Croatian Illustrative DNA results

[Jana]

Neat! My results :

middle ages
https://i.imgur.com/En9VpRO.png

migration period
https://i.imgur.com/wWvVH8E.png

iron age
https://i.imgur.com/jy21omy.png

bronze age
https://i.imgur.com/S9sFt0z.png

[Jana]

Used my AncestryDNA raw data file which has excellent quality, and here are my new coords:


Feiichy_scaled,0.132035,0.132019,0.054682,0.027455 ,0.036622,0.013945,0.012691,0.006461,-0.001841,-0.004374,-0.005521,0,0,0.012386,-0.008415,0.012066,0.025034,-0.000507,0.007668,0.003502,0.000624,-0.008037,0.001849,-0.009881,0.000239

[Jana]

https://i.imgur.com/qUI3bKT.png

https://i.imgur.com/zCDNnB8.png

[Beowulf]

Looks nice, congrats!

[Dušan]

Congratulations on results. :)

[Dušan]

Can you go on section Customizable Ancient Ancestry, choose 5 populations from all selected samples, and post that result?

[Jana]

Can you go on section Customizable Ancient Ancestry, choose 5 populations from all selected samples, and post that result?

:o

https://i.imgur.com/VcYMmVz.png

for some reason I get Sardinian/Italy with 5 and full sheet, but when I remove it it looks lot more neat.

[Jana]

closest modern populations, Bosniak Croatia? xD

https://i.imgur.com/HNMwlyl.png

[Beowulf]

Used my AncestryDNA raw data file which has excellent quality, and here are my new coords:


Feiichy_scaled,0.132035,0.132019,0.054682,0.027455 ,0.036622,0.013945,0.012691,0.006461,-0.001841,-0.004374,-0.005521,0,0,0.012386,-0.008415,0.012066,0.025034,-0.000507,0.007668,0.003502,0.000624,-0.008037,0.001849,-0.009881,0.000239

Looks very nice!


Distance to: Feiichy_scaled
0.03253029 Balkan:Croatian
0.03339061 Balkan:Slovenian
0.03525402 Germanic_People_of_CentralEurope:Austrian
0.03599566 Carpathian_Basin:Slovakian
0.03654590 Carpathian_Basin:Hungarian
0.03944133 Balkan:Serbian
0.04257270 Central_Europe:Czech
0.04530301 Balkan:Romanian
0.04577383 East_Europe:Ukrainian_West
0.04708768 Germanic_People_of_CentralEurope:German
0.05060264 Central_Europe:Polish
0.05248519 Balkan:Bulgarian
0.05348857 East_Europe:Russian_West
0.05467566 France:French_North
0.05607887 Germanic_People_of_CentralEurope:Swiss_German
0.05811087 East_Europe:Ukrainian_East
0.06209148 Scandinavia:Danish
0.06209986 Scandinavia:Swedish
0.06273017 France:French_Central
0.06684000 Great_Britain_Ireland:Orcadian
0.06733409 Great_Britain_Ireland:English
0.06767230 Scandinavia:Norwegian
0.06804916 East_Europe:Belarusian
0.06817769 Italy:Italian_North
0.07030572 Great_Britain_Ireland:Irish

https://www.exploreyourdna.com/calculateur/96/globe-58-calculator-gergo-marosvari.htm

You could use your new coordinates in exploreyourdna.com :)

[Jana]

https://i.imgur.com/sE4xe9x.png

https://i.imgur.com/lqTm1sn.png

[rothaer]

migration period
https://i.imgur.com/wWvVH8E.png


Is "Europe (Balkans)" and "Western Balkans" selected by you manually? Could you post the name of the references usaed by Davidski here?

I could then put it together as an "Illustrative Migration Period Western Balkans G25 calculator scaled" usable in Vahaduo.

[Jana]

Is "Europe (Balkans)" and "Western Balkans" selected by you manually?

Nope. I got it automatically.


Could you post the name of the references usaed by Davidski here?

Yes. :)

https://i.imgur.com/5EbrST9.png

[Duke]

its either that, or the samples form Roman Illyria were actually Romans taken as Illirian for sample.
Lets say Romans brought thier own culture there, and the samples were take from culturally roman graves.

There is no sense that Illyrans samples cluster with Tuscans or Latinum, since by the Roman historians, they were different people.
So this genetic test can be completely skewed by the wrong classification of samples.

