G25 Greeks and South Balkaners

[xripkan]

I made a model to distinguish the ancient Greek, Thraco-Illyrian, (Proto)-Slavic and West Asian ancestry.
Ancient Greek: I used Myceneans and Iberia samples.
Thracian-Illyrian(Ancient Balkans): Croatia IA (Illyrian), Bulgaria IA (Thracian), Scy_MDA (only 300,305,192,197) who are Northern Thracians with a low local Scythian admixture
Baltic/Proto-Slavic: Baltic MA samples
Slavic: Czech Slav, Hun Avars 1 and 2, Rus_Sunghir_MA
Caucasian: Armenia LBA
Eastern Anatolian/Mesopotamian/Iranian: Iran Ganj Dareh neolithic
Levantine: Levant_ISR_MLBA
I also added East and South Asia references but at this model I score no South Asia
My results:

Distance 0.01870270

Ancient Greece 49.2
Ancient Balkans 22.6
Baltics/Proto-Slavs 19.4
Ancient Levantine 5
EasternAnatolian/Mesopotamian/Iranian 3.2
East Asia 0.6
Caucasus 0
Slavs 0

Your thoughts?

[xripkan]

These are the references I used:
Ancient Balkans:MDA_Cimmerian,0.1001643,-0.0111707,0.042992,0.048127,-0.0266713,0.0068793,0.004465,0.0027693,-0.019975,-0.0287933,-0.007199,-0.0011993,-0.000545,-0.0191297,0.0218057,0.006983,-0.0022163,0.007137,-0.0010893,-0.0045857,-0.0117293,0.004287,-0.0002053,0.010363,-0.0017563
Ancient Balkans:Scythian_MDA_scy300,0.1161,0.140143,0.0256 44,-0.031331,0.016618,-0.005299,-0.001645,-0.007384,0.007772,0.033531,0.006983,0.006744,-0.00446,-0.000963,-0.0095,0.002254,-0.000782,0.004561,0.012318,-0.006503,-0.004118,0.012489,-0.00037,-0.000723,0.010298
Ancient Balkans:Scythian_MDA_scy192,0.124067,0.137096,0.01 5462,-0.020026,0.015695,-0.012829,0.00235,0.000692,0.001023,0.025878,0.0094 19,-0.000599,-0.006987,-0.008945,-0.013301,-0.009679,0.012908,0.004307,-0.000377,0.003502,-0.011729,0.009892,-0.004314,-0.004338,0.001796
Ancient Balkans:Scythian_MDA_scy305,0.118376,0.126941,0.01 0936,-0.014212,0.017849,-0.006693,-0.001175,-0.001154,0.00225,0.022415,-0.003897,0.007343,-0.013974,0.008257,-0.010179,0.000663,-0.005476,0.004181,0.016341,-0.008254,-0.009234,0.005812,-0.007395,0.007471,0.002754
Ancient Balkans:Scythian_MDA_scy197,0.122929,0.140143,0.02 9415,-0.023902,0.023081,-0.012829,0.015511,-0.005307,0.00225,0.035172,-0.005846,-0.001349,-0.01115,0.000275,-0.010586,-0.0118,0.001434,-0.000127,0.013324,-0.010255,-0.004742,-0.000989,0.003328,-0.002771,-0.008981
Ancient Balkans:BGR_IA_I5769,0.126344,0.157407,0.007165,-0.051034,0.029852,-0.02259,0.00423,-0.001385,0.007772,0.032074,-0.001461,0.005695,-0.013974,-0.003028,-0.015065,-0.001458,0.01369,0.006968,0.006285,-0.014757,-0.006239,0.004699,-0.007888,0.003494,-0.008861
Ancient Balkans:HRV_IA,0.132035,0.151314,0.033941,-0.01615,0.024928,-0.005857,-0.006345,0.007154,0.003681,0.028976,0.001786,0.011 69,-0.02111,-0.001376,-0.005972,-0.008486,-0.006519,0.004941,0.005531,-0.014257,-0.001872,0.00507,0.001479,0.00253,0.003353
Ancient Greece:GRC_Mycenaean,0.107847,0.1563915,-0.008108,-0.0646808,0.0216962,-0.0271222,-0.0005288,-0.0021345,0.00542,0.047336,0.005521,0.0169352,-0.012785,-0.0006195,-0.0163882,-0.0098118,0.0210245,0.0036108,0.0123188,-0.0039705,-0.0058648,0.0001858,-0.0065935,0.0011448,-0.0007185
Ancient Greece:Iberia_Northeast_Empuries2,0.118376,0.15842 3,-0.009051,-0.0670225,0.0252355,-0.027889,0.001645,-0.005077,0.0049085,0.042552,0.002842,0.01124,-0.016873,0.003578,-0.018526,-0.0157785,0.0035855,0.0003805,0.004588,-0.0126935,-0.008298,0.001546,0.001664,0.0071095,-0.008502
Baltics:Baltic_EST_MA_IIa_1,0.127482,0.11577,0.099 937,0.089471,0.052625,0.039045,0.00564,0.01223,0.0 05318,-0.033167,-0.008282,-0.013188,0.016947,0.015138,0.004343,0.016309,0.016 689,-0.006081,0.001006,0.000375,0.00574,-0.000989,0.003081,0.00723,-0.006826
Baltics:Baltic_EST_MA_IIf_1,0.126344,0.118817,0.08 2967,0.09044,0.045547,0.030957,0.020681,0.005769,-0.001432,-0.028793,-0.006171,-0.012139,0.013528,0.029726,-0.001493,0.001458,-0.005215,-0.000253,0.006662,-0.012506,0.000499,-0.001978,0.003328,-0.005904,0.005508
Baltics:Baltic_EST_MA_IIg_1,0.126344,0.1046,0.1086 11,0.078812,0.044931,0.028168,0.00611,0.004154,-0.007976,-0.034989,-0.003085,0,0.023488,0.01734,-0.007329,0.014452,0.008605,-0.00152,0.000628,0.018884,-0.001872,-0.006801,0.013557,-0.001446,0.016406
Baltics:Baltic_EST_MA_IVLS09KT_1,0.124067,0.11577, 0.087115,0.091086,0.043085,0.038766,0.011986,0.017 999,0.003272,-0.038999,-0.01023,-0.019633,0.024678,0.030827,-0.011672,0.020949,0.02047,-0.007728,-0.006411,0.004877,0.000749,0.009398,0.006779,0.000 12,-0.003712
Eastern ASIA:Mongolian,0.0516758,-0.3278128,0.0638842,-0.0265506,-0.045916,-0.0297298,0.014242,0.0177686,-0.0009406,0.008966,-0.0321206,-0.0031172,-0.000327,-0.0007432,0.0032574,0.0006894,-0.0033898,0.0001014,0.0042236,0.0090292,-0.021537,-0.0095706,-0.0186106,0.0002652,0.0007422
Eastern Anatolian/Mesopotamian/Iranian:IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N,0.0430252,0.0664158,-0.1550722,0.0047158,-0.122669,0.0235384,0.017109,-0.0011998,-0.082546,-0.0544158,-0.0028258,-0.0016186,0.0044896,-0.0062756,0.0316498,0.0561384,-0.0054242,0.0068664,0.0136508,-0.0334162,0.00856,-0.028836,-0.0110678,-0.039331,0.0222254
Slavs:HUN_Avar_Szolad_Av1,0.133173,0.132019,0.0659 96,0.049419,0.039392,0.024542,0.00893,0.008769,0.0 03886,-0.013668,-0.00065,-0.007343,0.008325,0.014863,-0.012486,0.005304,-0.005346,0.00228,0.002388,0.002126,-0.001497,-0.002844,0.007888,-0.006748,0.000838
Slavs:HUN_Avar_Szolad_Av2,0.134311,0.126941,0.0814 58,0.065569,0.035391,0.033746,0.00987,0.005769,0.0 04704,-0.02278,-0.002436,-0.005395,0.01219,0.020643,-0.015201,-0.003845,0.005867,0.004561,0.008673,0.0005,0.00149 7,-0.00272,0.013804,-0.007109,0.002634
Slavs:CZE_Early_Slav_RISE569,0.12862,0.129988,0.06 8259,0.046835,0.02739,0.013387,0.007285,0.014076,-0.001841,-0.018406,-0.000812,-0.004346,0.003717,0.007156,-0.010993,-0.003182,0.011604,-0.002027,-0.002388,-0.004752,0.005615,0.000618,0.001725,-0.000964,-0.006706
Slavs:RUS_Sunghir_MA_Sunghir6,0.129758,0.116786,0. 070899,0.060078,0.041238,0.018965,0.009165,0.01130 7,0.001432,-0.017859,0.000487,-0.008093,0.014271,0.023809,-0.014658,-0.005834,0.00013,-0.002154,0.000628,-0.001251,-0.007986,-0.005812,0.012695,-0.010724,-0.005868
Caucasus:ARM_LBA,0.100544,0.122879,-0.0314267,-0.0117357,-0.035699,0.0013017,0.00376,-0.0116917,-0.0465633,-0.0213217,-0.0052507,0.002348,-0.005996,-0.0046333,0.0093197,-0.005878,-0.0009127,0.000718,0.002011,0.0056277,-0.0056567,-0.0014427,0.0077647,-0.0022893,0.002954
Ancient Levantine:Levant_ISR_MLBA,0.080814,0.149283,-0.046009,-0.103683,-0.012618,-0.036256,-0.00564,-0.008769,0.00859,0.014579,0.01088,-0.007044,0.01665,0.004542,-0.012215,0.012198,0.002477,0.008742,0.006285,0.013 506,0.015348,0.013973,-0.013557,-0.001205,-0.004431

I would like to see the results of other users from Greece and Balkans.

