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View Full Version : How much Bell Beaker DNA Iberians have?


Jingle Bell
02-21-2023, 04:56 PM
Like everybody know that in CA /BA the Bell Beaker tradicion were introduced in Iberia (Which was before just WHG + ENF, some individuals with 3% or less Taforalt)
But my question is how much they have? 40%? 60%?
Has some qpAdm or g25 model abt that



Ty
Gallop
02-21-2023, 04:58 PM
0% We are exclusively from the Iberian Peninsula and arrived by parachute from somewhere in outer space.
Beowulf
02-21-2023, 05:16 PM
https://www.exploreyourdna.com/calculateur/128/g25-bell-beaker-bronze-age-calculator-by-sb.htm

Target: Spanish
Distance: 1.0850% / 0.01085015 | ADC: 0.25x RC
32.0 Bell_Beaker_Iberia
17.6 ITA_Proto-Villanovan
14.6 Late_BronzeAge_England
14.2 Welsh_Bell_Beaker
8.4 HRV_EBA
6.0 GRC_Logkas_MBA
5.4 Levant_PPNB
1.8 MAR_Taforalt



me:

Target: Ivorix
Distance: 1.2110% / 0.01211037 | ADC: 0.25x RC
46.4 German_Bell_Beaker
24.0 Bell_Beaker_HUN
13.8 ITA_Proto-Villanovan
7.6 Bohemian_Late_Bronze_Age
4.6 MAR_Taforalt
2.6 Spanish_Late_Bronze_Age
1.0 Tumulus_Culture
Jingle Bell
02-21-2023, 05:23 PM
https://www.exploreyourdna.com/calculateur/128/g25-bell-beaker-bronze-age-calculator-by-sb.htm

Target: Spanish
Distance: 1.0850% / 0.01085015 | ADC: 0.25x RC
32.0 Bell_Beaker_Iberia
17.6 ITA_Proto-Villanovan
14.6 Late_BronzeAge_England
14.2 Welsh_Bell_Beaker
8.4 HRV_EBA
6.0 GRC_Logkas_MBA
5.4 Levant_PPNB
1.8 MAR_Taforalt



me:

Target: Ivorix
Distance: 1.2110% / 0.01211037 | ADC: 0.25x RC
46.4 German_Bell_Beaker
24.0 Bell_Beaker_HUN
13.8 ITA_Proto-Villanovan
7.6 Bohemian_Late_Bronze_Age
4.6 MAR_Taforalt
2.6 Spanish_Late_Bronze_Age
1.0 Tumulus_Culture

Idk looks like they are overlaping, have a model with just EEF, Bell Beaker, Taforalt & Natufian/Iran N?
Beowulf
02-21-2023, 05:27 PM
Idk looks like they are overlaping, have a model with just EEF, Bell Beaker, Taforalt & Natufian/Iran N?

i could try to do one rn
Beowulf
02-21-2023, 05:33 PM
Idk looks like they are overlaping, have a model with just EEF, Bell Beaker, Taforalt & Natufian/Iran N?

me:

Target: Ivorix
Distance: 1.6771% / 0.01677097
72.4 Bell_Beaker
23.4 TUR_Barcin_N
3.4 MAR_Taforalt
0.8 IRN_Shahr_I_Sokhta_BA2_I8728



Spanish:

Target: Spanish
Distance: 1.7817% / 0.01781688
70.4 Bell_Beaker
26.6 TUR_Barcin_N
3.0 MAR_Taforalt


with corded ware and Baltic_HG included:

Target: Spanish_and_Portuguese
Distance: 1.7817% / 0.01781688
70.4 Bell_Beaker
26.6 TUR_Barcin_N
3.0 MAR_Taforalt
doesn't change

me:

