G25 of son and mother what is his other half?

[Ahaddad]

Motherscaled,0.085367,0.13405,0.034695,-0.003553,0.03139,-0.00502,-0.011045,-0.007384,0.014726,0.022233,0.002761,0.002997,-0.003717,-0.005918,0.001629,0.000796,0.003781,-0.000633,-0.001508,-0.005628,0.002496,-0.001978,0.001849,0.000482,-0.001676

Mother,0.0075,0.0132,0.0092,-0.0011,0.0102,-0.0018,-0.0047,-0.0032,0.0072,0.0122,0.0017,0.002,-0.0025,-0.0043,0.0012,0.0006,0.0029,-0.0005,-0.0012,-0.0045,0.002,-0.0016,0.0015,0.0004,-0.0014




Sonscaled,0.086506,0.137096,-0.019233,-0.039083,0.006155,-0.01004,-0.002585,-0.011538,0.006954,0.01221,-0.003897,-0.003597,-0.000446,0.003716,0.0057,-0.001724,-0.016559,0.000507,0.003645,-0.005127,0.00025,0.007666,-0.001109,-0.000241,-0.004311

Son,0.0076,0.0135,-0.0051,-0.0121,0.002,-0.0036,-0.0011,-0.005,0.0034,0.0067,-0.0024,-0.0024,-0.0003,0.0027,0.0042,-0.0013,-0.0127,0.0004,0.0029,-0.0041,0.0002,0.0062,-0.0009,-0.0002,-0.0036

[Luke35]

User gixajo has explained to me that there is symmetrical/equidistant plotting between parents and offspring on G25 (he has demonstrated this as both his parents are tested and on G25). Another forum member used mine and my mother's coordinates to approximate my father - to a seemingly excellent result.


So, to answer your question, though I don't have the skills to create coordinates for the father in this case, if you suspect the father is of a different ethnic group you can try this:

First put the mother and also the likely (if known) ancestry of the father in source, then put the son in test, and see what kind of split results. Work from there.

[Ahaddad]

User gixajo has explained to me that there is symmetrical/equidistant plotting between parents and offspring on G25 (he has demonstrated this as both his parents are tested and on G25). Another forum member used mine and my mother's coordinates to approximate my father - to a seemingly excellent result.


So, to answer your question, though I don't have the skills to create coordinates for the father in this case, if you suspect the father is of a different ethnic group you can try this:

First put the mother and also the likely (if known) ancestry of the father in source, then put the son in test, and see what kind of split results. Work from there.

His dad is Lebanese, it's compatible To his mom and him admix???

[Luke35]

His dad is Lebanese, it's compatible To his mom and him admix???

Yup, seems he (the dad) is reasonably close to the G25 Lebanese averages. He may diverge a little from the average.

Target: Sonscaled
Distance: 2.8509% / 0.02850869
52.4 Lebanese_Muslim
41.0 Motherscaled
6.6 Lebanese_Christian

Target: Sonscaled
Distance: 3.0894% / 0.03089377
54.8 Lebanese_Christian
45.2 Motherscaled

Target: Sonscaled
Distance: 2.7142% / 0.02714211
58.0 Lebanese_Druze
42.0 Motherscaled

---------------------------------------

Here is the mom's result using the Modern Averages Spreadsheet. What is her known ethnicity(s)?

Target: Motherscaled
Distance: 1.1337% / 0.01133724 | ADC: 0.25x
56.8 Spanish_Canarias
16.6 Montenegrin
13.6 Albanian
8.4 Spanish_Baleares
1.4 French_Provence
1.2 Esan_Nigeria
1.2 Quechua
0.8 Surui

[Luke35]

The son get's the best 50/50 split when using the Palestinian_Beit_Sahour average. I know nothing about the genetic similarity to Lebanese beyond the fact that they are very close on G25 (Lebonese and Palestinian_Beit_Sahour). So the father in this case may be genetically similar to the Palestinian_Beit_Sahour average.

Here is the son's result using the mother and the Palestinian average in source:

Target: Sonscaled
Distance: 3.5005% / 0.03500503
50.6 Palestinian_Beit_Sahour
49.4 Motherscaled

[Ahaddad]

The son get's the best 50/50 split when using the Palestinian_Beit_Sahour average. I know nothing about the genetic similarity to Lebanese beyond the fact that they are very close on G25 (Lebonese and Palestinian_Beit_Sahour). So the father in this case may be genetically similar to the Palestinian_Beit_Sahour average.

Here is the son's result using the mother and the Palestinian average in source:

Target: Sonscaled
Distance: 3.5005% / 0.03500503
50.6 Palestinian_Beit_Sahour
49.4 Motherscaled

But the distance is upper others ? The distance was not most important to see?

[Ahaddad]

The son get's the best 50/50 split when using the Palestinian_Beit_Sahour average. I know nothing about the genetic similarity to Lebanese beyond the fact that they are very close on G25 (Lebonese and Palestinian_Beit_Sahour). So the father in this case may be genetically similar to the Palestinian_Beit_Sahour average.

Here is the son's result using the mother and the Palestinian average in source:

Target: Sonscaled
Distance: 3.5005% / 0.03500503
50.6 Palestinian_Beit_Sahour
49.4 Motherscaled

But the distance is upper others ? The distance was not most important to see?

[Dr_Maul]

Target: Sonscaled
Distance: 1.4472% / 0.01447212
23.2 Samaritan
18.2 Basque_French
11.8 Karaite_Egypt
11.2 French_Seine-Maritime
11.0 Armenian
7.2 Italian_Liguria
5.6 Azeri_Turkey
5.2 Yemenite_Jew
2.0 Iraqi_Jew
1.4 Biaka
1.4 Brahmin_Uttar_Pradesh
0.8 Surui
0.6 Iranian_Mazandarani
0.2 Baka
0.2 Dinka

Their non-Levant half is southern shifted, either Sicilian/Italian or Balkan (High caucasus)

[Luke35]

But the distance is upper others ? The distance was not most important to see?