[Kaspias]

0.02433797

Ancient Balkans 29.2
Slavs 26.6
Ancient Greece 26.2
East Asia 9
EasternAnatolian/Mesopotamian/Iranian 9

[Thracian]

0.02433797

Ancient Balkans 29.2
Slavs 26.6
Ancient Greece 26.2
East Asia 9
EasternAnatolian/Mesopotamian/Iranian 9

Can you run mine?

Thracian_scaled,0.112685,0.114755,0.00264,-0.006137,0.00677,0,0.004465,0,-0.001841,0.002734,0.001299,-0.001948,-0.00223,0.002477,-0.006515,0.009016,0.013038,0.00228,0.006034,0.0057 53,-0.004492,0.00507,-0.000739,0.002048,-0.001317

[xripkan]

Can you run mine?

Thracian_scaled,0.112685,0.114755,0.00264,-0.006137,0.00677,0,0.004465,0,-0.001841,0.002734,0.001299,-0.001948,-0.00223,0.002477,-0.006515,0.009016,0.013038,0.00228,0.006034,0.0057 53,-0.004492,0.00507,-0.000739,0.002048,-0.001317

Distance 0.01419439

AncientBalkans 46.2
AncientGreece 10.6
Baltics 19.4
EasternASIA 1.4
EasternAnatolian/Mesopotamian/Iranian 6.4
Caucasus 5.2
AncientLevantine 10.8

[Impaler]

0.02125782

37.8 AncientBalkans
29.4 AncientGreece
19.4 Baltics
7.8 EasternAnatolian/Mesopotamian/Iranian
5.6 Slavs

[Impaler]

Distance 0.01419439

AncientBalkans 46.2
AncientGreece 10.6
Baltics 19.4
EasternASIA 1.4
EasternAnatolian/Mesopotamian/Iranian 6.4
Caucasus 5.2
AncientLevantine 10.8

Did you run in VahaduoJS?

[xripkan]

Did you run in VahaduoJS?

Yes

[Coastal Elite]

Using Vahaduo


Target: DacoCeltic_scaled
Distance: 2.0616% / 0.02061578

Aggregated

59.4 AncientBalkans
29.6 Baltics
7.8 Caucasus
3.2 Balkan

[Luke35]

Just for shits and giggles this is mine, I'll delete it but thought you might wanna see how your a
calculator handles a non- Balkan person:

Distance: 1.7371% / 0.01737124
Aggregated
55.2 AncientBalkans
36.2 Baltics
4.8 Slavs
3.2 Caucasus
0.6 EasternAnatolian/Mesopotamian/Iranian

[MagnusDark]

Target: MagnusDark
Distance: 0.02433409
Aggregated
44.8 AncientBalkans
33.6 AncientGreece
21.6 Baltics


Non-aggregated breakdown(deeper look)

Target: MagnusDark
Distance: 0.02433211
44.6 AncientBalkans:BGR_IA_I5769
33.6 AncientGreece:GRC_Mycenaean
18.0 Baltics:Baltic_EST_MA_IVLS09KT_1
3.6 Baltics:Baltic_EST_MA_IIg_1
0.2 AncientBalkans:Scythian_MDA_scy192


Single Distance to: MagnusDark
0.04250004 AncientBalkans:Scythian_MDA_scy192
0.04576255 AncientBalkans:BGR_IA_I5769
0.04728513 AncientBalkans:Scythian_MDA_scy197
0.05020661 AncientBalkans:Scythian_MDA_scy300
0.05280019 AncientBalkans:HRV_IA
0.05386127 AncientBalkans:Scythian_MDA_scy305
0.06810861 AncientGreece:GRC_Mycenaean
0.07152421 AncientGreece:Iberia_Northeast_Empuries2
0.10736587 Slavs:CZE_Early_Slav_RISE569
0.11432401 Slavs:HUN_Avar_Szolad_Av1
0.12311789 Caucasus:ARM_LBA
0.12836282 Slavs:RUS_Sunghir_MA_Sunghir6
0.13728280 Slavs:HUN_Avar_Szolad_Av2
0.13887818 AncientLevantine:Levant_ISR_MLBA
0.16356156 Baltics:Baltic_EST_MA_IIf_1
0.17100871 Baltics:Baltic_EST_MA_IIg_1
0.17211914 Baltics:Baltic_EST_MA_IIa_1
0.17216373 Baltics:Baltic_EST_MA_IVLS09KT_1
0.20721278 AncientBalkans:MDA_Cimmerian
0.30570484 EasternAnatolian/Mesopotamian/Iranian:IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
0.49682517 EasternASIA:Mongolian

[xripkan]

Just for shits and giggles this is mine, I'll delete it but thought you might wanna see how your a
calculator handles a non- Balkan person:

Distance: 1.7371% / 0.01737124
Aggregated
55.2 AncientBalkans
36.2 Baltics
4.8 Slavs
3.2 Caucasus
0.6 EasternAnatolian/Mesopotamian/Iranian

I think it fits with your Hungarian part. It gives a low distance because the Baltic reference covers somehow your Germanic acestry.

[MagnusDark]

Can you run mine?

Thracian_scaled,0.112685,0.114755,0.00264,-0.006137,0.00677,0,0.004465,0,-0.001841,0.002734,0.001299,-0.001948,-0.00223,0.002477,-0.006515,0.009016,0.013038,0.00228,0.006034,0.0057 53,-0.004492,0.00507,-0.000739,0.002048,-0.001317

Here it is in non-aggregated form

Target: Thracian_scaled
Distance: 1.4212% / 0.01421198
26.8 AncientBalkans:Scythian_MDA_scy192
18.4 Baltics:Baltic_EST_MA_IVLS09KT_1
13.4 AncientBalkans:Scythian_MDA_scy305
10.6 AncientLevantine:Levant_ISR_MLBA
9.4 AncientGreece:GRC_Mycenaean
6.6 EasternAnatolian/Mesopotamian/Iranian:IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
5.6 Caucasus:ARM_LBA
3.4 AncientBalkans:MDA_Cimmerian
2.8 AncientBalkans:BGR_IA_I5769
1.8 EasternASIA:Mongolian
1.2 Baltics:Baltic_EST_MA_IIa_1


Single Distance to: Thracian_scaled
0.04527314 AncientBalkans:Scythian_MDA_scy305
0.05083883 AncientBalkans:Scythian_MDA_scy192
0.06197593 AncientBalkans:Scythian_MDA_scy300
0.06784233 AncientBalkans:Scythian_MDA_scy197
0.07569918 AncientBalkans:HRV_IA
0.08301575 Caucasus:ARM_LBA
0.08374829 AncientBalkans:BGR_IA_I5769
0.09726045 Slavs:CZE_Early_Slav_RISE569
0.09766275 AncientGreece:GRC_Mycenaean
0.10130519 AncientGreece:Iberia_Northeast_Empuries2
0.10403381 Slavs:HUN_Avar_Szolad_Av1
0.11525557 Slavs:RUS_Sunghir_MA_Sunghir6
0.12644280 Slavs:HUN_Avar_Szolad_Av2
0.13266662 AncientLevantine:Levant_ISR_MLBA
0.14779073 Baltics:Baltic_EST_MA_IIf_1
0.15573843 Baltics:Baltic_EST_MA_IVLS09KT_1
0.15593577 Baltics:Baltic_EST_MA_IIg_1
0.15801337 AncientBalkans:MDA_Cimmerian
0.15878845 Baltics:Baltic_EST_MA_IIa_1
0.26247383 EasternAnatolian/Mesopotamian/Iranian:IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
0.45856730 EasternASIA:Mongolian

[Luke35]

I think it fits with your Hungarian part. It gives a low distance because the Baltic reference covers somehow your Germanic acestry.

