Genetic of France

[dududud]

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41431-020-0584-1.epdf?author_access_token=jIOmqeOV922JrQKolVvMVtR gN0jAjWel9jnR3ZoTv0N7JDduGto70lvrJ1118GWqvZDsP1gZG WLN2ldIXKg4bJyxV_WiTstcI5CiUJKh4gweWZqzh_wWxd3QbBa Lb8tL1djT75g8su49oKgniUafWg%3D%3D

[dududud]

Using aDNA data from Reich lab site, we the genetic landscape is mainly of Early Farmers ancestry (40-65%) but the Steppe Pastoralists are close (20-40%). Hunter-Gatherers'contribution is low (peak 16% in South West). North-South gradient of SP (high North) and EF (high South)

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EQbErbuXsAUAcvN?format=jpg&name=medium

[Samnium]

Haute Savoie is northern France while at the same latitude Poitou is Central France. I've always thought that strange.

[vbnetkhio]

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41431-020-0584-1.epdf?author_access_token=jIOmqeOV922JrQKolVvMVtR gN0jAjWel9jnR3ZoTv0N7JDduGto70lvrJ1118GWqvZDsP1gZG WLN2ldIXKg4bJyxV_WiTstcI5CiUJKh4gweWZqzh_wWxd3QbBa Lb8tL1djT75g8su49oKgniUafWg%3D%3D

great news. we were missing ancient samples from France.

just look at the map here.
https://umap.openstreetmap.fr/en/map/ancient-human-dna_41837#4/46.29/32.52

[dududud]

great news. we were missing ancient samples from France.

just look at the map here.
https://umap.openstreetmap.fr/en/map/ancient-human-dna_41837#4/46.29/32.52

Yeah, France dont have many sample.

[Hajimurad]

Did other european ethnicities (especially neighboring) migrated en masse to France before XIX-XXth c.? Which places they settled?

[Leto]

So the WHGs were supposedly replaced by the EEFs for the most part? Most of the HG ancestry in Europeans is from the Steppe?

[Samnium]

Did other european ethnicities (especially neighboring) migrated en masse to France before XIX-XXth c.? Which places they settled?

France stayed relatively untounched from "mass migrations", there were some spaniards that have gone in the North in the 17th century. That could explain why some results from there show modeling with spaniard populations like 90% French Nord + 10% Spaniard...

[Leto]

Basically the most Steppe-rich Frenchmen are from the Northwest. I guess Normandy, Brittany and Pays de la Loire. Don't know why Haute de France is less so.

[Samnium]

Basically the most Steppe-rich Frenchmen are from the Northwest. I guess Normandy, Brittany and Pays de la Loire. Don't know why Haute de France is less so.

Not Pays de la Loire. Pays de la Loire is Central France.

Yes Northwest Frenchmens (Normandy, Britanny) can have 70% N.Atlantic + Baltic, they are very close to Englishmen, Germans etc.

Then follow the rest of Northern France cluster that's also very close to mentionned populations a little bit south of it.

[Leto]

Not Pays de la Loire. Pays de la Loire is Central France.

Excuse me?
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/76/Pays_de_la_Loire_region_locator_map2.svg/499px-Pays_de_la_Loire_region_locator_map2.svg.png
Is this Central France to you? I'm sure at least Western and NW departments are in the NW cluster.

[Samnium]

Excuse me?
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/76/Pays_de_la_Loire_region_locator_map2.svg/499px-Pays_de_la_Loire_region_locator_map2.svg.png
Is this Central France to you? I'm sure at least Western and NW departments are in the NW cluster.

No they are in the Central French cluster oddly. The border is the "Loire" at the north of the region.

Maybe a tiny part, the northernmost would be in the NW cluster but most of the region, no.

[Leto]

No they are in the Central French cluster oddly. The border is the "Loire" at the north of the region.

Maybe a tiny part, the northernmost would be in the NW cluster but most of the region, no.
So how many French can be accepted as Northwestern Europeans? :D

[Samnium]

So how many French can be accepted as Northwestern Europeans? :D

In the paper there's a map. All those who are predominantly in blue or pink color could be possibly accepted as NW Euros, Brittons are even closer to Brits than to Central French.

[dududud]

France stayed relatively untounched from "mass migrations", there were some spaniards that have gone in the North in the 17th century. That could explain why some results from there show modeling with spaniard populations like 90% French Nord + 10% Spaniard...

My father is modeling like that and he don't have any spaniard ancestries



K13:

Using 1 population approximation:
1 Southwest_English @ 8.975968
2 Southeast_English @ 9.547073
3 French @ 10.771866
4 South_Dutch @ 10.842543
5 West_Scottish @ 11.667791
6 Orcadian @ 11.860160
7 Irish @ 12.321325
8 West_German @ 12.362424
9 North_Dutch @ 14.050799
10 Danish @ 14.492908
11 Spanish_Cataluna @ 15.000998
12 North_German @ 15.831644
13 Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon @ 16.208231
14 Spanish_Cantabria @ 16.523447
15 Southwest_French @ 16.639233
16 Norwegian @ 16.707010
17 Spanish_Aragon @ 17.254635
18 Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha @ 17.564276
19 Spanish_Murcia @ 17.639174
20 Spanish_Galicia @ 17.658463

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 61% West_Scottish + 39% Spanish_Aragon @ 4.2
2 69.1% Southwest_English + 30.9% Spanish_Aragon @ 4.47
3 59.7% Irish + 40.3% Spanish_Aragon @ 4.71
4 69.9% Southwest_English + 30.1% Spanish_Murcia @ 4.73
5 61.7% West_Scottish + 38.3% Spanish_Murcia @ 4.78
6 62% West_Scottish + 38% Spanish_Valencia @ 4.86
7 61.8% West_Scottish + 38.2% Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha @ 4.87
8 70.4% Southwest_English + 29.6% Spanish_Valencia @ 4.89
9 72.5% Southeast_English + 27.5% French_Basque @ 4.9
10 65% West_Scottish + 35% Spanish_Andalucia @ 4.92
11 67.6% Southeast_English + 32.4% Spanish_Aragon @ 4.93
12 73.1% Southwest_English + 26.9% Spanish_Andalucia @ 4.94
13 70.4% Southwest_English + 29.6% Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha @ 4.94
14 57.3% West_Scottish + 42.7% Spanish_Cataluna @ 4.98
15 66.4% Southwest_English + 33.6% Spanish_Cataluna @ 4.98
16 61% Orcadian + 39% Spanish_Aragon @ 4.98
17 68.7% Southwest_English + 31.3% Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon @ 5.1
18 59.8% West_Scottish + 40.2% Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon @ 5.14
19 73% Southwest_English + 27% Spanish_Extremadura @ 5.31
20 60.7% West_Scottish + 39.3% Spanish_Cantabria @ 5.34



Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% Spanish_Aragon +50% West_Scottish @ 5.467800


Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Southwest_English +25% Southwest_English +25% Spanish_Aragon @ 5.171289


