12th century Hungarian king Bela III autisomal, yDna and mtDna

[vbnetkhio]

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-021-98796-x

According to the pca, he's autosomally within the modern Hungarian range, and closest to modern southern Croats.

[Dušan]

Béla was the second son of Géza II of Hungary and Géza's wife, Euphrosyne of Kiev.


Parents:


Géza was born the eldest son of Béla the Blind, a cousin of King Stephen II of Hungary, and Helena of Serbia in 1130.


Euphrosyne was the first daughter of Grand Prince Mstislav I of Kiev and his second wife, Ljubava Saviditsch.


Of his 4 grandparents, 1 was Hungarian, 1 Serbian and 2 Russian/Ukrainian

[Dušan]

I checked origin of his great-grandparents.

Out of 8 - 1 from Hungary, 1 from Serbia, 1 from Byzantine empire, 1 from England and 4 from Kievan Rus.

So I am not sure if autosomal genetics of royal families matches with autosomal genetics of people they had ruled.
In this case it was coincidence.

[Varda]

Arpad's line https://www.yfull.com/tree/R-ARP5/

[Blondie]

These royal families have very mixed ancestry, hungarians are also diverse so im not surprised.

[Blondie]

But Árpáds are no more, the Habsburgs are the legitimate heirs of the throne, they live in Hungary (not far away from me btw), fun fact but they consider themselves hungarians, the crown prince György Habsburg is active in the hungarian politics and public life, he is also the hungarian ambassador in France.

[Jana]

Interesting, thanks for sharing. I'm somewhat surprised he plots with Croats and Hungarians, especially if he comes closest to southern Croats, but yeah he had very mixed ancestry.
His Byzantine part was probably very much southern. He probably does have minor exotic stuff even if it doesn't show on PCA.

https://media.springernature.com/lw685/springer-static/image/art%3A10.1038%2Fs41598-021-98796-x/MediaObjects/41598_2021_98796_Fig1_HTML.png?as=webp

[Varda]

His paternal grandmother Helena of Serbia was daughter of Uroš I of Serbia and Ana Diogenissa from Constantinople. Mother of Uroš I is unknown, but some Serbian historians think she was from Hungary. Uroš's father was Marko brother of Vukan grand prince of Serbia. Mother of Ana Diogenissa was Theodora Komnene.
Helena of Serbia was 1/2 or 1/4 Serbian.

[Varda]

About dna of Bela III from Poreklo https://forum.poreklo.rs/index.php?topic=1791.msg163185#msg163185

It is interesting that fraternal branch of Arpads is fully Bashkir. It's one of two R1a branches among Bashkirs.

These results confirmed some earlier assumptions about formation of proto-Magyars in the area of southern Ural, in Bashkiria. I think it has been written about that earlier, on the thread about Hungarians. Proto-Magyars were federation of different tribes, in which the Finno-Ugric element of N haplogroup prevailed linguistically. Regardless a leading clan obviously had further Turkic origin.
It seems that this initial formation happened in the Bashkiria.

[Ajeje Brazorf]

Can someone upload Béla III to GEDmatch? His Y-DNA clade is definitely Steppic.

https://i.imgur.com/Du68C1w.png

Global25 samples with similar Y-DNA


KAZ_Zevakinskiy_MLBA:I3763___BC_1495_,0.10927,0.01 9295,0.053551,0.076228,-0.035699,0.023985,-0.00517,-0.006231,-0.024134,-0.038087,0.010555,-0.001499,0.001338,-0.036332,0.019679,0.01485,-0.002217,-0.003041,-0.007668,-0.002126,-0.00861,0.012242,0.008997,0,-0.008742
KAZ_Nomad_IA:DA129___BC_383_,0.093335,-0.014217,0.026021,0.05814,-0.049548,0.013387,0.00423,-0.007154,-0.022293,-0.031345,0.001786,-0.006594,0.003865,-0.026836,0.013979,0.008618,-0.017993,-0.004307,-0.003017,-0.001376,-0.011729,-0.005564,-0.001972,0.003374,0.012813