Yeah, the distance is not too bad I am surprised.

[Daos777]

Target: yo_scaled
Distance: 2.3413% / 0.02341309
Aggregated
62.8 Baltics
12.6 AncientBalkans
12.2 AncientGreece
6.6 Caucasus
3.8 Slavs
1.4 EasternASIA
0.6 EasternAnatolian/Mesopotamian/Iranian

[Cumansky]

Preceded by: Lombards (Germanic), Kingdom of the Gepids (Balkan)

- Avar Khaganate (567AD-822AD)

Succeeded by: Frankish Empire (Germanic), First Bulgarian Empire (Balkan)

"According to historian Walter Goffart, Jordanes' remark shows that Byzantine scholars had invented a concept of the "Gothic nations, sharing the same language, white bodies, blond hair, and Arian form of Christianity"

[Cumansky]

Pen= 0

1.4376

70.83 Baltics
13.33 AncientBalkans
11.67 AncientGreece
4.17 Slavs

Pen= 0.001

1.9245

48.33 Baltics
37.5 Slavs (Avar Khaganate)
10.83 AncientBalkans
2.5 AncientGreece (SSA)
0.83 AncientLevantine (More SSA)

[Brás Garcia de Mascarenhas]

72.8 AncientBalkans
14.8 Baltics
11.0 AncientGreece
0.8 AncientLevantine
0.6 EasternASIA

[xripkan]

72.8 AncientBalkans
14.8 Baltics
11.0 AncientGreece
0.8 AncientLevantine
0.6 EasternASIA

I am curious to see which is your distance

[Brás Garcia de Mascarenhas]

I am curious to see which is your distance

Quite distant at 4%. I am not from the Balkan peninsula, I just wanted to see what I would get.

[xripkan]

Quite distant at 4%. I am not from the Balkan peninsula, I just wanted to see what I would get.

Yes, it makes sense. I would be surprised if it was less.

[Abdelnour]

I did mines too for the curiosity:

[1] "distance%=2.6481"

Scaled

AncientLevantine,63
AncientGreece,11.8
AncientBalkans,10.8
EasternAnatolian/Mesopotamian/Iranian,8
Caucasus,6.4

[Brás Garcia de Mascarenhas]

Yes, it makes sense. I would be surprised if it was less.

Modern Iberians have more correlation with Ancient Balkan samples than modern Balkan populations with the exception of indigenous Balkan ethnic groups such as the Albanians. They are the only ones who I have seen scoring higher Ancient Balkan or at least on the same level as Iberians. So even though my fit wasn't the best I can understand why I got what I got. The Croatia IA (Illyrian) sample you use in your run plots next to Spain and Portugal.

[Cumansky]

Modern Iberians have more correlation with Ancient Balkan samples than modern Balkan populations with the exception of indigenous Balkan ethnic groups such as the Albanians. They are the only ones who I have seen scoring higher Ancient Balkan or at least on the same level as Iberians. So even though my fit wasn't the best I can understand why I got what I got.

Lol you Iberians are gassed off these mislabeled poor quality samples

Don't worry more samples always going pop up

[xripkan]

Modern Iberians have more correlation with Ancient Balkan samples than modern Balkan populations with the exception of indigenous Balkan ethnic groups such as the Albanians. They are the only ones who I have seen scoring higher Ancient Balkan or at least on the same level as Iberians. So even though my fit wasn't the best I can understand why I got what I got. The Croatia IA (Illyrian) sample you use in your run plots next to Spain and Portugal.

You are right. Illyrians were West Med people and quite close to North Italy and to a lesser extent to Iberia. Even nowadays Albanians score at their oracles Iberian populations despite the Slavic migrations that affected the whole Balkan pennisula.

[Brás Garcia de Mascarenhas]

Lol you Iberians are gassed off these mislabeled poor quality samples

Don't worry more samples always going pop up

I don't think that Iberians are Illyrian like. It can be just a coincidence that the Illyrian sample has components in similar proportions to modern Iberians, I agree (plus a complete absence of any Slavic input, just like us). However, it also means that modern Balkan populations have drifted from their predecessors, which is normal. Historical migrations have happened in almost every single region in Europe. I am not necessarily close to all ancient samples from the Iberian peninsula too.

By the way, on second thought I don't think that Albanians will score higher Ancient Balkan on this run than Iberians because it has Ancient Greek samples which likely will pull it down (particularly among mainland Albanians).

[Cumansky]

I don't think that Iberians are Illyrian like. It can be just a coincidence that the Illyrian sample has components in similar proportions to modern Iberians, I agree (plus a complete absence of any Slavic input, just like us). However, it also means that modern Balkan populations have drifted from their predecessors, which is normal. Historical migrations have happened in almost every single region in Europe. I am not necessarily close to all ancient samples from the Iberian peninsula too.

By the way, on second thought I don't think that Albanians will score higher Ancient Balkan on this run than Iberians because it has Ancient Greek samples which likely will pull it down (particularly among mainland Albanians).

Lol. I don't want speculate because I don't want pretend to be expert in not my area. But you are really pure Mediterranean (Iberians) and those random ancient Balkans samples probably were too. But the names association is hilarious with everyone Illyrian or Thracian, you know my surname is from Thracian language but I will not try so hard to associate myself as these people, is fun to watch

[Cumansky]

This is what I get in the GEDmatch, how much % Slavs is Greek?

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 62.2% Estonian + 37.8% Turks_Istanbul @ 4.96
2 63.1% Russian + 36.9% Greek @ 4.99
3 67.6% Russian + 32.4% Sicilian @ 4.99
4 61% Lithuanian + 39% Turks_Istanbul @ 5.32
5 57.4% Finnish + 42.6% Greek @ 5.51
6 67.4% Estonian + 32.6% Turks_Kayseri @ 5.51
7 55% Estonian + 45% Greek @ 5.53
8 67% Estonian + 33% Turks_Adana @ 5.54
9 59.9% Estonian + 40.1% Sicilian @ 5.73
10 53.7% Lithuanian + 46.3% Greek @ 5.74
11 62.3% Finnish + 37.7% Sicilian @ 5.75
12 58.6% Lithuanian + 41.4% Sicilian @ 5.83
13 64.1% Estonian + 35.9% Turks_Aydin @ 5.89
14 65.8% Lithuanian + 34.2% Turks_Adana @ 5.92
15 69.2% Estonian + 30.8% Armenian @ 5.94
16 66.3% Lithuanian + 33.7% Turks_Kayseri @ 5.98
17 62.8% Lithuanian + 37.2% Turks_Aydin @ 6.06
18 64.3% Estonian + 35.7% Turks_Balikesir @ 6.15
19 83.6% Norwegian + 16.4% Syrian @ 6.39
20 63% Lithuanian + 37% Turks_Balikesir @ 6.43

[Brás Garcia de Mascarenhas]

You are right. Illyrians were West Med people and quite close to North Italy and to a lesser extent to Iberia. Even nowadays Albanians score at their oracles Iberian populations despite the Slavic migrations that affected the whole Balkan pennisula.

I wasn't aware of Albanians scoring Iberian at their oracles to be honest. I don't remember getting Albanian in my oracles but on a second thought if you are talking about Gedmatch runs, many do not have Albanian samples (especially the Eurogenes project) and that could be the reason why. Slavic migrations impacted the entire region but on different scales. Albanians and Greeks have the lowest Slavic input when compared to their neighbors.

[Brás Garcia de Mascarenhas]

Lol. I don't want speculate because I don't want pretend to be expert in not my area. But you are really pure Mediterranean (Iberians) and those random ancient Balkans samples probably were too. But the names association is hilarious with everyone Illyrian or Thracian, you know my surname is from Thracian language but I will not try so hard to associate myself as these people, is fun to watch

Iberians are not purely Mediterranean. I don't think there's such thing as pure Mediterranean, pure Slav, etc. Our main ancient ancestry seems to be a blend of Near Eastern Neolithic farmers and Mesolithic European Hunter-Gatherers. Having a Thracian surname doesn't mean much, my first name is Teutonic in origin, lol.

[xripkan]

I wasn't aware of Albanians scoring Iberian at their oracles to be honest. I don't remember getting Albanian in my oracles but on a second thought if you are talking about Gedmatch runs, many do not have Albanian samples (especially the Eurogenes project) and that could be the reason why. Slavic migrations impacted the entire region but on different scales. Albanians and Greeks have the lowest Slavic input when compared to their neighbors.

