Marcus Aurelius' "Meditations"

[Gooding]

I just got this book from B&N today and it's an extremely good read from my POV.So, how could we, today, live our lives according to the dictates of Nature, to accept life as it is and to use it as an opportunity to grow individually and as a people?My daughter told my wife and I today that she didn't believe in God and we told her that we agree with her.Why focus on a fantasy when we've got a whole natural world to venerate and a whole mythic literature that makes the world look that much more interesting?I told Kiersten that my gods and goddesses personify for me the Powers of Nature and help me to understand our ancestors, which are also family, a little bit more.Can I prove or disprove anything?Not at all and it's quite all right.Who needs to know everything?This is a really good book.:thumb001:

[Osweo]

Good man, I'm persuaded and downloading it now! :)

[Gooding]

I hope that you enjoy the book, Oswiu. :) It definitely provides food for thought.

[Cato]

Marcus Aurelius, like all Stoics (ancient and modern), believed in the laws of nature- the eternal laws of Zeus (or divine providence). The Stoics never took the existence of Zeus (God) for granted; Stoic philosophy is predicated upon the existence of God, they regarded themselves as his children and they trained themselves to cling to the good and avoid the evil. Without the existence of Zeus, the source and orderer of the cosmos and its laws, Stoicism falls into a shambles.

Marcus Aurelius is a royal philosopher; for the real face of his philosophy, Stoicism, you should endeavor to study the surviving fragments of Epictetus.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epictetus

Also, Stoics such as:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Musonius

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seneca_the_Younger

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zeno_of_Citium

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cleanthes

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chrysippus

Only Seneca has any texts still widely available. The remainder have fragments, usually quoted by others. I can also suggest the following two websites:

http://www.btinternet.com/~k.h.s/stoic-foundation.htm

http://www.wku.edu/~jan.garrett/stoa/

I own several versions of To Myself, which is the actual title of what's now called The Meditations of Marcus Aurelius and I've been interested in the Stoic philosophy for several years now.

[Sol Invictus]

Excellent book. I try to read a few lines every night before bed. Highly recommend this book.

[Cato]

I forgot the most important Wiki link:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stoicism

Marcus Aurelius is an example of the Roman-era Stoics of the middle to late empire. The reason why the emperor seems to remarkable is because he took this philosophy deeply to heart and mind. Centuries before the advent of Christianity with its supposed universal brotherhood, Stoicism taught of the brotherhood of man and the fatherhood of God- though these beliefs were philosophical rather than religious in nature. God for the Stoics was immanent and pantheistic (that is God didn't creature Nature ex nihilo in Stoicism because God WAS Nature, or the Mind of Nature more correctly) and human beings were likened to both divine beings (called sons of Zeus or somesuch) and animals (albeit animals with the singular ability for self-reflection).

Overall, a beautiful philosophy that has touched my life and opened up a deeper sense of wonder for the ancient modes of belief.

[Miguel]

This book is outstanding.

As Veritas Aequitas points out, it's best to use it as a manual. The content is actually somewhat repetitive, but it puts in a frame of mind rooted in the present as you read it.

I would also recommend it in the morning :)

Gregory Hays' translation comes in modern english, so you don't need to feel 18 centuries old as you read it. It's not dumbed down, it's beautifully written.

Some say this book could have been a better Bible. It's not its role, but it certainly is a solid philosophy masterpiece everyone should read.
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Video Review: Meditations by Marcus Aurelius review (http://bookvim.com/2009/07/meditations-by-marcus-aurelius-7-lessons-from-a-roman-emperor-review-chapter-20/)

[Cato]

In the ancient world, as today, repetition was a key component in learning any topic or doctrine. Stoics like Marcus Aurelius lived their saintly lives by repeating their beliefs and acting them out. They weren't just into theory and logic, but also practical moral living.

[Germanicus]

I will try to order a copy, thanks :thumb001:

[Cato]

I own many copies of this wonderful little book. I might suggest The Emperor's Handbook:

http://www.amazon.com/Emperors-Handbook-New-Translation-Meditations/dp/0743233832/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1248871708&sr=8-1

[Antonine]

I am finishing the book now and wholeheartedly recommend it. The Stoic philosophy is also reconcilable with non-Hellenic religions and cultures, which is why it has had a lot of influence along with Platonism in the east.

[Cato]

Excerpts of Diogenes Laertius' Life of Zeno (C.D. Yonge translation, 1854 or thereabouts). Zeno was the founder, or first explainer, of Stoicism; he was either a Hellenized Phoenician or a Greek from the Phoenician city of Kition (Citium).

"God is one, and he is called Mind, and Fate, and Jupiter, and many other names besides..."

"The [the Stoics] also say that God [Jupiter/Zeus] is a living being, immortal, rational, perfect, and intellectual in his happiness, unsusceptable to any kind of evil, having a foreknowledge of the world and of all that is in the world; however, that he has not the figure of a man. He is the creator of the universe, and as it were, the the father of all things in common. A portion of him pervades everything and is called different names according to its powers.

Athena with reference to the extension of his dominant power over the ether [upper air/heaven]..

Hera on account of his extension through the air...

Hephaistos on account of his pervading fire...

Poseidon, as pervading moisture...

Demeter, as pervading the earth..."

[I]"Diogenes Laertius:
The Lives and Opinions of Eminent Philosophers:
Book VII: The Stoics:"

http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/ancient/diogeneslaertius-book7-stoics.html

This beautiful and robust philosophy didn't die out; it only needs to be rediscovered and dusted off, like a forgotten vase.

[Liffrea]

Marcus Aurelius, Epictetus and Seneca are stoic philosophers I regularly read, Aristotle’s Ethics and Boethius’ Consolation of Philosophy, whilst not strictly speaking Stoic, are insightful as well.

Certainly my ethical-philosophical outlook owes much to Stoicism, it combines readily with the “spirit of courage” of Tolkien’s mythology, Nietzsche’s standpoint as exemplified in The Birth of Tragedy and, for an Odinist, with the NNV and Havamal.

[Cato]

Marcus Aurelius, Epictetus and Seneca are stoic philosophers I regularly read, Aristotle’s Ethics and Boethius’ Consolation of Philosophy, whilst not strictly speaking Stoic, are insightful as well.

Certainly my ethical-philosophical outlook owes much to Stoicism, it combines readily with the “spirit of courage” of Tolkien’s mythology, Nietzsche’s standpoint as exemplified in The Birth of Tragedy and, for an Odinist, with the NNV and Havamal.

Boethius is usually passed off as a Christian writer, but he makes no mention of Jesus or Christianity in his book. However, I do see shades of the ancient philosophy and he makes mention of the classical deities, although usually as natural phenomena. I can't really say that his God is the same as that of the Bible. Boethius' Lady Philosophy can, to me, be only Athena under another guise.

[Liffrea]

Originally Posted by Pallamedes
Boethius is usually passed off as a Christian writer, but he makes no mention of Jesus or Christianity in his book. However, I do see shades of the ancient philosophy and he makes mention of the classical deities, although usually as natural phenomena. I can't really say that his God is the same as that of the Bible. Boethius' Lady Philosophy can, to me, be only Athena under another guise.

Boethius was Christian but, you are correct, it is generally accepted his philosophy was of Greek Pagan origin.

[Cato]

Had Boethius been born a couple of centuries earlier, chances are he'd have been a pagan. But, as he lived after the fall of the western empire, Catholicism had replaced the ancient pagan religions of antiquity.