How good is the K36 runner?

[firemonkey]

I'd like opinions on this please .

I took the first 10 populations I have in the correlational and euclidean parts of my K36 ancestry report. The result was this


sample": "Custom:Tim",
"fit": 3.5178,
"Norway_west": 100,
"Iceland": 0,
"Ireland": 0,
"NE_England": 0,
"NL_Groningen": 0,
"NL_Utrecht": 0,
"Northern_Ireland": 0,
"Orkney": 0,
"Scotland": 0,
"Wales": 0,

Whether pen was on or off it was the same.

[firemonkey]

Unusually Jewish (Not that that's a bad or good thing), but best K36 distance so far.


"sample": "Custom:Tim",
"fit": 3.1846,
"NL_Overijssel": 25,
"GER_Schleswig-Holstein": 24.8,
"Cumbria": 9.6,
"Norway_west": 9.2,
"Yemen_Jew": 7.4,
"GER_Bayern": 6.4,
"Finnish_Swede": 4.6,
"GER_Saarland": 4.6,
"South-West_Finns": 4.4,
"GER_Th¸ringen": 4,

[JamesBond007]

If you don't mind me asking how did you do that ? Some of the populations on my k36 report are not on my G25 modern datasheet ? Did you use the Poi website or something etc... ?

[Omanvassal]

"sample": "Custom:AGUser_Omanvassal",
"fit": 2.1494,
"Moldavia": 48.33,
"Latvia_north-eastern": 44.17,
"Moroccan_North": 5,
"African_American": 2.5,

I just have basic version 4 pops, but is accurate can pick my Maghreb Levantine and SSA admixture precise

[firemonkey]

If you don't mind me asking how did you do that ? Some of the populations on my k36 report are not on my G25 modern datasheet ? Did you use the Poi website or something etc... ?

Eurogenes K36 (Lukasz PCA) nMonte Runner

[firemonkey]

"sample": "Custom:Tim",
"fit": 3.1792,
"GER_Schleswig-Holstein": 29.4,
"NL_Overijssel": 25.4,
"GER_Bayern": 15,
"NE_England": 11.4,
"Finnish_Swede": 10.8,
"Yemen_Jew": 8,

As low as I can go .

[oszkar07]

"sample": "Custom:Tim",
"fit": 3.1792,
"GER_Schleswig-Holstein": 29.4,
"NL_Overijssel": 25.4,
"GER_Bayern": 15,
"NE_England": 11.4,
"Finnish_Swede": 10.8,
"Yemen_Jew": 8,

As low as I can go .

Has any other calc given you some Jewish or Middleeastern populations

[Luke35]

I just used the free online calculator, only allows up to 4 populations, and there are much less to choose from compared to G25.

But got a good result here:

"sample": "Custom:mr_g",
"fit": 2.2916,
"GER_Hessen": 50.83,
"Hungary": 49.17,

[Coastal Elite]

I just used the free online calculator, only allows up to 4 populations, and there are much less to choose from compared to G25.

But got a good result here:

"sample": "Custom:mr_g",
"fit": 2.2916,
"GER_Hessen": 50.83,
"Hungary": 49.17,

How did you come up with those two populations? where they highest listed on the k36 report?

[Luke35]

How did you come up with those two populations? where they highest listed on the k36 report?

Not at all. My German ancestry is mostly West German, so I picked a W. German location at random. Hungary, well, because I'm half Hungarian. When I tried other stuff like Montenegrin, England, etc. they did not help improve the fit much, or I got low %. This calculator really likes my known ancestry, but no matter what I do I can't seem to get it below about 2.2 range. On G25 I can get freakishly low. I added Tajik, which is good for me on G25, and it slightly improves my fit here too.

"sample": "Custom:mr_g",
"fit": 2.2313,
"GER_Hessen": 50,
"Hungary": 43.33,
"Tajik_Yagnobi": 6.67,

[Luke35]

How did you come up with those two populations? where they highest listed on the k36 report?

Did you try plugging Irish and Romanian into this calc, see what you get?

[Coastal Elite]

Not at all. My German ancestry is mostly West German, so I picked a W. German location at random. Hungary, well, because I'm half Hungarian. When I tried other stuff like Montenegrin, England, etc. they did not help improve the fit much, or I got low %. This calculator really likes my known ancestry, but no matter what I do I can't seem to get it below about 2.2 range. On G25 I can get freakishly low. I added Tajik, which is good for me on G25, and it slightly improves my fit here too.

