Gedmatch for distant Lipka Tatar?

[Polak]

Hi, what would someone with one Lipka Tatar great grandparent get on Gedmatch? And which calculators are best for Tatar ancestry?

[Kaspias]

There is a potential for not showing up of Tatar admixture at all(1/8 is distant enough).

Anyway try Dodecad K12b, Eurogenes K13, MDLP K23b, MDLP World.

[Leto]

If they are 20-25% East Eurasian as some sources suggest, then 2-3% East Eurasian on Gedmatch would be a possible indicator (unless one has Russian or Finnish ancestry).

[Ion Basescul]

https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/1061/1924/products/Eyes_Emoji_grande.png?v=1571606063

[Polak]

If they are 20-25% East Eurasian as some sources suggest, then 2-3% East Eurasian on Gedmatch would be a possible indicator (unless one has Russian or Finnish ancestry).

I ran my results through Dodecad K12b, Eurogenes K13, MDLP K23b, MDLP World and I added up all the mongolid admixture and divided it by 4. I got an average of 2.7%. My EA is around 2% on each calculator.

I didn't get any central or East Asia for 23andme but I did get the Republic of Bashkortostan as a region in Russia. I've always thought my great grandmother was a Lipka Tatar, just noise or does it look like there's some truth to it?

[Kaspias]

I ran my results through Dodecad K12b, Eurogenes K13, MDLP K23b, MDLP World and I added up all the mongolid admixture and divided it by 4. I got an average of 2.7%. My EA is around 2% on each calculator.

I didn't get any central or East Asia for 23andme but I did get the Republic of Bashkortostan as a region in Russia. I've always thought my great grandmother was a Lipka Tatar, just noise or does it look like there's some truth to it?

Post your results here

[Leto]

I ran my results through Dodecad K12b, Eurogenes K13, MDLP K23b, MDLP World and I added up all the mongolid admixture and divided it by 4. I got an average of 2.7%. My EA is around 2% on each calculator.

I didn't get any central or East Asia for 23andme but I did get the Republic of Bashkortostan as a region in Russia. I've always thought my great grandmother was a Lipka Tatar, just noise or does it look like there's some truth to it?
Well, no one here can tell you whether or not she was.

[Lucas]

Post results from mentioned calcs, also from K36.

You can try also AdmixtureStudio or http://vahaduo.genetics.ovh/

[Polak]

102019
102020
102021
102022
102023

[Polak]

Post your results here

Done

[Polak]

Post results from mentioned calcs, also from K36.

You can try also AdmixtureStudio or http://vahaduo.genetics.ovh/

Your thoughts?

[WeirdLookingFellow]

You score less Asian input than several Romanians with no known Tatar admix. 2.25 is still sth on K13 but not considerable.

If Amerindian and Siberian counts, even I score more than you.

Don't know if that says more about gene inheritance overall or about the degree of Turkic and Tatar input in us.

[Figaro]

I ran my results through Dodecad K12b, Eurogenes K13, MDLP K23b, MDLP World and I added up all the mongolid admixture and divided it by 4. I got an average of 2.7%. My EA is around 2% on each calculator.

I didn't get any central or East Asia for 23andme but I did get the Republic of Bashkortostan as a region in Russia. I've always thought my great grandmother was a Lipka Tatar, just noise or does it look like there's some truth to it?

I’m not super sure how much of an indication the regional breakdown is or how “telling” it is for Tatar ancestry. My mother gets Bashgortostan, Cheylabinsk and Orenburg , all near each other in the Urals. My mother’s mother was descent from Belarusian Poles on both sides. The regions mentioned could just be indicating Slavs who moved there later on, as Poles in Belarus are a small but consistently found group that Far East due to Russian empire and later soviet “movements”.

Isn’t the regional breakdown entirely based upon self-reported ancestry?

[Polak]

You score less Asian input than several Romanians with no known Tatar admix. 2.25 is still sth on K13 but not considerable.

If Amerindian and Siberian counts, even I score more than you.

Don't know if that says more about gene inheritance overall or about the degree of Turkic and Tatar input in us.

I don't know if my great grandmother was Tatar or not, I've just been told that she was. How do my results compare to other Poles?

[Polak]

I’m not super sure how much of an indication the regional breakdown is or how “telling” it is for Tatar ancestry. My mother gets Bashgortostan, Cheylabinsk and Orenburg , all near each other in the Urals. My mother’s mother was descent from Belarusian Poles on both sides. The regions mentioned could just be indicating Slavs who moved there later on, as Poles in Belarus are a small but consistently found group that Far East due to Russian empire and later soviet “movements”.

Isn’t the regional breakdown entirely based upon self-reported ancestry?

Yes it is. I'm taking it with a grain of salt. But I've seen very Asian looking people get 90% EE with a Ural region. In particular Bashkortostan.

[Nomad]

You score less Asian input than several Romanians with no known Tatar admix. 2.25 is still sth on K13 but not considerable.

If Amerindian and Siberian counts, even I score more than you.

Don't know if that says more about gene inheritance overall or about the degree of Turkic and Tatar input in us.

