My Y-DNA clade+subclade

[Lorca]

So, I recently used the MorleyDNA subclade predictor and I have no idea where to start with my results.

R1b1
R1b-L506 (R1b-L278, R1b-M415)

It considered this to be the most likely, but I'm not sure what it actually means as I'm very new to the genetics of human populations.

[Leto]

Like I told you, I think you belong to the Asian branch of R1b given your purported ethnic background.

[gixajo]

So, I recently used the MorleyDNA subclade predictor and I have no idea where to start with my results.

R1b1
R1b-L506 (R1b-L278, R1b-M415)

It considered this to be the most likely, but I'm not sure what it actually means as I'm very new to the genetics of human populations.

You can use this one for free too:

https://cladefinder.yseq.net/

[Lorca]

You can use this one for free too:

https://cladefinder.yseq.net/

R-M269 was the result from that one

[gixajo]

I think simply it´s not clear any more acurate clade so they assigned you an unspecific and very ancient R1b.

[gixajo]

R-M269 was the result from that one

Really? That´s slighty more specific and about 4-5 K years more modern than previous one.

You can see here a heatmap for that clade: https://phylogeographer.com/scripts/heatmap.php

And here get an idea about countries where that clade could be common nowadays: https://www.yfull.com/tree/r-m269/

[gixajo]

What company was the raw data you used in the Ydna predictors from?

[Lorca]

It was from Ancestry.com... Long story short, I was adopted from Russia at a young age, and I know very little about my ethnic background

[gixajo]

It was from Ancestry.com... Long story short, I was adopted from Russia at a young age, and I know very little about my ethnic background

Well, R1b exists in Russia too, but is not the most usual haplogroup you can found there, if you see in the Ytree or in the Heatmap, usually R1b-M269 tends to be more common in Western European countries than in Eastern ones.

It could came to you from a Russian person anyway, as you can see, I am Spanish, my great grandparent in my direct paternal line was Spanish and I am R1a-Z91, that is a quite rarer subclade in Spain, probably more rare than find R1b in Russia.

Edit:I ask you the company you used because MyHeritage raw data can give some errors assigning some subclades, I don´t know if the same happens with Ancestry.com. But it´s practically 100% sure that you are R1b.

Did Ancestry.com give you any mtdna group too? Can I ask for your ethnic estimate?

[Leto]

The OP's 3/4 Azerbaijani and 1/4 Russian/Ukrainian. His Y-DNA is most likely not Slavic Russian but West Asian (AZ/ARM). R1b is like 5-7% in European Russia.

[Lorca]

I see... well, my ethnicity estimate isn't particularly enlightening.

Turkey & Caucasus 38%
Iran/Persia 34%
EE & Russia 20%
Cyprus 5%
Greece & Albania 2%
Finland 1%

So, most likely 3/4 Armenian or Azeri and 1/4 Russian

[Lorca]

According to the heatmap R-M269 is more common in Armenian populations than Azeri, but who knows? Seems like anything at this point is just speculation

[gixajo]

Oh yeah, I see that there are many R1b-M269 in that area of southern Caucasus (in Russia too).

So your autosomal estimate and your Ydna is quite coherent, as Leto said.

[Leto]

I see... well, my ethnicity estimate isn't particularly enlightening.

Turkey & Caucasus 38%
Iran/Persia 34%
EE & Russia 20%
Cyprus 5%
Greece & Albania 2%
Finland 1%

So, most likely 3/4 Armenian or Azeri and 1/4 Russian
Your UPDATED Eurogenes K13 oracle

