Haplogroup profile of Indigenous(Proto)Europeans - Identified and Unidentified.

[Linebacker]

Identified:

Kostenki 14 - age 38 700–36 200.

Y-Dna: C1
Mtdna: U2

https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-xSfth4D0nsc/WeF_nPEZJpI/AAAAAAAAGdA/Y165MwDGP7oEmEdSXtr82jL10cCJaj51ACLcBGAs/s1600/image.jpg

Sunghir - age 30,000-35,000.

Y-Dna - C1 all males
Mtdna - U2

https://www.researchgate.net/profile/M_Mednikova/publication/282705296/figure/fig2/AS:613864446107653@1523368097177/Left-lateral-views-of-the-Sunghir-1-and-5-adult-skulls-above-and-the-Sunghir-2-and-3_Q320.jpg

Motala 12 - age 8311–7466.

Y-Dna: I2a
Mtdna : U2e1

https://fbx.00e.myftpupload.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/03/mounted-2.jpg

LaBrana 1 - age 7940–7690. (Not to be confused with Loschbour)

Y-Dna: C1a2
Mtdna: U5b2c1

https://static.abc.es/Media/201401/30/brana-hombre--644x362.jpg

Loschbour Man - age 8170–7940.

Y-Dna: I2a
Mtdna: U5b1a

https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Dominique-Delsate/publication/237081430/figure/fig2/AS:393129493581825@1470740783556/Le-crane-et-la-face-de-lHomme-de-Loschbour-restaure-Photo-C-Dominique-DELSATE-MNHN.png

Ajvide 58 - age 4900–4600.

Y-Dna: I2a
Mtdna: U4d

https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRqy7HVjeZ60RxLxCPbEgGB4AfRA6oRp q04tQ&usqp=CAU

Bichon Man - age 13,770–13,560.

Y-Dna: I2a
Mtdna: U5b1h

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/64/Lat%C3%A9nium-cr%C3%A2ne-bichon.jpg/800px-Lat%C3%A9nium-cr%C3%A2ne-bichon.jpg

Cheddar man - age 7000-9000.

Y-dna:I2a2
Mtdna:U5b1

https://c8.alamy.com/comp/WHAC02/cheddar-man-skull-of-cheddar-man-from-cheddar-gorge-WHAC02.jpg

Unidentified:

Cro Magnon 1 - age 37,000-40,000.

Y-dna:Unidentified
Mtdna:Unidentified

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/a1/D047-_crane_de_l%E2%80%99homme_de_cro-magnon_-L1-Ch1.png/280px-D047-_crane_de_l%E2%80%99homme_de_cro-magnon_-L1-Ch1.png

Combe Capelle - age 30,000-35,000.

Y-dna:Unidentified
Mtdna:Unidentified

https://donsmaps.com/images35/img_2022combecapellesm.jpg

Oberkassel 1 - age 14,000-20,000.

Y-dna:Unidentified
Mtdna:Unidentified (Possible U5b1, found in female of same grave)

https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Ozgur_Bulut/project/Facial-Reconstruction-of-Cro-Magnon/attachment/599cb4b0b53d2ff30bdb6b70/AS:530288742342656@1503442096327/image/004.jpeg

Grimaldi man 1 and 2 - age 22,000-26,000.

Y-dna:Unidentified
Mtdna:Unidentified

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/f4/Abri_Pataud_-_Protomagdalenian_woman_skull_-_20090922.jpg/440px-Abri_Pataud_-_Protomagdalenian_woman_skull_-_20090922.jpg

Chancelade man - age 12,000-17,000.

Y-dna:Unidentified
Mtdna:Unidentified

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/3c/Moulage_de_cr%C3%A2ne%2C_Raymonden%2C_Chancelade%2 C_Dordogne.jpg/250px-Moulage_de_cr%C3%A2ne%2C_Raymonden%2C_Chancelade%2 C_Dordogne.jpg

Gross Fredenwalde - age 8000-10000.