Some Turkic tribes admixed with Romanians,Moldovans and Ukrainians before than pre Turco-Mongol expansions.

[Nomad]

You score less Asian input than several Romanians with no known Tatar admix. 2.25 is still sth on K13 but not considerable.

If Amerindian and Siberian counts, even I score more than you.

Don't know if that says more about gene inheritance overall or about the degree of Turkic and Tatar input in us.

Some Turkic tribes admixed with Romanians,Moldovans and Ukrainians before than pre Turco-Mongol expansions.

[Leto]

Some Turkic tribes admixed with Romanians,Moldovans and Ukrainians before than pre Turco-Mongol expansions.
Except the Ukrainians did not exist at that time ;)

[Rgvgjhvv]

You score less Asian input than several Romanians with no known Tatar admix. 2.25 is still sth on K13 but not considerable.

If Amerindian and Siberian counts, even I score more than you.

Don't know if that says more about gene inheritance overall or about the degree of Turkic and Tatar input in us.

No point in comparing with Romanians when he's not Romanian, lol. Absolutely useless actually.

[Lucas]

Your thoughts?

You have quite elevated African noise for a Pole. I have in K36 0.24 NE-African and it's very rare. You have 0.86 Pygmy. In lower K calcs of course even more SSA noise. I think it is more significant than your East-Asian/ Siberian noise.

[Nomad]

Except the Ukrainians did not exist at that time ;)

Pravilno ;) I could say the East Slavs totally.Some people thought that the Russians started to admix with Turco-Mongols but they don't know the Pechenegs,Cumans and Chernie Klobuki(Turkic groups with Black Hats)integrated to Slavic-Romanian communities.

[Leto]

Pravilno ;) I could say the East Slavs totally.Some people thought that the Russians started to with Turco-Mongols but they don't know the Pechenegs,Cumans and Chernie Klobuki(Turkic groups with Black Hats)integrated to Slavic-Romanian communities.
English-speaking people associate the word "Russian" (adjective) with "Russia" whereas in the Russian language "russki" is derived from "the (Kievan) Rus". So for us there is no problem with Russians being outside of Russia.

Yeah, but we don't really know what those pre-Mongol Turkics were like genetically. Some medieval sources suggest they had light features.

[Polak]

You have quite elevated African noise for a Pole. I have in K36 0.24 NE-African and it's very rare. You have 0.86 Pygmy. In lower K calcs of course even more SSA noise. I think it is more significant than your East-Asian/ Siberian noise.

Interesting, what is the significance of this SSA noise?

[Lucas]

Your thoughts?

You have quite elevated African noise for a Pole. I have in K36 0.24 NE-African and it's very rare. You have 0.86 Pygmy. In lower K calcs of course even more SSA noise. I think it is more significant than your East-Asian/ Siberian noise.

[Aspirin]

With such amount of East Asian you really can have one distant Lipka Tatar ancestor.

[Leto]

Polish and Belarusian Tatars in case you're interested (the oracles may be outdated as of now)

Some very interesting finds - Belarusian Tatars (siblings or close relatives). There is a couple of other people on that account but they seem mixed with Belarusians

E-M35
T2c

Gedrosia 12.98 Pct
Siberian 9.49 Pct
Northwest_African 0.29 Pct
Southeast_Asian 0.91 Pct
Atlantic_Med 15.64 Pct
North_European 27.24 Pct
South_Asian 0.95 Pct
East_African -
Southwest_Asian 2.90 Pct
East_Asian 12.03 Pct
Caucasus 17.56 Pct
Sub_Saharan -

Distance to: Enver
7.54091506 Crimean_Tatar_Steppe
16.73118645 Turk_Romania
17.29641581 Turk_Bulgaria
18.15616700 Uzbek
18.20162905 Tatar_Kazan
19.67927082 Turkmen_Uzbekistan
20.12610742 Crimean_Tatar_Mountain
20.25033086 Turk_Greece
20.28272664 Bashkir
21.30099763 R.Moldova_Gagauz

Target: Enver
Distance: 1.9180% / 1.91803529 | ADC: 0.25x
73.2 Crimean_Tatar_Steppe
9.4 Cornwall
7.0 Dargin
5.4 Yagnobi
4.6 Turk_Romania
0.4 Mixed_Germanic

#

Gedrosia 13.10 Pct
Siberian 6.46 Pct
Northwest_African 0.52 Pct
Southeast_Asian -
Atlantic_Med 15.93 Pct
North_European 21.42 Pct
South_Asian 0.87 Pct
East_African -
Southwest_Asian 5.83 Pct
East_Asian 8.54 Pct
Caucasus 27.34 Pct
Sub_Saharan -

Distance to: Riza
8.37637153 Crimean_Tatar_Mountain
10.79559632 Turk_Northwest
12.87789579 Turk_Bulgaria
13.43999628 Turk_Southwest
13.48469132 Yoruk
13.83834528 Turk_Romania
13.85248353 Turk_Greece
14.30959468 Crimean_Tatar_Coast
14.48187488 Turk_West_BlackSea
15.71159763 Turk_Macedonia

