What is your paternal line earliest known place of origin?

[Jana]

I was able to identify my paternal line place of origin, and it is village Klobuk in western Herzegovina, very close to Croatian border.
My grand-grandpa was muslim, but in Klobuk only Croats live and there are still Catholics carrying our surname living there.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Klobuk,_Ljubu%C5%A1ki

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e9/Klobuk-denis-luburic.jpg

What about you? Share your story please :)

[Jana]

Forgot to say. My paternal haplogroup is I-PH908 (most typical dinaric Slav marker). Write your subclade also, if you know it.

[nittionia]

The earliest I can trace my paternal line is Germany in the 1900s. He was a swimming instructor for the German military and then moved to America


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Roy]

Wierzbica, in those times it was a little town. Now it's a village. He was born in 1770, and had a cool name Wawrzyniec. This place belongs to historic Polish province of Lesser Poland, but now it is formally in the Mazovian voivodeship.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wierzbica,_Radom_County

[JamesBond007]

I was able to identify my paternal line place of origin, and it is village Klobuk in western Herzegovina, very close to Croatian border.
My grand-grandpa was muslim, but in Klobuk only Croats live and there are still Catholics carrying our surname living there.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Klobuk,_Ljubu%C5%A1ki

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e9/Klobuk-denis-luburic.jpg

What about you? Share your story please :)

Ulster Ireland probably Donegal what exact town no idea :


The House of de Burgh (Latinised to de Burca or de Burgo) was an ancient Anglo-Norman family.

Hubert de Burgh was Earl of Kent and Justiciar of England.[1] His elder brother was William de Burgh (c. 1160 - winter 1205/1206), who settled in Ireland in 1185 and founded the Irish line of the family, which after the 14th century took the name Burke, the Earls of Ulster, Lords of Connaught and Earls of Clanricarde.

In England the name was changed again to 'Burgh' some time after the Civil War in the 17th century, the 'de' having been removed to hide the family's connection to the nobility and Catholicism, but was returned to de Burgh in the late 19th century.

The de Burgh family include many prominent figures during The Middle Ages, The Crusades, The British Empire, World War One and World War Two

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/De_Burgh_family

[Kaspias]

I was able to document it 2 weeks ago. Apparently my paternal grandfather is actually from Provadia, Bulgaria. It is still unknown if he was Tatar or Turkmen originated, but he was ethnic Turk.

[JamesBond007]

Forgot to say. My paternal haplogroup is I-PH908 (most typical dinaric Slav marker). Write your subclade also, if you know it.

It is in my profile doll face

[Jana]

It is in my profile doll face

Is it subclade of U106 or L21?

[SUPREEEEEME]

My Y-DNA subclade is J-L70 (roughly, J2a>J-L26>J-L24>J-L25>J-Z438>J-Z387>J-L70) - which seems to have it's origins in the Levant or Southern Anatolia.

In terms of oral tradition, like most Jewish families, our paternal line is from Kna'an in the Levant.

The furthest back I can trace my paternal line is to Kiev, Ukraine circa 1883.

I most likely fall under J-P244 or J-BY268, as those are the Ashkenazi branches. J-L70 is found in Ashkenazi, Sephardi and Mizrahi Jews.

https://anthrogenica.com/showthread.php?18818-Jews-and-J-L70
https://anthrogenica.com/showthread.php?19736-J-L70-Presence-in-the-Middle-East-North-Africa

[JamesBond007]

Is it subclade of U106 or L21?

I think L21 it exists even in England but is obviously not the majority of England since the majority has a Germanic subclade. My Y-DNA does not match my autosomal DNA though since that is closest to the Dutch outside of Britain :

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/ac/R-L21.png

[Aldaris]

Oiartzun, afaik. Didn’t dig too deep though.

[Token]

R1a-L664, Osnabrück, Lower Saxony. A family of farmers and herders.

[AlfonsoVIII]

Southern lands of the council of Segovia -central Castile, Spain-, late 11th century.

[Satem]

Dębowierzchy - small village not far from place I live. I don't know how when did they move there, they were peasants and they were living all their live there until few generations back.

[itilvolga]

According to the e-state sources, the oldest known paternal ancestor of mine was born in Xinis, Erzurum in 1874.
The district was called as Xnunis (խնունիս) in 950 AD by Armenians and Tondrakians were living there.
In 20th century, the population was predominantly Armenian and Turk with partially Kurds.
His name was Kasım so he was most likely a Turk.

[J. Ketch]

Earliest recorded paternal ancestor is from the 1790s in the same village in County Offaly my father grew up in, with the same birth name as my father.

I know that paternal line has been in the same area for 1000+ years; maybe 1500 years. It comes from the Southern Ui Neill of the Early Middle Ages, one of the dynasties of the Connachta, and Niall of the Nine Hostages as the story goes.

Before that it's probably been in Ireland or Britain since the earliest Bell Beakers arrived, and ultimately came from the Eastern European Steppes. The earliest known examples of R1b are from Mesolithic Europe.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_U%C3%AD_N%C3%A9ill

[Ford]

A village in NE Bosnia, same village where all known paternal ancestors were born. He should have been born in the mid-early 1700s.

[Maintenance]

Rome and Vendel

[Luke35]

N-Y17696. He was born in 1875 in Ungvar, Hungary but the city is now located in Ukraine and called Uzhhorod.

My surname is a place name, so I assume my line lived there before Ungvar.

[Ion Basescul]

Mine is from Sirota, Moldova (https://moldova.europalibera.org/a/27204442.html), and I can only trace it to the 1920s, because my grandpa lost his parents in a car accident as a kid and being the only child was raised by his grandparents. So understandably, not a lot of people asked my grandpa about his past, hence I don't know much about his ancestors.
My grandpa and great-grandpa identified as Romanian/Moldovan, but their the village is historically recorded as being Ruthenian.
"SÂROTA, ruseşte Sirota, de la cuvântul rus „orfan", sătuc, în jud. Orhei, în valea Cohâlnicului, spre V. de centrul volostei Chiprieni. Are 33 case, cu o popu-laţie de 198 suflete, ţărani ruteni."

My line is I-PH908 and I'm negative for all known sub-branches below it.

[Saiwalo]

https://media.nationalgeographic.org/assets/photos/000/206/20672.jpg

[Jana]

^^^^ N1c pride :)

[Ion Basescul]

Mine is from Sirota, Moldova (https://moldova.europalibera.org/a/27204442.html), and I can only trace it to the 1920s, because my grandpa lost his parents in a car accident as a kid and being the only child was raised by his grandparents. So understandably, not a lot of people asked my grandpa about his past, hence I don't know much about his ancestors.
My grandpa and great-grandpa identified as Romanian/Moldovan, but their the village is historically recorded as being Ruthenian.
"SÂROTA, ruseşte Sirota, de la cuvântul rus „orfan", sătuc, în jud. Orhei, în valea Cohâlnicului, spre V. de centrul volostei Chiprieni. Are 33 case, cu o popu-laţie de 198 suflete, ţărani ruteni."

