Italian Gedmatch results [100% APULIAN]

[andre]

He's a friend's friend. He took My heritage dna test.

Y-dna: J2a1h
Mtdna:?

K36 MAP: 96635

He's parents are both from Salento, in Apulia.

My questions are:

1. He could have some slavic admix?

2. He has a strong hellenic background?


EUROGENES K13

Mixed Mode:
1 84,77% East_Sicilian + 15,23% Greek_Thessaly @ 1,616
2 93,36% East_Sicilian + 6,64% Bulgarian @ 1,695
3 94,92% East_Sicilian + 5,08% Serbian @ 1,705
4 94,14% East_Sicilian + 5,86% Romanian @ 1,710
5 96,48% East_Sicilian + 3,52% Croatian @ 1,735
6 96,48% East_Sicilian + 3,52% Austrian @ 1,745
7 97,27% East_Sicilian + 2,73% South_Polish @ 1,748
8 97,27% East_Sicilian + 2,73% Ukrainian @ 1,749
9 96,48% East_Sicilian + 3,52% Hungarian @ 1,750
10 97,27% East_Sicilian + 2,73% Polish @ 1,751

Least-squares method.

Using 1 populations approximation
1 100% East_Sicilian @ 2,171
2 100% Central_Greek @ 2,571
3 100% South_Italian @ 5,518
4 100% West_Sicilian @ 5,981
5 100% Italian_Abruzzo @ 6,275
6 100% Ashkenazi @ 7,306
7 100% Greek_Thessaly @ 8,372
8 100% Sephardic_Jew @ 11,854
9 100% Algerian_Jew @ 12,012
10 100% Italian_Jew @ 12,162

Using 2 populations approximation
1 50% East_Sicilian + 50% Central_Greek @ 1,859
2 50% East_Sicilian + 50% East_Sicilian @ 2,171
3 50% Central_Greek + 50% Central_Greek @ 2,571
4 50% South_Italian + 50% Greek_Thessaly @ 2,669
5 50% Central_Greek + 50% West_Sicilian @ 2,904
6 50% Greek_Thessaly + 50% Sephardic_Jew @ 2,977
7 50% East_Sicilian + 50% West_Sicilian @ 3,260
8 50% East_Sicilian + 50% Italian_Abruzzo @ 3,265
9 50% Central_Greek + 50% South_Italian @ 3,356
10 50% Central_Greek + 50% Ashkenazi @ 3,504

Using 3 populations approximation
1 33% East_Sicilian + 33% South_Italian + 33% Greek_Thessaly @ 1,834
2 33% East_Sicilian + 33% East_Sicilian + 33% Central_Greek @ 1,840
3 33% East_Sicilian + 33% Central_Greek + 33% Central_Greek @ 2,004
4 33% East_Sicilian + 33% East_Sicilian + 33% East_Sicilian @ 2,171
5 33% East_Sicilian + 33% Central_Greek + 33% West_Sicilian @ 2,185
6 33% Central_Greek + 33% Central_Greek + 33% West_Sicilian @ 2,234
7 33% Italian_Abruzzo + 33% Greek_Thessaly + 33% Algerian_Jew @ 2,265
8 33% South_Italian + 33% South_Italian + 33% Greek_Thessaly @ 2,305
9 33% Central_Greek + 33% South_Italian + 33% Greek_Thessaly @ 2,309
10 33% East_Sicilian + 33% East_Sicilian + 33% Greek_Thessaly @ 2,398

Using 4 populations approximation
1 25% East_Sicilian + 25% East_Sicilian + 25% South_Italian + 25% Greek_Thessaly @ 1,610
2 25% East_Sicilian + 25% East_Sicilian + 25% Central_Greek + 25% Central_Greek @ 1,859
3 25% East_Sicilian + 25% East_Sicilian + 25% East_Sicilian + 25% Central_Greek @ 1,879
4 25% East_Sicilian + 25% East_Sicilian + 25% East_Sicilian + 25% Greek_Thessaly @ 1,882
5 25% East_Sicilian + 25% East_Sicilian + 25% Central_Greek + 25% West_Sicilian @ 1,962
6 25% East_Sicilian + 25% East_Sicilian + 25% Central_Greek + 25% Greek_Thessaly @ 2,065
7 25% Central_Greek + 25% Central_Greek + 25% West_Sicilian + 25% Ashkenazi @ 2,079
8 25% Central_Greek + 25% Central_Greek + 25% Central_Greek + 25% West_Sicilian @ 2,082
9 25% East_Sicilian + 25% East_Sicilian + 25% East_Sicilian + 25% East_Sicilian @ 2,171
10 25% East_Sicilian + 25% East_Sicilian + 25% Central_Greek + 25% Italian_Abruzzo @ 2,187

DODECAD K12b

Mixed Mode:
1 81,64% C_Italian_D + 18,36% Samaritians @ 1,853
2 77,73% Ashkenazi_D + 22,27% N_Italian_D @ 2,113
3 94,92% S_Italian_Sicilian_D + 5,08% Finnish_D @ 2,140
4 94,92% S_Italian_Sicilian_D + 5,08% Lithuanians @ 2,155
5 66,80% Ashkenazi_D + 33,20% O_Italian_D @ 2,169
6 94,92% S_Italian_Sicilian_D + 5,08% Lithuanian_D @ 2,174
7 93,36% S_Italian_Sicilian_D + 6,64% Polish_D @ 2,178
8 94,14% S_Italian_Sicilian_D + 5,86% Belorussian @ 2,183
9 94,92% S_Italian_Sicilian_D + 5,08% FIN30 @ 2,187
10 69,92% Ashkenazi_D + 30,08% TSI30 @ 2,193

Least-squares method.