Target: Riza
Distance: 3.0381% / 3.03813676 | ADC: 0.5x
69.4 Crimean_Tatar_Mountain
25.2 Crimean_Tatar_Steppe
4.2 Turkmen_Uzbekistan
1.2 Tajik_Balanovsky2019

Target: Riza
Distance: 2.0655% / 2.06546420 | ADC: 0.25x
63.2 Crimean_Tatar_Mountain
25.4 Crimean_Tatar_Steppe
5.8 Tajiks
3.8 Yoruk
1.0 French_Basque
0.4 JPT30
0.2 Japanese
0.2 Pais_Vasco

#

Gedrosia 9.26 Pct
Siberian 10.34 Pct
Northwest_African -
Southeast_Asian 2.27 Pct
Atlantic_Med 14.25 Pct
North_European 32.42 Pct
South_Asian 1.42 Pct
East_African -
Southwest_Asian 1.51 Pct
East_Asian 16.78 Pct
Caucasus 11.75 Pct
Sub_Saharan -

Distance to: Antonina
9.59964062 Crimean_Tatar_Steppe
14.24801039 Tatar_Kazan
15.58676682 Bashkir
21.63987754 Uzbek
23.27610148 Udmurt
23.45100211 Mari
23.50405710 Turk_Romania
23.83418763 HUN_Szekely
24.28202422 Turk_Bulgaria
24.30400584 Karakalpak

Target: Antonina
Distance: 2.0690% / 2.06899796 | ADC: 0.25x
47.2 Crimean_Tatar_Steppe
40.6 Tatar_Kazan
6.0 Argyll
4.0 Japanese
2.2 Chinese


And here are two Polish Tatars from Bialystok (siblings)

Gedrosia 7.18 Pct
Siberian 12.22 Pct
Northwest_African -
Southeast_Asian 4.59 Pct
Atlantic_Med 16.44 Pct
North_European 33.04 Pct
South_Asian 1.17 Pct
East_African -
Southwest_Asian 1.88 Pct
East_Asian 10.11 Pct
Caucasus 12.76 Pct
Sub_Saharan 0.59 Pct

Distance to: Jaroslaw
10.97382340 Tatar_Kazan
11.70854816 Crimean_Tatar_Steppe
17.41080412 Bashkir
19.37336574 HUN_Szekely
19.79486550 Turk_Romania
20.67474063 Turk_Bulgaria
20.76646576 Udmurt
21.02461652 Mari
21.09420774 R.Moldova_Centre+North
22.31228585 Serb

Target: Jaroslaw
Distance: 1.8523% / 1.85231392 | ADC: 0.25x
52.2 Tatar_Kazan
37.2 Crimean_Tatar_Steppe
5.4 Cantabria
3.2 Lahu
1.8 Swiss_Italian
0.2 Dai

#

Gedrosia 9.90 Pct
Siberian 11.94 Pct
Northwest_African -
Southeast_Asian 1.56 Pct
Atlantic_Med 14.29 Pct
North_European 32.81 Pct
South_Asian -
East_African -
Southwest_Asian 1.33 Pct
East_Asian 14.08 Pct
Caucasus 14.09 Pct
Sub_Saharan -

Distance to: Halina
8.94025167 Crimean_Tatar_Steppe
12.36309023 Tatar_Kazan
15.43405650 Bashkir
21.38145224 Turk_Romania
21.69991475 Udmurt
21.88643644 Uzbek
22.01143112 Turk_Bulgaria
22.02908759 Mari
22.22073131 HUN_Szekely
23.77339269 R.Moldova_Centre+North

Target: Halina
Distance: 2.6187% / 2.61873719 | ADC: 0.25x
55.6 Crimean_Tatar_Steppe
39.2 Tatar_Kazan
3.6 Mixed_Germanic
1.6 Japanese

The Türük is so strong in them, stronger than in the Volga ones who live in a much more Eastern place!

[Polak]

With such amount of East Asian you really can have one distant Lipka Tatar ancestor.

You think so? Let's presume that most of this admixture came from my great grandmother, would that match up with the EE that Lipka Tatars usually get?

[Aspirin]

You think so? Let's presume that most of this admixture came from my great grandmother, would that match up with the EE that Lipka Tatars usually get?

I personally don't know, but for Slavs is more common to score high Siberian, high East Asian is a different thing. Maybe Leto will tell, he know better than me.

[Leto]

You think so? Let's presume that most of this admixture came from my great grandmother, would that match up with the EE that Lipka Tatars usually get?
Theoretically speaking:
~25% East Eurasian = 100% Tatar
~12.5% EE = 50% Tatar
~6.25% EE = 25% Tatar
~3.125% EE = 12.5% Tatar

Of course one would normally not inherit the exact same amount.

Your Dodecad K7b:

Population
South_Asian -
West_Asian 11.09 Pct
Siberian 1.16 Pct
African 1.06 Pct
Southern 7.31 Pct
Atlantic_Baltic 77.41 Pct
East_Asian 1.98 Pct

I would recommend you to convert the raw data to the V3 format, it is more accurate.

