Why and from where do I get so much Nordic/Germanic in my results?

[djipon]

I'm sorry for making a separate topic about it, but I really can't find the answer to that. In my two-way mixed mode on IllustrativeDNA most of my results are Balkan + Greek (as my great-great grandfather was a Greek emigrant). However, I get lots of other combinations that are Germanic/Nordic + Greek, which I really don't get... On the three-way mixed mode I have Germanic or Nordic on every single combination. Is it a misread for Slavic?

https://i.postimg.cc/sXLKMSzQ/t1.png
https://i.postimg.cc/23RwwDVC/t3.png
https://i.postimg.cc/3r4QnFdq/t4.png

Here are some of the three way combinations (but as I said, almost all combinations are similar, so I've chosen random ones):

https://i.postimg.cc/PJ8yYxf6/t2.png
https://i.postimg.cc/TYnMX2jq/t5.png
https://i.postimg.cc/pVwb75jL/t6.png
https://i.postimg.cc/3x7MrMnM/t7.png

I have no Germanic on the Periodic Ancestry Breakdown for the Middle Ages. I'm using the automatic Balkans -> Eastern Balkans region preset.

https://i.postimg.cc/52mh6PRX/t8.png

I don't know if I should used Global and Global, as it says it should be only used by people with Mixed ancestry... But where is the line for "mixed"? My great-great grandfather was Greek - is that recent enough for me to use the Global region? When I do use it, the Nordic dna finally appears as a significant chunk of the breakdown.

https://i.postimg.cc/N0fWT13p/t9.png

I'd be more than happy if you help me interpret the results and why I get them. Thank you in advance!

[Scandal]

Some of these calculators are just "fun calculators". I'm most familiar with Eurogenes K13 (I consider it most reliable), it shows you are average Bulgarian without any Germanic https://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?381644-Autosomal-results-as-Bulgarian-(MyHeritage-familytreeDNA-livingDNA-gedmatch-mytrueancestry)&p=7908775&viewfull=1#post7908775

[djipon]

Some of these calculators are just "fun calculators". I'm most familiar with Eurogenes K13 (I consider it most reliable), it shows you are average Bulgarian without any Germanic https://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?381644-Autosomal-results-as-Bulgarian-(MyHeritage-familytreeDNA-livingDNA-gedmatch-mytrueancestry)&p=7908775&viewfull=1#post7908775


Any chance it detects some kind of traces from before? The Greek group I belong to on MyHeritage was concentrated in Southern France before moving to Greece in the following centuries

https://i.postimg.cc/rpgDc0Rv/image.png

And the Romanian one begins from Germany

https://i.postimg.cc/y88dj6bj/image.png

[JerryS.]

Try a model with modern individuals.

[Scandal]

Any chance it detects some kind of traces from before? The Greek group I belong to on MyHeritage was concentrated in Southern France before moving to Greece in the following centuries
.....
You're getting lost in the "DNA test hell" which means you take many different tests / upload your raw data to many different websites and pay attention to every little detail (these things are often gimmicky).

You're genetically average Bulgarian, Eurogenes k13 shows that.

I find Eurogenes k13 to be a highly trustworthy calculator, if you're a European person, that calculators identifies your ethnicity more accurately than commercial DNA tests like Myheritage and 23andme. According to Myheritage I'm 7.5% Welsh/Scottish/Irish, but I have no such ancestry, I am genetically normal Hungarian, in fact in reality I am more eastern than average Hungarian so I am not western shifted in any way despite Myheritage giving the "cool" Scottish result.

[Scandal]

You get those "Nordic admixtures" on illustrative dna mixed mode because you it gives you Greek. Your DNA is not Greek, so it tries to compensate Greek with something very Northern (Bulgarians are genetically more Northern European than Greeks). It's a false result. Single population sharing represent who you are better, you are only 1/16 Greek according to your pedigree. You have "boring" Bulgarian results: mix of native Balkanites and Slav invaders from North.

[djipon]

Try a model with modern individuals.

Like which one?

[Far_away]

What is your modern results?
Global mode is not for us, you are getting Germanic and Baltic just like me getting France and Baltic, it should be just Slavic. Balkan mode ��

[djipon]

What is your modern results?
Global mode is not for us, you are getting Germanic and Baltic just like me getting France and Baltic, it should be just Slavic. Balkan mode ��

These are the modern results, or if you were asking for another section, let me know

https://i.postimg.cc/Y00NvdD7/12.png

[JerryS.]

Like which one?

