“Being in the same/different clusters” is a subjective statement, in my opinion.

[reboun]

Do you also think that “being in the same/different clusters” is a subjective statement? I think it is a subjective statement because two ethnicities’ being in the same/different clusters depends on the autosomal calculator used. According to Eurogenes K13, two ethnicities might be in the same cluster but according to Dodecad K12b calculator, those two ethnicities might not be in the same cluster, in my humble opinion.

[Voskos]

It all comes down to having different agendas. I agree.

[Grace O'Malley]

DNA plots are consistent. I've never seen populations in different clusters for instance.

Dodecad is just a weird calculator to me. I'm very distant from Irish on some of the Dodecad calculators and on Dodecad V3 my top population is Argyle while Irish is 17 yet Argyle and Irish should be very similar so obviously something not right with the samples used.

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 West_European 55.85
2 Mediterranean 22.41
3 East_European 12.97
4 West_Asian 7.71
5 Southwest_Asian 0.99
6 Northeast_Asian 0.06
7 South_Asian 0.01

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Argyll (1000 Genomes) 1.93
2 Orkney (1000 Genomes) 2.86
3 N._European (Xing) 2.89
4 Orcadian (HGDP) 2.97
5 CEU (HapMap) 3.88
6 German (Dodecad) 4.73
7 Mixed_Germanic (Dodecad) 7.83
8 Dutch (Dodecad) 9.21
9 Kent (1000 Genomes) 11.08
10 British_Isles (Dodecad) 12.39
11 Swedish (Dodecad) 12.52
12 British (Dodecad) 12.82
13 Cornwall (1000 Genomes) 13.53
14 French (HGDP) 13.77
15 Norwegian (Dodecad) 13.9
16 French (Dodecad) 14.07
17 Irish (Dodecad) 15.01
18 Slovenian (Xing) 16.83
19 Hungarians (Behar) 21.03
20 FIN (1000Genomes) 21.96

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 62.5% German (Dodecad) + 37.5% Mixed_Germanic (Dodecad) @ 0.7
2 70.4% German (Dodecad) + 29.6% Kent (1000 Genomes) @ 0.92
3 66.4% German (Dodecad) + 33.6% Dutch (Dodecad) @ 0.98
4 79.6% Dutch (Dodecad) + 20.4% Mixed_Slav (Dodecad) @ 0.99
5 74.5% German (Dodecad) + 25.5% Cornwall (1000 Genomes) @ 1.03
6 79.2% Dutch (Dodecad) + 20.8% Polish (Dodecad) @ 1.06
7 83.6% Dutch (Dodecad) + 16.4% Belorussian (Behar) @ 1.16
8 73.6% German (Dodecad) + 26.4% British (Dodecad) @ 1.18
9 58.4% Irish (Dodecad) + 41.6% Hungarians (Behar) @ 1.18
10 73% German (Dodecad) + 27% British_Isles (Dodecad) @ 1.21
11 76.4% Kent (1000 Genomes) + 23.6% Mixed_Slav (Dodecad) @ 1.25
12 95.5% Argyll (1000 Genomes) + 4.5% Finnish (Dodecad) @ 1.26
13 93.8% Argyll (1000 Genomes) + 6.2% FIN (1000Genomes) @ 1.27
14 76.9% Argyll (1000 Genomes) + 23.1% German (Dodecad) @ 1.37
15 81.9% Mixed_Germanic (Dodecad) + 18.1% Polish (Dodecad) @ 1.41
16 97.5% Argyll (1000 Genomes) + 2.5% Lithuanian (Dodecad) @ 1.42
17 97.4% Argyll (1000 Genomes) + 2.6% Lithuanians (Behar) @ 1.43
18 76.9% German (Dodecad) + 23.1% Irish (Dodecad) @ 1.45
19 76% Kent (1000 Genomes) + 24% Polish (Dodecad) @ 1.52
20 97.3% Argyll (1000 Genomes) + 2.7% Russian (HGDP) @ 1.53

Here the Dodecad K12b on Gedmatch

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 North_European 46.61
2 Atlantic_Med 37.81
3 Gedrosia 10.15
4 Caucasus 5.15
5 Southwest_Asian 0.22
6 Siberian 0.06

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Dutch (Dodecad) 1.61
2 Mixed_Germanic (Dodecad) 2.64
3 CEU30 (1000Genomes) 4.14
4 English (Dodecad) 4.39
5 Kent (1000Genomes) 4.75
6 British_Isles (Dodecad) 5.2
7 Argyll (1000Genomes) 5.99
8 Orkney (1000Genomes) 6.08
9 Orcadian (HGDP) 6.55
10 Irish (Dodecad) 6.69
11 German (Dodecad) 6.93
12 British (Dodecad) 6.96
13 Cornwall (1000Genomes) 7.25
14 Norwegian (Dodecad) 9.07
15 Swedish (Dodecad) 11.24
16 French (Dodecad) 11.27
17 French (HGDP) 11.87
18 Hungarians (Behar) 15.44
19 Cataluna (1000Genomes) 24.44
20 Polish (Dodecad) 24.55