[Leto]

I personally don't know, but for Slavs is more common to score high Siberian, high East Asian is a different thing. Maybe Leto will tell, he know better than me.
That's right but sometimes those components might be interchangeable, particularly in small amounts (2-3%).

[Polak]

That's right but sometimes those components might be interchangeable, particularly in small amounts (2-3%).

I think I understand, so you can't really distinguish "Siberian" from "East Asian" in such small amounts as 2%, which means there is no feasible way of finding out if its just part of my Slavic make up (Siberian) or genuine Tatar admixture (East Asian).

[Leto]

I think I understand, so you can't really distinguish "Siberian" from "East Asian" in such small amounts as 2%, which means there is no feasible way of finding out if its just part of my Slavic make up (Siberian) or genuine Tatar admixture (East Asian).
Yes, correct. Don't sweat it.
Check my updated message on the previous page.

[Ion Basescul]

I think I understand, so you can't really distinguish "Siberian" from "East Asian" in such small amounts as 2%, which means there is no feasible way of finding out if its just part of my Slavic make up (Siberian) or genuine Tatar admixture (East Asian).

Genuine Tatar admixture should be a mix of Siberian and East Asian. Szeklers can score up to 7% East Asian/Siberian, but it doesn't come from Tatars in their case. The easiest way to check if it's recent is by looking at your full list of DNA relatives where you've tested. Ideally, you should be on MyHeritage (they accept transfers), as it's got the biggest database of users from Europe.

[Polak]

Theoretically speaking:
~25% East Eurasian = 100% Tatar
~12.5% EE = 50% Tatar
~6.25% EE = 25% Tatar
~3.125% EE = 12.5% Tatar

Of course one would normally not inherit the exact same amount.

Your Dodecad K7b:

Population
South_Asian -
West_Asian 11.09 Pct
Siberian 1.16 Pct
African 1.06 Pct
Southern 7.31 Pct
Atlantic_Baltic 77.41 Pct
East_Asian 1.98 Pct

I would recommend you to convert the raw data to the V3 format, it is more accurate.

How would I go about converting it? Thanks

[Polak]

Genuine Tatar admixture should be a mix of Siberian and East Asian. Szeklers can score up to 7% East Asian/Siberian, but it doesn't come from Tatars in their case. The easiest way to check if it's recent is by looking at your full list of DNA relatives where you've tested. Ideally, you should be on MyHeritage (they accept transfers), as it's got the biggest database of users from Europe.

I've got Myheritage as well, what nationality should I sort by?

[Leto]

How would I go about converting it? Thanks
DNA Kit Studio. Kaspias and Lemgrant know better.
https://dnagenics.com/dna-kit-studio/
But you need to download the imputed txt file from DNA.Land first.

[DedPerded]

This Lithuanian Tatar has a powerful Anatolian and South Asian admixture. Lipka tatars can be descendants of Crimean tatars, not Kazan tatars?
102029

[Smitty]

Yes, correct. Don't sweat it.
Check my updated message on the previous page.

My mom gets over 2% Amerindian on Eurogenes K13, and her ancestry goes no farther east than western Poland/Pomerania. What do you make of that? I've seen even Irish get some Amerindian, but it still seems weird to me.

[Ion Basescul]

I've got Myheritage as well, what nationality should I sort by?

None, if you want to be sure then you should go through the full unfiltered list of your thousands of matches.

[Leto]

My mom gets over 2% Amerindian on Eurogenes K13, and her ancestry goes no farther east than western Poland/Pomerania. What do you make of that? I've seen even Irish get some Amerindian, but it still seems weird to me.
It's probably noise or just ancient Indo-European heritage. I'm also 2% Amerindian which obviously cannot be real. That's why I prefer calculators which don't have an Amerindian/Native American component because in Eurasia it's totally useless. At any rate, the Amerindians are said to be ca. 70% East Eurasian only.

[Leto]

This Lithuanian Tatar has a powerful Anatolian and South Asian admixture. Lipka tatars can be descendants of Crimean tatars, not Kazan tatars?
102029
They may be a mix of both kinds of Tatar. His Gedmatch would be more informative anyway.

[Polak]

DNA Kit Studio. Kaspias and Lemgrant know better.
https://dnagenics.com/dna-kit-studio/
But you need to download the imputed txt file from DNA.Land first.

I've converted the file to V3 and uploaded it to Gedmatch and ran it through the same calculators, my results are pretty much the same with maybe 0.01% difference.

[Leto]

I've converted the file to V3 and uploaded it to Gedmatch and ran it through the same calculators, my results are pretty much the same with maybe 0.01% difference.
You need to use the DNA.Land imputed file. Do you have an account on there? Download the txt file and then convert it to V3. Otherwise it's not gonna make a difference.

[Polak]

You need to use the DNA.Land imputed file. Do you have an account on there? Download the txt file and then convert it to V3. Otherwise it's not gonna make a difference.