My line is I-PH908 and I'm negative for all known sub-branches below it.

Now that I'm looking at this video from the village, those men that were filmed seem to have heavy Dinarid noses :lol:
My father's is very upturned though. The classic I-PH908 Dinarid nose comes from my maternal grandma and mom.

https://moldova.europalibera.org/a/27204442.html

[brennus dux gallorum]

I was able to identify my paternal line place of origin, and it is village Klobuk in western Herzegovina, very close to Croatian border.
My grand-grandpa was muslim, but in Klobuk only Croats live and there are still Catholics carrying our surname living there.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Klobuk,_Ljubu%C5%A1ki

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e9/Klobuk-denis-luburic.jpg

What about you? Share your story please :)

Wow wonderful landscape

[Annie999]

My great-great-grandfather was from Piedmont, Italy :)

[OrhanU]

According e-state records, my great grandpa is from Prijepolje/Serbia. Our family records in paternal side starts with him in Turkey (He is no:1 and I am 10 as great grandson).

He was a muslim and they don't have any migration stories rather than my great grandpa's to Turkey. My great grandpa came to Turkey for war voluntarily (They were called 'djurumlija').


Y-DNA is EV-13

[gixajo]

I only can look back to around 1850´s in my paternal line, with documents. True and documented direct lineage, not assumptions obtained trhough surnames. My maternal lineage is easier to investigate because I lived in the same place, in it I can go back to the end of XV century thanks to bauptism certificates and other documented data.

In that time, my paternal ancestor had 2 Spanish surnames, and was born in the same small Andalusian city, in Úbeda, Jaén province.What is strange is that supposedly my Y-Dna haplogrup is r1a1a1, and is quite rare in Spain, so probably some of my ancestor could be from East Europe. I am doing research about this, specially in lists of central European colons that arrived near that city from the year 1767. But they are other options that could explain my (most likely) haplogroup.

So, all that I can assume of my paternal lineage, links him with this little city:

https://i.imgur.com/Z7YFiTp.jpg

And the local countryside is this:

https://i.imgur.com/pCBUh3u.jpg

Úbeda with the neighbouring city of Baeza, are Wolrd heritage Sites.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C3%9Abeda

The article in Spanish has more information and better images:

https://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C3%9Abeda

[Roy]

Wow wonderful landscape

I've just read that Klobuk means hat. It's a very fitting name considering the hill behind.

[Jana]

Now that I'm looking at this video from the village, those men that were filmed seem to have heavy Dinarid noses :lol:
My father's is very upturned though. The classic I-PH908 Dinarid nose comes from my maternal grandma and mom.

https://moldova.europalibera.org/a/27204442.html

My father has small and very wide CM (Borreby) nose. I don't think dinarid nose is mark of PH908, rather of lineages like J-L283 and R-L23 predating Slavs on Balkan.

[Samnium]

Part of my paternal line is from here (Rumilly/L'Albanais area) :

https://www.tourisme.fr/images/otf_offices/1472/g-lansard-albanais1328-12-2012-moy-def.jpg

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/4b/b9/e7/4bb9e7df7b1520b0b6d777cc7271b91e.jpg

[Ion Basescul]

My father has small and very wide CM (Borreby) nose. I don't think dinarid nose is mark of PH908, rather of lineages like J-L283 and R-L23 predating Slavs on Balkan.

Could be anything, I don't know if there are any studies or if it even correlates to Y-DNA. I just know that when I posted my photos for the first time here, some people said PH908 :lol:

[lei.talk]

...in storage at my palaestra (https://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?6063&p=327217&viewfull=1#post327217),
the family-bible my mother left with me

preserves a sprawling lattice of names
written by several different feminine hands

that (according to ancestry.com (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancestry.com)) eventually lead to a family-farm in sweden (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Husby_(estate)).

:offtopid: the mormons are retro-actively baptising (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baptism_for_the_dead) every white person
whose genealogy they can trace. :focus:

my mother was one (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haplogroup_H_(mtDNA)#H3) of the many daughters of helena (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Seven_Daughters_of_Eve)
and my father was typical (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haplogroup_I-M253).

[Thracian]

According to official documents, my fathers great great father was born in Kardzhali -located in modern Bulgaria- in 1863. We can track a bit more my father's mother's paternal line.

Our Y-DNA is R1a-CTS3402.

[TheMaestro]

As far as I know, Lupci I poshtem in NE Kosovo, grandfather of my grandfather have lived for 104 years, our whole family have quiet long life expectancy.

[andre]

Y-dna: I-cts10057

All my ancestrors born in Bacau area.
My paternal ancestry came from a Free mine worker that was born in 1740-50 in Targu Ocna.
A lot of Transylvanian Romanians, szekely, armenians and germans settle in 1400-1500 for work in that salt mine. My haplogroup it’s a little weird.. maybe come from a Saxon settler, i don’t know; But i’m sure that in 1774 my paternal ancestror was orthodox and ethnically romanian.

[PaleoEuropean]

The Balkans, where my clade comes from. Probably impossible to find out the actual place just because it's so common in the region.

[Ülev]

somewhere in this area (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bremen):
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/67/Stadtmusikanten_Bremen.png/491px-Stadtmusikanten_Bremen.png
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Datei:Stadtmusikanten_Bremen.png

[Kyp]

https://image.shutterstock.com/image-vector/map-iran-zanjan-600w-418771306.jpg

Earliest mention of my paternal line is from times of Zanjan Khanate:


Zanjan Khanate was an 18th-19th century khanate based in Zanjan.

Zanjan Khanate was one of the Khanates located in historic Azerbaijan which became semi-independent from the Iranian mothercountry for more than a hundred years .

From Afshar tribe


The Afshar, also spelled Awshar (Turkish: Afşar or Avşar, Middle Turkic: اَفْشارْ), is one of the Oghuz tribes.[1] These originally nomadic Oghuz tribes moved from Central Asia and initially settled in what is now Iranian Azerbaijan, Azerbaijan Republic, Turkey.

[Blondie]

My paternal ancestry originated from Oberbayern and they were teachers in the 19. century.

[Leto]

https://image.shutterstock.com/image-vector/map-iran-zanjan-600w-418771306.jpg

Earliest mention of my paternal line is from times of Zanjan Khanate:



From Afshar tribe
Maybe you should order a separate Y DNA test. R1a isn't the most common lineage in Iran (~15% if I remember correctly) and in the Republic it's only 10% or so.