[Dušan]

Nope. I got it automatically.


I put mine in global.
With West Balkans is higher distance, it is even closer distance if I choose East Balkans, instead West Balkans.

[Jana]

its either that, or the samples form Roman Illyria were actually Romans taken as Illirian for sample.
Lets say Romans brought thier own culture there, and the samples were take from culturally roman graves.

They were genetically mixed origin samples of both local northern Illyrians and Eastern Roman soldiers.


There is no sense that Illyrans samples cluster with Tuscans or Latinum, since by the Roman historians, they were different people.
So thise genetic test can be completely skewed by the wrong classification of samples.

You can see that in Iron Age breakdown I get 45% pure northern Illyrian proper, those are samples that were unmixed and shifted towards Celts even.

[Jana]

I put mine in global.
With West Balkans is higher distance, it is even closer distance if I choose East Balkans, instead West Balkans.

yes, interesting. Did you check Bosniensis results thread? He is more like you than like me, but with lower Slavic than you.
I think I perhaps have very high Illyrian/West Balkan input because of my Dalmatian islander origins. But I'm not sure.

[Jana]

...

it would be cool to see your results, and that you get real coords :P

[Duke]

They were genetically mixed origin samples of both local northern Illyrians and Eastern Roman soldiers.



You can see that in Iron Age breakdown I get 45% pure northern Illyrian proper, those are samples that were unmixed and shifted towards Celts even.

Thing is, if certain type of burial culture was assumed as Illyrian, while in fact it was Roman, even those shifted could be just half Romans, who were culturally Roman.

Romans described Illyrians as physically different, visually, so its rather slim chance they were identical to Romans

[Duke]

it would be cool to see your results, and that you get real coords :P

yeah, ill get around to do that, I am Capricorn, so its all slow going for me i guess :D

[Jana]

Thing is, if certain type of burial culture was assumed as Illyrian, while in fact it was Roman, even those shifted could be just half Romans, who were culturally Roman.

Romans described Illyrians as physically different, visually, so its rather slim chance they were identical to Romans

thing is, Iron Age Illyrians and Imperial Romans were easy to distinguish genetically, they are not similar at all. These samples called Roman Illyria are mostly from late antiquity and early medieval Croatia and they plot between Illyrians and late Romans, just like it's explained. They are basically linguistically and genetically Romanized Dalmatians and Panonnians.

[Dušan]

thing is, Iron Age Illyrians and Imperial Romans were easy to distinguish genetically, they are not similar at all. These samples called Roman Illyria are mostly from late antiquity and early medieval Croatia and they plot between Illyrians and late Romans, just like it's explained. They are basically linguistically and genetically Romanized Dalmatians and Panonnians.

The Romans massively colonized Illyriа with the population of the Eastern Balkans and Anatolia.

I got very nice fit with Roman Illyria samples, but very bad with iron age pre-Roman Illyrians.

[Jana]

The Romans massively colonized Illyriа with the population of the Eastern Balkans and Anatolia.

I got very nice fit with Roman Illyria samples, but very bad with iron age pre-Roman Illyrians.

Indeed, that's what description says - a notable shift towards east med.

I must admit I'm very proud to score massive unaltered IA Illyrian too as I feel it's rare even among Croats. I wonder where I got it from as I consistently get highest Illyrian score among Balkan Slavs :p

[Voskos]

The Romans massively colonized Illyriа with the population of the Eastern Balkans and Anatolia.

I got very nice fit with Roman Illyria samples, but very bad with iron age pre-Roman Illyrians.

Yes I've read in a book that they sold thousands of indigenous people as slaves in Italy/Rome for example among natives in Epirus.

[Dušan]

Yes I've read in a book that they sold thousands of indigenous people as slaves in Italy/Rome for example among natives in Epirus.

Seems there were various migrations all over the empire, often by force.

From genetic point of view, it makes interesting to study pre-Slavic part of genes of modern Balkan Slavs.

[Vitez]

Do you guys think that the region (here West Balkan for us) is more important than the distance in the Periodical Breakdown?
For example if I put North Italy I get a better distance.

[Jana]

Do you guys think that the region (here West Balkan for us) is more important than the distance in the Periodical Breakdown?
For example if I put North Italy I get a better distance.

