What is the darkest European country? (Skin, eyes and hair)

[FergusNeil]

Which European country classifies as the darkest?

Criteria:
1- Skin
2- Eyes
3- Hair
4- Phenotypes

PS: We're looking at strictly native European populations even if there may be certain groups or phenotypes in minority in areas that might look darker such as Wales, Corsica or Provence (which clusters close to Northern Italy)

Also, Turkey is not included in the poll because 75% of the country is in Asia. Same for Georgia and Armenia

[Laag]

Bulgaria, Romania, Macedonia, Albania, Cyprus, Iberia, Malta.

[Lioncourt]

France and UK, they have the highest % of dark-skinned people.

[Crazy W.]

Portugal

[Blondie]

Cyprus, Malta

[Ion Basescul]

Which European country classifies as the darkest?

Criteria:
1- Skin
2- Eyes
3- Hair
4- Phenotypes

Mate, should have added UK, France and Belgium at least. They easily top all of those.

[FergusNeil]

Mate, should have added UK, France and Belgium at least. They easily top all of those.

I get what you're trying to say, but we're looking at strictly native European populations and in all measures, France, UK and Belgium are lighter than Southern European countries as a whole even if there maybe certain groups or phenotypes in minority in areas that might look darker such as Wales, Corsica or Provence (which clusters close to Northern Italy)

[Avicenna]

Cyprus by a country mile

[Rocinante]

Malta first, Cyprus second.

[Ion Basescul]

I get what you're trying to say, but we're looking at strictly native European populations and in all measures, France, UK and Belgium are lighter than Southern European countries as a whole even if there maybe certain groups or phenotypes in minority in areas that might look darker such as Wales, Corsica or Provence (which clusters close to Northern Italy)

Those people are not going anywhere, as opposed to the Euro migrants who usually don't remain indefinitely. So, they are pretty much there to stay and their offspring is just as good as native.

[Defcon2]

A survey on European darkness that does not include France or the UK is worthless.

[Crn Volk]

Greece

[Creoda]

Those people are not going anywhere, as opposed to the Euro migrants who usually don't remain indefinitely. So, they are pretty much there to stay and their offspring is just as good as native.
If all the non-white UK and Belgian citizens were assimilated into the native populations by the next generation, the average person would probably look something like Romanians.

[Voskos]

Greece

Most Macedonians who posted their face here are darker than an average Greeks.Must be a coincidence.

[Ülev]

note that Laag didn't mention Greece, and he is an expert

[Vojnik]

Most Macedonians who posted their face here are darker than an average Greeks.Must be a coincidence.

Anecdotal evidence is not evidence.

[Vojnik]

I'd say Cyprus. Makes sense as they are the most MENA genetically.

[Samnium]

A survey on European darkness that does not include France or the UK is worthless.

France isn't a dark country, on average it's Central Euro standards so neither dark or light.

Now France is a transitional country, you can put it as a whole on a survey I would say, atleast you would have to separate Southern France from Northern France.

Southern France (and even part of Central France) is close to Southern Euro numbers, Northern France, not at all.

For UK I think that they haVe much more dark haired people but at the same time light eyes are really very prevalent (and lighter shades of brown).

So to conclude : no, they are far from competing in the competition of the darkest country.

[Ion Basescul]

If all the non-white UK and Belgian citizens were assimilated into the native populations by the next generation, the average person would probably look something like Romanians.

Up until then, you are darker than Malta and Cyprus. Sorry

[HechtFans]

Ukraine? Seriously??

[Zroota]

Cyprus is in West Asia. Shouldn't be listed up there.

I'll go with Malta.

[Defcon2]

France isn't a dark country, on average it's Central Euro standards so neither dark or light.

Now France is a transitional country, you can put it as a whole on a survey I would say, atleast you would have to separate Southern France from Northern France.

Southern France (and even part of Central France) is close to Southern Euro numbers, Northern France, not at all.

For UK I think that they hae much more dark haired people but at the same time light eyes are really very prevalent (and lighter shades of brown).

So to conclude : no, they are far from competing in the competition of the darkest country.

In "color competitions" they usually include in the same package the color of eyes, skin and hair for no reason. I agree that on the Franco-German border there is more phenotypic overlap and they are all clearer for obvious reasons.
But that doesn't exclude a lot of dark French (plus 20% Muslims) to compete with dark Romanians or dark Spaniards.

Nor was I making a judgment of any kind, but the fact of including some countries and not others in the survey is a technique of manipulation.

[Samnium]

In "color competitions" they usually include in the same package the color of eyes, skin and hair for no reason. I agree that on the Franco-German border there is more phenotypic overlap and they are all clearer for obvious reasons.
But that doesn't exclude a lot of dark French (plus 20% Muslims) to compete with dark Romanians or dark Spaniards.

Not only Franco-German border, don't exagerate.

Normans, people from Pas-de-Calais, Bourgogne, Britanny, Lorraine, where I live (so Haute-Savoie) are close to Northern Euros countries in terms of "lightness", a bit darker but nowhere dark to be in the competition of the darkest people.

Central French can be quite dark but they are kind of an intermediate.

The only people that you could include are Southern French, that's all.

And I'm talking about native population not immigrants (it's obvious).