[vbnetkhio]

Can someone upload Béla III to GEDmatch? His Y-DNA clade is definitely Steppic.

https://i.imgur.com/Du68C1w.png

Global25 samples with similar Y-DNA


KAZ_Zevakinskiy_MLBA:I3763___BC_1495_,0.10927,0.01 9295,0.053551,0.076228,-0.035699,0.023985,-0.00517,-0.006231,-0.024134,-0.038087,0.010555,-0.001499,0.001338,-0.036332,0.019679,0.01485,-0.002217,-0.003041,-0.007668,-0.002126,-0.00861,0.012242,0.008997,0,-0.008742
KAZ_Nomad_IA:DA129___BC_383_,0.093335,-0.014217,0.026021,0.05814,-0.049548,0.013387,0.00423,-0.007154,-0.022293,-0.031345,0.001786,-0.006594,0.003865,-0.026836,0.013979,0.008618,-0.017993,-0.004307,-0.003017,-0.001376,-0.011729,-0.005564,-0.001972,0.003374,0.012813

His raw data has just been published, he should be on G25 soon

[Kaspias]

His raw data has just been published, he should be on G25 soon

Isn't it this?

https://www.ebi.ac.uk/ena/browser/view/SRR11727888?show=reads

[Ajeje Brazorf]

Isn't it this?

https://www.ebi.ac.uk/ena/browser/view/SRR11727888?show=reads

I hope not, because the coverage would be so low.

[vbnetkhio]

Isn't it this?

https://www.ebi.ac.uk/ena/browser/view/SRR11727888?show=reads

Somebody posted this in the Eurogenes blog comments:
https://www.ebi.ac.uk/ena/browser/view/PRJEB50150

But It looks like there's no data yet:


Submitted by XIAMEN UNIVERSITY on 15-JAN-2022

No public data has been made available in this project yet. Awaiting submission and/or validation of data.

The study has been out for months and they didn't create that ENA entry until now, so I suppose the data is coming soon

[Ajeje Brazorf]

delete

[Ajeje Brazorf]

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41431-020-0683-z


We set out to identify the origins of the Árpád Dynasty based on genome sequencing of DNA derived from the skeletal remains of Hungarian King Béla III (1172–1196) and eight additional individuals (six males, two females) originally interred at the Royal Basilica of Székesfehérvár. Y-chromosome analysis established that two individuals, Béla III and HU52 assign to haplogroups R-Z2125 whose distribution centres near South Central Asia with subsidiary expansions in the regions of modern Iran, the Volga Ural region and the Caucasus. Out of a cohort of 4340 individuals from these geographic areas, we acquired whole-genome data from 208 individuals derived for the R-Z2123 haplogroup. From these data we have established that the closest living kin of the Árpád Dynasty are R-SUR51 derived modern day Bashkirs predominantly from the Burzyansky and Abzelilovsky districts of Bashkortostan in the Russian Federation. Our analysis also reveals the existence of SNPs defining a novel Árpád Dynasty specific haplogroup R-ARP. Framed within the context of a high resolution R-Z2123 phylogeny, the ancestry of the first Hungarian royal dynasty traces to the region centering near Northern Afghanistan about 4500 years ago and identifies the Bashkirs as their closest kin, with a separation date between the two populations at the beginning of the first millennium CE.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/B%C3%A9la_III_of_Hungary

Y-DNA: R-SUR51 / R1a1a1b2a2a1c3
mtDNA: H1b


Hungary_Árpád_Béla_III:HU3B__AD_1148__Cov_95.34%,0 .132035,0.131003,0.050911,0.036499,0.035083,0.0156 18,0.007285,0.012692,0.000205,-0.004374,-0.004547,-0.001798,-0.008474,-0.002615,0.006379,0.014187,0.011604,0.000633,0.003 897,0.002001,0.004367,-0.004699,0.005669,0.00241,-0.002036


