Ukraine crowd--what phenotype do you see?

[Voyt]

https://www.kreisbote.de/bilder/2014/02/23/3380193/508037749-julia-timoschenko-kiew-maidan-unabhaengigkeitsplatz.jpg

[Voyt]

I didn't expect it, but predominantly Gorid and Pontid

[chociprasa]

Baltid, Neo-Danubian, West Baltid, Gorid, Pontid, Volgid, East Baltid, Armenoid, Turanid.

[Voyt]

Baltid, Neo-Danubian, West Baltid, Gorid, Pontid, Volgid, East Baltid, Armenoid, Turanid.

Where do you see Baltid and Neo-Danubian? Maybe 3/100

[ixulescu]

this is a rather old crowd, it's hard to classify old people


here's a better group:
https://image.shutterstock.com/z/stock-photo-kiev-ukraine-june-sweden-and-ukrainian-fans-arrive-in-the-fanzone-during-the-match-euro-105336470.jpg

[Jana]

this is a rather old crowd, it's hard to classify old people

It is not old, it's mostly middle aged which is majority of population for almost every European country.
That is how average looks like.

But I agree younger people are much better to classify.
Anyway, thse people look clearly Slavic just the lighting is rather dark.

[Jana]

I didn't expect it, but predominantly Gorid and Pontid

Pontid? Practically no Pontids at all. Almost all have wide faces.
Pontid influence is definitelly very overestimated among Ukrainians.

[Özgür Adam]

60-70% Ukrainians are brachy mixed. Dark pigmented Pontids is less >8%

[Özgür Adam]

I didn't expect it, but predominantly Gorid and Pontid

Gorid is predominate. Pontids is minority

[Jana]

Gorid is predominate. Pontids is minority

I would say they are mostly Neo-Danubian

[Satem]

Mostly Gorids, a few Dinarids, Pontids, Baltids, North Pontids

[Adamg]

Typical Zaporozhe Cossack wide faces and brachy heads, also dark pigmented mainly.

[TheMaestro]

Mostly Gorids, a few Dinarids, Pontids, Baltids, North Pontids

True Mr. Cibulo.

[FinalFlash]

Typical Zaporozhe Cossack wide faces and brachy heads, also dark pigmented mainly.

I'm surprised you know of Zaporozhe. I have friends who grew up there.

[Ülev]

Ukraine is Europe, but this part of Europe, listen to the rhythms

https://youtu.be/1N_iVnfY14E

[Adamg]

I highlighted most typical Ukrainian phenotypes. Rest are simply averages between them.

We see Caucasus, Turanid and Gorid influences blended in different proportions.

https://i.imgur.com/RPfWatk.jpg

[Özgür Adam]

I would say they are mostly Neo-Danubian

yes East Europid/Neo-Danubian is 20-30% common in Ukraine. Fischer call this phenotype homo sapiens slavonicus/slavic

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/NeAMsPgiBxg/maxresdefault.jpg

[Özgür Adam]

Ukraine is Europe, but this part of Europe, listen to the rhythms

https://youtu.be/1N_iVnfY14E

https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/2322925420/awc847ipj1en9j9ksbeu_400x400.png

[Voyt]

this is a rather old crowd, it's hard to classify old people


here's a better group:
https://image.shutterstock.com/z/stock-photo-kiev-ukraine-june-sweden-and-ukrainian-fans-arrive-in-the-fanzone-during-the-match-euro-105336470.jpg

That looks like it's from a soccer match with Sweden in Kiev, so not really representative of the population as a whole

Also, younger people don't represent a finalized phenotype because their skull structure isn't fully formed. Young people also like to dye their hair lighter colors and wear makeup

another pic:

92657


yes East Europid/Neo-Danubian is 20-30% common in Ukraine. Fischer call this phenotype homo sapiens slavonicus/slavic

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/NeAMsPgiBxg/maxresdefault.jpg

Are we using different definitions of neo-danubian? Your pic looks Gorid to me

http://humanphenotypes.net/NeoDanubian.html

[Özgür Adam]

Typical Zaporozhe Cossack wide faces and brachy heads, also dark pigmented mainly.

I know my ancestors from the 17th century and they were all Zaporozhian Cossacks. So I dont looking like a typical for average Ukrainian population? With mesocephalic / dolichocephalic oval face?

