Total Fertility Rate in Europe (map)

[Lucas]

Very interesting.
White catholics in Ulster, Arabs in Paris and Marseiile, Gypsies in Romania and Bulgaria, Kurds in Turkey.
In Albania Ghegs are on the highest spectrum, but Tosks the lowest.
http://milosp.info/maps/full/fertility.png

[Tenma de Pegasus]

Iberia and Italy are so fucked, they will disappear.

[Dušan]

Interesting, but sad informations on map.

[Graywolf]

Turkey's under the threat of demographyc crisis. The common illiteracy amongst Kurds leads them to breed that much. their ratio is. 4.28 while Turkey's ratio is 1.88 including Kurds. Turks will be outnumbered in near future by non-Turks (arab,kurd,zaza...). This explains why Erdogan is still president.

[ixulescu]

Very interesting.
White catholics in Ulster, Arabs in Paris and Marseiile, Gypsies in Romania and Bulgaria, Kurds in Turkey.
In Albania Ghegs are on the highest spectrum, but Tosks the lowest.


Higher fertility rate in Northeastern Romania has nothing to do with gypsies. That area is more rural and poorer, hence the higher birth rates, but it also has somewhat fewer gypsies than the rest of the country (percentually).

[ixulescu]

Turkey's under the threat of demographyc crisis. The common illiteracy amongst Kurds leads them to breed that much. their ratio is. 4.28 while Turkey's ratio is 1.88 including Kurds. Turks will be outnumbered in near future by non-Turks (arab,kurd,zaza...). This explains why Erdogan is still president.

Isn't it cheaper in every sense to let the southeastern region go?

[Graywolf]

In most cases richer regions wants independence like Venezia, Bask Country , Catalonia,Flanders...) It always bothered my mind why Kurds want to divide while receiving these much government service. %77 of Kurds dont pay electricity bills they use it uncontrolled and make them explode. Think an area its main income is smuggling Turkish Army shot 33 smugglers accidentally and made a hell of protests everywhere. They have one political party and it is the political side of terrorist organisation PKK. I have always wondered why dont they try political ways to separate like Catalonia.
Here is your answer: Turks didn't conquer the area from Kurds, like British did to Irish they conquered from Byzantium then Kurds came. So it is considered Turkish mainland. And Turks are all militaristic wont give even a rock. AND THE REAL REASON: KURDS DOESNT WANT TO DIVIDE. They want to abuse Turklish government's services and maintain foreign support (USA, RUSSIA, EU) as well. They know they ll be worse than Afganistan.

[Cristiano viejo]

Iberia and Italy are so fucked, they will disappear.

Humm, not really. We dont need to be 47 millions like we are now. When I was a kid we not even were 40 millions. And the country worked.
Let expel the 5 millions of immigrant-parasites we have and we will be the same millions than 30 years ago more or less :)

[Luso]

lol southern Portugal making lots of kids it looks like :rolleyes:

[Lucas]

Humm, not really. We dont need to be 47 millions like we are now. When I was a kid we not even were 40 millions. And the country worked.
Let expel the 5 millions of immigrant-parasites we have and we will be the same millions than 30 years ago more or less :)

Yes I remember too when Spain was similar to Poland in population number. I was really shocked when I read recently it has 47 mln now.

[Renekton]

Stop wars make love

[Cristiano viejo]

Yes I remember too when Spain was similar to Poland in population number. I was really shocked when I read recently it has 47 mln now.

Immigrants increased the total number as fuck, just with their arrival, I even dont talk about their fertility rate.
Without them we would be like in 80s, perfectly nice. Spain does not have resources and jobs for so many millions like right now.

[Dušan]

Humm, not really. We dont need to be 47 millions like we are now. When I was a kid we not even were 40 millions. And the country worked.
Let expel the 5 millions of immigrant-parasites we have and we will be the same millions than 30 years ago more or less :)

It will not be the same 40 millions, but with different age structure and more numerous older population, and with average age of over 40 years.

Total fertility rate below 2.1 is a big problem for European population.

[alnortedelsur]

And the saddest part, is that those European governments don't decide to take any action to solve the issue of low birth rates like doing something to assure NATIVES have more children, and increase their fertility rates to at least 2.0.