Using 4 populations approximation:
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
1 Southwest_English + Southwest_English + Southwest_English + Spanish_Aragon @ 5.171289
2 Southeast_English + Southwest_English + Southwest_English + Spanish_Aragon @ 5.239985
3 French + French_Basque + Southeast_English + West_Scottish @ 5.249857
4 French + French_Basque + West_Scottish + West_Scottish @ 5.291347
5 Southwest_English + Southwest_English + Spanish_Aragon + West_Scottish @ 5.321480
6 Southeast_English + Southwest_English + Spanish_Aragon + West_Scottish @ 5.388845
7 Southwest_English + Southwest_English + Southwest_English + Spanish_Murcia @ 5.416526
8 Danish + French_Basque + Spanish_Murcia + West_Scottish @ 5.422565
9 Spanish_Aragon + Spanish_Cataluna + West_Scottish + West_Scottish @ 5.425607
10 French + French_Basque + Southwest_English + West_Scottish @ 5.429473
11 French_Basque + Spanish_Murcia + West_Scottish + West_Scottish @ 5.429847
12 French_Basque + Spanish_Cataluna + West_Scottish + West_Scottish @ 5.429970
13 Southeast_English + Southeast_English + Southwest_English + Spanish_Aragon @ 5.432822
14 French_Basque + Norwegian + Spanish_Murcia + West_Scottish @ 5.453251
15 French_Basque + North_Dutch + Spanish_Murcia + West_Scottish @ 5.465650
16 Spanish_Aragon + Spanish_Aragon + West_Scottish + West_Scottish @ 5.467800
17 Danish + French_Basque + Spanish_Cataluna + West_Scottish @ 5.471735
18 French + French_Basque + Irish + Southeast_English @ 5.476704
19 French + French_Basque + Orcadian + West_Scottish @ 5.481054
20 French + French_Basque + Southeast_English + Southeast_English @ 5.492773




K15

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 60.4% Orcadian + 39.6% Spanish_Aragon @ 3.69
2 66.1% Orcadian + 33.9% French_Basque @ 4.09
3 62.5% West_Scottish + 37.5% Spanish_Aragon @ 4.17
4 73.9% Southeast_English + 26.1% French_Basque @ 4.2
5 60.5% Orcadian + 39.5% Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha @ 4.2
6 60.5% Orcadian + 39.5% Spanish_Valencia @ 4.21
7 69.3% Southeast_English + 30.7% Spanish_Aragon @ 4.32
8 64% Irish + 36% Spanish_Aragon @ 4.4
9 62.6% West_Scottish + 37.4% Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha @ 4.53
10 64.1% Orcadian + 35.9% Spanish_Andalucia @ 4.62
11 62.7% West_Scottish + 37.3% Spanish_Valencia @ 4.66
12 69.7% Southeast_English + 30.3% Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha @ 4.67
13 76.2% Southwest_English + 23.8% French_Basque @ 4.69
14 58.9% Orcadian + 41.1% Spanish_Murcia @ 4.71
15 64.2% Irish + 35.8% Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha @ 4.72
16 68.4% West_Scottish + 31.6% French_Basque @ 4.78
17 59.2% Orcadian + 40.8% Spanish_Cantabria @ 4.81
18 60.9% West_Scottish + 39.1% Spanish_Murcia @ 4.81
19 70% Southeast_English + 30% Spanish_Valencia @ 4.82
20 64.4% Irish + 35.6% Spanish_Valencia @ 4.88


Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% Orcadian +50% Spanish_Aragon @ 5.084285


Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Orcadian +25% Spanish_Aragon +25% Spanish_Aragon @ 5.084285


Using 4 populations approximation:
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
1 French + French_Basque + Orcadian + Orcadian @ 4.352415
2 French_Basque + Orcadian + Orcadian + Spanish_Cataluna @ 4.495479
3 French + French_Basque + Orcadian + West_Scottish @ 4.530705
4 French_Basque + Orcadian + Orcadian + Spanish_Murcia @ 4.546441
5 French + French_Basque + Orcadian + Southeast_English @ 4.596670
6 French + French_Basque + Irish + Orcadian @ 4.608884
7 French_Basque + Orcadian + Spanish_Murcia + West_Norwegian @ 4.726233
8 French_Basque + Orcadian + Orcadian + Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon @ 4.734296
9 French_Basque + Orcadian + Southeast_English + Southeast_English @ 4.739234
10 French_Basque + Southeast_English + Southeast_English + Southeast_English @ 4.768559
11 French_Basque + Orcadian + Southeast_English + Southwest_English @ 4.810252
12 French_Basque + Orcadian + Orcadian + Portuguese @ 4.812558
13 French_Basque + Orcadian + Spanish_Cataluna + West_Scottish @ 4.857675
14 French_Basque + Southeast_English + Southeast_English + Southwest_English @ 4.868325
15 French + French_Basque + West_Scottish + West_Scottish @ 4.882214
16 French_Basque + Orcadian + Spanish_Cataluna + West_Norwegian @ 4.890987
17 French_Basque + Orcadian + Orcadian + Spanish_Extremadura @ 4.896406
18 French_Basque + Orcadian + Southeast_English + West_German @ 4.907880
19 French_Basque + Orcadian + Orcadian + South_Dutch @ 4.926623
20 French_Basque + Orcadian + Spanish_Murcia + West_Scottish @ 4.937516

[Samnium]

My father is modeling like that and he don't have any spaniard ancestries

Genealogy: https://gw.geneanet.org/thexos_w?lang=fr&n=level&oc=0&p=...&type=tree


K13:

Using 1 population approximation:
1 Southwest_English @ 8.975968
2 Southeast_English @ 9.547073
3 French @ 10.771866
4 South_Dutch @ 10.842543
5 West_Scottish @ 11.667791
6 Orcadian @ 11.860160
7 Irish @ 12.321325
8 West_German @ 12.362424
9 North_Dutch @ 14.050799
10 Danish @ 14.492908
11 Spanish_Cataluna @ 15.000998
12 North_German @ 15.831644
13 Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon @ 16.208231
14 Spanish_Cantabria @ 16.523447
15 Southwest_French @ 16.639233
16 Norwegian @ 16.707010
17 Spanish_Aragon @ 17.254635
18 Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha @ 17.564276
19 Spanish_Murcia @ 17.639174
20 Spanish_Galicia @ 17.658463

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 61% West_Scottish + 39% Spanish_Aragon @ 4.2
2 69.1% Southwest_English + 30.9% Spanish_Aragon @ 4.47
3 59.7% Irish + 40.3% Spanish_Aragon @ 4.71
4 69.9% Southwest_English + 30.1% Spanish_Murcia @ 4.73
5 61.7% West_Scottish + 38.3% Spanish_Murcia @ 4.78
6 62% West_Scottish + 38% Spanish_Valencia @ 4.86
7 61.8% West_Scottish + 38.2% Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha @ 4.87
8 70.4% Southwest_English + 29.6% Spanish_Valencia @ 4.89
9 72.5% Southeast_English + 27.5% French_Basque @ 4.9
10 65% West_Scottish + 35% Spanish_Andalucia @ 4.92
11 67.6% Southeast_English + 32.4% Spanish_Aragon @ 4.93
12 73.1% Southwest_English + 26.9% Spanish_Andalucia @ 4.94
13 70.4% Southwest_English + 29.6% Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha @ 4.94
14 57.3% West_Scottish + 42.7% Spanish_Cataluna @ 4.98
15 66.4% Southwest_English + 33.6% Spanish_Cataluna @ 4.98
16 61% Orcadian + 39% Spanish_Aragon @ 4.98
17 68.7% Southwest_English + 31.3% Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon @ 5.1
18 59.8% West_Scottish + 40.2% Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon @ 5.14
19 73% Southwest_English + 27% Spanish_Extremadura @ 5.31
20 60.7% West_Scottish + 39.3% Spanish_Cantabria @ 5.34



Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% Spanish_Aragon +50% West_Scottish @ 5.467800


Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Southwest_English +25% Southwest_English +25% Spanish_Aragon @ 5.171289


