North-Western French phenotypes.

[Beraud]

A collection of pictures of natives from the Sarthe department, in North-Western France, part of the historical province of Maine, bordering Brittany to the West and Normandy to the North.

117566 117577
117567 117578
117568 117579
117569 117580
117570 117571117572 117573
117574 117575
117576

[Jingle Bell]

Mainly Alpine & Atlantid/N. Atlantid, some dinariced

[Oliver109]

Alpine, dinarid influenced types, Nordic influenced types, they look pretty British on the whole but that might be the styling at the time which funnily enough was more similar to the UK than it is today.

[Beraud]

117581 117582
117583 117584
117585 117586
117587 117588
117589 117590
117591 117592
117593 117594
117595

[Beraud]

117596 117597
117598 117599
117600 117601
117602 117603
117604 117605
117606 117607
117608 117609
117610

[Beraud]

117611 117612
117613 117614
117615 117616
117617 117618
117619 117620
117621 117622
117623 117624
117625

[Beraud]

117626 117627
117628 117629
117630 117631
117632 117633
117634 117635
117636 117637
117638 117639
117640



That's it for now, but I will continue posting on this thread later because I have hundreds more.

[Oliver109]

Thanks, keep em coming, anyway i would say there are quite a few atlanto brunns, atlantids, some eastern looking types too i.e Balkan/Polish

[CordedWhelp]

Kinda like somewhat more Dinarid/Central euro-influenced Brits, at least a good amount of them.

[Beraud]

Alpine, dinarid influenced types, Nordic influenced types, they look pretty British on the whole but that might be the styling at the time which funnily enough was more similar to the UK than it is today.

Yes, the similarity with the British is what comes to mind first, but overall they look rather French, mostly Alpine and Atlantid-derived.

[Beraud]

Thanks, keep em coming, anyway i would say there are quite a few atlanto brunns, atlantids, some eastern looking types too i.e Balkan/Polish

My pleasure.
Could you specify which ones look more atlantid, and which ones look more eastern ? That would help since I'm still kinda new to this taxonomy stuff and I've got a lot to learn.

[Oliver109]

My pleasure.
Could you specify which ones look more atlantid, and which ones look more eastern ? That would help since I'm still kinda new to this taxonomy stuff and I've got a lot to learn.

I would say these are the more eastern looking ones, most of the rest look quite English
https://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=117586&d=1677081615&thumb=1
https://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=117603&d=1677082123&thumb=1
https://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=117607&d=1677082230&thumb=1
https://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=117611&d=1677082359&thumb=1
https://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=117618&d=1677082518&thumb=1
https://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=117626&d=1677082725&thumb=1

[Beowulf]

this is a bit off topic but do u think my paternal great great grandfather could pass in NW France?

he was spanish but had French ancestry from NW (Brittany as i know)

https://i.postimg.cc/28YcgRRC/IMG-20230215-WA0002-2.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[Oliver109]

this is a bit off topic but do u think my paternal great great grandfather could pass in NW France?

he was spanish but had French ancestry from NW (Brittany as i know)

https://i.postimg.cc/28YcgRRC/IMG-20230215-WA0002-2.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

I think he would fit right in but hard to tell with an ancient photo

[Beraud]

Bump

[Beraud]

this is a bit off topic but do u think my paternal great great grandfather could pass in NW France?

he was spanish but had French ancestry from NW (Brittany as i know)

https://i.postimg.cc/28YcgRRC/IMG-20230215-WA0002-2.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

Yes he could easily pass in NW France, even looks native from the region

[Immanenz]

Yes he could easily pass in NW France, even looks native from the region

He looks Gracile Med like Bernardo Silva- more SW Europe, but Gracile Meds exist evn in borderline NW Europe (Luxenbourg, Belgium etc.)

[aherne]

I don't find them especially similar to brits. There is a lot more Alpine and Med, while Germanic influence is minimal. They look like what they are: a mix of ENF survivors and proto-Kelts (an element shared with Brits), as most ethnic French. Head shapes have changed since then: as people became dramatically taller, long heads became once again dominant. Modern French are mostly "Atlantid"/"North Atlantid"

[Oliver109]

I don't find them especially similar to brits. There is a lot more Alpine and Med, while Germanic influence is minimal. They look like what they are: a mix of ENF survivors and proto-Kelts (an element shared with Brits), as most ethnic French. Head shapes have changed since then: as people became dramatically taller, long heads became once again dominant. Modern French are mostly "Atlantid"/"North Atlantid"

I see a lot of overlap which is obviously to be expected, i would say 20% look completely British, another 50% look passable in the UK and the rest look totally foreign.

[Beraud]

I don't find them especially similar to brits. There is a lot more Alpine and Med, while Germanic influence is minimal. They look like what they are: a mix of ENF survivors and proto-Kelts (an element shared with Brits), as most ethnic French. Head shapes have changed since then: as people became dramatically taller, long heads became once again dominant. Modern French are mostly "Atlantid"/"North Atlantid"


"ENF survivors" doesn't mean anything. Natives of northern France are a mixture of Around 12% Western Hunter Gatherer, 38 to 44% Western Steppe Herder and 42 to 50% Early European Farmer, similar to the Iron Age Gauls of the region.