No, in this case the division or the split is more important than the distance. The higher distance might indicate a little something is missing, but honestly this distance (3.5) is not that bad.

[Ahaddad]

No, in this case the division or the split is more important than the distance. The higher distance might indicate a little something is missing, but honestly this distance (3.5) is not that bad.


Here the PCA


101950

[Luke35]

^^^ That helps with focusing on the target.. here we have 50/50 split and a closer distance:

Target: Sonscaled
Distance: 2.6303% / 0.02630258
50.2 Motherscaled
49.8 Iraqi_Jew

[Luke35]

Where did you access that PCA Ahaddad? I'd like to play around with it.

[Ahaddad]

Where did you access that PCA Ahaddad? I'd like to play around with it.

https://vahaduo.github.io/g25views/#WestEurasia

[Ahaddad]

But he isn't Iraq Jew btw

[Luke35]

But he isn't Iraq Jew btw

He could be genetically similar to them, without being them, happens all the time i.e. we have Hungarians on the forum who are closer to neighboring ethnicities rather than to their own native Hungarian.

Or perhaps we could say that he (the dad) has a specific mix of elements that pulls him to Iraq Jew's, so he plots with them, without being them if that makes sense.

Maybe I'm just plain wrong, or it's always worth considering that the G25 accuracy is simply failing in the case of your friend :)

[Ahaddad]

He could be genetically similar to them, without being them, happens all the time i.e. we have Hungarians on the forum who are closer to neighboring ethnicities rather than to their own native Hungarian.

Or perhaps we could say that he (the dad) has a specific mix of elements that pulls him to Iraq Jew's, so he plots with them, without being them if that makes sense.

Maybe I'm just plain wrong, or it's always worth considering that the G25 accuracy is simply failing in the case of your friend :)
He say something Important his mother has a little Lebanese (Great great grandmother Lebanese ) admix too so he is around 55% to 62% Middle eastern not 50/50

[Luke35]

He say something Important his mother has a little Lebanese (Great great grandmother Lebanese ) admix too so he is around 55% to 62% Middle eastern not 50/50

Ahhhh okay, that brings us back to the original model I posted for him. Perhaps that is the best one then.

[Ahaddad]

Ahhhh okay, that brings us back to the original model I posted for him. Perhaps that is the best one then.

What is better?

[Luke35]

What is better?

Wait, lemme think about this.. regardless if his mom has minor Lebanese ancestry too, we are examining his Paternal side when we get is mother's ancestry represented at 50%. So his paternal side looks like Iraq Jew was best fit. I dunno, I'm lost that's all I got.

[gixajo]

Motherscaled,0.085367,0.13405,0.034695,-0.003553,0.03139,-0.00502,-0.011045,-0.007384,0.014726,0.022233,0.002761,0.002997,-0.003717,-0.005918,0.001629,0.000796,0.003781,-0.000633,-0.001508,-0.005628,0.002496,-0.001978,0.001849,0.000482,-0.001676

Mother,0.0075,0.0132,0.0092,-0.0011,0.0102,-0.0018,-0.0047,-0.0032,0.0072,0.0122,0.0017,0.002,-0.0025,-0.0043,0.0012,0.0006,0.0029,-0.0005,-0.0012,-0.0045,0.002,-0.0016,0.0015,0.0004,-0.0014




Sonscaled,0.086506,0.137096,-0.019233,-0.039083,0.006155,-0.01004,-0.002585,-0.011538,0.006954,0.01221,-0.003897,-0.003597,-0.000446,0.003716,0.0057,-0.001724,-0.016559,0.000507,0.003645,-0.005127,0.00025,0.007666,-0.001109,-0.000241,-0.004311

Son,0.0076,0.0135,-0.0051,-0.0121,0.002,-0.0036,-0.0011,-0.005,0.0034,0.0067,-0.0024,-0.0024,-0.0003,0.0027,0.0042,-0.0013,-0.0127,0.0004,0.0029,-0.0041,0.0002,0.0062,-0.0009,-0.0002,-0.0036

You can use this to see where they plot, then draw a line passing thorugh two plots, and at the same distnace between the son and the mother, the father should be:

http://https://vahaduo.github.io/g25views/#NorthEurope

https://i.imgur.com/4foBnF0.png

According to this solution closest references are Iraki Jew, Iranian Jew or Egyptian.

Mother close reference is Moldavian or Romanian(there is an strange french sample near also), son plot near an Askhenazi Jew sample, and the father plots between 2 close Iraki Jew samples.(Iraqijew4241 and IraqiJew4061 )

So one of those 2 plots very very close the father of this person:

Unscaled

Iraqi_Jew:IraqiJew4061,0.008,0.0143,-0.0168,-0.0261,-0.0086,-0.0075,0.0008,-0.0028,-0.006,-0.0069,0.0009,-0.0048,0.0109,0.0045,-0.0069,0.0131,0.0014,-0.002,0.0007,-0.0073,-0.0038,-0.0016,-0.0064,-0.0049,0.0053
Iraqi_Jew:IraqiJew4241,0.0077,0.0134,-0.0176,-0.0231,-0.0072,-0.0085,-0.004,-0.0054,-0.0089,0.0034,0.0057,-0.0051,0.0045,0.0046,-0.0093,0.0057,-0.0071,-0.0029,-0.0012,-0.0153,0.0008,0.0013,0.0014,0.0009,-0.0044
Scaled

Iraqi_Jew:IraqiJew4061,0.091058,0.145221,-0.063356,-0.084303,-0.026466,-0.020917,0.00188,-0.006461,-0.012271,-0.012574,0.001461,-0.007194,0.016204,0.006193,-0.009365,0.017369,0.001825,-0.002534,0.00088,-0.009129,-0.004742,-0.001978,-0.007888,-0.005904,0.006347
Iraqi_Jew:IraqiJew4241,0.087644,0.136081,-0.066373,-0.074613,-0.022158,-0.023706,-0.0094,-0.012461,-0.018203,0.006196,0.009256,-0.007643,0.00669,0.006331,-0.012622,0.007558,-0.009257,-0.003674,-0.001508,-0.019134,0.000998,0.001607,0.001725,0.001084,-0.005269

All this is aproximately, and I did it in 5 minutes, I don´t know where is from exactly the father of that person.