"sample": "Custom:mr_g",
"fit": 2.2313,
"GER_Hessen": 50,
"Hungary": 43.33,
"Tajik_Yagnobi": 6.67,


That makes sense. I was just nerding out, trying to find my best 2 population fit on K36. Interestingly, my top two Nmonte populations are a better fit than my actual mix on this calculator.

sample": "Custom:dacoceltic",
"fit": 2.5488,
"GER_Bayern": 51.67,
"Swiss_German": 48.33,

"sample": "Custom:dacoceltic",
"fit": 2.4638,
"Swiss_German": 60,
"GER_Bayern": 31.67,
"Tajik_Yagnobi": 8.33,

vs

"sample": "Custom:dacoceltic",
"fit": 2.6355,
"Ireland": 50.83,
"South-East_Romania": 49.17,

"sample": "Custom:dacoceltic",
"fit": 2.6261,
"Ireland": 49.17,
"South-East_Romania": 48.33,
"Tajik_Yagnobi": 2.5,

[Luke35]

That makes sense. I was just nerding out, trying to find my best 2 population fit on K36. Interestingly, my top two Nmonte populations are a better fit than my actual mix on this calculator.

sample": "Custom:dacoceltic",
"fit": 2.5488,
"GER_Bayern": 51.67,
"Swiss_German": 48.33,

"sample": "Custom:dacoceltic",
"fit": 2.4638,
"Swiss_German": 60,
"GER_Bayern": 31.67,
"Tajik_Yagnobi": 8.33,

vs

"sample": "Custom:dacoceltic",
"fit": 2.6355,
"Ireland": 50.83,
"South-East_Romania": 49.17,

"sample": "Custom:dacoceltic",
"fit": 2.6261,
"Ireland": 49.17,
"South-East_Romania": 48.33,
"Tajik_Yagnobi": 2.5,

Alright man, let's both nerd out together here :) Your results are very interesting, and I see the program splits your known ancestry correctly at 50%, so that's reassuring. But I can confirm that my fit is better with my known ancestry vs. my top two populations.

Using my top two pops, Tajik helps:

"sample": "Custom:mr_g",
"fit": 2.4467,
"GER_Th¸ringen": 70,
"Austria": 30,

"sample": "Custom:mr_g",
"fit": 2.3108,
"GER_Th¸ringen": 74.17,
"Austria": 16.67,
"Tajik_Yagnobi": 9.17,


My real ancestry, again Tajik helps:

"sample": "Custom:mr_g",
"fit": 2.3656,
"Hungary": 54.17,
"GER_Rheinland-Pfalz": 45.83,

"sample": "Custom:mr_g",
"fit": 2.294,
"Hungary": 46.67,
"GER_Rheinland-Pfalz": 45.83,
"Tajik_Yagnobi": 7.5,

[Coastal Elite]

Alright man, let's both nerd out together here :) Your results are very interesting, and I see the program splits your known ancestry correctly at 50%, so that's reassuring. But I can confirm that my fit is better with my known ancestry vs. my top two populations.

Using my top two pops, Tajik helps:

"sample": "Custom:mr_g",
"fit": 2.4467,
"GER_Th¸ringen": 70,
"Austria": 30,

"sample": "Custom:mr_g",
"fit": 2.3108,
"GER_Th¸ringen": 74.17,
"Austria": 16.67,
"Tajik_Yagnobi": 9.17,


My real ancestry, again Tajik helps:

"sample": "Custom:mr_g",
"fit": 2.3656,
"Hungary": 54.17,
"GER_Rheinland-Pfalz": 45.83,

"sample": "Custom:mr_g",
"fit": 2.294,
"Hungary": 46.67,
"GER_Rheinland-Pfalz": 45.83,
"Tajik_Yagnobi": 7.5,

Very cool. Are GER_Th¸ringen and GER_Rheinland-Pfalz the closest German populations for you?

[Luke35]

Very cool. Are GER_Th¸ringen and GER_Rheinland-Pfalz the closest German populations for you?

GER_Th¸ringen is my closest after Austria, according to Lukasz's report. GER_Rheinland-Pfalz is in my top 10 populations, but I picked it because my mom is very west shifted.

*Edit

I just pulled up my mom's LM Genetics report, her first 2 populations are FR_West and FR_Brittany. Lemme plug one of those in with Hungary and see what happens..

[Luke35]

Yup, that helps, closest fit I have gotten so far..