Using 4 populations approximation:
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
1 Southwest_English + Southwest_English + Southwest_English + Spanish_Aragon @ 5.171289
2 Southeast_English + Southwest_English + Southwest_English + Spanish_Aragon @ 5.239985
3 French + French_Basque + Southeast_English + West_Scottish @ 5.249857
4 French + French_Basque + West_Scottish + West_Scottish @ 5.291347
5 Southwest_English + Southwest_English + Spanish_Aragon + West_Scottish @ 5.321480
6 Southeast_English + Southwest_English + Spanish_Aragon + West_Scottish @ 5.388845
7 Southwest_English + Southwest_English + Southwest_English + Spanish_Murcia @ 5.416526
8 Danish + French_Basque + Spanish_Murcia + West_Scottish @ 5.422565
9 Spanish_Aragon + Spanish_Cataluna + West_Scottish + West_Scottish @ 5.425607
10 French + French_Basque + Southwest_English + West_Scottish @ 5.429473
11 French_Basque + Spanish_Murcia + West_Scottish + West_Scottish @ 5.429847
12 French_Basque + Spanish_Cataluna + West_Scottish + West_Scottish @ 5.429970
13 Southeast_English + Southeast_English + Southwest_English + Spanish_Aragon @ 5.432822
14 French_Basque + Norwegian + Spanish_Murcia + West_Scottish @ 5.453251
15 French_Basque + North_Dutch + Spanish_Murcia + West_Scottish @ 5.465650
16 Spanish_Aragon + Spanish_Aragon + West_Scottish + West_Scottish @ 5.467800
17 Danish + French_Basque + Spanish_Cataluna + West_Scottish @ 5.471735
18 French + French_Basque + Irish + Southeast_English @ 5.476704
19 French + French_Basque + Orcadian + West_Scottish @ 5.481054
20 French + French_Basque + Southeast_English + Southeast_English @ 5.492773




K15

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 60.4% Orcadian + 39.6% Spanish_Aragon @ 3.69
2 66.1% Orcadian + 33.9% French_Basque @ 4.09
3 62.5% West_Scottish + 37.5% Spanish_Aragon @ 4.17
4 73.9% Southeast_English + 26.1% French_Basque @ 4.2
5 60.5% Orcadian + 39.5% Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha @ 4.2
6 60.5% Orcadian + 39.5% Spanish_Valencia @ 4.21
7 69.3% Southeast_English + 30.7% Spanish_Aragon @ 4.32
8 64% Irish + 36% Spanish_Aragon @ 4.4
9 62.6% West_Scottish + 37.4% Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha @ 4.53
10 64.1% Orcadian + 35.9% Spanish_Andalucia @ 4.62
11 62.7% West_Scottish + 37.3% Spanish_Valencia @ 4.66
12 69.7% Southeast_English + 30.3% Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha @ 4.67
13 76.2% Southwest_English + 23.8% French_Basque @ 4.69
14 58.9% Orcadian + 41.1% Spanish_Murcia @ 4.71
15 64.2% Irish + 35.8% Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha @ 4.72
16 68.4% West_Scottish + 31.6% French_Basque @ 4.78
17 59.2% Orcadian + 40.8% Spanish_Cantabria @ 4.81
18 60.9% West_Scottish + 39.1% Spanish_Murcia @ 4.81
19 70% Southeast_English + 30% Spanish_Valencia @ 4.82
20 64.4% Irish + 35.6% Spanish_Valencia @ 4.88


Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% Orcadian +50% Spanish_Aragon @ 5.084285


Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Orcadian +25% Spanish_Aragon +25% Spanish_Aragon @ 5.084285


Using 4 populations approximation:
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
1 French + French_Basque + Orcadian + Orcadian @ 4.352415
2 French_Basque + Orcadian + Orcadian + Spanish_Cataluna @ 4.495479
3 French + French_Basque + Orcadian + West_Scottish @ 4.530705
4 French_Basque + Orcadian + Orcadian + Spanish_Murcia @ 4.546441
5 French + French_Basque + Orcadian + Southeast_English @ 4.596670
6 French + French_Basque + Irish + Orcadian @ 4.608884
7 French_Basque + Orcadian + Spanish_Murcia + West_Norwegian @ 4.726233
8 French_Basque + Orcadian + Orcadian + Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon @ 4.734296
9 French_Basque + Orcadian + Southeast_English + Southeast_English @ 4.739234
10 French_Basque + Southeast_English + Southeast_English + Southeast_English @ 4.768559
11 French_Basque + Orcadian + Southeast_English + Southwest_English @ 4.810252
12 French_Basque + Orcadian + Orcadian + Portuguese @ 4.812558
13 French_Basque + Orcadian + Spanish_Cataluna + West_Scottish @ 4.857675
14 French_Basque + Southeast_English + Southeast_English + Southwest_English @ 4.868325
15 French + French_Basque + West_Scottish + West_Scottish @ 4.882214
16 French_Basque + Orcadian + Spanish_Cataluna + West_Norwegian @ 4.890987
17 French_Basque + Orcadian + Orcadian + Spanish_Extremadura @ 4.896406
18 French_Basque + Orcadian + Southeast_English + West_German @ 4.907880
19 French_Basque + Orcadian + Orcadian + South_Dutch @ 4.926623
20 French_Basque + Orcadian + Spanish_Murcia + West_Scottish @ 4.937516

Yes but it's normal for any french to be modeled like that. I was talking rather about the fact that there are people from Belgium or Netherlands that have a bit of Spanish and that could be Spanish soliders settling there. The same for the area north of Paris.

[Samnium]

My father is modeling like that and he don't have any spaniard ancestries

Genealogy: https://gw.geneanet.org/thexos_w?lang=fr&n=level&oc=0&p=...&type=tree


K13:

Using 1 population approximation:
1 Southwest_English @ 8.975968
2 Southeast_English @ 9.547073
3 French @ 10.771866
4 South_Dutch @ 10.842543
5 West_Scottish @ 11.667791
6 Orcadian @ 11.860160
7 Irish @ 12.321325
8 West_German @ 12.362424
9 North_Dutch @ 14.050799
10 Danish @ 14.492908
11 Spanish_Cataluna @ 15.000998
12 North_German @ 15.831644
13 Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon @ 16.208231
14 Spanish_Cantabria @ 16.523447
15 Southwest_French @ 16.639233
16 Norwegian @ 16.707010
17 Spanish_Aragon @ 17.254635
18 Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha @ 17.564276
19 Spanish_Murcia @ 17.639174
20 Spanish_Galicia @ 17.658463

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 61% West_Scottish + 39% Spanish_Aragon @ 4.2
2 69.1% Southwest_English + 30.9% Spanish_Aragon @ 4.47
3 59.7% Irish + 40.3% Spanish_Aragon @ 4.71
4 69.9% Southwest_English + 30.1% Spanish_Murcia @ 4.73
5 61.7% West_Scottish + 38.3% Spanish_Murcia @ 4.78
6 62% West_Scottish + 38% Spanish_Valencia @ 4.86
7 61.8% West_Scottish + 38.2% Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha @ 4.87
8 70.4% Southwest_English + 29.6% Spanish_Valencia @ 4.89
9 72.5% Southeast_English + 27.5% French_Basque @ 4.9
10 65% West_Scottish + 35% Spanish_Andalucia @ 4.92
11 67.6% Southeast_English + 32.4% Spanish_Aragon @ 4.93
12 73.1% Southwest_English + 26.9% Spanish_Andalucia @ 4.94
13 70.4% Southwest_English + 29.6% Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha @ 4.94
14 57.3% West_Scottish + 42.7% Spanish_Cataluna @ 4.98
15 66.4% Southwest_English + 33.6% Spanish_Cataluna @ 4.98
16 61% Orcadian + 39% Spanish_Aragon @ 4.98
17 68.7% Southwest_English + 31.3% Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon @ 5.1
18 59.8% West_Scottish + 40.2% Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon @ 5.14
19 73% Southwest_English + 27% Spanish_Extremadura @ 5.31
20 60.7% West_Scottish + 39.3% Spanish_Cantabria @ 5.34



Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% Spanish_Aragon +50% West_Scottish @ 5.467800


Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Southwest_English +25% Southwest_English +25% Spanish_Aragon @ 5.171289