In that case I'm not sure what to do because it says on DNA.LAND that the download of imputed files is temporarily disabled (from June 2020). In other words, I can't.

[Leto]

In that case I'm not sure what to do because it says on DNA.LAND that the download of imputed files is temporarily disabled (from June 2020). In other words, I can't.
That sucks. I can't help you any further then. Hopefully they will enable that function again in the future.

[Polak]

That sucks. I can't help you any further then. Hopefully they will enable that function again in the future.

It's okay, thanks for your help either way, I appreciate it.

[Polak]

I ran my genotype through yourdnaportal on the EDAR & EA section and I got:

102040

I also got a match for African. I'm guessing these don't mean a whole lot?

[Figaro]

For reference and because you got me thinking about this a bit, here is my mother's Dodecad K7b (on 23 she has her top few regional breakdowns in Bashkortostan and surrounds). You score more East Asian than she does (that is, she scores none on here). On most of the calcs, her EE side overpowers everything else to a good degree.

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 Atlantic_Baltic 71.24
2 West_Asian 13.55
3 Southern 11.75
4 Siberian 1.93
5 South_Asian 1.52


Finished reading population data. 223 populations found.
7 components mode.

--------------------------------

Least-squares method.

Using 1 population approximation:
1 Hungarians_Behar @ 4.014789
2 German_Dodecad @ 4.753119
3 Mixed_Germanic_Dodecad @ 4.878016
4 Dutch_Dodecad @ 5.234162
5 Ukranians_Yunusbayev @ 5.560009
6 CEU30_1000Genomes @ 5.970379
7 Cornwall_1000Genomes @ 6.020586
8 Kent_1000Genomes @ 6.514482
9 Mixed_Slav_Dodecad @ 6.695173
10 English_Dodecad @ 7.071976
11 Argyll_1000Genomes @ 7.479393
12 Irish_Dodecad @ 7.887708
13 British_Dodecad @ 7.898082
14 British_Isles_Dodecad @ 8.097100
15 Orcadian_HGDP @ 8.246036
16 Orkney_1000Genomes @ 8.906356
17 Polish_Dodecad @ 9.177875
18 French_HGDP @ 9.204906
19 French_Dodecad @ 9.669055
20 Russian_B_Behar @ 10.499952

Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% Hungarians_Behar +50% Ukranians_Yunusbayev @ 1.799976


Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% British_Isles_Dodecad +25% Mordovians_Yunusbayev +25% Romanians_Behar @ 0.745308


Using 4 populations approximation:
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
1 British_Isles_Dodecad + Mordovians_Yunusbayev + Orcadian_HGDP + Romanians_Behar @ 0.665767
2 British_Isles_Dodecad + British_Isles_Dodecad + Mordovians_Yunusbayev + Romanians_Behar @ 0.745308
3 British_Dodecad + Mordovians_Yunusbayev + Orcadian_HGDP + Romanians_Behar @ 0.764300
4 British_Isles_Dodecad + Mordovians_Yunusbayev + Orkney_1000Genomes + Romanians_Behar @ 0.780962
5 British_Isles_Dodecad + Irish_Dodecad + Mordovians_Yunusbayev + Romanians_Behar @ 0.798503
6 French_Dodecad + Lithuanian_Dodecad + Romanians_Behar + Russian_Dodecad @ 0.798579
7 British_Dodecad + British_Isles_Dodecad + Mordovians_Yunusbayev + Romanians_Behar @ 0.808728
8 Mordovians_Yunusbayev + Orcadian_HGDP + Orcadian_HGDP + Romanians_Behar @ 0.819627
9 Irish_Dodecad + Mordovians_Yunusbayev + Orcadian_HGDP + Romanians_Behar @ 0.823966
10 British_Dodecad + Mordovians_Yunusbayev + Orkney_1000Genomes + Romanians_Behar @ 0.827600
11 CEU30_1000Genomes + Orcadian_HGDP + Romanians_Behar + Russian_HGDP @ 0.842730
12 British_Dodecad + Irish_Dodecad + Mordovians_Yunusbayev + Romanians_Behar @ 0.860185
13 British_Dodecad + British_Dodecad + Mordovians_Yunusbayev + Romanians_Behar @ 0.873986
14 British_Isles_Dodecad + Dutch_Dodecad + Romanians_Behar + Russian_HGDP @ 0.891658
15 British_Isles_Dodecad + CEU30_1000Genomes + Romanians_Behar + Russian_HGDP @ 0.894946
16 Argyll_1000Genomes + CEU30_1000Genomes + Romanians_Behar + Russian_Dodecad @ 0.896727
17 British_Isles_Dodecad + Dutch_Dodecad + Romanians_Behar + Russian_Dodecad @ 0.901159
18 CEU30_1000Genomes + Irish_Dodecad + Romanians_Behar + Russian_HGDP @ 0.906690
19 British_Dodecad + Dutch_Dodecad + Romanians_Behar + Russian_Dodecad @ 0.911117
20 Argyll_1000Genomes + Cornwall_1000Genomes + Romanians_Behar + Russian_Dodecad @ 0.915270

[Polak]

For reference and because you got me thinking about this a bit, here is my mother's Dodecad K7b (on 23 she has her top few regional breakdowns in Bashkortostan and surrounds). You score more East Asian than she does (that is, she scores none on here). On most of the calcs, her EE side overpowers everything else to a good degree.

