Impaler's father results

[Impaler]

I have been always confused about my results. After all calculators and his autosomal results I found that he is part Roma (he doesn't know a clue about it). According to his Y-DNA subclade J-Y18402, his paternal side was definitely Roma, mostly Rudar (Boyash). They are the most assimilated tribe, they don't speak Romani neither have any Romani tradition. I think this is the most plausible explanation, that's why no one knows about it, they probably identified as Romanians.

I am not sure if he has other recent West Asian ancestry, he is definitely an outlier.

Feel free to ask questions about calculators, results etc. Maybe we can figure out more.


https://i.ibb.co/FY1SvCc/1.png (https://imgbb.com/)
https://i.ibb.co/tJ4wg3C/2.png (https://imgbb.com/)
https://i.ibb.co/3pvXvPZ/3.png (https://imgbb.com/)

[TheMaestro]

Romanian getting magyar POV

https://i.imgur.com/2cXXuoD.png

https://i.imgur.com/0x2KFz0.gif

[Luke35]

Would love to see K13 and K15 components, if you get them.

[Impaler]

Eurogenes K13:

Population
North_Atlantic 18.46 Pct
Baltic 16.26 Pct
West_Med 12.76 Pct
West_Asian 17.83 Pct
East_Med 19.82 Pct
Red_Sea 1.08 Pct
South_Asian 9.95 Pct
East_Asian -
Siberian 2.00 Pct
Amerindian -
Oceanian 1.47 Pct
Northeast_African 0.38 Pct
Sub-Saharan -

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Greek_Thessaly 12.92
2 Bulgarian 13.79
3 Romanian 14.59
4 Italian_Abruzzo 15.5
5 Central_Greek 15.58
6 East_Sicilian 16.65
7 Serbian 17.85
8 West_Sicilian 17.89
9 Ashkenazi 18.42
10 Tuscan 18.8
11 South_Italian 18.83
12 Turkish 20.8
13 Moldavian 21.37
14 North_Italian 21.45
15 Azeri 23.27
16 Turkmen 23.4
17 Sephardic_Jewish 23.47
18 Hungarian 24.03
19 Kumyk 24.25
20 Italian_Jewish 24.29

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 71.3% Greek_Thessaly + 28.7% Afghan_Pashtun @ 4.58
2 76.7% Greek_Thessaly + 23.3% Punjabi_Jat @ 4.62
3 75.8% Greek_Thessaly + 24.2% Pathan @ 4.68
4 76.3% Greek_Thessaly + 23.7% Kalash @ 4.69
5 76.5% Greek_Thessaly + 23.5% Burusho @ 4.84
6 77.4% Bulgarian + 22.6% Sindhi @ 5.16
7 78.8% Greek_Thessaly + 21.2% Sindhi @ 5.28
8 68% Greek_Thessaly + 32% Tadjik @ 5.29
9 75% Bulgarian + 25% Pathan @ 5.79
10 76% Bulgarian + 24% Makrani @ 5.85

Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Ashkenazi +25% Hungarian +25% Kalash @ 3.229331


Using 4 populations approximation:
1 Italian_Abruzzo + Italian_Jewish + Pathan + South_Polish @ 3.049299
2 Bulgarian + Italian_Jewish + Pathan + Serbian @ 3.056844
3 Italian_Jewish + Pathan + Romanian + Serbian @ 3.062772


Eurogenes K15:

Eurogenes K15:

Population
North_Sea 9.86 Pct
Atlantic 14.13 Pct
Baltic 11.61 Pct
Eastern_Euro 7.37 Pct
West_Med 8.07 Pct
West_Asian 17.13 Pct
East_Med 17.45 Pct
Red_Sea 1.30 Pct
South_Asian 9.96 Pct
Southeast_Asian -
Siberian 1.42 Pct
Amerindian -
Oceanian 1.42 Pct
Northeast_African 0.29 Pct
Sub-Saharan -

ingle Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Bulgarian 12.69
2 Romanian 13.5
3 Greek 13.52
4 Greek_Thessaly 13.98
5 Ashkenazi 15.39
6 Italian_Abruzzo 15.43
7 Central_Greek 15.7
8 Serbian 16.53
9 East_Sicilian 16.59
10 West_Sicilian 17.72
11 Tuscan 17.98
12 South_Italian 18.35
13 Turkish 19.22
14 Turkmen 19.39
15 Moldavian 19.45
16 Azeri 21.02
17 North_Italian 21.11
18 Austrian 21.43
19 Croatian 21.53
20 Tadjik 21.93

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 70.5% Bulgarian + 29.5% Makrani @ 4.09
2 71.8% Bulgarian + 28.2% Brahui @ 4.3
3 71.4% Bulgarian + 28.6% Balochi @ 4.46
4 69.4% Romanian + 30.6% Makrani @ 4.87
5 67.9% Greek + 32.1% Afghan_Pashtun @ 5.35
6 71% Romanian + 29% Brahui @ 5.36
7 77.5% Bulgarian + 22.5% Sindhi @ 5.41
8 69.7% Bulgarian + 30.3% Afghan_Pashtun @ 5.56
9 70.5% Romanian + 29.5% Balochi @ 5.57
10 73.9% Greek + 26.1% Pathan


Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Austrian +25% Brahui +25% Cyprian @ 4.382161


Using 4 populations approximation:
1 Assyrian + Lithuanian + Makrani + Spanish_Valencia @ 3.600881
2 Brahui + Iranian_Jewish + Lithuanian + Spanish_Valencia @ 3.628384
3 Brahui + Iranian_Jewish + Lithuanian + Spanish_Andalucia @ 3.634714

[Leto]

I commend you for posting this, there is nothing wrong with your father and I am one of the biggest proponents of Roma assimilation.
He seems a bit less than half Romani by the looks of it. At least if we go by the averages we have. They range from 20 to 30% South Asian on K13 but the average is around 25% or so. And it's ca. 50% Caucasoid in reality.

[Insuperable]

What does your grandparent look like?

[Impaler]

What does your grandparent look like?

I don't have a pic but as far as I remember he looked very West Asian.

[Leto]

Add his Dodecad K12b and HarappaWorld please.

[Impaler]

Add his Dodecad K12b and HarappaWorld please.