Using 1 populations approximation
1 100% Sicilian_D @ 4,299
2 100% S_Italian_Sicilian_D @ 4,355
3 100% Ashkenazi_D @ 6,108
4 100% Ashkenazy_Jews @ 6,740
5 100% Greek_D @ 7,143
6 100% C_Italian_D @ 7,961
7 100% Sephardic_Jews @ 11,113
8 100% O_Italian_D @ 11,816
9 100% Tuscan @ 12,335
10 100% Morocco_Jews @ 13,495

Using 2 populations approximation
1 50% Ashkenazi_D + 50% C_Italian_D @ 2,531
2 50% Ashkenazy_Jews + 50% C_Italian_D @ 2,918
3 50% Sephardic_Jews + 50% O_Italian_D @ 3,190
4 50% Sicilian_D + 50% Greek_D @ 3,456
5 50% S_Italian_Sicilian_D + 50% Greek_D @ 3,539
6 50% Ashkenazi_D + 50% O_Italian_D @ 3,664
7 50% N_Italian_D + 50% Cypriots @ 3,684
8 50% Ashkenazy_Jews + 50% O_Italian_D @ 4,067
9 50% Ashkenazi_D + 50% Tuscan @ 4,089
10 50% Greek_D + 50% Morocco_Jews @ 4,125

Using 3 populations approximation
1 33% Ashkenazi_D + 33% Ashkenazi_D + 33% O_Italian_D @ 2,170
2 33% S_Italian_Sicilian_D + 33% Ashkenazi_D + 33% O_Italian_D @ 2,236
3 33% Greek_D + 33% C_Italian_D + 33% Sephardic_Jews @ 2,294
4 33% Ashkenazi_D + 33% Ashkenazi_D + 33% TSI30 @ 2,294
5 33% Sicilian_D + 33% Ashkenazi_D + 33% O_Italian_D @ 2,349
6 33% Greek_D + 33% C_Italian_D + 33% Morocco_Jews @ 2,436
7 33% Greek_D + 33% Sephardic_Jews + 33% O_Italian_D @ 2,442
8 33% Ashkenazi_D + 33% Ashkenazy_Jews + 33% TSI30 @ 2,476
9 33% Greek_D + 33% Greek_D + 33% Morocco_Jews @ 2,496
10 33% Ashkenazi_D + 33% Ashkenazi_D + 33% Tuscan @ 2,499

Using 4 populations approximation
1 25% Cypriots + 25% Cypriots + 25% Bulgarian_D + 25% Murcia_1KG @ 1,998
2 25% Greek_D + 25% Greek_D + 25% C_Italian_D + 25% Morocco_Jews @ 2,011
3 25% O_Italian_D + 25% O_Italian_D + 25% Tuscan + 25% Samaritians @ 2,103
4 25% C_Italian_D + 25% C_Italian_D + 25% O_Italian_D + 25% Samaritians @ 2,151
5 25% S_Italian_Sicilian_D + 25% S_Italian_Sicilian_D + 25% Ashkenazi_D + 25% O_Italian_D @ 2,154
6 25% Ashkenazi_D + 25% Ashkenazi_D + 25% Ashkenazi_D + 25% N_Italian_D @ 2,263
7 25% Sicilian_D + 25% Sicilian_D + 25% Ashkenazi_D + 25% O_Italian_D @ 2,272
8 25% Ashkenazi_D + 25% Ashkenazi_D + 25% Ashkenazy_Jews + 25% N_Italian_D @ 2,357
9 25% Ashkenazi_D + 25% Ashkenazi_D + 25% Ashkenazi_D + 25% TSI30 @ 2,377
10 25% S_Italian_Sicilian_D + 25% S_Italian_Sicilian_D + 25% Ashkenazy_Jews + 25% O_Italian_D @ 2,465

MDLP K16

Mixed Mode:
1 83,20% Italian_228 + 16,80% Turk_482 @ 2,301
2 66,80% Greek_179 + 33,20% Cypriot_113 @ 2,458
3 96,48% Greek_185 + 3,52% BedouinB_71 @ 2,521
4 65,23% Cypriot_113 + 34,77% German_173 @ 2,531
5 60,55% Greek_184 + 39,45% Italian_228 @ 2,561
6 54,30% Greek_184 + 45,70% Sicilian_433 @ 2,612
7 50,39% Italian_225 + 49,61% Greek_184 @ 2,619
8 50,39% Greek_184 + 49,61% Italian_225 @ 2,620
9 67,58% Greek_185 + 32,42% Jew_238 @ 2,644
10 50,39% Sicilian_433 + 49,61% Greek_184 @ 2,646

Least-squares method.

Using 1 populations approximation
1 100% Greek_185 @ 3,970
2 100% Jew_1_257 @ 4,412
3 100% Italian_225 @ 4,506
4 100% Greek_184 @ 4,583
5 100% Jew_2_258 @ 5,221
6 100% Sicilian_433 @ 5,239
7 100% Greek_180 @ 5,618
8 100% Italian_228 @ 6,340
9 100% Jew_238 @ 6,708
10 100% Maltese_328 @ 6,863

Using 2 populations approximation
1 50% Italian_225 + 50% Greek_184 @ 2,620
2 50% Greek_184 + 50% Sicilian_433 @ 2,641
3 50% Jew_1_257 + 50% Greek_184 @ 2,690
4 50% Greek_184 + 50% Italian_228 @ 2,749
5 50% Greek_185 + 50% Jew_1_257 @ 2,785
6 50% Greek_184 + 50% Jew_2_258 @ 2,844
7 50% Greek_185 + 50% Jew_2_258 @ 2,930
8 50% Greek_185 + 50% Jew_238 @ 3,091
9 50% Greek_185 + 50% Italian_225 @ 3,316
10 50% Cypriot_113 + 50% Macedonian_324 @ 3,375

Using 3 populations approximation
1 33% Greek_179 + 33% Greek_179 + 33% Cypriot_113 @ 2,457
2 33% Cypriot_113 + 33% Cypriot_113 + 33% German_173 @ 2,589
3 33% Greek_184 + 33% Greek_184 + 33% Italian_228 @ 2,630
4 33% Greek_185 + 33% Greek_185 + 33% Jew_238 @ 2,645
5 33% Jew_1_257 + 33% Italian_225 + 33% Greek_184 @ 2,684
6 33% Greek_185 + 33% Jew_1_257 + 33% Greek_184 @ 2,710
7 33% Greek_185 + 33% Greek_185 + 33% Jew_245 @ 2,754
8 33% Greek_184 + 33% Greek_184 + 33% Sicilian_433 @ 2,796
9 33% Greek_185 + 33% Greek_185 + 33% Jew_251 @ 2,826
10 33% Cypriot_113 + 33% Cypriot_113 + 33% French_155 @ 2,828