Distance to: Lorca
1.53009395 75.00% Azerbaijani_Turkey + 25.00% Polish
1.64637846 71.60% Azerbaijani_Iran + 28.40% South_Polish
1.67826407 73.20% Azerbaijani_Iran + 26.80% Polish
1.74028303 75.40% Azerbaijani_Turkey + 24.60% Russian_Smolensk
1.85852903 69.80% Azerbaijani_Iran + 30.20% Ukrainian_Galicia
1.86622785 73.60% Azerbaijani_Iran + 26.40% Polish_Masuria
1.90052954 70.80% Azerbaijani_Iran + 29.20% Moldova_Ukrainian
1.91223625 73.80% Azerbaijani_Turkey + 26.20% Ukrainian_Belgorod
1.94411396 74.00% Azerbaijani_Turkey + 26.00% Ukrainian
2.00991786 75.40% Azerbaijani_Turkey + 24.60% Polish_Masuria
2.02366582 72.20% Azerbaijani_Iran + 27.80% Sorb_Lusatia
2.03138877 76.00% Azerbaijani_Turkey + 24.00% Belorussian
2.03319408 73.60% Azerbaijani_Turkey + 26.40% South_Polish
2.03444654 77.60% Azerbaijani_Turkey + 22.40% Lithuanian
2.04872124 75.80% Azerbaijani_Turkey + 24.20% Belarusian_Minsk
2.08425168 72.80% Azerbaijani_Turkey + 27.20% Moldova_Ukrainian
2.09878876 72.00% Azerbaijani_Iran + 28.00% Ukrainian
2.11610662 74.20% Azerbaijani_Turkey + 25.80% Russian_Southwest
2.12424281 72.00% Azerbaijani_Turkey + 28.00% Ukrainian_Galicia
2.13760695 77.60% Azerbaijani_Turkey + 22.40% Estonian

I think it's pretty fucking certain you are not Armenian. Armenians are considerably different from Azerbaijanis and the two groups have very rarely intermixed in recent history.

[gixajo]

Your UPDATED Eurogenes K13 oracle


I think it's pretty fucking certain you are not Armenian. Armenians are considerably different from Azerbaijanis and the two groups have very rarely intermixed in recent history.

Do K13 original spreadsheet, K15 and Dodecad say something similar?

[gixajo]

Your UPDATED Eurogenes K13 oracle


I think it's pretty fucking certain you are not Armenian. Armenians are considerably different from Azerbaijanis and the two groups have very rarely intermixed in recent history.

Do K13 original spreadsheet, K15 and Dodecad say something similar?

[Leto]

Do K13 original spreadsheet, K15 and Dodecad say something similar?
Yes but the updated spreadsheet is much better.

Distance to: Lorca
2.50832790 73.00% Azeri + 27.00% Ukrainian
2.57700278 72.20% Azeri + 27.80% Ukrainian_Lviv
2.61268482 74.40% Azeri + 25.60% Polish
2.66406275 73.20% Azeri + 26.80% Ukrainian_Belgorod
2.78724345 73.00% Azeri + 27.00% South_Polish
2.79448859 74.80% Azeri + 25.20% Russian_Smolensk
2.82980707 73.60% Azeri + 26.40% Southwest_Russian
2.86153115 60.60% Kurdish + 39.40% Moldavian
2.97546526 67.20% Kurdish + 32.80% Ukrainian
2.99416607 75.20% Azeri + 24.80% Estonian_Polish
3.00804371 77.00% Azeri + 23.00% Lithuanian
3.03934283 77.20% Azeri + 22.80% Estonian
3.07193868 66.40% Kurdish + 33.60% Ukrainian_Lviv
3.10201094 36.60% Croatian + 63.40% Kurdish
3.12868587 75.60% Azeri + 24.40% Belorussian
3.24112366 69.60% Azeri + 30.40% Croatian
3.26273915 67.00% Azeri + 33.00% Moldavian
3.28110601 67.20% Kurdish + 32.80% South_Polish
3.37916595 75.00% Azeri + 25.00% Kargopol_Russian
3.58009468 69.00% Kurdish + 31.00% Polish

He should buy G25 coordinates and try your fantastic models :D

[Dick]

R-M269 was the result from that one

Did you keep clicking on the numbers with plus sign in front of them? Try that until there's no more left.


https://i.imgur.com/LedNnzU.png

[gixajo]

Yes but the updated spreadsheet is much better.


He should buy G25 coordinates and try your fantastic models :D


I preferred not to say anything about it, knowing that you want to ban me for spamming G25 models.:rolleyes:

You can make him a custom K13 model for him.