Y-dna:Unidentified
Mtdna:Unidentified

https://www.realmofhistory.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/02/Mysterious_Graves_-8500-Year-Old_European_Cemetery_Gross_Fredenwalde_2.jpg?ezim gfmt=rs:350x378/rscb18/ng:webp/ngcb18

[Linebacker]

Done, this covers most of the fossils found on territorial Europe In the Upper-Paleolithic/Mesolithic period. Add if I am missing some.

Could be speculation in the thread for the unidentified ones.

**Actially Ajvide 58 is from the Neolithic period so my mistake.

[Flashball]

Big jaws

I'm U2e1a1
My father U5b2a1a

[Linebacker]

Big jaws

I'm U2e1a1
My father U5b2a1a

Interesting how the pair have split over the years. Today, there is almost no U present in areas where there are I2 carriers and there is almost no I2 in areas where there are U carries.

[Vrazijadivizija]

Nice,i have tons of connections to Motala and Sigtuna as its l2..

[J. Ketch]

You missed the Mac Daddy :rolleyes:

Villabruna 1 - R1b1a-L754* - Veneto, Northern Italy, 14000 YBP (12000 BC)

https://ic.pics.livejournal.com/vls_smolich/36547418/1349201/1349201_original.png

[Linebacker]

I didn't even know Villabruna had identified haplogroups. What about mtdna?

[Jana]

Interesting how the pair have split over the years. Today, there is almost no U present in areas where there are I2 carriers and there is almost no I2 in areas where there are U carries.

What?

[J. Ketch]

I didn't even know Villabruna had identified haplogroups. What about mtdna?
Don't know.

[vbnetkhio]

I didn't even know Villabruna had identified haplogroups. What about mtdna?

ancient samples' haplogroups spreadsheet:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1scJ0yHI-snwzxEX9924p-OaOOWVj7vrp2xTSeB4pObM/edit

it includes all ancient y-dna and mtdna published so far.

[Linebacker]

What?

Meaning I2 and U went hand in hand in Mesolithic samples as seen in Op yet in present day the areas where they peak are very far away from each other.

[Dick]

What happened to C. Were they Neanderthals

[Ion Basescul]

What happened to C. Were they Neanderthals

Now you C them, now you don't.

[Rethel]

Bichon Man - age 13,770–13,560.
Y-Dna: I2a
Mtdna: U5b1h

Regardless of this insane and false datation, this one is the only one known to me for
sure here, to be austosomaly the purest pre/WHG specimen, without any IE-like admix.

[Linebacker]

Regardless of this insane and false datation, this one is the only one known to me for
sure here, to be austosomaly the purest pre/WHG specimen, without any IE-like admix.

And what`s it real age according to the Rethelite R1 Club - who have much more credibility than scientists who do carbon dating for a living in laboratories?

[Rethel]

And what`s it real age according to the Rethelite R1 Club - who have much more credibility than scientists who do carbon dating for a living in laboratories?

Less than 4500-5000 years.
As they have living relatives, these people cannot
be older than Babel, and surely not than the Flood.

[Linebacker]

these people cannot be older than Babel, and surely not than the Flood.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iYVO5bUFww0

[Shubotai]

Know your roots. There are hardly strict lines though

Initial passengers (trying to reconstruct genome)
Neanderthals
C1a2

Civilized farmers (trying to get a hold on)
G2a

Cultured MENA (trying to get a passport)
J2b
E1b

Nomadic shepherds (trying to adapt)
I
R

[Illyrius]

Know your roots. There are hardly strict lines though

Initial passengers (trying to reconstruct genome)
Neanderthals
C1a2

Civilized farmers (trying to get a hold on)
G2a

Cultured MENA (trying to get a passport)
J2b
E1b

Nomadic shepherds (trying to adapt)
I
R

Wait what now C1a2 comes from Neanderthals?

[Altaylı]

Wait what?
I thought sunghir and kostenki were R1

[Linebacker]

Wait what?
I thought sunghir and kostenki were R1

https://en.meming.world/images/en/thumb/1/1d/Creating_Bugs_Bunny%27s_%22No%22.jpg/300px-Creating_Bugs_Bunny%27s_%22No%22.jpg

[Rethel]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iYVO5bUFww0

And what is so funny in that? Did you yourself checked it, dated it and resolved the timeline of
human existance or just you belive what some others (ungodly I suppose) people did tell you?