[gixajo]

You can make it most accurately, I calculate the point of plotting of the father with my finger.:D

[Lucas]

You can make it most accurately, I calculate the point of plotting of the father with my finger.:D

Simple methods are the best:)

[Luke35]

You can make it most accurately, I calculate the point of plotting of the father with my finger.:D

Best Answer: the ol' finger technique. :thumb001:

[gixajo]

probably a mean between these two samples is a very good solution:

Target: Sonscaled
Distance: 2.8053% / 0.02805329
51.0 Motherscaled
38.8 Iraqi_Jew:IraqiJew4241
10.2 Iraqi_Jew:IraqiJew4061

Target: Sonscaled
Distance: 2.8339% / 0.02833936
50.8 Motherscaled
49.2 Iraqi_Jew:IraqiJew4241

Target: Sonscaled
Distance: 3.1635% / 0.03163502
54.4 Motherscaled
45.6 Iraqi_Jew:IraqiJew4061

[Lucas]

Motherscaled,0.085367,0.13405,0.034695,-0.003553,0.03139,-0.00502,-0.011045,-0.007384,0.014726,0.022233,0.002761,0.002997,-0.003717,-0.005918,0.001629,0.000796,0.003781,-0.000633,-0.001508,-0.005628,0.002496,-0.001978,0.001849,0.000482,-0.001676

Mother,0.0075,0.0132,0.0092,-0.0011,0.0102,-0.0018,-0.0047,-0.0032,0.0072,0.0122,0.0017,0.002,-0.0025,-0.0043,0.0012,0.0006,0.0029,-0.0005,-0.0012,-0.0045,0.002,-0.0016,0.0015,0.0004,-0.0014




Sonscaled,0.086506,0.137096,-0.019233,-0.039083,0.006155,-0.01004,-0.002585,-0.011538,0.006954,0.01221,-0.003897,-0.003597,-0.000446,0.003716,0.0057,-0.001724,-0.016559,0.000507,0.003645,-0.005127,0.00025,0.007666,-0.001109,-0.000241,-0.004311

Son,0.0076,0.0135,-0.0051,-0.0121,0.002,-0.0036,-0.0011,-0.005,0.0034,0.0067,-0.0024,-0.0024,-0.0003,0.0027,0.0042,-0.0013,-0.0127,0.0004,0.0029,-0.0041,0.0002,0.0062,-0.0009,-0.0002,-0.0036

Here is the method:)
https://i.imgur.com/g6u4gv0.png

coords scaled


father_scaled,0.087645,0.140142,-0.073161,-0.074613,-0.01908,-0.01506,0.005875,-0.015692,-0.000818,0.002187,-0.010555,-0.010191,0.002825,0.01335,0.009771,-0.004244,-0.036899,0.001647,0.008798,-0.004626,-0.001996,0.01731,-0.004067,-0.000964,-0.006946




Target: x
Distance: 5.1278% / 0.05127826 | ADC: 1x
78.0 Iraqi_Jew
22.0 Karaite_Egypt

Target: x
Distance: 4.8445% / 0.04844516 | ADC: 0.5x
34.2 Samaritan
29.8 Iraqi_Jew
18.2 Iranian_Jew
11.4 Azeri_Turkey
6.4 Karaite_Egypt

Target: x
Distance: 4.6521% / 0.04652150 | ADC: 0.25x
52.0 Samaritan
16.0 Armenian
15.8 Azeri_Turkey
9.4 Iranian_Mazandarani
5.8 Yemenite_Jew
1.0 Iraqi_Jew

Target: x
Distance: 4.5977% / 0.04597690
53.4 Samaritan
12.2 Georgian_Imer
10.6 Yemenite_Jew
10.0 Iranian_Mazandarani
7.0 Azeri_Turkey
4.2 Armenian
2.6 Brahmin_Uttar_Pradesh


Distance to: father-scaled
0.05260738 Iraqi_Jew
0.05553400 Iranian_Jew
0.05587498 Karaite_Egypt
0.05771956 Lebanese_Druze
0.05964297 Druze
0.06027522 Samaritan
0.06126963 Lebanese_Muslim
0.06180127 Assyrian
0.06192321 Georgian_Jew
0.06296197 Lebanese_Christian
0.06315108 Syrian
0.06392408 Armenian
0.06524387 Mountain_Jew_Chechnya
0.06750590 Syrian_Jew
0.06847369 Cypriot
0.07002955 Palestinian_Beit_Sahour
0.07065191 Iraqi
0.07591450 Jordanian
0.07812383 Turkish_Trabzon
0.07817447 Greek_Trabzon
0.07868020 Palestinian
0.07903420 Greek_Central_Anatolia
0.08020480 Romaniote_Jew
0.08056281 Azeri_Turkey
0.08213788 Ezid




Now do the same for unscaled by yourself to exercise:)

[Luke35]

Here is the method:)
https://i.imgur.com/g6u4gv0.png



https://i.imgur.com/lnQDWF7.gif

[gixajo]

There are more references around the aproximate area where the father plots, try yourself more, see references in newest datasheet, and run different options till find most accurate, you know now how tofind a graphic solution to the several options that may appear.

I always loved the graphic solutions to math problem, they usually are the most intuitives.

[Lucas]

There are more references around the aproximate area where the father plots, try yourself more, see references in newest datasheet, and run different options till find most accurate, you know now how tofind a graphic solution to the several options that may appear.

I always loved the graphic solutions to math problem, they usually are the most intuitives.

Graphic test would be another proof for simple excel method to see if it was valid.
Both are compelementary. And it is cool.

[Ahaddad]

There are more references around the aproximate area where the father plots, try yourself more, see references in newest datasheet, and run different options till find most accurate, you know now how tofind a graphic solution to the several options that may appear.