P.S I know the anthropology of the Ukrainian people and I am in the group of Pontids who make up less than >8% of the population of Ukraine. The closest relatives to Ukrainian Pontid are Romanians and Bulgarians Pontids

[Özgür Adam]

Ukrainian public figure he has also Zaporozhye Cossack ancestry but he have brachy face and mixed eyes

Doesn't think he's Pontid

https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/ws/660/amz/worldservice/live/assets/images/2014/11/26/141126141546_korchynskiy_d_624x351_unian.jpg
https://i.ytimg.com/vi/alS50QXD_6g/maxresdefault.jpg
https://infofakt.com.ua/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/20111108033129-2426-900x600-690x500.jpg

[Voyt]

https://sun9-26.userapi.com/c855728/v855728712/106008/YvQJLeKvGlM.jpg


Slightly Pontized Mtebid (pontized part is the long skull)

http://humanphenotypes.net/pontidm.jpg+http://humanphenotypes.net/mtebidm.jpg


Ukrainian public figure he has also Zaporozhye Cossack ancestry but he have brachy face and mixed eyes

Doesn't think he's Pontid


Armenized neo-Danubian

[Özgür Adam]

Slightly Pontized Mtebid (pontized part is the long skull)

No way Mtebit, dude

[Jana]

yes East Europid/Neo-Danubian is 20-30% common in Ukraine. Fischer call this phenotype homo sapiens slavonicus/slavic

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/NeAMsPgiBxg/maxresdefault.jpg

Is Gorid more common than Neo-Danubian? I tough Gorid only dominant in Carpathian region, east Slovakia, west Ukraine...
It's pretty dark phenotype. Most Ukrainians are not that dark, aren't they?. In lighting like this everyone except really blond people will look dark.

[Voyt]

No way Mtebit, dude

perhaps I have it flipped then; slightly mtebized Pontid

[Pro.crasti.nation]

https://www.kreisbote.de/bilder/2014/02/23/3380193/508037749-julia-timoschenko-kiew-maidan-unabhaengigkeitsplatz.jpg

Is miserable, a phenotype? ;)

[Özgür Adam]

Is Gorid more common than Neo-Danubian? I tough Gorid only dominant in Carpathian region, east Slovakia, west Ukraine...
It's pretty dark phenotype. Most Ukrainians are not that dark, aren't they?. In lighting like this everyone except really blond people will look dark.

In Central Ukraine is also mostly common Gorid.

Neo-Danubian and Gorid is 70-80% Ukrainian population dominate in Central, North and West Ukraine.
As a percentage Ukrainians more darker than lighter.

Most lighter Ukrainians live North and Central Ukraine

[Tellerin]

Overow a lot of East European and Iranian signal

Main groups :
- mixed cluster East Europoid mix with wide face type
- cluster Trans-Caspian (North West Iranian Group, Mountain Jews and and West Asia)
Partitional :
- cluster East Europoid clean
- cluster Tavastid strong influence
- cluster Central Asiatic Alpine(North West Iranian Group and West Asia)
Up ot 5 persons:
- Turanid simillar to Bulgarians (East Iranian Group and West Asia)(Proto Bolgar - Esegel Black Bolgars)
- Caucasoid proto Turks 3500BC (Proto-Proto-Proto Bolgar)
1 person :
- female Red Nordid South West Russia type center down
- female Baltic countries center left
- Jewish center left

[andrzej]

Pontid? Practically no Pontids at all. Almost all have wide faces.
Pontid influence is definitelly very overestimated among Ukrainians.
These are people from Kiev, although many people will probably be from outside of it most are typical for the region. Kiev is just one region in Ukraine and it's more northern inclined. Ukraine is extremely diverse not only from region to region, but even among people from the same region you can have cities where people look predominately southern looking vs. cities with more northern looking people in close proximity. This is especially true in the Steppe regions where you have mixtures of Ukrainian (and sometimes Russian) Cossack descendants, Northern Ukrainians, and Russians.

In comparison these Ukrainians look different than the op's crowd:

https://64.media.tumblr.com/51bb94e16d0e24680a869a390652b540/43c812e326684d61-9d/s2048x3072/170e6e8c88f6571fa786b15dd8c8cb3636d965d5.jpg


Is Gorid more common than Neo-Danubian? I tough Gorid only dominant in Carpathian region, east Slovakia, west Ukraine...
It's pretty dark phenotype. Most Ukrainians are not that dark, aren't they?. In lighting like this everyone except really blond people will look dark.
No, it's pretty common all around.

