What is the difference between tavastid and brünn?

[Elias]

Except origin and distribution are, is there any difference between these two types?

[FergusNeil]

Yes. Brünn clusters more closely with the German Faelid type because of larger, muscular and boxier heads. Tavastids are more bawface. They have wider faces and are more closely related to the Borreby type rather than being close to Brünn

[dududud]

At the level of measurements?

[itilvolga]

Tavastids usually have straight blonde hair unlike Brünns, who usually have wavy/curly ginger/brown/chestnut hair. Also Tavastids have low forehead, Brünns are known with their high foreheads.

[Elias]

Yes. Brünn clusters more closely with the German Faelid type because of larger, muscular and boxier heads. Tavastids are more bawface. They have wider faces and are more closely related to the Borreby type rather than being close to Brünn

But some anthropologists combine brunn and borreby into one phenotype, aren't they same to each other then?

[Elias]

At the level of measurements?

Yes and also facial features

[lei.talk]

TAVASTID (https://www.theapricity.com/snpa/gloss2.htm#TAVASTID) (Tavast type Virchow (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rudolf_Virchow))
According to Lundman (https://sv.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bertil_Lundman)’s typology, the westernmost of the two East-Baltid (https://www.theapricity.com/snpa/rg-east.htm) subtypes (the other being Savolaxid) Named after the Tavastia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/H%C3%A4me) province of Finland.


https://i.imgur.com/DTANs0x.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/6zTrMSe.png (https://www.theapricity.com/snpa/gloss1.htm#)https://i.imgur.com/DTANs0x.png
Brünn

Etymology:
Brünn, or Brno (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brno), is a Czech city and archaeological site where Upper Paleolithic skeletal remains were discovered, certain skull types among which were named after the site. These skulls belong to the general Aurignacid (https://www.theapricity.com/snpa/gloss1.htm#AURIGNACID)/Capellid (https://www.theapricity.com/snpa/gloss1.htm#CAPELLID) variety of Upper Paleolithic human, and as such the application of the Brünn name to the Cro-Magnid type in question is somewhat probematic. However, we have decided to retain Coon (https://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?73486-quot-it-is-so-easy-that-a-six-year-old-girl-can-do-it-quot&p=1638587&viewfull=1#post1638587)'s use of the term, as no synonym exists in the literature.

Origins:
Mostly unreduced, typically dolicho (https://www.theapricity.com/snpa/gloss1.htm#DOLICHOCEPHALIC)- or mesocephalic (http://www.snpa.nordish.net/gloss2.htm#MESOCEPHALIC) and mostly depigmented Upper Palaeolithic survivor (https://www.theapricity.com/snpa/gloss2.htm#UPPER%20PALEOLITHIC) of Cro-Magnid provenience, closely related to the Dalo-Falid type; the two are distinguished by minor specializations only. The distinctive "Irish" features which characterize the Brünn are to some extent recalled in the Scandinavian Cro-Magnid stock. This is just as likely a result of convergence (https://www.theapricity.com/snpa/gloss1.htm#CONVERGENT%20EVOLUTION) as of synapomorphy (https://www.theapricity.com/snpa/gloss2.htm#SYNAPOMORPHY).

Description:
Like the Dalo-Falid (https://www.theapricity.com/snpa/gloss1.htm#F%C3%84LISH) type, Brünns are typically tall, broad-shouldered, and large-headed, with big bones and heavy musculature. In its unmixed form the type is usually quite easily distinguished from other local varieties, such as the shorter-statured, more gracile and more leptomorphic Keltic Nordid (https://www.theapricity.com/snpa/gloss1.htm#KELTIC%20NORDIC), with which it is cohabitant.

The modern Brünn inhabitants of western Ireland are mesocephalic (https://www.theapricity.com/snpa/gloss2.htm#MESOCEPHALIC) to sub-brachycephalic (https://www.theapricity.com/snpa/gloss2.htm#SUBBRACHYCEPHALIC), whereas their more easterly Cro-Magnid counterparts are typically long-headed. This is possibly due to the presence of a shorter-headed strain (such as Borreby) in the former, or to a local process of brachycephalization. The ancestral Cro-Magnid skull form was clearly dolichocranial (https://www.theapricity.com/snpa/gloss1.htm#DOLICHOCRANIAL).

