Middle Eastern DNA

[miarosie3]

Hello, I hope I don’t confuse anyone trying to explain this lol.

I took an ancestry DNA test to find out about my fathers ethnicity. The majority of my DNA is European because my mother, grandparents and two of my great grandparents are Welsh, the other two great grandparents are Polish and supposedly Irish. For my ancestry DNA I score 19% Northwestern Europe, 20% Middle East and 7% Eastern Euro. The Middle East surprised me a lot so I assumed it was coming from my father. I ran my results through gedmatch and most of my DNA was European, the secondary populations however were Middle Eastern. I then decided to run my raw data through your dna ports ancient Near East to see where my highest Middle East percentages were from but all of my Middle Eastern percentages were below 1% and my highest percentage was actually 25% for Bulgaria and the second highest being Macedonia. So that confused me. I decided to plug my results into my heritage and it said I only had 3% Middle Eastern whilst I had 0% Balkan. So I checked my DNA matches to see if I could get an idea of what was going on. I had 4,000 DNA matches so I used the ethnicity filter. Only 13 out 4,000 were Middle Eastern whilst 331 out of 4,000 were Balkan. I also used the k15 eurogenes plot map and I plot between N.italy and Bulgaria.

Any idea what’s going on? 😅

[dududud]

Send K15 et 13 Eurogene results.

[miarosie3]

K 13

Population
North_Atlantic 37.76 Pct
Baltic 22.17 Pct
West_Med 8.02 Pct
West_Asian 6.87 Pct
East_Med 12.89 Pct
Red_Sea 7.08 Pct
South_Asian -
East_Asian -
Siberian -
Amerindian 0.44 Pct
Oceanian 1.43 Pct
Northeast_African 3.36 Pct
Sub-Saharan -

[miarosie3]

Population k15
North_Sea 29.00 Pct
Atlantic 19.18 Pct
Baltic 8.72 Pct
Eastern_Euro 10.42 Pct
West_Med 6.06 Pct
West_Asian 4.35 Pct
East_Med 11.65 Pct
Red_Sea 6.20 Pct
South_Asian -
Southeast_Asian -
Siberian -
Amerindian -
Oceanian 1.10 Pct
Northeast_African 3.32 Pct
Sub-Saharan -

[Kamal900]

That is weird. Your East-Med, Red Sea and North-East African ancestries are high for a Brit.

[miarosie3]

I’m British from my mothers side for sure. It’s my fathers side that I’m not sure of. It says Middle East but then Bulgaria is also being thrown in there on some websites? Like I said above, I have 13 Middle Eastern matches out of 4,000

[FinalFlash]

You may want to get a second opinion.

[WeirdLookingFellow]

You clearly have very high East Med, Red Sea and even somen NE African. Do you have any known Jewish ancestry?

[miarosie3]

Not that I’m aware of.

[Kamal900]

You clearly have very high East Med, Red Sea and even somen NE African. Do you have any known Jewish ancestry?

Which is shocking for me to see a Brit to score such high ancestry. Maybe she does have a Jewish ancestor or something.

[WeirdLookingFellow]

Not that I’m aware of.

I'd advise checking some maiden names for your grandmas and the surname of your maternal grandfather. Such admix indicates to me around 1/4 to 1/8 Jewish ancestry, also you may want to take 23andme to see if they pick up any Ashkenazi. Also you can upload your rawdata on Myheritage, they pick up Ashkenazi as well.

[miarosie3]

Could the Jewish be coming from my fathers side? Because my grandfathers side of the family is Polish and my nanna’s side is Irish, their surnames are all very Irish. I don’t know much about my grandfathers history though, just that his father came to the UK from Poland.

[Pine]

You clearly have very high East Med, Red Sea and even somen NE African. Do you have any known Jewish ancestry?

His East Med + West Asian : Red Sea ratio doesn't make sense for a Western Jew, unless it's due to random inheritance and/or one category is pouring into another. His Red Sea is that of a full Jew.

[miarosie3]

I’m not sure what you mean?

[Adamm]

How do we know its Jewish, Red Sea in combination with West Med and NorthEast African is the typical North African (Maghrebi) component. You definitely got something unusual going on.

[Pine]

Are your original results from AncestryDNA?

[miarosie3]

Yes they’re ancestry DNA

[miarosie3]

They don’t seem to make any sense. My matches don’t even add up to what my results are telling me.

[Pine]

They don’t seem to make any sense. My matches don’t even add up to what my results are telling me.

Given that AncestryDNA assigned you Middle East and you decided to look for Balkan results based on calculators and found a lot, try looking for Cypriot cousin matches. They're common in the UK, score a lot of Middle Eastern on AncestryDNA and have are autosomally close to mainland Levantines. I assume you would've told us if either side gave you a Jewish result. Therefore, Western Jewish ancestry is unlikely, but Baghdadi Jews are fairly old in the UK,and they would just pop up under "Middle Eastern" on these sites. There is also the possibility of a non-paternal event, in which case it becomes even harder to tell.

