.8% Estonian_Polish + 10.2% Egyptian @ 5.71
9 86.5% Estonian_Polish + 13.5% Ashkenazi @ 5.77
10 77.7% Lithuanian + 22.3% Ashkenazi @ 5.78
11 87.8% Belorussian + 12.2% Mozabite_Berber @ 5.8
12 87.7% Belorussian + 12.3% Algerian @ 5.83
13 89.2% Estonian_Polish + 10.8% Tunisian_Jewish @ 5.9
14 88.6% Estonian_Polish + 11.4% Italian_Jewish @ 5.91
15 89.2% Estonian_Polish + 10.8% Libyan_Jewish @ 5.92
16 87.3% Belorussian + 12.7% Algerian_Jewish @ 5.92
17 90.4% Estonian_Polish + 9.6% Samaritan @ 5.96
18 89.4% Estonian_Polish + 10.6% Moroccan @ 5.98
19 90.6% Estonian_Polish + 9.4% Lebanese_Christian @ 5.99
20 80.8% Lithuanian + 19.2% Italian_Jewish @ 6

Converted European Jews from Steppe with Q Y-DNA marker have West Asian signal somewhat in their result:

Population Percent
1 East_Med 35.52
2 North_Atlantic 18.79
3 West_Med 17.85
4 West_Asian 9.65
5 Baltic 7.69
6 Red_Sea 5.84
7 Northeast_African 1.72
8 Siberian 1.57
9 East_Asian 0.94
10 Oceanian 0.44

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Ashkenazi 4.16
2 Italian_Jewish 6.84
3 East_Sicilian 7.43
4 Sephardic_Jewish 7.62
5 South_Italian 7.94
6 West_Sicilian 7.99
7 Algerian_Jewish 8.7
8 Central_Greek 8.91
9 Italian_Abruzzo 9.47
10 Tunisian_Jewish 10.83
11 Libyan_Jewish 11.67
12 Greek_Thessaly 12.43
13 Tuscan 13.46
14 Cyprian 16.38
15 Lebanese_Muslim 19.31
16 North_Italian 19.88
17 Bulgarian 20.29
18 Syrian 20.36
19 Palestinian 21.16
20 Samaritan 21.29

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 88.7% Italian_Jewish + 11.3% Finnish @ 2.3
2 88.2% Italian_Jewish + 11.8% Southwest_Finnish @ 2.33
3 89% Italian_Jewish + 11% East_Finnish @ 2.46
4 89.1% Italian_Jewish + 10.9% La_Brana-1 @ 2.52
5 87.9% Italian_Jewish + 12.1% North_Swedish @ 2.56
6 89.1% Italian_Jewish + 10.9% Estonian @ 2.65
7 84.2% Italian_Jewish + 15.8% Hungarian @ 2.8
8 88.4% Italian_Jewish + 11.6% Belorussian @ 2.82
9 87% Italian_Jewish + 13% South_Polish @ 2.89
10 88.4% Italian_Jewish + 11.6% Estonian_Polish @ 2.98
11 87.9% Italian_Jewish + 12.1% Southwest_Russian @ 2.98
12 88.7% Italian_Jewish + 11.3% Kargopol_Russian @ 3
13 89.5% Italian_Jewish + 10.5% Lithuanian @ 3.01
14 88% Italian_Jewish + 12% Polish @ 3.02
15 88.4% Italian_Jewish + 11.6% Russian_Smolensk @ 3.04
16 88.1% Italian_Jewish + 11.9% Swedish @ 3.08
17 88% Italian_Jewish + 12% Ukrainian_Belgorod @ 3.09
18 80.7% Italian_Jewish + 19.3% Serbian @ 3.1
19 87.4% Italian_Jewish + 12.6% Ukrainian @ 3.11
20 85.1% Italian_Jewish + 14.9% Austrian @ 3.14

[Jana]

You got all your West Asian from Yamnaya?

I don't think so, there is extra West Asian in SE Europeans that arrived later, probably from Anatolia.

[Cumansky]

I don't think so, there is extra West Asian in SE Europeans that arrived later, probably from Anatolia.

When did arrive and what culture can you pinpoint? My Father has more than me West Asian

[Jana]

When did arrive and what culture can you pinpoint? My Father has more than me West Asian

I am not really sure. Maybe some Iron Age migration. Because for example Greeks, Albanians and South Italians have highest CHG in Europe, but low Yamnaya.