[Renekton]

Cyprus.. It's obvious

[Zroota]

In "color competitions" they usually include in the same package the color of eyes, skin and hair for no reason. I agree that on the Franco-German border there is more phenotypic overlap and they are all clearer for obvious reasons.
But that doesn't exclude a lot of dark French (plus 20% Muslims) to compete with dark Romanians or dark Spaniards.

Nor was I making a judgment of any kind, but the fact of including some countries and not others in the survey is a technique of manipulation.
It's kinda clear that this thread is about the native population of Europe, discounting immigrants.

[Defcon2]

Not only Franco-German border, don't exagerate.

Normans, people from Pas-de-Calais, Bourgogne, Britanny, Lorraine, where I live (so Haute-Savoie) are close to Northern Euros countries in terms of "lightness", a bit darker but nowhere dark to be in the competition of the darkest people.

Central French can be quite dark but they are kind of an intermediate.

The only people that you could include are Southern French, that's all.

And I'm talking about native population not immigrants (it's obvious).


It's kinda clear that this thread is about the native population of Europe, discounting immigrants.

Immigrants are French like any other pale French. I could do the same with my country and exclude the descendants of foreigners from 700 years ago, anyone could adjust the "populations" to fit whatever they want.

That France has not yet assimilated such immigration through miscegenation is not my fault.

[itilvolga]

Malta. Cyprus isn’t European.

[Samnium]

Immigrants are French like any other pale French. I could do the same with my country and exclude the descendants of foreigners from 700 years ago, anyone could adjust the "populations" to fit whatever they want.

That France has not yet assimilated such immigration through miscegenation is not my fault.

I'm talking about who are fully or mostly French, not about immigrants, what's so hard to understand ? This thread is not political at all.

Immigration to France is a "recent" phenomenon, first waves of Italian migration... end of the 19th century, beginning of the 20th century. Before that ? Little to no mass migration or important foreign geneflow in France from the Dark Ages to the 19th century.

And no, immigrants aren't "French like any other pale French", then North-Africans in Spain are also as Spaniards as the locals, you're dishonest to bring that issue here whereas it's pretty clear that we aren't talking about foreign immigrants.

[Tenma de Pegasus]

Portugal



https://youtu.be/pVk0xB1guaM

Do you really think portugueses as whole are darker than nations like albania or greece and their islands? Because if it is, the rest of Iberia probably is too, since there is no big difference inside the Peninsula.

[Daco Celtic]

Lets just say Romanians are the darkest, end these retarded skin color threads, and get on with life

[Zeno]

Anecdotal evidence is not evidence.

Except real evidence shows that Greeks are lighter than you.

[Zeno]

https://youtu.be/pVk0xB1guaM

Do you really think portugueses as whole are darker than nations like albania or greece and their islands? Because if it is, the rest of Iberia probably is too, since there is no big difference inside the Peninsula.

The people in the video as a whole aren't lighter than Greeks in that regard.

[JohnnyP]

Except real evidence shows that Greeks are lighter than you.

Your jokes are nice...Have you ever thought to be comedian ?

[Zeno]

I bet everyone who voted Greece are the Monkeydonianz and le Durks.

[Vojnik]

Except real evidence shows that Greeks are lighter than you.

OK. Macedonians are darker, if you wish. But we will always be more European then you genetically. Science does not lie in that regard.

[Vojnik]

I bet everyone who voted Greece are the Monkeydonianz and le Durks.

Nah, I voted for your Arab brothers, the Cypriots.

[Zeno]

Your jokes are nice...Have you ever thought to be comedian ?

Your eye area is reminiscent of a chink's... How about you go to East Asia in China numba ONE? I can cite all of them really. But I doubt you can read your own language...

[Zeno]

Nah, I voted for your Arab brothers, the Cypriots.

I don't think Cypriots are Greek regardless. Kek, you thought I was offended?

[Nomansman]

Darkest would def be cyprus and malta. These people arent even too far from levantine arabs genetically and many really close to them as well

[Zeno]

OK. Macedonians are darker, if you wish. But we will always be more European then you genetically. Science does not lie in that regard.

Yeah, I doubt it. Mainland and Islander Greeks, especially in the Ionian Islands, have more noble European admixture than the Balkaners... Doesn't matter if you talk about the Pontics, who aren't even 10% of Greeks in total or Cypriots, who aren't even Greek...

[JohnnyP]

Your eye area is reminiscent of a chink's... How about you go to East Asia in China numba ONE? I can cite all of them really. But I doubt you can read your own language...

But im in Japan right now wtf?
Anyways you are young ,you have perspective to be Comedian,but comedy for kids.

[gixajo]

I'm talking about who are fully or mostly French, not about immigrants, what's so hard to understand ? This thread is not political at all.

Immigration to France is a "recent" phenomenon, first waves of Italian migration... end of the 19th century, beginning of the 20th century. Before that ? Little to no mass migration or important foreign geneflow in France from the Dark Ages to the 19th century.

And no, immigrants aren't "French like any other pale French", then North-Africans in Spain are also as Spaniards as the locals, you're dishonest to bring that issue here whereas it's pretty clear that we aren't talking about foreign immigrants.

