Turkic Presence among Attila's Huns

[Kaspias]

Source: https://www.pnas.org/content/115/13/3494

https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Saioa_Lopez3/publication/323712637/figure/fig1/AS:614076518506515@1523418659885/A-Investigated-skulls-with-strong-Left-AED-1108-intermediate-Middle-STR-220-and.png

(A) Investigated skulls with strong (Left, AED_1108) intermediate, (Middle, STR_220), and no (Right, AED_92) skull deformation. (B) Location of archaeological sites from which genomes were analyzed (n = 41) on a map of Europe with today's borders of Germany and the former borders of the western (green) and the eastern (light brown) Roman Empire. Bavarian sample sites (black square) are shown in the Inset. Sites in detail (number of deformed/nondeformed skulls): Altenerding (3/7), Alteglofsheim (1/0), Altheim (0/4), Barbing-Irlmauth (1/1), Burgweinting (1/1), and Straubing (3/9). Five additional individuals from Straubing were defined as intermediate. In addition, reference sites are given with which the Bavarian, Medieval genome data were compared: FN_2 (Freiham near Munich, ∼300 AD), deformed skull VIM_2 (Viminacium in Serbia, ∼550 AD), deformed skull KER_1 (Kerch on the Crimea, 256-401 cal AD), and two Sarmatians PR_4 and PR_10 (Pokrovka in southern Russia, 5th-2nd century BC).

Blue is normal skulls, green is intermediate, and red is elongated.
VIM_2 is the Gepid sample, who is also half Hun.

https://i.imgur.com/NlyjY7W.png


https://i.ibb.co/ZGn5g2d/Ads-z.png
https://i.ibb.co/rs7MFKn/0-25x.png
https://i.ibb.co/9hQ5Thj/0-5.png

https://i.ibb.co/zQK24Ky/dist.png
https://i.ibb.co/4fjfC1V/025an.png
https://i.ibb.co/0VJSchK/05an.png
https://i.ibb.co/t82cGgj/1x.png

[Kaspias]

K36 Map:

https://i.ibb.co/bXc3cdN/avg1.png
https://i.ibb.co/Tw2cy2y/avg2.png

[Aileron]

Atilla was a Turk, its a well known fact so no surprising

[SharpFork]

This doesn't really show anything by itself, late Sarmatians were similar to many Turkic groups as well, rather the Turkic names among Huns show some Turkic presence, but not Common Turkic AFAIK so at this point I don't even see the kinship between them and Turks coming from the Celestial Turks.

[Kamal900]

This doesn't really show anything by itself, late Sarmatians were similar to many Turkic groups as well, rather the Turkic names among Huns show some Turkic presence, but not Common Turkic AFAIK so at this point I don't even see the kinship between them and Turks coming from the Celestial Turks.

Turkic peoples of the Volga region are obviously NOT 100% Turkic genetically or whatever. In fact, Turkic peoples are far from homogenous since they mixed and assmilated a lot of people into their fold not much different from the Huns really. The name, Atila, is far more closer to Turkic than to any language family today, so it's safe to assume that at least the leaders of the Hunnic dynasty were Turkic.

[Kaspias]

This doesn't really show anything by itself, late Sarmatians were similar to many Turkic groups as well, rather the Turkic names among Huns show some Turkic presence, but not Common Turkic AFAIK so at this point I don't even see the kinship between them and Turks coming from the Celestial Turks.

This sample not only shows Turkic presence by itself, but also most probably show Oghuz presence. Late Sarmatians later assimilated and absorbed, already. On the other hand, this sample has nothing to do with them as she gets Oghuz's before than any other Turkic type.

