A Passage to India: From Aryans to Empire

[The Lawspeaker]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6WxtDribi7I

India is the only country left with a living Indo-European religious tradition. In this documentary I look at some ancient Hindu temples around Mysore, Chamundeshwari and others at Talakadu, all associated with the cursed Wodeyar dynasty. Then I head to the Nilgiri hills where my family used to live in the days of the British Raj. I visit the Ooty club in Udagamandalam of which my relative Cecil Ralph Townsend Congreve was once a member. I interview a member of the Toda tribe who practices a Dravidian form of buffalo worship. Finally I take a train to the tea planter's town of Coonoor where my ancestor Norman Rowsell died. This is a sequel to "A British History of Ceylon Tea" and again I am looking both at the native culture and also the legacy of the British Empire.

[Kamal900]

The Indo-Aryans were a mixture between local Central Asiatic natives that were very closely genetically related to the ancient neolithic Iranian farmers and the migrants from the steppes of Eastern Europe who also had CHG(Caucasian Hunter Gatherer) admixture in them as well.
https://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?304956-Steppe-migration-to-India-was-between-3500-4000-years-ago-David-Reich

A large bulk of the today's Indians and Pakistani DNA is from the ancient peoples of the Indus Valley Civilization - one of the earliest civilizations on earth.
http://cdn.sci-news.com/images/enlarge/image_1705_1e-Harappa.jpg
https://miro.medium.com/max/1600/1*68T2gZHbtvFw-eDBSyZP0g.jpeg
https://www.harappa.com/sites/default/files/question/indus-life.jpg

They had very close relations with the ancient Sumerians and the peoples of the Persian gulf in the UAE, Oman, Bahrain which was the center of the ancient Dilmun civilization of Arabia. The middle east had and still had close relations with the Indian subcontinent and etc. Now, today's Indo-Aryan peoples are over 1.3 billion people making them the largest Indo-European meta-ethnic group in the world, Bengalis are the 3rd largest ethnic group in the world behind Arabs and Han Chinese, and they're pretty diverse bunch, both genetically and culturally. Garhwali people of Northern India for example:
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1c/Anushka_Sharma_2014.jpg
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/64/Manasvi.jpg/800px-Manasvi.jpg
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/84/Urvashi_Rautela_at_the_special_screening_of_film_% 27Queen%27.jpg
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/80/Anukriti_Gusain_2014.jpg

Kashmiri people:
https://imagevars.gulfnews.com/2018/2/5/1_16a08491e7b.2168917_614541999_16a08491e7b_large. jpg
https://qph.fs.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-217dc62a19b1aab956ae313d126f8940.webp

Bengali people:
https://www.whatsuplife.in/kolkata/blog/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/bengali-fi.jpg
https://i.pinimg.com/originals/cd/7a/f5/cd7af5f196c4e70bc99e38a431e2976f.jpg

Punjabis:
https://img.etimg.com/photo/53023760/kishore.jpg
https://live.staticflickr.com/171/405680401_c5b2410a7c_b.jpg

These are just a few examples out of many Indo-Aryan ethnic groups.

[lameduck]

The Indo-Aryans were a mixture between local Central Asiatic natives that were very closely genetically related to the ancient neolithic Iranian farmers and the migrants from the steppes of Eastern Europe who also had CHG(Caucasian Hunter Gatherer) admixture in them as well.
https://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?304956-Steppe-migration-to-India-was-between-3500-4000-years-ago-David-Reich

A large bulk of the today's Indians and Pakistani DNA is from the ancient peoples of the Indus Valley Civilization - one of the earliest civilizations on earth.
http://cdn.sci-news.com/images/enlarge/image_1705_1e-Harappa.jpg
https://miro.medium.com/max/1600/1*68T2gZHbtvFw-eDBSyZP0g.jpeg
https://www.harappa.com/sites/default/files/question/indus-life.jpg

They had very close relations with the ancient Sumerians and the peoples of the Persian gulf in the UAE, Oman, Bahrain which was the center of the ancient Dilmun civilization of Arabia. The middle east had and still had close relations with the Indian subcontinent and etc. Now, today's Indo-Aryan peoples are over 1.3 billion people making them the largest Indo-European meta-ethnic group in the world, Bengalis are the 3rd largest ethnic group in the world behind Arabs and Han Chinese, and they're pretty diverse bunch, both genetically and culturally. Garhwali people of Northern India for example:
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1c/Anushka_Sharma_2014.jpg
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/64/Manasvi.jpg/800px-Manasvi.jpg
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/84/Urvashi_Rautela_at_the_special_screening_of_film_% 27Queen%27.jpg
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/80/Anukriti_Gusain_2014.jpg