Idk as I didn't adjust any settings, this is what I got.

[Jana]

I tried manually switching mode to global and I get completely same results.

[Tenn]

Thing is, if certain type of burial culture was assumed as Illyrian, while in fact it was Roman, even those shifted could be just half Romans, who were culturally Roman.

Romans described Illyrians as physically different, visually, so its rather slim chance they were identical to Romans

Those samples are local Balkan populations that can be modelled as Iron Age Balkan + Roman Imperial. This can be seen by their Y-DNA too like E-V13, R1b, J2b2.

I am not sure about the Iron Age results. But It doesn't make sense why southern Balkan populations would get that much more Anatolian. This could be automatically due to the fact that Northern Balkan populations have more Slavic and possibly lack of other ancient samples.

[Tenn]

The Romans massively colonized Illyriа with the population of the Eastern Balkans and Anatolia.

I got very nice fit with Roman Illyria samples, but very bad with iron age pre-Roman Illyrians.

I got good fit with IA Illyrian samples too. Even using samples in Croatia. It's actually Roman samples that give me less native Balkan and more Slavic because these samples are south of me. And there was a shift towards the east. While people who get less IA/BA usually get good fit with Roman dated samples.

As for Romans massively colonizing Illyria with Eastern Balkans and Anatolia, I am not sure about massively. There was an Illyrian revolt against the Romans and many of the tribes were killed off https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bellum_Batonianum

Illyrians weren't the only ones who revolted. Nor the only ones who served the Roman Empire.

[Dušan]

As for Romans massively colonizing Illyria with Eastern Balkans and Anatolia, I am not sure about massively. There was an Illyrian revolt against the Romans and many of the tribes were killed off https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bellum_Batonianum

Illyrians weren't the only ones who revolted. Nor the only ones who served the Roman Empire.

Most of Ilyricum was deserted because of wars with Romans, and then Romans settled Thracians and Anatolians into Illyricum.

[calxpal]

Cool! Do you think the results are good and intersting?

[Jana]

Cool! Do you think the results are good and intersting?

Yes, absolutely. Best thing I did.

[Tenn]

N]




There is obviously something that is wrong with these results.


Look at the Roman Illyria you score (35%), your Iron Age ancestry should be much less than that and not 45%. That calculator uses only samples from the Western Balkans and automatically assigns that and of course a fit of 2+ isn't that good.


You should barely have 25% ancestry from the Iron Age population that lived in Croatia. Also you have other type of foreign ancestry.



Thought I'd comment on this since you commented in my thread :)

[Jana]

There is obviously something that is wrong with these results.

There's nothing wrong with them.


Look at the Roman Illyria you score (35%), your Iron Age ancestry should be much less than that and not 45%.

No. Early Slavs were notably more southern shifted than Balto-Slavic Baltic bronze age samples used for Iron Age, thus some southern stuff went into them.


That calculator uses only samples from the Western Balkans and automatically assigns that and of course a fit of 2+ isn't that good.

No. I get same results in global mode. Fit over 2 is normal for ancient samples.


You should barely have 25% ancestry from the Iron Age population that lived in Croatia. Also you have other type of foreign ancestry.

I sense envy.


Thought I'd comment on this since you commented in my thread :)

Still coping with the fact some Slavs got more Iron age Illyrian than you?

xD

Cheers honey.

[Tenn]

Similarity map to Iron Age Croatia with modern populations:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FWrBlXEXgAEsbXI.jpg:large

[Duke]

Similarity map to Iron Age Croatia with modern populations:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FWrBlXEXgAEsbXI.jpg:large

So basically cisalpine gauls

Problem comes with sampling, we could assume a grave culture samples were taken from were Illyrain, but they weren't.
This can give wrong conclusions

[Tenn]

Someone like you is obviously not 45% Iron Age Illyrian. That is literally what some Albanians get when including other samples. About 35%-45% of the Albanian Y-DNA comes from these populations, one could expect something similar in autosomal. For South Slavs the autosomal DNA should be much less.


Post-Roman ancestry or South-East Euro ancestry simply shifted you southwards towards these samples. Just like that Serv obviously is not 60% Illyrian because that's not what the Balkans looked like when Slavs arrived.



Have a nice day!