Instead they come up with more abortion-friendly legislation, and the lefties come up with "solutions" like receiving millions of non-Europeans to compensate for the low fertility rate among Europeans.

That's what happens when who are in charge don't govern for their own people, but against them.

[Ryujin]

Just 1 or 2 children per family is reasonable. All governments should implement birth control policies. Uncontrolled births will lead the world into chaos, massive unemployment and scarcity of resources in the near future.

In western areas in Turkey; the birth ratio is considerably low but there's a huge difference with the East.

[Cristiano viejo]

It will not be the same 40 millions, but with different age structure and more numerous older population, and with average age of over 40 years.

Total fertility rate below 2.1 is a big problem for European population.

Yes, but at least we would be 100% homogeneus.

[Tenma de Pegasus]

Humm, not really. We dont need to be 47 millions like we are now. When I was a kid we not even were 40 millions. And the country worked.
Let expel the 5 millions of immigrant-parasites we have and we will be the same millions than 30 years ago more or less :)

When you were a kid, when your parents were kids the western christian population was lets say half of what is today, but the non western and the non christians were 5x times less than what they are today! And that is how the entire christian, european and european derived societies are in free fall compared to the rest of the world at the point that in few decades all the respect to rights and freedom will be vulnerable to other human civilizations with other cultures, behavior, mind because of opinions similiar to yours. For decades we had a christian democratic country was the world power and as our main influence, now lets prepare for an atheist dictatorship as our main power.

[Peterski]

Very interesting.

What is so interesting about it?

[Crn Volk]

Interesting N Macedonia is pretty uniform, bar one municipality in the north. I would have thought the West would be a darker shade, but thankfully it's not.

[Graywolf]

Interesting N Macedonia is pretty uniform, bar one municipality in the north. I would have thought the West would be a darker shade, but thankfully it's not.

In which region do Albanians live in N.Macedonia? I know they exist.

[Crn Volk]

In which region do Albanians live in N.Macedonia? I know they exist.

West and North-West mainly

[The Blade]

Iberia and Italy are so fucked, they will disappear.
They won't. Their populations are still large enough to handle it.

[Hithaeglir]

So according to this map, better birth rates correlate either with a healthy economy or cultural/religious aspects.

[Faklon]

lol southern Portugal making lots of kids it looks like :rolleyes:

It's where migrants gather between getting to Sweden or Paris.

[Dušan]

One historical map, for period between WW1 and WW2.
Too bad there is no data for all countries.



https://i.imgur.com/YfKVpuK.jpg

[Sebastianus Rex]

One historical map, for period between WW1 and WW2.
Too bad there is no data for all countries.



https://i.imgur.com/YfKVpuK.jpg

Back then abortion was not legal or widely practiced in most countries, that makes a huge difference over a decade or two.

[Dušan]

Back then abortion was not legal or widely practiced in most countries, that makes a huge difference over a decade or two.

It was good time when native European population grew natural way in lot of countries.

[Tooting Carmen]

Funny how Ireland's and France's birthrates are still close to replacement rate, but their fellow Catholic nations Poland, Portugal, Spain and Italy all have very low birthrates.

[Dušan]

Kingdom of Yugoslavia in 1931, religion and total fertility rates by municipalities.

https://i.imgur.com/8uKIew5.jpg

[Dušan]

Another map, very detailed, from 1930.

https://i.imgur.com/sLTyiZ1.png

[Östsvensk]

Mass immigration may negatively affect the birth rates of a country. The reason being that immigration lowers wages, and studies suggest that there is more incitement to have children when wages are rising. So the argument that immigration is needed to fuel the low birth rates is BS in that case, as immigration in itself bears responsibility for the low birth rates.

Sources:

Macunovich, D. (1999). The Role of Cohort Size and Relative Income in the Demographic Transition. Population and Environment 21, 155—192.

Borjas, G. J. (1999). Heaven’s Door: Immigration Policy and the American Economy. Princeton, NJ: Princeton University Press.