The Brünn forehead is high and broad, and the face broad and mostly orthognathous (https://www.theapricity.com/snpa/gloss2.htm#ORTHOGNATHOUS). The malars (https://www.theapricity.com/snpa/gloss2.htm) are wide, the lower jaw deep and broad (yet usually not as broad as in the Dalo-Falid type), and the chin is prominent and typically clefted (the latter is foremost a male trait).

As with the other Cro-Magnid (https://www.theapricity.com/snpa/gloss1.htm#CRO-MAGNID) types, male Brünn facial features can be very ruggedly masculine, often with exaggeratedly pronounced browridges and deep jaws; the degree of sexual dimorphism (https://www.theapricity.com/snpa/gloss2.htm#SEXUAL%20DIMORPHISM) is high, and a corresponding ruggedness is not usually observed among the females. As with Borreby (https://www.theapricity.com/snpa/gloss1.htm#BORREBY) women, these are typically rounder-featured and larger-breasted than the European mean.

The nose is moderately large, mesorrhine (https://www.theapricity.com/snpa/gloss2.htm#MESORRHINE) to leptorrhine (https://www.theapricity.com/snpa/gloss1.htm#LEPTORRHINE), and straight in profile, with a considerable concave minority. The tip is somewhat thick, and frequently upturned. The mouth is large and the lines around the oral cavity are deeply drawn, while the lips are moderately thick and little everted. The upper lip tends characteristically towards length and convexity.

The skin, typically freckled, is very fair, and does not easily tan. The hair is brown and wavy, and often rufous (the Irish Brünn is known for its frequent red-headedness). Curly hair seems to be an Irish specialty. The eyes are light-mixed blue in the great majority of cases.

Stereotypically "Irish" features are known to have been exaggerated in caricature.

Geographical distribution:
Western Ireland - Cork (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/County_Cork) and Kerry (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/County_Kerry) in particular - houses the only living Brünn population in the world today, and this element accounts for nearly half of the Irish racial composition (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irish_people) on the whole.

The Irish Brünn type has added an important increment to the Icelandic population (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Icelanders), which already contains a predominant Cro-Magnid (https://www.theapricity.com/snpa/gloss1.htm#CRO-MAGNID) strain through the presence of the western Norwegian Trønder (https://www.theapricity.com/snpa/gloss2.htm#TR%C3%98NDER) type of Viking descent. An aboriginal Brünn (https://www.theapricity.com/snpa/gloss1.htm#BRÜNN)-like population has also merged with the Germanic settlement in the Frisian (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frisii) and northwestern German country, where its descendants take the form of an altered Hallstatt Nordid (https://www.theapricity.com/snpa/gloss1.htm#HALLSTATT%20NORDIC), a type referred to as Anglo-Saxon (https://www.theapricity.com/snpa/gloss1.htm#ANGLO-SAXON). This mixed strain has played an important role in determining England's present racial situation (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_people).

Related or similar types:
- Dalo-Falid (https://www.theapricity.com/snpa/rg-dalofalid.htm)
- Trønder (https://www.theapricity.com/snpa/rg-tronder.htm)
- Anglo-Saxon (https://www.theapricity.com/snpa/rg-anglo.htm)

https://i.imgur.com/FSAsN1Y.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/qbBCYb7.png (https://www.theapricity.com/snpa/rg-main.htm)https://i.imgur.com/FSAsN1Y.png

[chociprasa]

Brünns: Closer-set eyes, usually more red haired or brown haired, black haired at times, with a more wavy and at times curly hair (Tavastids usually have straighter and more blonde hair), usually mesocephalic (depending on the CM reduction level, very seldomly brachycephalic, but sometimes dolichocephalic), larger/taller chin than the Tavastid but with a somewhat narrower jaw, skull size is about even, Brünns tend to have a slightly larger skull on average, but both types are known for being large-skulled, more oftenly mesomorph than the Tavastid (which has a bigger tendency towards endomorphism), larger forehead, nose is a bit larger and less soft than in the Tavastid, but shares many similarities, the Brünns probably also have wider lips on average.

They do share similarities, especially since many Tavastid types in Scandinavia and Finland are mixed with Trønder/Brünns.

A better comparision would've been to the Faelid type, Tavastid could be described as an intermediate type between Borreby and Savolaxid.