Using 4 populations approximation:
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
1 Southwest_English + Southwest_English + Southwest_English + Spanish_Aragon @ 5.171289
2 Southeast_English + Southwest_English + Southwest_English + Spanish_Aragon @ 5.239985
3 French + French_Basque + Southeast_English + West_Scottish @ 5.249857
4 French + French_Basque + West_Scottish + West_Scottish @ 5.291347
5 Southwest_English + Southwest_English + Spanish_Aragon + West_Scottish @ 5.321480
6 Southeast_English + Southwest_English + Spanish_Aragon + West_Scottish @ 5.388845
7 Southwest_English + Southwest_English + Southwest_English + Spanish_Murcia @ 5.416526
8 Danish + French_Basque + Spanish_Murcia + West_Scottish @ 5.422565
9 Spanish_Aragon + Spanish_Cataluna + West_Scottish + West_Scottish @ 5.425607
10 French + French_Basque + Southwest_English + West_Scottish @ 5.429473
11 French_Basque + Spanish_Murcia + West_Scottish + West_Scottish @ 5.429847
12 French_Basque + Spanish_Cataluna + West_Scottish + West_Scottish @ 5.429970
13 Southeast_English + Southeast_English + Southwest_English + Spanish_Aragon @ 5.432822
14 French_Basque + Norwegian + Spanish_Murcia + West_Scottish @ 5.453251
15 French_Basque + North_Dutch + Spanish_Murcia + West_Scottish @ 5.465650
16 Spanish_Aragon + Spanish_Aragon + West_Scottish + West_Scottish @ 5.467800
17 Danish + French_Basque + Spanish_Cataluna + West_Scottish @ 5.471735
18 French + French_Basque + Irish + Southeast_English @ 5.476704
19 French + French_Basque + Orcadian + West_Scottish @ 5.481054
20 French + French_Basque + Southeast_English + Southeast_English @ 5.492773




K15

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 60.4% Orcadian + 39.6% Spanish_Aragon @ 3.69
2 66.1% Orcadian + 33.9% French_Basque @ 4.09
3 62.5% West_Scottish + 37.5% Spanish_Aragon @ 4.17
4 73.9% Southeast_English + 26.1% French_Basque @ 4.2
5 60.5% Orcadian + 39.5% Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha @ 4.2
6 60.5% Orcadian + 39.5% Spanish_Valencia @ 4.21
7 69.3% Southeast_English + 30.7% Spanish_Aragon @ 4.32
8 64% Irish + 36% Spanish_Aragon @ 4.4
9 62.6% West_Scottish + 37.4% Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha @ 4.53
10 64.1% Orcadian + 35.9% Spanish_Andalucia @ 4.62
11 62.7% West_Scottish + 37.3% Spanish_Valencia @ 4.66
12 69.7% Southeast_English + 30.3% Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha @ 4.67
13 76.2% Southwest_English + 23.8% French_Basque @ 4.69
14 58.9% Orcadian + 41.1% Spanish_Murcia @ 4.71
15 64.2% Irish + 35.8% Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha @ 4.72
16 68.4% West_Scottish + 31.6% French_Basque @ 4.78
17 59.2% Orcadian + 40.8% Spanish_Cantabria @ 4.81
18 60.9% West_Scottish + 39.1% Spanish_Murcia @ 4.81
19 70% Southeast_English + 30% Spanish_Valencia @ 4.82
20 64.4% Irish + 35.6% Spanish_Valencia @ 4.88


Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% Orcadian +50% Spanish_Aragon @ 5.084285


Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Orcadian +25% Spanish_Aragon +25% Spanish_Aragon @ 5.084285


Using 4 populations approximation:
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
1 French + French_Basque + Orcadian + Orcadian @ 4.352415
2 French_Basque + Orcadian + Orcadian + Spanish_Cataluna @ 4.495479
3 French + French_Basque + Orcadian + West_Scottish @ 4.530705
4 French_Basque + Orcadian + Orcadian + Spanish_Murcia @ 4.546441
5 French + French_Basque + Orcadian + Southeast_English @ 4.596670
6 French + French_Basque + Irish + Orcadian @ 4.608884
7 French_Basque + Orcadian + Spanish_Murcia + West_Norwegian @ 4.726233
8 French_Basque + Orcadian + Orcadian + Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon @ 4.734296
9 French_Basque + Orcadian + Southeast_English + Southeast_English @ 4.739234
10 French_Basque + Southeast_English + Southeast_English + Southeast_English @ 4.768559
11 French_Basque + Orcadian + Southeast_English + Southwest_English @ 4.810252
12 French_Basque + Orcadian + Orcadian + Portuguese @ 4.812558
13 French_Basque + Orcadian + Spanish_Cataluna + West_Scottish @ 4.857675
14 French_Basque + Southeast_English + Southeast_English + Southwest_English @ 4.868325
15 French + French_Basque + West_Scottish + West_Scottish @ 4.882214
16 French_Basque + Orcadian + Spanish_Cataluna + West_Norwegian @ 4.890987
17 French_Basque + Orcadian + Orcadian + Spanish_Extremadura @ 4.896406
18 French_Basque + Orcadian + Southeast_English + West_German @ 4.907880
19 French_Basque + Orcadian + Orcadian + South_Dutch @ 4.926623
20 French_Basque + Orcadian + Spanish_Murcia + West_Scottish @ 4.937516

Yes but it's normal for any french to be modeled like that. I was talking rather about the fact that there are people from Belgium or Netherlands that have a bit of Spanish and that could be Spanish soliders settling there. The same for the area north of Paris.

[Adamastor]

There are French with 66% Neolithic Farmer ancestry LOL.


The results show that the French genetic landscape is predominantly of EF-related ancestry (ancestry proportions vary between 46.5 and 66.2%, Fig. 4b), which was found to follow a northsouth cline (Fig. S17) with the lowest values found in the NW (<50%).

It means Southern French are full blown Southern Europeans, not just ''intermediary''.

[Voskos]

interesting.northwest has the highest steppe, the Bretons.

[Samnium]

There are French with 66% Neolithic Farmer ancestry LOL.



It means Southern French are full blown Southern Europeans, not just ''intermediary''.

IMO Southern French plot northern of Spaniards and Italians, to me they are intermediates between SW Europe and proper Central Europe not full blown Southerners.

[Creoda]

There are French with 66% Neolithic Farmer ancestry LOL.



It means Southern French are full blown Southern Europeans, not just ''intermediary''.
66% Farmer would have to be Corsicans..


Target: French_Corsica
Distance: 1.9787% / 0.01978718
61.8 Anatolia_Barcin_N
26.8 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
6.4 WHG
3.8 Armenia_EBA
1.2 Morocco_Iberomaurusian

Target: French_Provence
Distance: 2.7148% / 0.02714761
53.0 Anatolia_Barcin_N
37.8 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
8.8 WHG
0.4 Morocco_Iberomaurusian

Target: French_South
Distance: 3.9270% / 0.03926974
55.0 Anatolia_Barcin_N
28.0 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
16.6 WHG
0.4 Morocco_Iberomaurusian

Target: French_Occitanie
Distance: 3.4150% / 0.03415013
50.6 Anatolia_Barcin_N
36.0 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
13.4 WHG

[Dorian]

Can any southern french be modelled with some Greek?even if minimal?

[Adamastor]

66% Farmer would have to be Corsicans..


Target: French_Corsica
Distance: 1.9787% / 0.01978718
61.8 Anatolia_Barcin_N
26.8 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
6.4 WHG
3.8 Armenia_EBA
1.2 Morocco_Iberomaurusian

Target: French_Provence
Distance: 2.7148% / 0.02714761
53.0 Anatolia_Barcin_N
37.8 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
8.8 WHG
0.4 Morocco_Iberomaurusian

Target: French_South
Distance: 3.9270% / 0.03926974
55.0 Anatolia_Barcin_N
28.0 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
16.6 WHG
0.4 Morocco_Iberomaurusian

Target: French_Occitanie
Distance: 3.4150% / 0.03415013
50.6 Anatolia_Barcin_N
36.0 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
13.4 WHG

These models you've runned are still Southern European genetically, not only Corsicans. But if we use other sources of neolithic (other than Barcin) I'm sure French could score even more.



