Z93/Y57/Y52 in England.

[TribalSky]

Hello
Are there any more Western Europeans with this Haplogroup? Its quite rare in England.
I'm English and my Y Haplo is - R-Z93> R-Z94>R-Z2124>R-Z2122>R-Y57>Y52 (Im waiting on YSEQ so I can view my next clade but its likely to be Y2631+ or YP1269+)
The main assumed theory is that this presence in England is due to the Sarmatian Iazyges tribe who were sent there in c174AD by Marcus Aurelius. After their 20 year service as cavalry, they were not permitted to leave so stayed in England.
This Haplo has been found in Sarmatian/Scythian kurgans and its rare presence in Iberia seems to be through some Sarmatian/Scythian mixture with the Visigoths.

[xripkan]

It is definitely from a Sarmatian or Scythian tribe. Its distribution across Europe and the fact that it has been found in a Sarmatian in Eastern Europe indicate that. This clade is quite similar to mine (R-YP4768). I think these two could be the main clades the Sarmato-Alan tribes brought in Europe.

[Artek]

Some are Scytho-Sarmatian but some are also Alanic in origins.

There was a lot of movement from France to England up to XVth century and some descendants of Alans could have migrated with other French who descend mostly from Gaulo-Frankish lines.

[TribalSky]

I can see that some Alans migrated alongside Germanic tribes and settled in Gaul and some went to Iberia with the Goths or went there freely after the Vandals. A lot of Alans had haplo G, whereas Z94 seems to be more common amongst Sarmatians and West Scythians.
I'd say its most likely that anyone who has Z94 in France/Iberia is a descendant of Alani who went there with the Goths or Independently and any English people who have the downclade of Z93>Z94>Y57/Y52 most likely descend from the 5,500 Sarmatian troops.
Either way this is an Iranic Steppe clade so its going to be Scythian Steppe in origin anyway. There is a Z94 recorded in China as well which must have some connection with the Yancai who were Alanic/Scythian in origin.

[Annihilus]

Nice haplo bro:thumb001:

[Leto]

Hello
Are there any more Western Europeans with this Haplogroup? Its quite rare in England.
I'm English and my Y Haplo is - R-Z93> R-Z94>R-Z2124>R-Z2122>R-Y57>Y52 (Im waiting on YSEQ so I can view my next clade but its likely to be Y2631+ or YP1269+)
The main assumed theory is that this presence in England is due to the Sarmatian Iazyges tribe who were sent there in c174AD by Marcus Aurelius. After their 20 year service as cavalry, they were not permitted to leave so stayed in England.
This Haplo has been found in Sarmatian/Scythian kurgans and its rare presence in Iberia seems to be through some Sarmatian/Scythian mixture with the Visigoths.
Very Indo-European, you're a lucky one 'cause that's unique in Western Europe (or in Europe at large for that matter). Is your autosomal result totally typical for England? I'd like to see your Gedmatch.

[Teutonski]

I am Z58

[xripkan]

Very Indo-European, you're a lucky one 'cause that's unique in Western Europe (or in Europe at large for that matter). Is your autosomal result totally typical for England? I'd like to see your Gedmatch.

R-Z93 arrived in Britain during Roman era and those that brought have been assimilated by the locals many centuries ago. So I don't think his haplogroup makes him autosomally different than a typical British.

[Leto]

R-Z93 arrived in Britain during Roman era and those that brought have been assimilated by the locals many centuries ago. So I don't think his haplogroup makes him autosomally different than a typical British.
And what if that's from a recent Anglo-Indian ancestor? :lol:

[xripkan]

And what if that's from a recent Anglo-Indian ancestor? :lol:

R-Y52 has mostly a European distribution (England, Germany, Switzerland). Indian R-Z93 clades are very different. This clade has been found to a sarmatian of Eastern Europe. It is probably connected to ancient European Scytho-Sarmatian tribes.

[Leto]

R-Y52 has mostly a European distribution (England, Germany, Switzerland). Indian R-Z93 clades are very different. This clade has been found to a sarmatian of Eastern Europe. It is probably connected to ancient European Scytho-Sarmatian tribes.
I know, just joking. I consider that ancient white heritage of course, pretty cool to me.

[TribalSky]

Hello
Which gedmatch calculator is most accurate? There are alot of different eurogenes ones.

My subclade of Y52 is YP1269/1270. So far a English and Swiss person have this. The Alans also settled near Savoy so this can explain that. The distribution of Y52 in Europe does fit with the Scytho-Sarmatians, not to mention that in Sarmatian burial kurgans near Rostov they found a number of males with Y52. As Xripkan has said and what archeological/Genetic studies have shown us that z93 especially the clades of y52 were mainly in Scythians and Sarmatians.

[Leto]

Hello
Which gedmatch calculator is most accurate? There are alot of different eurogenes ones.

Hi,
K13 and K15 are the most popular ones.

