Once again about drugs...

[Sarmata]

Reason to why I have created this thread is some accident from 2 days ago...

"Zatrucie amfetaminą i ecstasy było prawdopodobną przyczyną śmierci dwóch braci. 15- i 18-latek zatruli się podczas imprezy w nocy z poniedziałku na wtorek w Siemianowicach Śląskich. Ich 19-letni brat oraz 20-letnia znajoma, którzy uczestniczyli w tej samej imprezie, zażyli taką ilość narkotyków, że zdaniem lekarzy "trudno ją nawet zmierzyć".
- Stwierdziliśmy ogromne ilości amfetaminy i mniejsze stężenia ecstasy. Można powiedzieć, że w przypadku tego pierwszego narkotyku stężenia wykraczają wręcz poza możliwość pomiaru – o stanie najstarszego z braci i ich znajomej poinformował dyrektor Szpitala Miejskiego nr 2 w Siemianowicach Śląskich Bolesław Gębarski. Dodał, że życiu pacjentów nie zagraża już bezpośrednie niebezpieczeństwo".

Yes I know this is in Polish and maybe except Oswiu no one can read this short article...It's about 2 brothers, 15 and 18 years old kids actually who died becouse of drugs. Their third brother is in the hospital now. According to doctors they take so much drugs(amphetamine and ecstasy) that doctors can't measure it... And point is that I personaly know one of them(boy who survive) and boys father who works/worked( guy lost contact with reality) in my firm. To use a single word it's tragedy. So "drugs defenders" please think twice...

[Jamt]

That is tragic as hell. Not to common for users to die of speed and ecstasy but they definitely can do from heat, and lack of water after use, or, as in this case radical overdose.

[Birka]

Did someone make these brainiacs take the drugs? Was there a gun at their heads threatening them? They made the stupid choice. What is there to defend?

[Jamt]

They were kids. And one of them was someone who Sarmata know. So…

[Birka]

It is a shame that young people do drugs and overdose. Especially if they are friends. But that does not mean that governments should control the use of drugs. Knives are legal and people kill with them. Should we do away with knives?

[SwordoftheVistula]

They might be too young to make responsible decisions, I wouldn't mind a minimum age of 21 for drug use. I don't think this justifies banning it entirely though.

[Sol Invictus]

How many people overdose and die as a result of Marijuana use?

[Psychonaut]

They might be too young to make responsible decisions, I wouldn't mind a minimum age of 21 for drug use. I don't think this justifies banning it entirely though.

That's where I stand as well. Most organic drugs are far less dangerous than alcohol. Setting an age limit of 18 (or 21 depending on your municipality) would make sense if drugs like marijuana, mushrooms or cacti were legalized.

[Ulf]

For the gov't to tell you what you can or can not put into your body implies that you do not have ownership over your own body; that you don't have the right to decide what you'll do with your body, with your property and with your life.

I figured it was pretty common knowledge that taking too many drugs will probably kill or hospitalize you.

Oh well, hopefully he will recover and learn from this. :coffee:

[Fortis in Arduis]

The correct dose for MDMA is about 250mg, split into two doses, about 90 minutes aparts, the first dose being the main one and the second dose being about half that amount.

Anything more than that, and one experiences peripheral side effects such as overheating and the jitters.

So why did they take so much? :rolleyes:

[Jamt]

Maybe time to skip the smiley’s and reread Sarmatas post.
There are a lot of kids in this world.
It could be one of yours it happens to.

[Brynhild]

Maybe time to skip the smiley’s and reread Sarmatas post.
There are a lot of kids in this world.
It could be one of yours it happens to.

The very thing that worries me about mine. I've been upfront about my drug use (pot mostly) with them, and they're well educated enough about what's currently out there.

I don't want them to touch drugs, but I also must trust them to make their own decisions about what is and what isn't good for them. Hopefully, they won't do anything at all, but if there's a drug of choice it's home grown pot hands down. I know they all hate cigarettes so we're off to a good start in that regard.

[Absinthe]

Sad... :....

I am thinking that occassional (even one-time) drug users have more chances of OD-ing and dying from it, than habitual drug users... Mainly due to lack of experience and knowledge about drugs.

Of course, everytime one is using drugs, one is playing with one's life.

One of the reasons I never did drugs when all of my stoned friends were trying to convince me "it is harmless" and "nothing's ever happened to them", is that I realize that the drug is merely the substance, it needs an organism to interact with...