Can any southern french be modelled with some Greek?even if minimal?

No, despite Sikeliot's heavy propaganda on this forum, Greeks and South Italians are outliers in Southern Europe. True Southern European cluster is Northern Italian> Southern French > Iberian. Northern Balkanites were probably in this cluster before Slavic invasions (that's why Illyrians are modeled as Iberians/North Italians, not Greeks) and Greeks and modern South Italians have more Iran_N sources of DNA (plus Slavic in Greece and some Levant/Arabic/North African in South Italy).

Albanians and Central Italians are intermediary between South Euro cluster (Iberia/North Italy/South France) and Eastern-shifted South European cluster.

[dududud]

These models you've runned are still Southern European genetically, not only Corsicans. But if we use other sources of neolithic (other than Barcin) I'm sure French could score even more.




No, despite Sikeliot's heavy propaganda on this forum, Greeks and South Italians are outliers in Southern Europe. True Southern European cluster is Northern Italian> Southern French > Iberian. Northern Balkanites were probably in this cluster before Slavic invasions (that's why Illyrians are modeled as Iberians/North Italians, not Greeks) and Greeks and modern South Italians have more Iran_N sources of DNA (plus Slavic in Greece and some Levant/Arabic/North African in South Italy).

Albanians and Central Italians are intermediary between South Euro cluster (Iberia/North Italy/South France) and Eastern-shifted South European cluster.


Yeah, but you have different degree of cluster. French provençal are not exactly the same than SouthWestern French, because they are not Basque shifted.

You are a Venetian, right?

[Dorian]

No, despite Sikeliot's heavy propaganda on this forum, Greeks and South Italians are outliers in Southern Europe. True Southern European cluster is Northern Italian> Southern French > Iberian. Northern Balkanites were probably in this cluster before Slavic invasions (that's why Illyrians are modeled as Iberians/North Italians, not Greeks) and Greeks and modern South Italians have more Iran_N sources of DNA (plus Slavic in Greece and some Levant/Arabic/North African in South Italy).

Albanians and Central Italians are intermediary between South Euro cluster (Iberia/North Italy/South France) and Eastern-shifted South European cluster.

I'm not talking about such clusters but possible actual Greek ancestry diluted(see Greek colonies ,Marseille ,Antibes,Nice&Adge ) ..like even 90% X population + 10% Greek(any modern or ancient sample) would do it...

[Hajimurad]

I'm not talking about such clusters but possible actual Greek ancestry diluted(see Greek colonies ,Marseille ,Antibes,Nice&Adge ) ..like even 90% X population + 10% Greek(any modern or ancient sample) would do it...

I don't think about Greek admixture in Provence as ancient. These Greek colonies today inhabited chiefly by "French" people (of immigrant Italian and Corsican descent) and Kabyles. Modern Greek diaspora of Marseille are survivors of Chios massacre.

[Dorian]

I don't think about Greek admixture in Provence as ancient. These Greek colonies today inhabited chiefly by "French" people (of immigrant Italian and Corsican descent) and Kabyles. Modern Greek diaspora of Marseille are survivors of Chios massacre.

Yeah modern diaspora is another thing ,i'm referring to ethnic French ofc..So you say before the arrival of those immigrants the area was empty?

[Samnium]

These models you've runned are still Southern European genetically, not only Corsicans. But if we use other sources of neolithic (other than Barcin) I'm sure French could score even more.

Don't exagerate, actually the G25 of French Southerners are more southern shifted than the average, even deep southerners would plot well above Northern Spaniards, so no.

I'm not even talking about Northern French that can be considered as a NW population in all regards, at the first place those of the NW area (Normandy and Britanny).



No, despite Sikeliot's heavy propaganda on this forum, Greeks and South Italians are outliers in Southern Europe. True Southern European cluster is Northern Italian> Southern French > Iberian. Northern Balkanites were probably in this cluster before Slavic invasions (that's why Illyrians are modeled as Iberians/North Italians, not Greeks) and Greeks and modern South Italians have more Iran_N sources of DNA (plus Slavic in Greece and some Levant/Arabic/North African in South Italy).

One could argue that the true Southern Euros are Greeks and Southern Italians, it's a pointless discussion.

There's a SW Euro cluster and a SE one, not one is more "true" than the other.

[Hajimurad]

Yeah modern diaspora is another thing ,i'm referring to ethnic French ofc..So you say before the arrival of those immigrants the area was empty?

No, wasn't empty but French of Provence couldn't trace their ancestry from Greek colonists. That area was affected by piracy and epidemics and repopulated chiefly from mountains of France and Italy. Unlike colonies of Crimea, Asia Minor, Italy and Thrace (who preserved Greek ethnicity) ones of Provence lost their Greek character and became Latin-speaking (Provencal and French languages).

[Voskos]

Can any southern french be modelled with some Greek?even if minimal?

iirc there is like 10% balkan in southeast in one of the two latest studies. but this balkan could be anything theoretically.

[Dorian]

No, wasn't empty but French of Provence couldn't trace their ancestry from Greek colonists. That area was affected by piracy and epidemics and repopulated chiefly from mountains of France and Italy. Unlike colonies of Crimea, Asia Minor, Italy and Thrace (who preserved Greek ethnicity) ones of Provence lost their Greek character and became Latin-speaking (Provencal and French languages).

The loss of character or knowledge isn't that important , maybe you're right and there was massive repopulation..but from a quick scan on its history it seems to have "continuity" even after the epidemic.

During a two-year period, 50,000 of Marseille's total population of 90,000 died.
Marseille lost a significant portion of its population during the Great Plague of Marseille in 1720, but the population had recovered by mid-century.
Greeks and Italians started arriving at the end of the 19th century and in the first half of the 20th century, up to 40% of the city's population was of Italian origin;

In 2006, it was reported that 70,000 city residents were considered to be of Maghrebi origin, mostly from Algeria. The second largest group in Marseille in terms of single nationalities were from the Comoros, amounting to some 45,000 people.[33]

Currently, over one third of the population of Marseille can trace their roots back to Italy.[35] Marseille also has the second-largest Corsican and Armenian populations of France. Other significant communities include Maghrebis, Turks, Comorians, Chinese, and Vietnamese.[36]

In 1999, in several arrondissements, about 40% of the young people under 18 were of Maghrebi origin (at least one immigrant parent).

[Gaska]

France stayed relatively untounched from "mass migrations", there were some spaniards that have gone in the North in the 17th century. That could explain why some results from there show modeling with spaniard populations like 90% French Nord + 10% Spaniard...


Spaniards moved to France in the 17th century? Are you sure what you are saying?

Spaniards/Basques are very "French" the House of Burgundy helped during the Reconquista and hundreds of French knights settled in Castile from the 11th century, There are still many French surnames Spanishized in Castilian cities (Henao/Henault, Bracamonte/Braquemont ). That is probably one of the causes of these genetic similarities, in addition to sharing a common origin because France is the country of Europe with the highest percentage of Df27 after Spain.

Northern Italians and etruscans plots near Spaniards and Southern French-We are very similar genetically

[Voskos]

@Dorian. I found the said diagram. Turns out Balkan admixture is more like 5% in the southeast.(roughly)

https://www.biorxiv.org/content/biorxiv/early/2019/07/29/718098/F5.large.jpg

[Dorian]

@Dorian. I found the said diagram. Turns out Balkan admixture is more like 5% in the southeast.(roughly)

https://www.biorxiv.org/content/biorxiv/early/2019/07/29/718098/F5.large.jpg

I guess that this is more recent?could be from Italians as well?