Do you count yourself also as fully or half fully French?

[Zeno]

But im in Japan right now wtf?
Anyways you are young ,you have perspective to be Comedian,but comedy for kids.

Regardless, I have the relative evidence for my claims. Do you however?

[Samnium]

Do you count yourself also as fully or half fully French?

Well of course I'm half french, from paternal line (and I'm also born here), so I count myself as French (I'm also quite French looking according to most people here).

[JohnnyP]

Regardless, I have the relative evidence for my claims. Do you however?

Relative evidence for what you have?
You want to talk about Greek "Macedonians"
https://i.imgur.com/nAGhvFr.jpg


Or Cretan Greeks
https://i.imgur.com/z9olgsq.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/dqKY43I.jpg

[gixajo]

Well of course I'm half french, from paternal line (and I'm also born here), so I count myself as French (I'm also quite French looking according to most people here).

Me as a foreigner, I see you as 100% French, but what I want to know is if you consider for example a 50% mahgrebien and 50% français as french as you, not only you, your compatriots.

I mean, in France you have inmigrants from out Europe very soon, even 3th and 4th generation ones, form wich generation one non-french could be considered french (or Spanish, or German), do you think there must be differences in considering their origins to be considered French(or from any other country) depending where they ancestors come from?

[Samnium]

Me as a foreigner, I see you as 100% French, but what I want to know is if you consider for example a 50% mahgrebien and 50% français as french as you, not only you, your compatriots.

I mean, in France you have inmigrants from out Europe very soon, even 3th and 4th generation ones, form wich generation one non-french could be considered french (or Spanish, or German), do you think there must be differences in considering their origins to be considered French(or from any other country) depending where they ancestors come from?

I would have difficulties to consider him as French because his other ancestry is non-euro. Now with the Republican system, French nationality can be given to everyone almost so lot of people don't "care", but also others do. The RN (political party of Marine le Pen) wanted to take away the nationality given automatically if you're born in France. I will make a criteria : atleast half French and the other half European. For me it's enough honestly.

Now I don't think that European immigration is a problem because look, we have a real africanization and islamisation of the country. A real threat genetically and ethnically speaking. The big priority is that, not the Polish guy that came here.

Same for Spaniards, I don' think that they will "replace" SW France like Africans (and by the way SW French are close to Spaniards so...).

[Anaximander]

Apart from Malta and Cyprus which arent European countries,
Portugal is the darkest continental European country.

[Zeno]

Relative evidence for what you have?
You want to talk about Greek "Macedonians"
https://i.imgur.com/nAGhvFr.jpg


Or Cretan Greeks
https://i.imgur.com/z9olgsq.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/dqKY43I.jpg

Nice posting really, really old uncared boomers for "evidence" about Greek Macedonians.

And nice spam of the second pic about Cretans. But the first pic just shows tanned individuals and the second just two Dinarids. The first has two Meds, one is Atlanto-Med and the other is Gracile, and a fat Alpine. They're just tanned and have a weird moustache. So what. They're still lighter and more European looking than the Macedonian members here.

[Dunai]

Since I consider Cyprus and Malta borderline European (geographically speaking), I voted for Greece, but it was a close call with Portugal.

[Vojnik]

Nice posting really, really old uncared boomers for "evidence" about Greek Macedonians.

And nice spam of the second pic about Cretans. But the first pic just shows tanned individuals and the second just two Dinarids. The first has two Meds, one is Atlanto-Med and the other is Gracile, and a fat Alpine. They're just tanned and have a weird moustache. So what. They're still lighter and more European looking than the Macedonian members here.

Ok, I consider myself darker pigmented then the average Macedonian out there, but that's me in the avatar, and i very highly doubt i'm darker and less Eurpean looking then those Greeks posted by Johnny.

[gixajo]

I would have difficulties to consider him as French because his other ancestry is non-euro. Now with the Republican system, French nationality can be given to everyone almost so lot of people don't "care", but also others do. The RN (political party of Marine le Pen) wanted to take away the nationality given automatically if you're born in France. I will make a criteria : atleast half French and the other half European. For me it's enough honestly.

Now I don't think that European immigration is a problem because look, we have a real africanization and islamisation of the country. A real threat genetically and ethnically speaking. The big priority is that, not Polish people that came here.

What percentage of Frenchs with Mahgrebi origins do you think is fully integrated in France?

I know that French sate doesn´t make "race" ( religion also??) based statistics, but, which percentage of Mahgreb and French mixed citizens are also fully integrated?

I ask you because in my opinion, France is the reference in that issues.

Do you think that there is not any chance to integrate fully all that population?

[JohnnyP]

Nice posting really, really old uncared boomers for "evidence" about Greek Macedonians.

And nice spam of the second pic about Cretans. But the first pic just shows tanned individuals and the second just two Dinarids. The first has two Meds, one is Atlanto-Med and the other is Gracile, and a fat Alpine. They're just tanned and have a weird moustache. So what. They're still lighter and more European looking than the Macedonian members here.

Hahahaha, I will zoom these pictures foor you coz clearly you have problem with eyes.
https://i.imgur.com/afrEWGN.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/462sMM5.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/O4u8TwT.jpg

Also bonus picture from "Greek" from Solun or "Thessaloniki".
https://i.imgur.com/O1AXrpD.jpg

Again Greeks are darkest people in Europe.