[Altaylı]

https://en.meming.world/images/en/thumb/1/1d/Creating_Bugs_Bunny%27s_%22No%22.jpg/300px-Creating_Bugs_Bunny%27s_%22No%22.jpg

Aren't They ANE's

[Luso]

I am so disgraced to have this indo-euro ugly paternal heritage. I'd rather be E1b12931231831

I am serious btw.

[Linebacker]

To answer the people who ask about where C1 went, its not extinct. 1 in a million Europeans today is C1a with subclade C-V222 and C-V20

There was one guy I found posted on Eupedia who was C1 but he didn't post any pictures. Would be cool to see how a C1 person would look like.

https://www.eupedia.com/forum/threads/30392-Haplogroup-C

[Linebacker]

And what is so funny in that? Did you yourself checked it, dated it and resolved the timeline of
human existance or just you belive what some others (ungodly I suppose) people did tell you?

Ridiculous Rethel.

You are denying scientific facts just because they state people are older than the Bible says.

[Alexandro]

I am so disgraced to have this indo-euro ugly paternal heritage. I'd rather be E1b12931231831

If my paternal haplogroup is not Sub Saharan African in origin I'm asking for a refund, I AM BLACK.

[Chaos One]

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c6/Haplogrupo_C1a_%28ADN-Y%29.png

[Chaos One]

I am so disgraced to have this indo-euro ugly paternal heritage. I'd rather be E1b12931231831

I am serious btw.

Let's be A00.

[Alexandro]

Let's be A00.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/a0/Distribution_of_Y-Chromosome_Haplogroup_A_in_Africa.png/800px-Distribution_of_Y-Chromosome_Haplogroup_A_in_Africa.png

Can I join?

[Chaos One]

Can I join?

"Haplogroup A is a human Y-chromosome DNA haplogroup, which includes all living human Y chromosomes which do not belong to haplogroup BT. Bearers of extant sub-clades of haplogroup A are almost exclusively found in Africa (or among descendants of populations which have recently left Africa), in contrast with haplogroup BT, bearers of which participated in the Out of Africa migration of anatomically modern humans."

A00 is not related to all other Haplogroups except A0 itself.

That means your common ancestor is not related to 99,5% of humanity and almost no one is your distant relative. What can be better than this?

[Alexandro]

"Haplogroup A is a human Y-chromosome DNA haplogroup, which includes all living human Y chromosomes which do not belong to haplogroup BT. Bearers of extant sub-clades of haplogroup A are almost exclusively found in Africa (or among descendants of populations which have recently left Africa), in contrast with haplogroup BT, bearers of which participated in the Out of Africa migration of anatomically modern humans."

A00 is not related to all other Haplogroups except A0 itself.

That means your common ancestor is not related to 99,5% of humanity and almost no one is your distant relative. What can be better than this?

Yes, and not only that but you're black! :cool:

[Chaos One]

Yes, and not only that but you're black! :cool:

Yes, a different, unique and special kind of black. It's a win/win situation.

[Defcon2]

Yes, a different, unique and special kind of black. It's a win/win situation.

I have a black but vulgar haplo, common in African Americans, West Africans and Afro-Europeans.

[Defcon2]

If my paternal haplogroup is not Sub Saharan African in origin I'm asking for a refund, I AM BLACK.

If you had my last name, you would!

[Chaos One]

I have a black but vulgar haplo, common in African Americans, West Africans and Afro-Europeans.

Yup, but in fact the A00 IMO is the most interesting Haplogroup at all.

Basically speaking, you're an alternative offshoot of humanity. Everyone has the same common ancestor except you and those A00.

https://theconversation.com/albert-and-adam-rewrite-the-story-of-human-origins-15835

[Linebacker]

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c6/Haplogrupo_C1a_%28ADN-Y%29.png

So there is people descended from European Cro-Magnons in Japan.