[Cumansky]

I am not really sure. Maybe some Iron Age migration. Because for example Greeks, Albanians and South Italians have highest CHG in Europe, but low Yamnaya.

I assume must be late migration to Greece, Italy and Albania because Farmer derived Sardinians don't score any West Asian, and that was the substrate always found in the Balkans, West Asian was brought with Turkish rapes and Jewish medieval migrations:

# Population Percent
1 West_Med 56.16
2 East_Med 21.22
3 North_Atlantic 20.84
4 Red_Sea 1.31
5 Sub-Saharan 0.35
6 East_Asian 0.12

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Sardinian 4.42
2 Spanish_Andalucia 30.86
3 North_Italian 31.53
4 Tuscan 32.24
5 Spanish_Extremadura 32.62
6 Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha 32.68
7 Spanish_Valencia 32.77
8 Spanish_Aragon 32.92
9 West_Sicilian 33.2
10 Spanish_Cantabria 33.43
11 Spanish_Murcia 33.58
12 Southwest_French 33.8
13 Spanish_Galicia 34.09
14 Portuguese 34.2
15 Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon 34.6
16 South_Italian 34.84
17 Spanish_Cataluna 35.24
18 Algerian_Jewish 35.68
19 East_Sicilian 35.97
20 Central_Greek 36.27

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 100% Sardinian + 0% Abhkasian @ 4.42
2 100% Sardinian + 0% Adygei @ 4.42
3 100% Sardinian + 0% Afghan_Pashtun @ 4.42
4 100% Sardinian + 0% Afghan_Tadjik @ 4.42
5 100% Sardinian + 0% Afghan_Turkmen @ 4.42
6 100% Sardinian + 0% Aghan_Hazara @ 4.42
7 100% Sardinian + 0% Algerian @ 4.42
8 100% Sardinian + 0% Algerian_Jewish @ 4.42
9 100% Sardinian + 0% Altaian @ 4.42
10 100% Sardinian + 0% Armenian @ 4.42
11 100% Sardinian + 0% Ashkenazi @ 4.42
12 100% Sardinian + 0% Assyrian @ 4.42
13 100% Sardinian + 0% Austrian @ 4.42
14 100% Sardinian + 0% Austroasiatic_Ho @ 4.42
15 100% Sardinian + 0% Azeri @ 4.42
16 100% Sardinian + 0% Balkar @ 4.42
17 100% Sardinian + 0% Balochi @ 4.42
18 100% Sardinian + 0% Bangladeshi @ 4.42
19 100% Sardinian + 0% Bantu_N.E. @ 4.42
20 100% Sardinian + 0% Bantu_S.E. @ 4.42

[Kyp]

I am not really sure. Maybe some Iron Age migration. Because for example Greeks, Albanians and South Italians have highest CHG in Europe, but low Yamnaya.

Croats are iranics confirmed ;)

[Seya]

I assume must be late migration to Greece, Italy and Albania because Farmer derived Sardinians don't score any West Asian, and that was the substrate always found in the Balkans:

# Population Percent
1 West_Med 56.16
2 East_Med 21.22
3 North_Atlantic 20.84
4 Red_Sea 1.31
5 Sub-Saharan 0.35
6 East_Asian 0.12

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Sardinian 4.42
2 Spanish_Andalucia 30.86
3 North_Italian 31.53
4 Tuscan 32.24
5 Spanish_Extremadura 32.62
6 Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha 32.68
7 Spanish_Valencia 32.77
8 Spanish_Aragon 32.92
9 West_Sicilian 33.2
10 Spanish_Cantabria 33.43
11 Spanish_Murcia 33.58
12 Southwest_French 33.8
13 Spanish_Galicia 34.09
14 Portuguese 34.2
15 Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon 34.6
16 South_Italian 34.84
17 Spanish_Cataluna 35.24
18 Algerian_Jewish 35.68
19 East_Sicilian 35.97
20 Central_Greek 36.27