[Faklon]

https://media.tenor.com/images/8ea9a954deb8cabc63f93b1cf0b33404/tenor.gif

[Gota_type_]

Relative evidence for what you have?
You want to talk about Greek "Macedonians"
https://i.imgur.com/nAGhvFr.jpg


Or Cretan Greeks
https://i.imgur.com/z9olgsq.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/dqKY43I.jpg


I have never seen a native Spaniard with such dark features (dark pigmentation or ethnic looking). Even gypsies look lighter than those examples. Maybe you find 1 in 100 but almost never you will find 3-4 like them in the same group. So, if these people exist in Greece, they are the darkest in Europe for sure, and I don´t consider the people in the pictures to be white obviously.

[JohnnyP]

I have never seen a native Spaniard with such dark features (dark pigmentation or ethnic looking). Even gypsies look lighter than those examples. Maybe you find 1 in 100 but almost never you will find 3-4 like them in the same group. So, if these people exist in Greece, they are the darkest in Europe for sure, and I don´t consider them to be white obviously.

You have google, write Crete greeks.

[Voskos]

So, if these people exist in Greece, they are the darkest in Europe for sure, and I don´t consider the people in the pictures to be white obviously.

I think Spaniards are complexed and insecure. I come from the same geographical region as the people in the pics posted by Johnny, and guess what, people guess me as Spaniard wherever I go.:heh:

[Faklon]

Johnny reminds me of Latino gangs in GTA

Los Diablos ese or how they were called

[JohnnyP]

I think Spaniards are complexed and insecure. I come from the same geographical region as the people in the pics posted by Johnny, and guess what, people guess me as Spaniard wherever I go.:heh:

Man, you need to be more real, Greeks are really most darkest people of Europe...

[JohnnyP]

Johnny reminds me of Latino gangs in GTA

Los Diablos ese or how they were called

But im partly Mexican,maybe coz that...

[Voskos]

Man, you need to be more real, Greeks are really most darkest people of Europe...

Cretan Greeks maybe, not the mainland ones. People like zoran zaev for example would be too dark sinned even for Crete.

[JohnnyP]

Cretan Greeks maybe, not the mainland ones. People like zoran zaev for example would be too dark sinned even for Crete.

Man , its okay there is also in Macedonians,Albanians,Bulgarians even Serbians who are darker, but Greeks are far behind that ,too many dark skin people in Greece.
Mainland Greeks are not that much dark coz are mixed with Macedonians and Albanians.

[Gota_type_]

I think Spaniards are complexed and insecure. I come from the same geographical region as the people in the pics posted by Johnny, and guess what, people guess me as Spaniard wherever I go.:heh:

Don´t project yourself.

Those that consider you as Spaniard (if you look like the people in the pictures) then they have no idea of how we look like. I am talking about the dark-ethnic looking of those pictures, there are others that look normal south-Europeans. And I can imagine that some ignorant consider Spaniards to be such dark or ethnic considering that the image sold of Spaniards in some countries is totally distorted (for example, I saw a commercial about tourism in Spain, the commercial was shown in Finland, and.......they chose a GYPSY, not even a Spanish gypsy but some kind of balkanic gypsy, to portrait a Spaniard. It seems they could not find a dark haired finnish and saw some gypsy in the street and used him for the commercial). Ignorant people everywhere.

[Voskos]

Man , its okay there is also in Macedonians,Albanians,Bulgarians even Serbians who are darker, but Greeks are far behind that ,too many dark skin people in Greece.
Mainland Greeks are not that much dark coz are mixed with Macedonians and Albanians.

Again my friend. Mainland Greeks are at least on par with Macos and Southern Albos. Vojnik would be typical for the mainland, you on the other hand would pass better in Crete/Peloponnisos, despite your somewhat Bulgarian vibe.

[Zeno]

Man, you need to be more real, Greeks are really most darkest people of Europe...

Yeah, these pics are not examples of Cretan Greeks. Fuck. Off.

Not even 5% of Cretans look like that. For Greeks as a whole, not even 2%.

[JohnnyP]

Again my friend. Mainland Greeks are at least on par with Macos and Southern Albos. Vojnik would be typical for the mainland, you on the other hand would pass better in Crete/Peloponnisos, despite your somewhat Bulgarian vibe.

Man why you talking about Vojnik or Me ?We are talking about Darkest European country,so Greeks are most darkest ethnicitie in Europe,even you claim Cypriots to be Greeks...Thats two in one.
And yeah , Mainland Greeks (North and Thessaly Greeks) are mixed with slavophone Macedonians.

[Zeno]

Yeah, these pics are not examples of Cretan Greeks. Fuck. Off.

Not even 5% of Cretans look like that. For Greeks as a whole, not even 2%.

And mind you, I talk about the dark individuals here.

[JohnnyP]

Yeah, these pics are not examples of Cretan Greeks. Fuck. Off.

Not even 5% of Cretans look like that. For Greeks as a whole, not even 2%.

But you lying yourself..Thats okay if you deny here, buts reallity is that Greeks are darkest people in Europe ,together with Cypriots but even you claim Cypriots to be Greeks.