Explains looks like this in some Japanese men.

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/53/02/f7/5302f7de61dd4d8e6631481337b60797.jpg

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/d4/e3/89/d4e389e45a3d72ddcbb7e5b1660f48bc.png

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/27/47/4e/27474e279dcb0c887b109ce1f03dbd91.jpg

[Luso]

So there is people descended from European Cro-Magnons in Japan.

Explains looks like this in some Japanese men.

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/53/02/f7/5302f7de61dd4d8e6631481337b60797.jpg

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/d4/e3/89/d4e389e45a3d72ddcbb7e5b1660f48bc.png

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/27/47/4e/27474e279dcb0c887b109ce1f03dbd91.jpg

I will get cromagnid Jaw surgery and it will change my haplogroup to I2 or something.

[Chaos One]

Well, I'm the worst I2 ever then. Zero CM on features lol

[Altaylı]

So there is people descended from European Cro-Magnons in Japan.

Explains looks like this in some Japanese men.

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/53/02/f7/5302f7de61dd4d8e6631481337b60797.jpg

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/d4/e3/89/d4e389e45a3d72ddcbb7e5b1660f48bc.png

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/27/47/4e/27474e279dcb0c887b109ce1f03dbd91.jpg

these men look very cool.

[Chaos One]

So there is people descended from European Cro-Magnons in Japan.

Almost sure it's Ainu effect/lineage.

[Altaylı]

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/a0/Distribution_of_Y-Chromosome_Haplogroup_A_in_Africa.png/800px-Distribution_of_Y-Chromosome_Haplogroup_A_in_Africa.png

Can I join?

i was A in my dream lol :d

[Altaylı]

https://images.imgbox.com/5e/e1/3inDPphl_o.jpg
these people look asiatic
i thought Sunghir people were R1 :picard2::picard1:

[Scandal]

So there is people descended from European Cro-Magnons in Japan.

Explains looks like this in some Japanese men.

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/53/02/f7/5302f7de61dd4d8e6631481337b60797.jpg

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/d4/e3/89/d4e389e45a3d72ddcbb7e5b1660f48bc.png

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/27/47/4e/27474e279dcb0c887b109ce1f03dbd91.jpg

You find such features in almost any race or ethnicity (in some ethnicities more common than in others). I doubt it's necessarily connected to Cro-magnons.
Japanese have way too little (if any) autosomal WHG admixture to influence there looks.

[Rethel]

Ridiculous Rethel.

You are denying scientific facts just because they state people are older than the Bible says.

"Scientific facts" are not always facts, and often are wrong, lying or just assumtions.

You don't know, if they are true. You was just told about it by some people, and you have belived them - people, who
are often ignorants, evil, corrupted, liers or just careerists who don't care about the truth, but of their own benefit.

[Altaylı]

Waiting for the discovery of samples that prove Proto-Slavs were indeed I2 carriers and R1a was spread in North-Eastern Europe by Mongol Empire.

[Rethel]

...

You both will be waiting soooo loooong:

https://c8.alamy.com/comp/EJ1C6R/skeletons-sitting-bench-outdoors-fun-waiting-conceptual-dark-humour-EJ1C6R.jpg

[Linebacker]

You find such features in almost any race or ethnicity (in some ethnicities more common than in others). I doubt it's necessarily connected to Cro-magnons.
Japanese have way too little (if any) autosomal WHG admixture to influence there looks.

They have had all the time in the world to evolve into a different race, natural for any Euro autosomal to be completely gone from them.

But haplogroups survive the test of time, if they carry C1 they descend from Cro-Magnon still, there is no other pre-historic population that carried C1 which we have discovered.

[Altaylı]

You both will be waiting soooo loooong:

https://c8.alamy.com/comp/EJ1C6R/skeletons-sitting-bench-outdoors-fun-waiting-conceptual-dark-humour-EJ1C6R.jpg

:lol00002:

[Scandal]

edit : double post

[Scandal]

They have had all the time in the world to evolve into a different race, natural for any Euro autosomal to be completely gone from them.