Using 4 populations approximation
1 25% Greek_184 + 25% Greek_184 + 25% Jew_2_258 + 25% Italian_228 @ 2,450
2 25% Greek_184 + 25% Greek_184 + 25% Jew_2_258 + 25% Sicilian_433 @ 2,577
3 25% Italian_225 + 25% Italian_225 + 25% Greek_184 + 25% Greek_184 @ 2,620
4 25% Greek_185 + 25% Greek_185 + 25% Greek_185 + 25% Jew_251 @ 2,715
5 25% Greek_185 + 25% Greek_185 + 25% Greek_185 + 25% Jew_238 @ 2,730
6 25% Greek_185 + 25% Greek_185 + 25% Greek_185 + 25% Jew_245 @ 2,748
7 25% Greek_185 + 25% Greek_185 + 25% Jew_1_257 + 25% Jew_238 @ 2,762
8 25% Greek_185 + 25% Greek_185 + 25% Jew_1_257 + 25% Jew_1_257 @ 2,785
9 25% Greek_180 + 25% Greek_180 + 25% Italian_228 + 25% Cypriot_113 @ 2,791
10 25% Greek_185 + 25% Greek_185 + 25% Jew_1_257 + 25% Jew_251 @ 2,792

[Leto]

Doesn't look like normal Gedmatch to me. Where are the admix proportions?

[andre]

Doesn't look like normal Gedmatch to me. Where are the admix proportions?

I used Admixturestudio since i'm waiting for the data on Gedmatch.

[WeirdLookingFellow]

I used Admixturestudio since i'm waiting for the data on Gedmatch.

Admix studio still gives you the proportions.

[andre]

k13

Component %
North_Atlantic 17,28%
Baltic 10,37%
West_Med 21,79%
West_Asian 13,53%
East_Med 29,68%
Red_Sea 6,43%
South_Asian 0,05%
East_Asian 0,11%
Amerindian 0,34%
Northeast_African 0,41%
Sub-Saharan 0,02%

[andre]

Distance to: G_K13

2.23696223 East_Sicilian
2.57382983 Central_Greek
3.93606402 Apulia
4.56830384 Molise
4.75876034 Sicily
4.81017671 Campania
5.00507742 Malta
5.16755261 Abruzzo
5.33239158 Basilicata
5.81859089 Greek_Andros_Island
6.17446354 Calabria
6.65257093 West_Sicilian
7.13707223 Ashkenazi
7.56795877 Greek_Peloponnese
7.62422291 GR_Peloponese
8.25133323 Turk_Crete
8.56481757 Greek_Eastern-Thrace
8.67348258 Greek_Thessaly
8.69695349 Greek_Western-Thrace
9.39099036 Greek_Chios
9.40193597 Greek_Macedonia_Thrace
9.84603600 Greek_Dodecanese
10.17313128 Vlach_Central-Macedonia
10.41401460 Greek_Symi_Island
10.55120372 Greek_Eastern-Macedonia

[andre]

k12b

Component %
Gedrosia 4,10%
Northwest_African 3,11%
Southeast_Asian 0,01%
Atlantic_Med 29,32%
North_European 15,24%
South_Asian 0,10%
Southwest_Asian 13,36%
East_Asian 0,01%
Caucasus 34,75%

[Leto]

Freaking Samnium would like these results xD

[Leto]

You may want to add K15 as well.

[andre]

Eurogenes k15

North_Sea 9,37%
Atlantic 13,44%
Baltic 6,43%
Eastern_Euro 4,59%
West_Med 17,95%
West_Asian 13,94%
East_Med 27,52%
Red_Sea 6,59%
South_Asian 0,01%
Amerindian 0,08%
Northeast_African 0,06%


Mixed Mode:
1 74,61% Italy_East_Sicily + 25,39% Macedonian_2 @ 1,929
2 73,05% Italy_Calabria + 26,95% Macedonian_2 @ 2,026
3 84,77% Italy_East_Sicily + 15,23% Serbian_Bosnia @ 2,074
4 83,20% Italy_East_Sicily + 16,80% Serbian @ 2,078
5 83,20% Italy_East_Sicily + 16,80% Romania_Nw @ 2,079
6 81,64% Italy_East_Sicily + 18,36% Montenegrin @ 2,107
7 87,11% Italy_East_Sicily + 12,89% Croatian @ 2,118
8 81,64% Italy_East_Sicily + 18,36% Romania_Se @ 2,122
9 80,08% Italy_East_Sicily + 19,92% Macedonian @ 2,127
10 80,08% Italy_Calabria + 19,92% Romania_Se @ 2,149

Least-squares method.

Using 1 populations approximation
1 100% Central_Greek @ 2,956
2 100% East_Sicilian @ 3,061
3 100% Italy_Apulia @ 3,070
4 100% Italy_Abruzzo @ 4,106
5 100% Italy_Campania @ 4,224
6 100% Italy_West_Sicily @ 4,414
7 100% Italy_Central_Sicily @ 4,611
8 100% Ashkenazi @ 5,164
9 100% Italy_East_Sicily @ 5,226
10 100% Greek_Crete @ 5,494

Using 2 populations approximation
1 50% Italy_Campania + 50% Ashkenazi @ 2,365
2 50% Sephardic_Jewish + 50% Albanian-North @ 2,407
3 50% Italy_Apulia + 50% Ashkenazi @ 2,526
4 50% Central_Greek + 50% East_Sicilian @ 2,611
5 50% Greek_Thessaly + 50% Sephardic_Jewish @ 2,664
6 50% Italy_East_Sicily + 50% GR_Peloponese @ 2,674
7 50% East_Sicilian + 50% Italy_Apulia @ 2,702
8 50% Italy_Calabria + 50% Albanian-South @ 2,718
9 50% Italy_Calabria + 50% GR_Peloponese @ 2,723
10 50% Central_Greek + 50% Italy_Apulia @ 2,783