I always loved the graphic solutions to math problem, they usually are the most intuitives.
His dad is Lebanese Muslim and his mom has a little Lebanese don't know % but it's a great great

[Lucas]

His dad is Lebanese Muslim and his mom has a little Lebanese don't know % but it's a great great

Your father scaled if you didn't notice:)


father_scaled,0.087645,0.140142,-0.073161,-0.074613,-0.01908,-0.01506,0.005875,-0.015692,-0.000818,0.002187,-0.010555,-0.010191,0.002825,0.01335,0.009771,-0.004244,-0.036899,0.001647,0.008798,-0.004626,-0.001996,0.01731,-0.004067,-0.000964,-0.006946

[Lucas]

But for example I'm not between my parents both on G25 and Gedmatch calcs. We create rather form of triangle on PCA.
So for me this method wouldn't be ideal.

[gixajo]

And here you have another coordinates that could be close to the actual solution:

Solution_Scaled=Iraqi_Jew:IraqiJew4061,+Iraqi_Jew: IraqiJew4241,



Solution_Scaled,0.089351,0.140651,-0.064865,-0.079458,-0.024312,-0.022312,-0.003760,-0.009461,-0.015237,-0.003189,0.005359,-0.007419,0.011447,0.006262,-0.010994,0.012464,-0.003716,-0.003104,-0.000314,-0.014132,-0.001872,-0.000186,-0.003082,-0.002410,0.000539


Target: Sonscaled
Distance: 2.8608% / 0.02860796
51.8 Motherscaled
48.2 Solution_Scaled

In ancient averages, because in modern results would be near 100% Iraqi Jew, because it´s a very simple mean made with 2 references from datasheet.;)

Target: Solution
Distance: 1.5035% / 0.01503513
25.4 Levant_LBN_MA
17.0 Levant_Ashkelon_LBA
12.0 AZE_Caucasus_lowlands_LC
10.6 TKM_Parkhai_MBA
10.4 Levant_Megiddo_IBA
6.6 Levant_Beirut_IAII
5.6 Levant_LBN_MA_o3
4.8 Kura-Araxes_ARM_Kaps
2.6 Kura-Araxes_ARM_Kalavan
2.2 TUR_Kaman-Kalehoyuk_MLBA_low_res
1.0 TUR_Tell_Kurdu_EC
0.8 IRN_Wezmeh_N
0.6 TUR_Ikiztepe_LC
0.2 DEU_MA_o
0.2 PER_LaGalgada_4100BP

[gixajo]

But in customized models those alternative coordinates made with datasheet references ussually work quite well:

Arabian,=Saudi,+(Yemenite_Al_Jawf,+Yemenite_Mahra, )
MiddleEast,=Jordanian,+Syrian
Turkish:B=Turkish_Adana,+Turkish_Aydin,+Turkish_Ba likesir,+Turkish_Central,+Turkish_Deliorman,+Turki sh_East,+Turkish_Istanbul,+Turkish_Kayseri,+Turkis h_North,+Turkish_Northwest,+Turkish_South,+Turkish _Southwest,
Iran:B,=Iranian_Fars,+Iranian_Zoroastrian,
Lebanese=Lebanese_Christian,+Lebanese_Druze,+Leban ese_Muslim,



Arabian,0.05059585,0.13995270,-0.06513990,-0.11723870,-0.00940130,-0.04997380,-0.01229238,-0.00808298,0.05608075,-0.00410653,0.01556333,-0.03192903,0.06243548,0.00350273,0.00455410,0.0252 5745,-0.02140830,0.00386218,0.00015448,0.02687405,0.0126 3658,0.01614353,-0.00905183,0.00697205,-0.00832413
MiddleEast,0.05685165,0.12859275,-0.04813445,-0.06769060,-0.01581660,-0.02342100,-0.00406920,-0.00286015,0.00661045,-0.00050155,0.00442385,-0.00707060,0.01346310,-0.00017820,-0.00193140,0.00745640,-0.00185565,0.00011665,0.00003315,0.00229120,0.0015 7940,0.00151840,-0.00176365,0.00088215,-0.00121830
Turkish:B,0.0992254,0.0786815,-0.0200851,-0.0319207,-0.0200989,-0.0106798,0.0050411,-0.0002120,-0.0184973,-0.0010534,-0.0007855,0.0013163,-0.0028215,0.0017155,-0.0041298,0.0000325,0.0029920,0.0011112,0.0018688,-0.0017495,-0.0029590,-0.0000647,-0.0019151,-0.0004425,-0.0000719
Iran:B,0.0900715,0.1017110,-0.0635430,-0.0233070,-0.0457275,0.0023995,0.0031345,-0.0052650,-0.0284790,-0.0158325,0.0002660,-0.0003485,0.0045525,-0.0037460,0.0058380,0.0126770,-0.0044705,0.0022025,0.0018490,-0.0088545,-0.0018130,-0.0035630,0.0009845,-0.0039630,0.0047155
Lebanese,0.08266933,0.14034033,-0.04785800,-0.07207067,-0.01501100,-0.02607833,-0.00123600,-0.00513433,0.00114867,0.00715633,0.00546567,-0.00379467,0.01049567,0.00160867,-0.00861033,0.00616833,-0.00218200,0.00101300,0.00221367,-0.00011100,-0.00075000,0.00016400,-0.00141500,0.00221267,-0.00082433


Target: Solution_Scaled
Distance: 3.2332% / 0.03233192
83.2 Lebanese
15.6 Iran
1.2 Arabian

Distance to: Solution_Scaled
0.03493628 Lebanese
0.05186034 MiddleEast
0.08220219 Iran:B
0.09644505 Turkish:B
0.12457740 Arabian

[Ahaddad]

But in customized models those alternative coordinates made with datasheet references ussually work quite well:

Arabian,=Saudi,+(Yemenite_Al_Jawf,+Yemenite_Mahra, )
MiddleEast,=Jordanian,+Syrian
Turkish:B=Turkish_Adana,+Turkish_Aydin,+Turkish_Ba likesir,+Turkish_Central,+Turkish_Deliorman,+Turki sh_East,+Turkish_Istanbul,+Turkish_Kayseri,+Turkis h_North,+Turkish_Northwest,+Turkish_South,+Turkish _Southwest,
Iran:B,=Iranian_Fars,+Iranian_Zoroastrian,
Lebanese=Lebanese_Christian,+Lebanese_Druze,+Leban ese_Muslim,