[Far_away]

Someone like you is obviously not 45% Iron Age Illyrian. That is literally what some Albanians get when including other samples. About 35%-45% of the Albanian Y-DNA comes from these populations, one could expect something similar in autosomal. For South Slavs the autosomal DNA should be much less.


Post-Roman ancestry or South-East Euro ancestry simply shifted you southwards towards these samples. Just like that Serv obviously is not 60% Illyrian because that's not what the Balkans looked like when Slavs arrived.



Have a nice day!

https://i.ibb.co/LDyQPFC/steamuserimages-a-akamaihd.jpg

[Jana]

https://i.ibb.co/LDyQPFC/steamuserimages-a-akamaihd.jpg

Ignore him, he's disturbed diaspora nationalist from Norway who already had at least 50 accounts banned here.

[Jana]

So basically cisalpine gauls

Problem comes with sampling, we could assume a grave culture samples were taken from were Illyrain, but they weren't.
This can give wrong conclusions

Most of Croatian Iron age samples come from Japodi, but there were single Liburnian and Histrian plus Delmatae samples too.
Their overlap with La Tene Celts is huge

all these Illyrians were pretty homogenous but Japodi were even more northern shifted than average. It was always epeculated they had contacts with Celts, although apparently Celts never settled there permanently.

[Wend-Kruzek]

:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes: Is a Far away --- Slav???

[Jana]

:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes: Is a Far away --- Slav???

Yes, he is a Serb.

[Wend-Kruzek]

I'm not sure;);)

[Jana]

I'm not sure;);)

Serbs are usually half Slavic half Balkan. Some are more Slavic than that, some less. Anyway, all Slavs have early Slavic admixture.

[Wend-Kruzek]

He probably doesn't. :D:D

[Jana]

He probably doesn't. :D:D

you like trolling? Don't. Besides that, this is thread a bout my results.

[Solitelj pameti]

How you made it for yourself ?

[Jana]

How you made it for yourself ?

uploaded raw data file and paid cash

[Wend-Kruzek]

you like trolling? Don't. Besides that, this is thread a bout my results.
Sorry. I did not mean it.
-far away- Haplogroup did not move from the Balkans. / I-A13912/
And
I also have Illustrative DNA, I should not original G25 .They were making some changes now. I have changed my results.:coffee:
My great grandfather /Krajčirovič/ was Croatian - escape from the Turks 16th. There are still villages in Slovakia where you can speak Croatian.

Nice Day

[Nausevar]

Sorry. I did not mean it.
-far away- Haplogroup did not move from the Balkans. / I-A13912/
It's a subclade of I-PH908 that originated in western Ukraine 2000 years ago and moved to the balkans some 1400-1500 years ago. It was brought by slavic speakers.

[Varda]

Sorry. I did not mean it.
-far away- Haplogroup did not move from the Balkans. / I-A13912/
And
I also have Illustrative DNA, I should not original G25 .They were making some changes now. I have changed my results.:coffee:
My great grandfather /Krajčirovič/ was Croatian - escape from the Turks 16th. There are still villages in Slovakia where you can speak Croatian.

Nice Day

Those are leftovers of real Croatians who speak medieval Croatian language. Present day Croatians are mostly croatized Catholic Serbs plus some other croatized ethnicities, and they speak Serbian with some non-Serbian decorations.

[Varda]

Those are leftovers of real Croatians who speak medieval Croatian language. Present day Croatians are mostly croatized Catholic Serbs plus some other croatized ethnicities, and they speak Serbian with some non-Serbian decorations.

Every video of Croatian TV from Burgenland has a subtitle. Because present day Croatians from Croatia don't understand Burgenland Croatians xD https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burgenland_Croats

[Jana]

every thread Varda blesses with its presence turns into crap. xD

:bullshit: :bullshit: :bullshit:

[rothaer]

My great grandfather /Krajčirovič/ was Croatian - escape from the Turks 16th.

Makes about 150 years per generation. :cheer_icoon:

[Wend-Kruzek]

Makes about 150 years per generation. :cheer_icoon:

Sorry. I do not understand.
My great grandfather died in 1914 WW1 in Russia-and his ancestors came to Hungary ...!!!
And who does the calculations for the generation on 150y????!!!! explain!!!!
I have a family tree of about 1700./ M.Theresia -regulation registers/-
It should be even better in Germany. Yes-Or not?

