Oldest R1b-L151 found in Afanasievo

[Token]

So the oldest R1b-L151, directly ancestral to European R1b, was found in Mongolia in a Afanasievo barrow.

http://eurogenes.blogspot.com/2020/03/the-origins-of-east-asians-wang-et-al.html?m=1

Thoughts?

[Grace O'Malley]

So the oldest R1b-L151, directly ancestral to European R1b, was found in Mongolia in a Afanasievo barrow.

http://eurogenes.blogspot.com/2020/03/the-origins-of-east-asians-wang-et-al.html?m=1

Thoughts?

Really interesting. Hopefully more studies like this coming soon.

[Imperator Biff]

R1b-L51/151 confirmed from the Pontic steppe east repin horizon.
Like it was ever in any doubt.

Game over baby.

[Grace O'Malley]

R1b-L51/151 confirmed from the Pontic steppe east repin horizon.
Like it was ever in any doubt.

Game over baby.

Yes it's odd the way many people try to deny it. It's obvious with the autosomals that people have today. It's almost like logic goes out the window with some people. :)

[Token]

Yes, the sample was similar to other Afanasevo so it is game over, L51 is a steppe uniparental.

[Imperator Biff]

Yes it's odd the way many people try to deny it. It's obvious with the autosomals that people have today. It's almost like logic goes out the window with some people. :)

Even if we get more hi res samples from the region confirmed for the SNP those types will still deny it and claim it’s a ‘balkan’ or a ‘baltic’ lineage of some kind or even a neolithic marker that got its steppe component from CWC women even tho it’s brother subclade is dominant in Yamnaya. It’s sad how fucking deluded these people are.
Ultimately BB and Yamnaya have a common eneolithic steppe heritage, probably in Sredni Stog I would suspect.

[Raizen]

He was uploaded to the datasheet.

Distance: 3.3037% / 0.03303721
44.4 Anatolia_Barcin_N
27.4 MNG_Afanasievo_1
13.2 Yoruba
7.0 WHG
4.0 MAR_Taforalt
3.6 Surui
0.4 Hun_Tian_Shan

[Eline]

He was uploaded to the datasheet.

Distance: 3.3037% / 0.03303721
44.4 Anatolia_Barcin_N
27.4 MNG_Afanasievo_1
13.2 Yoruba
7.0 WHG
4.0 MAR_Taforalt
3.6 Surui
0.4 Hun_Tian_ShanAre these your results or his resutls?

Everybody knew that Afanasievo had some Yamnaya DNA mixed with the locals in Central Asia. But I didn't expect so much Yamnaya/44% West Asian Anatolia_Barcin_N there.

R1b in Afanasievo is most likely from the (late-P)IEans from Yamnaya.

[Ülev]

Modern distribution of haplogroup R1b-L51*
https://indo-european.eu/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/haplogroup-r1b-l51-basal.jpg

[Raizen]

Are these your results or his resutls?

Everybody knew that Afanasievo had some Yamnaya DNA mixed with the locals in Central Asia. But I didn't expect so much Yamnaya/44% West Asian Anatolia_Barcin_N there.

R1b in Afanasievo is most likely from the (late-P)IEans from Yamnaya.

This is me modelled with the new Afanasevo sample hehe, notice the Yoruba.

[Eline]

Yes! R1b is the major lineage from Yamnaya that was brought by the ealy Indo-Europeans into Europe.

Does anybody have gedmatch kit number of this man?

[Eline]

This is me modelled with the new Afanasevo sample hehe, notice the Yoruba.Oh ok. That makes more sense.

Afanasievo was Yamnaya-like. If you model yourself with Yamnaya you might score higher for Yamnya since Afanasievo was derived from Yamnya but not exactly the same.

[Joso]

Yes it's odd the way many people try to deny it. It's obvious with the autosomals that people have today. It's almost like logic goes out the window with some people. :)

There is nothing bad about it. Most people already had it in mind.
And, actually this is exactly what matters it the best hablogroup.
I=Afro-asiatic and iBerberian abomination :cool:

[Leto]

Indo-Europeans really spread far and wide. From Iberia to Mongolia, amazing.

[Token]

Indo-Europeans really spread far and wide. From Iberia to Mongolia, amazing.
How do we know this guy spoke Indo-European?

[Leto]

How do we know this guy spoke Indo-European?
What else would he have been if he was racially European?

[Raizen]

There is nothing bad about it. Most people already had it in mind.
And, actually this is exactly what matters it the best hablogroup.
I=Afro-asiatic and iBerberian abomination :cool:

I'm R1b-U106 bro, from Netherlands, North Brabant. What is your subclade?

[Turul Karom]

Not surprising. All R1 is Eurasian, ancestrally.