Target: Ivorix
Distance: 1.5149% / 0.01514861
67.6 Bell_Beaker
24.4 TUR_Barcin_N
3.2 Balto_Slavic_HG
3.2 MAR_Taforalt
1.4 IRN_Shahr_I_Sokhta_BA2_I8728
0.2 ETH_4500BP

seems that average Iberian is very Bell Beaker



Balto_Slavic_HG,0.134333930510026,0.14662594494550 3,0.144817420900241,0.109365591188951,0.1178176056 07788,0.035669640710542,0.027085641692321,0.038257 115775023,0.040288960753807,-0.037243767767701,0.003563796472252,-0.037518699625593,0.075612647241867,0.102935027431 567,-0.071574435460521,-0.012685564214993,0.018290155112738,0.000105099068 142,-0.000949748373409,-0.002705448889259,0.001174264190032,-0.012436118662118,0.00941657033031,-0.060439542083368,0.007960075988019

Corded_Ware,0.1253507,0.10915866,0.056808809,0.089 148191,0.0044132128,0.033087128,0.0037300426,0.000 56465957,-0.028402702,-0.041441191,-0.0014857447,0.00009887234,-0.0056111064,-0.014620191,0.026595404,0.0083559362,-0.0093626809,0.0014421702,-0.0005696383,0.0058938085,0.0016965106,0.003409553 2,0.0045051064,0.015449404,-0.0021528511

Bell_Beaker,0.1265229,0.1325213,0.0590877,0.044193 6,0.0381485,0.0140513,0.0027846,0.0032261,0.006109 2,0.0059698,-0.0025635,0.0052943,-0.0143048,-0.0130118,0.0165,0.0078349,0.0003837,0.0029519,0.0 005835,0.0053108,0.006311,0.0020447,-0.0022681,0.0001815,0.0001687