"sample": "Custom:mr_g",
"fit": 2.1994,
"Hungary": 52.5,
"FR_West": 40.83,
"Tajik_Yagnobi": 6.67,

[Coastal Elite]

GER_Th¸ringen is my closest after Austria, according to Lukasz's report. GER_Rheinland-Pfalz is in my top 10 populations, but I picked it because my mom is very west shifted.

*Edit

I just pulled up my mom's LM Genetics report, her first 2 populations are FR_West and FR_Brittany. Lemme plug one of those in with Hungary and see what happens..

Ahhh..maybe more east shifted? How close are you to Prussian? I was thinking that might be close to you but maybe I'm way off

[Luke35]

Ahhh..maybe more east shifted? How close are you to Prussian? I was thinking that might be close to you but maybe I'm way off

Nope, I'm too south shifted :laugh:

"sample": "Custom:mr_g",
"fit": 2.7945,
"Hungary": 100,
"GER_West_Prussia": 0,

[Coastal Elite]

Nope, I'm too south shifted :laugh:

"sample": "Custom:mr_g",
"fit": 2.7945,
"Hungary": 100,
"GER_West_Prussia": 0,

So they are more Slavic and probably no Balkan influence like you have? I'm assuming that is the difference

[Luke35]

Ahhh..maybe more east shifted? How close are you to Prussian? I was thinking that might be close to you but maybe I'm way off

And surprise, surprise the algorithm preferred Croatian over Hungary, when paired with my mom's top population.

"fit": 2.1577,
"FR_West": 46.67,
"Croatia": 45.83,
"Tajik_Yagnobi": 7.5,
"Hungary": 0,

[JamesBond007]

Eurogenes K36 (Lukasz PCA) nMonte Runner

Cool thanks for the information I just emailed Lukasz for my k36 coordinates for here :

http://185.144.156.77:3000/eurogenesK36pca.html

[JamesBond007]

I'd like opinions on this please .

I took the first 10 populations I have in the correlational and euclidean parts of my K36 ancestry report. The result was this


sample": "Custom:Tim",
"fit": 3.5178,
"Norway_west": 100,
"Iceland": 0,
"Ireland": 0,
"NE_England": 0,
"NL_Groningen": 0,
"NL_Utrecht": 0,
"Northern_Ireland": 0,
"Orkney": 0,
"Scotland": 0,
"Wales": 0,

Whether pen was on or off it was the same.

Well, it was experimental about a year ago from what I know. I am not sure if it ever got past the experimental stage.

[Luke35]

So they are more Slavic and probably no Balkan influence like you have? I'm assuming that is the difference

Yes, the Slavic element I have seems to be much better aligned with South Slavic states.

Is there any way that you can get either of your parents to take a DNA test? It wasn't too hard to convince my mom to do it, but if I want her to do 23andMe too, I will probably have to buy it for her. I'm considering doing that due to the phasing feature they offer..

[Coastal Elite]

Yes, the Slavic element I have seems to be much better aligned with South Slavic states.

Is there any way that you can get either of your parents to take a DNA test? It wasn't too hard to convince my mom to do it, but if I want her to do 23andMe too, I will probably have to buy it for her. I'm considering doing that due to the phasing feature they offer..

lol..good question. Only one of my siblings and some uncles and first cousins have taken it. I have another sister who received one as a gift but doesn't really care about genetic testing so I might have my dad use it instead. I need to bug him to do it. I don't see a point in my mom taking it since I've seen the results of some uncles although the results may differ a bit.

[Luke35]

lol..good question. Only one of my siblings and some uncles and first cousins have taken it. I have another sister who received one as a gift but doesn't really care about genetic testing so I might have my dad use it instead. I need to bug him to do it. I don't see a point in my mom taking it since I've seen the results of some uncles although the results may differ a bit.

Of course, you just need your dad's, really. Well, if you need some extra support in convincing him to take it, I am happy to write him an impassioned note - I'm serious.

What is the extra kit, a 23andMe?

[Coastal Elite]

Of course, you just need your dad's, really. Well, if you need some extra support in convincing him to take it, I am happy to write him an impassioned note - I'm serious.

What is the extra kit, a 23andMe?

AncestryDNA unfortunately but it might work better for a full Romanian

[Luke35]

AncestryDNA unfortunately but it might work better for a full Romanian

Darn, would be cool if you could phase with him on 23andMe. Be interesting to see if he scores any Germanic Europe on Ancestry.

And his data would be great to have on GEDmatch and G25, I'm crossing my fingers for you.