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 100% Sardinian + 0% Abhkasian @ 4.42
2 100% Sardinian + 0% Adygei @ 4.42
3 100% Sardinian + 0% Afghan_Pashtun @ 4.42
4 100% Sardinian + 0% Afghan_Tadjik @ 4.42
5 100% Sardinian + 0% Afghan_Turkmen @ 4.42
6 100% Sardinian + 0% Aghan_Hazara @ 4.42
7 100% Sardinian + 0% Algerian @ 4.42
8 100% Sardinian + 0% Algerian_Jewish @ 4.42
9 100% Sardinian + 0% Altaian @ 4.42
10 100% Sardinian + 0% Armenian @ 4.42
11 100% Sardinian + 0% Ashkenazi @ 4.42
12 100% Sardinian + 0% Assyrian @ 4.42
13 100% Sardinian + 0% Austrian @ 4.42
14 100% Sardinian + 0% Austroasiatic_Ho @ 4.42
15 100% Sardinian + 0% Azeri @ 4.42
16 100% Sardinian + 0% Balkar @ 4.42
17 100% Sardinian + 0% Balochi @ 4.42
18 100% Sardinian + 0% Bangladeshi @ 4.42
19 100% Sardinian + 0% Bantu_N.E. @ 4.42
20 100% Sardinian + 0% Bantu_S.E. @ 4.42

Are they the only europeans with 0% west asian?

[Cumansky]

Are they the only europeans with 0% west asian?

Moroccans and some North Africans too, but they are mix of mostly MENA + some European

[Seya]

Moroccans and some North Africans too, but they are mix of mostly MENA + some European

i was talking about europeans. i wonder if finns have any

[Leto]

Are they the only europeans with 0% west asian?
Some Iberians score zero, especially Northern Spaniards and Basques, I believe.

[Leto]

i was talking about europeans. i wonder if finns have any
Finns score very little, yes. 2-3% or so.

[Seya]

Some Iberians score zero, especially Northern Spaniards and Basques, I believe.

yeah basques.. but sardinians and basques are unique anyway. I don't think any other iberians score 0%...i think..

[Cumansky]

i was talking about europeans. i wonder if finns have any

My Mother scores 1.7%

[Seya]

My Mother scores 1.7%

that's pretty low indeed. i imagined ukrainians have more than that

[Lemgrant]

i was talking about europeans. i wonder if finns have any

from Eurogenes k13, you can see here the full datasheet with sorted values: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1bD7HlvtvSVrxb_gi8XpsJoKTyVrKQ0CD-y4KhwYjJAg

Sardinian: 0.05
French Basque: 0.35
Southwest_French: 1.36
East_Finnish: 1.63
Southwest_Finnish: 1.93
Finnish: 2.21
Spanish: 2.33
Portuguese: 2.43
Estonian: 2.45
North_Swedish: 3.16
Belorussian: 3.87
Lithuanian: 3.91
Estonian_Polish: 3.94
English: 4.69
French: 4.96
Orcadian: 4.97

[Lemgrant]

that's pretty low indeed. i imagined ukrainians have more than that
in eurogenes k13:

Ukrainian average is 6.12
Ukrainian_Lviv is 7.1
Ukrainian_Belgorod: 8.78

[Seya]

from Eurogenes k13, you can see here the full datasheet with sorted values: https://drive.google.com/open?id=123L-aXzT_HWoDJpyQ5N7eTVKCsbDDup2

Sardinian: 0.05
French Basque: 0.35
Southwest_French: 1.36
East_Finnish: 1.63
Southwest_Finnish: 1.93
Finnish: 2.21
Spanish: 2.33
Portuguese: 2.43
Estonian: 2.45
North_Swedish: 3.16
Belorussian: 3.87
Lithuanian: 3.91
Estonian_Polish: 3.94
English: 4.69
French: 4.96
Orcadian: 4.97

thank you! very helpful.
i have quite a lot apparently. i score almost 14

[Ylla]

I only get 10 which is weird but I also get a huge amount of East med

[Gaditanian]

In K13
West_Asian 2.20 Pct
In K15
West_Asian 1.66 Pct

[War Chef]

It's a caucasus component. Main Haplogroup of arabs (J1) is from the Caucasus originally. Arabs are a mix of Caucasus population mixed with a Natufian/Proto-Semitic population. This migration likely happened in the Neolithic. Mesopotamians are obviously less semitic than peninsula arabs.



Makes sense since Assyrians are a native northern middle eastern population.

Kura araxes culture

[War Chef]

No. I score 10% West Asian for example, and I cluster in Central Europe. It's CHG component. Yamnaya was half west asian.