But haplogroups survive the test of time, if they carry C1 they descend from Cro-Magnon still, there is no other pre-historic population that carried C1 which we have discovered.

I am not saying they don't descend from Cro-magnon, I'm just saying it's very unlikely to be the reason he looks that way. He needs to have a decent amount of autosomal WHG admixture to influence his look and he has little to none such admixture.
I've seen Blacks and Amerindians too with those angular features. It's not always connected to Cro-magnons. Convergent evolution is a thing.

[Linebacker]

I am not saying they don't descend from Cro-magnon, I'm just saying it's very unlikely to be the reason he looks that way. He needs to have a decent amount of autosomal WHG admixture to influence his look and he has little to none such admixture.
I've seen Blacks and Amerindians too with those angular features. It's not always connected to Cro-magnons. Convergent evolution is a thing.

Its about gene expression more than anything. More than a few on Apricity have posted results with high WHG admixture and they did not look at all Cromagnid.

[Immanenz]

They have had all the time in the world to evolve into a different race, natural for any Euro autosomal to be completely gone from them.

But haplogroups survive the test of time, if they carry C1 they descend from Cro-Magnon still, there is no other pre-historic population that carried C1 which we have discovered.

Pan-human features, not necessary exclusivly connected to WHG.


To answer the people who ask about where C1 went, its not extinct. 1 in a million Europeans today is C1a with subclade C-V222 and C-V20

There was one guy I found posted on Eupedia who was C1 but he didn't post any pictures. Would be cool to see how a C1 person would look like.

https://www.eupedia.com/forum/threads/30392-Haplogroup-C

the chance to connect his pheno to his haplogroup is like 0,0 %- the haplo is way too rare and way to old.

[Rethel]

Well, I'm the worst I2 ever then. Zero CM on features lol

Marry one. Problem solved.

https://lovehairstyles.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/11/sassy-short-curly-hairstyles-women-naturally-short-pixie-cut-black-color-square-face-shape.jpg


Almost sure it's Ainu effect/lineage.

Yep, but it is interesting, was their look their original (they are D, separate D, but the D
basic looks differently) or their aboriginolike featrues came from this C1 or other C people?

[Linebacker]

Marry one. Problem solved.

https://img.wprost.pl/_thumb/0a/92/62e33c36a51cb47ee1ea174010c5.png

Fixed, Miss Universe 2021 from Poland. Polish women are a lot more Native than Indi-European.

http://iloveepoetry.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/Smug-Dog-300x288.png

[Rethel]

Fixed, Miss Universe 2021 from Poland. Polish women are a lot more Native than Indi-European.

Some yes, but too IE for him. Remember, that CM-like features did appeared also among IEs on the Steppe (alongside
with couple of other types). The thing which made a difference was mainly the skin color (so EHG were +/- the same
as modern Whites) and the überconcentration of CM features among WHG (which among IEs were much weaker).

[Illyrius]

Fixed, Miss Universe 2021 from Poland. Polish women are a lot more Native than Indi-European.

http://iloveepoetry.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/Smug-Dog-300x288.png

Looks like my grandma when she was young

[Chaos One]

Marry one. Problem solved.

My wife is more like North Pontid. Doesn't help too much.


Yep, but it is interesting, was their look their original (they are D, separate D, but the D
basic looks differently) or their aboriginolike featrues came from this C1 or other C people?

I mean, there're some gaps in Japanese history IMO because folklore and everything.

When they say "Jomon people", IMO there're basically different groups. I would say that while there're logical connections, "D" Jomon People are probably related to Okinawans and people on Southern/Central Japan (Japanese HG) while Ainus had a different path coming from North, being C1.

Like:

"The relationship of Jōmon people to the modern Japanese (Yamato people), Ryukyuans, and Ainu is diverse and not well clarified. Morphological studies of dental variation and genetic studies suggest that the Jōmon people were of southern origin, while other studies of bacteria suggest that the Jōmon people were of possible northern origin.[43][44] According to recent studies the contemporary Japanese people descended from a mixture of the ancient hunter-gatherer Jōmon and the Yayoi rice agriculturalists, and these two major ancestral groups came to Japan over different routes at different times.[45][46][47][48][49][50] Recent studies however support a predominantly Yayoi ancestry for contemporary Japanese people.