[Kaspias]

https://image.shutterstock.com/image-vector/map-iran-zanjan-600w-418771306.jpg

Earliest mention of my paternal line is from times of Zanjan Khanate:



From Afshar tribe

Do a Y-Test, I wonder your matches

[Kyp]

Maybe you should order a separate Y DNA test. R1a isn't the most common lineage in Iran (~15% if I remember correctly) and in the Republic it's only 10% or so.

I definetly will at some point

[RandomGuy20]

My Y-dna is Slavic (I-S17250), thought to originate in East Poland/West Ukraine amongst the White Croats who migrated down to modern-day Croatia :)

[Glauk]

From the highlands of Puka
tribe of Thaqi: 3 brothers settled in kosovo and founded the village where i come from

[Westbrook]

Halle as part of Herzogtum Magdeburg/Brandenburg


Really slow progress doing this the old fashioned way and having grandparents who don't like to help.

[Benyzero]

As far as I know, Lupci I poshtem in NE Kosovo, grandfather of my grandfather have lived for 104 years, our whole family have quiet long life expectancy.

Nigga you will live 4eva

[Dušan]

Area between Bileća and Trebinje, in Republika Srpska.
Same as Bosniensis.

[TheMaestro]

Nigga you will live 4eva

U2 my gulyas long head baratom

[Dušan]

From the highlands of Puka
tribe of Thaqi: 3 brothers settled in kosovo and founded the village where i come from

Nice to admit that you are settlers on Kosovo, no natives.

[PaleoEuropean]

https://media.nationalgeographic.org/assets/photos/000/206/20672.jpg

Whats your haplogroup?

[Norb]

R1a-L664, Osnabrück, Lower Saxony. A family of farmers and herders.

you are L664?

[Leto]

R1a-L664, Osnabrück, Lower Saxony. A family of farmers and herders.
You have barely posted your commercial results and Gedmatch.

[Saiwalo]

Whats your haplogroup?

N-L550

[Benyzero]

U2 my gulyas long head baratom

I propose an attack on round headed ppl. We begin the assault at dawn

[Ülev]

Y-DNA haplogroup N1c1-L550 (Y4343 subclade), and includes Alexander Nevsky (1220-1263) and Ivan the Terrible (1530-1584).
https://www.eupedia.com/europe/Haplogroup_N1c_Y-DNA.shtml
https://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?318392-Classify-Ivan-the-Terrible

:scratch:

[Smitty]

The farthest back my family can be traced is my 3x great-grandfather, Joseph Smith, of southern Indiana, born about 1810. I don't know where he hailed from, but it was likely either Pennsylvania or more probably Luxembourg/West Germany. With a name like Smith, I despair of ever taking the line back any further. I'm a bit envious of those of you who can go back centuries.

[Token]

You have barely posted your commercial results and Gedmatch.

I have posted my Gedmatch results many times. I don't post commercial calculators because they are totally worthless in my opinion.

[Token]

you are L664?

Yep. Discovered it a few weeks ago.

[Glauk]

Nice to admit that you are settlers on Kosovo, no natives.

Lol, where are the kosovo serbs? Dead or in vojvodina? What about you pricks setting dalmatia?

My village was made by albos, only albos have lived there so yeah it has nothing to do with you or your people

[Norb]

Yep. Discovered it a few weeks ago.

do you know the subclade?

[PaleoEuropean]

The farthest back my family can be traced is my 3x great-grandfather, Joseph Smith, of southern Indiana, born about 1810. I don't know where he hailed from, but it was likely either Pennsylvania or more probably Luxembourg/West Germany. With a name like Smith, I despair of ever taking the line back any further. I'm a bit envious of those of you who can go back centuries.

Probably not too hard if you can find accredited genealogies of local areas.

[Brás Garcia de Mascarenhas]

Somewhere in Scotland.

[Adamm]

My paternal line comes from Taforalt (North East Morocco) from inside the mountains (used as barrier against hostile tribes):

https://i.imgur.com/mIfurmx.png
https://i.imgur.com/ZDs7M1U.png
https://i.imgur.com/BXMZ9K5.png
https://i.imgur.com/hQMJrml.jpg

Since history until now we've cultivated olives (oil), almonds and grain as a way for a living.

[mamacia]

I'm paternally Albanian from Kosovo and my ancestors used to live in Kosovo for as long as we can remember. We used to be Catholics. My great grandfather lived to a 105 years old. We don't have any memory of coming from somewhere else except for belonging to some highland tribe which many people joined. But going way back we probably did come from somewhere else since it was probably impossible to always inhabit an area like Kosovo, it's demographics have always changed. The Mountains of Malsia have always been the core area of Albanians after Slavs came and where we survived as a population. And even had independence from Ottoman rule with our own laws. Except for Western pockets of Kosovo and Macedonia which had a small Albanian population, Slavs settled largely in the plains / lowlands after they came. We have expanded and grown later as a population again.



Nice to admit that you are settlers on Kosovo, no natives.

Funny this is coming from a guy with a Slavic haplogroup. Your haplogroup is Slavic and shows that you aren't native. You immigrated into the Balkans and settled there like everybody else. Your paternal lineage can be traced back to Poland where they found it's ancestral clade. So it is kinda ironic here you're talking about being native. Meanwhile my haplogroup has been found in Bronze Age Western Balkans from Illyrians, so who is really more native ?

Even most Kosovo Serbs are 1930 immigrants, majority of their Slavic haplogroups are also Slavic, you can see this by the Serbian DNA project

https://dnk.poreklo.rs/DNK-projekat/

The Kosovo Serbs that lived in Stefan Dusans time are totally different people who also came from somewhere else prior to settling there. They came from more North too actually. But I guess they sprouted out of it's ground ?

Kosovo Serbs belong to Montenigrin/Albanian tribes many of them. Whereas Illyrians belonged to haplogroups J2b2-L23 , R1b-L23 and EV13 which are common in Albanians. Slavic lineages have replaced them totally in some areas. Even in Bosnia, Croatia and Republika Srpska where you claim to of come from (And I guarantee you you came from somewhere else before that too). I have even seen Bosnian Serbs match Albanians on DNA test which shows that these Bosnian Serbs have immigrated into Bosnia since they get Albanian relatives.

But I guess history for you starts in the 17th century regarding who is native. How about we go 2000 years back for example and see who is more native ?