TUR_Barcin_N,0.1175998,0.180118,0.0035312,-0.101158,0.0510443,-0.0483875,-0.0043582,-0.0069334,0.0362287,0.0807473,0.0079718,0.0118803,-0.0234545,0.0004691,-0.0419807,-0.0101913,0.0233091,0.0019866,0.0136954,-0.0097489,-0.0142249,0.0057723,-0.0041232,-0.0031658,-0.0043437
TUR_Tepecik_Ciftlik_N,0.108701,0.1731478,-0.0143308,-0.100534,0.0270818,-0.0402298,-0.0045828,-0.005019,0.02623,0.05745,0.008444,0.0080555,-0.0101832,0.0052298,-0.0352192,-0.0104748,0.0088662,0.0004432,0.005342,-0.0032828,0.0026827,0.0044515,-0.0071795,-0.0038258,-0.0045805
BRA_LapaDoSanto_9600BP,0.050765,-0.3095332,0.1206032,0.098515,-0.1156522,-0.017626,-0.284645,-0.3400012,-0.0136212,-0.0184422,0.002241,-0.003267,0.0004162,0.017478,-0.0065688,0.0064438,0.006493,-0.001267,0.0026898,0.003727,-0.0010482,0.007963,-0.002662,-0.0043378,0.001413
Dinka,-0.577083,0.0507765,-0.0003773,-0.0075098,-0.0053855,-0.0016735,-0.0176848,0.0204222,0.081145,-0.0969495,-0.02107,0.022742,-0.0383172,-0.0011698,0.0101452,-0.021347,0.0186125,-0.0094382,0.0241968,-0.0241678,0.002402,0.003308,0.001479,0.0009038,0.0 096995
ETH_4500BP,-0.511066,0.043668,0.000754,0.000969,-0.00277,-0.011435,0.050997,-0.045229,0.089172,-0.087838,-0.012991,-0.002997,-0.031219,0.000688,0.02158,-0.029965,0.027772,0.039273,0.00176,-0.009004,0.000374,0.006183,-0.003451,-0.00241,-0.000838
Gambian,-0.6064875,0.0671942,0.0197362,0.0114665,0.0021028, 0.0055777,-0.0358392,0.0387677,-0.0317353,0.0241463,0.0054132,-0.0036467,0.0162287,-0.0009865,0.011016,-0.0153362,0.009692,-0.0011823,-0.002116,-0.0032307,-0.001643,-0.0018137,0.0043958,-0.0001005,0.001377
Han,0.0206952,-0.4507105,-0.0082967,-0.0651579,0.0780846,0.0374475,0.0029055,-0.004804,-0.0150232,-0.0031146,-0.0495875,-0.0070573,0.0072707,-0.0081072,-0.0043305,0.0012535,0.0017542,-0.0008638,-0.0020455,-0.0102206,0.0122397,0.0069582,0.0141063,-0.0012925,-0.0022315
IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N,0.0430252,0.0664158,-0.1550722,0.0047158,-0.122669,0.0235384,0.017109,-0.0011998,-0.082546,-0.0544158,-0.0028258,-0.0016186,0.0044896,-0.0062756,0.0316498,0.0561384,-0.0054242,0.0068664,0.0136508,-0.0334162,0.00856,-0.028836,-0.0110678,-0.039331,0.0222254
IRN_Shahr_I_Sokhta_BA2_I8728,0.033009,-0.081242,-0.184789,0.125325,-0.09848,0.06777,0.002585,0.007615,0.03661,0.02606,-0.002273,0.010041,-0.005798,0.006744,0.004479,0.001326,0.008605,0.001 267,0.00352,0.001376,0.003743,-0.004946,-0.00037,-0.00253,-0.007305
Kura-Araxes_ARM_Kaps,0.1013025,0.133034,-0.07071,-0.043605,-0.0498555,-0.0092035,0.008108,-0.011653,-0.066368,-0.01631,0.0030855,0.011015,-0.019846,0.005849,0.0042075,-0.0102095,-0.0001305,-0.003927,-0.001697,0.0032515,0.003494,-0.000247,-0.0036975,-0.0090975,-0.0030535
Levant_PPNB,0.072847,0.1639064,-0.0316026,-0.1361132,0.0332986,-0.0645352,-0.0134426,-0.0147684,0.0741604,0.03601,0.0188046,-0.0150764,0.035738,0.0025596,-0.0217696,0.006099,0.0098048,-0.0013176,-0.0047264,0.0188088,-0.001797,0.0071472,0.0008872,-0.0056874,-0.0037602
MAR_Taforalt,-0.189857,0.0814452,-0.0242866,-0.085595,0.027636,-0.0552202,-0.0705968,0.0184146,0.155397,0.003499,0.0209156,-0.0318316,0.0747168,-0.0513334,0.0711988,-0.0363032,0.0052676,-0.066106,-0.1424162,0.0389938,-0.0376836,-0.1255322,0.0730118,-0.0137606,0.0164534
Nganassan,0.0476917,-0.4066181,0.1557885,0.0023902,-0.1594452,-0.0882129,0.0285066,0.0433367,0.0310876,0.0128477, 0.1028569,0.0094115,-0.0040734,-0.0261619,-0.0219731,-0.0123307,-0.0010952,0.0134165,0.0268365,-0.0008505,0.0431363,-0.0118954,0.0336096,0.0003977,0.0135556
Yoruba,-0.6300625,0.0625011,0.022113,0.0167079,0.0005035,0 .0124741,-0.044417,0.0477673,-0.0488813,0.0327694,0.0046205,0.0007904,0.0230561, 0.0009509,0.0125232,-0.0096067,0.0070763,0.0004491,0.006022,-0.00299,0.0015542,0.0023156,-0.0017592,-0.0004711,-0.0004246


Spanish,0.1167516,0.1468214,0.0423019,0.0004833,0. 0449001,-0.0013727,-0.001644,0.0018936,0.0233905,0.0323268,-0.0032129,0.0079422,-0.0151961,-0.0126213,0.0096531,0.0005964,-0.0027105,-0.0000932,-0.0020745,-0.0016142,0.0037468,-0.000729,-0.002501,-0.0030021,0.000449
Beowulf
02-21-2023, 05:41 PM
sorry i forgot to add the EFF