Abernethy, V. D. (1999). A Darwinian Account of the Fertility Opportunity Hypothesis. Population and Environment 21(2):

Abernethy, V. D. (2001). Comment on Bermingham's summary of the U.N.'s Year 2000 Replacement Migration, Is it a Solution to Declining Population and Ageing. Population and Environment 22: 365—376.

But then again, we also see birth rates below the replacement level in countries without immigration like Iceland, Japan and Eastern Europe.

[Seya]

Very interesting.
White catholics in Ulster, Arabs in Paris and Marseiile, Gypsies in Romania and Bulgaria, Kurds in Turkey.
In Albania Ghegs are on the highest spectrum, but Tosks the lowest.
http://milosp.info/maps/full/fertility.png
Those dark area do not correspond to the gypsy population of Romania but to the most retarded population of Romania.
This is where most gyspies live:
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/69/Tiganii_din_2011.png

[black hole]

Those dark area do not correspond to the gypsy population of Romania but to the most retarded population of Romania.
This is where most gyspies live:
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/69/Tiganii_din_2011.png





Moldovans considered retarded? :D

[Seya]

Moldovans considered retarded? :D

People here are not divided like that. We’re all Romanians. But in those regions do live the least educated population of the country. Not all Moldova is like that and it has nothing to do with being Moldovian either.

[dviz]

Moldovans considered retarded? :D

No.

Two counties in Romania, Vaslui (in Moldova) and Teleorman (in Wallachia), are the butt of jokes in Romania. It just so happens that Vaslui and Teleorman are the Romanian counties with the highest rates of increase and decrease in population, respectively.

Moldova has the highest fertility rate because it is the most rural region of Romania. At the same time, it is the region with the fewest gypsies.

In Vaslui the fertility rate is 3 births per woman, which is quite a lot these days:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5e/Romania_total_fertility_rate_by_county_%282019%29. png/737px-Romania_total_fertility_rate_by_county_%282019%29. png?20211120234151

[Zevoos]

Another map, very detailed, from 1930.

https://i.imgur.com/sLTyiZ1.png

Damn that's bad, the best of Europe has barely grown in the last century while the worst doubled in numbers. Add intra-European mass migration and you have a fine dysgenic cocktail.
On the other hand this shows that the fears regarding MENAs and Africans popping out 5 kids forever are unfounded. They will get to subreplacement level eventually.

[Aspirin]

Moldovans considered retarded? :D

Yes, Moldovans are considered second class citizens in Romania, and are constantly mocked and insulated. This is of course historically motivated.

[Victor]

Yes, Moldovans are considered second class citizens in Romania, and are constantly mocked and insulated. This is of course historically motivated.

I'm not going to troll or any kind of ethnic bs, but I didn't notice that urban Moldovans are a target of such stuff in Romania. Same in Russia, some Moldovans are considered "rednecks" for ultra rural mentality and behaviour, but if they're modern people, especially somewhere from Chinisau they're barely recognized as something different. So it's not about being ethnic Moldovan, but about mentality of exact people.

[Seya]

I'm not going to troll or any kind of ethnic bs, but I didn't notice that urban Moldovans are a target of such stuff in Romania. Same in Russia, some Moldovans are considered "rednecks" for ultra rural mentality and behaviour, but if they're modern people, especially somewhere from Chinisau they're barely recognized as something different. So it's not about being ethnic Moldovan, but about mentality of exact people.

The ones from the Republic might be mocked, not the ones from Romania. Here every region has some stereotypes and people from other regions make jokes but with no bad intentions. No one gets offended. Everyone finds it funny. There are jokes about Transylvanians, about inhabitants of Bucharest, about west Valachians...it's not to be offensive. Now about the Moldovians from the Republic..well their behavior is not always the best, at least here. Rural mentality is a good way to describe most of them...but it's not always the case. There are many well educated people coming from there too.

[Victor]

The ones from the Republic might be mocked, not the ones from Romania. Here every region has some stereotypes and people from other regions make jokes but with no bad intentions. No one gets offended. Everyone finds it funny. There are jokes about Transylvanians, about inhabitants of Bucharest, about west Valachians...it's not to be offensive. Now about the Moldovians from the Republic..well their behavior is not always the best, at least here. Rural mentality is a good way to describe most of them...but it's not always the case. There are many well educated people coming from there too.