As for native population of Kosovo, they were said to of immigrated into Northern Albania when the Slavs came. I have read this in plenty of books. Founders of some Albanian tribes have tradition of coming from the plains of Kosovo for example

From Carleton Coon's book races of Europe



The most important fis is that to which the people of the famous bairaks of Shoshi and Shala, in Dukagin, belong, and also three of the five bairaks of Mirdita. The restrictions against intermarriage between Shoshi and Shala have broken down, as well even as unions between moieties within these bairaks, but in Mirdita all the young men of the three bairaks of Spaç, Orosh, and Kushnein must take their wives from the other two, Dibri and Fan. The original ancestors of this super-fis were brothers, who came from the plain of Kossovo into the mountains looking for refuge, at least 100 generations ago, according to the popular tradition. That many such movements must have taken place in the past is apparent; northern Albania is a refuge area of the first water





Slavs invaded and settled in the lowlands, whereas Illyrians went into the mountains, it is no secret that Albanians survived somewhere in the mountains, this even gave us independence from the Ottomans and most Slavic empires including Serbs, Bulgarians etc. Whatever Albanians lived in the plains / lowlands majority fused eventually into Slavs. It would be impossible or hard for an Albanian population to of survived there in a pool of Slavs under Slavic rule without eventually getting assimilated unless it was ruled by Albanians themselves, Ottoman rule was totally different in Kosovo, they never settled their population there like Slavs did.. This also allowed more for the growth of an Albanian population eventually while being ruled by a foreign empire without getting assimilated. This is a no brainer. Only thing that occurred was Islamization basically. The Mountains of Malsia served as a refuge area and where we survived as a population independent from Slavic and Ottoman rule and even Roman possibly. But the difference between Romans and Ottomans and Slavs is that the Romans and Ottomans never settled their people there like the Slavs did.



the Albanians that settled in the lowlands later were never settled there by Ottomans as you claim, except for a few who were going in raids and the Ottomans settled them to control them better, majority of them migrated there mostly themselves. Many of them fled also blood feuds from the mountains since Albanians have tradition of practicing blood feuds that dates back to the 15th century from the Kanun

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gjakmarrja


These type of blood feuds are practiced to this very day which leads a lot of people into leaving the country.


There were also still small pockets of Albanians in Kosovo before even Ottomans as demographics show, house holds in Pec, Prizren and other areas marked as ''Arbanas/Albanian'' , but we know that most of the plains were dominated by Slavs, this is no secret. Except for Dukagjini and League of Lezhe ruling those lands and some Albanian conquerors ruling Macedonia.



This is something I can admit, what I rather find funny is how you people think that these lands always belonged to you, as if they have been your lands from the very start when they actually haven't. This is my issue. You are Slavic immigrants, largely, at least paternally. Your paternal ancestors immigrated from Poland. Meanwhile Northern Albania is just a neighboring area to Kosovo, some tribes in Kosovo came right from it's borders around Tropoje before these borders even existed but you're trying to argue we never stepped foot into those lands prior to Slavs or back in Ancient times when the Illyrians existed when they were basically just neighboring areas. Only reason why we are recorded as a minority there is because of your empires and because you people invaded those areas and mass immigrated there basically and we had to survive somewhere in the mountains. That doesn't make these lands automatically yours, I couldn't care less what you think.

When the Serbian army occupied Kosovo in the 20th century it was majority Albanian so were pockets of Nish and todays Southern Serbia but they should let themselves get ruled by Serbs as if these lands have always been Serbian when it shows you are immigrants there yourselves ? You see Serbs immigrated even into modern Albania where the Nemanjic empire expanded and there was even a Serb population in Albania.


Can you prove to me that Serbs are mixed with native population of Kosovo ? Prior to Serbs Kosovo was described as Bulgarian so how is it possible ? And prior to Bulgarians most of the natives in Kosovo fled into the mountains of Northern Albania I have read. What was left of them seem to of just been some pockets of Arbanas and Vlachs.

From Branimir Anzulovic ,





This is an issue that has been much discussed. Serbs claim that Albanians came to Kosovo relatively late, but all historical indications point out that Albanians are descendants of old Illyrians, who were a power in the Balkans before the Roman Empire subdued them. When Serbs, and other Slavs, settled there in the seventh century, the old inhabitants withdrew to the mountains, and became shepherds.




Only mistake he makes is that Serbs did not settle there in the 7th century, we rather see a settlement of other Slavic tribes unrelated to Serbs that settled there early on and in Macedonia. Serbs came later.


There is another book from the Roman Empire that mentions the same thing, that the natives of Kosovo immigrated supposedly into Northern Albania.





You can say whatever you want but you are Slavic immigrants but you seem too blind to even see this, it is ironic you're talking about being native when your Y-DNA is SLAVIC.



You're talking as if these lands in the Balkans have always belonged to you when they actually haven't , pretty much everybody has immigrated back and forth at one point, you see this with almost every population that their ancestors at one point came from somewhere else.

But the biggest migration was done of course by Balkan Slavs aka Serbs who many came from more Northern Slavic areas as even attested by their haplogroups yet depict Albanians as migrants. I kinda find it ironic when actually overall Albanians have migrated the least distance atleast since the Bronze Age. There have basically been some migrations back and forth from Malsia - Kosovo - Macedonia more or less. And there also have been migrations into Greece as we know and the South since at least the 13th century but we know we originated north of the jireck line... I believe migrations into the south occurred earlier since at least year 600.

[mashail]

Haplogroup R-BY126933 most likely it has East European origin.

[Token]

do you know the subclade?

No, but i plan to buy Yfull soon.

[Smitty]

Probably not too hard if you can find accredited genealogies of local areas.

Not so far. People moved around a lot in the early 1800s Midwest, and my ancestors weren't too notable. But I'll keep looking.

[Jana]

Haplogroup R-BY126933 most likely it has East European origin.

And location?

[Westbrook]

You've tried a service like ancestry.com?
Not so far. People moved around a lot in the early 1800s Midwest, and my ancestors weren't too notable. But I'll keep looking.

[Hapanuwa]

According to the e-state sources, all of my male line (and female line) of ancestors are traceable to my village in Western Turkey. Up to the 1800s everyone's from the same village and all have Turkish/Muslim names.

Morley predicted me as E-v13, although I think it's probably wrong.

[PT Tagus]

Probably in Caucasus or Anatolia.

[mashail]

And location?
Location of my parent's mother northeast Iraq father northwest Iraq :) .
I also have far ancestors who are Jewish, Berber, Balkan.

[Cumansky]

Family of Vlad Impaler of Wallachia (Eflak)

[Cumansky]

I am better than you trust

[Coastal Elite]

The surname originated in the Maramures region in the 13th Century. My grandpa was a skilled woodcarver so this proves a connection.

[Jana]

Family of Vlad Impaler of Wallachia (Eflak)

Nobody believe your BS. Your father is a Polak.