There is no Albanian reference at Eurogenes. This is a typical North Albanian result:
Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 West_Med 24.84
2 East_Med 24.69
3 North_Atlantic 21.79
4 Baltic 16.74
5 West_Asian 8.74
6 Red_Sea 2.28


Finished reading population data. 204 populations found.
13 components mode.

--------------------------------

Least-squares method.

Using 1 population approximation:
1 Greek_Thessaly @ 6.346410
2 Tuscan @ 8.972743
3 West_Sicilian @ 10.927164
4 Bulgarian @ 11.529442
5 Italian_Abruzzo @ 11.862312
6 Central_Greek @ 12.261062
7 North_Italian @ 12.330067
8 East_Sicilian @ 13.146957
9 Romanian @ 13.367900
10 Ashkenazi @ 15.633838
11 South_Italian @ 15.724633
12 Serbian @ 17.446739
13 Algerian_Jewish @ 21.397388
14 Italian_Jewish @ 21.614210
15 Portuguese @ 21.705061
16 Spanish_Extremadura @ 21.981619
17 Sephardic_Jewish @ 22.371721
18 Spanish_Galicia @ 22.829340
19 Spanish_Andalucia @ 22.996775
20 Spanish_Murcia @ 23.293661

Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% Greek_Thessaly +50% Tuscan @ 5.357772

[Cumansky]

Iberians are not purely Mediterranean. I don't think there's such thing as pure Mediterranean, pure Slav, etc. Our main ancient ancestry seems to be a blend of Near Eastern Neolithic farmers and Mesolithic European Hunter-Gatherers. Having a Thracian surname doesn't mean much, my first name is Teutonic in origin, lol.

I know because I have some DNA in your region even tho I am kind of outlier. It boil down to fact your race is lacking CHG that is all over the Balkans, Balkans score alot West Asian in K13 you Iberians don't, my 7% SSA Mother don't either. It might be from Native Anatolia Oghuz Turks that brought it to the Balkans in middle age as one of the sources for that admixture that is there and why Balkans people are genetically closer to PERSIAN empires etc

[Brás Garcia de Mascarenhas]

There is no Albanian reference at Eurogenes. This is a typical North Albanian result:
Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 West_Med 24.84
2 East_Med 24.69
3 North_Atlantic 21.79
4 Baltic 16.74
5 West_Asian 8.74
6 Red_Sea 2.28


Finished reading population data. 204 populations found.
13 components mode.

--------------------------------

Least-squares method.

Using 1 population approximation:
1 Greek_Thessaly @ 6.346410
2 Tuscan @ 8.972743
3 West_Sicilian @ 10.927164
4 Bulgarian @ 11.529442
5 Italian_Abruzzo @ 11.862312
6 Central_Greek @ 12.261062
7 North_Italian @ 12.330067
8 East_Sicilian @ 13.146957
9 Romanian @ 13.367900
10 Ashkenazi @ 15.633838
11 South_Italian @ 15.724633
12 Serbian @ 17.446739
13 Algerian_Jewish @ 21.397388
14 Italian_Jewish @ 21.614210
15 Portuguese @ 21.705061
16 Spanish_Extremadura @ 21.981619
17 Sephardic_Jewish @ 22.371721
18 Spanish_Galicia @ 22.829340
19 Spanish_Andalucia @ 22.996775
20 Spanish_Murcia @ 23.293661

Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% Greek_Thessaly +50% Tuscan @ 5.357772



This is my K13:

# Population Percent
1 North_Atlantic 36.75
2 West_Med 25.64
3 East_Med 14.09
4 Baltic 11.57
5 West_Asian 4.55
6 Red_Sea 2.76
7 Northeast_African 2.5
8 Siberian 0.94
9 Oceanian 0.76
10 Sub-Saharan 0.43

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Portuguese 2.94
2 Spanish_Extremadura 3.73
3 Spanish_Galicia 4.46
4 Spanish_Murcia 4.54
5 Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon 4.65
6 Spanish_Andalucia 5.1
7 Spanish_Cataluna 5.16
8 Spanish_Valencia 5.47
9 Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha 5.68
10 Spanish_Cantabria 7.18
11 North_Italian 7.36
12 Spanish_Aragon 8.77
13 Southwest_French 9.16
14 French 10.16
15 Tuscan 13.28
16 West_German 15.99
17 South_Dutch 16.12
18 Romanian 18.95
19 Serbian 19.21
20 West_Sicilian 19.89

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 95.4% Portuguese + 4.6% Balkar @ 1.89
2 96.1% Portuguese + 3.9% Abhkasian @ 1.91
3 95.7% Portuguese + 4.3% North_Ossetian @ 1.93
4 95.5% Portuguese + 4.5% Kabardin @ 1.93
5 95.7% Portuguese + 4.3% Ossetian @ 1.94
6 96% Portuguese + 4% Georgian @ 1.94
7 95.7% Portuguese + 4.3% Adygei @ 1.95
8 95.5% Portuguese + 4.5% Kumyk @ 2.03
9 95.8% Portuguese + 4.2% Chechen @ 2.08
10 80.4% Spanish_Andalucia + 19.6% Serbian @ 2.08
11 95.3% Portuguese + 4.7% Nogay @ 2.11
12 95.9% Portuguese + 4.1% Armenian @ 2.12
13 95.1% Portuguese + 4.9% Turkish @ 2.12
14 96% Portuguese + 4% Lezgin @ 2.14
15 79.4% Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha + 20.6% Bulgarian @ 2.15
16 83.2% Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon + 16.8% Greek_Thessaly @ 2.18
17 96.1% Portuguese + 3.9% Kurdish @ 2.19
18 95.8% Portuguese + 4.2% Azeri @ 2.2
19 96.2% Portuguese + 3.8% Georgian_Jewish @ 2.21
20 96.1% Portuguese + 3.9% Tabassaran @ 2.21


I don't have any Greek sample on my top 20 but I have Tuscan. I am slightly more eastern-shifted than your average Portuguese, I inherited it from my dad apparently. This is his K13 oracle:


Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 90.5% Portuguese + 9.5% Southwest_Russian @ 3.82
2 86.5% Portuguese + 13.5% Croatian @ 3.84
3 91.8% Portuguese + 8.2% Erzya @ 3.86
4 89.3% Portuguese + 10.7% Ukrainian @ 3.86
5 86.3% Portuguese + 13.7% Moldavian @ 3.86
6 90.8% Portuguese + 9.2% Estonian_Polish @ 3.86
7 82.5% Portuguese + 17.5% Serbian @ 3.87
8 91% Portuguese + 9% Belorussian @ 3.91
9 91.4% Portuguese + 8.6% Kargopol_Russian @ 3.92
10 91% Portuguese + 9% Ukrainian_Belgorod @ 3.95
11 92.1% Portuguese + 7.9% Lithuanian @ 3.98
12 89.4% Portuguese + 10.6% Ukrainian_Lviv @ 3.99
13 84.4% Portuguese + 15.6% Bulgarian @ 3.99
14 91.1% Portuguese + 8.9% Russian_Smolensk @ 3.99
15 83.3% Portuguese + 16.7% Romanian @ 4
16 89.3% Portuguese + 10.7% South_Polish @ 4
17 90.5% Portuguese + 9.5% Polish @ 4.06
18 92.1% Portuguese + 7.9% East_Finnish @ 4.09
19 73.5% Spanish_Valencia + 26.5% Serbian @ 4.1
20 85.6% Portuguese + 14.4% Hungarian @ 4.11

[Rgvgjhvv]

How do I run this?

[Mingle]

How do I run this?

Target: Markos
Distance: 1.9091% / 0.01909093
Aggregated
45.2 AncientGreece
20.6 Slavs
13.6 AncientBalkans
10.8 Caucasus
6.6 AncientLevantine
3.2 EasternAnatolian/Mesopotamian/Iranian

Ran it for you.

[Rgvgjhvv]

Target: Markos
Distance: 1.9091% / 0.01909093
Aggregated
45.2 AncientGreece
20.6 Slavs
13.6 AncientBalkans
10.8 Caucasus
6.6 AncientLevantine
3.2 EasternAnatolian/Mesopotamian/Iranian

Ran it for you.

Thanks brah

[17571imre]

Distance: 1.2003% / 0.01200333
Aggregated
33.6
AncientBalkans

33.4
Slavs

21.4
Baltics

10.0
AncientGreece

1.6
EasternAnatolian/Mesopotamian/Iranian

[Ylla]

39.2 AncientGreece
33.0 AncientBalkans
18.0 Slavs
7.2 Baltics
2.0 Caucasus
0.6 EasternAnatolian/Mesopotamian/Iranian

Distance: 1.6402% / 0.01640185

[WeirdLookingFellow]

My minor but present German admix is screwing it up and converting Slav to Baltics I guess. Also, while Greek is quite present, I am still closer to the Paleo-Balkan sample and almost equally distant to the Baltic and Greek samples.