Here you have all the K13 updated references for the ethnicities that showed his FTDNA results, select these that you consider appropiate for him:


Armenian,3.13,2.22,12.06,37.82,35.29,5.75,2.77,0.2 4,0.10,0.13,0.35,0.17,0.16
Armenian_East,3.34,2.6,11.32,39.4,34.05,5.27,2.98, 0.22,0.1,0.17,0.36,0.09,0.04
Armenian_West,2.91,1.84,12.8,36.23,36.53,6.22,2.55 ,0.25,0.09,0.09,0.34,0.25,0.27
Azerbaijani_Iran,4,4.61,7.74,36.49,27.9,5.04,6.93, 2.11,3.46,0.71,0.19,0.65,0.17
Azerbaijani_Turkey,5.4,5.26,8.22,35.43,28,3.9,6.17 ,2.43,4.02,0.47,0.21,0.31,0.12
Azeri,5.54,4.68,6.92,34.81,28.48,5.51,7.13,2.28,2. 92,0.54,0.54,0.35,0.29
Greek,19.35,16.29,20.51,13.35,25.39,3.12,0.24,0.35 ,0.44,0.34,0.35,0.17,0.05
Greek_Andros_Island,19.35,10.61,18.08,15.98,28.96, 4.76,0,0.37,0.54,0.73,0,0.64,0
Greek_Athens,17.98,12.99,21.25,14.22,27.77,3.93,0. 32,0.47,0.29,0.16,0.24,0.14,0.25
Greek_Cappadocian,6.83,3.81,18.16,27.6,36.59,4.92, 0.94,0.03,0.64,0.03,0.4,0,0
Greek_Caucasus,2.09,2.19,14.56,38.52,36.1,4.13,1.6 4,0.14,0.14,0,0.49,0,0
Greek_Central,17.81,13.51,20.59,14.66,27.30,4.05,0 .60,0.29,0.33,0.42,0.40,0.03,0.01
Greek_Central_Macedonia,18.99,17.79,21.11,12.46,24 .88,2.53,0.36,0.37,0.21,0.55,0.18,0.23,0.19
Greek_Chios,12.26,6.67,20.79,20.21,33.04,5.56,0,0. 58,0.45,0.02,0.19,0.18,0
Greek_Crete,13.22,9.49,20.29,17.33,32.47,5.12,0.27 ,0.24,0.20,0.15,0.60,0.47,0.16
Greek_Cyclades,17.87,9.96,20.68,15.25,28.66,4.63,0 .10,0.57,0.50,0.54,0.53,0.16,0.08
Greek_Cypriot,5.67,2.81,19.86,20.34,41.08,8.12,0.5 ,0.07,0.23,0,0.47,0.3,0.54
Greek_Dodecanese,12.59,6.27,20.44,18.63,33.75,6.15 ,0.72,0.46,0.28,0.21,0.24,0.17,0.09
Greek_Eastern-Macedonia,20.66,15.94,21.89,13.13,22.35,4.13,0,0.4 1,0.19,0,0.06,1.25,0
Greek_Eastern-Thrace,16.34,17.89,20.20,13.03,27.42,3.63,0,0,1.02 ,0.31,0.13,0,0
Greek_Ionia,16.28,11.33,20.69,15.75,29.74,4.46,0.0 9,0.62,0.26,0.20,0.36,0.18,0.05
Greek_Istanbul,18.08,15.35,16.12,19.69,26.36,2.59, 0,0,0.53,0.42,0.73,0.13,0
Greek_Macedonia_Thrace,15.23,16.22,18.36,17.97,26. 41,3.56,0.54,0.36,0.58,0,0.53,0.15,0.03
Greek_North_Aegean,14.57,8.12,21.16,16.95,32.41,5. 20,0.62,0.24,0.25,0.07,0.17,0.23,0.02
Greek_Northeast,20.18,16.56,20.31,13.42,24.38,3.47 ,0.20,0.26,0.34,0.53,0.20,0.04,0.10
Greek_Northern-Thrace,19.04,22.53,19.23,12.02,24.12,0,0,0,1.00,0, 1.52,0,0
Greek_Peloponnese,18.68,15.50,20.35,13.16,26.48,3. 48,0.73,0.30,0.30,0.36,0.49,0.16,0.02
Greek_Symi_Island,14.19,2.63,21.63,17.09,35.08,5.8 4,1.17,0.68,0.64,0,0,0.7,0.34