It's not even about education, but about face mimics and mentality recognition every cop here in Russia will recognize asap and check documents of the people. Some Moldovans have it written on face, their clothes and behaviour who are they, without saying a word. But the ones from Chisinau for example cannot be recognized as something alien. Same as Russians, we have some exact populations, especially northern Russians who look like hobbits in Moscow. I lived years next to bus station where buses from north arrive, and I always see those extremely blonde close to white round headed 170-175 cm height people with extremely gracile body, red face, tiny noses from towns where populace didn't change since 1800s.

[Seya]

It's not even about education, but about face mimics and mentality recognition every cop here in Russia will recognize asap and check documents of the people. Some Moldovans have it written on face, their clothes and behaviour who are they, without saying a word. But the ones from Chisinau for example cannot be recognized as something alien. Same as Russians, we have some exact populations, especially northern Russians who look like hobbits in Moscow. I lived years next to bus station where buses from north arrive, and I always see those extremely blonde close to white round headed 170-175 cm height people with extremely gracile body, red face, tiny noses from towns where populace didn't change since 1800s.

Yes, it's true. There is indeed something about them recognizable from a km away. I can spot a Moldavian way before he opens his mouth. They rarely pass unnoticeable. I don't exactly know why..I never actually thought about it. Maybe as you said, their style (clothes, haircuts...), face/body mimics...I have no idea. Sometimes it's just about their physical appearance but not always. Some of them could look potentially local but still they don't.

[Aspirin]

I'm not going to troll or any kind of ethnic bs, but I didn't notice that urban Moldovans are a target of such stuff in Romania. Same in Russia, some Moldovans are considered "rednecks" for ultra rural mentality and behaviour, but if they're modern people, especially somewhere from Chinisau they're barely recognized as something different. So it's not about being ethnic Moldovan, but about mentality of exact people.

This is historically motivated, there were always hatred between Moldovans and Wallachians, due to the formers being more successful historically, hence why many prominent Romanian figures are Moldovans or people who originate in Moldova. Moldova was allways more developed till 1859 polittically, economically and especially culturally. After that due to loss of its political/economic/cultural independence it started to degenerate, first via heavy brain drains towards Wallachia, and after due to political/economic marginalisation and low investitions in local infrastructure and cultural development. Nowadays, this region is in an intense process of Gypsifiction via manele music and heavy birthrate of local Gypsies.

[Victor]

This is historically motivated, there were always hatred between Moldovans and Wallachians, due to the formers being more successful historically, hence why many prominent Romanian figures are Moldovans or people who originate in Moldova. Moldova was allways more developed till 1859 polittically, economically and especially culturally. After that due to loss of its political/economic/cultural independence it started to degenerate, first via heavy brain drains towards Wallachia, and after due to political/economic marginalisation and low investitions in local infrastructure and cultural development. Nowadays, this region is in an intense process of Gypsifiction via manele music and heavy birthrate of local Gypsies.

Yeh probably you know some things better than I do, I know Wallachia just as a passer by. Most of my Ro friends are from Banat (especially Timisoara) from times when I was active nationalist and had friends from Noua Dreapta whom i've met through my Serbian friends.

[Zohor]

This is historically motivated, there were always hatred between Moldovans and Wallachians, due to the formers being more successful historically, hence why many prominent Romanian figures are Moldovans or people who originate in Moldova. Moldova was allways more developed till 1859 polittically, economically and especially culturally. After that due to loss of its political/economic/cultural independence it started to degenerate, first via heavy brain drains towards Wallachia, and after due to political/economic marginalisation and low investitions in local infrastructure and cultural development. Nowadays, this region is in an intense process of Gypsifiction via manele music and heavy birthrate of local Gypsies.


Don't you have a bit overreacted opinion? I mean Seya even told it's not about mocking, but some kind of difference of mentality of some Moldovans easy to spot by people raised in Romania, which indeed it partly has reason in history but it was more focusing on the new capital area(and the area with natural resources) not some jealousy ending up with underdeveloping the region on purpose, come on. Also, bruh manele - it's just music, listening to it won't make you gypsy.