People from central Ukraine:

https://www.telegraf.in.ua/uploads/posts/2012-04/1333902912_yuvitek.jpg
https://www.telegraf.in.ua/uploads/posts/2012-04/1333905295_lukasik.jpg
https://www.telegraf.in.ua/uploads/posts/2012-04/1333897879_knu.jpg
https://www.telegraf.in.ua/uploads/posts/2012-04/1333902899_premera.jpg
https://www.telegraf.in.ua/uploads/posts/2012-04/1333902919_brest.jpg

https://www.telegraf.in.ua/uploads/posts/2012-04/1333897843_vodokanal-ekoenergo.jpg
https://www.telegraf.in.ua/uploads/posts/2012-04/1333902926_drayv.jpg
https://www.telegraf.in.ua/uploads/posts/2012-04/1333897850_lukas.jpg
https://www.telegraf.in.ua/uploads/posts/2012-04/1333897923_gornyak.jpg
https://www.telegraf.in.ua/uploads/posts/2012-04/1333897936_shturm.jpg
https://www.telegraf.in.ua/uploads/posts/2012-04/1333897878_tm-olsu.jpg
https://www.telegraf.in.ua/uploads/posts/2012-04/1333898534_strit.jpg
https://www.telegraf.in.ua/uploads/posts/2012-04/1333897848_kvsz.jpg
https://www.telegraf.in.ua/uploads/posts/2012-04/1333897876_neftyanik.jpg
https://www.telegraf.in.ua/uploads/posts/2012-04/1333898567_sellok.jpg
https://www.telegraf.in.ua/uploads/posts/2012-04/1333898549_tehvagonmash.jpg
https://www.telegraf.in.ua/uploads/posts/2012-04/1333898535_unisistem.jpg
https://www.telegraf.in.ua/uploads/posts/2012-04/1333898575_inter-avto.jpg
https://www.telegraf.in.ua/uploads/posts/2012-04/1333905332_vpu-7.jpg
https://www.telegraf.in.ua/uploads/posts/2012-04/1333905300_sokol.jpg



Typical Zaporozhe Cossack wide faces and brachy heads, also dark pigmented mainly.
Definitely not. As I mentioned above, these people are from Kiev, although their phenotypes were among Zaporzhian Cossacks since there was constant influx from the right bank - most Zaporzhians were far more southern looking particularly Pontid, but also more Caucaus-like and Turanid phenotypes among them. Same as what you still see among Ukrainians of the Steppe particularly the former Taurida area and the descendants of Ukrainian Cossacks in the Kuban a.k.a. Kuban Cossacks:

https://64.media.tumblr.com/f99220b4b61fb68f8bfa3748011bc62e/82102301001a5b94-eb/s2048x3072/ae55d0506e972c266818188febc1399f0f86c902.jpg
https://64.media.tumblr.com/2438244738d3e9c3c8193e857f4af46f/2d9fae1fe1bb8dc7-d8/s1280x1920/9d0fa78d98922219de9e1729e4be6ed63c73400c.jpg
https://64.media.tumblr.com/a09d8e65ade0af65e729b3c8f30ea189/2d9fae1fe1bb8dc7-33/s1280x1920/413f60a589962d2bac824daf690b8f5709fb7be7.jpg
https://64.media.tumblr.com/e4f2314503cce2f27a77744f711b5ce9/2d9fae1fe1bb8dc7-c9/s1280x1920/e9d8fa431c653672f20b7bfd23d390ea62234183.jpg
https://penzavzglyad.ru/images/uploads/7f5c60bd83fc54f41c2020227e53b684.jpg
https://worldpodium.ru/sites/default/files/styles/original/public/1_992.jpg?itok=IV_2QunP
https://i.ytimg.com/vi/Hv1ISDaWASw/maxresdefault.jpg

Özgür Adam above is actually a good example of a common phenotype you'd see among them v.s people in Kiev.



I'm surprised you know of Zaporozhe. I have friends who grew up there.
Most residents of Zaporzhia now only slightly descendants of Zaporzhians, most of them were deported from the region and mostly ended up in the Kuban of Russia and other parts of Southern Ukraine. There are also many descendants in the Donbas. Those who stayed ended up state peasants but their lands received a great influx of migrants from Northern/Central Ukraine and Russia, who they ended up mixing with and their appearance became even more diluted.