[Blondie]

I've been in Greece many times (northen and central part) and i didn't see any such very dark arab looking people. Yes they are med looking on average but their face is clearly european and their skin color was much lighter than these posted greek peoples, they must be individuals. I was in Macedonia too, maybe they are a little bit lighter than greeks but the difference is not much.

[Zeno]

But you laying yourself..Thats okay if you deny here, buts reallity is that Greeks are darkest people in Europe ,together with Cypriots but even you claim Cypriots to be Greeks.

No, you're the one who's lying...

All of the Monkeydonianz and shiiiieeet here are darker than Greeks on average. I've seen countless threads and you're darker than us. There's also the studies proving we're lighter.

[Zeno]

I've been in Greece many times (northen and central part) and i didn't see any such very dark arab looking people. Yes they are med looking on average but their face is clearly european and their skin color was much lighter than these posted greek peoples, they must be individuals. I was in Macedonia too, maybe they are a little bit lighter than greeks but the difference is not much.

Thanks Blondie for being realistic. We might have disagreed on how much lighter hair is on Greece, but we can totally agree on that. Because that's the objective truth.

[Faklon]

No, you're the one who's lying...

All of the Macedonian members here are darker than Greeks on average. I've seen countless threads and you're darker than us. There's also the studies proving we're lighter.

The important part is lightness!1

[JohnnyP]

No, you're the one who's lying...

All of the Macedonian members here are darker than Greeks on average. I've seen countless threads and you're darker than us. There's also the studies proving we're lighter.

Hahahahahaha , can i see your study and can you find most darkest Macedonian from internet or whatever i will find most darkest Greek guy and we will comapre here?
Its basic think that we call Greeks - Gypsies coz they are tooo dark...
Also you gut pictures with dark Greeks from North Greece and Crete, post me people from Macedonian like these guys..Never..But i will wait.
Delusional guy.Please logout you have online class.

[Voskos]

Man why you talking about Vojnik or Me ?We are talking about Darkest European country,so Greeks are most darkest ethnicitie in Europe,even you claim Cypriots to be Greeks...Thats two in one.
And yeah , Mainland Greeks (North and Thessaly Greeks) are mixed with slavophone Macedonians.

First of all there's no Bulgarophone Slavs in thessaly. As for the rest you could be right if you include the islands and exclude the outlying types like zaev from macos.

[Rocinante]

No, you're the one who's lying...

All of the Macedonian members here are darker than Greeks on average. I've seen countless threads and you're darker than us. There's also the studies proving we're lighter.

Macedonians are lighter my friend, even genetically. Doesn't mean they are more european.

[JohnnyP]

First of all there's no Bulgarophone Slavs in thessaly. As for the rest you could be right if you include the islands and exclude the outlying types like zaev from macos.

No man , i see now why you are all delusional, these guys in Thessaly are Macedonians mixed with Greeks,also in North Greece.
But okay i will stop here its blind alley...You are whitest in Europe and half Greece is Bulgars half true Hellenes.

[Voskos]

No man , i see now why you are all delusional, these guys in Thessaly are Macedonians mixed with Greeks,also in North Greece.
But okay i will stop here its blind alley...You are whitest in Europe and half Greece is Bulgars half true Hellenes.

You're the one who's delusional to think there's Bulgarian admixture in Thessaly. I never claimed Greeks are particularly light, but they certainly aren't as dark as you depict them.

[Vojnik]

Macedonians are lighter my friend, even genetically. Doesn't mean they are more european.

I don’t usually indulge in these arguments about lightness, but explain why Macedonians are not at least equally European as Greeks?

[Lioncourt]

All of the Macedonian members here are darker than Greeks on average. I've seen countless threads and you're darker than us. There's also the studies proving we're lighter.

You and Markos aren't lighter than Vojnik, Johnny or Aspar. Only Faklon is lighter. I haven't seen the other Greek members.

[Rocinante]

I don’t usually indulge in these arguments about lightness, but explain why Macedonians are not at least equally European as Greeks?

No, i dind't say they were less european, i meant they are equally european than greeks. Macedonian samples score 100% european in my models.

[JohnnyP]

You're the one who's delusional to think there's Bulgarian admixture in Thessaly. I never claimed Greeks are particularly light, but they certainly aren't as dark as you depict them.

Again you are very delusional guy...There a tons of evidence about Macedonians who were mixed with Greeks in Thessaly.
Here's one Serbian book from 1872 ,when Macedonians "doesnt exist" ,ask for some Serbian friend to translate to you...If you cant i will
"Greeks are 1.300.000 in Greek Kingdom, other 850.000 are in Thessaly mixed with Macedonians"
https://i.imgur.com/9aIzGYf.jpg

[Faklon]

Sorry, I'll edit that out. But you'll upvote if it's a good edit.

Only if you show screenshots of your 15yo chatting with Vikernes in a serious manner.