Arabian,0.05059585,0.13995270,-0.06513990,-0.11723870,-0.00940130,-0.04997380,-0.01229238,-0.00808298,0.05608075,-0.00410653,0.01556333,-0.03192903,0.06243548,0.00350273,0.00455410,0.0252 5745,-0.02140830,0.00386218,0.00015448,0.02687405,0.0126 3658,0.01614353,-0.00905183,0.00697205,-0.00832413
MiddleEast,0.05685165,0.12859275,-0.04813445,-0.06769060,-0.01581660,-0.02342100,-0.00406920,-0.00286015,0.00661045,-0.00050155,0.00442385,-0.00707060,0.01346310,-0.00017820,-0.00193140,0.00745640,-0.00185565,0.00011665,0.00003315,0.00229120,0.0015 7940,0.00151840,-0.00176365,0.00088215,-0.00121830
Turkish:B,0.0992254,0.0786815,-0.0200851,-0.0319207,-0.0200989,-0.0106798,0.0050411,-0.0002120,-0.0184973,-0.0010534,-0.0007855,0.0013163,-0.0028215,0.0017155,-0.0041298,0.0000325,0.0029920,0.0011112,0.0018688,-0.0017495,-0.0029590,-0.0000647,-0.0019151,-0.0004425,-0.0000719
Iran:B,0.0900715,0.1017110,-0.0635430,-0.0233070,-0.0457275,0.0023995,0.0031345,-0.0052650,-0.0284790,-0.0158325,0.0002660,-0.0003485,0.0045525,-0.0037460,0.0058380,0.0126770,-0.0044705,0.0022025,0.0018490,-0.0088545,-0.0018130,-0.0035630,0.0009845,-0.0039630,0.0047155
Lebanese,0.08266933,0.14034033,-0.04785800,-0.07207067,-0.01501100,-0.02607833,-0.00123600,-0.00513433,0.00114867,0.00715633,0.00546567,-0.00379467,0.01049567,0.00160867,-0.00861033,0.00616833,-0.00218200,0.00101300,0.00221367,-0.00011100,-0.00075000,0.00016400,-0.00141500,0.00221267,-0.00082433


Target: Solution_Scaled
Distance: 3.2332% / 0.03233192
83.2 Lebanese
15.6 Iran
1.2 Arabian

Distance to: Solution_Scaled
0.03493628 Lebanese
0.05186034 MiddleEast
0.08220219 Iran:B
0.09644505 Turkish:B
0.12457740 Arabian

So his dad is Lebanese ???

[gixajo]

An adding this one to the sources:


Levantine,0.08970675,0.15220263,-0.04970895,-0.08630155,-0.00821318,-0.02909195,-0.00308430,-0.00400938,0.01374138,0.01814400,0.00735825,-0.00407470,0.00702445,0.00651988,-0.00855050,0.00501358,-0.00108388,0.00259705,0.00276545,0.00053945,-0.00321313,0.00803751,0.00093205,0.00186763,0.0012 6450

Target: Solution_Scaled
Distance: 3.1923% / 0.03192303
46.2 Lebanese
28.6 Levantine
23.4 Iran
1.8 Arabian

So he could be perfectly Lebanese.:thumb001:

[gixajo]

So his dad is Lebanese ???

I don´t know where is he from, but he could be Lebanese too, not very typical, because he scores too high in Iran, and I don´t think that that is very common in Lebanese, but I am not any expert in that area genetics.

Edit:distance is a very little high (over 3) so there is at least one origin that is not included in sources that we must add to make distances lower, any idea?

[gixajo]

But could be Lebanese...

Target: Solution_Scaled
Distance: 3.4936% / 0.03493628
100.0 Lebanese

[gixajo]

But could be Lebanese...

Target: Solution_Scaled
Distance: 3.4936% / 0.03493628
100.0 Lebanese

[Ahaddad]

But could be Lebanese...

Target: Solution_Scaled
Distance: 3.4936% / 0.03493628
100.0 Lebanese

Lebanese Muslim have little bit more west Asian (Mesopotamian/Arab and Iranian admix) his dad is Lebanese Muslim I think he take little bit Iranian for this.

[gixajo]

Actually, a Lebanese Druze individual reference is very close to the proposed solution:

https://i.imgur.com/R7x2fj9.png

Lebanese_Druze:1153

[Ahaddad]

Actually, a Lebanese Druze individual reference is very close to the proposed solution:

https://i.imgur.com/R7x2fj9.png

Lebanese_Druze:1153

Yes he fit close to levant than Mesopotamian or Assyrian right ? But I try understand what is this solution..

[gixajo]

QUOTE=Ahaddad;6874795]Yes he fit close to levant than Mesopotamian or Assyrian right ? But I try understand what is this solution..[/QUOTE]

There are many possible solutions, what I proposed is one among them.

For example in the last PCA son and mother project another line that suggests that a different reference could be another solution.


Lebanese_Christian:Lebanese1AQ127,0.080814,0.13608 1,-0.056945,-0.071706,-0.011079,-0.030957,-0.00188,-0.003923,0.005318,0.010205,0.004384,-0.004196,0.007136,-0.006744,-0.003122,0.003447,-0.001565,0.006334,0.011564,-0.004752,0.007487,-0.001237,-0.007888,0.00723,0.001557

Target: Sonscaled
Distance: 2.9862% / 0.02986238
54.8 Lebanese_Christian
45.2 Motherscaled

[gixajo]

So mother was form Iberian peninsula finally:

Distance to: Motherscaled
0.03064683 Spanish_Canarias:CAN1220
0.03304826 Portuguese:EBC_Portugal7
0.03328643 Spanish_Galicia:HG01704
0.03334356 Spanish_Canarias:CAN3
0.03388299 Spanish_Extremadura:HG01527
0.03473269 Spanish_Eivissa:CAR256
0.03557868 Spanish_Canarias:CAN956
0.03683986 Portuguese:Portugal6
0.03690039 Portuguese:EBC_Portugal11
0.03805295 Spanish_Extremadura:HG01509
0.03809940 Portuguese:EBC_Portugal13
0.03810774 Portuguese:Portugal12
0.03827211 Portuguese:EBC_Portugal1
0.03857387 Spanish_Murcia:HG01618
0.03860168 Spanish_Canarias:CAN9
0.03878238 Spanish_Canarias:CAN884
0.03910238 Portuguese:EBC_Portugal3
0.03965104 Portuguese:EBC_Portugal2
0.03977131 French_Provence:provance2708
0.03988601 Spanish_Camp_de_Tarragona:FOR094
0.04005444 Spanish_Andalucia:HG01623
0.04008000 Portuguese:EBC_Portugal12
0.04021217 Spanish_Canarias:CAN11
0.04031657 Spanish_Mallorca:ALE339
0.04040674 Spanish_Canarias:CAN17

Son closest individuals:

Distance to: Sonscaled
0.02839965 Ashkenazi_Lithuania:Ashk_LT_LT_7
0.02901468 Ashkenazi_Poland:Ashk_PL_PL_24
0.02993718 Ashkenazi_Lithuania:Ashk_LT_LT_8
0.03029834 Ashkenazi_Lithuania:Ashk_LT_LT_2
0.03054249 Ashkenazi_Ukraine:Ashk_UA_UA_15
0.03185103 Ashkenazi_Poland:Ashk_PL_PL_8
0.03191716 Ashkenazi_Poland:Ashk_PL_PL_10
0.03195703 Ashkenazi_Ukraine:Ashk_UA_UA_2
0.03268920 Ashkenazi_Russia:Ashk_RU_RU_4
0.03274041 Ashkenazi_Ukraine:Ashk_UA_UA_11
0.03295055 Ashkenazi_Ukraine:Ashk_UA_UA_8
0.03301263 Ashkenazi_Germany:Ashk_DE_DE_9
0.03305503 Ashkenazi_Ukraine:Ashk_UA_UA_10
0.03312041 Ashkenazi_Poland:Ashk_PL_PL_11
0.03315546 Ashkenazi_Ukraine:Ashk_UA_UA_18
0.03317949 Ashkenazi_Ukraine:Ashk_UA_UA_13
0.03325112 Ashkenazi_Ukraine:Ashk_UA_UA_1
0.03328663 Ashkenazi_Russia:Ashk_RU_RU_1
0.03342821 Ashkenazi_Poland:Ashk_PL_PL_12
0.03346167 Ashkenazi_Ukraine:Ashk_UA_UA_20
0.03348648 Ashkenazi_Belarussia:Ashk_BY_BY_3
0.03348765 Ashkenazi_Germany:Ashk_DE_DE_3
0.03364659 Ashkenazi_Lithuania:Ashk_LT_LT_6
0.03365264 Ashkenazi_Poland:Ashk_PL_PL_5
0.03436595 Ashkenazi_Poland:Ashk_PL_PL_13

And closest references to proposed first solution:

Distance to: Solution
0.01990924 Iraqi_Jew:IraqiJew4241
0.01990934 Iraqi_Jew:IraqiJew4061
0.02602848 Iraqi_Jew:IraqiJew1417
0.02626685 Iraqi_Jew:IraqiJew1430
0.02782265 Assyrian:Assyrian159
0.02832843 Iranian_Jew:IranianJew1513
0.02855520 Iranian_Jew:IranianJew1132
0.02935336 Iraqi_Jew:IraqiJew1771
0.03014125 Georgian_Jew:GeorgianJew1671
0.03132997 Lebanese_Muslim:Lebanese20AR21
0.03151458 Iranian_Jew:IranianJew1143
0.03167362 Syrian:Ber1AH252
0.03221000 Georgian_Jew:GeorgianJew1654
0.03229156 Armenian:armenia139
0.03269141 Lebanese_Druze:1247
0.03269398 Iranian_Jew:IranianJew1832
0.03273946 Iranian_Jew:IranianJew1556
0.03332737 Druze:HGDP00558
0.03343089 Iraqi_Jew:IraqiJew4291
0.03366779 Assyrian:Assyrian164
0.03385282 Syrian:Ber16AG184
0.03469793 Armenian:armenia279
0.03485848 Iranian_Jew:IranianJew1409
0.03508425 Lebanese_Druze:1271
0.03509589 Lebanese_Druze:971

[gixajo]

Some member has another different good method to find one parent coordinates knowing previously the son and other parent ones, ask him too.

As far as I know he gave some members coordinates that can use as if they were one of their parents coordinates.

[Ahaddad]

QUOTE=Ahaddad;6874795]Yes he fit close to levant than Mesopotamian or Assyrian right ? But I try understand what is this solution..

There are many possible solutions, what I proposed is one among them.

For example in the last PCA son and mother project another line that suggests that a different reference could be another solution.


Lebanese_Christian:Lebanese1AQ127,0.080814,0.13608 1,-0.056945,-0.071706,-0.011079,-0.030957,-0.00188,-0.003923,0.005318,0.010205,0.004384,-0.004196,0.007136,-0.006744,-0.003122,0.003447,-0.001565,0.006334,0.011564,-0.004752,0.007487,-0.001237,-0.007888,0.00723,0.001557

Target: Sonscaled
Distance: 2.9862% / 0.02986238
54.8 Lebanese_Christian
45.2 Motherscaled[/QUOTE]

Yes he could be fit as half Lebanese Christian (make more sense than Iraqi Jew or Assyrian etc ) his dad is Lebanese Muslim

[Luke35]

...

[Luke35]

Looks pretty solidly Spanish.