I wish you a nice and successful day

[Wend-Kruzek]

Every video of Croatian TV from Burgenland has a subtitle. Because present day Croatians from Croatia don't understand Burgenland Croatians xD https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burgenland_Croats

Varda-Varda
Don't worry. They definitely understand.:)
You probably haven't heard of a Slovak from the east. :picard1:They would have to translate every second word.:picard1:
The funny thing is that the Croatian language is very close to the Serbian language. So I understand too. Not everything but...Mi smo samo blizo . Zdravo lipo, Bok

Aequitas et libertas

I wish you a nice and successful day

[Wend-Kruzek]

It's a subclade of I-PH908 that originated in western Ukraine 2000 years ago and moved to the balkans some 1400-1500 years ago. It was brought by slavic speakers.

Yes, I read it, but I wouldn't comment on it yet.It is not confirmed. See you in the Future:thumb001:

well thank you.

[rothaer]

Sorry. I do not understand.
My great grandfather died in 1914 WW1 in Russia-and his ancestors came to Hungary ...!!!
And who does the calculations for the generation on 150y????!!!! explain!!!!
I have a family tree of about 1700./ M.Theresia -regulation registers/-
It should be even better in Germany. Yes-Or not?

I wish you a nice and successful day

You stated:

"My great grandfather /Krajčirovič/ was Croatian - escape from the Turks 16th."

Now, if one of your four great-grandfathers was Croatian and escaped from the Turks in the 16th century, say abt. 1550, then this was abt. 450 years ago. A great-grandfather is three generations back from you so that would make 450 / 3 = 150 years per generation. ;) So he did, of course, not escape from the Turks in the 16th century.

What is a regulation register in German, can you tell? I can not relate to what the translator gives me.

[cakmir7y]

You stated:

"My great grandfather /Krajčirovič/ was Croatian - escape from the Turks 16th."

Now, if one of your four great-grandfathers was Croatian and escaped from the Turks in the 16th century, say abt. 1550, then this was abt. 450 years ago. A great-grandfather is three generations back from you so that would make 450 / 3 = 150 years per generation. ;) So he did, of course, not escape from the Turks in the 16th century.\

What is a regulation register in German, can you tell? I can not relate to what the translator gives me.

Provided we speak about Hungary, it could be "Das theresianische Urbar von 1767".

[Wend-Kruzek]

You stated:

"My great grandfather /Krajčirovič/ was Croatian - escape from the Turks 16th."

Now, if one of your four great-grandfathers was Croatian and escaped from the Turks in the 16th century, say abt. 1550, then this was abt. 450 years ago. A great-grandfather is three generations back from you so that would make 450 / 3 = 150 years per generation. ;) So he did, of course, not escape from the Turks in the 16th century.

What is a regulation register in German, can you tell? I can not relate to what the translator gives me.

""""""You must reeeeeed. !!!!!!!!!

Sorry. I do not understand.
My great grandfather died in 1914 WW1 in Russia-and his ancestors came to Hungary ...!!!
And who does the calculations for the generation on 150y????!!!! explain!!!!
I have a family tree of about 1700./ M.Theresia -regulation registers/-
It should be even better in Germany. Yes-Or not?"""""""

I wrote that his ancestors!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Wend-Kruzek]

Provided we speak about Hungary, it could be "Das theresianische Urbar von 1767".

correction below

[Wend-Kruzek]

Provided we speak about Hungary, it could be "Das theresianische Urbar von 1767".

No , sorry My mistake.:picard1: I mean as a Slovak and writing stupi.......
I meant M.Theresia Reforms - Regulations- Regula, obligations to record baptism, maried , death.- MATRICA /register/
- Hungarian records are available on familysearch.

Have nice day

[Voskos]

Target: Feiichy_scaled
Distance: 2.4824% / 0.02482430
55.2 Baltic_EST_MA
31.6 Mediterranean:GRC_Koufonisi_Cycladic_EBA
12.8 Celto-Germanic:IRL_Eyrephort_VA
0.4 HUN_early_Avar_leader

[Wend-Kruzek]

Rothaer-----Sorrry , my fault:picard1:. I read the communication. I forgot that in English- we must define a person. and other things- as The -and a / it is not in Slovak language/

Now we leave it to the original Croatians.
Bok.