[Cumansky]

Nobody believe your BS. Your father is a Polak.

How you know my Father? You met my Father? No you never met my Father

[Jana]

How you know my Father? You met my Father? No you never met my Father

You mentioned his ancestry many times and we saw his DNA results, you aren't fooling anyone, wannabe Vlach.

[Joso]

Germany

[Cumansky]

You mentioned his ancestry many times and we saw his DNA results, you aren't fooling anyone, wannabe Vlach.

I am so offended by this Nazi tomboy with chronic Human Papiloma Virus

God punished you with Earthquake already you want aftershock now?

[Smitty]

You've tried a service like ancestry.com?

Yeah, I actually found a cousin on Ancestry, who gave me that furthest generation, and with that information I found that guy's will. But nothing more than that. He probably was an immigrant, which could explain the lack of records. But the Midwest is like a black hole around that time anyway.

[Cumansky]

I rest my case. Vlad out until next time

[El_Abominacion]

Guangdong province, China.

My Y-DNA is O-F1399 which is exclusively Chinese and Vietnamese and despite being only 1/8th my surname is also Chinese

https://media-cdn.tripadvisor.com/media/photo-s/1a/08/b0/6e/photo2jpg.jpg

https://img2.chinadaily.com.cn/images/201802/21/5a8ceb26a3106e7d2d739813.jpeg

https://london.wtm.com/__novaimages/5947801?v=637063711033900000

[Sora]

According to my father: Kürtün, Gümüşhane
According to E-Devlet: Almus, Tokat

:confused:

[Westbrook]

That's a shame. Ancestry was a yuge help tracing my mother's side of the family, but we've all been southerners and east coasters.
Yeah, I actually found a cousin on Ancestry, who gave me that furthest generation, and with that information I found that guy's will. But nothing more than that. He probably was an immigrant, which could explain the lack of records. But the Midwest is like a black hole around that time anyway.

[Dušan]

I'm paternally Albanian from Kosovo and my ancestors used to live in Kosovo for as long as we can remember. We used to be Catholics. My great grandfather lived to a 105 years old. We don't have any memory of coming from somewhere else except for belonging to some highland tribe which many people joined. But going way back we probably did come from somewhere else since it was probably impossible to always inhabit an area like Kosovo, it's demographics have always changed. The Mountains of Malsia have always been the core area of Albanians after Slavs came and where we survived as a population. And even had independence from Ottoman rule with our own laws. Except for Western pockets of Kosovo and Macedonia which had a small Albanian population, Slavs settled largely in the plains / lowlands after they came. We have expanded and grown later as a population again.




Funny this is coming from a guy with a Slavic haplogroup. Your haplogroup is Slavic and shows that you aren't native. You immigrated into the Balkans and settled there like everybody else. Your paternal lineage can be traced back to Poland where they found it's ancestral clade. So it is kinda ironic here you're talking about being native. Meanwhile my haplogroup has been found in Bronze Age Western Balkans from Illyrians, so who is really more native ?

Even most Kosovo Serbs are 1930 immigrants, majority of their Slavic haplogroups are also Slavic, you can see this by the Serbian DNA project

https://dnk.poreklo.rs/DNK-projekat/

The Kosovo Serbs that lived in Stefan Dusans time are totally different people who also came from somewhere else prior to settling there. They came from more North too actually. But I guess they sprouted out of it's ground ?

Kosovo Serbs belong to Montenigrin/Albanian tribes many of them. Whereas Illyrians belonged to haplogroups J2b2-L23 , R1b-L23 and EV13 which are common in Albanians. Slavic lineages have replaced them totally in some areas. Even in Bosnia, Croatia and Republika Srpska where you claim to of come from (And I guarantee you you came from somewhere else before that too). I have even seen Bosnian Serbs match Albanians on DNA test which shows that these Bosnian Serbs have immigrated into Bosnia since they get Albanian relatives.

But I guess history for you starts in the 17th century regarding who is native. How about we go 2000 years back for example and see who is more native ?


As for native population of Kosovo, they were said to of immigrated into Northern Albania when the Slavs came. I have read this in plenty of books. Founders of some Albanian tribes have tradition of coming from the plains of Kosovo for example

From Carleton Coon's book races of Europe





Slavs invaded and settled in the lowlands, whereas Illyrians went into the mountains, it is no secret that Albanians survived somewhere in the mountains, this even gave us independence from the Ottomans and most Slavic empires including Serbs, Bulgarians etc. Whatever Albanians lived in the plains / lowlands majority fused eventually into Slavs. It would be impossible or hard for an Albanian population to of survived there in a pool of Slavs under Slavic rule without eventually getting assimilated unless it was ruled by Albanians themselves, Ottoman rule was totally different in Kosovo, they never settled their population there like Slavs did.. This also allowed more for the growth of an Albanian population eventually while being ruled by a foreign empire without getting assimilated. This is a no brainer. Only thing that occurred was Islamization basically. The Mountains of Malsia served as a refuge area and where we survived as a population independent from Slavic and Ottoman rule and even Roman possibly. But the difference between Romans and Ottomans and Slavs is that the Romans and Ottomans never settled their people there like the Slavs did.



the Albanians that settled in the lowlands later were never settled there by Ottomans as you claim, except for a few who were going in raids and the Ottomans settled them to control them better, majority of them migrated there mostly themselves. Many of them fled also blood feuds from the mountains since Albanians have tradition of practicing blood feuds that dates back to the 15th century from the Kanun

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gjakmarrja


These type of blood feuds are practiced to this very day which leads a lot of people into leaving the country.


There were also still small pockets of Albanians in Kosovo before even Ottomans as demographics show, house holds in Pec, Prizren and other areas marked as ''Arbanas/Albanian'' , but we know that most of the plains were dominated by Slavs, this is no secret. Except for Dukagjini and League of Lezhe ruling those lands and some Albanian conquerors ruling Macedonia.



This is something I can admit, what I rather find funny is how you people think that these lands always belonged to you, as if they have been your lands from the very start when they actually haven't. This is my issue. You are Slavic immigrants, largely, at least paternally. Your paternal ancestors immigrated from Poland. Meanwhile Northern Albania is just a neighboring area to Kosovo, some tribes in Kosovo came right from it's borders around Tropoje before these borders even existed but you're trying to argue we never stepped foot into those lands prior to Slavs or back in Ancient times when the Illyrians existed when they were basically just neighboring areas. Only reason why we are recorded as a minority there is because of your empires and because you people invaded those areas and mass immigrated there basically and we had to survive somewhere in the mountains. That doesn't make these lands automatically yours, I couldn't care less what you think.