Greek_Thessaly,20.88,16.97,20.47,11.67,24.62,3.45, 0.50,0.40,0.37,0.495,0.30,0.04,0.09
Greek_Trabzon,3.03,2.61,15.35,37.05,36.21,3.91,0.9 5,0.22,0.3,0.04,0.3,0,0.3
Greek_West,19.36,16.49,21.06,12.79,26.50,2.08,0.03 ,0.40,0.26,0.37,0.25,0.07,0.03
Greek_West_Macedonia,20.56,15.60,20.43,13.81,24.46 ,3.48,0.14,0.29,0.43,0.49,0.11,0.22,0
Greek_Western-Thrace,21.88,13.08,22.91,12.65,25.86,1.90,0,1.34,0 ,0.38,0,0,0
Iran_Bandari,1.22,5.00,1.58,39.40,17.21,4.19,19.92 ,0.00,0.19,1.09,0.71,2.73,6.66
Iran_Centraleast,3.29,4.79,3.67,39.54,25.33,5.16,1 5.06,0.17,1.02,0.62,0.51,0.37,1.89
Iranian,2.07,4.23,4.23,38.20,29.70,7.48,10.56,0.04 ,1.34,0.28,0.24,0.17,1.47
Lor_Iran,1.16,3.82,5.91,39.11,29.66,7.04,9.87,0.18 ,1.31,0.38,0.39,0.36,0.68
Russian_average,26.03,47.50,8.65,5.49,2.99,0.68,1. 32,0.45,4.75,1.23,0.46,0.15,0.31
Russian_Kargopol,24.92,48.36,7.52,5.54,1.50,0.04,2 .49,0.23,6.67,1.70,0.23,0.53,0.26
Russian_Kostroma,26.19,48.54,6.21,5.35,3.19,0.39,1 .05,0.69,6.37,1.16,0.52,0.19,0.16
Russian_Pinega,24.72,51.94,5.05,2.82,0.39,0.58,1.5 8,0.24,9.96,1.96,0.27,0.31,0.23
Russian_Smolensk,28.16,48.47,8.74,5.82,3.83,1.69,1 .38,0.17,0.85,0.43,0.38,0.06,0.01
Russian_Southwest,25.91,47.21,8.25,6.80,6.26,0.55, 1.00,0.22,2.14,0.81,0.43,0.19,0.23
Turk_Anatolia,7.8,6.7,11.49,28.23,26.85,4.32,3.32, 3.21,6.46,0.63,0.45,0.3,0.23
Turk_Central_Black_Sea,5.57,5.29,11.47,31.63,27.5, 4.32,2.57,3.81,6.75,0.59,0.3,0.02,0.08
Turk_Central_East,6.5,6,11.05,29.12,29.7,4.14,3.61 ,2.42,5.93,0.55,0.53,0.18,0.21
Turk_Central_West,9.43,6.14,11.37,27.29,27.47,4.87 ,2.76,3.24,5.81,0.51,0.59,0.26,0.21
Turk_Crete,15.92,13.82,17.01,15.12,26.39,4.34,0,1. 98,2.4,0.21,0.19,1.76,0.87
Turk_Cypriot,5.87,3.86,18.77,18.36,36.95,8.38,2.06 ,0.64,1.47,0.3,0,1.95,1.31
Turk_Deliorman,18.24,21.24,14.61,15.55,19.50,2.61, 1.05,2.57,3.74,0.41,0.51,0.17,0.15
Turk_East,5.37,4.44,10.98,35.86,29.82,4.02,4.85,1. 19,2.15,0.61,0.25,0.3,0.13
Turk_East_Black_Sea,2,2.18,14.83,40.78,33.76,2.4,1 .81,0.76,0.89,0.12,0.38,0,0
Turk_Makedonya,19.58,18.64,16.77,13.73,23.61,2.80, 0.68,1.01,2.18,0.21,0.36,0.21,0.24
Turk_Meskhetian,1.28,2.96,12.66,45.51,29.35,3.41,2 .82,1.13,0.09,0.06,0.4,0.3,0
Turk_North_West,8.8,9.51,12.55,25.66,23.89,2.89,2. 3,4.75,8.02,0.63,0.61,0.26,0.07
Turk_South,6.89,6.1,10.81,27.85,26.51,5.15,3.94,3. 32,7.45,0.44,0.45,0.5,0.48
Turk_South_East,5.41,4.3,10.44,34.23,30.39,4.93,4. 07,1.77,3.24,0.35,0.32,0.36,0.12
Turk_Trakya,15.59,18.68,14.59,17.12,21.06,2.92,1.4 2,2.18,5.21,0.48,0.35,0.19,0.20