+puntDNAL K13

HarappaWorld:

S-Indian 7.61 Pct
Baloch 14.16 Pct
Caucasian 25.04 Pct
NE-Euro 24.86 Pct
SE-Asian -
Siberian 1.83 Pct
NE-Asian -
Papuan 1.3 Pct
American -
Beringian -
Mediterranean 18.62 Pct
SW-Asian 6.47 Pct
San -
E-African -
Pygmy 0.11 Pct
W-African -

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 romanian-a (behar) 14.74
2 bulgarian (yunusbayev) 15.22
3 ashkenazi (harappa) 16.16
4 romanian-b (behar) 16.81
5 tuscan (1000genomes) 16.91
6 tuscan (hgdp) 17.09
7 tuscan (hapmap) 17.43
8 ashkenazy-jew (behar) 17.82
9 turk-aydin (hodoglugil) 18.12
10 italian (hgdp) 21.02
11 stalskoe (xing) 23.46
12 nogai (yunusbayev) 23.61
13 sephardic-jew (behar) 23.63
14 turkmen (yunusbayev) 24.21
15 turk-istanbul (hodoglugil) 24.34
16 morocco-jew (behar) 24.42
17 tajik (yunusbayev) 24.76
18 turk-kayseri (hodoglugil) 25.75
19 hungarian (behar) 26.26
20 turkish (harappa) 26.28

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 73.1% bulgarian (yunusbayev) + 26.9% gujarati-muslim (harappa) @ 3.78
2 72.3% romanian-a (behar) + 27.7% bene-israel-jew (behar) @ 4.09
3 71.7% bulgarian (yunusbayev) + 28.3% bene-israel-jew (behar) @ 4.3
4 75.2% bulgarian (yunusbayev) + 24.8% sindhi (hgdp) @ 4.4
5 73.1% bulgarian (yunusbayev) + 26.9% punjabi-jatt-muslim (harappa) @ 4.46
6 72.6% bulgarian (yunusbayev) + 27.4% sindhi (harappa) @ 4.47
7 74.8% bulgarian (yunusbayev) + 25.2% punjabi-arain (xing) @ 4.5
8 67.3% bulgarian (yunusbayev) + 32.7% pashtun (harappa) @ 4.52
9 72.3% bulgarian (yunusbayev) + 27.7% kashmiri (harappa) @ 4.56
10 74.1% romanian-a (behar) + 25.9% gujarati-muslim (harappa) @ 4.65
11 74% bulgarian (yunusbayev) + 26% punjabi (harappa) @ 4.68
12 68.2% romanian-a (behar) + 31.8% pashtun (harappa) @ 4

Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% bulgarian_yunusbayev +25% haryana-jatt_harappa +25% sephardic-jew_behar @ 2.264500


Using 4 populations approximation:
1 cypriot_behar + pushtikar-brahmin_harappa + tuscan_hapmap + ukranian_yunusbayev @ 1.663487
2 ashkenazy-jew_behar + bulgarian_yunusbayev + pushtikar-brahmin_harappa + romanian-a_behar @ 1.765800
3 ashkenazy-jew_behar + pushtikar-brahmin_harappa + romanian-a_behar + romanian-a_behar @ 1.776576
4 bulgarian_yunusbayev + pushtikar-brahmin_harappa + sephardic-jew_behar + serbian_harappa @ 1.803568
5 ashkenazy-jew_behar + bulgarian_yunusbayev + punjabi-jatt-sikh_harappa + romanian-a_behar @ 1.805076
6 cypriot_behar + pushtikar-brahmin_harappa + tuscan_hgdp + ukranian_yunusbayev @ 1.813114
7 ashkenazy-jew_behar + bulgarian_yunusbayev + bulgarian_yunusbayev + punjabi-jatt-sikh_harappa @ 1.821440
8 pushtikar-brahmin_harappa + romanian-a_behar + sephardic-jew_behar + serbian_harappa @ 1.846900
9 cypriot_behar + pushtikar-brahmin_harappa + tuscan_1000genomes + ukranian_yunusbayev @ 1.954029
10 ashkenazi_harappa + bulgarian_yunusbayev + pushtikar-brahmin_harappa + romanian-a_behar @ 1.963436


Dodecad K12b:

Population
Gedrosia 13.85 Pct
Siberian 1.40 Pct
Northwest_African 0.52 Pct
Southeast_Asian -
Atlantic_Med 20.88 Pct
North_European 24.29 Pct
South_Asian 7.79 Pct
East_African 0.84 Pct
Southwest_Asian 6.46 Pct
East_Asian -
Caucasus 23.84 Pct
Sub_Saharan 0.13


Target: Father_K12b
Distance: 1.6157% / 1.61569082 | ADC: 0.5x RC
37.8 Moldovan_Gagauz
26.2 Balkan_Gypsy
19.6 Pamiri_Rushan
16.4 Italian_Piedmont

puntDNAL K13:

opulation
West_Asia 25.03 Pct
NE_Europe 25.75 Pct
Americas 0.33 Pct
Siberia 3.12 Pct
Oceania 2.09 Pct
South_Asia 8.21 Pct
NE_Asia -
East_Africa 0.15 Pct
SE_Asia 0.06 Pct
SW_Europe 25.82 Pct
SW_Asia 8.58 Pct
West_Africa 0.23 Pct
South_Africa 0.62 Pc


Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 NE_European 31.18
2 Mediterranean 26.71
3 Caucasian 23.6
4 S_Indian 6.3
5 SW_Asian 4.72
6 Siberian 2.84
7 Oceanian 1.91
8 Omo_River 0.94
9 Beringian 0.9
10 S_African 0.68
11 Horn_Of_Africa 0.19
12 Amerindian 0.03

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Greek_Central 11.11
2 Greek_Thessaly 11.18
3 Bosnian 13.73
4 Bulgarian 13.79
5 Albanian 13.95
6 Macedonian 14
7 Montenegrin 14.32
8 Tuscan 14.44
9 Romanian 14.48
10 Italian 15.61
11 Ashkenazy_Jew 17.94
12 Serbian 18.28
13 Sicilian 19.56
14 Brazilian 21.01
15 Sephardic_Jew 21.02
16 Croatian 22.47
17 French 22.83
18 Portuguese 23.06
19 Spaniard 23.7
20 Romani 23.89

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 67.8% Bulgarian + 32.2% Pashtun @ 3.09
2 66.7% Romanian + 33.3% Pashtun @ 3.33
3 67% Montenegrin + 33% Pashtun @ 3.44
4 67.6% Macedonian + 32.4% Pashtun @ 3.67
5 64.8% Montenegrin + 35.2% Tadjik @ 3.8
6 65.8% Bulgarian + 34.2% Tadjik @ 3.88
7 77.2% Bulgarian + 22.8% Balochi @ 3.9
8 62.7% Italian + 37.3% Tadjik @ 3.91
9 77.8% Bulgarian + 22.2% Brahui @ 4.04
10 52.1% Spaniard + 47.9% Tadjik @ 4.05


Using 4 populations approximation:
1 Finnish + Chechen + Sardinian + Pashtun @ 2.508218
2 Mordovian + Chechen + Sardinian + Pashtun @ 2.581949
3 Russian + Italian + Romani + Turk_Istanbul @ 2.680674
4 Russian + Basque + Pashtun + Assyrian @ 2.693573
5 Karelian + Macedonian + Romani + Turk_Trabzon @ 2.712628
6 Russian + Chechen + Sardinian + Pashtun @ 2.713487
7 Karelian + Basque + Pashtun + Assyrian @ 2.715482
8 Mordovian + Basque + Pashtun + Armenian @ 2.736030
9 Mordovian + Basque + Pashtun + Azerbaijani @ 2.743771
10 Finnish + Macedonian + Romani + Turk_Trabzon @ 2.765021

[Impaler]

Double.