Distance to: KAZ_Hun-Sarmatian
0.03437019 KAZ_Nomad_HP
0.04633048 MNG_Hovsgol_BA_o1
0.05300693 RUS_Shamanka_N
0.05311662 RUS_Lokomotiv_N
0.06104688 KAZ_Golden_Horde_Asian
0.06303760 KGZ_Nomad_MA
0.07957570 MNG_Hovsgol_BA_low_res
0.08540570 MNG_Hovsgol_BA
0.08868076 Hun_Tian_Shan_o
0.09516278 RUS_Kurma_EBA
0.09617393 RUS_Devils_Gate_Cave_N
0.09775853 RUS_Ust_Belaya
0.09787774 RUS_Shamanka_EBA
0.10384268 RUS_Baikal_EBA
0.10657922 RUS_Ust_Ida_EBA
0.10881318 RUS_Ust_Ida_LN
0.11176964 RUS_Baikal_MA
0.11538871 RUS_Kurma_EBA_o
0.11757654 RUS_Karasuk_o
0.13367232 RUS_Yana_MA
0.14154325 MNG_Xiong_Nu_East_Asian
0.14307221 NPL_Samdzong_1500BP
0.15247899 RUS_Kolyma_Meso
0.15488742 NPL_Mebrak_2125BP
0.15592818 RUS_Magadan_BA

I can try to isolate her East Eurasian side tomorrow(or next day) to see her Asian admixture clearly.


For linguistics, to begin with, most of the names used in the elite class have Turkic etymology. Attila is Atilla, Mundzuk is Muncuk, Uldin is Uldız, Dengizik is Deniz, Eitil is İtil, İlek is the same, İlek...

These names are still using as name-surname and with their own meaning in Turkey.

[Turul Karom]

This sample not only shows Turkic presence by itself, but also most probably show Oghuz presence. Late Sarmatians later assimilated and absorbed, already. On the other hand, this sample has nothing to do with them as she gets Oghuz's before than any other Turkic type.

Distance to: KAZ_Hun-Sarmatian
0.03437019 KAZ_Nomad_HP
0.04633048 MNG_Hovsgol_BA_o1
0.05300693 RUS_Shamanka_N
0.05311662 RUS_Lokomotiv_N
0.06104688 KAZ_Golden_Horde_Asian
0.06303760 KGZ_Nomad_MA
0.07957570 MNG_Hovsgol_BA_low_res
0.08540570 MNG_Hovsgol_BA
0.08868076 Hun_Tian_Shan_o
0.09516278 RUS_Kurma_EBA
0.09617393 RUS_Devils_Gate_Cave_N
0.09775853 RUS_Ust_Belaya
0.09787774 RUS_Shamanka_EBA
0.10384268 RUS_Baikal_EBA
0.10657922 RUS_Ust_Ida_EBA
0.10881318 RUS_Ust_Ida_LN
0.11176964 RUS_Baikal_MA
0.11538871 RUS_Kurma_EBA_o
0.11757654 RUS_Karasuk_o
0.13367232 RUS_Yana_MA
0.14154325 MNG_Xiong_Nu_East_Asian
0.14307221 NPL_Samdzong_1500BP
0.15247899 RUS_Kolyma_Meso
0.15488742 NPL_Mebrak_2125BP
0.15592818 RUS_Magadan_BA

I can try to isolate her East Eurasian side tomorrow(or next day) to see her Asian admixture clearly.


For linguistics, to begin with, most of the names used in the elite class have Turkic etymology. Attila is Atilla, Mundzuk is Muncuk, Uldin is Uldız, Dengizik is Deniz, Eitil is İtil, İlek is the same, İlek...

These names are still using as name-surname and with their own meaning in Turkey.

Compare kits of Huns against kits of Hungarian conquerors from pre settlement if you can.

[SharpFork]

Turkic peoples of the Volga region are obviously NOT 100% Turkic genetically or whatever. In fact, Turkic peoples are far from homogenous since they mixed and assmilated a lot of people into their fold not much different from the Huns really. The name, Atila, is far more closer to Turkic than to any language family today, so it's safe to assume that at least the leaders of the Hunnic dynasty were Turkic.

Attila is commonly held to be a Gothic nickname.


