Ancient admixtures from Lemmi's lab

[Lemminkäinen]

Usually admixtures consider Neolithic and Middle Eastern admixtures as one chunk. It is crazy, because no one can suggest that nothing came to Europe after the Neolithic era. It is difficult to determine how the qpAdm makes the split, but considering zero Middle Eastern proportion for Finns and Balts gives a hint that this could work.

Some disadvantages:

- available Russian study samples fit poorly to the Human Origin sample set used in most studies

- for some unknown reason Swedish HO samples fail to work with qpAdm, a twst showing genetic drift

https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEizCfksXQtAox9lpTYQN7jZ76ZFn7N55KEJeT6mPkx7dA YKtAwZymjNaRyhKkfw_frRbyYFG9o61zlvOJqMa3ZZ2zski_7T zx7mPc-BVrZfWdSjUsZnM2Cr56OvGyXHA0vdn9n6Xrl9ft8wUjoJnP2HW 88P2qGjtp_8N0cyMyfxL_zRMHdvolPy4Q/s16000/qpadm1.gif

https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEhZpaeGbKGVKWSYrM132r7TkDS42PqXoRV0LsW44ywE1j-fxQSUcQjU_ktB41SCERU0H8Sj1jUCtwaC-8x6FmcJbNk6uUZGDwXakLnm7IQzHJRA_S0fgn0gajQZ8r3Okcv WUucqgtbXIK9cbfSw-B8x5fIxw4ZUvHmqqm37jp53elERdaLp2Nx78A/s1117/qpadm2.gif

[Flashball]

Near East = natufian?

Sami have a lot of non european siberian.

[Lucas]

Usually admixtures consider Neolithic and Middle Eastern admixtures as one chunk. It is crazy, because no one can suggest that nothing came to Europe after the Neolithic era. It is difficult to determine how the qpAdm makes the split, but considering zero Middle Eastern proportion for Finns and Balts gives a hint that this could work.

]

Can you share dataset you used for qpadm?

[Lemminkäinen]

Can you share dataset you used for qpadm?

Yamnaya_Samara
LBK_EN
WHG
Nganasan
BedouinB


It could sound weird to use Bedouins representing Middle East, but Haak et. al 2015 used them in his comparable test (page 124 in his study). He used the most distant Bedouins, called them as BedouinB. He also used Nganasans. The reason use those modern populations is that we have no suitable ancient populations, especially representing the time era from ancient times to the present. Natufians are too old to be considered as a European migration source. BedouinB and Nganasans were chosen to have purest representatives. A drawback is that those groups naturally produce higher tail admixture, but at the same time higher certainty between proportions.

[Batman_]

ANF does not peak in middle eastern populations.

[Lemminkäinen]

ANF does not peak in middle eastern populations.

As I wrote, some studies assume that all ancient Near-Eastern admixture in Mediterranen area is from ANF, but it is not true.

[Batman_]

Most of it is ANF. We have Iron Age and Bronze Age samples that show this. https://reich.hms.harvard.edu/sites/reich.hms.harvard.edu/files/inline-files/8_25_2022_Manuscript1_ChalcolithicBronzeAge_1.pdf . Depends on what regions you are talking about. It peaks in South-East Europe and Italy where it is also found high in Iron Age samples. Some could of come during the Bronze Age and some Roman period etc.

Your model in the OP is not accurate, one can put anything into these.

[HectorOfTroy]

Not accurate. Sardinian is way to high on WHG, sardinians are mainly EEF/Anatolian farmer

[Lemminkäinen]

Haak et al:

French

Bedouin 8.1 (for Spaniards 18.5)
EN 56.6
Nganasan 3.6
WHG 0
Yamnaya 31.6

me:
Yamnaya 37.3
EN 34.8
WHG 10.5
Siberian 1.9
Bedouin 15.4

Many admixture tests get WHG around 10%, LBK around 50-60% for French, but they don't use Bedouins or any Middle-Easterners. You can't get it if you don't use it. My EN+Bedouin is 50.2. Most admixture tests are inaccurate because testers don't use Middle-East samples. Yeah, Haak el. al 2005 show

[Russki]

Lemminkäinen posted a spreadsheet where Swedes and Russians have the same amount of Siberian admixture?

No way.

I think the Finnish TA members are supposed to spread the myth that Russians are as Siberian-admixed as Finns themselves, if not more.

[Lemminkäinen]

Lemminkäinen posted a spreadsheet where Swedes and Russians have the same amount of Siberian admixture?

No way.

I think the Finnish TA members are supposed to spread the myth that Russians are as Siberian-admixed as Finns themselves, if not more.

I just wrote that Swedish data was invalid. Regarding Russians the Siberian admixture varies pretty much. Look at the spreadsheet twice. I also made clear that Russian studies use different snp set than the HO set, which can have effect on results.

For clarity sake, I don't think all the time about Russia and Russians. Very seldom actually