Most Powerful City

[SwordoftheVistula]

A local radio station advertises itself as 'the most powerful station in the most powerful city in the world'.

Got me to thinking. Is this true? Back in the 90s, woulda said New York has this title, maybe not so anymore.

Anyways, here's the nominees:

Washington, DC

New York City

London

Brussels (Seat of the EU)

Rome (Seat of the Roman Catholic Church)

Moscow

Beijing

Hong Kong


And no, you can't nominate your hometown or the capital of whatever tiny ass country you live in.

[Joe McCarthy]

It's premature to say Beijing, and financial power passed from London to NYC almost a century ago. That leaves NYC or DC as the default pick.

[Kadu]

Shangai deserves a place in that list, more so than Beijing IMO.

[Unurautare]

Rome is eternal. :<

[Comte Arnau]

No doubt about it. Controlling powers are still in Manhattan, we're seeing it even more obviously now.

[Sabinae]

"Powerful" is such a relative/subjective term... greatly depends on the aspects/domains you take into consideration.

[morski]

I believe the axis Rome, London, Washington DC rules supreme.

[Joe McCarthy]

Rome is eternal. :<

Yet it probably hasn't been the center of world power since the fall of the Empire.

[Joe McCarthy]

No doubt about it. Controlling powers are still in Manhattan, we're seeing it even more obviously now.

That's only if one assumes financial elites are more powerful than political and defense elites. DC is very arguably more important.

[beaver]

London - the center of the Universe now

[Hurrem sultana]

Washington

[Libertas]

Rome is eternal. :<

But powerless in the modern world excepting the Vatican City, actually independent of Rome, the seat of the Catholic Church.:)

[Peyrol]

Tel-Aviv

[Caeruleus]

Tel-Aviv :D ;) (Tribuno you are fast man) :)

[Oreka Bailoak]

Washington controls New York City.

[Joe McCarthy]

Tel Aviv - no financial power, and very little influence among most of the world's governments, unlike DC.

[beaver]

Tribuno you are fast man
Tribuno is a right smart man :D

[Unurautare]

But powerless in the modern world excepting the Vatican City, actually independent of Rome, the seat of the Catholic Church.:)

Think about it,it's the only city in the world to have had such a large and powerful empire named after it,hmm,even my country is named after it.
It may not be seen as "the most powerful" today(from whatever point of view) but it's still a very powerful symbol.

[Oreka Bailoak]

Tel-Aviv
I don't think Tel-Aviv has more power than the Israeli lobby in Washington which funds 50% of the American Democratic party and 25% of the American Republican party. That lobby is influential in immigration policy, political correctness, and Middle East foreign policy.

[Peyrol]

I don't think Tel-Aviv has more power than the Israeli lobby in Washington which funds 50% of the American Democratic party and 25% of the American Republican party. That lobby is influential in immigration policy, political correctness, and foreign policy.

American Jewish votes dems? :eek:

[Oreka Bailoak]

American Jewish votes dems?

Why is that surprising?

[Caeruleus]

Tribuno is a right smart man :D

we basically posted at the same time, he did it a few milliseconds earlier :)

Tel-Aviv as in the jews control the world, its zeee jewish conspiracy theory, AGAIN :) ... dont take stuff so seriously Joe ;)

[Joe McCarthy]

I don't think Tel-Aviv has more power than the Israeli lobby in Washington which funds 50% of the American Democratic party and 25% of the American Republican party. That lobby is influential in immigration policy, political correctness, and Middle East foreign policy.

The Israel lobby isn't involved in immigration policy. I think you mean to say Jews. In fact, AIPAC, the main Israeli lobby, is the purview of Jewish conservatives for the most part, not apt to support PC.

In any case, AIPAC isn't the most powerful lobby in the US, and of course Tel Aviv is not the most powerful city in the world. Even the US refuses to recognize Israeli acquisition of the Occupied Territories or recognize Jerusalem as Israel's capital.

[Svartálfar]

1)Bejing.
2)Tel-Aviv.
3)Zurich.
4)Mecca.
5)Bruxelles.

[Oreka Bailoak]

The Israel lobby isn't involved in immigration policy. I think you mean to say Jews. In fact, AIPAC, the main Israeli lobby, is the purview of Jewish conservatives for the most part, not apt to support PC.

In any case, AIPAC isn't the most powerful lobby in the US, and of course Tel Aviv is not the most powerful city in the world. Even the US refuses to recognize Israeli acquisition of the Occupied Territories or recognize Jerusalem as Israel's capital.

Very well said. I'm fairly certain that liberal Jewish interest groups were very important to our current immigration policy which is based on the Immigration and Nationality Act of 1965. Are you sure they had no influence? I can go check a book really quick if you're not sure.

