Young agriculture workers from East Anglia

[Creoda]

Or thereabouts. A group that wouldn't pass in Wales, Scotland or Ireland.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=azZuW5dnQGk
https://agronomist.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/12/1609351915_maxresdefault.jpg
https://i.ytimg.com/vi/7LJr8BO-5l8/maxresdefault.jpg
https://i.ytimg.com/vi/azZuW5dnQGk/maxresdefault.jpg
https://i.ytimg.com/vi/FaTi4px44ls/maxresdefault.jpg
https://www.green-shoots.org/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/DSC_0044.jpg
https://www.green-shoots.org/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/DSC_0059.jpg
https://www.green-shoots.org/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/Jimmy-McNair-1-image-by-Green-Shoots.jpg
https://images.cm.archant.co.uk/service/social-media-image/1850338/2517622/1/6217250-2/Molly-Sellar---Easton-Otley-Le.jpg
https://i.ytimg.com/vi/o3mov6oKoUI/maxresdefault.jpg
https://www.techcorridor.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/Emma2_700x974_acf_cropped.jpg
https://www.green-shoots.org/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/Hazel-Fielding-640x640.jpg
https://i.postimg.cc/Gh2dCrXN/gg.jpg

[Tooting Carmen]

Very Germanic-looking.

[Oliver109]

Pass best in Belgium and the Netherlands, typical northern European types.

[Arūnas]

The Last of the Mohicans, and yes, Noble people

[Token]

Largely Nordic, but unlike in your pictures of farmers from Cumbria, these are clearly of the Germanic kind (while the Keltic variety was predominant in the Cumbrians). I'm still of the opinion that East Anglians are genetically mostly Germanic despite the opinion of some scholars, and their faces seems to vindicate it.

[Creoda]

Largely Nordic, but unlike in your pictures of farmers from Cumbria, these are clearly of the Germanic kind (while the Keltic variety was predominant in the Cumbrians). I'm still of the opinion that East Anglians are genetically mostly Germanic despite the opinion of some scholars, and their faces seems to vindicate it.
I'm not sure anyone has said otherwise tbh, it's common sense.

https://i.postimg.cc/sxPrX7Jz/iron-age.jpg

[Oliver109]

Largely Nordic, but unlike in your pictures of farmers from Cumbria, these are clearly of the Germanic kind (while the Keltic variety was predominant in the Cumbrians). I'm still of the opinion that East Anglians are genetically mostly Germanic despite the opinion of some scholars, and their faces seems to vindicate it.

True though i would still argue that east Anglians pass better in Cumbria than they do in the Netherlands or Germany even though i said in my comment above that they pass in those countries well. something about their facial features still seems more British more than anything and when i have visited east Anglia i do not notice a major difference from other English regions.

[Ayetooey]

The ones from Essex looked a lot more generic south-east English than these east Anglians who look more distinct.

[Tooting Carmen]

The ones from Essex looked a lot more generic south-east English than these east Anglians who look more distinct.

Despite its putative Anglo-Saxon heritage, Essex seems to produce quite a few darker types: Russell Brand, Russell Kane, several TOWIE people.

[Avicenna]

Extremely Germanic looking

[Ayetooey]

Despite its putative Anglo-Saxon heritage, Essex seems to produce quite a few darker types: Russell Brand, Russell Kane, several TOWIE people.

I don't think it's any more Anglo-Saxon than neighboring counties, but Essex was a Saxon kingdom where as East Anglia was founded by the Angles so there is a difference there. Russell Brand is from Grays; south-west Essex is basically an extension of East London so phenotypes like his doesn't surprise me, he could easily be mixed. David Gandy is also from South Essex.

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/611586491982020628/854470580824702986/unknown.png

[Oliver109]

I don't think it's any more Anglo-Saxon than neighboring counties, but Essex was a Saxon kingdom where as East Anglia was founded by the Angles so there is a difference there. Russell Brand is from Grays; south-west Essex is basically an extension of East London so phenotypes like his doesn't surprise me, he could easily be mixed. David Gandy is also from South Essex.

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/611586491982020628/854470580824702986/unknown.png

Essex is very diverse when it comes to phenotypes, some parts of the county are very blonde especially around the Burnham on Crouch peninsula and also towards Southend i noticed many people with typical Anglo Saxon looks, the dark strains are also evident, too and are native, possibly a result of residual French influence being only 50 miles from France, i also notice that even more to the southwest of London where there are many darker types in less urban areas.

[catgeorge]

Farmers and Geologists have always been superior beings.
From establishing Kingdoms and Palaces to mastering math and science.