[Impaler]

I think he is very West Asian admixed. His full Roma relative was high in West Asian. I saved some of his results from G25 calculators:

Modern Average Scaled:

Target: Father_scaled
Distance: 2.2664% / 0.02266417 | ADC: 0.25x RC
40.0 Roma_Bilbao
24.8 Gagauz
17.0 Azeri_Turkey
15.2 Russian_Smolensk
2.0 Roma_Barcelona
1.0 Papuan


K64 Supreme:

Target: Father_scaled
Distance: 2.4548% / 0.02454796
32.4 East_Slavic
14.0 Sardinian
13.8 Iran
13.8 South_Caucasus
11.2 South_India
9.8 North_Italy
3.8 West_Levant
1.2 Melanesian

World K134:

Target: Father_scaled
Distance: 2.5258% / 0.02525762
29.8 Polish-Ukrainian-Belarusian
22.0 Armenian-Assyrian
17.6 Basque
8.4 Chenchu-Relli
8.4 Crete-Kos
7.2 Trabzon-Laz
5.2 Gupta
1.0 Papuan-Kosipe-Koinanbe
0.2 Bulgarian-Romanian-Moldovan-Macedonian
0.2 Qiang-Tibetan

Regional Supreme:

Target: Father_scaled
Distance: 2.3585% / 0.02358516
30.0 Middle_East:Assyrian
26.2 Eastern_Europe:Russian_Smolensk
21.2 Southern_Europe:Spanish_Asturias
14.6 South_Asia:Uttar_Pradesh
3.8 Southern_Europe:Greek_Central_Macedonia
3.6 Southern_Europe:Italian_Bergamo
0.6 Middle_East:Turkish_Central

AncestryDNA Supreme:

Target: Father_scaled
Distance: 2.1640% / 0.02163956
28.6 Eastern_Europe_&_Russia
20.4 Italy
14.2 Turkey_&_the_Caucasus
13.4 Iran/Persia
12.0 Northern_&_Western_India
10.2 Sardinia
1.2 Melanesia

Gencove:

Target: Father_scaled
Distance: 2.1313% / 0.02131253
34.6 East_European
27.8 Anatolia_Caucasus_Iranian_Plateau
17.8 South_West_European
15.2 Central_Indian_subcontinent
3.2 Central_Asia
1.0 Océania
0.4 North_central_Asia

[Impaler]

YourDNAPortal:

Turkic K11:

Admix 4 Oracle:
Italian_North 25
Russians_C 25
Tajik_Ishkasim 25
Turkish_Adana 25

Admix 10% - min:
Cossacks_Kuban 20
Brahmin 10
Cypriot 10
Druze 10
English 10
Kryashen_Tatars 10
Kurd_SE 10
North_Ossetians 10
Sardinian 10


Kurdish K10:

Admix 4 Oracle:
Albanian 25
Norwegian 25
Pathan 25
Sicilian 25

Admix 10% - min:
Italian_North 30
Algerian 10
Burusho 10
French 10
Lezgin 10
Pathan 10
Romanian 10
Ukrainian 10

AncientNearEast13:

Admix 4 Oracle:
Balochi 25
Jewish_Libyan25
Lithuanian 25
Sicilian 25

Admix 10% - min:
Hungarian 20
Scottish 20
Bengali 10
Druze 10
Iran_ChL 10
Jewish_Moroccan 10
Jewish_Yemenite 10
Romanian 10


MDLP K27:

Admix 4 Oracle:
North_Italian 25
Roma 25
Turkmenian 25
Ukrainian 25

Admix 10% - min:
Mordovian 20
Bosnian 10
Cretan 10
Dharkar 10
Kabardinian 10
Romaniann 10
S1 Oetzi 10
Slovakian-Roma 10
West-Sicilian 10

[Leto]

K13

Impaler_father,18.46,16.26,12.76,17.83,19.82,1.08, 9.95,0,2.00,0,1.47,0.38,0

Target: Impaler_father
Distance: 1.9169% / 1.91688252 | ADC: 0.25x RC
36.0 Greek_Istanbul
33.7 Roma_Wallachia
16.1 Austrian_Burgenland
9.4 Pamiri_Tajikistan
4.8 Turkish_Deliorman

Obviously the Pamiris are only superficially similar to the Roma because of both South Asian and European admixture.

[Luke35]

Really awesome to finally unravel the mystery of your results.

Here is a quick model I made. I ran my father's theoretical coordinates too, as I thought they might pick of a little Roma, but they did not. I was playing with some German pops earlier, so I left them in the source and you scored a little.


Target: Impaler_father
Distance: 617.2960% / 6.17295955 | ADC: 0.5x
51.4 Romanian_Muntenia
48.6 Roma_Wallachia

Target: Impaler
Distance: 654.6666% / 6.54666608 | ADC: 0.5x
75.0 Romanian_Muntenia
22.2 Roma_Wallachia
2.8 German_Rhineland-Palatinate

Target: Mr.G_father
Distance: 271.7947% / 2.71794675 | ADC: 0.5x
61.4 Hungarian_Transylvania
26.6 Hungrian_Transdanubia
11.2 German_Rhineland-Palatinate_East_of_Rhine
0.8 German_South_Hesse