[Leto]

I'm R1b-U106 bro, from Netherlands, North Brabant. What is your subclade?
His subclade is Afro-Brazilian :swl

[Eline]

He was Western Eurasian with some Eastern Eurasian shift. He was not really an European by modern standards and had a different genetic profile than modern people.

[Voskos]

It looks like the real Mongolians were Nordic.

[Joso]

His subclade is Afro-Brazilian :swl

It is not however, it would be better to be it than to be a semite, because at least blacks are low IQ but not exactly evil.
At least, this weight in the conscience i don't have, my friend :cool:

[Eline]

His R1b is most likely from Yamnaya, but he could also speak some local unrelated language to Yamnya. Because some Eastern Eurasian haplogroups like Q are also found with him.

[Leto]

It is not however, it would be better to be it than to be a semite, because at least blacks are dumn but not exactly evli.
At least, this weight in the conscience i don't have, my friend :cool:
Do you actually know your DNA results? I was obviously trollin'.

[Leto]

It looks like the real Mongolians were Nordic.
I guess whites in that region were gradually submerged by chinks.

[Eline]

It looks like the real Mongolians were Nordic.
Not really.

First, that R1b guy was not really 'Nordic'. Original Yamnaya was not 'Nordic' and he also mixed with the locals in Central Asia.
Second, Mongolians slowly replaced and assimilated those people. There is almost no R1b in modern Mongolians.

[Raizen]

His subclade is Afro-Brazilian :swl

So R1b-DF27? Hehe.

[Raizen]

It is not however, it would be better to be it than to be a semite, because at least blacks are low IQ but not exactly evil.
At least, this weight in the conscience i don't have, my friend :cool:
Why are you talking shit about other haplogroups if you don't even know yours, lol. It is quite possible that you are 'iBerberian'.

[Joso]

Do you actually know your DNA results? I was obviously trollin'.

It is ok, it was just a fact i wanted to say.
I prefer to be around low IQ people than around manipulative ones.

[Joso]

Why are you talking shit about other haplogroups if you don't even know yours, lol. It is quite possible that you are 'iBerberian'.

Even if i was it, nothing would change because the logic knows no owner.
Studying mathematics is very cool, bro

[Raizen]

Even if i was it, nothing would change because the logic knows no owner.
Studying mathematics is very cool, bro

So would you still talk shit about your haplogroup and bow down before R1b, i doubt

[Raizen]

I guess whites in that region were gradually submerged by chinks.

Can you please stop referring to other races with derogatory terms, no one does that with whites

[Leto]

Can you please stop referring to other races with derogatory terms, no one does that with whites
Come on, dude, don't be an SJW. I'm part ching-chong myself unfortunately, so I have a pass ;)

[Raizen]

Come on, dude, don't be an SJW. I'm part ching-chong myself unfortunately, so I have a pass ;)
Ok then i allow you.

[Synapsid]

They found R1a-417 in Stredny stog, but how L51 got into the bell beakers without CWC interferance is another question. As I said before, some say that Steppe ancestry in Beaker folks were similar but distinct from Corded ware culture due to the discrepancies in Y-DNA, but I don't currently hold that view. I believe both Beakers and CWC were both descendants of Stredny Stog II (who had R1a-417), with Beakers having additional HG admixture, before migrating and mixing with Globular amphora/TRB farmers. I believe this Hunter Gatherer admixture is crucial, since they found in P312 in some HG samples. Token said that Volosovo might be this prime canditate. Beakers might have followed a nothern route (across the sea, like they did in Britain?) before entering the Northern European plaiins. This might explain the Y-DNA difference between Beakers and CWC

[Grace O'Malley]

They found R1a-417 in Stredny stog, but how L51 got into the bell beakers without CWC interferance is another question. As I said before, some say that Steppe ancestry in Beaker folks were similar but distinct from Corded ware culture due to the discrepancies in Y-DNA, but I don't currently hold that view. I believe both Beakers and CWC were both descendants of Stredny Stog II (who had R1a-417), with Beakers having additional HG admixture, before migrating and mixing with Globular amphora/TRB farmers. I believe this Hunter Gatherer admixture is crucial, since they found in P312 in some HG samples. Token said that Volosovo might be this prime canditate. Beakers might have followed a nothern route (across the sea, like they did in Britain?) before entering the Northern European plaiins. This might explain the Y-DNA difference between Beakers and CWC

From what I've heard very early Corded Ware had R1b-L51 so it looks like Bell Beaker came from Corded Ware.

[Grace O'Malley]

Large distances to myself.