[Peyrol]

Why is that surprising?

I believed they were split 50/50

[Oreka Bailoak]

I believed they were split 50/50
They've always been very strongly against many conservative ideas for the past 100 years in America (pro-immigration, pro-welfare spending, pro-bigger government size). Most of them were already very politically left (with a few being ultra-far left, Communists) when they came to America in the early 1900's.

[Joe McCarthy]

Very well said. I'm fairly certain that liberal Jewish interest groups were very important to our current immigration policy which is based on the Immigration and Nationality Act of 1965. Are you sure they had no influence? I can go check a book really quick if you're not sure.

Well, I should probably amend myself somewhat. There are very likely Jewish liberal lobbies that double both in lobbying on behalf of Israel and immigration, but the real Zionist lobbying power is with AIPAC, and they don't involve themselves in domestic policy in the US of any sort to my knowledge, and certainly not immigration except maybe as it pertains to Jewish refugees.

[beaver]

we basically posted at the same time, he did it a few milliseconds earlier

Tel-Aviv as in the jews control the world, its zeee jewish conspiracy theory, AGAIN ... dont take stuff so seriously Joe

In Tribuno's post was very funny to compare the avatar with the statement :D :thumb001:

[rhiannon]

In the West: London/NYC
In the East: Beijing/Tokyo

[ikki]

They've always been very strongly against many conservative ideas for the past 100 years in America (pro-immigration, pro-welfare spending, pro-bigger government size). Most of them were already very politically left (with a few being ultra-far left, Communists) when they came to America in the early 1900's.

communism and jews were synonymous. might have changed now that theres no more jewgold coming from the soviets. More like neo-commies now.. aka multicultists.

[beaver]

In the West: London/NYC
In the East: Beijing/Tokyo
The whole interest is to determine ONE current axe of the Globe. Its clear that NYC controls much more money and has more influence now. But London is still the center in minds over the world. We should talk in English finally (not in American :D).

[rhiannon]

The whole interest is to determine ONE current axe of the Globe. Its clear that NYC controls much more money and has more influence now. But London is still the center in minds over the world. We should talk in English finally (not in American :D).

I don't think there is only one. If forced to choose? I can't.

[beaver]

I don't think there is only one. If forced to choose? I can't.
if you dont want, lady...

[ikki]

no singapore?

[Treffie]

Probably London


London handled 31% of global currency transactions in 2005 — an average daily turnover of US$753 billion — with more US dollars traded in London than New York, and more Euros traded than in every other city in Europe combined

I've no idea what the figure is now

[Odoacer]

NYC, being the capital of U.S. media & finance, has considerable power over what transpires in DC. I think the edge is still with NYC.

[Joe McCarthy]

NYC, being the capital of U.S. media & finance, has considerable power over what transpires in DC. I think the edge is still with NYC.

It's a matter of whether one thinks media and finance trumps politics, defense, and intelligence.

[SwordoftheVistula]

American Jewish votes dems? :eek:


I believed they were split 50/50

It's about an 80-20 split, in favor of the Dems. Also, they supply about 70% of the money to Democrats.

As to Tel-Aviv, the Jews there are not the ones which are powerful on the world stage, it's the Jews in New York City and Washington DC.

Jewish interests were the main ones behind the 1965 immigration law changes, there's a thread or two around here somewhere about it, as it's not relevant to this topic.



3)Zurich.

As a financial city, it's smaller than London, New York, or Hong Kong.

Shanghai & Singapore I strongly considered, but did not list for the same reason.



4)Mecca.

That's a good suggestion, but they only use the city about once a year or so. Islamic clerical power is scattered around to a few other cities.


I also intended to include suburbs & other districts as part of the city. For example, the Vatican is clearly included in Rome from the initial post, and the US Defense Industry is actually headquartered in Arlington, Virginia across the river from Washington DC (Northrop Grumman, Boeing, General Dynamics, etc), this should be counted as part of Washington DC for the purposes of this poll. Also include Canterbury (seat of the Anglican/Episcopalian Church) as withing Greater London.



Tokyo

That's another one I strongly considered listing, but Japan has faded in strength since it's high point in the 80s & early 90s. There's not really any reason for considering them that you couldn't use as an even better case to consider Hong Kong or Beijing.



"Powerful" is such a relative/subjective term... greatly depends on the aspects/domains you take into consideration.

Yes, that's the reason for this poll. Is it the banks & media of New York? The politicians of Washington DC or Beijing? The religious power of Rome? Or a city like London or Moscow which combines all of the above but at a lesser level?

[Odoacer]

It's a matter of whether one thinks media and finance trumps politics, defense, and intelligence.