There's one here about 2 pages back using TA members with G25. It's not an ideal source but there are some Greek/Balkan people as well as eastern Europe.

https://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?328135-G25-Modeling-ancestry-with-TA-members

[djipon]

There's one here about 2 pages back using TA members with G25. It's not an ideal source but there are some Greek/Balkan people as well as eastern Europe.

https://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?328135-G25-Modeling-ancestry-with-TA-members

Distance to: djipon_scaled
0.03003095 Vojnik_scaled(Macedonian)
0.03352485 Vale_scaled(Macedonian)
0.03483749 alexmegas(Romanian)_scaled
0.03525361 Fellow(Moldova/Romania)_scaled
0.03769242 Vasil(Macedonian)_scaled
0.03849993 Bosniensis_scaled(Bosnia)
0.03867117 IrisSelene_scaled(Romanian/Bulgarian/Hungarian/Croatmix)
0.04077184 Martin_scaled(¾Macedonian/¼Serbian)
0.04316282 Enr1989(Italy)_scaled
0.04364654 Feiichy_Grandaunt(German/Serbo-Greek)
0.04462649 Imre(1/4Dutch)_scaled
0.04498149 VASILIKI_scaled(Greece)
0.04623778 Nurzat(Ukrainian/Romanian)
0.04877114 someonenotyou(Hungarian)
0.04921738 DacoCeltic(Irish/Romanian)_scaled
0.04990205 Stears_scaled(Hungarian)
0.05254938 Mr.G_dad_scaled(Hun)
0.05298374 VFlumina(Italy)_scaled
0.05353069 Mr.G_scaled(Hun/DE)
0.05471712 Hrvoje(Croat/Slovenian)
0.05798951 Feiichy_Mother(Croat/German/Serb/Greek)
0.05806653 ImreMother(Hungarian)_scaled
0.05980577 Dunai_scaled(Hungarian)
0.06023013 Feiichy_Father(Croat)
0.06137588 Feiichy_scaled(Croat)

Target: djipon_scaled
Distance: 1.9066% / 0.01906613
31.8 IrisSelene_scaled(Romanian/Bulgarian/Hungarian/Croatmix)
31.4 Claudia_scaled(Italy)
15.2 Stears_scaled(Hungarian)
8.4 Martin_scaled(¾Macedonian/¼Serbian)
5.8 CelestiaSis_scaled(American)
3.8 Vale_scaled(Macedonian)
2.2 PeterskiLD_scaled(Poland)
1.2 Abriekman(Poland/Jewish)_scaled
0.2 VASILIKI_scaled(Greece)

[protos]

Your results will vary depending on DNA company. That's because they test different parts of your genome. In fact, unless you do WGS test you won't get completely accurate results.

I'll show you how my results compare.

This is my 23 and me when I added it in Illustrative DNA (Ancient Population Mixed Mode - Iron Age):
https://i.ibb.co/dJWC0WV/23andme.png

This is combined top 5 DNA companies results:
https://i.ibb.co/GvxYTBx/combined.png

This is with whom I actually share genes (uploaded VCF file with 95% SNP coverage on sequencing.com) today:
https://i.ibb.co/4ZX17y3/map.png

And actual genetic distance:
https://i.ibb.co/FmTxcFV/gen-dist.png

[Solitude]

Basically you re mix between Farmers and Steppes when a calc pull a sample with high farmer and low steppe this calc will compensate lack of steppe from sample with high farmer choosing a sample with high steppe, run your coords in a ancient calc like bronze age when you will get always a mix farmer and steppes

[djipon]

Your results will vary depending on DNA company. That's because they test different parts of your genome. In fact, unless you do WGS test you won't get completely accurate results.

I'll show you how my results compare.

This is my 23 and me when I added it in Illustrative DNA (Ancient Population Mixed Mode - Iron Age):
https://i.ibb.co/dJWC0WV/23andme.png

This is combined top 5 DNA companies results:
https://i.ibb.co/GvxYTBx/combined.png

This is with whom I actually share genes (uploaded VCF file with 95% SNP coverage on sequencing.com) today:
https://i.ibb.co/4ZX17y3/map.png

And actual genetic distance:
https://i.ibb.co/FmTxcFV/gen-dist.png

So which one of the two Iron Age comparisons would you consider more accurate? Or you wouldn't consider anything accurate at all

[protos]

So which one of the two Iron Age comparisons would you consider more accurate? Or you wouldn't consider anything accurate at all

My deeper origins are mostly from Macedonia so for sure that one with Greeks (combined one).

[djipon]

My deeper origins are mostly from Macedonia so for sure that one with Greeks (combined one).

I find these the most accurate of the lot... Though, to be honest, I feel more and more confused, the more I go deeper

https://i.postimg.cc/g2fdBVM4/image.png

These' number is pretty low in the list and fit not so good as the others, but I find them plausible, because the Greek samples are closer to some Jewish samples. I got 2% Ashkenazi on familytreeDNA, so idk if I should consider these kinds of little details when making my conclusions for now.

https://i.postimg.cc/vHkpQQWZ/image.png
https://i.postimg.cc/Z5zV708p/image.png

The three way mixed makes no sense to me whatsoever, because there is literally no combination between three that doesn't contain Nordic, Viking or Russian Nordic

https://i.postimg.cc/sfZLTFFF/image.png

[JerryS.]