Distance to: Hungary_Árpád_Béla_III:HU3B__AD_1148__Cov_95.34%
0.01828872 Austrian:Austria16
0.02105992 German:German40
0.02164607 magicalM_scaled
0.02244261 Austrian:Austria17
0.02291803 KikiBuddy_father_scaled
0.02305412 omgpeeps/calxpal_scaled
0.02308218 German:German4
0.02379964 Avar:MGS219
0.02392644 European:5443804115_R01C01
0.02394050 German_Erlangen:GSM1658650
0.02395249 Austrian
0.02402593 German_Erlangen:GSM1658600
0.02425257 European:8324843130_R01C01
0.02446234 Hungary_Fonyód_EMA:FVD005__AD_450__Cov_70.25%
0.02448352 Austrian:Austria7
0.02478731 Ayetooey_scaled
0.02483662 cercle_scaled
0.02488296 Ayetooey_AncestryDNA_scaled

[Ajeje Brazorf]

Another Árpád dynasty member, adjacent to Béla III in southern aisle. Burial: presumably prior to Béla III. Could be Béla III’s father King Géza II (lived 1130–1162), or grandfather Béla II (1110–1141) or a more distant ancestor.

Y-DNA: R-SUR51 / R1a1a1b2a2a1
mtDNA: T2b2b1


Hungary_Árpád:HU52__AD_1100__Cov_84.99%,0.122929,0 .145221,0.054682,0.041667,0.030775,0.008925,0.0131 61,0.006461,0.008795,-0.001276,-0.005034,0.005995,-0.012487,-0.001789,0.009908,-0.002387,-0.014603,0.004687,0.009176,-5e-04,0.007612,0.009892,0.003697,-0.000241,-0.001437


Distance to: Hungary_Árpád:HU52__AD_1100__Cov_84.99%
0.02218528 Welsh:WalesL42
0.02336345 Afrikaner:AFR086
0.02518090 Huijbregts_scaled
0.02527800 Denmark_Holbæk_Medieval:CGG101835__AD_1375__Cov_70 .57%
0.02531277 MoedlingLerchengasse_6c:MGS152
0.02585789 Belgium_Sint-Truiden_EarlyLateMedieval:OLV071__AD_1000__Cov_44. 98%
0.02599244 European:8546260098_R06C02
0.02608840 English_Cornwall:HG00239
0.02608930 European:8327817147_R03C02
0.02610671 European:5434289071_R04C02
0.02620600 BelgianA
0.02663604 European:8324843039_R03C01
0.02668457 European:8543229215_R04C02
0.02673233 European:5434289104_R05C02
0.02678567 Welsh:WalesDR56
0.02690626 Afrikaner:AFR035
0.02696019 European:8327817131_R02C01
0.02699994 French_Seine-Maritime:EXPL0023

[rothaer]

(...)

Feiichy ancient Slavic calculator 2.4:

(Balto-)Slavic:HUN_Avar_Szolad_Av2,0.134311,0.126941,0.08 1458,0.065569,0.035391,0.033746,0.00987,0.005769,0 .004704,-0.02278,-0.002436,-0.005395,0.01219,0.020643,-0.015201,-0.003845,0.005867,0.004561,0.008673,5e-04,0.001497,-0.00272,0.013804,-0.007109,0.002634
(Balto-)Slavic:DEU_Krakauer_Berg_MA_KRA001,0.129758,0.125 926,0.075424,0.072029,0.046778,0.026774,0.011986,0 .010384,-0.001636,-0.021322,-0.003085,-0.006294,0.008028,0.021194,-0.013843,0.013789,0.019036,-0.005701,0.00352,0.005378,0.004991,-0.008408,0.000986,-0.006145,0.001796
(Balto-)Slavic:DEU_Krakauer_Berg_MA_KRA009,0.126344,0.127 957,0.067127,0.070737,0.042162,0.02008,0.011281,0. 014999,-0.001023,-0.032802,-0.001949,-0.01124,0.017542,0.01968,-0.012893,0.007558,0.011604,0.00114,0.005782,0.0115 06,-0.010357,0.003091,0.007765,-0.008796,-0.001676
(Balto-)Slavic:DEU_Krakauer_Berg_MA_KRA011,0.125205,0.129 988,0.078818,0.072675,0.047701,0.027889,0.013161,0 .006692,0.005522,-0.020593,-0.00065,-0.009292,0.018583,0.027249,-0.011672,-0.010342,-0.006389,0.00266,0.008045,0.002876,-0.011729,-0.008037,0.007272,-0.003494,0.003952
Celtic-like:Slovakia_LIA_LaTene_I11712,0.12862,0.147252,0 .056191,0.031654,0.046778,0.006136,-0.00282,0.000692,0.00634,0.020775,-0.006658,0.004946,-0.009068,-0.01156,0.010179,0.003713,0.00013,0.002027,0.00729 ,-0.001501,-0.000749,0.00136,-0.002465,-0.00253,0.004431
Celtic-like:Slovakia_LIA_LaTene_I11713,0.12862,0.149283,0 .052797,0.02907,0.047086,0.014781,-0.00235,-0.002077,0.013499,0.016037,0.00065,0.003447,-0.01219,-0.015276,0.004479,0.005436,-0.003912,0.007475,0.000628,-0.001376,0.001872,0.003833,-0.005053,-0.001566,-0.005149
Celtic-like:Slovakia_LIA_LaTene_I11715,0.122929,0.148267, 0.061471,0.02907,0.033852,0.010877,0.003055,0.0119 99,0.011044,0.025149,-0.000162,0.002548,-0.012933,0,0.012215,-0.004906,-0.017602,0.000633,0.011439,-0.009254,0.004991,-0.000124,-0.003451,-0.000602,0.017244
Celtic-like:Slovakia_LIA_LaTene_I11716,0.129758,0.141159, 0.047517,0.011951,0.04647,0.007251,-0.00376,-0.004846,0.00859,0.023326,-0.003897,0.010491,-0.013974,0.001789,-0.000271,-0.004508,0.007693,0.003674,0.005405,0.004377,-0.001248,0.008903,0.000739,-0.00241,0.001916
Celtic-like:France_GrandEst_IA1_SG_Jeb8.SG,0.119514,0.138 112,0.055814,0.029716,0.044931,-0.006414,-0.004465,0.002077,0.009817,0.01057,0.000162,0.0080 93,-0.022894,-0.009083,0.019272,0.007823,0.002217,-0.001014,-0.000754,0.003001,-0.005615,-0.003091,-0.011832,-0.00723,0.004431
Celtic-like:France_GrandEst_IA1_SG_NOR2B6.SG,0.118376,0.1 42174,0.04714,0.004199,0.042469,0.000279,-0.011751,0.010615,0.019225,0.01385,0.011367,0.0113 9,-0.005203,-0.004679,0.013029,0.016176,0.030379,0.007855,0.005 656,0.003627,0.004742,-0.006306,-0.002218,0.001084,-0.010538
Celtic-like:France_GrandEst_IA1_SG_NOR3-15.SG,0.113823,0.148267,0.064111,0.019057,0.041238 ,-0.006693,0.00564,-0.001615,0.013703,0.019135,-0.007307,-0.001199,-0.014569,-0.013487,0.024158,-0.004508,-0.02047,-0.008235,-0.006913,0.010255,-0.003119,-0.003339,-0.017748,0.001687,-0.002036
Finnic-like:Udmurt11,0.102441,-0.021326,0.081458,0.067507,-0.032006,0.007809,0.011986,0.007384,-0.011453,-0.037723,0.022247,-0.001199,0.013082,-0.038672,-0.009365,-0.006762,-0.00352,0.00266,-0.010182,-0.014382,0.006738,0.000866,-0.008134,0.010001,-0.002754