[Voskos]

I guess that this is more recent?could be from Italians as well?

no idea tbh. but it's intriguing that it only shows up in the BDR departement (where the Greek colony is situated).

[dududud]

no idea tbh. but it's intriguing that it only shows up in the BDR departement (where the Greek colony is situated).

5% is to mutch to be old.

[Voskos]

5% is to mutch to be old.

really you think so? what about combination of old and recent?

[Adamastor]

One could argue that the true Southern Euros are Greeks and Southern Italians, it's a pointless discussion.

There's a SW Euro cluster and a SE one, not one is more "true" than the other.

Well, yeah. But depends if one focus on the word ''Southern'' or on the word ''Euro''. To be Southern European one must be European with no overlap with Anatolians, Middle Easterners and North Africans. So Southwestern Europeans are only European in that sense.

[Samnium]

Well, yeah. But depends if one focus on the word ''Southern'' or on the word ''Euro''. To be Southern European one must be European with no overlap with Anatolians, Middle Easterners and North Africans. So Southwestern Europeans are only European in that sense.

South-Eastern Euro populations (in other words : "East Meds") don't cluster with Middle-Easterners or whatever.

Some people said that they are barely Europeans, I don't see being "European" as primarily and only "genetical", there's certainly a link between all Europeans populations but throwing out Southern Italians out of Europe because being genetically closer to Levantines than let's say French it's quite ridiculous. Culturally and historically they have always been part of the West, except of some peculiar areas like Sicily. They are also still removed from these non-eurp populations and have Euro admixture predominantly, it's the 20%/30% Non-Euro that "shift" them, otherwise they are mainly EEF, with a little bit of Steppe and WHG (very slight).

[Adamastor]

South-Eastern Euro populations (in other words : "East Meds") don't cluster with Middle-Easterners or whatever.

Some people said that they are barely Europeans, I don't see being "European" as primarily and only "genetical", there's certainly a link between all Europeans populations but throwing out Southern Italians out of Europe because being genetically closer to Levantines than let's say French it's quite ridiculous. Culturally and historically they have always been part of the West, except of some peculiar areas like Sicily. They are also still removed from these non-eurp populations and have Euro admixture predominantly, it's the 20%/30% Non-Euro that "shift" them, otherwise they are mainly EEF, with a little bit of Steppe and WHG (very slight).

I think they are culturally European and part of the West, but genetically they are intermediates between Europeans and Middle Easterners. Even Mycenaeans were the same.

[Samnium]

I think they are culturally European and part of the West, but genetically they are intermediates between Europeans and Middle Easterners. Even Mycenaeans were the same.

I've never said the contrary but you have to taking in account that they are close to the most Euro admixed Levantines not to Saudis or Moroccans. They are only 20%/30% "Non-European" West Eurasian in average. So they are still 70% Euro, not only "50%".

[Duffmannn]

Spaniards moved to France in the 17th century? Are you sure what you are saying?
y

He´s somewhat right, part of northern France (and Franco Condado) was part of the Spanish Empire:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/d7/Tachtigjarige_Oorlog_1568-es.svg/800px-Tachtigjarige_Oorlog_1568-es.svg.png

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e7/France_1643_to_1715-es.svg/800px-France_1643_to_1715-es.svg.png?1581463444213

[Gaska]

Well, yeah. But depends if one focus on the word ''Southern'' or on the word ''Euro''. To be Southern European one must be European with no overlap with Anatolians, Middle Easterners and North Africans. So Southwestern Europeans are only European in that sense.

Have you analyzed the idiocy you have written?

[Gaska]

He´s somewhat right, part of northern France (and Franco Condado) was part of the Spanish Empire:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/d7/Tachtigjarige_Oorlog_1568-es.svg/800px-Tachtigjarige_Oorlog_1568-es.svg.png

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e7/France_1643_to_1715-es.svg/800px-France_1643_to_1715-es.svg.png?1581463444213


I think Flanders wars do not count as migrations-I don't think that influences the genetic resemblance between Spaniards and French

[Samnium]

I think Flanders wars do not count as migrations-I don't think that influences the genetic resemblance between Spaniards and French

Yes it counts. Because some people observed slightly more Med ancestry in areas that received spaniard soldiers, as well as locals having some southern shifting to their own origin (like 90% Sourh Dutch + 10% Spaniard).

[dududud]

Yes it counts. Because some people observed slightly more Med ancestry in areas that received spaniard soldiers, as well as locals having some southern shifting to their own origin (like 90% Sourh Dutch + 10% Spaniard).

How do you explain the results of my father, with any spaniard ancestries?

[Samnium]

How do you explain the results of my father, with any spaniard ancestries?

No, I've said that all French come as a mixture of a NW Population and a spaniard one, I've only said that there are some people in Belgium for example that are more southern shifted than usual and that could be spaniard soldiers coming here in the 17th century as they show something like : 90% Belgium + 10% Spaniard in their results.

On Anthrogenica they spoke about that.

[dududud]

No, I've said that all French come as a mixture of a NW Population and a spaniard one, I've only said that there are some people in Belgium for example that are more southern shifted than usual and that could be spaniard soldiers coming here in the 17th century as they show something like : 90% Belgium + 10% Spaniard in their results.

On Anthrogenica they spoke about that.

Sur Anthrogenica ils doutent des samples, alors que tout est clean dans cette étude, faut arrêter de déconner.

Avec leur régionalisme à deux francs, ils rejettent l'homogénéité des français, cette étude prouve encore une fois (encore, après la précédente étude) la relative homogénéité des français.

Je cite un ami (qui s'est fait bannir d'Anthrogenica à cause de la critique envers leur indépendantisme débile) :

"en fait, ces connards ne jurent que part 4 gd parents du même coin
en réalité, l'étude anglaise montre que même le status social & le niveau d'éducation peut biaiser les résultat sur la structure de la population
Donc, même en sélectionnant des samples avec 4 gd parent du mm coin ça ne garanti pas un biais à cause des facteurs socio économiques...
En plus, tout ça les auteur en parlent dans l'étude...
C'est pkoi ils sont pris deux cohi-oerts ave des critères de selection différents, des époques différentes & des SNP différents!
Avec tout ça, ils trouvent des résultats concordants...ce qui le valident.
Mais ces connards d'anthro sont tellement obsédés par leur régionalise à deux balles qu'ils n'en tiennent absolument pas compte"

[Samnium]

Sur Anthrogenica ils doutent des samples, alors que tout est clean dans cette étude, faut arrêter de déconner.

Avec leur régionalisme à deux francs, ils rejettent l'homogénéité des français, cette étude prouve encore une fois (encore, après la précédente étude) la relative homogénéité des français.

Je cite un ami (qui s'est fait bannir d'Anthrogenica à cause de la critique envers leur indépendantisme débile) :

"en fait, ces connards ne jurent que part 4 gd parents du même coin
en réalité, l'étude anglaise montre que même le status social & le niveau d'éducation peut biaiser les résultat sur la structure de la population
Donc, même en sélectionnant des samples avec 4 gd parent du mm coin ça ne garanti pas un biais à cause des facteurs socio économiques...
En plus, tout ça les auteur en parlent dans l'étude...
C'est pkoi ils sont pris deux cohi-oerts ave des critères de selection différents, des époques différentes & des SNP différents!
Avec tout ça, ils trouvent des résultats concordants...ce qui le valident.
Mais ces connards d'anthro sont tellement obsédés par leur régionalise à deux balles qu'ils n'en tiennent absolument pas compte"

Oui les Français sont homogènes génétiquement mais je dis qu'il y a une personne sur Anthrogenica qui a un composant East Med et West Med légèrement plus élevé que la moyenne ce qui pourrait indiquer un ancêtre espagnol.