[Aspirin]

Don't you have a bit overreacted opinion? I mean Seya even told it's not about mocking, but some kind of difference of mentality of some Moldovans easy to spot by people raised in Romania, which indeed it partly has reason in history but it was more focusing on the new capital area(and the area with natural resources) not some jealousy ending up with underdeveloping the region on purpose, come on. Also, bruh manele - it's just music, listening to it won't make you gypsy.

People who listen to manele music start to imitate Gypsy culture and to behave like them, is similar with nigger culture influence in US via most degenerated forms of rap which nowdays have a very devastated effect on US whites. Is the same situation in Romania. This shit start slowly to have some effects in MD too, I see more and more local youth who listen to this filthy degenerated music.

[rajputprincess]

Delete

[MinervaItalica]

Dark green countries have more immigration who obviously have higher fertility rate. Italy is still more conservatist but i wonder how much this will last. Soon or later we will be forced to import more immigrant to increase demographics.

[dviz]

Don't you have a bit overreacted opinion? I mean Seya even told it's not about mocking, but some kind of difference of mentality of some Moldovans easy to spot by people raised in Romania, which indeed it partly has reason in history but it was more focusing on the new capital area(and the area with natural resources) not some jealousy ending up with underdeveloping the region on purpose, come on. Also, bruh manele - it's just music, listening to it won't make you gypsy.

Complaining about being mocked by Romanians is Moldovenist/suveranist political speech. It's on the same level with the grandma stories about the brutal Romanian gendarmes in Bessarabia, meaning there is some truth behind it, but the reality is different. There is friendly banter between Romanian regions, but nothing serious. Moldovans take it a bit harder because they're thinner skinned (I would speculate this is some North Caucasian cultural influence).

Aspirin is right though about the manele trash.

[Dušan]

Damn that's bad, the best of Europe has barely grown in the last century while the worst doubled in numbers. Add intra-European mass migration and you have a fine dysgenic cocktail.
On the other hand this shows that the fears regarding MENAs and Africans popping out 5 kids forever are unfounded. They will get to subreplacement level eventually.


No, the best part of Europe - Slavs and Mediterraneans - had very nice high fertility.
It would be great to have again at least fertility of 3, so our population flourish again.

[Dušan]

Another map, very detailed, from 1930.

https://i.imgur.com/sLTyiZ1.png

Here most likely Germans and Hungarians lowering fertility average in Serbian Vojvodina and Romanian part of Banat.

[rothaer]

Here most likely Germans and Hungarians lowering fertility average in Serbian Vojvodina and Romanian part of Banat.

German figures were fine in 1870 - 1910 and from that time do hail the thoughts of having a notable surplus and having Lebensraum would be fine.

As for 1930: Yes, and now imagine you had already millions of losses in WWI, have this ferility figures (1930) and are starting Lebensraum wars for Germany, inevitably yielding additional losses of men in the best age for procreation! :joker000: That it summed up to abt. 4 million military losses and abt. 7 million losses in total was not clear from the beginning, admittedly, but that the risk was given considering the experiences from WWI actually was clear. Both my grandfathers were Wehrmacht soldiers (over all death rate: 29%) that survived and my parents are both only children, born 1941 and 1942. What a demographic desaster!

We know the huge wrongs and damages that were done to other people, but the enormous mistreatment of the own German people by Hitler and his "visions" as an "artist" are often not thought of. (I now even exclude all psychological consequences as for today.) Pls don't misinterpret this as any self-pitying. It's not. It shall demonstrate that Hitler's Lebensraum conquest aims - regardless of it's military failure - from the very first beginning actually were nonsensical, harmful and irresponsible even from a German perspective.

[Davy Jones's Locker]

And the saddest part, is that those European governments don't decide to take any action to solve the issue of low birth rates like doing something to assure NATIVES have more children, and increase their fertility rates to at least 2.0.

Instead they come up with more abortion-friendly legislation, and the lefties come up with "solutions" like receiving millions of non-Europeans to compensate for the low fertility rate among Europeans.

That's what happens when who are in charge don't govern for their own people, but against them.