Target: WeirdFellow_scaled
Distance: 1.6087% / 0.01608718
Aggregated
39.4 Baltics
33.4 AncientBalkans
24.6 AncientGreece
2.4 Slavs
0.2 Caucasus

0.05653133 Slavs:CZE_Early_Slav_RISE569
0.05850654 AncientBalkans:Scythian_MDA_scy305
0.06049324 Slavs:HUN_Avar_Szolad_Av1
0.06426181 AncientBalkans:HRV_IA
0.06526272 AncientBalkans:Scythian_MDA_scy197
0.06913960 AncientBalkans:Scythian_MDA_scy192
0.07092537 AncientBalkans:Scythian_MDA_scy300
0.07450084 Slavs:RUS_Sunghir_MA_Sunghir6
0.08449919 Slavs:HUN_Avar_Szolad_Av2
0.09562264 AncientBalkans:BGR_IA_I5769
0.10653562 Baltics:Baltic_EST_MA_IIf_1
0.11753117 Baltics:Baltic_EST_MA_IIg_1
0.11795871 Baltics:Baltic_EST_MA_IIa_1
0.11854959 AncientGreece:Iberia_Northeast_Empuries2
0.11856993 AncientGreece:GRC_Mycenaean
0.11897148 Baltics:Baltic_EST_MA_IVLS09KT_1
0.12456631 Caucasus:ARM_LBA
0.17140761 Balkans:MDA_Cimmerian
0.17213222 AncientLevantine:Levant_ISR_MLBA
0.30583660 EasternAnatolian/Mesopotamian/Iranian:IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
0.47636444 EasternASIA:Mongolian

[Thracian]

I also ran my coordinates with R to see what do I get for pen=0.001. I believe that pen=0.001 is more accurate than pen=0. I always get Southwestern Slavs instead of Bulgarians when I use pen=0 in my models. Pen=0.001 usually gives more reasonable results.


[1] "distance%=1.8701"

Thracian_scaled

ANCIENT_BALKANS,58.8
SLAVS,9.6
CAUCASUS,8.2
BALTICS,7.2
ANCIENT_LEVANTINE,6
EASTERN_ANATOLIAN/MESOPOTAMIAN/IRANIAN,5.2
ANCIENT_GREECE,3.2
EASTERN_ASIA,1.8

[andre]

Target: Andrei_scaled
Distance: 2.1770% / 0.02177044
Aggregated
30.2 Ancient_Greece
25.0 Baltics
24.6 Slavs
13.6 Ancient_Balkans
6.6 Ancient_Levantine

wtf

[WeirdLookingFellow]

Target: Andrei_scaled
Distance: 2.1770% / 0.02177044
Aggregated
30.2 Ancient_Greece
25.0 Baltics
24.6 Slavs
13.6 Ancient_Balkans
6.6 Ancient_Levantine

wtf

the distance is kind of bad considering you're mostly balkan with some slight Ashkenazi. Maybe replace the Levantine with Askhenazi and see if you get a better fit.

[Jana]

Could somebody run mine? Thanks in advance.

Feodora_scaled,0.132035,0.132019,0.055437,0.026809 ,0.036007,0.014223,0.012456,0.005538,-0.002045,-0.005285,-0.006171,0.001199,-0.000297,0.010872,-0.008822,0.012463,0.025034,0.001647,0.007793,0.002 751,0.000125,-0.005688,0.002218,-0.009519,-0.000239

[xripkan]

I also ran my coordinates with R to see what do I get for pen=0.001. I believe that pen=0.001 is more accurate than pen=0. I always get Southwestern Slavs instead of Bulgarians when I use pen=0 in my models. Pen=0.001 usually gives more reasonable results.


[1] "distance%=1.8701"

Thracian_scaled

ANCIENT_BALKANS,58.8
SLAVS,9.6
CAUCASUS,8.2
BALTICS,7.2
ANCIENT_LEVANTINE,6
EASTERN_ANATOLIAN/MESOPOTAMIAN/IRANIAN,5.2
ANCIENT_GREECE,3.2
EASTERN_ASIA,1.8


Could you run mine with pen=0.001? Christos_scaled,0.118376,0.137096,0.005657,-0.024225,0.01908,-0.008925,0.0047,0.008077,-0.003681,0.020593,-0.002111,0.002398,0.001338,0.008945,-0.023615,-0.000265,0.005085,0.000127,0.003645,-0.002751,-0.00861,0,-0.006409,0.006145,-0.001557

[Lemgrant]

in R

pen=0.001:

[1] "distance%=2.2696"

Lemgrant

Slavs,51.2
Baltics,40.8
AncientBalkans,3.2
AncientGreece,2
AncientLevantine,1
EasternASIA,0.8
EasternAnatolian/Mesopotamian/Iranian,0.6
Caucasus,0.4


pen=0:

[1] "distance%=2.0207"

Lemgrant

Baltics,63
AncientBalkans,20.6
Slavs,15.2
Caucasus,1
EasternAnatolian/Mesopotamian/Iranian,0.2

[MagnusDark]

I also ran my coordinates with R to see what do I get for pen=0.001. I believe that pen=0.001 is more accurate than pen=0. I always get Southwestern Slavs instead of Bulgarians when I use pen=0 in my models. Pen=0.001 usually gives more reasonable results.


[1] "distance%=1.8701"

Thracian_scaled

ANCIENT_BALKANS,58.8
SLAVS,9.6
CAUCASUS,8.2
BALTICS,7.2
ANCIENT_LEVANTINE,6
EASTERN_ANATOLIAN/MESOPOTAMIAN/IRANIAN,5.2
ANCIENT_GREECE,3.2
EASTERN_ASIA,1.8


Can you run mine with pen 0 and 0.001 to see the differentiation? I want to see if I can get a tighter fit than Vahaduo shows. Thanks in advance.

,PC1,PC2,PC3,PC4,PC5,PC6,PC7,PC8,PC9,PC10,PC11,PC1 2,PC13,PC14,PC15,PC16,PC17,PC18,PC19,PC20,PC21,PC2 2,PC23,PC24,PC25
MagnusDark_scaled,0.127482,0.150298,0.020365,-0.02584,0.028621,-0.007251,0.00611,0.002769,-0.002863,0.022233,0.001624,0.007343,-0.011596,0.003165,-0.02158,0.006895,0.030379,-0.00266,0.006159,-0.007379,-0.010606,0.000124,0.000986,0.000964,-0.002036

,PC1,PC2,PC3,PC4,PC5,PC6,PC7,PC8,PC9,PC10,PC11,PC1 2,PC13,PC14,PC15,PC16,PC17,PC18,PC19,PC20,PC21,PC2 2,PC23,PC24,PC25
MagnusDark,0.0112,0.0148,0.0054,-0.008,0.0093,-0.0026,0.0026,0.0012,-0.0014,0.0122,0.001,0.0049,-0.0078,0.0023,-0.0159,0.0052,0.0233,-0.0021,0.0049,-0.0059,-0.0085,0.0001,0.0008,0.0008,-0.0017

[Ford]

Distance: 1.6482% / 0.01648177
Aggregated
35.8 Slavs
27.4 AncientBalkans
26.4 Baltics
10.4 AncientGreece

I'm Bosnian Serb

[xripkan]

Could somebody run mine? Thanks in advance.

Feodora_scaled,0.132035,0.132019,0.055437,0.026809 ,0.036007,0.014223,0.012456,0.005538,-0.002045,-0.005285,-0.006171,0.001199,-0.000297,0.010872,-0.008822,0.012463,0.025034,0.001647,0.007793,0.002 751,0.000125,-0.005688,0.002218,-0.009519,-0.000239

Running on vahaduoJS

distance 0.02281031

Ancient Balkans 31.4
Baltics 43.2
Slavs 16.4
Ancient Greece 7
EasternAnatolian/Mesopotamian/Iranian 2

[Ford]

nvm, xripkan already posted

[Thracian]

Could you run mine with pen=0.001? Christos_scaled,0.118376,0.137096,0.005657,-0.024225,0.01908,-0.008925,0.0047,0.008077,-0.003681,0.020593,-0.002111,0.002398,0.001338,0.008945,-0.023615,-0.000265,0.005085,0.000127,0.003645,-0.002751,-0.00861,0,-0.006409,0.006145,-0.001557

Sure.