The Jōmon people were not one homogenous ethnic group. According to Mitsuru Sakitani the Jōmon people are an admixture of two distinct haplogroups: A more ancient group from Central Asia (carriers of Y chromosome D1a), that were present since more than 35 000 years in Japan and a more recent group from East Asia (carriers of Y chromosome type C1a) that migrated to Japan about 13 000 years ago."

I mean, Jomon era is one thing while you can make distinctions between Japanese HG (D1a) and Ainu (C1a).

[Shubotai]

They were indeed different groups, but that is a distortion. Sakitani Mitsuru never said such a thing in his book DNA・考古・言語の学際研究が示す新・日本列島史―日本人集団・日本語の成立史. Ainu are 0% C1a in every research conducted. Only D1b, now D1a2a and C2b. More likely their looks can be connected to their maternal haplogroup N9b which is a descendant of mtdna N the common maternal haplogroup in west Eurasia. But I also agree that the ancestors of D1a2a were different than both modern Japanese and Ainu.

[Scandal]

Its about gene expression more than anything. More than a few on Apricity have posted results with high WHG admixture and they did not look at all Cromagnid.

How do you know they didn't look Cro-magnid? You can inherit facial features from Cro-magnon people without having a huge jaw, prominent cheekbones etc. Modern Europeans are between 20% and 50% WHG (Sicilian vs Estonian). Ethnicities that are 30, 40 or 50% WHG obviously get a lot of their traits from WHGs. It's impossible to be 1/3 or 1/2 something and not inherit anything from that race at all. Just compare half Asian half White people to full Whites or compare a group of 10 Half Finnish-Half Greek individuals to a group of 10 pure Finns. If you removed all WHG admixture from Europeans, they'd look quite different and not only the previously big jawed individuals would start to look different.

[Linebacker]

1.How do you know they didn't look Cro-magnid? You can inherit facial features from Cro-magnon people without having a huge jaw, prominent cheekbones etc. Modern Europeans are between 20% and 50% WHG (Sicilian vs Estonian). Ethnicities that are 30, 40 or 50% WHG obviously get a lot of their traits from WHGs.2. It's impossible to be 1/3 or 1/2 something and not inherit anything from that race at all. Just compare half Asian half White people to full Whites or compare a group of 10 Half Finnish-Half Greek individuals to a group of 10 pure Finns. If you removed all WHG admixture from Europeans, they'd look quite different and not only the previously big jawed individuals would start to look different.

1.Because they simply didn't.

2.Its fully possible. I will do a quick example. This polish man on the left will who I randomly found will be more WHG and less Neolithic admixed than me and I still end up having a more CM appearance thanks to the right gene expression.

I don't really know what kind of WHG I will have since I never bothered to do those kind tests but in any case it will not be higher than an average Pole.

https://i.postimg.cc/76dwR7X4/5d020501250000ae13e1f2b5.jpg

So In the end correct gene expression trumps all, various admixtures can definitely stay silent on your phenotype regardless of percentage.

[Rethel]

I mean, Jomon era is one thing while you can make distinctions between Japanese HG (D1a) and Ainu (C1a).

That would make sense, but the problem is, that Ainu are mostly D. Are there some archeo samples?

[Rethel]

Modern Europeans are between 20% and 50% WHG (Sicilian vs Estonian).

Where did you get this? WHG in european populations is much less than that.

[Kriptc06]

Cultured MENA (trying to get a passport)
J2b
E1b


gib pasporto


Seriously what happened to C?

[Chaos One]

That would make sense, but the problem is, that Ainu are mostly D. Are there some archeo samples?

"On the other hand, the Ainu exhibited no other Y-haplogroups (C-M8, O-M175*, and O-M122*) common in mainland Japanese and Okinawans. It is noteworthy that the rest of the Ainu gene pool was occupied by the paternal lineage (Y-haplogroup C-M217*) from North Asia including Sakhalin."