Using 3 populations approximation
1 33% Italy_Apulia + 33% Italy_Campania + 33% Ashkenazi @ 2,060
2 33% Italy_Apulia + 33% Italy_Apulia + 33% Ashkenazi @ 2,191
3 33% Italy_East_Sicily + 33% Italy_Calabria + 33% Albanian-Macedonia @ 2,234
4 33% Italy_East_Sicily + 33% Italy_East_Sicily + 33% Albanian-Macedonia @ 2,267
5 33% Italy_Calabria + 33% Italy_Calabria + 33% Albanian-Macedonia @ 2,296
6 33% Italy_Abruzzo + 33% Italy_Campania + 33% Ashkenazi @ 2,318
7 33% Ashkenazi + 33% Greek_Crete + 33% West_Sicilian @ 2,331
8 33% Italy_East_Sicily + 33% Italy_East_Sicily + 33% Albanian-South @ 2,355
9 33% Italy_Calabria + 33% Italy_Calabria + 33% Albanian-Kosovo @ 2,380
10 33% Italy_East_Sicily + 33% Italy_Calabria + 33% Albanian-South @ 2,381

Using 4 populations approximation
1 25% Italy_East_Sicily + 25% Italy_East_Sicily + 25% Italy_Calabria + 25% Macedonian_2 @ 1,912
2 25% Italy_East_Sicily + 25% Italy_East_Sicily + 25% Italy_East_Sicily + 25% Macedonian_2 @ 1,930
3 25% Italy_Calabria + 25% Italy_Calabria + 25% Italy_Calabria + 25% Macedonian_2 @ 2,062
4 25% Italy_West_Sicily + 25% Italy_West_Sicily + 25% Ashkenazi + 25% Greek @ 2,092
5 25% Italy_Apulia + 25% Italy_Apulia + 25% Italy_Campania + 25% Ashkenazi @ 2,134
6 25% Italy_Apulia + 25% Italy_Apulia + 25% Italy_Apulia + 25% Ashkenazi @ 2,233
7 25% Italy_East_Sicily + 25% Italy_East_Sicily + 25% Italy_East_Sicily + 25% Albanian-Macedonia @ 2,323
8 25% Italy_East_Sicily + 25% Italy_East_Sicily + 25% Italy_Calabria + 25% Albanian-Kosovo @ 2,333
9 25% Italy_East_Sicily + 25% Italy_East_Sicily + 25% Italy_Calabria + 25% Albanian-Macedonia @ 2,343
10 25% Italy_Central_Sicily + 25% Italy_Central_Sicily + 25% Ashkenazi + 25% Greek @ 2,343

[andre]

He has some Illyrian admixture for sure.

[Ion Basescul]

I don't know where you guys are seeing Slavic. It's probably Arbereshe (Italian Albanian), since Apulia was their main settlement.

[Leto]

To me normal Southern Italian, maybe a little less Southern than some others but still quite regular.

[Ion Basescul]

To me normal Southern Italian, maybe a little less Southern than some others but still quite regular.

This is even more likely than assuming other ancestries. These results look normal for that area. The second population simply adds some Northern-like ancestry to compensate. The guy isn't East Sicilian afterall.

1 84,77% East_Sicilian + 15,23% Greek_Thessaly @ 1,616
2 93,36% East_Sicilian + 6,64% Bulgarian @ 1,695
3 94,92% East_Sicilian + 5,08% Serbian @ 1,705
4 94,14% East_Sicilian + 5,86% Romanian @ 1,710
5 96,48% East_Sicilian + 3,52% Croatian @ 1,735
6 96,48% East_Sicilian + 3,52% Austrian @ 1,745
7 97,27% East_Sicilian + 2,73% South_Polish @ 1,748
8 97,27% East_Sicilian + 2,73% Ukrainian @ 1,749
9 96,48% East_Sicilian + 3,52% Hungarian @ 1,750
10 97,27% East_Sicilian + 2,73% Polish @ 1,751

[xripkan]

He has recent Greek ancestry for sure. Not very different to Mainland Greeks. His haplogroups must be either Roman or Ancient Greek. Salento is the area where Griko people live.
I would like to see G25 results of this individual.

[xripkan]

This is even more likely than assuming other ancestries. These results look normal for that area. The second population simply adds some Northern-like ancestry to compensate. The guy isn't East Sicilian afterall.

1 84,77% East_Sicilian + 15,23% Greek_Thessaly @ 1,616
2 93,36% East_Sicilian + 6,64% Bulgarian @ 1,695
3 94,92% East_Sicilian + 5,08% Serbian @ 1,705
4 94,14% East_Sicilian + 5,86% Romanian @ 1,710
5 96,48% East_Sicilian + 3,52% Croatian @ 1,735
6 96,48% East_Sicilian + 3,52% Austrian @ 1,745
7 97,27% East_Sicilian + 2,73% South_Polish @ 1,748
8 97,27% East_Sicilian + 2,73% Ukrainian @ 1,749
9 96,48% East_Sicilian + 3,52% Hungarian @ 1,750
10 97,27% East_Sicilian + 2,73% Polish @ 1,751

Check my results. We are similar, I have just more Northern input

80.3% South_Italian + 19.7% Polish @ 1.74
81.3% South_Italian + 18.7% Belorussian @ 1.74
74.5% South_Italian + 25.5% Croatian @ 1.74
79% South_Italian + 21% South_Polish @ 1.81

[Pubiczar]

I don't know where you guys are seeing Slavic. It's probably Arbereshe (Italian Albanian), since Apulia was their main settlement.

Well if it's an Arbereshe admix isn't that a sign of indirectly Slavic admix?
Any post medieval Slavic migrations Balkan population has Slavic dna.
Also Arbereshe are an interesting population and not quite the same as the Albanians. Recent dna paper about Arbereshe showed that J2b2, the main haplogroup among the Albanians is quite low in Arbereshe. While I2a is found much more in Arbereshe than in modern Albanians.