Hungrian_Transdanubia,32.22,31.69,14.10,7.11,10.52 ,1.02,0.61,0.41,0.91,0.59,0.42,0.22,0.10
Hungarian_Transylvania,28.08,29.17,15.62,8.20,11.9 8,1.72,1.24,0.42,2.15,0.76,0.27,0.13,0.13
Roma_Balkans,9.73,9.53,12.55,16.84,18.44,2.86,26.4 3,1.28,0.92,0.27,0.61,0.45,0.09
Roma_Wallachia,10.87,10.98,13.02,16.12,19.24,2.66, 23.01,1.43,0.72,0.21,1.21,0.39,0.14
Romanian,23.71,26.24,17.13,10.25,17.33,1.90,0.64,0 .60,1.07,0.54,0.38,0.11,0.10
Romanian_Banat,23.88,25.79,17.43,10.47,17.42,1.87, 0.49,0.57,1.19,0.45,0.26,0.11,0.06
Romanian_Crişana,25.14,27.30,16.89,9.51,16.54,1.32 ,0.69,0.43,0.91,0.60,0.44,0.12,0.10
Romanian_Dobruja,22.26,25.09,17.69,10.81,18.50,2.1 6,0.71,0.71,1.15,0.45,0.30,0.06,0.10
Romanian_Maramureş,26.03,28.85,16.08,9.29,14.55,1. 83,0.84,0.74,0.77,0.46,0.42,0.07,0.06
Romanian_Muntenia,22.61,24.55,17.51,11.08,18.76,2. 11,0.62,0.62,1.03,0.54,0.35,0.12,0.09
Romanian_North-Moldavia,24.89,30.80,15.19,9.09,14.27,1.69,0.84,0. 56,1.37,0.53,0.47,0.17,0.13
Romanian_Oltenia,23.41,24.91,18.15,10.55,18.10,1.8 3,0.51,0.71,0.87,0.38,0.37,0.08,0.12
Romanian_South-Moldavia,24.02,26.72,16.79,9.78,17.00,2.06,0.64,0. 58,1.14,0.64,0.37,0.10,0.16
Romanian_Transylvania,24.22,26.32,17.35,9.92,17.02 ,1.80,0.57,0.56,1.10,0.59,0.38,0.09,0.10
Romanian_Wallachia,22.69,24.74,17.64,10.95,18.58,2 .07,0.62,0.65,1.01,0.49,0.35,0.11,0.10
German_County_Glatz,35.77,31.04,14.63,8.13,7.64,0. 3,0,1.02,0,0.72,0,0.72,0
German_East_Prussia_Central,46.40,36.05,9.33,1.39, 2.77,2.18,0,0.12,0.19,0.31,0.99,0.18,0.09
German_Hamburg,50.83,28.92,8.41,3.93,4.04,1.33,1.3 2,0,0.62,0.15,0,0.45,0
German_Hither_Pomerania,43.825,32.395,11.415,5.735 ,3.815,0.35,0.545,0.72,0.44,0.475,0.05,0.24,0
German_Lower_Saxony_North,49.55,27.97,10.58,6.26,2 .15,0.25,1.64,0.39,0.16,0.19,0.54,0.32,0.00
German_Lower_Saxony_South,48.78,25.87,11.39,6.78,3 .82,0.44,1.48,0.00,0.51,0.31,0.04,0.12,0.45
German_Lower_Silesia,34.34,36.33,12.87,6.99,6.65,0 ,0.6,0,0.31,0.85,0.34,0.47,0.23
German_Mecklenburg_Center/East,42.39,32.89,11.32,5.1,5.27,0.54,0.89,0,0,1.13 ,0,0,0.47
German_Mecklenburg_West,45.13,33.44,9.22,6.21,3.28 ,0.16,0.49,0.62,0.34,0.34,0.33,0.43,0.00
German_North_Bohemia,38.27,31.61,13.93,5.63,7.42,0 .38,0.90,0.53,0.10,0.41,0.50,0.00,0.31
German_North_Hesse,43.69,22.35,14.83,4.48,10.49,1. 78,0,0.69,0,0.86,0.22,0,0.6
German_North_Rhine,43.36,21.95,15.88,7.62,8.34,0.6 2,0.96,0.13,0.23,0.17,0.38,0.23,0.13
German_Saarland,43.50,20.17,18.47,5.85,9.04,1.30,1 .03,0.00,0.20,0.12,0.04,0.17,0.09
German_Schleswig-Holstein,50.35,26.87,11.48,4.44,3.57,0.78,0.52,0.2 7,0.18,0.83,0.39,0.09,0.24
German_South_Hesse,41.78,21.94,17.52,5.66,8.80,1.5 0,0.66,0.33,0.41,0.56,0.46,0.11,0.27
German_Rhineland-Palatinate,42.44,20.12,17.36,5.05,11.26,1.57,0.27, 0.15,0.65,0.45,0.39,0.11,0.20
German_Rhineland-Palatinate_East_of_Rhine,46.37,21.92,13.75,6.97,7. 95,2.21,0.46,0.00,0.00,0.03,0.00,0.20,0.15
German_Westphalia,48.90,25.72,11.45,6.87,3.44,0.81 ,1.08,0.20,0.26,0.57,0.25,0.06,0.39
Upper_Silesia,33.01,43.21,9.27,6.4,5.21,0.26,0.67, 0,1.04,0.31,0.58,0,0.06

[Impaler]

I added some Iranian samples, the fit is lower:

Target: Father_K13
Distance: 3.8444% / 3.84438453 | ADC: 0.5x RC
54.2 Romanian_Muntenia
28.9 Roma_Wallachia
16.9 Persian_Eastcentral

[Jana]

Thanks for sharing, very interesting results! As far as I remember you papa looks Slavic, so no wonder Roma admixture may be unknown to him, especially if that particular tribe is assimilated.
Is his Romanian ancestry from Wallachia?

Is Greek coming from his side or your maternal side?

[Impaler]

Thanks for sharing, very interesting results! As far as I remember you papa looks Slavic, so no wonder Roma admixture may be unknown to him, especially if that particular tribe is assimilated.
Is his Romanian ancestry from Wallachia?

Is Greek coming from his side or your maternal side?

Yes, his Romanian side is from Buzau county, Wallachia.
My Greek is from maternal side.

By the way, this is his Y-DNA according to his STRs results
https://www.yfull.com/tree/J-Y18402*/

[Jana]

Yes, his Romanian side is from Buzau county, Wallachia.
My Greek is from maternal side.

By the way, this is his Y-DNA according to his STRs results
https://www.yfull.com/tree/J-Y18402*/

Looks like a Romani specific lineage of broadly Caucasus origin Y-DNA?

[Impaler]

Looks like a Romani specific lineage of broadly Caucasus origin Y-DNA?

Yes, right, ancient origins.

I am also on FTDNA Romany group and that's what they said about this specific subclade:

"As you see in the link the J-Y18402 tMRCA of 1000 years is just after the Romaní exodus from India or contemporary.

They could have been Zutt (Jat) cavalry or have been forced soldiers or logistic with the Ghaznavid army. We did multiple remarches and, clearly, the mutation is a known old Maykop culture mutation, in the actual region of Chechenia and Caucasus.

The main branch has the J-Y3612 “NAKHS people” sample.
That is just 2 mutations upstream our sub-branch: J-Y18402.

Those Nakho-Dagestanian came from the Kura-Araxes and Maikop trans-caucasian culture spreading north, from Dagestan on the Caspian sea, toward Grozni and then North of the present Sochi.

The Scandinavians & Balkan clans, which are all under J-Y3612, had a Y-DNA flow from those regions' populations. But J-Y3612 formed 7650 years ago so it was formed at the very end of Neolithic, near the region that is now North of Sochi, in Russia. From there, they surely moved North and possibly East. In-fact we can see that most men of J-Y3612 subgroups are still in Russia, Caucasus etc.

J-Y18402 “could” just be a Middle-age DNA flow into Romaní that originated from very ancient Russians herders / nomads or Caucasian people.
Anyway Y haplogroup J-Y18402 was generated 3450 years ago! So they had plenty time to spread and to be everywhere already in ancient times and, clearly, also East toward India and the North.

The very interesting fact is that MOST of the J-Y18402 tested people on YFull are actually from Romaní clans so this old paternal line from Dagestan / Maikop survives mainly in Romaní (for what we know until now)."