[Coastal Elite]

Darn, would be cool if you could phase with him on 23andMe. Be interesting to see if he scores any Germanic Europe on Ancestry.

And his data would be great to have on GEDmatch and G25, I'm crossing my fingers for you.

One take away I have with both the G25 and K36 is that I plot close to Swiss-German. Whenever that is sampled, I plot near it despite it being a pseudo ethnicity for me.

[Grace O'Malley]

I forgot about this calculator.

Just tried some populations. Will have to try and find my k36 report to see what I got on that.

"sample": "Custom:AGUser_Grace",
"fit": 2.9771,
"NE_England": 27.5,
"Norway_west": 27.5,
"Northern_Ireland": 23.33,
"NL_Utrecht": 11.67,
"FR_West": 10,
"Finnish_Swede": 0,
"Iceland": 0,
"Ireland": 0,
"NW_England": 0,
"Norway_Hedmark": 0,
"Orkney": 0,
"Scotland": 0,
"Wales": 0,

[Lucas]

Guys can you ask Poi on Anthrogenica to have a look on my last emails. I sent to him updated spreadsheet few times but no response. There are many new pops added.

[Grace O'Malley]

Guys can you ask Poi on Anthrogenica to have a look on my last emails. I sent to him updated spreadsheet few times but no response. There are many new pops added.

I'm not sure what is happening there. He hasn't updated the G25 Runner either and I haven't seen him post in a while.

[firemonkey]

I forgot about this calculator.

Just tried some populations. Will have to try and find my k36 report to see what I got on that.

"sample": "Custom:AGUser_Grace",
"fit": 2.9771,
"NE_England": 27.5,
"Norway_west": 27.5,
"Northern_Ireland": 23.33,
"NL_Utrecht": 11.67,
"FR_West": 10,
"Finnish_Swede": 0,
"Iceland": 0,
"Ireland": 0,
"NW_England": 0,
"Norway_Hedmark": 0,
"Orkney": 0,
"Scotland": 0,
"Wales": 0,

Using that

"sample": "Custom:Tim",
"fit": 3.4647,
"Norway_west": 65.8,
"NW_England": 18.2,
"Finnish_Swede": 8.6,
"FR_West": 7.4,
"Iceland": 0,
"Ireland": 0,
"NE_England": 0,
"NL_Utrecht": 0,
"Northern_Ireland": 0,
"Norway_Hedmark": 0,
"Orkney": 0,
"Scotland": 0,
"Wales": 0,

[andre]

Someone could run me please?
Andrei_scaled,0.122929,0.137096,0.039598,0.005168, 0.028313,-0.000558,0.008695,0.004846,-0.004295,0.00656,-0.001137,-0.002398,0.00669,0.018992,-0.018594,-0.011933,-0.011474,0.010008,0.00817,-0.012881,-0.00574,-0.000124,0.002958,-0.002048,-0.001916

[firemonkey]

Guys can you ask Poi on Anthrogenica to have a look on my last emails. I sent to him updated spreadsheet few times but no response. There are many new pops added.


Recently you gave me updated coordinates , for which much thanks. If new coordinates have been given and yet the spreadsheet Poi uses hasn't been updated could this result in faulty results with the runner ?

[firemonkey]

Lukasz nMonte for me





population breakdown estimated %
NL_Groningen 30.4
Northern_Ireland 30.4
Ireland 25.6
Iceland 9.8
Norway_central 1.8
Norway_south-east 1.2
Norway_north 0.4
Chechens 0.2
Orkney 0.2


Without Dutch and Iceland
Northern_Ireland 50.8
Ireland 14.8
Norway_south-east 11.6
Scotland 8.4
Norway_central 7.2
SV_Skane 2.6
SV_Svealand 1.4
SV_Gotaland 1.2
Norway_Hedmark 0.4
Norway_north 0.4
Norway_west 0.4
SV_Norrland 0.4
Chechens 0.2
Orkney 0.2

Without Northern Ireland 33.4
Scotland 33.4
Ireland 31.8
Norway_south-east 9
Norway_central 6
SV_Skane 5.8
Orkney 3.8
Yorkshire&Humber 2.8
SW_England 1.8
SV_Gotaland 1.4
Norway_Hedmark 1.2
NE_England 0.8
Norway_north 0.8
Norway_west 0.8
SV_Svealand 0.6


Without Scandinavian

Scotland 37.2
Ireland 24.4
Orkney 16.2
Niedersachsen 10.4
Yorkshire&Humber 6.4
Schleswig-Holstein 4.0
Estonia_NW 0.4
Saami_Finland 0.4
NE_England 0.2
South-West_Finns 0.2
SW_England 0.2


Without Northern German

Scotland 54.6
Orkney 21.8
Yorkshire&Humber 13
Ireland 8.8
NE_England 0.6
Saami_Finland 0.4
Estonia_NW 0.2
Estonia_SC 0.2
RU_North_Dvina 0.2
Vepsians 02

[firemonkey]

Result with previous coordinates I was given in September.