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 77.6% Mixed_Germanic (Dodecad) + 22.4% Norwegian (Dodecad) @ 0.34
2 81.3% Mixed_Germanic (Dodecad) + 18.7% Swedish (Dodecad) @ 0.57
3 95.6% Dutch (Dodecad) + 4.4% Mordovians (Yunusbayev) @ 0.66
4 95.5% Dutch (Dodecad) + 4.5% Russian (Dodecad) @ 0.72
5 95.7% Dutch (Dodecad) + 4.3% Russian_B (Behar) @ 0.74
6 53.7% Argyll (1000Genomes) + 46.3% German (Dodecad) @ 0.77
7 95.8% Dutch (Dodecad) + 4.2% Russian (HGDP) @ 0.77
8 96.1% Dutch (Dodecad) + 3.9% Lithuanian (Dodecad) @ 0.78
9 50.9% Irish (Dodecad) + 49.1% German (Dodecad) @ 0.79
10 95.3% Dutch (Dodecad) + 4.7% Mixed_Slav (Dodecad) @ 0.79
11 96.4% Dutch (Dodecad) + 3.6% Lithuanians (Behar) @ 0.8
12 95.6% Dutch (Dodecad) + 4.4% Belorussian (Behar) @ 0.8
13 51.4% Orcadian (HGDP) + 48.6% German (Dodecad) @ 0.82
14 95.4% Dutch (Dodecad) + 4.6% Ukranians (Yunusbayev) @ 0.87
15 70.4% Orcadian (HGDP) + 29.6% Hungarians (Behar) @ 0.88
16 94.8% Dutch (Dodecad) + 5.2% Polish (Dodecad) @ 0.88
17 96.4% Dutch (Dodecad) + 3.6% FIN30 (1000Genomes) @ 0.9
18 96.5% Dutch (Dodecad) + 3.5% Finnish (Dodecad) @ 0.9
19 87.5% CEU30 (1000Genomes) + 12.5% Ukranians (Yunusbayev) @ 0.95
20 87.1% Kent (1000Genomes) + 12.9% Mordovians (Yunusbayev) @ 0.99

The upgraded Dodecad K12b on vahaduo is much better reinforcing the samples used in the original were a bit off.

Target: Grace
Distance: 0.5430% / 0.54301804
68.9 Irish
16.7 Icelandic
11.1 Danish
3.3 Latvian


Distance to: Grace
2.11007109 Icelandic
2.59882666 Scottish
2.61715494 Irish
3.03122088 English_North
3.85611203 Norwegian
3.95576794 German_Northwest
4.10565464 English
4.22077007 Danish
4.51211702 English_South
5.19699913 French_Northwest
5.67451319 Dutch
6.22705388 Swedish
7.77739674 German
8.42206032 Belgian
11.24814651 French_North
12.16000822 French_Northeast
12.89091541 Czech
13.03407457 Bavarian_German
14.91516678 Hungarian_Alföld
14.98535952 Hungarian_Transdanubia+Budapest
15.16941001 Hungarian
15.24326409 Sorb_Lusatia
15.29021583 Slovenian
15.39927920 Slovak
15.48402725 Hungarian_North

The Eurogenes K13 on Vahaduo is remarkably similar for me.

Target: Grace
Distance: 1.9009% / 1.90091955
69.6 Icelandic
19.6 West_Scottish
9.3 Irish_Ulster
1.3 Dargin
0.2 Karitiana

Distance to: Grace
2.37583669 Icelandic
3.03324908 Scottish_Gaidhealtachd
3.90000000 Irish_Connacht
3.92126255 Scottish
3.97353747 Dutch_North
3.99221743 Scottish_Southwest
4.02823783 West_Scottish
4.04991358 Norwegian
4.11541006 Irish
4.25025882 Irish_Munster
4.25540832 Scottish_Northeast
4.25605451 Orcadian
4.35045975 Scottish_East
4.41269759 Irish_Leinster
4.50302121 Scottish_North_Highlands
4.52268725 Irish_Ulster
4.67891013 Denmark
4.67923071 Dutch_Central
4.86428823 Norway_South_Central
4.90855376 English_North
5.16241223 Welsh
5.19384251 Dutch
5.25249465 Sweden_Götaland
5.75115641 German_Northwest
5.81993127 English

[reboun]

I've never seen populations in different clusters for instance.


What does it mean?

[Grace O'Malley]

What does it mean?

If you look at any dna plot populations are always in the same clusters for groups. A couple of examples below. It's always consistent.

https://images.ctfassets.net/cnu0m8re1exe/7l5LHDUmUHk6GJT2ftJdQp/362031dc7ae743989df33913d7036579/genmapeuropeA.jpg

https://images.squarespace-cdn.com/content/v1/55d49893e4b0caee6f77186f/1559843339212-3ABEL2NK6X5EPTWBXJV7/DNA+ethnicity+estimation+Ancestry+reference+panels +populations+Jayne+3.png