[Beraud]

I don't find them especially similar to brits. There is a lot more Alpine and Med, while Germanic influence is minimal. They look like what they are: a mix of ENF survivors and proto-Kelts (an element shared with Brits), as most ethnic French. Head shapes have changed since then: as people became dramatically taller, long heads became once again dominant. Modern French are mostly "Atlantid"/"North Atlantid"


Claiming ethnic French people are a mixture of "ENF survivors" and "proto-Kelts" is fantasy. This is not how ancient population genetics works. Besides, British people themselves show Alpine and Med influence in their phenotype.

[Boudin]

Composite of the first post:
https://i.imgur.com/EEu6Tso.png

[aherne]

"ENF survivors" doesn't mean anything. Natives of northern France are a mixture of Around 12% Western Hunter Gatherer, 38 to 44% Western Steppe Herder and 42 to 50% Early European Farmer, similar to the Iron Age Gauls of the region.

Early Europen Farmer came from Near East, hence lots of overlap with other populations across the Mediterranean. Based on my personal observations, I think these genetic estimates are spot on (this time), reflecting into the phenotypes of ALL (not just Northern) French

[Flashball]

Very good thread.

I wonder if the similarity with some English face can be explained by the influx of Middle Age French contributions (43% on average in the South East of England) and endogamy.

[Beraud]

Early Europen Farmer came from Near East, hence lots of overlap with other populations across the Mediterranean. Based on my personal observations, I think these genetic estimates are spot on (this time), reflecting into the phenotypes of ALL (not just Northern) French

You cannot compare them with modern Middle Easterners.
Early European Farmer aka Anatolian Farmers were radically different from modern Middle Eastern people and were primarily descended from Anatolian Hunter Gatherers. Modern Middle Easterners have a lot of Neolithic Levantine and Iranian Neolithic admixture, which the original Anatolian Farmers did not have.

[Beraud]

Very good thread.

I wonder if the similarity with some English face can be explained by the influx of Middle Age French contributions (43% on average in the South East of England) and endogamy.


It definitely can.

[Jingle Bell]

"ENF survivors" doesn't mean anything. Natives of northern France are a mixture of Around 12% Western Hunter Gatherer, 38 to 44% Western Steppe Herder and 42 to 50% Early European Farmer, similar to the Iron Age Gauls of the region.

They are 42% - 50% Early Anatolian Farmer, EEF's are 25% 15% WHG
NW Frenchs are even more North Shifted than Gauls (40% Steppe) vs (44% Steppe) prob from extra Germanic Iron Age admix from Roman times

[Beraud]

117696 117697
117698 117699
117700 117701
117702 117703
117704 117705
117706 117707
117708 117709
117710

[Beraud]

117711 117712
117713 117714
117715 117716
117717 117718
117719 117720
117721 117722
117723 117724
117725

[Beraud]

117726 117727
117728 117729
117730 117731
117732 117733
117734 117735
117736 117737
117738 117739
117740

[Beraud]

117793 117794
117795 117796
117797 117798
117799 117800
117801 117802
117803 117804
117805 117806
117807

[Beraud]

117808 117809
117810 117811
117812 117813
117814 117815
117816 117817
117818 117819
117820 117821
117822

[Beraud]

118018 118019
118020 118021
118022 118023
118024 118025
118026 118027
118028 118029
118030 118031
118032

[Beraud]

118033 118034
118035 118036
118037 118038
118039 118040
118041 118042

[aherne]

"ENF survivors" doesn't mean anything. Natives of northern France are a mixture of Around 12% Western Hunter Gatherer, 38 to 44% Western Steppe Herder and 42 to 50% Early European Farmer, similar to the Iron Age Gauls of the region.

ENF survivors originating 8-9 thousand years ago from Anatolia and Near East (bringing pan-Mediterannean phenotypes: Med, Alpine, Dinaric, very common in ethnic French along with Keltic Nordid). Here genetic results fit those of racial anthropology

[Flashball]

ENF survivors originating 8-9 thousand years ago from Anatolia and Near East (bringing pan-Mediterannean phenotypes: Med, Alpine, Dinaric, very common in ethnic French along with Keltic Nordid). Here genetic results fit those of racial anthropology

Outdate. Stop your autism.

Med = non-european face

They looks what they are: white (and no, maghrebi are not white), nothing exotic, very western euro face.

Your racial classification is outdated: you have to read genetic studies from 2023
This is what is science, you know.

[Oliver109]

Outdate. Stop your autism.

Med = non-european face

They looks what they are: white (and no, maghrebi are not white), nothing exotic, very western euro face.

Your racial classification is outdated: you have to read genetic studies from 2023
This is what is science, you know.

Some alpines from France look non European though, pass in Caucasus, Afghanistan.