I wouldn't say it "trumps." But you have to finance politics, defense, & intelligence, & the media plays an important role in influencing public opinion of politicians & policies. Really I think NYC & DC can hardly be considered apart from one another.

[Lurker]

Yet it probably hasn't been the center of world power since the fall of the Empire.

Well, Rome was the seat of the papacy and the center of the catholic church, the most powerful institution in Medieval Europe (especially in Western Europe). Rome would be in the top 2 cities in power in Medieval Europe, losing (maybe) to Constantinople. I think Rome's loss of power actually came to be after the Protestant Reformation. One must remember, though, that even after the Reformation Rome was important in the world of arts, being the center of classicism and of several trends, like baroque, mannerism, etc. There's a reason why the only sister city to Paris is Rome and viceversa. So, in the end, Rome would lose more and more political power after the separation of the two Roman empires, but it'd still have spiritual and cultural power for quite some time.

Edit: I voted for NYC. The financial system and the media, in the end, own the political system. Look how the financial system is basically getting almost everything it wants from Europe, putting people from Goldman Sachs or ECB in power.

[Der Steinadler]

I would say Athens.

The west lives in its shadow.

[SwordoftheVistula]

I would say Athens.

The west lives in its shadow.

I'm hoping this is a troll post? Athens is the capital of a small country which is reliant on the rest of the EU for financial support to the point that more & more decisions on how the country is run come from the EU and not from Athens.

[Ouistreham]

The idea that specifically located directional centers would host a concentration of powers on definite spots of the world map is a concept from the era when the telegraph wasn't invented yet.

No Town Hall is needed in the Global Village.

[Der Steinadler]

I'm hoping this is a troll post? Athens is the capital of a small country which is reliant on the rest of the EU for financial support to the point that more & more decisions on how the country is run come from the EU and not from Athens.

no its not a troll post, unless you want to be.

point is, the west is built upon the philosophy of the Athenians.

that's its power.

[SwordoftheVistula]

We're talking today, not 2500 years ago.

[Der Steinadler]

it still applies.

western thought is Athenian.

[Peyrol]

Seriously:

EUROPE: Berlin/Paris
ASIA: Beijing/Tokyo
OCEANIA: Camberra
NORTH AMERICA: NYC/Washington
SOUTH AMERICA: Brasilia/Buenos Aires
AFRICA: Pretoria/Lagos

[Albion]

It's premature to say Beijing, and financial power passed from London to NYC almost a century ago. That leaves NYC or DC as the default pick.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Financial_centre#Global_Financial_Centres_Index
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&sid=af92ReNSibw4&refer=uk


I wouldn't base this on economics alone though. I actually began to wonder about New York, as a kid in the 90s all I heard about was New York this, New York that, now all I hear is about the cities in California.
Did something suddenly change or has it always been like that?

As global cities New York and London are rated at the top. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_city#GaWC_studies)
I'd personally go with London though, New York lacks its old worldy charms. :D :rolleyes:

[Joe McCarthy]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Financial_centre#Global_Financial_Centres_Index
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&sid=af92ReNSibw4&refer=uk


I wouldn't base this on economics alone though. I actually began to wonder abut New York, as a kid in the 90s all I heard about was New York this, New York that, now all I hear is about the cities in California.
Did something suddenly change or has it always been like that?

As global cities New York and London are rated at the top. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_city#GaWC_studies)
I'd personally go with London though, New York lacks its old worldy charms. :D :rolleyes:

Hmmm, that's interesting. One of those links even notes that NYC used to be the unchallenged financial capital of the world. Yet London has made a comeback.

I suppose it's only a matter of time now before we give up on this independence notion and rejoin the British Empire. :cool:

[SwordoftheVistula]

Berlin/Paris

Past their prime, and in at any rate clearly lesser than London or Moscow. Berlin isn't even the financial capital of Germany.


ASIA: Beijing/Tokyo

Tokyo also passed its prime, and has been eclipsed by Beijing, I think. Still, it seems to have gotten enough nominations that I probably should have listed it instead of Hong Kong.


OCEANIA: Camberra
SOUTH AMERICA: Brasilia/Buenos Aires
AFRICA: Pretoria/Lagos

Of regional significance, but of none on the world scale


the cities in California.


Also of regional significance, but not on the world scale. One exception, Los Angeles has Hollywood and much of the TV/entertainment industry, which would make them a strong contender for the top 5 in the world, but I don't think for the top spot. California's economic power (Silicon Valley) is fading, along with the state as a whole.

[Gaztelu]

One exception, Los Angeles has Hollywood and much of the TV/entertainment industry, which would make them a strong contender for the top 5 in the world, but I don't think for the top spot.