Well, Yamnaya was half west-Asian, but also half EHG......
Pure HG don't exist anymore.
So yamna would still cluster with central and eastern Euros (just east of Germans/Poles)

[Leto]

Kura araxes culture
Yesterday I was running North Caucasian samples on G25. What do you think is the better choice - Kura Araxes or Maykop?

[War Chef]

Yesterday I was running North Caucasian samples on G25. What do you think is the better choice - Kura Araxes or Maykop?

Well Maykop is derived from Kura-Araxes migrants, or something of that sort.
I don't know.

All I know is the Kura-Araxes were sort of like the "northmen" of the middle-east, but instead of pillaging like vikings they traded wine. They were massive wine drinkers & consumers and had serious settlement in Israel and Syria. Syria is where Proto-Semitic languages arose, and how "west-asian" genes got to the Arabian peninsula.

[War Chef]

I assume must be late migration to Greece, Italy and Albania because Farmer derived Sardinians don't score any West Asian, and that was the substrate always found in the Balkans, West Asian was brought with Turkish rapes and Jewish medieval migrations:

# Population Percent
1 West_Med 56.16
2 East_Med 21.22
3 North_Atlantic 20.84
4 Red_Sea 1.31
5 Sub-Saharan 0.35
6 East_Asian 0.12

Single Population Sharing:

"west-med" is algorithmically similar to west-Asian, only that the former branched off and was isolated for a long time, with strong founder effect that with time it became its own thing.

[Cumansky]

"west-med" is algorithmically similar to west-Asian, only that the former branched off and was isolated for a long time, with strong founder effect that with time it became its own thing.

No, West Asian pure Gedrosian component that why it peak in Caucasus related groups

[War Chef]

No, West Asian pure Gedrosian component that why it peak in Caucasus related groups

Terms like "gedrosia" and even west-asian and west-med were all made to conveniently split genetic groups. Some of these groups formed from isolation. Sardinian ancestors were from Anatolia, they became "west-med" by founder effect and isolation. Same reason Basques are so western, because they floated apart from everyone else.

[Jana]

Well, Yamnaya was half west-Asian, but also half EHG......
Pure HG don't exist anymore.
So yamna would still cluster with central and eastern Euros (just east of Germans/Poles)

Didn't Yamnaya plot between Estonians/Latvians and Afghans/Tajiks ?

[War Chef]

Didn't Yamnaya plot between Estonians/Latvians and Afghans/Tajiks ?

I would think so myself, but ppl said otherwise and then showed a PCA plot..... here let me see if I can find it brb (googling)

[Cumansky]

Terms like "gedrosia" and even west-asian and west-med were all made to conveniently split genetic groups. Some of these groups formed from isolation. Sardinian ancestors were from Anatolia, they became "west-med" by founder effect and isolation. Same reason Basques are so western, because they floated apart from everyone else.

That your wishful thinking but still not true, you saying that West Asian and West Med same component, when they have a different proportions

[War Chef]

Ahhh, still considerably closer to N-E Europeans (Finns + Estii) than to Afghans

https://indo-european.eu/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/pca5_mapa.png

[War Chef]

Smaller

https://indo-european.eu/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/pca-mathieson-2018.png

[War Chef]

That your wishful thinking but still not true, you saying that West Asian and West Med same component, when they have a different proportions

They are brother and sister, much like "North Sea" is brother to "North-east euro"..... both coming from a common Corded Ware origin

[Dick]

Terms like "gedrosia" and even west-asian and west-med were all made to conveniently split genetic groups. Some of these groups formed from isolation. Sardinian ancestors were from Anatolia, they became "west-med" by founder effect and isolation. Same reason Basques are so western, because they floated apart from everyone else.

Sardinians are void of Kura–Araxes culture or the early trans-Caucasian admixture of which modern day Anatolians have. Kura-Araxes is what constitutes some of the west Asian if not most.