The mother:

Distance to: Motherscaled
0.03372587 Spanish_Canarias
0.03616499 Spanish_Extremadura
0.03654630 Portuguese
0.03718368 Spanish_Murcia
0.03913400 Spanish_Galicia
0.04060710 Spanish_Andalucia
0.04213145 Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon
0.04237282 Spanish_Eivissa
0.04244825 Spanish_Alacant
0.04250504 Spanish_Baleares
0.04359169 Spanish_Mallorca
0.04371869 Spanish_Menorca
0.04531168 Spanish_Camp_de_Tarragona
0.04545360 Italian_Liguria
0.04621292 Swiss_Italian
0.04621360 Spanish_Cataluna
0.04624244 Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha
0.04697191 French_Provence
0.04729041 Spanish_Valencia
0.04767917 Italian_Piedmont
0.04776853 Spanish_Girona
0.04797934 Spanish_Penedes
0.04826669 Italian_Veneto
0.04836397 Italian_Trentino-Alto-Adige
0.04895972 Spanish_Peri-Barcelona

[Luke35]

Using the mom's closest population:

Target: Sonscaled
Distance: 2.9845% / 0.02984545
60.8 Lebanese_Muslim
39.2 Spanish_Canarias

Target: Sonscaled
Distance: 2.7031% / 0.02703079
51.2 Iraqi_Jew
48.8 Spanish_Canarias

[Ahaddad]

Using the mom's closest population:

Target: Sonscaled
Distance: 2.9845% / 0.02984545
60.8 Lebanese_Muslim
39.2 Spanish_Canarias

Target: Sonscaled
Distance: 2.7031% / 0.02703079
51.2 Iraqi_Jew
48.8 Spanish_Canarias

His dad is Lebanese Muslim

[Ahaddad]

Some member has another different good method to find one parent coordinates knowing previously the son and other parent ones, ask him too.

As far as I know he gave some members coordinates that can use as if they were one of their parents coordinates.


Do you have the father Unscaled coordinates??

[gixajo]

Looks pretty solidly Spanish.

The mother:

Distance to: Motherscaled
0.03372587 Spanish_Canarias
0.03616499 Spanish_Extremadura
0.03654630 Portuguese
0.03718368 Spanish_Murcia
0.03913400 Spanish_Galicia
0.04060710 Spanish_Andalucia
0.04213145 Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon
0.04237282 Spanish_Eivissa
0.04244825 Spanish_Alacant
0.04250504 Spanish_Baleares
0.04359169 Spanish_Mallorca
0.04371869 Spanish_Menorca
0.04531168 Spanish_Camp_de_Tarragona
0.04545360 Italian_Liguria
0.04621292 Swiss_Italian
0.04621360 Spanish_Cataluna
0.04624244 Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha
0.04697191 French_Provence
0.04729041 Spanish_Valencia
0.04767917 Italian_Piedmont
0.04776853 Spanish_Girona
0.04797934 Spanish_Penedes
0.04826669 Italian_Veneto
0.04836397 Italian_Trentino-Alto-Adige
0.04895972 Spanish_Peri-Barcelona

Canarian natives have a lot of North African input, as you surely already know, and distances are not very typical for a native person. Maybe the mother is from South America?

[gixajo]

With those references:


Amerindian,0.05436967,-0.29863367,0.11187933,0.08561167,-0.10229633,-0.01710567,-0.24649467,-0.29544133,-0.00721667,-0.01559333,-0.00024900,-0.00372400,0.00231900,0.01401467,-0.00821100,0.00129067,0.00334633,0.00021767,0.0046 9700,0.00300767,0.00010800,0.00123633,0.00109267,0 .00337033,0.00195233
NorthAfrica,-0.0673137,0.1314590,-0.0116907,-0.0712517,0.0206577,-0.0312307,-0.0239980,0.0074100,0.0542707,0.0230963,0.0068190,-0.0077440,0.0248620,-0.0128367,0.0141237,-0.0078340,-0.0032800,-0.0154520,-0.0330237,0.0072563,-0.0099777,-0.0268773,0.0190723,-0.0015783,0.0024743
Lebanese,0.08266933,0.14034033,-0.04785800,-0.07207067,-0.01501100,-0.02607833,-0.00123600,-0.00513433,0.00114867,0.00715633,0.00546567,-0.00379467,0.01049567,0.00160867,-0.00861033,0.00616833,-0.00218200,0.00101300,0.00221367,-0.00011100,-0.00075000,0.00016400,-0.00141500,0.00221267,-0.00082433
Iberian:Center,0.11164140,0.14594010,0.04041465,-0.00269165,0.04294360,-0.00147585,-0.00171355,0.00317290,0.02653685,0.03157990,-0.00221925,0.00826750,-0.01368300,-0.01220250,0.01127050,-0.00380075,-0.00640495,-0.00096065,-0.00232535,-0.00149035,0.00287500,0.00028850,0.00013350,-0.00322815,-0.00191590
SSA:A,-0.55687967,0.06753267,0.00828100,-0.00197833,-0.00047466,-0.00003500,-0.01680300,0.02377800,0.01856900,-0.02692533,-0.00502067,0.00591333,-0.01327400,0.00153100,-0.00610700,0.00092800,0.00531300,-0.00194267,0.00208467,-0.00411667,0.00054600,-0.00162833,-0.00365633,-0.00061267,0.00158167
SSA:B,-0.6242421,0.0639936,0.0215130,0.0145326,0.0028094, 0.0117579,-0.0161961,0.0216721,-0.0308661,0.0149323,0.0037054,0.0018871,-0.0006642,0.0019913,-0.0064682,0.0041677,-0.0048993,0.0149827,-0.0066659,0.0019943,0.0010692,0.0020188,0.0011803, 0.0001642,0.0012754

Target: Motherscaled
Distance: 1.8963% / 0.01896295
81.8 Iberian
12.2 Lebanese
3.0 Amerindian
3.0 SSA
0.0 NorthAfrica

Distance to: Motherscaled
0.04342566 Iberian:Center
0.12338477 Lebanese
0.19119533 NorthAfrica
0.60096995 Amerindian
0.64994023 SSA:A
0.71668474 SSA:B

I would think she is from Latin America and not Canarian, or at least that she has any atypical ancestor being Canarian.