Some Governments in Europe have implemented policy changes to improve the situation but with limited success.

[Dušan]

Another map, very detailed, from 1930.

https://i.imgur.com/sLTyiZ1.png

Year 1960.

https://i.imgur.com/R7cFRTi.jpeg

[Nurzat]

Very interesting.
White catholics in Ulster, Arabs in Paris and Marseiile, Gypsies in Romania and Bulgaria, Kurds in Turkey.
In Albania Ghegs are on the highest spectrum, but Tosks the lowest.
http://milosp.info/maps/full/fertility.png

you are actually totally wrong about Romania if you are implying the fertility in those counties scoring higher on the map is from Gypsies - those counties in northeast Romania that have highest fertility rate have lowest rates of Gypsies by far, the Gypsies are concentrated in southern Transylvania and southern Romania in general - in Romania, the northeastern area, i.e. Moldova region, which is northern-shifted compared to the rest of the territory (towards Ruthenian-like) has always had the highest fertility rates and is a very rural area as well.

so you cannot attribute that at least in the case of Romania to lower-class citizens, as I suppose you want to do from the particular populations you are mentioning

[Dušan]

Between 1930-1960 terrible fertility trasformations of Serbs and Ukrainians
From people with highest fertility rate to people with lowest fertility rate. :(

[Dušan]

you are actually totally wrong about Romania if you are implying the fertility in those counties scoring higher on the map is from Gypsies - those counties in northeast Romania that have highest fertility rate have lowest rates of Gypsies by far, the Gypsies are concentrated in southern Transylvania and southern Romania in general - in Romania, the northeastern area, i.e. Moldova region, which is northern-shifted compared to the rest of the territory (towards Ruthenian-like) has always had the highest fertility rates and is a very rural area as well.

so you cannot attribute that at least in the case of Romania to lower-class citizens, as I suppose you want to do from the particular populations you are mentioning

Yeah, Moldova region seems very healthy and vital.

[Nurzat]

Yeah, Moldova region seems very healthy and vital.

in Romania indeed Gypsies have much higher fertility rates compared to the other ethnic groups (though Gypsies aren't really an ethnic group anymore, their first language is Romanian for the vast majority, if anything they could be considered a social class, but even so they are integrated in Romanian communities for the most part), but it doesn't show on the map because Romanians have terribly low rates as well (most of my friends, acquaintances and relatives are still not married in their 30s and 40s and actually most are actually single, both men and women, most of them also gaining above average wages, so the problem is not financial, not looks or intelligence either, and it hits both my rural and urban acquaintances the same). so I guess Romania would show the same as Serbia maybe if the Gypsy fertility rates wouldn't bring the numbers up, except for Moldova region which for some reason is still very family-focused

[tropicalslavic]

I am European and would keep having kids if my dumb fuck hereditary hormonal problems weren't kicking in already in my late 20's. There's still hope though. :)

I'm sure it's been discussed to death but most people would be open to having more children if there were more very well thought out programs to support it, like there are in some European countries. Plus making abortion something that only occurs when the mother's life is in certain danger - like medically verifiable danger, not "it would make her big sad if she had a baby :(". If people felt like raising productive citizens for their country was going to pay off with a nice retirement, tax benefits, etc., more people would feel like having kids is manageable.

[Zeno]

Well, having less people isn't necessarily too bad.

It's really bad when, along with fewer people as a whole, the makeup of the population is ethnically diversified. Then there will be huge problems. There are already huge problems.

[tropicalslavic]

Well, having less people isn't necessarily too bad.

It's really bad when, along with fewer people as a whole, the makeup of the population is ethnically diversified. Then there will be huge problems. There are already huge problems.

Having less people isn't necessarily bad in a place like India or China where they are nowhere near even being remotely endangered in the slightest.

There does come a point where even someone like me, who generally thinks people should do what they want, feels alarmed by the birth rates of most civilized Western nations.

Most people are so dumb they don't get it. I had to explain to my own mom that if every couple only has one child, we will die out. "How come?" - genuine question. As if each generation halving itself didn't mean that, you know, the population of the country/ethnicity/etc. was also halving. As if everyone could just go on forever only having one child at most.