[Pubiczar]

Double

[xripkan]

Well if it's an Arbereshe admix isn't that a sign of indirectly Slavic admix?
Any post medieval Slavic migrations Balkan population has Slavic dna.
Also Arbereshe are an interesting population and not quite the same as the Albanians. Recent dna paper about Arbereshe showed that J2b2, the main haplogroup among the Albanians is quite low in Arbereshe. While I2a is found much more in Arbereshe than in modern Albanians.

He seems shifted towards Mainland Greeks so his minor Slavic admixture must be from this recent Greek ancestry. Furthermore Arbereshe live in Northern Apulia. He is from Salento.

[Raizen]

He has some Balkan ancestry, this is normal for Apulia

[Pribislav]

Well if it's an Arbereshe admix isn't that a sign of indirectly Slavic admix?
Any post medieval Slavic migrations Balkan population has Slavic dna.
Also Arbereshe are an interesting population and not quite the same as the Albanians. Recent dna paper about Arbereshe showed that J2b2, the main haplogroup among the Albanians is quite low in Arbereshe. While I2a is found much more in Arbereshe than in modern Albanians.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serbs_in_Italy#History

[Pubiczar]

He seems shifted towards Mainland Greeks so his minor Slavic admixture must be from this recent Greek ancestry. Furthermore Arbereshe live in Northern Apulia. He is from Salento.

It probably it is Greek although when it's Apulia in question anything is possible. I think Apulia has recent Balkan ancestry the most out of all Italian regions. Most of my Italian matches on 23andMe are actually from Apulia.

[andre]

Distance to: G_MDLPK16
2.72374742 Romanian_Jew
2.96187441 Italian_WestSicily
3.29569416 Italian_South
3.95092394 Ashkenazi_Jew
4.07132657 Sicilian
4.13396904 Italian_AgriculturalSicily
4.22042652 Italian_EastSicily
4.60770008 Italy_South
4.63237520 Italy_Abruzzo
4.75475551 Italian_CentralSicily
5.11662975 Greek_Laconia
5.19805733 Greek_WGA
5.28221544 Greek_Turkey
5.36607864 Cretan
5.41682564 Greek_CentralGreece
6.27490239 Maltese
6.28299292 Greek-Macedonia
6.50732664 Bulgarian_Jewish
6.94268680 Greek_Coriell
7.06485669 Greek-Peloponness
7.08282430 Greek
7.35135362 Italian_Jewish
7.68565547 Greek-Islands
8.12756421 Bulgarian_EastRumelia
8.14483732 Albanian

[andre]

Distance to: G_K13
2.23696223 East_Sicilian
2.57382983 Central_Greek
3.93606402 Apulia
4.56830384 Molise
4.75876034 Sicily
4.81017671 Campania
5.00507742 Malta
5.16755261 Abruzzo
5.33239158 Basilicata
5.81859089 Greek_Andros_Island
6.17446354 Calabria
6.65257093 West_Sicilian
7.13707223 Ashkenazi
7.56795877 Greek_Peloponnese
7.62422291 GR_Peloponese
8.25133323 Turk_Crete
8.56481757 Greek_Eastern-Thrace
8.67348258 Greek_Thessaly
8.69695349 Greek_Western-Thrace
9.39099036 Greek_Chios
9.40193597 Greek_Macedonia_Thrace
9.84603600 Greek_Dodecanese
10.17313128 Vlach_Central-Macedonia
10.41401460 Greek_Symi_Island
10.55120372 Greek_Eastern-Macedonia

Target: Gianluca_K13
Distance: 1.2479% / 1.24794315 | ADC: 0.25x
48.4 East_Sicilian
43.0 Central_Greek
4.2 Pomak_Xanthi
2.2 Sardinian
1.2 Yemenite_Jewish
1.0 Ashkenazi

[Jana]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serbs_in_Italy#History

Molisse Croats are not Serbs, imbecile. Seek psychiatric help.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molise_Croats

[Leto]

Have you seen that guy's face?

[Pribislav]

Molisse Croats are not Serbs, imbecile. Seek psychiatric help.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molise_Croats

Serbian despitate was Croatian state and Đurađ Branković was Croatian? :coffee:

You don't have controle on yourself!

[andre]

Have you seen that guy's face?

Yes, he could pass it’s dark skinned with green eyes.. could pass as israeli easly. (Mixed Ashkenazi with Sephardim)
In balkans he would be sooo gypsy.

[Leto]

Yes, he could pass it’s dark skinned with green eyes.. could pass as israeli easly. (Mixed Ashkenazi with Sephardim)
In balkans he would be sooo gypsy.
Damn, that's unexpected. His results aren't super swarthy or woggy.

[Jana]

Serbian despitate was Croatian state and Đurađ Branković was Croatian? :coffee:

You don't have controle on yourself!

You know well what I am talking about, little troll.

[Leto]

@Feiichy, stop attacking him, nobody cares about Serbs and Croats, it's not a freaking Balkan thread!

[Leto]

This is why TA is a piece of shit forum. I dislike the excessively liberal fucks on Anthrogenica but at the same time I can understand why some people are put off by TA.

[Jana]

@Feiichy, stop attacking him, nobody cares about Serbs and Croats, it's not a freaking Balkan thread!

Stop attacking him lol. He posted wrong information claiming Croats in Molisse are Serbs on purpose, foreigners may start to think that and I am here to correct that.
They are Croats and he should piss off from them.

[Leto]

Stop attacking him lol. He posted wrong information claiming Croats in Molisse are Serbs on purpose, foreigners may start to think that and I am here to correct that.
They are Croats and he should piss off from them.
So there were no Serbs in Italy?

The way you corrected him was quite aggressive. But he is a tough guy, thick-skinned :cool:

[Jana]

So there were no Serbs in Italy?

The way you corrected him was quite aggressive. But he is a tough guy, thick-skinned :cool:

There were, but not in Molisse. Trieste has big historical Serbian community.