[Nurzat]

congrats and thanks for posting it! Roma mixed in Persia and in the Ottoman empire on the way to the Balkans so the lesser mixed ones (considering more recent times) score even more "West Asian" (not the best label for it) or Persian than Indian. so the West Asian and Persian must be from the Roma side as well. hard to draw precise lines when it's about very mixed populations like this one, but anyway it's even more interesting as it links you to an even broader region, so rich in history (I am quite passionate about the Orient, as Apricitans know :) ) can't wait to test my parents as well

[Leto]

Can you also post his Gedrosia K3? Just curious about the West-East ratio.

[Impaler]

Can you also post his Gedrosia K3? Just curious about the West-East ratio.

Population
E_Eurasian 7.32 Pct
SSA 1.88 Pct
W_Eurasian 90.8 Pct

[Rostos vilmoskörte]

Gypsy

[Dunai]

Based on my most recent custom-made calculator these are your dad's results (btw, I'd wish Roma ancestry wouldn't be stigmatized on anthro sites, it's getting pathetic to read all the insults, it literally is as normal as any other ancestry):

Target: Impalerdad
Distance: 2.8882% / 2.88823015 | ADC: 0.25x RC
32.0 Balkanic_Roma
18.9 Northwest_Turkish
18.3 South_Greek
13.5 Southwest_German
10.4 Northeast_Caucasian
6.9 East_Balkanic

[Leto]

(btw, I'd wish Roma ancestry wouldn't be stigmatized on anthro sites, it's getting pathetic to read all the insults, it literally is as normal as any other ancestry):
That is also thanks to some fat and mentally ill individuals that no one wants to associate with, if you know what I mean.

[Rostos vilmoskörte]

That is also thanks to some fat and mentally ill individuals that no one wants to associate with, if you know what I mean.

OP has been anti Roma aswell and insulted anyone trying to explain his results.
Took him a few years to accept hes his own worst nightmare.

[Mortimer]

That is also thanks to some fat and mentally ill individuals that no one wants to associate with, if you know what I mean.

I guess you mean me

[Cristiano viejo]

I always knew you were Gypsy.

[Mortimer]

Welcome to the tribe

[Leto]

I guess you mean me
Unfortunately, those traits can be applied to you. And that is no one else's fault. You have been spamming this forum with yourself since ever.

[Leto]

OP has been anti Roma aswell and insulted anyone trying to explain his results.
Took him a few years to accept hes his own worst nightmare.
He can be anti-Roma because of their bad culture, lifestyle and behavior. His own family is assimilated and don't act/look like Gypsies.

[Mortimer]

Unfortunately, those traits can be applied to you. And that is no one else's fault. You have been spamming this forum with yourself since ever.

Sounds like a dumb apology for hating roma ancestry your answer to dunai is that it is Mortimers fault before I was here there was much more anti roma hatred because there was no roma to defend

[Rostos vilmoskörte]

He can be anti-Roma because of their bad culture, lifestyle and behavior. His own family is assimilated and don't act/look like Gypsies.

He has the gypsy mentality to bring in violance instead of words and by his family you mean who exactly? He has posted his full indian looking relatives before.

[Kyp]

Seems like the most logical explanation!

[Leto]

Sounds like a dumb apology for hating roma ancestry your answer to dunai is that it is Mortimers fault before I was here there was much more anti roma hatred because there was no roma to defend
You have become a symbol of Roma for many. Like I said, I am a big proponent of Roma assimilation. If you were healthier, you would be fine. Let's not talk about you here, I was hoping you wouldn't see that fucking comment.

[Mortimer]

He can be anti-Roma because of their bad culture, lifestyle and behavior. His own family is assimilated and don't act/look like Gypsies.

I think it is the other way around he only admitted roma ancestry because there is this big fat and mentally ill guy around who emboldened him not the other way around that he disacciates from the fat guy

[Mortimer]

You have become a symbol of Roma for many. Like I said, I am a big proponent of Roma assimilation. If you were healthier, you would be fine. Let's not talk about you here, I was hoping you wouldn't see that fucking comment.

I think he only says he is roma because I'm here not the other way around

[Jana]

Stop destroying Impaler's thread. Really irritating.

[Sora]

Looks typical Romanian with part Romani ancestry, but Romani is really less than half

[Smitty]

I think he only says he is roma because I'm here not the other way around

I highly doubt that. This place isn't all that racist when it comes down to it. Most people are interested in genetics, whoever's genetics they are. Impaler will have to speak for himself, but I think this thread was about the truth and his own ancestry. Nothing to do with you or Roma advocacy.

[Impaler]

Here the same case and same tribe. A full Roma who never identified as a Roma. He said that he is just a Vlach - Bulgarian + some Romanian or just Kopanari which means Rudar/Boyash. He is an IT and very civilised.
As you can see he scored huge West Asian and Iran country as region:

https://i.ibb.co/BgnJYwM/Screenshot-20220123-185019-2.png (https://ibb.co/FBH1dnT)
https://i.ibb.co/mCYsdS7/Screenshot-20220123-185027-2.png (https://ibb.co/hRn5rCv)
https://i.ibb.co/xLS14mz/Screenshot-20220123-185038-2.png (https://ibb.co/ZX6BZHc)
https://i.ibb.co/ZJpxW6x/Screenshot-20220123-185109-2.png (https://ibb.co/3s9cByc)

[Luke35]

Impaler, are you thinking that your father is half Roma, or full Roma, genetically? His result looked like half to me.

[rothaer]

He can be anti-Roma because of their bad culture, lifestyle and behavior. His own family is assimilated and don't act/look like Gypsies.

I agree with emphasis. I don't know where that thinking comes from that says that someone that has a particular ancestry must find that cool of find people cool that fully have that ancestry. Also, an individual does not always appreciate every single of his own mental of physical traits. So why should there be an exception for the topic of ancestry?

Secondly, I think nobody should be critizised in the context of posting his results. Because what would that lead to? It would lead to that a number of people would not post their results.

I expressly thank Impaler for posting these results.

[Impaler]

Impaler, are you thinking that your father is half Roma, or full Roma, genetically? His result looked like half to me.

His SA is lower than average half Romas and his WA is way higher. I don't know if he is half or less.

[Impaler]

Double.

[Mejgusu]

Congratulations for your fathers results. I can’t explain the Westasian shift of some Romani, maybe just a genetic evidence of their migration route? You shouldn’t care about some comments here.

[CommonSense]

There are many members of your grandfather's tribe in Serbia too, especially in Vojvodina. Most of them don't identify as Romani/Gypsies. All people who don't speak their ancestral language are prone to identity loss and assimilation.