[Ayetooey]

Essex is very diverse when it comes to phenotypes, some parts of the county are very blonde especially around the Burnham on Crouch peninsula and also towards Southend i noticed many people with typical Anglo Saxon looks, the dark strains are also evident, too and are native, possibly a result of residual French influence being only 50 miles from France, i also notice that even more to the southwest of London where there are many darker types in less urban areas.

Agreed, Essex has more continental types of both an Anglo-Saxon, and southern/French variety. But I don't think it looks particularly different to Kent or Sussex.

[Creoda]

I'm not sure anyone has said otherwise tbh, it's common sense.

I think what has happened is that there is the 'SE England' genetic cluster (encompassing much of England, including East Anglia) that is often talked about in studies as being the most Germanic, and then there is the specific geographical region of SE England - the two have been confused. There is not much difference in that cluster, but East Anglia is most Germanic within it.

[Oliver109]

Agreed, Essex has more continental types of both an Anglo-Saxon, and southern/French variety. But I don't think it looks particularly different to Kent or Sussex.

I think there are more upper Palaeolithic types in Essex, possibly a result of migration from London ironically(who's ancestors came from much further north often) but the native types of essex are probably often more of a French caste, French influence in southern England is not insignificant.

[Ayetooey]

If East Anglia is the most North Germanic, but plots roughly the same as other parts of England on admix calcs, then it probably has the highest wog admix as well, since we know how northern Anglo-Saxons were genetically, with some of the samples having NA in the mid 50s and 27+ Baltic. Either way it would have the lowest local admix.

[Ayetooey]

I think there are more upper Palaeolithic types in Essex, possibly a result of migration from London ironically(who's ancestors came from much further north often) but the native types of essex are probably often more of a French caste, French influence in southern England is not insignificant.

Lots of people from North/Central Essex have some ancestry from Suffolk also. My mum has a maternal great-grandfather from Suffolk. But conversely Essex is full of Irish/Scottish migrants, and even has a significant Jewish community.

I don't know a lot about the ancestry of "native" Londoners from the center or west. But East London was historically part of Essex, and officially so until the 20th century, and a lot of the migrants from London to Essex are actually cockneys anyway.

[Oliver109]

Lots of people from North/Central Essex have some ancestry from Suffolk also. My mum has a maternal grandfather from Suffolk. But conversely Essex is full of Irish/Scottish migrants, and even has a significant Jewish community.

I don't know a lot about the ancestry of "native" Londoners from the center or west. But East London was historically part of Essex, and officially so until the 20th century, and a lot of the migrants from London to Essex are actually cockneys anyway.
Nearly all the migrants to Essex are from east or north London, for people in west London Essex would be considered bad taste to move to lol or just simply too far and most of those in south London move to Surrey or Kent, Irish influence is fairly significant because of the migration from north London and around 10% hold Irish names like Kelly and Murphy.

[Creoda]

If East Anglia is the most North Germanic, but plots roughly the same as other parts of England on admix calcs, then it probably has the highest wog admix as well, since we know how northern Anglo-Saxons were genetically, with some of the samples having NA in the mid 50s and 27+ Baltic. Either way it would have the lowest local admix.
Definitely. East Anglia had a strong concentration of Celtic and then Roman settlement, and I believe R1b-L21 is almost absent in natives of Suffolk.

[Ayetooey]

Definitely. East Anglia had a strong concentration of Celtic and then Roman settlement, and I believe R1b-L21 is almost absent in natives of Suffolk.

These stats are a bit outdated, but they show that non Germanic continental Y dna's are higher in that region. G for example 10-14% in Suffolk. https://anthrogenica.com/showthread.php?6154-Y-DNA-Haplogroup-Percentages-and-maps-for-England-Source-FTDNA-Y-DNA-projects

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/13/3f/fb/133ffb5645da69382c08c1ea0c913ff2.png

[Davystayn]

Despite its putative Anglo-Saxon heritage, Essex seems to produce quite a few darker types: Russell Brand, Russell Kane, several TOWIE people.

Essex is virtually an extension of London now in many places, full of former eastenders, can't really ascertain it properly in places like Billericay or Braintree

[Sharpshooter]

My definition of what the term "passes" means must be a bit different to what this forum has it. I mean if I saw them here in Northern Ireland I wouldn't think "they definitely don't look like they come from here". If you said they're not atypical for Ireland I would agree with that. But passing is a bit of a different concept, I think most NW Europeans would "fit in" in most other countries personally. Even a lot of Polish/Lithuanians here aren't easy to pick out only until they start speaking. I think when someone looks noticeably different would be someone from southern Europe, say Spain/Portugal/Italy/Greece thats when you start to think "does that person have foreign family?".

This thread is relevant to me as I actually grew up in Ipswich, did my primary and secondary school there, but I never thought I looked different in anyway. I have the Noel/Liam Gallagher atlantid/brunn look I guess. Although East Anglia is "more Germanic" than elsewhere in the British Isles, it doesn't mean it literally looks like Denmark or Holland, but it would certainly look a bit noticeably different from say Derry or rural Donegal.