[xripkan]

Distance to: G_K13
2.23696223 East_Sicilian
2.57382983 Central_Greek
3.93606402 Apulia
4.56830384 Molise
4.75876034 Sicily
4.81017671 Campania
5.00507742 Malta
5.16755261 Abruzzo
5.33239158 Basilicata
5.81859089 Greek_Andros_Island
6.17446354 Calabria
6.65257093 West_Sicilian
7.13707223 Ashkenazi
7.56795877 Greek_Peloponnese
7.62422291 GR_Peloponese
8.25133323 Turk_Crete
8.56481757 Greek_Eastern-Thrace
8.67348258 Greek_Thessaly
8.69695349 Greek_Western-Thrace
9.39099036 Greek_Chios
9.40193597 Greek_Macedonia_Thrace
9.84603600 Greek_Dodecanese
10.17313128 Vlach_Central-Macedonia
10.41401460 Greek_Symi_Island
10.55120372 Greek_Eastern-Macedonia

Target: Gianluca_K13
Distance: 1.2479% / 1.24794315 | ADC: 0.25x
48.4 East_Sicilian
43.0 Central_Greek
4.2 Pomak_Xanthi
2.2 Sardinian
1.2 Yemenite_Jewish
1.0 Ashkenazi

This could be the results of a Greek from Cyclades. Do you know from which place of Salento he is?

[andre]

This could be the results of a Greek from Cyclades. Do you know from which place of Salento he is?

No, I don’t know.

[Vid Flumina]

Freaking Samnium would like these results xD

Combining this result (Salento clustered tightly with Cosenza on academic paper) with Haute Savoie sample I get this for monsieur Samnium:

Distance to: Samniun_proxy
7.08976727 Tuscan
8.86485758 North_Italian
10.02659962 Greek_Thessaly
12.22298654 Italian_Abruzzo
12.29909753 Greek
12.44946184 West_Sicilian
12.72097087 Bulgarian
12.94414539 Romanian
14.05470028 Serbian
14.94302513 Central_Greek
15.01471611 East_Sicilian
15.49334373 Ashkenazi
15.65244070 Portuguese
16.06942749 Spanish_Galicia
16.22139328 Spanish_Extremadura
16.59729797 Spanish_Murcia
17.12840623 Spanish_Cataluna
17.60510721 South_Italian
17.61880246 Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon
18.21203174 Spanish_Andalucia
18.84612692 Spanish_Valencia
18.91804430 French
20.25198015 Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha
20.70692396 Austrian
20.82762348 Italian_Jewish

Target: Samniun_proxy
Distance: 3.9363% / 3.93633608 | ADC: 0.5x
66.4 Tuscan
14.4 Greek_Thessaly
9.6 Serbian
9.6 West_German


Updated spreadsheet

Distance to: Samniun_proxy
4.78361788 Italy_Emiliaromagna
5.79740459 Italy_Tuscany
6.22274055 Italy_Liguria
6.60746547 Albanian-Kosovo
6.92286068 Italy_Friuli
7.08976727 Tuscan
7.13122710 Italy_Lazio
7.41313024 Italy_Veneto
7.87174695 Italy_Marche
7.93102137 Albanian-South
7.99257155 Albanian-North
8.27472054 Italy_Lombardy
8.34147469 Albanian-Macedonia
8.67118088 Kosovo_Albanian
9.28343686 Macedonian_2
9.64951812 Italy_Trentino
10.02659962 Greek_Thessaly
10.86624130 France_Corsica
11.23475856 Italy_Piedmont
11.73458191 GR_Peloponese
11.78644006 Macedonian
12.22479448 Romania_South
12.29909753 Greek
12.30947602 Bulgarian
12.42361888 Montenegrin

Target: Samniun_proxy
Distance: 3.3514% / 3.35135153 | ADC: 0.5x
55.0 Italy_Emiliaromagna
23.4 Italy_Friuli
14.6 Albanian-South
6.6 Macedonian_2
0.2 Serbian
0.2 Yemenite_Jewish

[Leto]

Samnium would almost certainly end up plotting in Emilia-Romagna.

[andre]

Other options?

[Leto]

Samnium has not appeared yet.

[Ethel]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/667098601671098390/693915524710793316/image0.jpg

[Raizen]

Sikeliot:

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/gm2aTUCT_EE/hqdefault.jpg

[Samnium]

Freaking Samnium would like these results xD

Why freaking ? xD

Typical results for an apulian, nothing really special.


Samnium would almost certainly end up plotting in Emilia-Romagna.

Lower Veneto/Lombardy I would say. Not Emilia-Romagna.

By the way the Annecy sample isn't really representative, and I've also some Aostan from the Northwestern part of the valley, close to the border (1/8) but also some Swiss French (1/8 also I believe and I don't know from where) so it's not that simple, and even my Haute-Savoie ancestry isn't from Annecy (not that area).

My apulian ancestry isn't from Salento and my calabrian ancestry is from Cosenza, so even for the italian part it's not accurate.

The only thing that I can say is that I will plot in Northern Italy, the regions I don't know and I can't be sure at all given the "diversity" of my papertrail.

You don't inherit the same "%" of your grandparents so now it's very difficult saying anything.



Combining this result (Salento clustered tightly with Cosenza on academic paper) with Haute Savoie sample I get this for monsieur Samnium:

I explained why this simulation is almost 100% sure to be wrong, and by the way this is a Tuscan-like sample, not any kind of Northern Italian sample.

12.22298654 Italian_Abruzzo
12.29909753 Greek
12.44946184 West_Sicilian
12.72097087 Bulgarian
12.94414539 Romanian
14.05470028 Serbian
14.94302513 Central_Greek
15.01471611 East_Sicilian
15.49334373 Ashkenazi

Only a Tuscan can be that close to Sicilians. My paternal side will shift me toward France by the way. The "French reference" is very remote for someone that is half French.

[Samnium]

I don't know where you guys are seeing Slavic. It's probably Arbereshe (Italian Albanian), since Apulia was their main settlement.

No there were only few Arbereshe settlements in Apulia, it's mostly Cosenza (Calabria) for Arbereshe.

It's recent Greek ancestry, a trend that I've observed in some parts of Basilicata, Apulia and Cosenza as well.

There have been recent migrations from Greece to Southern Italy (the last hundreds of years).

[Leto]

Lower Veneto/Lombardy I would say. Not Emilia-Romagna.