I mean, probably the majority are in fact D but some were C and that's why.

[Scandal]

Where did you get this? WHG in european populations is much less than that.

https://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?155723-K8-All-Populations-Spreadsheet

[Unknown European]

I didn't even know Villabruna had identified haplogroups. What about mtdna?

Villabruna's mtdna was U5b2b same as

Rochedane
Paglicci 71
Continenza 7
STANKOa
Iboussieres39
VLASA41
VLASA44
C. Cocina-25-7-41-capa 2;CC1
HJDK_21
HJDK_31
Grave 84, S5885.E1.L1

[Linebacker]

Villabruna's mtdna was U5b2b same as

Rochedane
Paglicci 71
Continenza 7
STANKOa
Iboussieres39
VLASA41
VLASA44
C. Cocina-25-7-41-capa 2;CC1
HJDK_21
HJDK_31
Grave 84, S5885.E1.L1

So that`s really weird. A stray R1b Indo in the middle of Mesolithic Europe, and he had the same mtdna as most Natives.

Its either some huge coincidence or Indo-European origins are not what they are believed to be.

[Rethel]

https://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?155723-K8-All-Populations-Spreadsheet

It is wrong. Too old. Maybe counting parially some EHG as WHG. Even logically not possible, if for example SHG had allready 50% of it, Neolithic Balkans 2%, Cucuteni 20%, GAC 25%. And then Indoeuropeans arrived, and surelly did not bring with themselves so much whg, to make this even higher than in neolithic local community. Quite opposite, not only this dropped because of the huge new population, but was yet additionaly decimated by wars, gnocides and diseases.

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/7f/fd/81/7ffd81d9023b7b1322d6ed27b2515b7f.jpg

[Rethel]

So that`s really weird. A stray R1b Indo in the middle of Mesolithic Europe, and he had the same mtdna as most Natives.

Its either some huge coincidence or Indo-European origins are not what they are believed to be.

Nothing strange. There were some single wanderings on the east and west from Indoeuropean urururheimat, long before Coirded and Yamnaya expantion, so, you have Villabruna, Iboussieres, Irongates from the one side, Maltaboy, Lokomotiv, Botai aso from the other. It was very wise to marry a local women, to not to die from inbreeding. Such migrations could have 5-30 people max, so, it is logical, that they would make wife trade with local people. This is also the reason of, why EHG admix appeard in late Wuhageans resulting in light eyes. Just life.

[Scandal]

It is wrong. Too old. Maybe counting parially some EHG as WHG. Even logically not possible, if for example SHG had allready 50% of it, Neolithic Balkans 2%, Cucuteni 20%, GAC 25%. And then Indoeuropeans arrived, and surelly did not bring with themselves so much whg, to make this even higher than in neolithic local community. Quite opposite, not only this dropped because of the huge new population, but was yet additionaly decimated by wars, gnocides and diseases.

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/7f/fd/81/7ffd81d9023b7b1322d6ed27b2515b7f.jpg

That study in the picture is also quite old, I remember seeing it around 2015 or 2016. EHG was ANE+WHG. WHG is older component than EHG and ANE.

There are yamaya results at the bottom of the study I linked, WHG score is bolded :

Yamnaya (Russia/Ukraine, 3000BC) (n=6)
34.69% 4.76% 23.94% 0 35.86% 0.53% 0.14% 0.07%

[Defcon2]

It is wrong. Too old. Maybe counting parially some EHG as WHG. Even logically not possible, if for example SHG had allready 50% of it, Neolithic Balkans 2%, Cucuteni 20%, GAC 25%. And then Indoeuropeans arrived, and surelly did not bring with themselves so much whg, to make this even higher than in neolithic local community. Quite opposite, not only this dropped because of the huge new population, but was yet additionaly decimated by wars, gnocides and diseases.

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/7f/fd/81/7ffd81d9023b7b1322d6ed27b2515b7f.jpg

Modern Spaniards don't have WHG?