[rothaer]

Here the same case and same tribe. A full Roma who never identified as a Roma. He said that he is just a Vlach - Bulgarian + some Romanian or just Kopanari which means Rudar/Boyash. He is an IT and very civilised.
As you can see he scored huge West Asian and Iran country as region:

https://i.ibb.co/BgnJYwM/Screenshot-20220123-185019-2.png (https://ibb.co/FBH1dnT)
https://i.ibb.co/mCYsdS7/Screenshot-20220123-185027-2.png (https://ibb.co/hRn5rCv)
https://i.ibb.co/xLS14mz/Screenshot-20220123-185038-2.png (https://ibb.co/ZX6BZHc)
https://i.ibb.co/ZJpxW6x/Screenshot-20220123-185109-2.png (https://ibb.co/3s9cByc)

A stunning result. Both the low European (18.6%) and the high West Asian (53.2%) are remarkable. I wondered whether at the start of the migration from Indian/Pakistan border area there will alrady have been some West Asian into the people. But this guy that is half Punjabi and half Pashtunhas has nothing of that, so I guess no.

https://i.imgur.com/2qMeDnA.jpg

This huge amount of West Asian must have been picked up along the way. It would be interetesting to enlight that part of the history.

[Leto]

There are many members of your grandfather's tribe in Serbia too, especially in Vojvodina. Most of them don't identify as Romani/Gypsies. All people who don't speak their ancestral language are prone to identity loss and assimilation.
Do they identify as Serbians? The Serbian language, church, etc.

[Leto]

There are many members of your grandfather's tribe in Serbia too, especially in Vojvodina. Most of them don't identify as Romani/Gypsies. All people who don't speak their ancestral language are prone to identity loss and assimilation.
Do they identify as Serbians? The Serbian language, church, etc.

[CommonSense]

Do they identify as Serbians? The Serbian language, church, etc.

Some of them identify as Romanians, others as Serbs. They're also present in Bosnia (so called "Karavlasi") and Slavonia and Baranja in Croatia.

[CommonSense]

....

[Leto]

Some of them identify as Romanians, others as Serbs. They're also present in Bosnia (so called "Karavlasi") and Slavonia and Baranja in Croatia.
They might be more mixed on average from centuries ago, hence the lower South Asian in Impaler's father than a normal half Gypsy is expected to score.

[CommonSense]

They might be more mixed on average from centuries ago, hence the lower South Asian in Impaler's father than a normal half Gypsy is expected to score.

Yeah, I agree. It would obviously make sense for a group like them to be less endogamous compared traditional Gypsy societies.

[Impaler]

They might be more mixed on average from centuries ago, hence the lower South Asian in Impaler's father than a normal half Gypsy is expected to score.

Is K36 a good calculator for someone like him?

[Luke35]

Is K36 a good calculator for someone like him?

What might be interesting for you is to have ph2ter make your father some maps, I know he does K36, K13, K15, K12b. He has acquired some really good regional population samples, so his maps have improved over time.

[Impaler]

What might be interesting for you is to have ph2ter make your father some maps, I know he does K36, K13, K15, K12b. He has acquired some really good regional population samples, so his maps have improved over time.

K36:

Population
Amerindian -
Arabian -
Armenian 0.98 Pct
Basque 2.93 Pct
Central_African -
Central_Euro 4.33 Pct
East_African -
East_Asian -
East_Balkan 15.06 Pct
East_Central_Asian -
East_Central_Euro 3.76 Pct
East_Med 11.92 Pct
Eastern_Euro 3.95 Pct
Fennoscandian 3.54 Pct
French 2.14 Pct
Iberian 2.21 Pct
Indo-Chinese -
Italian 6.18 Pct
Malayan -
Near_Eastern 8.39 Pct
North_African -
North_Atlantic 5.8 Pct
North_Caucasian 4.68 Pct
North_Sea 2.33 Pct
Northeast_African -
Oceanian 0.76 Pct
Omotic -
Pygmy -
Siberian -
South_Asian 8.45 Pct
South_Central_Asian 6.14 Pct
South_Chinese -
Volga-Ural -
West_African -
West_Caucasian 6.45 Pct
West_Med -

[Leto]

Is K36 a good calculator for someone like him?
I don't use it much personally and it has no accessible oracle. Plus it seems to be more sensitive to raw data quality, more than K13 for example. Nevertheless posting it wouldn't be a bad idea.

[Mortimer]

I highly doubt that. This place isn't all that racist when it comes down to it. Most people are interested in genetics, whoever's genetics they are. Impaler will have to speak for himself, but I think this thread was about the truth and his own ancestry. Nothing to do with you or Roma advocacy.

This place was much more racist before, it is not racist since Im here, that also due to me. Google threads from 2009, since Im here it is much less racist.

[Kyp]

Congratulations for your fathers results. I can’t explain the Westasian shift of some Romani, maybe just a genetic evidence of their migration route? You shouldn’t care about some comments here.


A stunning result. Both the low European (18.6%) and the high West Asian (53.2%) are remarkable. I wondered whether at the start of the migration from Indian/Pakistan border area there will alrady have been some West Asian into the people. But this guy that is half Punjabi and half Pashtunhas has nothing of that, so I guess no.

This huge amount of West Asian must have been picked up along the way. It would be interetesting to enlight that part of the history.


I have seen some Turks and Kurds from Anatolia scoring "Romani Balkan" genetic group on Myheritage despite having any South Asian ancestry.

I don't know if thats from Gypsy admixture or just shared ancestry...

[Mortimer]

I have seen some Turks and Kurds from Anatolia scoring "Romani Balkan" genetic group on Myheritage despite having any South Asian ancestry.

I don't know if thats from Gypsy admixture or just shared ancestry...

Check the settings, if it is default or high threshold, if it is a very low threshold you might get some controvesial minor groups. I have hungarian under lowest threshold but Im not hungarian. But under highest threshold i still have romani.

[Jana]

I have seen some Turks and Kurds from Anatolia scoring "Romani Balkan" genetic group on Myheritage despite having any South Asian ancestry.

I don't know if thats from Gypsy admixture or just shared ancestry...

I bet on shared West Asian ancestry. I get Balkan Roma genetic group on myheritage, and both me and my father score 0% south Asian (he does not get this genetic group tho)
However my father has Bosniak ancestry from same area where some of tested Gypsies are from, so I assume they are part Slavic/Bosniak

[Impaler]

Some other results:

DNAGenics:

https://i.ibb.co/crNF0N9/Recent-ancestry.png (https://ibb.co/TgH86HG)


IllustrativeDNA:

https://i.ibb.co/1RcJhw9/screencapture-lab-illustrativedna-order-result-625-0-2022-01-24-14-06-51.png (https://ibb.co/8Pk4TSj)


https://i.ibb.co/M8SfxLN/fghfghfg.png (https://ibb.co/7gCQdFy)

[ph2ter]

What might be interesting for you is to have ph2ter make your father some maps, I know he does K36, K13, K15, K12b. He has acquired some really good regional population samples, so his maps have improved over time.

I told Impaler a long time ago that he has about 15-25% of Romani ancestry (analysing his G25 values).