Distance to: djipon_scaled
0.03003095 Vojnik_scaled(Macedonian)
0.03352485 Vale_scaled(Macedonian)
0.03483749 alexmegas(Romanian)_scaled
0.03525361 Fellow(Moldova/Romania)_scaled
0.03769242 Vasil(Macedonian)_scaled
0.03849993 Bosniensis_scaled(Bosnia)
0.03867117 IrisSelene_scaled(Romanian/Bulgarian/Hungarian/Croatmix)
0.04077184 Martin_scaled(¾Macedonian/¼Serbian)
0.04316282 Enr1989(Italy)_scaled
0.04364654 Feiichy_Grandaunt(German/Serbo-Greek)
0.04462649 Imre(1/4Dutch)_scaled
0.04498149 VASILIKI_scaled(Greece)
0.04623778 Nurzat(Ukrainian/Romanian)
0.04877114 someonenotyou(Hungarian)
0.04921738 DacoCeltic(Irish/Romanian)_scaled
0.04990205 Stears_scaled(Hungarian)
0.05254938 Mr.G_dad_scaled(Hun)
0.05298374 VFlumina(Italy)_scaled
0.05353069 Mr.G_scaled(Hun/DE)
0.05471712 Hrvoje(Croat/Slovenian)
0.05798951 Feiichy_Mother(Croat/German/Serb/Greek)
0.05806653 ImreMother(Hungarian)_scaled
0.05980577 Dunai_scaled(Hungarian)
0.06023013 Feiichy_Father(Croat)
0.06137588 Feiichy_scaled(Croat)

Target: djipon_scaled
Distance: 1.9066% / 0.01906613
31.8 IrisSelene_scaled(Romanian/Bulgarian/Hungarian/Croatmix)
31.4 Claudia_scaled(Italy)
15.2 Stears_scaled(Hungarian)
8.4 Martin_scaled(¾Macedonian/¼Serbian)
5.8 CelestiaSis_scaled(American)
3.8 Vale_scaled(Macedonian)
2.2 PeterskiLD_scaled(Poland)
1.2 Abriekman(Poland/Jewish)_scaled
0.2 VASILIKI_scaled(Greece)

As you can see with modern individuals the Nordic Germanic is gone.

[djipon]

As you can see with modern individuals the Nordic Germanic is gone.

Yeah, so I guess I shouldn't consider the Three Way fits in illustrative at all.

[protos]

I find these the most accurate of the lot... Though, to be honest, I feel more and more confused, the more I go deeper

https://i.postimg.cc/g2fdBVM4/image.png

These' number is pretty low in the list and fit not so good as the others, but I find them plausible, because the Greek samples are closer to some Jewish samples. I got 2% Ashkenazi on familytreeDNA, so idk if I should consider these kinds of little details when making my conclusions for now.

https://i.postimg.cc/vHkpQQWZ/image.png
https://i.postimg.cc/Z5zV708p/image.png

The three way mixed makes no sense to me whatsoever, because there is literally no combination between three that doesn't contain Nordic, Viking or Russian Nordic

https://i.postimg.cc/sfZLTFFF/image.png

Well one of your parents is Bulgarian and other is Greek, so having post-Medieval Syrmia (Serb) and Anatolian Greek is surely a good description for you. Also if I am not mistaken this medieval Greek mainlander is Greek Vlach, they have less Mediterranean and more Balkan admix, which you probably don't have (assuming that your Greek parent is not from Epirus or Thessaly).

Also, I know that Greeks will be angry at me but I'll say it anyway, it shows how huge population exchange in Greece occurred historically. The Greeks of classical city states are virtually gone from Greece, and newly Hellenized Anatolians/Levantines repopulated coastal Greek cities during Roman/Byzantine era.

[djipon]

Well one of your parents is Bulgarian and other is Greek, so having post-Medieval Syrmia (Serb) and Anatolian Greek is surely a good description for you. Also if I am not mistaken this medieval Greek mainlander is Greek Vlach, they have less Mediterranean and more Balkan admix, which you probably don't have (assuming that your Greek parent is not from Epirus or Thessaly).