When the Serbian army occupied Kosovo in the 20th century it was majority Albanian so were pockets of Nish and todays Southern Serbia but they should let themselves get ruled by Serbs as if these lands have always been Serbian when it shows you are immigrants there yourselves ? You see Serbs immigrated even into modern Albania where the Nemanjic empire expanded and there was even a Serb population in Albania.


Can you prove to me that Serbs are mixed with native population of Kosovo ? Prior to Serbs Kosovo was described as Bulgarian so how is it possible ? And prior to Bulgarians most of the natives in Kosovo fled into the mountains of Northern Albania I have read. What was left of them seem to of just been some pockets of Arbanas and Vlachs.

From Branimir Anzulovic ,




Only mistake he makes is that Serbs did not settle there in the 7th century, we rather see a settlement of other Slavic tribes unrelated to Serbs that settled there early on and in Macedonia. Serbs came later.


There is another book from the Roman Empire that mentions the same thing, that the natives of Kosovo immigrated supposedly into Northern Albania.





You can say whatever you want but you are Slavic immigrants but you seem too blind to even see this, it is ironic you're talking about being native when your Y-DNA is SLAVIC.



You're talking as if these lands in the Balkans have always belonged to you when they actually haven't , pretty much everybody has immigrated back and forth at one point, you see this with almost every population that their ancestors at one point came from somewhere else.

But the biggest migration was done of course by Balkan Slavs aka Serbs who many came from more Northern Slavic areas as even attested by their haplogroups yet depict Albanians as migrants. I kinda find it ironic when actually overall Albanians have migrated the least distance atleast since the Bronze Age. There have basically been some migrations back and forth from Malsia - Kosovo - Macedonia more or less. And there also have been migrations into Greece as we know and the South since at least the 13th century but we know we originated north of the jireck line... I believe migrations into the south occurred earlier since at least year 600.

Term Kosovo means nothing on Albanian. What does it mean? It means that you are foreigners in Kosovo, with no tradition and historical record on this area.
It is Slavic word. There are several tens of Kosovos in Poland and in Russia.


Kosowo – część miasta Złocieniec
Kosowo – wieś w woj. kujawsko-pomorskim, w pow. nakielskim, w gminie Mrocza
Kosowo – wieś w woj. kujawsko-pomorskim, w pow. świeckim, w gminie Świecie
Kosowo – wieś w woj. kujawsko-pomorskim, w pow. tucholskim, w gminie Cekcyn
Kosowo – część wsi Trzeszczon w woj. kujawsko-pomorskim, w pow. włocławskim, w gminie Chodecz
Kosowo – wieś w woj. pomorskim, w pow. kartuskim, w gminie Przodkowo
Kosowo – wieś w woj. wielkopolskim, w pow. gnieźnieńskim, w gminie Czerniejewo
Kosowo – wieś w woj. wielkopolskim, w pow. gostyńskim, w gminie Gostyń
Kosowo – przysiółek wsi Będargowo w woj. zachodniopomorskim, w pow. choszczeńskim, w gminie Pełczyce

https://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kosowo_(ujednoznacznienie)


Косово — деревня в Междуреченском районе Вологодской области.
Косово — деревня в Дзержинском районе Калужской области.
Косово — деревня в Медынском районе Калужской области.
Косово — деревня в Клинском районе Московской области.
Косово — деревня в Шаховском районе Московской области.
Косово — деревня в Батецком районе Новгородской области.
Косово — деревня в Великолукском районе Псковской области.
Косово — деревня в Молоковском районе Тверской области.
Косово — деревня в Даниловском районе Ярославской области.

https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%9A%D0%BE%D1%81%D0%BE%D0%B2%D0%BE

Most of toponimes in Kosovo are Slavic.

Yes, Serbs came from north to Balkans, adopted Orthodox Christianity from Greeks, and created civilized medieval state. Hundreds of churches and monasteries in Kosovo and Metochia ("Dukagjini") proves presence of one noble culture on this area.
Term Metochia mean monastery land. Both term Kosovo and Metochia are connected with Serbs, and have zero connection with Albanians.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metochion
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metohija

Serbs intermariage with some paleo-Balkan population here, what autosomal genetics clearly proves. We are not descendants only from immigrants from north, but from natives here, also.




About very rare presence of Albanians in Kosovo, Metochia and even northern Albania, best indicator is Dečani chrysobulls from 14th century:


The first charter concludes that the region was ethnically Serb.

89 settlements with 2,666 households were recorded of which:

3 Albanian settlements (3,3%)
86 Serbian settlements (96,6%)
2,166 livestock households of 2,666 agricultural households:

44 Albanian households (2%)
2,122 Serbian households (98%)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/De%C4%8Dani_chrysobulls

97-98% Serbs!

Even when Ottomans conquered Serbia in 15th century, there are tiny minority of Albanians in Kosovo, what Ottoman census proves:


The Ottoman cadastral tax census (defter) of 1455 in the Branković lands (covering most of present-day Kosovo) recorded:

480 villages,
13,693 adult males,
12,985 dwellings,
14,087 household heads (480 widows and 13,607 adult males).
Yugoslav and Serbian scholars have researched the defter, concluding that:[1]

13,000 Serb dwellings present in all 480 villages and towns
75 Vlach dwellings in 34 villages
46 Albanian dwellings in 23 villages
17 Bulgarian dwellings in 10 villages
5 Greek dwellings in Lauša, Vučitrn
1 Jewish dwelling in Vučitrn
1 Croat dwelling

Out of all names mentioned in this census, conducted by the Ottomans in 1455, covering areas of most of present-day Kosovo, 95.88% of all names were of Serbian origin, 1.90% of Roman origin, 1.56% of uncertain origin, 0.26% of Albanian origin, 0.25% of Greek origin, etc.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1455_defter_of_the_Brankovi%C4%87_lands

96% Serbs!

But after great migration of Serbs due to austrian-ottoman wars in the end of 17th and in 18th century, you began to settle in Kosovo and Metochia.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Migrations_of_the_Serbs

You exploit Serbian trouble and settled on Serbian land, both by Ottomans, and by your own.

If great migrations of Serbs didn't happend, Albanians would never settled on Kosovo, because Serbs would never ever let them in.


What is your historical and cultural inpact on Kosovo? Nothing.
There are material evidence of Serbian presence - thousand of churches and monasteries (some of them destroyed by Albanians), there are linguistic evidence of Serbian presence.
But about Albanians? Nothing.

[Halgurd]

According to family stories, Samarra (Mesopotamia).

[Div]

I come from a mixed background, I do know that the village that my family is from has been recorded up to around 1304. My paternal line as far as I know extends to the 1750s from a Catholic man called "Gjin" who moved to that village from the north. His sons eventually became Muslim and one of them became my direct ancestor.