[Zeno]

Hahahahahaha , can i see your study and can you find most darkest Macedonian from internet or whatever i will find most darkest Greek guy and we will comapre here?
Its basic think that we call Greeks - Gypsies coz they are tooo dark...
Also you gut pictures with dark Greeks from North Greece and Crete, post me people from Macedonian like these guys..Never..But i will wait.
Delusional guy.Please logout you have online class.

https://www.jstor.org/stable/29539448?seq=1#page_scan_tab_contents

https://www.jstor.org/stable/25839805?seq=1#page_scan_tab_contents

https://www.jstor.org/stable/25753006?seq=1#page_scan_tab_contents

https://issuu.com/stampalia/docs/katagogh_ellhnon/9?e=0

https://archive.org/stream/reportofbritisha11scie#page/228/mode/2up

https://archive.org/stream/zeitschriftfre11berl#page/304/mode/2up

http://fyletika.blogspot.com/2014/01/blog-post_22.html?m=0 (the research is in orange font and will appear in pdf form in English).

[Voskos]

"Greeks are 1.300.000 in Greek Kingdom, other 850.000 are in Thessaly mixed with Macedonians"
https://i.imgur.com/9aIzGYf.jpg

The data from your source doesn't concord with any ethnographic map, not even the pro-slavic ones.

https://www.bl.uk/britishlibrary/~/media/bl/global/world-war-one/collection-item-images/ethnographical-map-balkan-peninsular3.jpg
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Macedonians_on_a_french.rev.jpg
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/2b/Macedonians_on_a_french.rev.jpg

[Anaximander]

Again you are very delusional guy...There a tons of evidence about Macedonians who were mixed with Greeks in Thessaly.
Here's one Serbian book from 1872 ,when Macedonians "doesnt exist" ,ask for some Serbian friend to translate to you...If you cant i will
"Greeks are 1.300.000 in Greek Kingdom, other 850.000 are in Thessaly mixed with Macedonians"

Slav macedonci in Thessaly, lol.

Did u also see them in Crete maybe???
U are a joke dude!

[JohnnyP]

https://www.jstor.org/stable/29539448?seq=1#page_scan_tab_contents

https://www.jstor.org/stable/25839805?seq=1#page_scan_tab_contents

https://www.jstor.org/stable/25753006?seq=1#page_scan_tab_contents

https://issuu.com/stampalia/docs/katagogh_ellhnon/9?e=0

https://archive.org/stream/reportofbritisha11scie#page/228/mode/2up

https://archive.org/stream/zeitschriftfre11berl#page/304/mode/2up

http://fyletika.blogspot.com/2014/01/blog-post_22.html?m=0 (the research is in orange font and will appear in pdf form in English).

HAAHAAHAHAHAHA...

[Zeno]

Only if you show screenshots of your 15yo chatting with Vikernes in a serious manner.

Except that they're deleted. If they were still there, I'd post them. It's gold material there for cringe. No jokes there m8.

[Zeno]

HAAHAAHAHAHAHA...

Why are you laughing retard? Maybe because you can't read? It's 7 different sources, and I have more. The three of them were stored in Jstor.

[Zeno]

You and Markos aren't lighter than Vojnik, Johnny or Aspar. Only Faklon is lighter. I haven't seen the other Greek members.

Excuse me, Aspar and Johnny and Vojnik aren't darker? Are you serious m8? Especially Vojnik. Are you delusional?

[alnortedelsur]

https://youtu.be/pVk0xB1guaM

Do you really think portugueses as whole are darker than nations like albania or greece and their islands? Because if it is, the rest of Iberia probably is too, since there is no big difference inside the Peninsula.

Lol at this people who insist on Portugal or Spain.

[Anaximander]

HAAHAAHAHAHAHA...

See, see these Huns, ''Huncite'' dressed in ancient Macedonian helmets...
https://i.imgur.com/W6J9T46.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/HifRz3J.jpg

U are huns, many of u are turanid exactly like u. My alfoldo-turanid freind.

[alnortedelsur]

I think Spaniards are complexed and insecure. I come from the same geographical region as the people in the pics posted by Johnny, and guess what, people guess me as Spaniard wherever I go.:heh:

That's not because Spaniards are dark, but because of overspread ignorance worldwide about Spanish looks.

[JohnnyP]

Why are you laughing retard? Maybe because you can't read? It's 7 different sources, and I have more. The three of them were stored in Jstor.

Omg you are really delusional guy.

[Anaximander]

That's not because Spaniards are dark, but because of overspread ignorance worldwide about Spanish looks.

Spaniards have the same colours with Greeks, while Portuguese are a bit darker than both.

[Jana]

Malta is darkest since Cyprus is rather West Asian. I am not sure who is darker between Greece and Portugal, these two are darkest mainland European countries.

[JohnnyP]

The data from your source doesn't concord with any ethnographic map, not even the pro-slavic ones.

https://www.bl.uk/britishlibrary/~/media/bl/global/world-war-one/collection-item-images/ethnographical-map-balkan-peninsular3.jpg
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Macedonians_on_a_french.rev.jpg
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/2b/Macedonians_on_a_french.rev.jpg

Btw that book was official Serbian Geography book for 1871
https://i.imgur.com/l2jGBy5.jpg

From what year is your maps and source?

[Voskos]

Btw that book was official Serbian Geography book for 1871.From what year is your maps and source?

Jovan Cvijic. 1918.

[alex23]

If all the non-white UK and Belgian citizens were assimilated into the native populations by the next generation, the average person would probably look something like Romanians.