[TribalSky]

My K13 is -

Population
North_Atlantic 49.29 Pct
Baltic 23.58 Pct
West_Med 14.41 Pct
West_Asian 3.13 Pct
East_Med 6.01 Pct
Red_Sea 0.65 Pct
South_Asian 1.35 Pct
East_Asian 1.08 Pct
Siberian 0
Amerindian 0
Oceanian 0.49 Pct
Northeast_African 0
Sub-Saharan 0

My K15 -

Population
North_Sea 29.97 Pct
Atlantic 31.78 Pct
Baltic 12.69 Pct
Eastern_Euro 7.89 Pct
West_Med 9.77 Pct
West_Asian 1.74 Pct
East_Med 3.95 Pct
Red_Sea 0
South_Asian 1.21 Pct
Southeast_Asian 0.66 Pct
Siberian 0
Amerindian 0
Oceanian 0.34 Pct
Northeast_African 0
Sub-Saharan 0

I've used GedMatch before but never known which were the most accurate or useful calculators.

[Leto]

My K13 is -

Population
North_Atlantic 49.29 Pct
Baltic 23.58 Pct
West_Med 14.41 Pct
West_Asian 3.13 Pct
East_Med 6.01 Pct
Red_Sea 0.65 Pct
South_Asian 1.35 Pct
East_Asian 1.08 Pct
Siberian 0
Amerindian 0
Oceanian 0.49 Pct
Northeast_African 0
Sub-Saharan 0

My K15 -

Population
North_Sea 29.97 Pct
Atlantic 31.78 Pct
Baltic 12.69 Pct
Eastern_Euro 7.89 Pct
West_Med 9.77 Pct
West_Asian 1.74 Pct
East_Med 3.95 Pct
Red_Sea 0
South_Asian 1.21 Pct
Southeast_Asian 0.66 Pct
Siberian 0
Amerindian 0
Oceanian 0.34 Pct
Northeast_African 0
Sub-Saharan 0

I've used GedMatch before but never known which were the most accurate or useful calculators.
I've run your values through Vahaduo nMonte, here they are:

K13
Distance to: TribalSky
2.50962149 Southeast_English
5.04324300 Southwest_English
5.13569859 Orcadian
6.19487692 North_Dutch
6.19734621 South_Dutch
6.28634234 Danish
6.77983038 West_Scottish
6.81023494 Irish
7.49188895 North_German
7.83739753 West_German
8.72856231 Norwegian
10.58567901 Swedish
11.65488739 French
14.47826647 Austrian
15.09606240 East_German
16.35763736 North_Swedish
19.38078172 Spanish_Cataluna
19.84115420 Hungarian
20.58798679 Southwest_French
20.66656478 Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon
21.00623955 Spanish_Galicia
21.19030439 Spanish_Cantabria
21.40035046 Portuguese
22.45794737 Spanish_Valencia
22.53827855 Spanish_Murcia

Target: TribalSky
Distance: 1.4332% / 1.43318249
83.4 Southeast_English
7.0 La_Brana-1
6.4 Spanish_Aragon
3.2 Spanish_Valencia


K15
Distance to: TribalSky
6.67224850 South_Dutch
7.01979344 Southeast_English
7.45657428 Southwest_English
7.87565235 North_German
8.00864533 Irish
9.10421331 West_Scottish
9.48632173 Danish
10.13328673 North_Dutch
10.78420141 French
11.77501592 Orcadian
11.83330047 West_German
13.63282803 East_German
14.16394366 Norwegian
14.84928618 Swedish
15.70332449 West_Norwegian
15.98684146 Austrian
16.61765627 North_Swedish
16.73519346 Spanish_Cataluna
18.02157596 Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon
18.27006568 Southwest_Finnish
18.44174341 Spanish_Galicia
18.74933866 Hungarian
19.02681003 Portuguese
19.14352632 Southwest_French
19.42942356 Spanish_Cantabria

Target: TribalSky
Distance: 2.2259% / 2.22590746
63.4 Irish
16.8 French_Basque
6.4 Lithuanian
6.2 La_Brana-1
5.0 Spanish_Valencia
1.6 Lebanese_Druze
0.4 Chamar
0.2 Yemenite_Jewish

On K13 you are very English.

Post Dodecad K12b please.

[TribalSky]

My Dodecad K12b -

Population
Gedrosia 9.27 Pct
Siberian 0
Northwest_African 1.12 Pct
Southeast_Asian 0
Atlantic_Med 37.26 Pct
North_European 43.90 Pct
South_Asian 0.17 Pct
East_African 0
Southwest_Asian 0.24 Pct
East_Asian 0.33 Pct
Caucasus 7.68 Pct
Sub_Saharan 0

My mothers side are all from East Anglia as far back as I've got with records (1600s) so I expect that side to be majorly Anglo-Saxon or Danish/Scand and my fathers side are all from the East and West Midlands with 2 lines from Ireland and maybe a Belgian or Northern French line with the surname 'Debrix' in the mid/late 1700s. I also have lines on my fathers side to Edward II of England, Thomas of Brotherton and Henry, 3rd Earl of Lancaster.