[Ahaddad]

Thing about west asian is as the turkish member said, heavily CHG-shifted. Kurds and iranians are more CHG shifted than lebanese are, hence why the higher "west asian". But that doesnt mean theyre more caucasus-shifted. Its just the fact that groups like lebanese get less "wast asian" due to their fact that their caucasus component goes to other components, such as east med. '

CHG/gedrosia is also peaked in groups like balochs(theyre an ethnicity from south east iran to south west pakistan....no, theyre not punjabis or indians. Theyre iranics and different from rest of the pakis). I can demonstrate it for you:

Here is k13 eurogenes. It has the component called "west asian". This is what happens when both the baloch, lebanese and iranian runs their kit:

Kurd/west iranian:

Population
North_Atlantic 4.43 Pct
Baltic 4.43 Pct
West_Med 8.77 Pct
West_Asian 37.04 Pct
East_Med 30.42 Pct
Red_Sea 3.01 Pct
South_Asian 4.77 Pct
East_Asian 2.66 Pct
Siberian 1.46 Pct
Amerindian 1.22 Pct
Oceanian 0.48 Pct
Northeast_African -
Sub-Saharan 1.31 Pc


A lebanese christian:


Population
North_Atlantic 4.43 Pct
Baltic -
West_Med 12.16 Pct
West_Asian 19.82 Pct
East_Med 48.94 Pct
Red_Sea 11.53 Pct
South_Asian 1.83 Pct
East_Asian 1.08 Pct
Siberian -
Amerindian -
Oceanian 0.21 Pct
Northeast_African -
Sub-Saharan


And a pak baloch:

Population
North_Atlantic -
Baltic 0.79 Pct
West_Med -
West_Asian 57.35 Pct
East_Med 6.55 Pct
Red_Sea 5.25 Pct
South_Asian 25.15 Pct
East_Asian -
Siberian -
Amerindian 0.88 Pct
Oceanian 0.34 Pct
Northeast_African 0.62 Pct
Sub-Saharan 3.07 P

Now, it seems like the most west asian shifted group here is the pak baloch, although the formers are actually west asians. But as told before, west asian is heavily gedrosia/CHG-shifted.

Now, lets try with a calc that doesnt has the component "west asian", but instead divided it to "baloch"(just called baloch, because it peaks the most in balochs) and "caucasian".

Lets try harrappaworld:

PAK-Baloch:

# Population Percent
1 Baloch 61.79
2 SW-Asian 14.05
3 Caucasian 12.23
4 S-Indian 6.97
5 W-African 2.3
6 Papuan 1.09
7 San 0.75
8 Beringian 0.4
9 American 0.32
10 E-African 0.09


the kurd/west iranian:

Population
S-Indian 0.60 Pct
Baloch 23.64 Pct
Caucasian 41.09 Pct
NE-Euro 6.75 Pct
SE-Asian 0.09 Pct
Siberian 1.11 Pct
NE-Asian 3.60 Pct
Papuan 0.26 Pct
American 0.07 Pct
Beringian 1.01 Pct
Mediterranean 9.96 Pct
SW-Asian 10.68 Pct
San -
E-African -
Pygmy 1.13 Pct
W-African -


The lebanese christian:


Population
S-Indian 0.54 Pct
Baloch 13.40 Pct
Caucasian 41.92 Pct
NE-Euro 1.68 Pct
SE-Asian 0.80 Pct
Siberian -
NE-Asian -
Papuan 0.58 Pct
American -
Beringian -
Mediterranean 15.18 Pct
SW-Asian 25.91 Pct
San -
E-African -
Pygmy -
W-African

As it shows in harrappaworld, baloch is no longer the most west asian-shifted group. Lebanese(although they can even get up to 50% caucasian, which i never seen for west iranians/kurds) is the most caucasian-shifted one and the kurd is almost equally as caucasian-shifted. The kurd here is just more baloch/gedrosia/CHG-shifted.
Its the same case with other calcs, that are doing the same thing: putting CHG with caucasus and label it as west asian.

Also the reason why i prefer harrappaworld over many other calcs-

It’s a big true I take two person one Lebanese/ Assyrian and other Lebanese and put in EUROGENES k13, first take 32,3% West Asian and second take 22% west Asian in EUROGENES, but when you put they in Harappa Lebanese/Assyrian make 42% Caucasian and Lebanese 45% Caucasian, but Lebanese/Assyrian have 18% Baloch and Lebanese 12%, so the EUROGENES make a false close Caucasian sometimes.

[Ahaddad]

Some kits to see:

H245013-Syrian muslim
A783425-Lebanese Muslim
M868550-Lebanese Christian
M581378-Palestinian Muslim
M757015-Palestinian Muslim
T107876-Lebanese/Assyrian
QZ5375914-Syrian Muslim Damascus
A258833-Lebanese muslim

[Abdelnour]

K13:
West_Asian 20.61
K15:
West_Asian 18.96

[Ahaddad]

K13:
West_Asian 20.61
K15:
West_Asian 18.96



Put you on Harappa and see your caucasian and baloch.