[1] "distance%=2.1493"

Christos_scaled

ANCIENT_BALKANS,55.2
ANCIENT_GREECE,19.6
SLAVS,11.4
ANCIENT_LEVANTINE,7.8
BALTICS,3.8
EASTERN_ANATOLIAN/MESOPOTAMIAN/IRANIAN,2.2

[xripkan]

Sure.

[1] "distance%=2.1493"

Christos_scaled

ANCIENT_BALKANS,55.2
ANCIENT_GREECE,19.6
SLAVS,11.4
ANCIENT_LEVANTINE,7.8
BALTICS,3.8
EASTERN_ANATOLIAN/MESOPOTAMIAN/IRANIAN,2.2


I think running on VahaduoJS gives better results. I get roughly 50% Ancient Greece, 20% Thracians, 20% Proto-Slavs, 10% West Asia/Levant. This is what I get in most calculators.

[Thracian]

Can you run mine with pen 0 and 0.001 to see the differentiation? I want to see if I can get a tighter fit than Vahaduo shows. Thanks in advance.

,PC1,PC2,PC3,PC4,PC5,PC6,PC7,PC8,PC9,PC10,PC11,PC1 2,PC13,PC14,PC15,PC16,PC17,PC18,PC19,PC20,PC21,PC2 2,PC23,PC24,PC25
MagnusDark_scaled,0.127482,0.150298,0.020365,-0.02584,0.028621,-0.007251,0.00611,0.002769,-0.002863,0.022233,0.001624,0.007343,-0.011596,0.003165,-0.02158,0.006895,0.030379,-0.00266,0.006159,-0.007379,-0.010606,0.000124,0.000986,0.000964,-0.002036

,PC1,PC2,PC3,PC4,PC5,PC6,PC7,PC8,PC9,PC10,PC11,PC1 2,PC13,PC14,PC15,PC16,PC17,PC18,PC19,PC20,PC21,PC2 2,PC23,PC24,PC25
MagnusDark,0.0112,0.0148,0.0054,-0.008,0.0093,-0.0026,0.0026,0.0012,-0.0014,0.0122,0.001,0.0049,-0.0078,0.0023,-0.0159,0.0052,0.0233,-0.0021,0.0049,-0.0059,-0.0085,0.0001,0.0008,0.0008,-0.0017

You are welcome. The fit gets higher which is normal because the fit always higher for pen=0.001 than pen=0.

pen=0.001

[1] "distance%=2.8206"

MagnusDark_scaled

ANCIENT_BALKANS,79.2
ANCIENT_GREECE,7.4
SLAVS,6.8
BALTICS,6.6


pen=0 using R (it is same as Vahaduo)

[1] "distance%=2.4331"

MagnusDark_scaled

ANCIENT_BALKANS,44.8
ANCIENT_GREECE,33.6
BALTICS,21.6

[MagnusDark]

You are welcome. The fit gets higher which is normal because the fit always higher for pen=0.001 than pen=0.

pen=0.001

[1] "distance%=2.8206"

MagnusDark_scaled

ANCIENT_BALKANS,79.2
ANCIENT_GREECE,7.4
SLAVS,6.8
BALTICS,6.6


pen=0 using R (it is same as Vahaduo)

[1] "distance%=2.4331"

MagnusDark_scaled

ANCIENT_BALKANS,44.8
ANCIENT_GREECE,33.6
BALTICS,21.6


Why does the fit increase with that particular algorithm? It seems more accurate despite its larger distance(however marginal).

[xripkan]

Why does the fit increase with that particular algorithm? It seems more accurate despite its larger distance(however marginal).

Where are you from?

[Lemgrant]

I think running on VahaduoJS gives better results. I get roughly 50% Ancient Greece, 20% Thracians, 20% Proto-Slavs, 10% West Asia/Levant. This is what I get in most calculators.

it is the same in R with pen=0. Vahaduo doesn't have the option for pen=0.001. It is the same algorithm (nMonte3)

[MagnusDark]

Where are you from?

Albania. Specifically the Martanesh/Okshtun region of Diber Vogel. Mothers side is from Came, Megulle, Malzi, Kukes county.

Father: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dib%C3%ABr_County

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bulqiz%C3%AB_District

Mother: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malzi

[Thracian]

I think running on VahaduoJS gives better results. I get roughly 50% Ancient Greece, 20% Thracians, 20% Proto-Slavs, 10% West Asia/Levant. This is what I get in most calculators.

I really don't know pen=0 or pen=0.001 is more accurate. My experiences with pen=0 were really odd. For example, if I select Bulgarians with other South Slavic folks such as Serbians, Croatians and Bosnians or Romanians I get 0% Bulgarian. I get more reasonable scores on pen=0.001.

And for your model, I agree with you pen=0 looks better for you and it seems it fits with your other results.

[xripkan]

Albania. Specifically the Martanesh/Okshtun region of Diber Vogel. Mothers side is from Came, Megulle, Malzi, Kukes county.

Father: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dib%C3%ABr_County

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bulqiz%C3%AB_District

Mother: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malzi

This is why you score Ancient Greece. Vahaduo gives somewhat elevated results to you but I would say it is in a good track.

[Thracian]

Why does the fit increase with that particular algorithm? It seems more accurate despite its larger distance(however marginal).

I really don't know why. I just noticed the fit is higher for pen=0.001 than pen=0 all the time for same model.

[Jana]

Running on vahaduoJS

distance 0.02281031

Ancient Balkans 31.4
Baltics 43.2
Slavs 16.4
Ancient Greece 7
EasternAnatolian/Mesopotamian/Iranian 2

Wow, amazing fit :D

[xripkan]

I really don't know pen=0 or pen=0.001 is more accurate. My experiences with pen=0 were really odd. For example, if I select Bulgarians with other South Slavic folks such as Serbians, Croatians and Bosnians or Romanians I get 0% Bulgarian. I get more reasonable scores on pen=0.001.

And for your model, I agree with you pen=0 looks better for you and it seems it fits with your other results.

I ran at Vahaduo your coordinates using Balkan references. You get mostly Bulgarian:

Bulgarian 90.2
Romanian 9.8
Serbian 0
Croatian 0
Bosnian 0

[MagnusDark]

This is why you score Ancient Greece. Vahaduo gives somewhat elevated results to you but I would say it is in a good track.

It is probably due to more atypical components I have. My father included. For instance, in K36 we get 31(me) and 35(him) for "Italian" component; which is really just a Central Mediterranean component. Oddly enough, Mycenaean scored like 60 percent or so of this component. This could explain why I sometimes get more "Ancient Greek" than is typical. It is probably noticing similar admixture.

As far as I was advised, The people who average the highest in moderns are Tuscans with 26-28 percent. Albanians averaging between 20-26. Me and my father are quite atypical as we are more elevated than either group. Which could also explain why we shift more towards Tuscans than the average Albanian. There is also a slight Sardinian "like" pull for him and me which I am not sure if it has to do with the same thing.

[xripkan]

It is probably due to more atypical components I have. My father included. For instance, in K36 we get 31(me) and 35(him) for "Italian" component; which is really just a Central Mediterranean component. Oddly enough, Mycenaean scored like 60 percent or so of this component. This could explain why I sometimes get more "Ancient Greek" than is typical. It is probably noticing similar admixture.

As far as I was advised, The people who average the highest in moderns are Tuscans with 26-28 percent. Albanians averaging between 20-26. Me and my father are quite atypical as we are more elevated than either group. Which could also explain why we shift more towards Tuscans than the average Albanian. There is also a slight Sardinian "like" pull for him and me which I am not sure if it has to do with the same thing.

It seems you are more Balkan Neolithic shifted than the average Albanian.

[MagnusDark]

It seems you are more Balkan Neolithic shifted than the average Albanian.

Could well be. Seems to be the only thing I can think of.