[Gaska]

Oui les Français sont homogènes génétiquement mais je dis qu'il y a une personne sur Anthrogenica qui a un composant East Med et West Med légèrement plus élevé que la moyenne ce qui pourrait indiquer un ancêtre espagnol.

These are the percentages of West Med in Europe- Sardinia-51,87%, French Basque-35,86%, Southwest France-30,54%, Spanish-Aragón/Cantabria/Andalucia/Castilla/Valencia-29,79%, 29,27%, 29,07%, 28,52%, 27,72%, North Italian-25,76%, Portuguese-25,32%, France-19,50%, Bulgaria 17,91%, Romania, 17,09%, Serbia, 15,84%, Southewest England-15,10%

It seems a component linked to Anatolian Neolithic farmers and their percentages in the south of France and the French-Basque Country are higher than in Spain (except in the Spanish-Basque Country), then I think that an elevation of that component in northern France does not means having Spanish ancestors, I would think of Basque, Aquitans or Occitan ancestors better than Spanish soldiers. In the same way I do not think there are many Spanish descendants of Napoleon's soldiers, although you may be right and this could have happened

In any case, the percentages in Spain, France and Northern Italy are very similar. The same goes for East Med which is only strange or very high in Greece, Southern Italy, the Balkans-

[Samnium]

These are the percentages of West Med in Europe- Sardinia-51,87%, French Basque-35,86%, Southwest France-30,54%, Spanish-Aragón/Cantabria/Andalucia/Castilla/Valencia-29,79%, 29,27%, 29,07%, 28,52%, 27,72%, North Italian-25,76%, Portuguese-25,32%, France-19,50%, Bulgaria 17,91%, Romania, 17,09%, Serbia, 15,84%, Southewest England-15,10%

It seems a component linked to Anatolian Neolithic farmers and their percentages in the south of France and the French-Basque Country are higher than in Spain (except in the Spanish-Basque Country), then I think that an elevation of that component in northern France does not means having Spanish ancestors, I would think of Basque, Aquitans or Occitan ancestors better than Spanish soldiers. In the same way I do not think there are many Spanish descendants of Napoleon's soldiers, although you may be right and this could have happened

In any case, the percentages in Spain, France and Northern Italy are very similar. The same goes for East Med which is only strange or very high in Greece, Southern Italy, the Balkans-

Yes it's possible also for Southern French ancestors definitely. Especially after the Revolution, regional "borders" began to sink down and to be destroyed.

[dududud]

These are the percentages of West Med in Europe- Sardinia-51,87%, French Basque-35,86%, Southwest France-30,54%, Spanish-Aragón/Cantabria/Andalucia/Castilla/Valencia-29,79%, 29,27%, 29,07%, 28,52%, 27,72%, North Italian-25,76%, Portuguese-25,32%, France-19,50%, Bulgaria 17,91%, Romania, 17,09%, Serbia, 15,84%, Southewest England-15,10%

It seems a component linked to Anatolian Neolithic farmers and their percentages in the south of France and the French-Basque Country are higher than in Spain (except in the Spanish-Basque Country), then I think that an elevation of that component in northern France does not means having Spanish ancestors, I would think of Basque, Aquitans or Occitan ancestors better than Spanish soldiers. In the same way I do not think there are many Spanish descendants of Napoleon's soldiers, although you may be right and this could have happened

In any case, the percentages in Spain, France and Northern Italy are very similar. The same goes for East Med which is only strange or very high in Greece, Southern Italy, the Balkans-

For example, my father is modelized as 44% EEF and 42% Indo-european.

My mother is 66 EEF:
66.0 Anatolia_Barcin_N
26.0 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
8.0 WHG

Without Neolithic levant, iran farmer, etc, it would seem

[Samnium]

For example, my father is modelized as 44% EEF and 42% Indo-european.

My mother is 66 EEF:
66.0 Anatolia_Barcin_N
26.0 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
8.0 WHG

Without Neolithic levant, iran farmer, etc, it would seem

You added other components or just these three ?

[dududud]

You added other components or just these three ?

No.

Just these components:

Anatolia_Barcin_N,0.1175998,0.180118,0.0035312,-0.101158,0.0510443,-0.0483875,-0.0043582,-0.0069334,0.0362287,0.0807473,0.0079718,0.0118803,-0.0234545,0.0004691,-0.0419807,-0.0101913,0.0233091,0.0019866,0.0136954,-0.0097489,-0.0142249,0.0057723,-0.0041232,-0.0031658,-0.0043437
Anatolia_Tepecik_Ciftlik_N,0.108701,0.1731478,-0.0143308,-0.100534,0.0270818,-0.0402298,-0.0045828,-0.005019,0.02623,0.05745,0.008444,0.0080555,-0.0101832,0.0052298,-0.0352192,-0.0104748,0.0088662,0.0004432,0.005342,-0.0032828,0.0026827,0.0044515,-0.0071795,-0.0038258,-0.0045805
BRA_LapaDoSanto_9600BP,0.050765,-0.3095332,0.1206032,0.098515,-0.1156522,-0.017626,-0.284645,-0.3400012,-0.0136212,-0.0184422,0.002241,-0.003267,0.0004162,0.017478,-0.0065688,0.0064438,0.006493,-0.001267,0.0026898,0.003727,-0.0010482,0.007963,-0.002662,-0.0043378,0.001413
Dinka,-0.577083,0.0507765,-0.0003773,-0.0075098,-0.0053855,-0.0016735,-0.0176848,0.0204222,0.081145,-0.0969495,-0.02107,0.022742,-0.0383172,-0.0011698,0.0101452,-0.021347,0.0186125,-0.0094382,0.0241968,-0.0241678,0.002402,0.003308,0.001479,0.0009038,0.0 096995
ETH_4500BP,-0.511066,0.043668,0.000754,0.000969,-0.00277,-0.011435,0.050997,-0.045229,0.089172,-0.087838,-0.012991,-0.002997,-0.031219,0.000688,0.02158,-0.029965,0.027772,0.039273,0.00176,-0.009004,0.000374,0.006183,-0.003451,-0.00241,-0.000838
Gambian,-0.6064875,0.0671942,0.0197362,0.0114665,0.0021028, 0.0055777,-0.0358392,0.0387677,-0.0317353,0.0241463,0.0054132,-0.0036467,0.0162287,-0.0009865,0.011016,-0.0153362,0.009692,-0.0011823,-0.002116,-0.0032307,-0.001643,-0.0018137,0.0043958,-0.0001005,0.001377
Han,0.0206952,-0.4507105,-0.0082967,-0.0651579,0.0780846,0.0374475,0.0029055,-0.004804,-0.0150232,-0.0031146,-0.0495875,-0.0070573,0.0072707,-0.0081072,-0.0043305,0.0012535,0.0017542,-0.0008638,-0.0020455,-0.0102206,0.0122397,0.0069582,0.0141063,-0.0012925,-0.0022315
IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N,0.0455292,0.0660095,-0.1518855,0.0026648,-0.1250232,0.0204982,0.0170972,-0.0017305,-0.0814005,-0.0579968,0.0004465,-0.001611,0.0072845,-0.0087735,0.0294512,0.0567152,-0.005248,0.0084882,0.007259,-0.037018,0.0075492,-0.0286258,-0.010322,-0.0404578,0.0265842
IRN_Shahr_I_Sokhta_BA3,0.033009,-0.081242,-0.180641,0.120157,-0.097557,0.065539,0.0047,0.009461,0.035996,0.02678 9,-0.002273,0.003747,-0.005649,0.007982,0.003529,0.003182,0.008736,0.001 647,0.000126,-0.002001,0.001373,-0.008161,0.000246,-0.001928,-0.008023
Jarawa,-0.0219821,-0.2430289,-0.1324164,0.0986968,0.0323713,-0.0045841,-0.01012,0.0065044,0.0546974,0.0238044,0.0228054,0. 0027349,-0.0041532,0.0103562,-0.0108067,-0.0114441,0.0094529,-0.0019082,-0.0062221,0.0286778,-0.0046401,0.0111366,-0.0123402,0.0022668,0.0049844
Kura-Araxes_ARM_Kaps,0.1013025,0.133034,-0.07071,-0.043605,-0.0498555,-0.0092035,0.008108,-0.011653,-0.066368,-0.01631,0.0030855,0.011015,-0.019846,0.005849,0.0042075,-0.0102095,-0.0001305,-0.003927,-0.001697,0.0032515,0.003494,-0.000247,-0.0036975,-0.0090975,-0.0030535
Levant_PPNB,0.0765462,0.163754,-0.0321495,-0.1368722,0.0360838,-0.0655392,-0.0129842,-0.014076,0.070254,0.0393175,0.0188778,-0.012551,0.0316648,0.001961,-0.027246,0.007657,0.0153525,-0.001267,-0.0038025,0.0192277,-0.0014352,0.0074502,0.000955,-0.0038258,-0.0047002
MAR_Iberomaurusian,-0.189857,0.0814452,-0.0242866,-0.085595,0.027636,-0.0552202,-0.0705968,0.0184146,0.155397,0.003499,0.0209156,-0.0318316,0.0747168,-0.0513334,0.0711988,-0.0363032,0.0052676,-0.066106,-0.1424162,0.0389938,-0.0376836,-0.1255322,0.0730118,-0.0137606,0.0164534
Nganassan,0.0476917,-0.4066181,0.1557885,0.0023902,-0.1594452,-0.0882129,0.0285066,0.0433367,0.0310876,0.0128477, 0.1028569,0.0094115,-0.0040734,-0.0261619,-0.0219731,-0.0123307,-0.0010952,0.0134165,0.0268365,-0.0008505,0.0431363,-0.0118954,0.0336096,0.0003977,0.0135556
WHG,0.1246365,0.116278,0.184789,0.189279,0.1546445 ,0.0464355,0.0131605,0.0372675,0.0890705,0.017768,-0.0153455,-0.015811,0.0159065,-0.0030275,0.053338,0.0582065,0.00502,0.016343,-0.0093015,0.055589,0.0944585,0.0111905,-0.049607,-0.160866,0.0170045
Yamnaya_RUS_Samara,0.1259169,0.0887318,0.0428032,0 .1164425,-0.028236,0.045529,0.0036719,-0.002279,-0.0558095,-0.0715732,0.0009742,-0.0003934,-0.0019885,-0.025529,0.0362032,0.0160764,-0.0005869,-0.0012038,-0.0038966,0.0149446,-0.0022928,6.19e-05,0.0112925,0.0189332,-0.0039516
Yoruba,-0.6300625,0.0625011,0.022113,0.0167079,0.0005035,0 .0124741,-0.044417,0.0477673,-0.0488813,0.0327694,0.0046205,0.0007904,0.0230561, 0.0009509,0.0125232,-0.0096067,0.0070763,0.0004491,0.006022,-0.00299,0.0015542,0.0023156,-0.0017592,-0.0004711,-0.0004246