More like two Bulgarian parents and one of them having Greek ancestors on one side, but I got your point :)

[protos]

More like two Bulgarian parents and one of them having Greek ancestors on one side, but I got your point :)

My medieval looks like this:
https://i.ibb.co/0f3BhBW/medieval.png

[djipon]

My medieval looks like this:
https://i.ibb.co/0f3BhBW/medieval.png

It's going to turn out you are more Bulgarian than me :D I don't even get the Bitola and Ryahovets samples in the mixed mode, which are closest to nowadays Bulgarians.

https://i.postimg.cc/tJX2qcgk/image.png

[protos]

It's going to turn out you are more Bulgarian than me :D I don't even get the Bitola and Ryahovets samples in the mixed mode, which are closest to nowadays Bulgarians.

https://i.postimg.cc/tJX2qcgk/image.png

My closest modern:
https://i.ibb.co/mSNVkDs/modern.png

and ancient populations:
https://i.ibb.co/h2vBLh6/ancient.png

So I think you're still closer to Bulgarians :)

[djipon]

My closest modern:
https://i.ibb.co/mSNVkDs/modern.png

and ancient populations:
https://i.ibb.co/h2vBLh6/ancient.png

So I think you're still closer to Bulgarians :)

I am almost equaly far from both Bulgarians and Macedonians (I won't get into the topic if they are different or not), but you are still closer to them xd even to the nowadays Bulgarian population.

https://i.postimg.cc/1tRW0txP/image.png

[protos]

I am almost equaly far from both Bulgarians and Macedonians (I won't get into the topic if they are different or not), but you are still closer to them xd even to the nowadays Bulgarian population.

https://i.postimg.cc/1tRW0txP/image.png

As I said, my deeper ancestry is from Macedonia (area around Ohrid and Struga), plus a bit of southeastern Serbia (near Nis), and very distant Hungarian (possibly a Cuman) ancestor. It makes sense I'm closer to Bulgaria given that one of your parent has their family origins from Greece

[Solitude]

There's one here about 2 pages back using TA members with G25. It's not an ideal source but there are some Greek/Balkan people as well as eastern Europe.

https://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?328135-G25-Modeling-ancestry-with-TA-members

Jerry can you help me to intrepret my result with modern individuals from this calc above, is with my real coords , i added my mixed compatibility samples , without them calc can't run

Target: NightmareCity_scaled
Distance: 1.5142% / 0.01514175
37.2 Erronkari(Basque/Argentinian)
23.0 Bantu-West
20.2 Cole(British)_scaled
10.6 Nassbean(Morocco)_scaled
5.2 Amerindian
3.2 Native_Brazilian
0.6 Claudia_scaled(Italy)

Target: NightmareCity_scaled
Distance: 1.8448% / 0.01844849 | R5P | ADC: 0.25x RC
39.0 Erronkari(Basque/Argentinian)
23.8 SSA
19.0 Cole(British)_scaled
10.2 Nassbean(Morocco)_scaled
8.0 Amerindian

[djipon]

As I said, my deeper ancestry is from Macedonia (area around Ohrid and Struga), plus a bit of southeastern Serbia (near Nis), and very distant Hungarian (possibly a Cuman) ancestor. It makes sense I'm closer to Bulgaria given that one of your parent has their family origins from Greece

Do you wan't to compare GEDmatch kits? I wonder if we share common ancestor

[Dušan]

It's going to turn out you are more Bulgarian than me :D I don't even get the Bitola and Ryahovets samples in the mixed mode, which are closest to nowadays Bulgarians.


Bitola sample is closest to modern Romanians and Serbs.

https://i.imgur.com/7VXOz2v.png



I got it as closest of all ancient samples.

https://i.imgur.com/pYYZ5Hj.png

[djipon]

Bitola sample is closest to modern Romanians and Serbs.

https://i.imgur.com/7VXOz2v.png



I got it as closest of all ancient samples.

https://i.imgur.com/pYYZ5Hj.png

What I meant was that these samples are the closest I can get to as Bulgarian in illustrativeDNA (let me know if there are other samples), and protos was still closer than me.

[djipon]

Btw, can someone tell me which is the best calculator for Thracian, Dacian, Paenonian comparison?

[protos]

Do you wan't to compare GEDmatch kits? I wonder if we share common ancestor

Sent you a PM

[protos]

Bitola sample is closest to modern Romanians and Serbs.

https://i.imgur.com/7VXOz2v.png



I got it as closest of all ancient samples.

https://i.imgur.com/pYYZ5Hj.png

Yeah, I'm not so close to Medieval Bitola Slavs (4.549), or Medieval Ryahovets Slavs (4.190). I am closest to Iron Age samples from Balkans, then Roman and post-Roman central and north Italy (Turin/Tarquinia/Rome), Roman Balkans, and Hunyadi family. Basically every sample related to pre-Slavic Balkans and northern Italy is closer to me than Slavic samples. Even Pannonian Celts and Colonial Spaniards samples come closer (well actually not closer to Ryahovets and Bitola Slavs, but closer to Doclea Slavs).