[Smitty]

That's a shame. Ancestry was a yuge help tracing my mother's side of the family, but we've all been southerners and east coasters.

That makes sense. The East has been well-settled for a long time, and I've heard Southerners have pretty good records. The Midwest, on the other hand, was, I think, more transient than the South and was settled long before good recordkeeping began. I can't tell you how many lines dead-end in Ohio for me.

[jingorex]

http://www.iceman.it/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/oetz.jpg
https://www.worldatlas.com/r/w1200-h701-c1200x701/upload/2a/cc/96/alps-mountain-range-europe.jpg

[Rumata]

I was able to identify my paternal line place of origin, and it is village Klobuk in western Herzegovina, very close to Croatian border.
My grand-grandpa was muslim, but in Klobuk only Croats live and there are still Catholics carrying our surname living there.
What about you? Share your story please :)

Mine is from Perm region of Russia which is near Ural mountains. It's quite recent though.

Do you know the etymology of "Klobuk" in Croatian language? In Russian it means this:
Chorni Klobuky (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chorni_Klobuky) :D

[Rumata]

somewhere in this area (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bremen):
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/67/Stadtmusikanten_Bremen.png/491px-Stadtmusikanten_Bremen.png
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Datei:Stadtmusikanten_Bremen.png

Aren't you a Vlach as you told me then?

[Leto]

Mine is from Perm region of Russia which is near Ural mountains. It's quite recent though.

Do you know the etymology of "Klobuk" in Croatian language? In Russian it means this:
Chorni Klobuky (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chorni_Klobuky) :D
I know you don't want to test but your additional Mongoloid may come from there. In the Ural region even 10-12% is not unusual (but you guys keep in mind only 8% of Russians live in the Ural region).

[Leto]

My paternal grandfather was born in Minsk oblast/uyezd, so his father must have been from there too. I know almost nothing about my great-grandfather and grandmother other than their given names and the fact they were Roman Catholics.

I guess it's "some kind" of Z282 or whatever it's called. Baltic or Slavic.

[Rumata]

I know you don't want to test but your additional Mongoloid may come from there. In the Ural region even 10-12% is not unusual (but you guys keep in mind only 8% of Russians live in the Ural region).

Which line of my ancestors looks the most Mongoloid to you then?


https://ibb.co/Vmx8QRg

[Ülev]

Aren't you a Vlach as you told me then?

I am honorary Vlach

[Rumata]

I am honorary Vlach

I knew you tried to fool me then. So who you really are?

[Ülev]

klobouk in Czech language hat
https://translate.google.com/#view=home&op=translate&sl=cs&tl=en&text=klobouk
and a town in Poland - Kłobuck with a hat in coats of arms

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/K%C5%82obuck

[Ülev]

I knew you tried to fool me then. So who you really are?

everyone on TA know who I am

[Slavic Italian]

Where did R1a1a start?

[Slavic Italian]

Mine is from Perm region of Russia which is near Ural mountains. It's quite recent though.

Do you know the etymology of "Klobuk" in Croatian language? In Russian it means this:
Chorni Klobuky (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chorni_Klobuky) :D

I match a lot with Perm region.

[Rumata]

everyone on TA know who I am

I don't. Why just not say it? It's not a shame to spell. Come on.

[Leto]

Which line of my ancestors looks the most Mongoloid to you then?


https://ibb.co/Vmx8QRg

They don't look particularly mong to me, maybe the one in the upper left corner but even he is not much mong. They all look like unmixed Russians to me. In older photos I actually see fewer mongy folks than in living people. Must be recent mixing.

[Ülev]

I don't. Why just not say it? It's not a shame to spell. Come on.

I'm not at the police interrogation, am I? :rolleyes:

[Rumata]

I match a lot with Perm region.

I doubd my father has a lot of old genetics from that region. You can see his photo in the left bottom corner.

[Slavic Italian]

I doubd my father has a lot of old genetics from that region. You can see his photo in the left bottom corner.

I match with Finno Ugrics.

[Rumata]

I'm not at the police interrogation, am I? :rolleyes:

Of course you're not. It's just nice to know who you talk to.

[Leto]

I doubd my father has a lot of old genetics from that region. You can see his photo in the left bottom corner.
Perm was incorporated into Russia in the early 16th century. But as you know looks don't always match genotype. He may be 10% mong but still look Polish, that's perfectly possible. My maternal family from Kirov oblast looked European.

[Rumata]

They don't look particularly mong to me, maybe the one in the upper left corner but even he is not much mong. They all look like unmixed Russians to me. In older photos I actually see fewer mongy folks than in living people. Must be recent mixing.

Dude, these are all of my lines. No additional adimixtures in myself. And I agree that the upper left looked the most close to Mongoloids, but it's not "he" but my great grandmother.

[Rumata]

I match with Finno Ugrics.

I had no testing.

[Ülev]

Of course you're not. It's just nice to know who you talk to.

you could read it - N. Germany (Opa), also Poland of course, France and Scotland - deep in the past, no one ever crossed east border of Warta river - that makes me Vassiliy as @#@!

[Leto]

Dude, these are all of my lines. No additional adimixtures in myself. And I agree that the upper left looked the most close to Mongoloids, but it's not "he" but my great grandmother.
Woah, really? And which one is the Cherkes? Don't attack me for using this "funny" word but none looked particularly "black-assed" to me if ya know what I mean ;)

[Rumata]

you could read it - N. Germany (Opa), also Poland of course, France and Scotland - deep in the past, no one ever crossed east border of Warta river - that makes me Vassiliy as @#@!

Thanks, Vasiliy, now we are on even terms :D

[Ülev]

so, all family on the lands of East Germanic Tribes (to the Wisła river) :rolleyes:

[Rumata]

Woah, really?

Really what? Do I look like a person to make fun of the gender of my ancestors??

[Finnish Swede]

Late 16th century ... back then the area was part of Denmark (and still the next 100years).


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u9tgiAYfhXU

[Leto]

Really what? Do I look like a person to make fun of the gender of my ancestors??
Sorry. I didn't look closely enough. Mistook your grandma for a man. Back in the day people were tougher and had to go through a lot of hardships, so that's all good ;)

[Slavic Italian]

Late 16th century ...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u9tgiAYfhXU

Glad you are back.

[Rumata]

Sorry. I didn't look closely enough. Mistook your grandma for a man. Back in the day people were tougher and had to go through a lot of hardships, so that's all good ;)

I shouldn't have uploaded it in the first place. The purpose was totally worthless.

[Jana]

Mine is from Perm region of Russia which is near Ural mountains. It's quite recent though.