Something like gypsies not Romanians.

[Voskos]

That's not because Spaniards are dark, but because of overspread ignorance worldwide about Spanish looks.

You think I'm dark?Maybe I am maybe not, you'll never know cause it doesn't matter. That being said even my own compatriots have mistaken me for Spanish a couple of times.

[Creoda]

Something like gypsies from Romania not Romanians.
According to Ion Basecul there's no difference.

[JohnnyP]

Jovan Cvijic. 1918.


Soo you just proved me now that you are stupid?
I said there were Macedonians mixed with Greeks in Thessaly with evidence from 1871year , you posting me map about religions from 1918?
Of course there will be not so much Macedonians after 1913year,atleast there were not so many Macedonians who declared like Macedonians, these who remain there was declaring like Greeks or in minority like Macedonians but they were not recognized by Greek gouverment after Bucharest treaty there "were not Macedonians in Aegea part of ex-Macedonia",even these slavophone Macedonians were not allowed to speaks on Macedonian language.

[Morena]

Cyprus.

[Kivan]

Portuguese don't look dark at all. I've been in the country, by the way.

Cyprus doesn't count since it's in Asia, so Malta.
Now if we talk about continental Europe, i would say Greece.

[Voskos]

Soo you just proved me now that you are stupid?
I said there were Macedonians mixed with Greeks in Thessaly with evidence from 1871year , you posting me map about religions from 1918?
Of course there will be not so much Macedonians after 1913year,atleast there were not so many Macedonians who declared like Macedonians, these who remain there was declaring like Greeks or in minority like Macedonians but they were not recognized by Greek gouverment after Bucharest treaty there "were not Macedonians in Aegea part of ex-Macedonia",even these slavophone Macedonians were not allowed to speaks on Macedonian language.

first of all it's an ethnographic map and not a religious one.Secondly your source says, ''850.000 Greeks in Thessaly mixed with Macedonians''. I don't see a reason, from the moment Slavic Macedonians declared as such in what you call ''Aegean'', as shown in the map I posted, would refrain from doing so in Thessaly. So their number in Thessaly was either very small or there simply weren't any at all.

[Anaximander]

Portuguese don't look dark at all. I've been in the country, by the way.

Cyprus doesn't count since it's in Asia, so Malta.
Now if we talk about continental Europe, i would say Greece.

Portuguese are the darkest continental European nation.

[alnortedelsur]

Portuguese are the darkest continental European nation.

Not true. I haven't been to Portugal but I met many Portuguese and Portuguese descendants back in Venezuela, and most of them were very fair skinned, with a good percentage of them (not a majority, but a good percentage) having blondish hair tones and light eyes.

[Anaximander]

Not true. I haven't been to Portugal but I met many Portuguese and Portuguese descendants back in Venezuela, and most of them were very fair skinned, with a good percentage of them (not a majority, but a good percentage) having blondish hair tones and light eyes.

We are talking about tiny difference in percentage of light eyes in the degree of 2-3%.
Portuguese have 2-3% less light eyes than my country Greece and Spain.
The differences are tiny thought.

[Rgvgjhvv]

I mean, "Cyprus isn't European" isn't an obvious statement like people are making it out to be. Don't really understand where the confidence is coming from. I don't think it's so black and white at all.

[Rgvgjhvv]

Greeks are predominately Mediterranean-influenced in both skin tone and phenotype. This continuous comparison to Balkan neighbours to the north isn't realistic. It's a strange obsession that only exists on TA.

Greeks are unique in their geographical positioning. Any comparisons to neighbouring countries is a stretch and utilizes more imagination than logic.

[JohnnyP]

first of all it's an ethnographic map and not a religious one.Secondly your source says, ''850.000 Greeks in Thessaly mixed with Macedonians''. I don't see a reason, from the moment Slavic Macedonians declared as such in what you call ''Aegean'', as shown in the map I posted, would refrain from doing so in Thessaly. So their number in Thessaly was either very small or there simply weren't any at all.

No first of all most of Macedonians after Bucharest treaty when Greece took Aegea part of Macedonia were not allowed even to speaks their language, not to declaring like Macedonians, rest just accepted Greek identity coz piece, come on post me all of your maps , with ethnicities from Greece.But before 1913 year.

[Voskos]

No first of all most of Macedonians after Bucharest treaty when Greece took Aegea part of Macedonia were not allowed even to speaks their language, not to declaring like Macedonians, rest just accepted Greek identity coz piece, come on post me all of your maps , with ethnicities from Greece.But before 1913 year.

are we gonna debate all day man?:D
Here's one from 1847, it's Austrian:
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/ac/Ethnographic_map_Ami_Bou%C3%A9%2C_1847.jpg

and one from 1881 taken from a German handatlas:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C7yA8PcX0AEWHBH?format=jpg&name=medium
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C7yA8PcX0AEWHBH?format=jpg&name=medium

[Rædwald]

https://i.postimg.cc/R0W0QMWh/giphy.gif

Southrons complaining that the UK and France aren't on this poll :coffee:

[Dunai]

I mean, "Cyprus isn't European" isn't an obvious statement like people are making it out to be. Don't really understand where the confidence is coming from. I don't think it's so black and white at all.