[Pine]

Check what ethnicities your closest cousin matches are.

[miarosie3]

I decided to search for Balkan matches because I got such a high Bulgarian result for the ancient Middle East calculator on Yourdnaportal

[Pine]

I decided to search for Balkan matches because I got such a high Bulgarian result for the ancient Middle East calculator on Yourdnaportal

I understand. Instead, see who your closest cousin matches are.

[Leto]

GEDmatch calcs are total BS sometimes, they're far from infallible. 12% East Med and 7% Red Sea is a weird combination. Deep Sicilians and Greek Islanders may get that amount of RS but that ALWAYS goes hand in hand with a much higher East Med percentage (30+ percent).

East_Med 12.89 Pct
Red_Sea 7.08 Pct

East_Med 11.65 Pct
Red_Sea 6.20 Pct

[miarosie3]

My closest cousin matches are from my grandmothers side

[miarosie3]

That’s why I decided on trying 23andme to see how different their results would be. I’ve asked a few people, one minute I’m being told he’s Bulgarian and the next I’m being told he’s Arab. It’s confusing.

[Leto]

Show your K36 results please.

[miarosie3]

Population
Amerindian -
Arabian 6.51 Pct
Armenian -
Basque 1.00 Pct
Central_African -
Central_Euro 3.53 Pct
East_African -
East_Asian -
East_Balkan 2.17 Pct
East_Central_Asian -
East_Central_Euro 5.92 Pct
East_Med 4.11 Pct
Eastern_Euro 5.60 Pct
Fennoscandian 7.16 Pct
French 6.73 Pct
Iberian 7.56 Pct
Indo-Chinese -
Italian 8.48 Pct
Malayan -
Near_Eastern 2.83 Pct
North_African -
North_Atlantic 13.28 Pct
North_Caucasian 3.34 Pct
North_Sea 16.21 Pct
Northeast_African 3.88 Pct
Oceanian 0.78 Pct
Omotic -
Pygmy -
Siberian -
South_Asian -
South_Central_Asian -
South_Chinese -
Volga-Ural 0.87 Pct
West_African -
West_Caucasian -
West_Med -

[Leto]

I think you might have some Middle Eastern in you.

[archangel]

Sorry sis but you have sandnigger in you:(

[Pine]

My closest cousin matches are from my grandmothers side

As in, tell us what your closest cousin matches are that cannot be from your mom's side.

[Pine]

Sorry sis but you have sandnigger in you:(

It's a day to celebrate, not to frown.

[miarosie3]

I really can’t tell because they’re all so mixed. The huge majority of them all match with cousins from my cousin on my mothers side.

[archangel]

It's a day to celebrate, not to frown.

Man i would feel ashamed by it you know

[Pine]

Man i would feel ashamed by it you know

At least you look happy about it in your avi.

[Pine]

I really can’t tell because they’re all so mixed. The huge majority of them all match with cousins from my cousin on my mothers side.

Do any of them have Arabic names?

[miarosie3]

Should it show on my k36 map results?

And good for you man, I’m not ashamed of it though.

[miarosie3]

Nope

[Pine]

Should it show on my k36 map results?

And good for you man, I’m not ashamed of it though.

It does show on there. You get high Arabic and high Northeast African.

[miarosie3]

No, not on that. But the map, like where you insert those numbers and it shows you how well you match with each population

[Pine]

No, not on that. But the map, like where you insert those numbers and it shows you how well you match with each population

Those aren't helpful for mixed people.

[miarosie3]

These are my results for the ancient Near East Calculator on mydnaportal. Does it show here?

Bulgarian

0.7421826

Romanian

0.7734578

Croatian

1.1045882

Albanian

1.1424513

French

1.1599461

Hungarian

1.2146246

Greek

1.2495923

Sicilian

1.533438



Population

Value

Bulgarian

25.2

Romanian

19

Hungarian

4.8

French

4.4

English

3.8

Europe_LNBA

3.4

Czech

3.2

Scottish

3.2

Jew_Ashkenazi

2.8

Sicilian

2.4

Lithuanian

2.2

Steppe_MLBA

2

Italian_South

1.8

Sardinian

1.6

Croatian

1.4

Jew_Moroccan

1.4

Libyan

1.2

Palestinian

1.2

Algerian

1

Finnish

1

Russian

1

SHG

1

Cypriot

0.8

Estonian

0.8

Somali

0.8

Druze

0.6

Jew_Libyan

0.6

Steppe_EMBA

0.6

WHG

0.6

BedouinA

0.4

Bichon

0.4

Egyptian

0.4

Jew_Tunisian

0.4

Jew_Yemenite

0.4

Lebanese

0.4

Masai

0.4

Syrian

0.4

Australian

0.2

Burusho

0.2

Eskimo

0.2

Gambian

0.2

Jew_iraqi

0.2

Jordanian

0.2

Kurd_SE

0.2

Kusunda

0.2

Levant_N

0.2

Moroccan

0.2

Papuan

0.2

Saharawi

0.2

Saudi

0.2

Steppe_Eneolithic

0.2

Steppe_IA

0.2

[Pine]

Mia, they will average your ethnicity for single population oracles. They're not useful to you. If anything, show mixed population oracles (the ones which show you as a sum of populations).