"sample": "Custom:Firemonkey",
"fit": 1.0287,
"Wales": 38.6,
"NL_Groningen": 24.4,
"Northern_Ireland": 21.2,
"NL_Friesland": 5.8,
"NE_England": 4.8,
"Norway_south-east": 4.2,
"Norway_north": 1,

As you can see the distance is much smaller .

[Lucas]

Recently you gave me updated coordinates , for which much thanks. If new coordinates have been given and yet the spreadsheet Poi uses hasn't been updated could this result in faulty results with the runner ?

Still I hope Poi will update... Can you send him PM on Anthrogenica? I sent him few emails from two different accounts (on Septmeber and October). Certainly he received.

[firemonkey]

I've just sent him a PM.

[JamesBond007]

Result with previous coordinates I was given in September.




"sample": "Custom:Firemonkey",
"fit": 1.0287,
"Wales": 38.6,
"NL_Groningen": 24.4,
"Northern_Ireland": 21.2,
"NL_Friesland": 5.8,
"NE_England": 4.8,
"Norway_south-east": 4.2,
"Norway_north": 1,

As you can see the distance is much smaller .

Lukasz sent me my k36 coordinates today. I only have access to the free version of poi so it seems I am limited to 4 populations :

[
{
"sample": "Custom:Kevin",
"fit": 3.9587,
"NL_Groningen": 54.17,
"Wales": 45.83,
"NL_Friesland": 0,
"Northern_Ireland": 0,

"closestDistances": [
"NL_Groningen:average: 4.064141",
"Wales:average: 4.102017",
"NL_Friesland:average: 4.228344",
"Northern_Ireland:average: 4.301929"
]
}

[JamesBond007]

[
{
"sample": "Custom:Kevin",
"fit": 3.7689,
"Norway_Hedmark": 31.67,
"Orkney": 23.33,
"NL_Gelderland": 22.5,
"West_Scottish": 22.5,

"closestDistances": [
"Orkney:average: 4.007512",
"NL_Gelderland:average: 4.056859",
"West_Scottish:average: 4.135735",
"Norway_Hedmark:average: 4.433231"
]
}
]

[JamesBond007]

I am having trouble getting it under a 3 fit :

[
{
"sample": "Custom:Kevin",
"fit": 3.6255
"FR_North-East": 35,
"Norway_Hedmark": 29.17,
"West_Scottish": 24.17,
"GER_West_Prussia": 11.67,

"closestDistances": [
"West_Scottish:average: 4.135735",
"FR_North-East:average: 4.27.8578",
"Norway_Hedmark:average: 4.433231",
"GER_West_Prussia:average: 4.863782"
]
}
]

[JamesBond007]

[
{
"sample": "Custom:Kevin",
"fit": 3.5522,
"GER_Rheinland-Pfalz": 55,
"Norway_Hedmark": 35,
"GER_Niedersachsen": 5,
"West_Scottish": 5,

"closestDistances": [
"GER_Rheinland-Pfalz:average: 3.973669",
"GER_Niedersachsen:average: 3.988580",
"West_Scottish:average: 4.135735",
"Norway_Hedmark:average: 4.433231"
]
}
]

[firemonkey]

I am having trouble getting it under a 3 fit :

[
{
"sample": "Custom:Kevin",
"fit": 3.6255
"FR_North-East": 35,
"Norway_Hedmark": 29.17,
"West_Scottish": 24.17,
"GER_West_Prussia": 11.67,

"closestDistances": [
"West_Scottish:average: 4.135735",
"FR_North-East:average: 4.27.8578",
"Norway_Hedmark:average: 4.433231",
"GER_West_Prussia:average: 4.863782"
]
}
]


I've had the same problem . Using my previous coordinates I could get it to the low 1s , but can't now get it below 3.

[Lucas]

I've had the same problem . Using my previous coordinates I could get it to the low 1s , but can't now get it below 3.

I made coordinates using new spreadsheet. This is the reason. Still waiting for Poi's update...