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 Atlantic_Baltic 71.24
2 West_Asian 13.55
3 Southern 11.75
4 Siberian 1.93
5 South_Asian 1.52


Finished reading population data. 223 populations found.
7 components mode.

--------------------------------

Least-squares method.

Using 1 population approximation:
1 Hungarians_Behar @ 4.014789
2 German_Dodecad @ 4.753119
3 Mixed_Germanic_Dodecad @ 4.878016
4 Dutch_Dodecad @ 5.234162
5 Ukranians_Yunusbayev @ 5.560009
6 CEU30_1000Genomes @ 5.970379
7 Cornwall_1000Genomes @ 6.020586
8 Kent_1000Genomes @ 6.514482
9 Mixed_Slav_Dodecad @ 6.695173
10 English_Dodecad @ 7.071976
11 Argyll_1000Genomes @ 7.479393
12 Irish_Dodecad @ 7.887708
13 British_Dodecad @ 7.898082
14 British_Isles_Dodecad @ 8.097100
15 Orcadian_HGDP @ 8.246036
16 Orkney_1000Genomes @ 8.906356
17 Polish_Dodecad @ 9.177875
18 French_HGDP @ 9.204906
19 French_Dodecad @ 9.669055
20 Russian_B_Behar @ 10.499952

Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% Hungarians_Behar +50% Ukranians_Yunusbayev @ 1.799976


Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% British_Isles_Dodecad +25% Mordovians_Yunusbayev +25% Romanians_Behar @ 0.745308


Using 4 populations approximation:
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
1 British_Isles_Dodecad + Mordovians_Yunusbayev + Orcadian_HGDP + Romanians_Behar @ 0.665767
2 British_Isles_Dodecad + British_Isles_Dodecad + Mordovians_Yunusbayev + Romanians_Behar @ 0.745308
3 British_Dodecad + Mordovians_Yunusbayev + Orcadian_HGDP + Romanians_Behar @ 0.764300
4 British_Isles_Dodecad + Mordovians_Yunusbayev + Orkney_1000Genomes + Romanians_Behar @ 0.780962
5 British_Isles_Dodecad + Irish_Dodecad + Mordovians_Yunusbayev + Romanians_Behar @ 0.798503
6 French_Dodecad + Lithuanian_Dodecad + Romanians_Behar + Russian_Dodecad @ 0.798579
7 British_Dodecad + British_Isles_Dodecad + Mordovians_Yunusbayev + Romanians_Behar @ 0.808728
8 Mordovians_Yunusbayev + Orcadian_HGDP + Orcadian_HGDP + Romanians_Behar @ 0.819627
9 Irish_Dodecad + Mordovians_Yunusbayev + Orcadian_HGDP + Romanians_Behar @ 0.823966
10 British_Dodecad + Mordovians_Yunusbayev + Orkney_1000Genomes + Romanians_Behar @ 0.827600
11 CEU30_1000Genomes + Orcadian_HGDP + Romanians_Behar + Russian_HGDP @ 0.842730
12 British_Dodecad + Irish_Dodecad + Mordovians_Yunusbayev + Romanians_Behar @ 0.860185
13 British_Dodecad + British_Dodecad + Mordovians_Yunusbayev + Romanians_Behar @ 0.873986
14 British_Isles_Dodecad + Dutch_Dodecad + Romanians_Behar + Russian_HGDP @ 0.891658
15 British_Isles_Dodecad + CEU30_1000Genomes + Romanians_Behar + Russian_HGDP @ 0.894946
16 Argyll_1000Genomes + CEU30_1000Genomes + Romanians_Behar + Russian_Dodecad @ 0.896727
17 British_Isles_Dodecad + Dutch_Dodecad + Romanians_Behar + Russian_Dodecad @ 0.901159
18 CEU30_1000Genomes + Irish_Dodecad + Romanians_Behar + Russian_HGDP @ 0.906690
19 British_Dodecad + Dutch_Dodecad + Romanians_Behar + Russian_Dodecad @ 0.911117
20 Argyll_1000Genomes + Cornwall_1000Genomes + Romanians_Behar + Russian_Dodecad @ 0.915270

Interesting results. Makes me wonder whether the Eastern European category on 23andme has Asian and other admixture accounted into it?

[Figaro]

I’m not too sure what is “normal” South Asian on that calc for a non-admixed Slav. Maybe there’s a hint in there...as more Indo-Aryan like substrates in genes could be hiding in there.

[Figaro]

Bump.

[Polak]

bump

[Chris596]

Well, in my opinion you could really have legit Tatar ancestry. You score more East Asian than me on all of these calculators. Your East Asian, Siberian, Arctic, Amerindian together is significant I think.