If everyone in India and China did that for the next 100 years, they'd be fine.

The clock really is ticking for Western countries.

[Kess]

Well, having less people isn't necessarily too bad.

If they are part of the dependent population, then yes.
If they are part of the productive population, then no.

[Victor]

If there were more very well thought out programs to support it, like there are in some European countries.

No, it's the dead end, having kids on condition that someone provides you for this. There should be totally different motivation.

[tropicalslavic]

No, it's the dead end, having kids on condition that someone provides you for this. There should be totally different motivation.

It's not "on the condition".

Society has gone from multi-generational homes with lots of community support in raising children, to one couple living alone trying to do all of it just the two of them.

You can either bring back the old ways, or create something to compensate for them being gone. There used to be a "village". That's why people felt so comfortable having lots of children. It didn't all just fall on two adults.

A part of why many people are not having children that they would otherwise love to have is because it's a bigger responsibility to have children than it ever was before.

[Victor]

It's not "on the condition".

Society has gone from multi-generational homes with lots of community support in raising children, to one couple living alone trying to do all of it just the two of them.

You can either bring back the old ways, or create something to compensate for them being gone. There used to be a "village". That's why people felt so comfortable having lots of children. It didn't all just fall on two adults.

A part of why many people are not having children that they would otherwise love to have is because it's a bigger responsibility to have children than it ever was before.
I can't find my older message with thoughts about it to quote and I have no strength to type something similar.

Отправлено с моего N6000 через Tapatalk

[tropicalslavic]

I can't find my older message with thoughts about it to quote and I have no strength to type something similar.

Отправлено с моего N6000 через Tapatalk

Honestly you're a real one for that. Not a hill I'm willing to die on today either lol. Have a nice day

[Victor]

Honestly you're a real one for that. Not a hill I'm willing to die on today either lol. Have a nice day
Here it is




A person needs real motivation to have children, pretentious conversations about saving the nation or the "white race" (depending on the target audience) barely work.

First of all, it is necessary to eliminate what actively opposes fertility - that is, the propaganda of debauchery, the attitude towards abortion and divorce as something normal, the childfree and feminist movements should be recognized as extremist, that is, they should not have a voice in principle.

At the same time, it is necessary to promote family values. No one will run to give birth because of beautiful pictures and words, but when something is repeated many times, it affects the subconscious of a person. Plus, the opponents of the family should be shown as degenerates, direct enemies of your people who want it to disappear. It is necessary to show the existing links of such activists with foreign foundations that promote such things around the world.

As for religion, direct religious propaganda is not needed, because the Church is not a tool for earthly purposes and it can only alienate secular people and cause a negative reaction. This does not mean that the Church does not have the right to loudly voice its attitude to these issues. At a certain point, when society has already been sufficiently transformed in these matters, religious and secular points of view will find a natural understanding here.

Step-by-step social changes are needed. Within 10-15 years, it is necessary to completely abolish the old-age pension (except in cases of disability, person's merits to the country).

From childhood, from school, a person needs to be taught that his main support is not the state, but the family, that children are obliged to support and feed their older relatives, as they took care of them in childhood. Everyone should see children as their direct investment in the future and their own well-being.

The thinking of hedonism and extreme individualism, which is now being imposed also at the level of propaganda, should be eliminated in favor of some form of corporatism, the center of which should be the family, which will realize itself as a self-sufficient unit, on all members of which its well-being depends.

It is also necessary to destroy the dreamy thinking about life in the masses, which is also promoted through the media and culture. Many people now feel undervalued and their illusory ambitions unfulfilled, which society has imposed on them. There must be rich, middle-class, and poor people, there must be people who will be ready to do the simplest and dirtiest work without grumbling about life and without the need to import immigrants, because there are only "academics who should not dirty their hands." Only culturally/religiously close people should be accepted as immigrants, exceptions are only for outstanding specialists.

Money rewards for having children are a bit overrated and create social parasites. The only one I like is Russian "maternity capital", a sum of money given to mothers they can use to buy/build a house. interest-free loans are also good. Plus those outstanding mothers who give birth to some five children should feel some kind of privilege in society.



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