Turk_Turkey_average,6.02,5.27,11.79,32.45,28.56,4. 17,3.28,2.55,4.58,0.43,0.44,0.26,0.14
Ukrainian,26.53,45.54,10.39,5.93,6.34,0.90,0.97,0. 43,1.33,0.70,0.47,0.19,0.27
Ukrainian_Galicia,27.87,39.97,12.58,7.17,7.51,1.27 ,1.03,0.33,1.17,0.57,0.37,0.09,0.07
Ukrainian_Carpathian,26.50,38.13,13.24,7.09,9.82,1 .21,1.06,0.35,1.41,0.65,0.25,0.16,0.13
Ukrainian_Belgorod,25.78,47.29,7.85,8.78,5.54,0.58 ,1.10,0.71,1.02,0.59,0.25,0.16,0.34
Ukrainian_Ivano_Frankivsk,26.18,38.44,13.89,5.43,1 1.20,1.12,1.13,0.20,1.35,0.50,0.20,0.16,0.21
Belorussian,29.37,49.40,7.59,3.87,4.98,1.44,0.97,0 .18,1.32,0.18,0.38,0.20,0.13
Belarusian_Minsk,27.19,49.58,9.18,4.63,4.58,0.53,1 .26,0.24,1.21,0.72,0.43,0.21,0.22
Polish,30.43,45.49,10.42,5.43,3.74,1.24,0.96,0.11, 0.29,0.84,0.26,0.51,0.28
Polish_Masuria,32.51,44.26,10.88,4.19,3.27,0.95,1. 21,0.16,1.06,0.51,0.33,0.29,0.39
South_Polish,30.66,42.03,11.08,6.56,6.22,0.35,1.02 ,0.45,0.97,0.07,0.25,0.12,0.22

[Leto]

Why? Doesn't the oracle I posted say enough? I mean we'll never know where his West Asian and Slavic ancestry is exactly from, like pinpointing a specific region but I think generally speaking it's quite clear he is quarter Slavic with the rest being (something very similar to) Azerbaijani. I checked the guy's matches and there's nothing conclusive there, none of the matches is strong enough (the strongest is at 25 cM).

[gixajo]

Why? Doesn't the oracle I posted say enough? I mean we'll never know where his West Asian and Slavic ancestry is exactly from, like pinpointing a specific region but I think generally speaking it's quite clear he is quarter Slavic with the rest being (something very similar to) Azerbaijani. I checked the guy's matches and there's nothing conclusive there, none of the matches is strong enough (the strongest is at 25 cM).

It is an area with so much genetic diversity, possibly the richest in the entire world, that maybe he could find a particular ethnic group that could have gone unnoticed and fits him better.

But I suppose , that what he has shown us so far represents his possible ancestry quite well, in general terms.

It´s too late, I´m going to the bed. Have a good night, and good luck with your search Lorca.

[Lorca]

So I guess it’s completely impossible to know for sure what my ethnic make up is? What other steps can be taken to narrow it down? Like I previously stated, i’m very new to all this and I’m not sure where to begin