Kashmiri people:
https://imagevars.gulfnews.com/2018/2/5/1_16a08491e7b.2168917_614541999_16a08491e7b_large. jpg
https://qph.fs.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-217dc62a19b1aab956ae313d126f8940.webp

Bengali people:
https://www.whatsuplife.in/kolkata/blog/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/bengali-fi.jpg
https://i.pinimg.com/originals/cd/7a/f5/cd7af5f196c4e70bc99e38a431e2976f.jpg

Punjabis:
https://img.etimg.com/photo/53023760/kishore.jpg
https://live.staticflickr.com/171/405680401_c5b2410a7c_b.jpg

These are just a few examples out of many Indo-Aryan ethnic groups.

these indo aryan Indians you have posted look racially similar to middle esterners to me , they are just local indid variation of middle eastern phenos.

[hussein khan]

The Indo-Aryans were a mixture between local Central Asiatic natives that were very closely genetically related to the ancient neolithic Iranian farmers and the migrants from the steppes of Eastern Europe who also had CHG(Caucasian Hunter Gatherer) admixture in them as well.
https://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?304956-Steppe-migration-to-India-was-between-3500-4000-years-ago-David-Reich

A large bulk of the today's Indians and Pakistani DNA is from the ancient peoples of the Indus Valley Civilization - one of the earliest civilizations on earth.
http://cdn.sci-news.com/images/enlarge/image_1705_1e-Harappa.jpg
https://miro.medium.com/max/1600/1*68T2gZHbtvFw-eDBSyZP0g.jpeg
https://www.harappa.com/sites/default/files/question/indus-life.jpg

They had very close relations with the ancient Sumerians and the peoples of the Persian gulf in the UAE, Oman, Bahrain which was the center of the ancient Dilmun civilization of Arabia. The middle east had and still had close relations with the Indian subcontinent and etc. Now, today's Indo-Aryan peoples are over 1.3 billion people making them the largest Indo-European meta-ethnic group in the world, Bengalis are the 3rd largest ethnic group in the world behind Arabs and Han Chinese, and they're pretty diverse bunch, both genetically and culturally. Garhwali people of Northern India for example:
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1c/Anushka_Sharma_2014.jpg
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/64/Manasvi.jpg/800px-Manasvi.jpg
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/84/Urvashi_Rautela_at_the_special_screening_of_film_% 27Queen%27.jpg
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/80/Anukriti_Gusain_2014.jpg

Kashmiri people:
https://imagevars.gulfnews.com/2018/2/5/1_16a08491e7b.2168917_614541999_16a08491e7b_large. jpg
https://qph.fs.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-217dc62a19b1aab956ae313d126f8940.webp

Bengali people:
https://www.whatsuplife.in/kolkata/blog/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/bengali-fi.jpg
https://i.pinimg.com/originals/cd/7a/f5/cd7af5f196c4e70bc99e38a431e2976f.jpg

Punjabis:
https://img.etimg.com/photo/53023760/kishore.jpg
https://live.staticflickr.com/171/405680401_c5b2410a7c_b.jpg

These are just a few examples out of many Indo-Aryan ethnic groups.

https://imagevars.gulfnews.com/2018/2/5/1_16a08491e7b.2168917_614541999_16a08491e7b_large. jpg

Are these actually kashmiris? 1/2 of them or more can easily pass better in AFG than subcontinent

[Kamal900]

https://imagevars.gulfnews.com/2018/2/5/1_16a08491e7b.2168917_614541999_16a08491e7b_large. jpg

Are these actually kashmiris? 1/2 of them or more can easily pass better in AFG than subcontinent

Well, these pictures were from Google images and Wikipedia, so..

[Kamal900]

these indo aryan Indians you have posted look racially similar to middle esterners to me , they are just local indid variation of middle eastern phenos.

With the exception of Bengalis, yeah, they do since they do have genetic affinity with the middle east way before the foundation of IVC.