Distance to: Grace_scaled
0.14126442 MNG_Afanasievo_1:I6221
0.14495325 MNG_Afanasievo_1:I6222
0.18563267 MNG_Sagly_EIA_4:I7024
0.21294521 MNG_Sagly_EIA_4:I6233
0.22308399 MNG_Mongun_Taiga_LBA_3:I6363
0.22733947 MNG_Chemurchek_EBA_2:I12957
0.22748123 MNG_Pazyryk_EIA_6:I6263
0.23288240 MNG_EIA_2:I6364
0.23301483 MNG_Center_West_LBA_5:I6367
0.23500852 MNG_Center_West_LBA_5:I6362
0.23865071 MNG_Chemurchek_EBA_2:I12978
0.24080494 MNG_Mongun_Taiga_LBA_3:I7033
0.25019088 MNG_Sagly_EIA_4:I12970
0.25094615 MNG_Sagly_EIA_4:I6232
0.26132036 MNG_Sagly_EIA_4:I7023
0.26701804 MNG_Sagly_EIA_4:I6224
0.27629786 MNG_Sagly_EIA_4:I6226
0.28013934 MNG_Sagly_EIA_4:I7030
0.28454817 MNG_Sagly_EIA_4:I7029
0.28541275 MNG_Sagly_EIA_4:I7027
0.28654902 MNG_Sagly_EIA_4:I6231
0.28887131 MNG_EIA_5:I13965
0.29154309 MNG_Sagly_EIA_4:I6230
0.31571511 MNG_Mongun_Taiga_LBA_3:I12976
0.35758704 MNG_Sagly_EIA_4:I7022

Target: Grace_scaled
Distance: 14.0051% / 0.14005094
87.2 MNG_Afanasievo_1
12.8 MNG_Sagly_EIA_4

Target: Grace_scaled
Distance: 14.0051% / 0.14005094
82.6 MNG_Afanasievo_1:I6221
12.8 MNG_Sagly_EIA_4:I7024
4.6 MNG_Afanasievo_1:I6222

This is the spreadsheet in anyone wants to use it.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1ixQrFPZII-LL4_z-16TQEwrDUqDB-sNC/view

[Rocinante]

https://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=96587&d=1585305361

I'm R1b-L151 but Morley doesn't give me any other subclade. Anyone knows how to read this in a better way, so it can give a clue for the next subclade?

[Raizen]

https://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=96587&d=1585305361

I'm R1b-L151 but Morley doesn't give me any other subclade. Anyone knows how to read this in a better way, so it can give a clue for the next subclade?

90% chance that you are DF27, but the only way to know for sure is to pay money.

[Rocinante]

90% chance that you are DF27, but the only way to know for sure is to pay money.

How do you reach to that conclusion?

[Raizen]

How do you reach to that conclusion?

Because 90% of Iberian R1b is DF27 but everything is possible ofc, there are Iberians here who are L21.

[Rocinante]

Because 90% of Iberian R1b is DF27 but everything is possible ofc, there are Iberians here who are L21.

In the west, most common R1b is L21.

[Raizen]

In the west, most common R1b is L21.

:laugh:

[Rocinante]

:laugh:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/ac/R-L21.png

I don't know what's so funny, but lacking of basque genetics in the west and a bit more celtic origin in the west, make sense that the most common R1b there would be L21.

[Grace O'Malley]

In the west, most common R1b is L21.

No all of Iberia when looking at R1b is mostly DF27. So most people of that ancestry will highly likely be DF27. Did you get tested at 23&Me?

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/proxy/jo8b-2f92zut_G_jwX_-umzkJ0Ase4yEN0UUYbsMMpEtDfPtj54Mh8nN7VUFHz9ggykJzc dEqqZsCa8UO5GPCR79zuYTTLmhAPdZGrbz6oF8MUJ2T9JV94Sb BifwFw

[Raizen]

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/ac/R-L21.png

I don't know what's so funny, but lacking of basque genetics in the west and a bit more celtic origin in the west, make sense that the most common R1b there would be L21.
As your map shows, L21 is not the majority of west iberians R1b, because west iberia is 50% R1b and only 10% of it is L21.

[Rocinante]

No all of Iberia when looking at R1b is mostly DF27. So most people of that ancestry will highly likely be DF27. Did you get tested at 23&Me?

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/proxy/jo8b-2f92zut_G_jwX_-umzkJ0Ase4yEN0UUYbsMMpEtDfPtj54Mh8nN7VUFHz9ggykJzc dEqqZsCa8UO5GPCR79zuYTTLmhAPdZGrbz6oF8MUJ2T9JV94Sb BifwFw

I wish i tested with 23andme, it was with ShitHeritage :lmao but i'm planning to test with LivingDNA in the future. I know most common R1b in Iberia is DF27 (i'm actually wishing it, just to challenge genetics, because i never score basque in any calc :lmao


As your map shows, L21 is not the majority of west iberians R1b, because west iberia is 50% R1b and only 10% of it is L21.

I didn't meant it was the majority, but it's pretty common. Almost all R1b old portuguese and galician TA users are L21. R1b-DF27 is more common though.

[Luso]

Hi, I'm Iberian with R1b-L51