[miarosie3]

And what about the k15 plot map?

[miarosie3]

Would you also say that my father is fully Middle Eastern?

[Pine]

And what about the k15 plot map?

Anything that assigns you one point is useless to you.

[Pine]

Would you also say that my father is fully Middle Eastern?

What are the full results from AncestryDNA?

[miarosie3]

Ireland and Scotland 28%
Middle East 20%
England, Wales and Norrhwestern Europe 19%
Eastern Europe and Russia 7%
Germanic Europe 7%
Norway 7%
Baltic 6%
France 7%
Ehtiooea and Etritea 2%
Turkey and the caucus 1%

[Pine]

Ireland and Scotland 28%
Middle East 20%
England, Wales and Norrhwestern Europe 19%
Eastern Europe and Russia 7%
Germanic Europe 7%
Norway 7%
Baltic 6%
France 7%
Ehtiooea and Etritea 2%
Turkey and the caucus 1%

No, your father isn't fully Middle Eastern. It looks like a grandparent was.

[miarosie3]

Any idea what the other grandparent could’ve been?

[Mingle]

Your Red Sea seems too high for someone that is only partially Southern Euro/Balkan or Western Jewish. My guess is you have a recent Arab ancestor.

Post your mixed mode oracle for your Eurogenes K13 or K15.

[miarosie3]

I think I posted that earlier on in the thread, is that the correct one?

[miarosie3]

I’ve been speaking with someone on reddit who believes that I may possibly have a grandparent that is Egyptian and a grandparent that is Bulgarian

[Smeagol]

I'd advise checking some maiden names for your grandmas and the surname of your maternal grandfather. Such admix indicates to me around 1/4 to 1/8 Jewish ancestry, also you may want to take 23andme to see if they pick up any Ashkenazi. Also you can upload your rawdata on Myheritage, they pick up Ashkenazi as well.

She scores more Red Sea and NE African than even a full Ashkenazi Jew. https://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?238755-Ashkenazi-GEDMatch-results
It's clearly some type of Arab ancestry.

[Nazarene]

Welcome to the fam

[WeirdLookingFellow]

She scores more Red Sea and NE African than even a full Ashkenazi Jew. https://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?238755-Ashkenazi-GEDMatch-results
It's clearly some type of Arab ancestry.

Yes you are right on that, I couldn't check averages when I posted.

In regards to the Bulgarian, that's not possible based on the calculators. Bulgarians score higher West Asian and little Red Sea, at a level that makes it very old/noise. As others said it's probably an Arab ancestor.

[Kamal900]

Welcome to the fam


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=97aiSGxmizg
https://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?305496-The-Genetic-Structure-of-Levantine-and-Egyptian-Arabs&p=6305654&viewfull=1#post6305654

[21993]

Welcome!!

[miarosie3]

Thank you all :)

[Mingle]

I think I posted that earlier on in the thread, is that the correct one?You posted the admixture results not the mixed mode oracle.

My guess is you have an Egyptian grandparent. I've heard of many cases of Westerners being part Egyptian but not really part Peninsular Arab.

[Figaro]

You clearly have very high East Med, Red Sea and even somen NE African. Do you have any known Jewish ancestry?

Hmm...is excess NE african in a european possibly explained via sephardi ancestry?

OP's "concern" and scores remind me of my dad's results. Interesting.

[Pine]

Hmm...is excess NE african in a european possibly explained via sephardi ancestry?

OP's "concern" and scores remind me of my dad's results. Interesting.

No, because Sephardim don't typically have that much NE African unless they're Sephardim who fled to North Africa and mixed with Berbers. Also, this is at most a grandparent, so the amount cannot be explain by Sephardic ancestry. She also would've almost surely scored some Jewish on AncestryDNA with a Sephardic grandparent. A grandparent who was somewhere between North African and Middle Eastern seems most likely. He was probably either North African or Egyptian.

[miarosie3]

Welp, I’m getting a lot of different answers from different people. But I think one thing we can agree on is that my results are mysterious lmao

[marco]

She’s part Egyptian, one of her grandparents on her dads side is fully Egyptian or close to it. She also scores Bedouin B in some of her oracles so she arab ancestry, she has a lot to be proud of and hopefully she can learn more about her culture instead of certain people saying they would be ashamed, talking about the Turk earlier on in the thread.

[marco]

Man i would feel ashamed by it you know

Post your results including gedmatch and your haplogroup. Since you are so confident that you are a pure Turk