[lameduck]

With the exception of Bengalis, yeah, they do since they do have genetic affinity with the middle east way before the foundation of IVC.

no wonder lots of indians get targeted in the west for looking arab/Mena post 9/11.

[Kamal900]

no wonder lots of indians get targeted in the west for looking arab/Mena post 9/11.

Well, it's due to orientalist western imperialism that gives this image that basically all brown peoples of west, central and south Asia are the same, especially by Americans since they're extremely ignorant about us and others. Not to mention that Afghans and Pakistanis are Muslims.

[lameduck]

Well, it's due to orientalist western imperialism that gives this image that basically all brown peoples of west, central and south Asia are the same, especially by Americans since they're extremely ignorant about us and others. Not to mention that Afghans and Pakistanis are Muslims.

yeah Pakistan and Afghanistan are seen as legit middle eastern countires by many westerners , but now they are getting more specific and creating other special categories for Pakistan and Afghanistan.

[Kamal900]

yeah Pakistan and Afghanistan are seen as legit middle eastern countires by many westerners , but now they are getting more specific and creating other special categories for Pakistan and Afghanistan.

In the US census, Pakistanis and Afghans are regarded as Asian Americans while us Middle Easterners are regarded as Whites which is fucked up really.

[Thambi]

In the US census, Pakistanis and Afghans are regarded as Asian Americans while us Middle Easterners are regarded as Whites which is fucked up really.

Afghans are white under US Census but yeah pakistanis are asians. These racial divisions are hilarious.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a6/UScensus_on_racial_definitions.png

[Kamal900]

Afghans are white under US Census but yeah pakistanis are asians. These racial divisions are hilarious.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a6/UScensus_on_racial_definitions.png

I know, right? Why don't they put us as Asians as well?

[The Lawspeaker]

Afghans are white under US Census but yeah pakistanis are asians. These racial divisions are hilarious.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a6/UScensus_on_racial_definitions.png

They don't make any sense: they should use MENA for North Africa, Turkey and the Middle East up to Afghanistan. Australia, New Zealand, Spain and Portugal are white countries and so, for the most part, are Argentina and Uruguay. The indigenous groups in Australia, New Zealand and in Argentina and Uruguay is so small that they could be in their own category.

[Kamal900]

They don't make any sense: they should use MENA for North Africa, Turkey and the Middle East up to Afghanistan. Australia, New Zealand, Spain and Portugal are white countries and so, for the most part, are Argentina and Uruguay. The indigenous groups in Australia, New Zealand and in Argentina and Uruguay is so small that they could be in their own category.

I wouldn't count Turkey as MENA since Turks are a mish-mash of Anatolian, Turkic and European, but the rest I agree.

[lameduck]

I know, right? Why don't they put us as Asians as well?

west eurasian is closest thing to race we have uptill now that can be backed scintifically , at higher global level specially when you add east asians and SSAs etc europeans and nearesterners get very close , so it does have a scintific base that middle easterners are grouped as white.

[Trouble]

Afghans are white under US Census but yeah pakistanis are asians. These racial divisions are hilarious.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a6/UScensus_on_racial_definitions.png

Sudanis who are majority black and Kazakhs who are majority Mongoloid are both considered white on the census, man this country is a joke.

[Thambi]

Sudanis who are majority black and Kazakhs who are majority Mongoloid are both considered white on the census, man this country is a joke.

LOL was about to say. and sudan is white but spain/portugal aren't.

[Trouble]

these indo aryan Indians you have posted look racially similar to middle esterners to me , they are just local indid variation of middle eastern phenos.

I think a lot of Pakistanis look way more middle eastern than those Indians he posted. It's true there are similar features for example large bug eyes are ubiquitous among MENA and South Asians(Im an exception) as are hooked noses but I think they look distinct. Though outside South Asia those Indians may still pass better in the mideast than anywhere else, as Ive said before.

[The Lawspeaker]

This probably comes closer to the truth:

https://i.ibb.co/xX5qyF6/mapmap.png

[Trouble]

I know, right? Why don't they put us as Asians as well?

Maybe not as Asians but you guys deserve your own category. I don't think there's many Arabs or Persian who consider themselves Asian, while most Indians do(given our central location).