By the way the Annecy sample isn't really representative, and I've also some Aostan from the Northwestern part of the valley, close to the border (1/8) but also some Swiss French (1/8 also I believe and I don't know from where) so it's not that simple, and even my Haute-Savoie ancestry isn't from Annecy (not that area).

My apulian ancestry isn't from Salento and my calabrian ancestry is from Cosenza, so even for the italian part it's not accurate.

The only thing that I can say is that I will plot in Northern Italy, the regions I don't know and I can't be sure at all given the "diversity" of my papertrail.

You don't inherit the same "%" of your grandparents.

Well, that may or may not be the case, we don't know. I just think you like splitting hairs too much :swl
Italy is not a country, it's a whole fucking continent! :lol:

[Samnium]

Well, that may or may not be the case, we don't know. I just think you like splitting hairs too much :swl
Italy is not a country, it's a whole fucking continent! :lol:

Very diverse country, and I'm very "mixed" as well, in the sense that I've many "regional" and "european" ancestries so it add even more to the complexity.

I think I will destroy the calculator xD

By the way these ancestries are also from heavily understudied regions.

[Rocinante]

Target: Italian_Apulia
Distance: 1.8677% / 0.01867677
58.6 ANF
27.2 Steppe
8.0 Ganj_Dareh
6.2 Natufian

They seem to be the southern italians with higher steppe admixture.

[Samnium]

Target: Italian_Apulia
Distance: 1.8677% / 0.01867677
58.6 ANF
27.2 Steppe
8.0 Ganj_Dareh
6.2 Natufian

They seem to be the southern italians with higher steppe admixture.

Molisans are the most Northern shifted, but honestly I've seen some Apulians plotting in Central Italy, so I don't know really. One or two Sicilians also.

Syracusa/South-East Sicily might be on par with Apulia.

By the way I've seen Cosentians with 20% Greek and Balkans on 23andme with recent regions in Greece, I don't have their exact results on (G25 or whatever) but it would be interesting.

[Rocinante]

Molisans are the more northern shifted, but honestly I've seen some Apulians plotting in Central Italy, so I don't know really.

Target: Italian_Molise
Distance: 1.6756% / 0.01675574
58.4 ANF
29.4 Steppe
7.2 Ganj_Dareh
4.4 Natufian
0.6 WHG

You're right, they have Steppe admixture like the average iberian.

[Samnium]

Target: Italian_Molise
Distance: 1.6756% / 0.01675574
58.4 ANF
29.4 Steppe
7.2 Ganj_Dareh
4.4 Natufian
0.6 WHG

You're right, they have Steppe admixture like the average iberian.

Keep in mind these are averages, I don't know if there are differences between different Apulians, it's possible that Salento would be more Southern shifted than Bari or Foggia, we can use the linguistical map but I don't think that it match perfectly genetics.

But from what I've seen Molisans are on the tail end of the Southern Italian cluster and the most shifted towards Central Italy.

[xripkan]

Keep in mind these are averages, I don't know if there are differences between different Apulians, it's possible that Salento would be more Southern shifted than Bari or Foggia, we can use the linguistical map but I don't think that it match perfectly genetics.

But from what I've seen Molisans are on the tail end of the Southern Italian cluster and the most shifted towards Central Italy.

Indeed there are great differences between Apulians. There are 15 Apulian references at g25. Some of them seem Northern-shifted. I used all the Italian references as a spreadsheet. My closest 50 references include 6 Apulians. Keep in mind that if I take the averages my closest region is Molise then Abruzzo then Marche and after these Apulia.
0.03008021 Italian_Molise:PG27
0.03147015 Italian_Umbria:PG04
0.03252772 Italian_Abruzzo:Alp162
0.03268941 Italian_Abruzzo:ItalyAbruzzo15
0.03320971 Italian_Abruzzo:ItalyAbruzzo19
0.03333547 Italian_Abruzzo:ItalyAbruzzo22
0.03397708 Italian_Apulia:cera9
0.03436396 Italian_Campania:NaN289RM
0.03509488 Italian_Basilicata:PG21
0.03523059 Italian_Lazio:NOR28
0.03540677 Italian_Marche:MarACV100D
0.03573718 Italian_Marche:MarADC050D
0.03574312 Italian_Abruzzo:ItalyAbruzzo20
0.03641767 Italian_Apulia:cera8
0.03643999 Italian_Umbria:PG03
0.03655792 Italian_Marche:MarACY030D
0.03674234 Italian_Umbria:PG05
0.03682001 Italian_Piedmont:Piedmont154
0.03710720 Italian_Abruzzo:ItalyAbruzzo16
0.03736808 Italian_Marche:MarACO100D
0.03738948 Italian_Marche:MarACW080D
0.03775383 Italian_Campania:NaN119AMR
0.03800904 Italian_Lazio:PG30
0.03837832 Italian_Basilicata:PG18
0.03841118 Italian_Tuscany:NA20506
0.03853759 Italian_Abruzzo:Alp616
0.03873768 Italian_Abruzzo:ItalyAbruzzo23
0.03890836 Italian_Marche:MarABQ080D
0.03900942 Italian_Abruzzo:ItalyAbruzzo17
0.03904295 Italian_Apulia:ITS7
0.03949758 Italian_Campania:NaN238DM
0.03958607 Italian_Basilicata:PG17
0.03963647 Italian_Apulia:ALP379
0.03973368 Italian_Campania:ITS2
0.03989044 Italian_Apulia:cera2
0.03990132 Italian_Marche:MarABN020D
0.03995195 Italian_Tuscany:Tuscany74
0.04005421 Italian_Marche:MarADG030D
0.04008538 Italian_Apulia:Pu2
0.04043537 Italian_Molise:PG26
0.04044744 Italian_Marche:MarABU050D
0.04045186 Italian_Umbria:PG11
0.04045479 Italian_Marche:MarABY030D
0.04089450 Italian_Umbria:PG08
0.04105550 Italian_Abruzzo:ALP161
0.04112716 Italian_Abruzzo:ALP205
0.04121942 Italian_Tuscany:MURLO114
0.04128498 Italian_Basilicata:PG22
0.04130430 Italian_Abruzzo:Alp380
0.04136797 Italian_Tuscany:NA20508