[Leto]

For example, my father is modelized as 44% EEF and 42% Indo-european.

My mother is 66 EEF:
66.0 Anatolia_Barcin_N
26.0 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
8.0 WHG

Without Neolithic levant, iran farmer, etc, it would seem
Haha, just ran myself for fun

52.8 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
28.4 Anatolia_Barcin_N
14.0 WHG
3.0 Nganassan
1.8 Han

The distance is big though, 6+.

How much Steppe is your father?

[Gaska]

For example, my father is modelized as 44% EEF and 42% Indo-european.

My mother is 66 EEF:
66.0 Anatolia_Barcin_N
26.0 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
8.0 WHG

Without Neolithic levant, iran farmer, etc, it would seem

NAt WMed EMed Bal RSea NAfr SA SS SI WA EA O A
Basque K13- 52,72- 30,72- 5,76- 8,58- 0,31- 0,0- 0,0- 0,4.- 0,00- 0,54- 0,87- 0,00- 0,10-

French-Basq- 52,62- 35,86- 3,07- 6,10- 0,31- 0,20- 0,32- 0,04- 0,06- 0,35- 0,65- 0,30- 0,08

France- 42,60- 19,50- 10,33- 17,48- 2,82- 0,07- 1,08- 0,12- 0,27- 4,96- 0,15- 0,23- 0,38
Aragón-Spain- 43,83- 29,79- 12,05- 8,27- 2.37- 0,46- 0,40- 0,04- 0,50- 1,32- 0,25- 0,39- 0,32
N-Italia- 31,68- 25,76- 19,58- 11,93- 2,78- 0,04- 0,56- 0,03- 0,13- 6,90- 0,34- 0,21- 0,05
Greece - 16,86- 21,47- 29,25- 10,36- 5,03- 0,03- 0,29- 0,01- 0,14- 15,44- 0,24- 0,56- 0,32

The biggest difference between French and Spanish is that the French have more Baltic than us. The Greeks and North Italians have much more East Med and the Greeks much more red Sea-
North African is very small in all (in Spain it depends on the regions because in the Canary Islands it is high)
The Basques are much more North Atlantic and West Med and we have very little East Med-But in general, Western European countries are very similar genetically speaking

[dududud]

Haha, just ran myself for fun

52.8 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
28.4 Anatolia_Barcin_N
14.0 WHG
3.0 Nganassan
1.8 Han

The distance is big though, 6+.

How much Steppe is your father?

Distance: 5.7803% / 0.05780347
44.2 Anatolia_Barcin_N
42.8 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
13.0 WHG

[Leto]

Distance: 5.7803% / 0.05780347
44.2 Anatolia_Barcin_N
42.8 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
13.0 WHG
Pretty much like the study suggested.

[SharpFork]

Can any southern french be modelled with some Greek?even if minimal?
Using the samples from Global25 and modelling people from Provance(the only ones with Near Eastern ancestral components, a potential sign of Greek influence) as a mixture of other modern French people and Ancient Greeks gives us a Ancient Greek admixture of 1/3 to 0, although I really think Iberian or Italian descended Pied Noirs might be among the people sampled, otherwise I can't explain the stark difference. The average is 13.2%.

In any case if we just use Iran Neolothic I think the actual Greek adxmiture would have been at most 5-10% if it really even exists to this day and if Greeks were the only contributing factor to the Near Eastern DNA, as opposed to Corsicans and Italians or even MENA people during the Roman period, overall at least using modern sample the Greek contribution seems hard to even prove given how few samples have Near Eastern ancestry at all AFAIK.

[Lucas]

Using the samples from Global25 and modelling people from Provance(the only ones with Near Eastern ancestral components, a potential sign of Greek influence) as a mixture of other modern French people and Ancient Greeks gives us a Ancient Greek admixture of 1/3 to 0, although I really think Iberian or Italian descended Pied Noirs might be among the people sampled, otherwise I can't explain the stark difference. The average is 13.2%.



It is more then probable, as they only record someone's place of birth in this study, not his four grandparents. And Pied Noirs settled mainly in southern France.

[SharpFork]

It is more then probable, as they only record someone's place of birth in this study, not his four grandparents. And Pied Noirs settled mainly in southern France.
At the same time the Ligurian and Piedmontese samples on g25 also have quite some Near Eastern-like or Berber-like admixture, so maybe it's not so foreign to Provence, but if they don't even check for recent ancestry it seems pointless.
Makes answering the question even harder but at this point I would say Greek admixture is probably negligible in people from the region.