[lameduck]

Sudanis who are majority black and Kazakhs who are majority Mongoloid are both considered white on the census, man this country is a joke.

i think that map is wrong , according to census website its only middle east that is white , not sudan , kazakhistan

https://www.census.gov/topics/population/race/about.html

[Kamal900]

This probably comes closer to the truth:

https://i.ibb.co/xX5qyF6/mapmap.png

Much more better, lol.

[Thambi]

i think that map is wrong , according to census website its only middle east that is white , not sudan , kazakhistan

https://www.census.gov/topics/population/race/about.html

they're included in that region. they dont say central asia anywhere.

[Trouble]

Much more better, lol.

The problem is that those definitions mean nothing to the average person, who the fuck describes themselves as indic or turkic?

I'd just say central asian for Turkic(Turkey should be in the Middle East), Indic should be South Asian obviously. Sinic/SEA should just be East Asia, or split between Northeast Asia and Southeast Asia.

[Kamal900]

The problem is that those definitions mean nothing to the average person, who the fuck describes themselves as indic or turkic?

I'd just say central asian for Turkic(Turkey should be in the Middle East), Indic should be South Asian obviously. Sinic/SEA should just be East Asia, or split between Northeast Asia and Southeast Asia.

The thing is that we're taking into account the racial groups of west Asians here. In Canada, middle easterners are regarded as west Asians in the census while they're Whites in America which is absurd. Turkic peoples are heavily mixed with peoples from different continents, so it's better to use Turkic for these specific people.

[Thambi]

The problem is that those definitions mean nothing to the average person, who the fuck describes themselves as indic or turkic?

I'd just say central asian for Turkic(Turkey should be in the Middle East), Indic should be South Asian obviously. Sinic/SEA should just be East Asia, or split between Northeast Asia and Southeast Asia.

many americans surprisingly think turkey is in europe actually. It is technically speaking, at least part of it. but many assume that its a european country rather than middle eastern

[Trouble]

many americans surprisingly think turkey is in europe actually. It is technically speaking, at least part of it. but many assume that its a european country rather than middle eastern

Really? I did not know that. My impression was they just viewed Turkey as just another "goddamn ayrab" country.

A lot of Americans think Pakistan is in the middle east. Like a LOT. Also try telling them that all the "stan" countries are not Arab.

[lameduck]

Really? I did not know that. My impression was they just viewed Turkey as just another "goddamn ayrab" country.

A lot of Americans think Pakistan is in the middle east. Like a LOT. Also try telling them that all the "stan" countries are not Arab.

Pakistan is second largest muslim country in the world and close ally of west , so it is used quite often to represent muslims in media , and for outsiders muslim=middle east.

e.g they often time use Pakistani characters to show issues of muslim youth trying to bridge between conservative background and western ideals.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4aS-qGHH6E0


or kamala khan

[Thambi]

Really? I did not know that. My impression was they just viewed Turkey as just another "goddamn ayrab" country.

A lot of Americans think Pakistan is in the middle east. Like a LOT. Also try telling them that all the "stan" countries are not Arab.

turkish people arent heavily muslim compared to other countries in the region and with their appearance they look even more euro. yeah they think all -stan countries are ayrab, hence the reason for pakistan being a middle eastern country in the US. I bet when americans see people from kazakhstan, they'll realize how ignorant they are lol.

Turkey however many think is a euro country, and many are aware of constantinople/istanbul, etc.

[tipirneni]

turkish people arent heavily muslim compared to other countries in the region and with their appearance they look even more euro. yeah they think all -stan countries are ayrab, hence the reason for pakistan being a middle eastern country in the US. I bet when americans see people from kazakhstan, they'll realize how ignorant they are lol.

Turkey however many think is a euro country, and many are aware of constantinople/istanbul, etc.

Even parts of South India looks very euro. Have you been to Vinayak Nagar colony in Mylapore recently ?

[Thambi]

Even parts of South India looks very euro. Have you been to Vinayak Nagar colony in Mylapore recently ?

is that pondicherry area with french admix? I've been to chennai area once when i was a kid and i dont remember the phenos much. but from videos i've seen from there, most people look melanid/GI.

and I'm telugu btw, not tamil bro. I'm more familiar with hyd/telangana than TN.

[FinalFlash]

This probably comes closer to the truth:

https://i.ibb.co/xX5qyF6/mapmap.png

From Mauritania to Afghanistan? This map is actually worse lol