And since no two organisms are the same, the reaction to the drugs depends on the psychosomatic and biochemical state of each individual at the time of drug use.

So who can guarantee to me that a certain substance is 'harmless'. What if I have a certain condition that I am unaware of, that makes it harmful for me?

I'd rather be safe than sorry...

[Thorum]

Maybe time to skip the smiley’s and reread Sarmatas post.
There are a lot of kids in this world.
It could be one of yours it happens to.

Unfortunately, as my kids are growing up now, they are taught by society and government that alcohol is ok, and other drugs aren't. Utterly ridiculous!!

I will teach them correctly. That all drugs can be bad. All drugs can kill. Alcohol is by far the most deadly. I don't recommend drugs, though I am not against drugs. It is an individual decision whether or not to use drugs. Again, I will teach them that alcohol is by far the most devastating and damaging.

[Thorum]

One of the reasons I never did drugs when all of my stoned friends were trying to convince me "it is harmless"

Do you drink? What about your avatar?

:mmmm:

[Absinthe]

Do you drink? What about your avatar?

:mmmm:
It was chosen for aesthetic/artistic (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Absinthe:_La_Folie_Verte) purposes. ;)

Besides, the absinthe that circulates now is nothing like the absinthe of the 19th century. It's just strong alcohol.

[Thorum]

It was chosen for aesthetic/artistic (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Absinthe:_La_Folie_Verte) purposes. ;)

Besides, the absinthe that circulates now is nothing like the absinthe of the 19th century. It's just strong alcohol.

Absinthe, I love your avatar!! :rolleyes:

Actually, my point was that my guess is you drink. And you think it is ok to drink alcohol but other drugs aren't ok.

Sorry, doesn't make sense to me.

[Absinthe]

I drink, but I don't think it's a good idea to drink (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_dissonance). :)

[Thorum]

I drink, but I don't think it's a good idea to drink (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_dissonance). :)

Absinthe, I love to drink. I also love to smoke marijuana. I have also done coke, LSD, mushrooms, snorted heroin, loveboat/PCP, quaaludes, etc.....

Mostly in my 20's. I stopped drinking about 7 years ago. I haven't done any other drugs for probably 15 years.

With all that said, In my experience, nothing.......nothing has caused me more mental, physical and social damage than alcohol.

I guess my perspective is shaped by my life...

[Absinthe]

I didn't say anyone shouldn't, I merely said it's not a good idea to. :) It's up to anyone to decide what to do with their own bodies, and none of my business... ;)

[Galloglaich]

Firstly, let me offer my condolences to Sarmata and wish his friend a quick and healthy recovery.

Secondly, as for the "drug defender" business-I don't really consider myself defending "drugs" so much as defending the freedom for one to make decisions concerning his/her own body and activities. As previously stated, I don't think that there is too much confusion about the fact that drugs are potentially harmful and/or fatal. Anyone engaging in drug activity usually knows this upfront beforehand. We face the same risks in other situations everyday and never bat an eye. For example, we all know when we enter our vehicle that there is a risk involved in driving; yet in spite of the fact that more people are killed in automobile accidents than in overdoses we continue to drive and no one ever seems to call for the banning of driving "for the safety of the people". It's about RESPONSIBILITY. We choose to act as responsibly as possible and mitigate the risks involved in LIVING as best as we can. For some people, the benefit of using drugs in a responsible manner (yes, it can be done) outweighs the risk of injury or death. If one chooses not to make that choice, all good and fine, but do they really have the right to preclude others from making a different choice? If I choose not to drive should I be able to prohibit my neighbor from doing so just because I don't like it? In either case accidents can and unfortunately will happen, but that is a simple fact that needs to be understood and calculated in one's risk assessment.

Also, let's face it, drug prohibition doesn't work anyway. I don't know the laws in Poland, but if there had been more laws on the books would that really have stopped Sarmata's friend from experimenting with drugs? To the contrary, if drug use were more open in public, the possibility strongly exists that a fatal dosage error would not have occurred due to information being more obtainable. Just my 2 cents worth. Once again, my condolences to Sarmata.

[Eldritch]

Do not expose your brain to MDMA.

Its long-term effects are still not quite clear, and even what is known about it now is pretty scary. Taking it once or twice probably won't do you any permanent harm, but Ibiza's "fuckin' havin' it" crowd will be on ten different medications by the time they hit middle age.