Culturally they are European, but geographically Cyprus is between Southern Turkey and Syria, basically in the Middle East.

Cyprus
https://uploads-ssl.webflow.com/5b2accd8cfe7f108e315278c/5bf3bd0e4f15711b2dee92c6_Cyprus%20in%20the%20Middl e%20East.png

Middle East
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/3f/Middle_East_%28orthographic_projection%29.svg/800px-Middle_East_%28orthographic_projection%29.svg.png

[Voskos]

Map of Europe according to Encyclopaedia Britannica:

https://cdn.britannica.com/s:700x500/67/367-050-0F839196/Europe.jpg

https://www.britannica.com/place/Europe

[Autrigón]

https://i.postimg.cc/R0W0QMWh/giphy.gif

Southrons complaining that the UK and France aren't on this poll :coffee:Why not? Ukraine and Hungary are on the poll and both are lighter that France and UK.

[Rgvgjhvv]

Culturally they are European, but geographically Cyprus is between Southern Turkey and Syria, basically in the Middle East.


Plenty of maps say otherwise, which is why I simply said it's not black and white - which is true.

[JohnnyP]

are we gonna debate all day man?:D
Here's one from 1847, it's Austrian:
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/ac/Ethnographic_map_Ami_Bou%C3%A9%2C_1847.jpg

and one from 1881 taken from a German handatlas:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C7yA8PcX0AEWHBH?format=jpg&name=medium
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C7yA8PcX0AEWHBH?format=jpg&name=medium

Hahahahaha,but i dont see there Macedonian ethnicity of course German and Austrian map :D
But there are Macedonians in book from 1666year,but not your maps.
https://i.imgur.com/FZaxgDu.jpg

Also Macedonian language mentioned in "Vocabularium ecclesiasticum" - Rodrigo Fernandez de Santaella. from 1555year but not on your maps :D
https://i.imgur.com/KBrWtMH.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/MNsgkr2.jpg

I think Macedonians dissapeared after 1666 year, what you think ? Also these Serbian books which was highschool official books are nonsense?
Or maybe Macedonians "became"something different in meantime?What you think?
They are everywhere before that and after , but on these maps without Macedonians?
https://i.imgur.com/WlF8UC6.jpg
Italian newspapper
https://i.imgur.com/wblWfho.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/nO4Rczd.jpg
- Macedonian revolutionary Jane Sandanski and one of his quotes in the Italian newspaper “L’Italia all’Estero” 1908, he says: “"Macedonians will liberate Macedonia without interfering from the neighboring states: in Macedonia there should be no Bulgarians, no Greeks, no Serbs, no Romanians, no Turks, but only Macedonians." ��
Whats wrong with your maps?


Also Charles Green, “Austria containing a Description of the Manners, Customs, Character, and Costumes of the People of that Empire”, 1823 year.
https://i.imgur.com/PuLvdbs.jpg

Also from Ion Dragoumis, “Martyrs’ and Heroes’ Blood”, edition Malliaris-Paideia (photocopy of the 1907 edition), page 98.
https://i.imgur.com/NAQR7so.jpg

[Tenma de Pegasus]

Lol at this people who insist on Portugal or Spain.

Yes, especially when the peninsula is more or less the same with some few changes. Iberia is one of the most homogeneous regions of Europe and some people, not everyone of course, insist to treat Portugal as way different of Spain. Even when Argentano posts the genetic profile of white latinos, we can see how similar the iberian groups are with just some specif differences, despite the countries of Latam were colonized by different groups of Peninsulares such as Southeast Iberians in Mexico and DR or Northwest Iberians in Brazil, Argentina and Uruguay.


https://youtu.be/jxt6MIPtcqQ


https://youtu.be/3nCuDZtQRP4

[Septentrion]

Why not? Ukraine and Hungary are on the poll and both are lighter that France and UK.

Ukraine and Hungary are only slightly lighter than France, not much of a difference. Both are darker than Northern France.

[Richard Alvarez]

What about the Canary Islands?
Aren't Canarians a bit darker than Cypriots due to their Guanche influence?

[Valenman]

I imagine that borderline countries like Cyprus, Malta are not included?
I would say that where in general there are fewer people with light eyes/hair is Greece (There are even fewer in Sardinia, but it is not a country). But the country with the highest percentage of dark/rare Phenotypes is Italy among 100% native people Although in Italy, even in the South, there are super clear/Nordic Phenotypes that, although they are a small minority, are still more than in Spain, for example.. But if we include people born in the Country, but more non-European people would be Bulgaria,Russia
and to a lesser extent France, England and Ukraine. Spain in some provinces already has more than 30% of births to non-European parents and the majority of them are Latinos who have quite low inbreeding indexes, which is why I believe that in Spain it is 2-3 generations there will be many people with some Extra-European grandparent, but at the moment there are very few

[Vessna]

Ukraine and Hungary are only slightly lighter than France, not much of a difference. Both are darker than Northern France.

Eastern Ukrainians are way lighter than Southern France fyi.

[Mopi Licinius Crassus]

Eastern Ukrainians are way lighter than Southern France fyi.

in you experience Vessnakins, who are the darkest Euros ? :)