[Abdelnour]

Put you on Harappa and see your caucasian and baloch.

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 Caucasian 40.89
2 SW-Asian 24.32
3 Mediterranean 15.89
4 Baloch 12.07
5 NE-Euro 3.66
6 E-African 1.49
7 SE-Asian 0.86
8 Papuan 0.36
9 NE-Asian 0.29
10 S-Indian 0.17

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 lebanese (behar) 3.98
2 syrian (behar) 6.19
3 palestinian (harappa) 6.46
4 jordanian (behar) 7.76
5 lebanese-muslim (haber) 7.89
6 lebanese-christian (haber) 9.49
7 palestinian (hgdp) 9.73
8 lebanese-druze (haber) 10.69
9 iraqi-arab (harappa) 10.97
10 cypriot (behar) 11.09
11 iraq-jew (behar) 11.41
12 samaritian (behar) 11.83
13 armenian (harappa) 13.16
14 iraqi-mandaean (harappa) 13.33
15 uzbekistan-jew (behar) 13.36
16 sephardic-jew (behar) 13.42
17 iranian-jew (behar) 13.59
18 georgia-jew (behar) 13.79
19 assyrian (harappa) 15.21
20 morocco-jew (behar) 15.34

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 57.7% iraq-jew (behar) + 42.3% morocco-jew (behar) @ 2.72
2 69.7% palestinian (harappa) + 30.3% sephardic-jew (behar) @ 3.09
3 85.2% lebanese (behar) + 14.8% sephardic-jew (behar) @ 3.27
4 90.5% syrian (behar) + 9.5% sardinian (hgdp) @ 3.28
5 87% lebanese (behar) + 13% morocco-jew (behar) @ 3.28
6 95.8% lebanese (behar) + 4.2% sardinian (hgdp) @ 3.3
7 71.3% syrian (behar) + 28.7% sephardic-jew (behar) @ 3.31
8 96.9% lebanese (behar) + 3.1% basque (hgdp) @ 3.4
9 96.8% lebanese (behar) + 3.2% spain-basc (henn2012) @ 3.42
10 96.3% lebanese (behar) + 3.7% spaniard (1000genomes) @ 3.49
11 53.2% iranian-jew (behar) + 46.8% morocco-jew (behar) @ 3.49
12 74.6% syrian (behar) + 25.4% morocco-jew (behar) @ 3.54
13 95.6% lebanese (behar) + 4.4% italian (hgdp) @ 3.54
14 94.7% lebanese (behar) + 5.3% tuscan (hapmap) @ 3.55
15 90.7% lebanese (behar) + 9.3% ashkenazy-jew (behar) @ 3.55
16 73.4% palestinian (harappa) + 26.6% morocco-jew (behar) @ 3.55
17 94.5% lebanese (behar) + 5.5% tuscan (1000genomes) @ 3.56
18 53.7% iraqi-mandaean (harappa) + 46.3% morocco-jew (behar) @ 3.61
19 97.1% lebanese (behar) + 2.9% french (hgdp) @ 3.64
20 92.9% lebanese (behar) + 7.1% ashkenazi (harappa) @ 3.65

[Mesoman]

I see a lot of middle eastern people from Fertile Crescent share up to 20% to West Asian component, Lebanese Muslim around 22-26%, Lebanese Christian-19-22%, Syrian-20-28%, Iraqi arabs-25-30%, Iraqi Christians 30-36%, Kurds around 37-40%, Armenians 38-40%, Kurd Jews and Iranian Jews around 30%.

I know that have people from Caucasus like Georgians have more than 50%, but I think west Asian it’s very present in Mesopotamia, south to north and all ethnicities from Iraq have up than 28% of West Asian component. I see the Assyrians (indigenous people from Iraq), all of them have around 34-35%. My question is if this componente can be a Mesopotamian component?

The percentages depend on the calculator. Out of all the calcs out there, the average west asian for lebanese muslims,christians and druze is 18-22%, assyrians and kurdish,iranian jews usually get the similar west asian percentage. 29-32% for iranian/kurdish jews and 32-35% for assyrians. West med for different assyrian subgroups (northern assyrian, western assyrian, southern assyrian) is very slightly altered.