I know, I know, now people would tell me that Romanians, Ukrainians, Russians etc are more East Asian than me, blabla, yes they are... But I'm half Szekely Hungarian, if I would be full or ,,normal'' Hungarian I would probably get 0% East Asian or under 1%.. Most of the time I score 2% - 2.5% Siberian+East Asian in total on different calculators. My father is Szekely Hungarian and he is around ~4% East Asian, most likely.

I'm mostly a Balkanigg@ anyway lol, both of my parents are like South Slavs genetically. So in my opinion you can have distant Tatar ancestry, judging by your results.


Also, please try out these calculators and tell me your results. I'm interested, how many East Asian alleles can it detect for you (it detected 6 in my case), and what % of Turkic, SE & NE Asian and Mongol you get here:

https://yourdnaportal.com/edar

https://yourdnaportal.com/gadata/TurkicK11

Edit: I also couldn't help but notice that you are ~1% Sub-Saharan, interesting.

[Polak]

Well, in my opinion you could really have legit Tatar ancestry. You score more East Asian than me on all of these calculators. Your East Asian, Siberian, Arctic, Amerindian together is significant I think.

I know, I know, now people would tell me that Romanians, Ukrainians, Russians etc are more East Asian than me, blabla, yes they are... But I'm half Szekely Hungarian, if I would be full or ,,normal'' Hungarian I would probably get 0% East Asian or under 1%.. Most of the time I score 2% - 2.5% Siberian+East Asian in total on different calculators. My father is Szekely Hungarian and he is around ~4% East Asian, most likely.

I'm mostly a Balkanigg@ anyway lol, both of my parents are like South Slavs genetically. So in my opinion you can have distant Tatar ancestry, judging by your results.


Also, please try out these calculators and tell me your results. I'm interested, how many East Asian alleles can it detect for you (it detected 6 in my case), and what % of Turkic, SE & NE Asian and Mongol you get here:

https://yourdnaportal.com/edar

https://yourdnaportal.com/gadata/TurkicK11

Edit: I also couldn't help but notice that you are ~1% Sub-Saharan, interesting.

Here are Asian results:

102187
102188
102189

As you can see, I have one match and my "Asian" matches Gedmatch pretty well as well. Don't know what people usually get for these though, tbh.

And just for fun, African:

102190

Also one match, again; I'm not sure what people usually get for this or how valid it is, but my SSA stays the same on most calculators on Gedmatch.

[Chris596]

Here are Asian results:

102187
102188
102189

As you can see, I have one match and my "Asian" matches Gedmatch pretty well as well. Don't know what people usually get for these though, tbh.

And just for fun, African:

102190

Also one match, again; I'm not sure what people usually get for this or how valid it is, but my SSA stays the same on most calculators on Gedmatch.

That's quite strange to be honest. With these results I expected the calculator to detect at least 7-8 alleles in your case. But of course there are hundreds-thousands of alleles and probably this calculator lacks many of them, I was just curious what you might get here.

The Turkic calculator is interesting, it says you are 1% Turkic. Unfortunately I still don't know what to think, because I have quite different results. Still, the most interesting thing is that you got ,,Mongol'' which is 1.5% + 0.25% Southeast Asian, that's a good indication I think. This is what I get here:

-Turkic 4.48%
-Northeast Asian 0.47%
-Southeast Asian 0.45%
-Papuan 0.16%

[Polak]

That's quite strange to be honest. With these results I expected the calculator to detect at least 7-8 alleles in your case. But of course there are hundreds-thousands of alleles and probably this calculator lacks many of them, I was just curious what you might get here.

The Turkic calculator is interesting, it says you are 1% Turkic. Unfortunately I still don't know what to think, because I have quite different results. Still, the most interesting thing is that you got ,,Mongol'' which is 1.5% + 0.25% Southeast Asian, that's a good indication I think. This is what I get here:

-Turkic 4.48%
-Northeast Asian 0.47%
-Southeast Asian 0.45%
-Papuan 0.16%

Your Turkic makes sense because you genuinely have Turkic ancestry, whereas "Tatar" was a broad term given to a wide variety of "steppe raiders" by Europeans. These groups ended up intermarrying and mixing because their cultures were closer to one another than the European ones, so its safe to assume that Lipka and Volga Tatars are alot more "Mongoloid" than Crimean Tatars who are alot more "Turkic". That's my take anyway.

And to be honest the alleles don't really surprise me because my great grandmother (if she really was Tatar) would only be like 20-25% EA which means she would only have about 7 or 8 alleles.

[Polak]

Bump.

Hypothetically, if my great grandmother was in fact partially or fully Lipka, would I still score Central or East Asian on 23andme or is it distant enough where the admixture only gets picked up on autosomal calculators (Eurogenes, etc.)? On 23andme I don't get any Asian despite getting between 2-3% on every autosomal calc, but I do get Bashkortostan as a region in my Eastern European? Do the regions overlap to some degree?

[Abriekman]

Bump.