Germanic:ALH_1___AD_450___Coverage_94.81%,0.118376 ,0.129988,0.06939,0.051034,0.048009,0.023148,0.014 101,-0.000692,0.006136,-0.001822,-0.002436,0.003447,-0.008474,-0.012248,0.012486,0.008088,-0.005215,0.004307,0.00817,0.009755,0.009858,0.0046 99,0.001725,0.002771,-0.002395
Germanic:R2204___AD_150___Coverage_65.74%,0.132035 ,0.128972,0.076178,0.057494,0.04647,0.021196,0.006 815,0.011769,0.001227,-0.01221,-0.002436,-0.002398,0.000595,-0.009083,0.020765,0.0118,-0.010431,0.005701,0.006159,0.005753,0.013102,0.003 833,0,0.013496,-0.00012
Germanic:SZ13___AD_488___Coverage_70.31%,0.133173, 0.133034,0.065996,0.059109,0.041238,0.017012,0.004 23,0.001154,-0.005522,-0.004191,-0.007632,0.007493,-0.008622,-0.004542,0.016422,0.006232,0.001043,-0.002407,0.007165,0.002876,0.015473,0.014715,0.003 328,0.01458,0.000359
Germanic:SZ15___AD_508___Coverage_99.90%,0.138864, 0.116786,0.058454,0.042959,0.036314,0.024821,0.002 35,0.010153,0.001227,-0.003827,0.001949,0.001948,-0.013082,-0.015276,0.016558,0.017634,0.012517,0.000127,0.013 073,0.013006,0.003993,0.00272,-0.002342,0.025064,-0.004191
Germanic:SZ16___AD_508___Coverage_54.61%,0.133173, 0.128972,0.068259,0.062662,0.035699,0.019522,0.002 585,0.009923,0.001432,-0.005832,0.001137,0.008992,-0.005946,-0.006881,0.024158,0.006232,-0.008084,-0.000253,-0.003017,0.009004,0.003244,0.005193,0.001109,0.014 219,0.003353
Germanic:SZ22___AD_508___Coverage_59.28%,0.130897, 0.131003,0.057699,0.06137,0.044008,0.011713,0.0051 7,0.002538,-0.000409,0.000547,-0.012991,0.005845,-0.004906,-0.010735,0.010586,0.012463,0.000782,-0.003801,0.002891,0.012381,0.009109,0.004328,-0.004314,0.005663,0.003952
Germanic:SZ2___AD_508___Coverage_99.66%,0.122929,0 .139128,0.070144,0.067184,0.038469,0.018128,0.0061 1,0.006461,-0.000205,-0.009294,-0.000974,-0.00015,-0.008474,-0.00055,0.017372,-0.006629,-0.022296,0.005954,0.005908,-0.004627,0.015597,0.000742,0.007395,0.008555,0.002 634
Germanic:SZ7___AD_508___Coverage_63.80%,0.135449,0 .135065,0.066373,0.062016,0.035083,0.01255,0.00611 ,0.005307,0.003272,0,-0.011205,3.00E-04,-0.007433,-0.010322,0.018729,0.002784,-0.005476,0.000127,0.001885,0.002376,0.009234,0.007 419,0.001602,0.015785,-0.001197
Germanic:CL146___AD_605___Coverage_71.88%,0.129758 ,0.131003,0.063356,0.05491,0.040931,0.015897,0.003 525,0.010384,0.001023,-0.006925,-0.002761,0.004346,-0.017988,-0.007982,0.026873,0.001193,-0.0103,0.003294,0.010056,0.011255,0.006239,0.00432 8,0.003944,0.017954,0.000838
Germanic:CL92___AD_605___Coverage_64.15%,0.135449, 0.132019,0.070144,0.04845,0.037238,0.013945,0.0079 9,0.020307,0.005522,0.002551,-0.013478,-0.001649,-0.005798,-0.004404,0.02348,0.005171,-0.023208,0.005321,0.004777,-0.003502,0.008735,0.008903,-0.00493,0.003615,0.001078
Graeco-Roman:ITA_Rome_Imperial_RMPR76,0.095611,0.142174,-0.042992,-0.064923,-0.011079,-0.015618,-0.006815,-0.007384,-0.007976,0.010934,0.004547,0.001349,0.005798,-0.009909,-0.012079,0.00358,0.026729,-0.008108,-0.002388,0.007003,-0.005116,0.004575,-0.003944,0.008073,-0.000359
Palaeo-Balkan:ALB_MA_I13839,0.120652,0.151314,0.013953,-0.037468,0.030159,-0.012271,-0.001175,-0.001615,0.006136,0.025149,-0.004222,0.003897,-0.015609,0.002202,-0.019815,-0.007425,0.008605,0.006461,0.00817,-0.014257,-0.007112,0.002968,0.006039,-0.003735,-0.000599
Turkic:TUR_Ottoman_MA2195,0.072847,-0.144205,0.035449,-0.000969,-0.045855,-0.02008,0.009165,0.004154,-0.014112,-0.011299,-0.006008,-0.006594,-0.001189,-0.013349,0.004072,0.00053,0.005476,0.002914,-0.005405,0.007879,-0.012104,0.000495,-0.011339,-0.006386,-0.004191