Western_EEF,0.12952109,0.17219559,0.05244315,-0.040698,0.082976975,-0.02126535,-0.0032655,-0.00173535,0.061416787,0.0918165,-0.001299125,0.01541125,-0.02989,-0.016560725,-0.011451312,-0.003651625,0.0054354625,0.0024651875,0.0023489125 ,-0.0034729125,0.0092000625,0.000973725,-0.014676838,-0.02819435,0.0001496

Target: Spanish_and_Portuguese
Distance: 1.3818% / 0.01381807
58.8 Bell_Beaker
29.6 Western_EEF
7.0 Levant_PPNB
3.2 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
1.4 MAR_Taforalt


me:
Target: Ivorix
Distance: 1.9747% / 0.01974724
62.0 Bell_Beaker
21.2 Western_EEF
9.4 Levant_PPNB
2.4 Balto_Slavic_HG
2.2 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
1.2 IRN_Shahr_I_Sokhta_BA2_I8728
Marshall Theodore
02-21-2023, 05:45 PM
0% We are exclusively from the Iberian Peninsula and arrived by parachute from somewhere in outer space.

https://www.theapricity.com/forum/image.php?u=23708&dateline=1676857821
Jingle Bell
02-21-2023, 05:48 PM
sorry i forgot to add the EFF


Western_EEF,0.12952109,0.17219559,0.05244315,-0.040698,0.082976975,-0.02126535,-0.0032655,-0.00173535,0.061416787,0.0918165,-0.001299125,0.01541125,-0.02989,-0.016560725,-0.011451312,-0.003651625,0.0054354625,0.0024651875,0.0023489125 ,-0.0034729125,0.0092000625,0.000973725,-0.014676838,-0.02819435,0.0001496

Target: Spanish_and_Portuguese
Distance: 1.3818% / 0.01381807
58.8 Bell_Beaker
29.6 Western_EEF
7.0 Levant_PPNB
3.2 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
1.4 MAR_Taforalt


me:
Target: Ivorix
Distance: 1.9747% / 0.01974724
62.0 Bell_Beaker
21.2 Western_EEF
9.4 Levant_PPNB
2.4 Balto_Slavic_HG
2.2 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
1.2 IRN_Shahr_I_Sokhta_BA2_I8728

Tysm, Levant and Iran N must be from Romans, interestingly iberians do score some CHG & Natufian related in this model but dont in standart model, i wonder why
Gallop
02-21-2023, 06:44 PM
Te he dado permiso para publicar mi Avatar? Bórralo!

xd
DraviXi99
02-21-2023, 07:02 PM
Like everybody know that in CA /BA the Bell Beaker tradicion were introduced in Iberia (Which was before just WHG + ENF, some individuals with 3% or less Taforalt)
But my question is how much they have? 40%? 60%?
Has some qpAdm or g25 model abt that



Ty

60%
Petalpusher
02-21-2023, 07:16 PM
It's a hard question to answer for any population. First wich BB exactly, and beakers were already a mix within European context, an earlier Yamnaya like population or CW (themselves a composite) that merged with some local middle late neolithic cultures. Different models will give...different answers. Probably the best indicator would be the ANE in general, because it wasn't in Iberia before the Bronze age (or very very low level). CHG or EHG either but they are, in and of itself ancient basal + ANE and WHG + ANE.
Gallop
02-21-2023, 07:21 PM
Target: Spanish
Distance: 1.0641% / 0.01064050
44.0 Bell_Beaker
29.2 Western_EEF
11.4 TUR_Tepecik_Ciftlik_N
10.4 Corded_Ware
2.6 MAR_Taforalt
2.4 Kura-Araxes_ARM_Kaps