Here are K13 maps for his father:

Normal similarity K13 map:

https://i.imgur.com/cysexMu.png

and his admixture map where I grouped his K13 breakdown list into 4 groups: Romanian, Caucasian, Jewish and Indian:

https://i.imgur.com/p1AdLiz.png

His G25 values probably would turn more accurate than K13.

[Mejgusu]

I have seen some Turks and Kurds from Anatolia scoring "Romani Balkan" genetic group on Myheritage despite having any South Asian ancestry.

I don't know if thats from Gypsy admixture or just shared ancestry...

Idk, South Asian is common among Iranics, I saw South Asia at Kurdish/Persian Myheritage results too(but no Romani). I am not a big fan of myheritage, because of that I am not sure how accurate they are showing specific ancestry.


Some other results:

I think Central Asia mostly refers to Afghan Iranics, although some Romanians have a bit real Turkic ancestry I can’t say whether your father has. If I am not wrong Romanis sometimes get close to them on population estimates.

[Luke35]

I told Impaler a long time ago that he has about 15-25% of Romani ancestry (analysing his G25 values).

Here are K13 maps for his father:

Normal similarity K13 map:

https://i.imgur.com/cysexMu.png

and his admixture map where I grouped his K13 breakdown list into 4 groups: Romanian, Caucasian, Jewish and Indian:

https://i.imgur.com/p1AdLiz.png

His G25 values probably would turn more accurate than K13.

Brilliant maps.

[Impaler]

I told Impaler a long time ago that he has about 15-25% of Romani ancestry (analysing his G25 values).

Here are K13 maps for his father:

Normal similarity K13 map:


and his admixture map where I grouped his K13 breakdown list into 4 groups: Romanian, Caucasian, Jewish and Indian:


His G25 values probably would turn more accurate than K13.


Same 15% Caucasian percentage on G25 map. You made for him with unscaled coords.

https://i.ibb.co/XpWYTwG/WH4EZiv.png (https://ibb.co/ctyYdms)

[Hungarian_master]

Quite interesting!

Your Dad was an adopted child?

[Impaler]

Quite interesting!

Your Dad was an adopted child?

No, he wasn't. He looks similar with his father.

[Hungarian_master]

No, he wasn't. He looks similar with his father.

But even he don't know before about his Gypsy ancestry.

[Impaler]

But even he don't know before about his Gypsy ancestry.

Because it was very assimilated. Rudars/Boyash don't consider themselves Gypsies. They speak no Romani, neither have any tradition.

You can see here:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CUmPtQ1dq9s&t=89s

[Impaler]

Here another example of Boyash with the same Y-DNA subclade. So the Caucasian ancestry is not random but real. As you can see he has region in Adygea.

He is my cousin on 23andMe and GEDmatch.


https://i.ibb.co/rvk2Bp1/west-asian.png (https://imgbb.com/)
https://i.ibb.co/KDJ174F/south-asian.png (https://imgbb.com/)
https://i.ibb.co/p1mX8s2/Euro1.png (https://imgbb.com/)
https://i.ibb.co/HCkGMzy/euro2.png (https://imgbb.com/)

[Leto]

What does he score on Gedmatch?

[JosephK]

Because it was very assimilated. Rudars/Boyash don't consider themselves Gypsies. They speak no Romani, neither have any tradition.

You can see here:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CUmPtQ1dq9s&t=89s

That may explain why Impaler didn't match with a lot of "Roma" on GEDMatch back when I ran his results...

[Impaler]

What does he score on Gedmatch?

Which calculator?

[Leto]

Which calculator?
Just the most useful ones - K13 and K12b ;)

[Leto]

Which calculator?
Just the most useful ones - K13 and K12b ;)

[Impaler]

Just the most useful ones - K13 and K12b ;)
Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 South_Asian 27.16
2 East_Med 19.15
3 West_Asian 18.5
4 West_Med 12.25
5 Baltic 12.05
6 North_Atlantic 6.76
7 East_Asian 2.23
8 Oceanian 1.51
9 Amerindian 0.37

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Afghan_Tadjik 23.69
2 Tadjik 24.35
3 Turkmen 24.37
4 Afghan_Pashtun 24.51
5 Pathan 25.88
6 Azeri 26.1
7 Turkish 26.32
8 Iranian 27.65
9 Punjabi_Jat 27.94
10 Burusho 28.11
11 Greek_Thessaly 28.15
12 Central_Greek 28.75
13 East_Sicilian 29.01
14 Kurdish 29.19
15 Kumyk 29.44
16 Ashkenazi 29.83
17 Kalash 29.85
18 Italian_Abruzzo 30.03
19 South_Italian 30.08
20 Bulgarian 30.43

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 59.2% Central_Greek + 40.8% Kanjar @ 6.22
2 54.1% Ashkenazi + 45.9% Gujarati @ 6.3
3 54% Ashkenazi + 46% Kshatriya @ 6.38
4 55% Central_Greek + 45% Kshatriya @ 6.49
5 58.4% Central_Greek + 41.6% Dharkar @ 6.51
6 61.3% Greek_Thessaly + 38.7% Velamas @ 6.52
7 61.7% Central_Greek + 38.3% North_Kannadi @ 6.68
8 55.2% Central_Greek + 44.8% Bangladeshi @ 6.77
9 52.1% Ashkenazi + 47.9% Brahmin_UP @ 6.84
10 55.1% Central_Greek + 44.9% Gujarati @ 6.89
11 60.8% Central_Greek + 39.2% Velamas @ 6.92
12 54.8% East_Sicilian + 45.2% Kshatriya @ 6.94
13 59.1% East_Sicilian + 40.9% Kanjar @ 7.1
14 61.5% Central_Greek + 38.5% Dusadh @ 7.16
15 59% Greek_Thessaly + 41% Dharkar @ 7.18
16 54.9% East_Sicilian + 45.1% Gujarati @ 7.19
17 61% Central_Greek + 39% Kol @ 7.19
18 61.9% Greek_Thessaly + 38.1% Kurumba @ 7.2
19 59.8% Greek_Thessaly + 40.2% Kanjar @ 7.23
20 55.6% Greek_Thessaly + 44.4% Kshatriya @ 7.24


Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 Caucasus 24.38
2 South_Asian 21.96
3 North_European 17.51
4 Gedrosia 15.64
5 Atlantic_Med 12.65
6 Southwest_Asian 5.18
7 Southeast_Asian 1.27
8 East_Asian 0.88
9 Northwest_African 0.28
10 East_African 0.25