This sample not only shows Turkic presence by itself, but also most probably show Oghuz presence. Late Sarmatians later assimilated and absorbed, already. On the other hand, this sample has nothing to do with them as she gets Oghuz's before than any other Turkic type.

So? You theorize people looking barely more like Oghuz than other nomads 1-2 centuries before the Gokturks to be undeniably Oghuz? That's going too far. We already are unsure how prevalent the overall Turkic element was, let alone the non-Oghur one.


[/QUOTE]For linguistics, to begin with, most of the names used in the elite class have Turkic etymology. Attila is Atilla, Mundzuk is Muncuk, Uldin is Uldız, Dengizik is Deniz, Eitil is İtil, İlek is the same, İlek...[/QUOTE]
Some names like Attila can be interpreted through Germanic or Sarmatian, Attila especially is far better explained through Gothic rather than any Turkic origin theory.

[Kaspias]

Attila is commonly held to be a Gothic nickname.


So? You theorize people looking barely more like Oghuz than other nomads 1-2 centuries before the Gokturks to be undeniably Oghuz? That's going too far. We already are unsure how prevalent the overall Turkic element was, let alone the non-Oghur one.


For linguistics, to begin with, most of the names used in the elite class have Turkic etymology. Attila is Atilla, Mundzuk is Muncuk, Uldin is Uldız, Dengizik is Deniz, Eitil is İtil, İlek is the same, İlek...[/QUOTE]
Some names like Attila can be interpreted through Germanic or Sarmatian, Attila especially is far better explained through Gothic rather than any Turkic origin theory.[/QUOTE]

Attila commonly may hold to be a Gothic nickname since they were historical allies and admirer of Huns. On the other hand, Turks use these names in their names and surnames for centuries. Besides, these names also have their own meaning in daily life.

Attila: Atil(İtil) = Volga River
Dengizik: Deniz = Sea
Mundzuk: Muncuk(Boncuk) = Jewel
Oktar: Oktar = Archer
Uldin: Uldız(Yıldız) = Star
Ernek: Irnek = Little Finger
... Can write here all of them. Those were not a result of research but from my daily Turkish language.



The gothic theory relies on only Grimm Brothers, also Helfen describes it as those names were pseudo names which Germanized afterward and became known in today's world with this form. Almost all of them can be traced to modern Turkish, not even proto.



So? You theorize people looking barely more like Oghuz than other nomads 1-2 centuries before the Gokturks to be undeniably Oghuz? That's going too far. We already are unsure how prevalent the overall Turkic element was, let alone the non-Oghur one.


Heartland of Oghuz was the Western-Central part of the Turkic Khaganate while capital was in Mongolia(in advance a connection between Xiongnu and Europe Huns). Moreover, Oghuzs were major Turkic power in the region after Turkic Khanate. One could expect they didn't migrate and breed, gained strength and manpower for centuries and became superpower among Turks. Considering how the people who preferred to join migration died in various wars. In this sense, it is surprising to see that a person who gets all Oghuz populations before than other Turks. Can point out two things: One is there was no huge genetical differences among all groups of Turks in that time period or Oghuzs(or ancestors of Oghuzs) were in Europe.

[Kaspias]

https://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?313596-A-closer-look-to-Huns

[Kamal900]

Attila is commonly held to be a Gothic nickname.


So? You theorize people looking barely more like Oghuz than other nomads 1-2 centuries before the Gokturks to be undeniably Oghuz? That's going too far. We already are unsure how prevalent the overall Turkic element was, let alone the non-Oghur one.


For linguistics, to begin with, most of the names used in the elite class have Turkic etymology. Attila is Atilla, Mundzuk is Muncuk, Uldin is Uldız, Dengizik is Deniz, Eitil is İtil, İlek is the same, İlek...[/QUOTE]
Some names like Attila can be interpreted through Germanic or Sarmatian, Attila especially is far better explained through Gothic rather than any Turkic origin theory.[/QUOTE]

That's because a lot of Goths got assimilated to the Hunnic confederacy. It's not Germanic or Indo-European name in general but rather very closely related to Turkic.