[Lemgrant]

Target: Andrei_scaled
Distance: 2.1770% / 0.02177044
Aggregated
30.2 Ancient_Greece
25.0 Baltics
24.6 Slavs
13.6 Ancient_Balkans
6.6 Ancient_Levantine

wtf

your result with pen=0.001:



[1] "1. CLOSEST SINGLE ITEM DISTANCE%"
AncientBalkans:Scythian_MDA_scy305
5.652511
AncientBalkans:Scythian_MDA_scy197
5.708015
AncientBalkans:HRV_IA
5.767606
AncientBalkans:Scythian_MDA_scy192
6.541544
AncientBalkans:Scythian_MDA_scy300
6.597885
Slavs:HUN_Avar_Szolad_Av1
6.959994
Slavs:CZE_Early_Slav_RISE569
6.963922
Slavs:RUS_Sunghir_MA_Sunghir6
8.086709
AncientBalkans:BGR_IA_I5769
8.914693
Slavs:HUN_Avar_Szolad_Av2
9.304542
AncientGreece:Iberia_Northeast_Empuries2
10.871305
AncientGreece:GRC_Mycenaean
11.350250
Baltics:Baltic_EST_MA_IIf_1
11.490888
Caucasus:ARM_LBA
12.327874
Baltics:Baltic_EST_MA_IIg_1
13.164221
Baltics:Baltic_EST_MA_IVLS09KT_1
13.478838
Baltics:Baltic_EST_MA_IIa_1
13.509382
AncientLevantine:Levant_ISR_MLBA
16.609167
AncientBalkans:MDA_Cimmerian
18.153893
EasternAnatolian/Mesopotamian/Iranian:IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
30.676269
EasternASIA:Mongolian
48.259755





[1] "distance%=2.5968"

Andre_scaled

AncientBalkans,54.8
Slavs,27.4
Baltics,10
AncientGreece,5.4
AncientLevantine,2.2
Caucasus,0.2

[xripkan]

This is my K13:

# Population Percent
1 North_Atlantic 36.75
2 West_Med 25.64
3 East_Med 14.09
4 Baltic 11.57
5 West_Asian 4.55
6 Red_Sea 2.76
7 Northeast_African 2.5
8 Siberian 0.94
9 Oceanian 0.76
10 Sub-Saharan 0.43

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Portuguese 2.94
2 Spanish_Extremadura 3.73
3 Spanish_Galicia 4.46
4 Spanish_Murcia 4.54
5 Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon 4.65
6 Spanish_Andalucia 5.1
7 Spanish_Cataluna 5.16
8 Spanish_Valencia 5.47
9 Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha 5.68
10 Spanish_Cantabria 7.18
11 North_Italian 7.36
12 Spanish_Aragon 8.77
13 Southwest_French 9.16
14 French 10.16
15 Tuscan 13.28
16 West_German 15.99
17 South_Dutch 16.12
18 Romanian 18.95
19 Serbian 19.21
20 West_Sicilian 19.89

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 95.4% Portuguese + 4.6% Balkar @ 1.89
2 96.1% Portuguese + 3.9% Abhkasian @ 1.91
3 95.7% Portuguese + 4.3% North_Ossetian @ 1.93
4 95.5% Portuguese + 4.5% Kabardin @ 1.93
5 95.7% Portuguese + 4.3% Ossetian @ 1.94
6 96% Portuguese + 4% Georgian @ 1.94
7 95.7% Portuguese + 4.3% Adygei @ 1.95
8 95.5% Portuguese + 4.5% Kumyk @ 2.03
9 95.8% Portuguese + 4.2% Chechen @ 2.08
10 80.4% Spanish_Andalucia + 19.6% Serbian @ 2.08
11 95.3% Portuguese + 4.7% Nogay @ 2.11
12 95.9% Portuguese + 4.1% Armenian @ 2.12
13 95.1% Portuguese + 4.9% Turkish @ 2.12
14 96% Portuguese + 4% Lezgin @ 2.14
15 79.4% Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha + 20.6% Bulgarian @ 2.15
16 83.2% Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon + 16.8% Greek_Thessaly @ 2.18
17 96.1% Portuguese + 3.9% Kurdish @ 2.19
18 95.8% Portuguese + 4.2% Azeri @ 2.2
19 96.2% Portuguese + 3.8% Georgian_Jewish @ 2.21
20 96.1% Portuguese + 3.9% Tabassaran @ 2.21


I don't have any Greek sample on my top 20 but I have Tuscan. I am slightly more eastern-shifted than your average Portuguese, I inherited it from my dad apparently. This is his K13 oracle:


Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 90.5% Portuguese + 9.5% Southwest_Russian @ 3.82
2 86.5% Portuguese + 13.5% Croatian @ 3.84
3 91.8% Portuguese + 8.2% Erzya @ 3.86
4 89.3% Portuguese + 10.7% Ukrainian @ 3.86
5 86.3% Portuguese + 13.7% Moldavian @ 3.86
6 90.8% Portuguese + 9.2% Estonian_Polish @ 3.86
7 82.5% Portuguese + 17.5% Serbian @ 3.87
8 91% Portuguese + 9% Belorussian @ 3.91
9 91.4% Portuguese + 8.6% Kargopol_Russian @ 3.92
10 91% Portuguese + 9% Ukrainian_Belgorod @ 3.95
11 92.1% Portuguese + 7.9% Lithuanian @ 3.98
12 89.4% Portuguese + 10.6% Ukrainian_Lviv @ 3.99
13 84.4% Portuguese + 15.6% Bulgarian @ 3.99
14 91.1% Portuguese + 8.9% Russian_Smolensk @ 3.99
15 83.3% Portuguese + 16.7% Romanian @ 4
16 89.3% Portuguese + 10.7% South_Polish @ 4
17 90.5% Portuguese + 9.5% Polish @ 4.06
18 92.1% Portuguese + 7.9% East_Finnish @ 4.09
19 73.5% Spanish_Valencia + 26.5% Serbian @ 4.1
20 85.6% Portuguese + 14.4% Hungarian @ 4.11

What about your G25? Do you score more Steppe than the average Portuguese?

[Kamal900]

The calculator ain't good for someone like me:

"sample": "Test1:Moody_scaled",
"fit": 3.5965,
"AncientLevantine": 60,
"AncientGreece": 17.5,
"EasternAnatolian/Mesopotamian/Iranian": 12.5,
"Caucasus": 5,
"Baltics": 3.33,
"EasternASIA": 1.67,

"closestDistances": [
"AncientLevantine:Levant_ISR_MLBA: 6.124604",
"AncientGreece:GRC_Mycenaean: 10.016551",
"Caucasus:ARM_LBA: 10.087812",
"AncientGreece:Iberia_Northeast_Empuries2: 10.270842",
"AncientBalkans:BGR_IA_I5769: 11.285006",
"AncientBalkans:Scythian_MDA_scy305: 11.514837",
"AncientBalkans:Scythian_MDA_scy300: 11.530227",
"AncientBalkans:Scythian_MDA_scy192: 11.566990",
"AncientBalkans:Scythian_MDA_scy197: 12.616186",

[xripkan]

The calculator ain't good for someone like me:

"sample": "Test1:Moody_scaled",
"fit": 3.5965,
"AncientLevantine": 60,
"AncientGreece": 17.5,
"EasternAnatolian/Mesopotamian/Iranian": 12.5,
"Caucasus": 5,
"Baltics": 3.33,
"EasternASIA": 1.67,

"closestDistances": [
"AncientLevantine:Levant_ISR_MLBA: 6.124604",
"AncientGreece:GRC_Mycenaean: 10.016551",
"Caucasus:ARM_LBA: 10.087812",
"AncientGreece:Iberia_Northeast_Empuries2: 10.270842",
"AncientBalkans:BGR_IA_I5769: 11.285006",
"AncientBalkans:Scythian_MDA_scy305: 11.514837",
"AncientBalkans:Scythian_MDA_scy300: 11.530227",
"AncientBalkans:Scythian_MDA_scy192: 11.566990",
"AncientBalkans:Scythian_MDA_scy197: 12.616186",

Run the model with Saudi extra reference. You will get more valid results.

[Kamal900]

Run the model with Saudi extra reference. You will get more valid results.

Adding a canaanite from Lebanon during the Roman period, BedouinB and a Berber from Tunisia did helped a lot:

"sample": "Test1:Moody_scaled",
"fit": 1.4235,
"Levant_LBN_Roman": 30,
"AncientGreece": 19.17,
"BedouinB": 15.83,
"Berber_Tunisia_Chen": 11.67,
"Caucasus": 11.67,
"EasternAnatolian/Mesopotamian/Iranian": 10.83,
"EasternASIA": 0.83,

"closestDistances": [
"Levant_LBN_Roman:undefined: 3.969613",
"AncientLevantine:Levant_ISR_MLBA: 6.124604",
"AncientGreece:GRC_Mycenaean: 10.016551",
"Caucasus:ARM_LBA: 10.087812",
"AncientGreece:Iberia_Northeast_Empuries2: 10.270842",
"BedouinB:undefined: 11.053829",
"AncientBalkans:BGR_IA_I5769: 11.285006",

[xripkan]

Adding a canaanite from Lebanon during the Roman period, BedouinB and a Berber from Tunisia did helped a lot:

"sample": "Test1:Moody_scaled",
"fit": 1.4235,
"Levant_LBN_Roman": 30,
"AncientGreece": 19.17,
"BedouinB": 15.83,
"Berber_Tunisia_Chen": 11.67,
"Caucasus": 11.67,
"EasternAnatolian/Mesopotamian/Iranian": 10.83,
"EasternASIA": 0.83,

"closestDistances": [
"Levant_LBN_Roman:undefined: 3.969613",
"AncientLevantine:Levant_ISR_MLBA: 6.124604",
"AncientGreece:GRC_Mycenaean: 10.016551",
"Caucasus:ARM_LBA: 10.087812",
"AncientGreece:Iberia_Northeast_Empuries2: 10.270842",
"BedouinB:undefined: 11.053829",
"AncientBalkans:BGR_IA_I5769: 11.285006",

Your ancient Greece must be ancient/Neolithic East Med.