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Turkmens (Yunusbayev) 24.36
2 Bnei_Menashe_Jews (Behar) 24.4
3 Tajiks (Yunusbayev) 25.87
4 Iranian (Dodecad) 29.28
5 Iranians (Behar) 29.42
6 Turkish (Dodecad) 29.63
7 Turks (Behar) 29.9
8 Nogais (Yunusbayev) 30.15
9 Ashkenazy_Jews (Behar) 30.22
10 Kumyks (Yunusbayev) 30.43
11 Greek (Dodecad) 30.5
12 O_Italian (Dodecad) 30.53
13 Bulgarian (Dodecad) 30.55
14 Romanians (Behar) 30.69
15 Pathan (HGDP) 30.89
16 S_Italian_Sicilian (Dodecad) 31.01
17 Ashkenazi (Dodecad) 31.07
18 Kurd (Dodecad) 31.14
19 Kurds (Yunusbayev) 31.58
20 Sicilian (Dodecad) 31.61

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 55.8% Bnei_Menashe_Jews (Behar) + 44.2% Romanians (Behar) @ 2.96
2 56.7% Bnei_Menashe_Jews (Behar) + 43.3% Bulgarians (Yunusbayev) @ 3.24
3 55.7% Bnei_Menashe_Jews (Behar) + 44.3% Bulgarian (Dodecad) @ 3.3
4 53% Bulgarians (Yunusbayev) + 47% Cochin_Jews (Behar) @ 5.19
5 54.2% Greek (Dodecad) + 45.8% Brahmins_from_Uttar_Pradesh (Metspalu) @ 5.2
6 59.2% Greek (Dodecad) + 40.8% Tharus (Metspalu) @ 5.31
7 60.8% Greek (Dodecad) + 39.2% Kanjars (Metspalu) @ 5.33
8 54.1% Bulgarian (Dodecad) + 45.9% Cochin_Jews (Behar) @ 5.34
9 60.4% Greek (Dodecad) + 39.6% Muslim (Metspalu) @ 5.35
10 56.9% Greek (Dodecad) + 43.1% Kshatriya (Metspalu) @ 5.43
11 59.5% Greek (Dodecad) + 40.5% Iyengar (Dodecad) @ 5.69
12 60.4% Greek (Dodecad) + 39.6% Dharkars (Metspalu) @ 5.87
13 54.5% Ashkenazy_Jews (Behar) + 45.5% Brahmins_from_Uttar_Pradesh (Metspalu) @ 5.89
14 60.7% Greek (Dodecad) + 39.3% INS30 (SGVP) @ 5.9
15 60.8% Greek (Dodecad) + 39.2% GIH30 (Dodecad) @ 6.1
16 62.4% Bnei_Menashe_Jews (Behar) + 37.6% Hungarians (Behar) @ 6.12
17 58.3% Greek (Dodecad) + 41.7% Indian (Dodecad) @ 6.21
18 57.7% Greek (Dodecad) + 42.3% Brahmins_from_Tamil_Nadu (Metspalu) @ 6.24
19 54% Romanians (Behar) + 46% Cochin_Jews (Behar) @ 6.27
20 53.8% Ashkenazi (Dodecad) + 46.2% Brahmins_from_Uttar_Pradesh (Metspalu) @ 6.36


Ion_K13,6.76,12.05,12.25,18.5,19.15,0,27.16,2.23,0 ,0.37,1.51,0,0
Ion_K12b,15.64,0,0.28,1.27,12.65,17.51,21.96,0.25, 5.18,0.88,24.38,0

[Leto]

Ion_K13,6.76,12.05,12.25,18.5,19.15,0,27.16,2.23,0 ,0.37,1.51,0,0
Ion_K12b,15.64,0,0.28,1.27,12.65,17.51,21.96,0.25, 5.18,0.88,24.38,0
This person is very Romani, 27/22 percent South Asian is a lot!

Target: Ion_K13
Distance: 2.7625% / 2.76247396
37.4 Greek_Northern_Thrace
31.4 Kannada_North
17.7 Greek_Caucasus
5.1 Ho
4.4 Turkish_East-Black_Sea
3.1 Cypriot_Greek
0.9 Latvian

Target: Ion_K12b
Distance: 1.7370% / 1.73699320 | ADC: 0.25x RC
66.0 Balkan_Gypsy
15.0 Dargin_Kaitag
7.5 Moldovan_Central
7.3 Santhal
4.2 Haryana_Ror

Truly they are a three way (Indian-West Asian-Balkan) mix.

[Guti]

Dodecad K12b:

Population
Gedrosia 13.85 Pct
Siberian 1.40 Pct
Northwest_African 0.52 Pct
Southeast_Asian -
Atlantic_Med 20.88 Pct
North_European 24.29 Pct
South_Asian 7.79 Pct
East_African 0.84 Pct
Southwest_Asian 6.46 Pct
East_Asian -
Caucasus 23.84 Pct
Sub_Saharan 0.13


Target: Father_K12b
Distance: 1.6157% / 1.61569082 | ADC: 0.5x RC
37.8 Moldovan_Gagauz
26.2 Balkan_Gypsy
19.6 Pamiri_Rushan
16.4 Italian_PiedmontRoma are mixed people so it is almost impossible to trace all their non-Roma ancestors. Because Roma people can have ancestors from every country they resided.

You dad has by far less Roma ancestry than you think, maybe less than 25% Roma.


I see the Caucasus-component almost at the same level as an average in Romania. Furthermore I detect a notable increase of the Gedrosia-component compared to an average in Romania.

I don't have DNA result of Roma from Turkey or Iran right now, so I can't compare it with the results of your father. But as far as I know Roma people in West Asia have by far much less of the 'Gedrosia'-component compared to their Iranic neighbours.
Gedrosia-component in your dad is relatively high (compared to average Romanian and Roma in Turkey/West Asa), if we assume that your dad is less than 25% Roma than we can be conclude that he has more Middle Eastern (non-Roma) ancestry from Central Iran and not from Turkey. If most of his Roma ancestors were from Turkey and not Iran, then he would have more of the Caucasus-component than the Gedrosia-Component.

Caucasian admixture
https://i.postimg.cc/mgY5tW9N/Caucasian-admixture.png

Gedrosian admixture
https://i.postimg.cc/ZqjsxPVW/Gedrosian-admixture.png

https://www.eupedia.com/europe/autosomal_maps_dodecad.shtml#Dodecad_K12b

[Guti]

Yes, right, ancient origins.

I am also on FTDNA Romany group and that's what they said about this specific subclade:

"As you see in the link the J-Y18402 tMRCA of 1000 years is just after the Romaní exodus from India or contemporary.

Those Nakho-Dagestanian came from the Kura-Araxes and Maikop trans-caucasian culture spreading north, from Dagestan on the Caspian sea, toward Grozni and then North of the present Sochi. I have seen your father's G25 scaled coordinates.

Your dad has more 'Middle Eastern' Persian roots (close to the southern parts of the Caspian Sea ), than the 'Middle Eastern' Anatolian/Ottoman roots.

I don't think that he had direct ancestors from the Northern Caucasus region. More from Persia/Caspian Sea, that's where the 'Caucasus-link' comes from.


https://i.postimg.cc/902b7J7R/roma-migration.jpg