Target: Hungary_Árpád_Béla_III:HU3B__AD_1148__Cov_95.34%
Distance: 1.4322% / 0.01432181
48.0 Germanic
29.2 (Balto-)Slavic
9.0 Palaeo-Balkan
7.0 Celtic-like
6.8 Graeco-Roman

Target: Hungary_Árpád:HU52__AD_1100__Cov_84.99%
Distance: 1.8065% / 0.01806491
75.4 Germanic
17.0 Palaeo-Balkan
3.6 Celtic-like
2.8 Graeco-Roman
1.2 (Balto-)Slavic

Wtf, that much Germanic and without scoring any Turkic, not even as a proxy for further eastern things? And the second one does not even score notably (Balto-)Slavic.

It's stunning that HU52 with that autosomal genetics has R-Z2125 with all what you quoted about that above.

For comparison:

Target: rothaer_wife2_scaled
Distance: 1.1985% / 0.01198534
71.0 Germanic
29.0 (Balto-)Slavic

Target: #Oda#(Lower_Saxony)_scaled
Distance: 1.1842% / 0.01184182
69.4 Germanic
23.4 Celtic-like
7.2 (Balto-)Slavic

[rothaer]

https://i.imgur.com/eVE1QMz.jpeg

Bela III's Balto-Slavic and some more southern things are clear, but from where does he have his 48% proto Germanic?

HU52's autosomal genetic is even more a conundrum, considering that he shall be an ancestor or other older male lineage relative of Bela III.

:icon_ask:

[Beowulf]

<tbody>
Distance to:
Beowulf_Scaled


0.05320380
Hungary_Árpád_Béla_III:HU3B__AD_1148__Cov_95.34%



</tbody>

[gixajo]

[im
:icon_ask:

This other Hungarian king (https://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?375745-Ladislaus-I-of-Hungary-on-G25)was quite Turkic with the same calculator you posted:


Ladislaus_I,0.117238,0.091398,0.052797,0.046189,0. 01908,0.013945,0.007285,0.006461,-0.004909,-0.011663,-0.000812,-0.001798,-0.001933,0.004404,0.00475,0.004773,0.007562,-0.003294,0.004274,0.005753,-0.002371,0.002597,0.000863,-0.005904,-0.002036

Target: Ladislaus_I
Distance: 1.2020% / 0.01202041
40.0 (Balto-)Slavic
29.6 Germanic
15.0 Turkic
8.2 Graeco-Roman
7.2 Celtic-like