Hypothetically, if my great grandmother was in fact partially or fully Lipka, would I still score Central or East Asian on 23andme or is it distant enough where the admixture only gets picked up on autosomal calculators (Eurogenes, etc.)? On 23andme I don't get any Asian despite getting between 2-3% on every autosomal calc, but I do get Bashkortostan as a region in my Eastern European? Do the regions overlap to some degree?

Very unlikely to get East Asian on 23andme, since you inherited 3% Eastern Eurasian, which can be considered as part of Eastern European. It is a lot for a Pole

If you have Bashortostan recent ancestor location, then your Great grandparent was fully Tatar with 100% chance in my opinion

[Polak]

Ok thank you :)

I got Bashkortostan as one of my Russia regions.

[Sora]

100% ethnic Polish(or Eastern Slavs) can have that amount of Mongoloid too. Also Lipka Tatars are 30%-35% Mongoloid on average and if we calculate this way, you may either have Lipka Tatar ancestry or be just an ethnic Polish.

Have your parents taken test also?

[Abriekman]

100% ethnic Polish(or Eastern Slavs) can have that amount of Mongoloid too. Also Lipka Tatars are 30%-35% Mongoloid on average and if we calculate this way, you may either have Lipka Tatar ancestry or be just an ethnic Polish.

Have your parents taken test also?

It is hard to score such amount, when you are additonally German and Ashkenazi. Bashkortostan location on 23andme is the best indicator of it in my opinion. This exact percentage of East Asian admixture matches with 1/8 Tatar between

[Polak]

100% ethnic Polish(or Eastern Slavs) can have that amount of Mongoloid too. Also Lipka Tatars are 30%-35% Mongoloid on average and if we calculate this way, you may either have Lipka Tatar ancestry or be just an ethnic Polish.

Have your parents taken test also?

I can't really comment on how much other Slavs score, but I have never ever seen an ethnic Pole score as much as me.

Lipkas are about 20-25% Asian on average, so I'm not sure where you got your figure from. I think you may be mixing them up with some other Turkic groups in Eastern Europe (such as Bashkirs) who score far more Mongoloid.

I'm not on good terms with my father, and he wouldn't be interested in taking the test anyway since this sort of stuff is not his cup of tea. My mum might in the future but I'd have to speak to her over it because they aren't cheap. I have posted threads with my family members (where my Lipka would come from) and several of them have Siberian/Mongoloid/Asiatic influences and even phenotypes, such as Ladogan, Volgid and Uralid, which pure Slavs (and especially Poles) would not have. Irregardless of whether they are Lipka or not. Feel free to check them out and tell me what you think.

[Chelubey]

I used to think that Lipka were somehow connected with the Volga Tatars, but :
https://realnoevremya.ru/articles/46284


The memory of the clans Shirin, Baryn, Sidzhiut, Jalair, as well as Kungrat and Naiman has been preserved in Polish sources.


This set of clans is very similar to the Kazakh one.
The Volga Tatars have long lacked a clan structure.
Lipki are possibly descendants of one of Nogai groups or Steppe Crimean Tatars

[Figaro]

It is hard to score such amount, when you are additonally German and Ashkenazi. Bashkortostan location on 23andme is the best indicator of it in my opinion. This exact percentage of East Asian admixture matches with 1/8 Tatar between

Bashkoortostan is an indicator of Tatar on there? My mother scores that region in her East Euro, plus other surrounding Ural regions. Her gedmatch I don’t think indicates any at all Though.

[Chaos One]

Bashkoortostan is an indicator of Tatar on there? My mother scores that region in her East Euro, plus surrounding Ural regions. Her gedmatch I don’t think indicates any at all Though.

I would try some one-to-one runs using some kits to confirm.

[Abriekman]

Bashkoortostan is an indicator of Tatar on there? My mother scores that region in her East Euro, plus other surrounding Ural regions. Her gedmatch I don’t think indicates any at all Though.

What is your ancestry?

[Figaro]

What is your ancestry?

Well, my mother is 1/2 Polish (North Kresy), 1/4 Danish, some Swabian and 1/16 AJ.

[Abriekman]

Well, my mother is 1/2 Polish (North Kresy), 1/4 Danish, some Swabian and 1/16 AJ.

It is a weird for your parent to score Ural regions, if her only Eastern European is Polish, I am 18,75% Russian on paper and got only 3 Russian regions, of which only one is correct

[Figaro]

It is a weird for your parent to score Ural regions, if her only Eastern European is Polish, I am 18,75% Russian on paper and got only 3 Russian regions, of which only one is correct

I agree. My Poles were from northern Belarus though, and were under the Russian empire for a time- my family does claim a little “Russian”, but I don’t know if that’s a half confused memory of that area being under Russia at the time, or what (my Polish side immigrated to US around 1910)

[Figaro]

I agree. My Poles were from northern Belarus though, and were under the Russian empire for a time- my family does claim a little “Russian”, but I don’t know if that’s a half confused memory of that area being under Russia at the time, or what (my Polish side immigrated to US around 1910)

I will also add that her Russian regions are very consistent and have been since the regional feature in AC was introduced on 23. Only changes are occasional shuffling of regions (cheylsbinsk rose up a couple places)