[Kamal900]

Your ancient Greece must be ancient/Neolithic East Med.

Most likely due to the Aegean admixture from the Philistines or something. My genetic analysis from Anthrogenica:

It's largely the same with your results. The samples you are closest to are also the most recent (Medieval and then Roman-era), they are also geographically close to the area your family hails from (Sidon). The Iron Age I Ashkelonites are associated with the Philistine wave of settlement and are therefore very similar to Western Jews, tellingly however the closest sample to you (ASH066) is the only one within the IA1 cluster to derive most of its ancestry from the local LBA Canaanites (that being said this sample also has some degree of Mycenaean-like ancestry, which places him not too far from the Medieval Sidonians), this individual is J1-Z2331. The Iron Age II Ashkelonites are much more similar to the Bronze Age Sidonians and are effectively associated with the phase of Aegean-Canaanite syncretism in Philistia which saw the adoption of a coastal Canaanite dialect very similar to Old Byblian (and which eventually replaced the Philistine language). Combined with the MBA Sidonians, everything is pointing towards Phoenician ancestry here.

The MLBA sample from Tel Shadud (Levant_ISR_MLBA_I2062) comes after, this individual is associated with the Canaanite areas that were situated inland and eventually gave rise to the Proto-Israelites, this sample is quite close to present-day Samaritans. So judging from your results, it's already clear that your ancestry is derived from the coastal areas of Canaan, from the standpoint of internal linguistic classification the Canaanite dialects also follow a coastal-inland divide.
https://anthrogenica.com/showthread.php?18455-New-MyTrueAncestry-feature&p=616254&viewfull=1#post616254
https://i.ibb.co/C7SswZG/2019-11-01-21-38-11-mytrueancestry-com-474b1310f02b.jpg

[Ljubic]

Father:
Distance: 0.01395795
AncientBalkans: 10.8
AncientGreece: 34.0
Baltics: 53.6
Slavs: 0.8
Caucasus: 0.8

Me:
Distance: 0.01679546
AncientBalkans: 12.4
AncientGreece: 24.0
Baltics: 24.2
Slavs: 36.8
Caucasus: 0.8
Ancient Levantine: 1.8

Whats even the difference between Baltic and Slavic? Why the hell does my Father only score only 0,8% Slavic but 53.6% Baltic? He has the same thing on Eurogenes K15 where his Eastern European is only at 10% while he scores 24% Baltic.

[xripkan]

Father:
Distance: 0.01395795
AncientBalkans: 10.8
AncientGreece: 34.0
Baltics: 53.6
Slavs: 0.8
Caucasus: 0.8

Me:
Distance: 0.01679546
AncientBalkans: 12.4
AncientGreece: 24.0
Baltics: 24.2
Slavs: 36.8
Caucasus: 0.8
Ancient Levantine: 1.8

Whats even the difference between Baltic and Slavic? Why the hell does my Father only score only 0,8% Slavic but 53.6% Baltic? He has the same thing on Eurogenes K15 where his Eastern European is only at 10% while he scores 24% Baltic.

Baltics are the Proto-Slavs I would say. While Slavs are Baltics mixed with indigenous people of Eastern people/Northern Balkans. They are closer to what Slavs who settled Balkans were. There is some overlapping between these categories.

[Kamal900]

Baltics are the Proto-Slavs I would say. While Slavs are Baltics mixed with indigenous people of Eastern people/Northern Balkans. They are closer to what Slavs who settled Balkans were. There is some overlapping between these categories.

Well, here's my K36 oracle results:

My results:

[1,] "Sidon_ERS1790730_" "13.0941"
[2,] "Sidon_BA_ERS1790730_" "13.209"
[3,] "ASH2_3_Philistine_" "13.2883"
[4,] "ASH003_Philistine_" "13.4051"
[5,] "ASH066_Philistine_" "13.646"
[6,] "BA_Sydon_" "14.1524"
[7,] "ASH29_Philistine_" "14.2527"
[8,] "IA_Levant_Egypt_" "14.3688"
[9,] "VAR43_3DRIF26_Gladiator_York_100_400_AD_" "14.7327"
[10,] "ASH33_Philistine_" "14.8053"
[11,] "IA_LevantEgypt_3DRIF26b_" "15.7248"
[12,] "I4351_Copper_Age_Iran_I4351_" "15.7941"
[13,] "3drif_26_Laz_et_al_2017_gladiator" "16.0351"
[14,] "ASH087_Philistine_" "16.3043"
[15,] "3drif_26_Vadim_s_file_gladiator" "16.8372"
[16,] "Sidon_BA_ERS1790733_" "16.8953"
[17,] "Sidon_ERS1790733_" "16.9466"
[18,] "Sidon_BA_ERS1790732_" "17.0423"
[19,] "Sidon_ERS1790732_" "17.0726"
[20,] "sidon_731_" "17.4466"
[21,] "Sidon_BA_ERS1790731_" "17.6087"
[22,] "ASH8_Philistine_" "18.7802"
[23,] "ASH135_Philistine_" "19.0972"
[24,] "Egyptian_mumy_" "19.512"
[25,] "I4241_Copper_Age_Iran_I4241_" "19.6198"
[26,] "I0867_Levant_PPNB_Motza_Israel_7300_6750_BCE_" "20.3349"
[27,] "Egyptian_mummy_" "20.4935"
[28,] "CL38_Greek_south_Italian_2" "21.1096"
[29,] "Egyptian_mummy_III_jk2911_" "21.4769"
[30,] "jk2911_Egypt_769_560_BC_2" "21.4971"

Mixed:

[1,] "37.6 % i1407_areni_merged_ + 62.4 % VAR43_3DRIF26_Gladiator_York_100_400_AD_" "3.9255"
[2,] "36.9 % i1407_areni_merged_ + 63.1 % IA_Levant_Egypt_" "3.9812"
[3,] "60.5 % 3drif_26_Laz_et_al_2017_gladiator + 39.5 % i1407_areni_merged_" "4.5844"
[4,] "39 % i1407_areni_merged_ + 61 % IA_LevantEgypt_3DRIF26b_" "4.5912"
[5,] "59.7 % 3drif_26_Laz_et_al_2017_gladiator + 40.3 % I1955_Kurdistan_Medieval_1430_1485_AD]_" "4.8197"
[6,] "59.7 % 3drif_26_Laz_et_al_2017_gladiator + 40.3 % Late_Medieval_Iran_" "4.8328"
[7,] "39.8 % I1955_Kurdistan_Medieval_1430_1485_AD]_ + 60.2 % IA_LevantEgypt_3DRIF26b_" "4.8645"
[8,] "60.2 % IA_LevantEgypt_3DRIF26b_ + 39.8 % Late_Medieval_Iran_" "4.88"
[9,] "38.1 % Late_Medieval_Iran_ + 61.9 % VAR43_3DRIF26_Gladiator_York_100_400_AD_" "4.9244"
[10,] "38 % I1955_Kurdistan_Medieval_1430_1485_AD]_ + 62 % VAR43_3DRIF26_Gladiator_York_100_400_AD_" "4.9313"

[WeirdLookingFellow]

Father:
Distance: 0.01395795
AncientBalkans: 10.8
AncientGreece: 34.0
Baltics: 53.6
Slavs: 0.8
Caucasus: 0.8

Me:
Distance: 0.01679546
AncientBalkans: 12.4
AncientGreece: 24.0
Baltics: 24.2
Slavs: 36.8
Caucasus: 0.8
Ancient Levantine: 1.8

Whats even the difference between Baltic and Slavic? Why the hell does my Father only score only 0,8% Slavic but 53.6% Baltic? He has the same thing on Eurogenes K15 where his Eastern European is only at 10% while he scores 24% Baltic.

He might be more German pulled. This model is not great for people with Germanic input as the calculator decides to consider Germanic Baltic, and then pulls from Slavic in favor of more Baltic.