You forgot to mention the Ports of Los Angeles and Long Beach, which are 1st and 2nd busiest ports in the US and when combined, the 6th busiest port in the world.

When you put that into perspective, LA is very influential in the Pacific.

[SwordoftheVistula]

You forgot to mention the Ports of Los Angeles and Long Beach, which are 1st and 2nd busiest ports in the US and when combined, the 6th busiest port in the world.

When you put that into perspective, LA is very influential in the Pacific.

How much influence does that have on the world as a whole though? Finance, media, religion, and political control all have influence over large parts of the world. Rail/port hubs, not so much.

[Why so serious?]

How about Paris? No one seem to even notice France these days despite them being one of the main players in the EU.

[SwordoftheVistula]

How about Paris?


No one seem to even notice France these days despite them being one of the main players in the EU.

Thank you for answering your own question.

I did list Brussels for those who wished to vote the EU, but I think the reality is that no continental European city can compete with London and Moscow.

[Albion]

How about Paris? No one seem to even notice France these days despite them being one of the main players in the EU.

They do here, quite a few people pop over to Paris for a weekend or go to Northern France for a visit, it's quite common.
Paris is still seen as a "Global City" on a par with London by most English people I'd think.

[Gratis]

London? Please. It's New York.

Why is Rome on the list?

[SwordoftheVistula]

Paris is still seen as a "Global City" on a par with London by most English people I'd think.

But it's not a seat of world finance like London


Why is Rome on the list?

For people who think religion the most significant power, since it's the seat of the largest/most powerful church.

[Peyrol]

But it's not a seat of world finance like London



For people who think religion the most significant power, since it's the seat of the largest/most powerful church.

In this case, in the poll should be the option "Vatican City" and not Rome. The Vatican is not Rome and not a italian territory.

[Fenlander]

London: Financially, culturally and historically 'superior' to all. ;)

A Europe without London would look something like Syria. Over 83% of all European finances go through London.

[SwordoftheVistula]

In this case, in the poll should be the option "Vatican City" and not Rome. The Vatican is not Rome and not a italian territory.

It's within the city confines. I forgot to say in the OP, that the metro area, not just the city limits, is included. For example, the Pentagon, CIA, and other US intelligence & defense apparatus located in northern Virginia should be counted as 'Washington DC'


A Europe without London would look something like Syria. Over 83% of all European finances go through London.

But how does it compare on the world scale to New York and Beijing?

[safinator]

Most powerful city would probably go along with most poweful country so the obvious choice can't be aything but New York City, considering the finance elite especially have the headquarters there.

Washington has the white house and that's it.

[Linebacker]

Dubai

[morski]

Babylondon.

[Albion]

London. Capital of a major country and world's largest financial centre (75% of EU total). New York loses out because it isn't the seat of government.

[Graham]

London's too powerful. English ancestry in that city will be a small part of the city in future. All foreign. If anything, a curse.

[Albion]

London's too powerful. English ancestry in that city will be a small part of the city in future. All foreign. If anything, a curse.

Agreed. This is why I said before that an English parliament should be based in Winchester (the old capital) or somewhere more central and northern.

[zhaoyun]

Power is a hard term to quantify, naming the world's most powerful city is not an easy task. But I would take into account a wide variety of measures including the strength of cultural institutions, financial wealth, centrality of political and economic power (where decisions are made that influence the rest of the world), etc.

Usually the most powerful city in the world is in the most powerful nation in the world. Currently, that is the United States. I think the toss up is between New York and Washington DC. However, as DC is primarily just a seat of political power, it is really New York that is the overwhelmingly most powerful city in the US in economic, financial, and cultural terms. Therefore I chose New York.

The development of power is complicated and many institutions that are considered barometers of power take many decades and generations to form. For example, there is a good chance that China may overtake the US as the world's largest economy before 2020, but at that point, I still would not consider Shanghai a more powerful city than New York because China still lacks many of the cultural and financial institutions that can match New York in that area. However, it may be the case that in 40 years, Shanghai may replace New York as the most powerful city in the world. Though it's still too early to state so.

[Rædwald]

Vatican City

[Caismeachd]

I voted Moscow for the amount of billionaires.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/calebmelby/2012/03/16/moscow-beats-new-york-london-in-list-of-billionaire-cities/

[justme]

London... But I think New York City city steals the title only because it's more "business popular"

[KrashNick]

Komorani xD

[Kastrioti1443]

Laci City.... as soon as you get into this city inhabited by cavemen, you will loos either your life or your car.:D

[justme]

Politically Washington is the most powerful
Economically New York is the most powerful
Technology wise job wise Tokyo is most powerful
Influential/people power is London