[Samnium]

Indeed there are great differences between Apulians. There are 15 Apulian references at g25. Some of them seem Northern-shifted. I used all the Italian references as a spreadsheet. My closest 50 references include 6 Apulians. Keep in mind that if I take the averages my closest region is Molise then Abruzzo then Marche and after these Apulia.
0.03008021 Italian_Molise:PG27
0.03147015 Italian_Umbria:PG04
0.03252772 Italian_Abruzzo:Alp162
0.03268941 Italian_Abruzzo:ItalyAbruzzo15
0.03320971 Italian_Abruzzo:ItalyAbruzzo19
0.03333547 Italian_Abruzzo:ItalyAbruzzo22
0.03397708 Italian_Apulia:cera9
0.03436396 Italian_Campania:NaN289RM
0.03509488 Italian_Basilicata:PG21
0.03523059 Italian_Lazio:NOR28
0.03540677 Italian_Marche:MarACV100D
0.03573718 Italian_Marche:MarADC050D
0.03574312 Italian_Abruzzo:ItalyAbruzzo20
0.03641767 Italian_Apulia:cera8
0.03643999 Italian_Umbria:PG03
0.03655792 Italian_Marche:MarACY030D
0.03674234 Italian_Umbria:PG05
0.03682001 Italian_Piedmont:Piedmont154
0.03710720 Italian_Abruzzo:ItalyAbruzzo16
0.03736808 Italian_Marche:MarACO100D
0.03738948 Italian_Marche:MarACW080D
0.03775383 Italian_Campania:NaN119AMR
0.03800904 Italian_Lazio:PG30
0.03837832 Italian_Basilicata:PG18
0.03841118 Italian_Tuscany:NA20506
0.03853759 Italian_Abruzzo:Alp616
0.03873768 Italian_Abruzzo:ItalyAbruzzo23
0.03890836 Italian_Marche:MarABQ080D
0.03900942 Italian_Abruzzo:ItalyAbruzzo17
0.03904295 Italian_Apulia:ITS7
0.03949758 Italian_Campania:NaN238DM
0.03958607 Italian_Basilicata:PG17
0.03963647 Italian_Apulia:ALP379
0.03973368 Italian_Campania:ITS2
0.03989044 Italian_Apulia:cera2
0.03990132 Italian_Marche:MarABN020D
0.03995195 Italian_Tuscany:Tuscany74
0.04005421 Italian_Marche:MarADG030D
0.04008538 Italian_Apulia:Pu2
0.04043537 Italian_Molise:PG26
0.04044744 Italian_Marche:MarABU050D
0.04045186 Italian_Umbria:PG11
0.04045479 Italian_Marche:MarABY030D
0.04089450 Italian_Umbria:PG08
0.04105550 Italian_Abruzzo:ALP161
0.04112716 Italian_Abruzzo:ALP205
0.04121942 Italian_Tuscany:MURLO114
0.04128498 Italian_Basilicata:PG22
0.04130430 Italian_Abruzzo:Alp380
0.04136797 Italian_Tuscany:NA20508

Yeah I know, as I've said I've seen even Apulians plotting in Central Italy so seeing Northern shifted samples here isn't surprising at all.

That's why people have to be very careful with averages, the Calabrian average on G25 has two samples xD

The minimal amount for making an average xD

[Leto]

Yeah I know, as I've said I've seen even Apulians plotting in Central Italy so seeing Northern shifted samples here isn't surprising at all.

That's why people have to be very careful with averages, the Calabrian average on G25 has two samples xD

The minimal amount for making an average xD
G25 isn't bad but overrated. I'm still more comfortable using Gedmatch, the database is much larger. Go to Reddit and see that most people don't even know Gedmatch, let alone G25. They do 23andme and take it at face value.

[Samnium]

G25 isn't bad but overrated. I'm still more comfortable using Gedmatch, the database is much larger. Go to Reddit and see that most people don't even know Gedmatch, let alone G25. They do 23andme and take it at face value.

I prefer Gedmatch not because of the "precision" but because of the database as you've said, I've found many results there, that you can only dream of for G25.

One thing also : we don't know the location of these G25 samples, in Italy the location is very very important.

Someone from Latina (Southern Latium, near Campania) wouldn't be the same as someone who's from Viterbo region (near Umbria and Tuscany).

Not giving the location is like trowing results with only one truth: that they are from the same region.

So these averages are what they are, nowhere an average of the region.

[crazyladybutterfly]

pretty sure that if he has any normal relevant "northern" ADMIXTURE it is germanic and not slavic.

[Kenshiro]

This is mine, from Gargano (Northeast Apulia)
112359
112360
This with yourdnaportal k13 and k15
112361
112362
This ancient with K13 on vahaduo, first yourdnaportal and second gedmatch
112363
And this with ancient yourdnaportal K15
112364

[Ajeje Brazorf]

He's a friend's friend. He took My heritage dna test.

He's parents are both from Salento, in Apulia.

Interesting results, I'm just now seeing this thread. Do you know precisely what city or area in Salento your friend is from? The curious thing is that there is a certain rivalry between the people from Bari or in any case from central Apulia and the people from Salento. Their dialects are different and you can tell within the first 3 seconds they open their mouths. The prolonged Greek-Byzantine domination at the expense of the Lombard one has left its mark even in the conformation of the local Romance dialects.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/4/42/Dialetti_italiani_meridionali_estremi.svg/612px-Dialetti_italiani_meridionali_estremi.svg.png

Eurogenes K13


andre_friend (Salento),17.28,10.37,21.79,13.53,29.68,6.43,0.05, 0.11,0.34,0.41,0.02

PCA

https://i.imgur.com/JGPHr6Y.png

[Kenshiro]

Target: Italian_Molise
Distance: 1.6756% / 0.01675574
58.4 ANF
29.4 Steppe
7.2 Ganj_Dareh
4.4 Natufian
0.6 WHG

You're right, they have Steppe admixture like the average iberian.

117752

Molise/North Apulia sign similar, but North Apulia have more Balkan