Do you know the etymology of "Klobuk" in Croatian language? In Russian it means this:
Chorni Klobuky (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chorni_Klobuky) :D

Klobuk means hat :)
But specifically it means a mushroom hat

https://edutorij.e-skole.hr/share/proxy/alfresco-noauth/edutorij/api/proxy-guest/262e076f-8ee5-4dd2-a8a2-dbfd7eb188b0/content/uploads/biologija-2/m04/j01/Biologija-7.-razred-3.-modul-2.-jedinica-1.jpg

[Jana]

Where did R1a1a start?

R1 is Siberian.

[Ülev]

Aren't you a Vlach as you told me then?

and, I wish I could be honorary Чудь белоглазый too
https://youtu.be/sYql0238-i0

[Rumata]

Klobuk means hat :)
But specifically it means a mushroom hat

https://edutorij.e-skole.hr/share/proxy/alfresco-noauth/edutorij/api/proxy-guest/262e076f-8ee5-4dd2-a8a2-dbfd7eb188b0/content/uploads/biologija-2/m04/j01/Biologija-7.-razred-3.-modul-2.-jedinica-1.jpg

It seems to be an originallly Turkic word:

Turkic: Karakalpak or Qaraqalpaq
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chorni_Klobuky

[Westbrook]

I've actually had the same thing happen with Ohio lol
That makes sense. The East has been well-settled for a long time, and I've heard Southerners have pretty good records. The Midwest, on the other hand, was, I think, more transient than the South and was settled long before good recordkeeping began. I can't tell you how many lines dead-end in Ohio for me.

[InfamousAngel99]

North Carolina, USA.
I can't go back too far on my paternal line or maternal line, unfortunately.

[InfamousAngel99]

The south is usually easy to research, but not my direct paternal branch.

[InfamousAngel99]

I've actually had the same thing happen with Ohio lol

Same here.

[Dunai]

I am totally stuck with my paternal line to the mid 19th century East-Southern Historic Hungary, while with my maternal line I can go back way into the High Middle Ages, and perhaps even into the Early Middle Ages (though I still have to find time and patience to analyze the validity of my leads with data before 1000). It's a major bummer for me, because apparently there are no more records that I can verify who was my 3rd generation paternal great grandfather on my father's side, the giver of my family name.

[mamacia]

Lol, where are the kosovo serbs? Dead or in vojvodina? What about you pricks setting dalmatia?

My village was made by albos, only albos have lived there so yeah it has nothing to do with you or your people


My mothers village in Kosovo was also made by Albanians and has an Albanian name and only Albanians live there. Nothing to do with Slavs.


As for these Serbs, they can say whatever they want, they are Slavic immigrants to me,

Many Albanian tribes originated in the mountains of Eastern Montenegro, Tropoja, Rugova mountains etc right at the border of Kosovo. My family supposedly comes from a tribe from there right at the border somewhere in the mountains. We don't have any family history or memory to of come from there but I am basing this of the tribe we belong to. As I explained many people that didn't originally belong to these tribes fused into these tribes anyway for protection and various other things.


I know Morina tribe and parts of Kelmendi also originated right at it's borders or close by. I am not familar with all the tribes. But I know Morina does. And also part of Gashi




Morina tribe (Albanian: fisi Morinë or fisi Marin) is a small tribe and historical region of the Gjakova highlands in Kosovo. The border post between Albania and Kosovo called Qafë Morinë (Morina Pass) lies on Morina territory, however the Morina have settled various parts of Kosovo, in particular Gjakova, Kamenica, Kosovo and Gjilan.[1]





https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morina_(tribe)

Such borders back then did not even exist. It's mostly just mountains that seperates these various areas. Plains of Kosovo were invaded by Slavs basically where as mountains of it's Western parts and the Malsi region is where Albanians survived.

There are no tribes that originated in Kosovo proper itself because Kosovo for it's most part isn't a mountainous area and had a government control and different empires ruling it, whereas these tribes were founded largely in areas that had no government control such as mountain areas and where the people were self ruled with their own laws, this is also how the Kanun was invented basically.

Even all Serbian tribes originated in mountainous areas around Montenegro.


On Average we have migrated by far much less. Especially taking into consideration that such borders back then didn't exist and there were Catholic Albanians always living in Western Kosovo at the border of Northern Albania and even Western Macedonia. I consider Kosovo and Macedonia basically just to be an extension of the Malsia but less mountainous, kinda like a plain or a center that basically at one point was run over by Slavs while we Albanians still maintained our independence in the mountains.


Compare these type of migrations coming basically from a border in some mountain area to a tribe migrating all the way from Poland ..... I find it ironic that these people think that Kosovo is some totally foreign land when literally some of our tribes originate right around the Rugova / North Albanian mountains, we were literally pushed out from Kosovo by Slavs I believe


Also, majority of Kosov Serbs are Slavic by Y-DNA And the ones that seem to have native haplogroups seem related to Albanians or some Vlachs or they came from Montenegro. Haven't seen any evidence of them being descendants of some type of Ancient Dardanians as they claim but I guess Ancient DNA will reveal more if we find Iron Age DNA from Kosovo.


It's more probable that Albanians are Dardanians anyway or at least the descendants of Dardans are the ancestors of Albanians since Dardanians did not exist by the time Romans occupied them, especially the Illyrians that lived in Western Kosovo certainly must of immigrated West into the mountains of Northern Albania when the Slavic tribes invaded the area and founded possibly some of these tribes. Its also possibly Illyrians in these mountains maintained their independence already during Roman times. I believe this is where Albanian language survived and that Vlachs are just Romanised Illyrians basically and there was basically some Vlach-Albanian co-existants around these areas including Macedonia and Kosovo up on till the Slavs arrived.

[Westbrook]

Test tube baby?
The south is usually easy to research, but not my direct paternal branch.

[InfamousAngel99]

Test tube baby?

Haha, no. My dad's direct paternal line is just very hard to follow. My dad's, dad's mother's side is VERY easy to research. Everyone with her maiden surname in the U.S. is related, and the rest of her family was very wealthy and kept great records.

[Div]

The south is usually easy to research, but not my direct paternal branch.

Most southerners are either English or Scots-Irish, crazy that you are so mixed

[InfamousAngel99]

Most southerners are either English or Scots-Irish, crazy that you are so mixed

I get most of my "mixture" from my mother, who only has one branch of her family that was in the U.S. before the 1900s. Her one branch that was from the U.S. was from the Northern states.

The last immigrant on my dad's side came to the U.S. from France in the early 1800s. His family has been in the south for hundreds of years. Some branches came to the U.S. in the 1600s.

[Oghuz]

Dagestan-Azerbaijan border and then Arran Azerbaijan also known as Caucasian Albania.