This is the Canarian Islands average result with these sources:

Target: Spanish_Canarias
Distance: 0.8151% / 0.00815143
82.2 Iberian
17.0 NorthAfrica
0.6 Lebanese
0.2 Amerindian
0.0 SSA

[gixajo]

To compare ,with those sources these are our results (and any of us are from Center Iberia but I use that reference as more representative for all Iberians):

Target: gixajo_scaled
Distance: 2.0401% / 0.02040104
100.0 Iberian
0.0 Amerindian
0.0 Lebanese
0.0 NorthAfrica
0.0 SSA

Target: gixajo_dad_scaled
Distance: 2.1591% / 0.02159109
97.0 Iberian
1.8 Lebanese
1.2 NorthAfrica
0.0 Amerindian
0.0 SSA

Target: gixajo_mom_scaled
Distance: 2.6919% / 0.02691918
100.0 Iberian
0.0 Amerindian
0.0 Lebanese
0.0 NorthAfrica
0.0 SSA

[gixajo]

references:

Lebanese=Lebanese_Christian,+Lebanese_Druze,+Leban ese_Muslim,
NorthAfrica,=Moroccan,+Algerian,+Tunisian,
Iberian:Center=CastillaYLeón+CastillaLaMancha
Amerindian=Quechua+Zapotec+North_Amerindian
SSA=Bantu_Kenya,+Masai+Igbo
SSA:B,=Pemba+ZAF,+Yoruba,

[Ahaddad]

With those references:


Amerindian,0.05436967,-0.29863367,0.11187933,0.08561167,-0.10229633,-0.01710567,-0.24649467,-0.29544133,-0.00721667,-0.01559333,-0.00024900,-0.00372400,0.00231900,0.01401467,-0.00821100,0.00129067,0.00334633,0.00021767,0.0046 9700,0.00300767,0.00010800,0.00123633,0.00109267,0 .00337033,0.00195233
NorthAfrica,-0.0673137,0.1314590,-0.0116907,-0.0712517,0.0206577,-0.0312307,-0.0239980,0.0074100,0.0542707,0.0230963,0.0068190,-0.0077440,0.0248620,-0.0128367,0.0141237,-0.0078340,-0.0032800,-0.0154520,-0.0330237,0.0072563,-0.0099777,-0.0268773,0.0190723,-0.0015783,0.0024743
Lebanese,0.08266933,0.14034033,-0.04785800,-0.07207067,-0.01501100,-0.02607833,-0.00123600,-0.00513433,0.00114867,0.00715633,0.00546567,-0.00379467,0.01049567,0.00160867,-0.00861033,0.00616833,-0.00218200,0.00101300,0.00221367,-0.00011100,-0.00075000,0.00016400,-0.00141500,0.00221267,-0.00082433
Iberian:Center,0.11164140,0.14594010,0.04041465,-0.00269165,0.04294360,-0.00147585,-0.00171355,0.00317290,0.02653685,0.03157990,-0.00221925,0.00826750,-0.01368300,-0.01220250,0.01127050,-0.00380075,-0.00640495,-0.00096065,-0.00232535,-0.00149035,0.00287500,0.00028850,0.00013350,-0.00322815,-0.00191590
SSA:A,-0.55687967,0.06753267,0.00828100,-0.00197833,-0.00047466,-0.00003500,-0.01680300,0.02377800,0.01856900,-0.02692533,-0.00502067,0.00591333,-0.01327400,0.00153100,-0.00610700,0.00092800,0.00531300,-0.00194267,0.00208467,-0.00411667,0.00054600,-0.00162833,-0.00365633,-0.00061267,0.00158167
SSA:B,-0.6242421,0.0639936,0.0215130,0.0145326,0.0028094, 0.0117579,-0.0161961,0.0216721,-0.0308661,0.0149323,0.0037054,0.0018871,-0.0006642,0.0019913,-0.0064682,0.0041677,-0.0048993,0.0149827,-0.0066659,0.0019943,0.0010692,0.0020188,0.0011803, 0.0001642,0.0012754

Target: Motherscaled
Distance: 1.8963% / 0.01896295
81.8 Iberian
12.2 Lebanese
3.0 Amerindian
3.0 SSA
0.0 NorthAfrica

Distance to: Motherscaled
0.04342566 Iberian:Center
0.12338477 Lebanese
0.19119533 NorthAfrica
0.60096995 Amerindian
0.64994023 SSA:A
0.71668474 SSA:B

I would think she is from Latin America and not Canarian, or at least that she has any atypical ancestor being Canarian.

This is the Canarian Islands average result with these sources:

Target: Spanish_Canarias
Distance: 0.8151% / 0.00815143
82.2 Iberian
17.0 NorthAfrica
0.6 Lebanese
0.2 Amerindian
0.0 SSA

You are correct she is from Latin America and like I say she has also Lebanese origin from a great grandfather

[Ahaddad]

references:

Lebanese=Lebanese_Christian,+Lebanese_Druze,+Leban ese_Muslim,
NorthAfrica,=Moroccan,+Algerian,+Tunisian,
Iberian:Center=CastillaYLeón+CastillaLaMancha
Amerindian=Quechua+Zapotec+North_Amerindian
SSA=Bantu_Kenya,+Masai+Igbo
SSA:B,=Pemba+ZAF,+Yoruba,

Without his mom admix what his admix fit? He fit around 60% Lebanese ?

[Ahaddad]

Ancient admixture

Target: Sonscaled
Distance: 2.6402% / 0.02640162
51.8 Motherscaled
23.6 Levant_Hazor_MLBAI3965
18.2 Levant_Beirut_HellenisticSFI-20
5.6 Levant_Ashkelon_LBAASH34
0.8 Levant_Yehud_IBAI7003

[Ahaddad]

Up

[Abriekman]

But for example I'm not between my parents both on G25 and Gedmatch calcs. We create rather form of triangle on PCA.
So for me this method wouldn't be ideal.

I know one person who is also on some PCAs not between his parents, but when he runs his modern averages G25 results it looks like he is just nearly 50/50 split of them. I do not think PCA means much in this case, because it depends which 25 demensions you see on 2D PCA.