Target: Gallop_scaled
Distance: 1.9874% / 0.01987434
45.4 Bell_Beaker
35.4 Western_EEF
9.0 Kura-Araxes_ARM_Kaps
5.2 Corded_Ware
4.0 MAR_Taforalt
1.0 ETH_4500BP

Target: Father_scaled
Distance: 2.2485% / 0.02248521
38.4 Bell_Beaker
30.4 Western_EEF
11.2 Corded_Ware
5.2 TUR_Tepecik_Ciftlik_N
4.2 MAR_Taforalt
4.0 Kura-Araxes_ARM_Kaps
3.4 TUR_Barcin_N
1.8 Balto_Slavic_HG
1.4 Gambian



Distance to: Spanish
0.06321860 Bell_Beaker
0.10544151 Western_EEF

Distance to: Gallop_scaled
0.06763464 Bell_Beaker
0.11008196 Western_EEF

Distance to: Father_scaled
0.06985071 Bell_Beaker
0.11128051 Western_EEF
Jingle Bell
02-21-2023, 07:35 PM
I found some models with qpAdm in that article:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6436108/

https://imgur.com/a/XinVp5A

So East Iberia IA can be modeled as 40% - 50% Bell Beaker + 40% - 50% Iberian EEF (CA)

North Iberians (Celtiberian) can be modeled as 55% - 65% Bell Beaker + 35% - 45% Iberian CA

SW Iberia IA (Tartesso) can be modeled also as 40% - 50% Bell Beaker

Since modern Iberians have some Greco-Roman and NA but at the same time have more "Celt related" DNA than the Iberians from IA my estimative its abt 45% - 60%, what u guys think?
Looks like g25 also agree with qpAdm
Jingle Bell
02-21-2023, 07:48 PM
sorry i forgot to add the EFF


Western_EEF,0.12952109,0.17219559,0.05244315,-0.040698,0.082976975,-0.02126535,-0.0032655,-0.00173535,0.061416787,0.0918165,-0.001299125,0.01541125,-0.02989,-0.016560725,-0.011451312,-0.003651625,0.0054354625,0.0024651875,0.0023489125 ,-0.0034729125,0.0092000625,0.000973725,-0.014676838,-0.02819435,0.0001496

Target: Spanish_and_Portuguese
Distance: 1.3818% / 0.01381807
58.8 Bell_Beaker
29.6 Western_EEF
7.0 Levant_PPNB
3.2 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
1.4 MAR_Taforalt


me:
Target: Ivorix
Distance: 1.9747% / 0.01974724
62.0 Bell_Beaker
21.2 Western_EEF
9.4 Levant_PPNB
2.4 Balto_Slavic_HG
2.2 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
1.2 IRN_Shahr_I_Sokhta_BA2_I8728

Looks like ur model its right, must be around 60% or 50% by what Iberian IA get in qpAdm, u must score Balt + some more BBC bcs ur English
Great job!

I also tried hehe


Target: JingleBell_scaled
Distance: 1.6718% / 0.01671790
39.2 Yoruba
25.2 Western_EEF
14.6 Corded_Ware
6.2 Levant_PPNB
4.6 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
4.0 Gambian
2.6 ETH_4500BP
2.4 BRA_LapaDoSanto_9600BP
1.2 MAR_Taforalt

Corded Ware never was in iberia so i take off to see, also added a Serfadi sample:


Target: JingleBell_scaled
Distance: 1.7237% / 0.01723671
42.0 Yoruba
19.4 Bell_Beaker
16.8 Western_EEF
10.6 Libyan_Jew
3.2 ETH_4500BP
3.0 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
2.6 BRA_LapaDoSanto_9600BP
1.0 Levant_PPNB
1.0 MAR_Taforalt
0.4 Gambian

20% Bell Beaker, looks ok, if i am 40% Christian Iberian thats means if i were 100% C. Iberian i would be abt 50% Bell Beaker, looks right