Looking at my old class photos I would say about 25-40% would have noticeable Germanic admixture looking closer to continental Europe than to Scotland or Ireland, but there's another half that still looks closer to the rest of the British Isles than to continental Europe.

[Creoda]

My definition of what the term "passes" means must be a bit different to what this forum has it. I mean if I saw them here in Northern Ireland I wouldn't think "they definitely don't look like they come from here". If you said they're not atypical for Ireland I would agree with that. But passing is a bit of a different concept, I think most NW Europeans would "fit in" in most other countries personally without bother. Even a lot of Polish/Lithuanians here aren't easy to pick out only until they start speaking. I think when someone looks noticeably different would be someone from southern Europe, say Spain/Portugal/Italy/Greece thats when you start to think "does that person have foreign family?".

This thread is relevant to me as I actually grew up in Ipswich, did my primary and secondary school there, but I never thought I looked different in anyway. I have the Noel/Liam Gallagher atlantid/brunn look I guess. Although East Anglia is "more Germanic" than elsewhere in the British Isles, it doesn't mean it literally looks like Denmark or Holland, but it would certainly look a bit noticeably different from say Derry or rural Donegal.

Looking at my old class photos I would say about 25-40% would have noticeable Germanic admixture looking closer to continental Europe than to Scotland or Ireland, but there's another half that still looks closer to the rest of the British Isles than to continental Europe.
I meant as a group they'd stick out (at least to the trained eye), not as individuals. Also think they'd stick out as a group in Denmark/Netherlands, because their faces are largely characteristically English.

My definition of passing is whoever would rarely if ever be taken as foreign. The other definition of 'can easily be mistaken for' seems a bit pointless to me, it would extend to most Europeans in each other's countries.

[Daco Celtic]

I think the second to last girl passes best in Ireland

[Charlemagne7]

I think they could pass as a group in eastern Scotland.

[Norb]

there is certainly not a distinct 'South-East look' or a 'East Anglian look'

[Oliver109]

there is certainly not a distinct 'South-East look' or a 'East Anglian look'

Would you say there is a distinct west of England look? i am not so sure and would find it hard to tell apart a group of Devonians from a group of people from Leicestershire.

[Creoda]

The only English groups that can routinely be told apart on looks alone for mine are Northerners and Southerners. I often see someone and think 'that's a Northern face' or the opposite, never 'that's a Western/Eastern face'.

[Graham]

Such a strong English look. As a group don't look like any other nation.

[Creoda]

Older people from the same video series

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PX4BDa_l5nI&t=43s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MzgGj2DPaxQ&t=6s

[Ayetooey]

The only English groups that can routinely be told apart on looks alone for mine are Northerners and Southerners. I often see someone and think 'that's a Northern face' or the opposite, never 'that's a Western/Eastern face'.

I agree; northerners come off as a bit more wide-faced/cm to me. Could be an interesting anthrotard thread idea, guess the northerners vs southerners

[Oliver109]

I agree; northerners come off as a bit more wide-faced/cm to me. Could be an interesting anthrotard thread idea, guess the northerners vs southerners

True, wide faces are more common in the North, i could often tell northerners apart from southerners recently here in London because southerners often have more long thin narrow heads, Creoda's excellent post a few months back on Cricket players from the South showed this well. When it comes to general lenght and narrowness of head i think that southerners do have those traits more.

[Ayetooey]

True, wide faces are more common in the North, i could often tell northerners apart from southerners recently here in London because southerners often have more long thin narrow heads, Creoda's excellent post a few months back on Cricket players from the South showed this well. When it comes to general lenght and narrowness of head i think that southerners do have those traits more.

Agreed. And I’d say the difference between SW/SE England as someone who’s lived in both only really boils down to the slightly higher prevalence of dark hair in the SW when compared to the SE, rather than any noticeable phenotypical differences. Individuals from both still look individually the same and I couldn’t guess someone as specifically being SW or SE. The same probably applies to the NE vs NW.

[Oliver109]

Agreed. And I’d say the difference between SW/SE England as someone who’s lived in both only really boils down to the slightly higher prevalence of dark hair in the SW when compared to the SE, rather than any noticeable phenotypical differences. Individuals from both still look individually the same and I couldn’t guess someone as specifically being SW or SE. The same probably applies to the NE vs NW.

I think people in the SE tend to maybe have finer facial features and often look more continental than in the SW, Essex was mentioned on here as containing higher Atlantid and Med strains and then there is also i think a higher prevalence of subnordids, people seem to look more attractive in the home counties i have noticed and i think that is down to more regular facial features probably as a result of more European influence though of course it could be the higher living standards there.