The creativity religion

[Turkey]

My race is my religion. What do people think about this religion?


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creativity_%28religion%29

[Loddfafner]

They are the absolute dregs of the white nationalist movement. It is for all practical purposes a support group for violent criminals. Klassen's books are incoherent, repetitive rants that somehow dazzle semi-literate convicts and addicts.

[Stars Down To Earth]

My race is my religion. What do people think about this religion?
I think this "religion" makes for great entertainment when you're pissed.

When you're sober, on the other hand, the crap is unreadable.

[Absinthe]

They are the absolute dregs of the white nationalist movement. It is for all practical purposes a support group for violent criminals. Klassen's books are incoherent, repetitive rants that somehow dazzle semi-literate convicts and addicts.
This is what I think of it as well. And I've met a couple of them, who fit exactly that description.

[Der Steinadler]

....as its American one dosn't need to read beyond the title.

[Joe McCarthy]

Any serious effort to make a religion centered around race died in the Berlin bunker. There were some currents surrounding Rosenberg and Himmler, with their immersion in things like Gnosticism and Marcionism, that had some potential. The Nazis though lost their bearings...

Creativity, though admittedly stupid, isn't much dumber than other ersatz religions white racialists dabble in. ;)

[Curly]

Any serious effort to make a religion centered around race died in the Berlin bunker. There were some currents surrounding Rosenberg and Himmler, with their immersion in things like Gnosticism and Marcionism, that had some potential. The Nazis though lost their bearings...

Creativity, though admittedly stupid, isn't much dumber than other ersatz religions white racialists dabble in. ;)
Nor is it much dumber than Christianity.

http://images.encyclopediadramatica.ch/8/84/Christianity2.jpg

[Loddfafner]

"Creativity" is a white imitation of the crudest variants of black nationalism. It is, for all practical purposes, a means of recruiting non-prisoners into prison gangs.

[Joe McCarthy]

Nor is it much dumber than Christianity.

http://images.encyclopediadramatica.ch/8/84/Christianity2.jpg

Christianity has a serious intellectual legacy and is one of the foundation stones of Western Civilization. Replacement religions are a joke precisely because they can't live up to this weighty contribution.

[Der Steinadler]

Christianity is politics disguised as religion.

[Curly]

Christianity has a serious intellectual legacy and is one of the foundation stones of Western Civilization. Replacement religions are a joke precisely because they can't live up to this weighty contribution.
Western Civilization reached its peak in the Classical Age of (pagan) Greece and Rome. Christianity ushered in a thousand years of darkness. The Renaissance came about when Europeans rediscovered the knowledge of pre-Christian Antiquity.

[Der Steinadler]

Christianity has a serious intellectual legacy and is one of the foundation stones of Western Civilization. Replacement religions are a joke precisely because they can't live up to this weighty contribution.

Expand, with reference to seriously intellectual work.

[Joe McCarthy]

Western Civilization reached its peak in the Classical Age of (pagan) Greece and Rome. Christianity ushered in a thousand years of darkness. The Renaissance came about when Europeans rediscovered the knowledge of pre-Christian Antiquity.

Western Civilization didn't exist in the Classical era. That's why it was the Classical. :rolleyes:

[Joe McCarthy]

Expand, with reference to seriously intellectual work.

Erm, Duns Scotus? Aquinas? Ignatius of Loyola? Calvin? The King James Bible? Anselm? St. Augustine of Hippo?

[Curly]

Western Civilization didn't exist in the Classical era. That's why it was the Classical. :rolleyes:
So Ancient Greece and Rome weren't part of the West? :rolleyes::rolleyes:

Sounds like an ex post facto redefinition of "Western Civilization" to me.

[Curly]

Erm, Duns Scotus? Aquinas? Ignatius of Loyola? Calvin? The King James Bible? Anselm? St. Augustine of Hippo?
:rolleyes2: Theological bullshit does not count as serious intellectual achievement.

[Der Steinadler]

Erm, Duns Scotus? Aquinas? Ignatius of Loyola? Calvin? The King James Bible? Anselm? St. Augustine of Hippo?

mmm.

Repetition on the same theme....God, the Chosen People, Jesus was the son of God etc etc etc.

There is no intellectual enquiry in christian history. The reason being is because Christianity is a Prescriptive framework.

It does not allow inquiry outside of it's shell.

It's like an isloated utopia. An island unto itself.

Therefore, without the unlimited activity of inquiry, nothing can be discovered either physically, mentally, or spiritually.

On Western Civilisation, I think Alfred Whitehead said it correctly......

"The safest general characterization of the European philosophical tradition is that it consists of a series of footnotes to Plato. I do not mean the systematic scheme of thought which scholars have doubtfully extracted from his writings. I allude to the wealth of general ideas scattered through them."

In other words, Western Civilisation is......

http://www.acheronpress.co.uk/images/pic-plato.jpg

[Joe McCarthy]

:rolleyes2: Theological bullshit does not count as serious intellectual achievement.

By the same logic one could say the same thing of Homer. It's based in myth, ergo it's 'bullshit'.

[Joe McCarthy]

So Ancient Greece and Rome weren't part of the West? :rolleyes::rolleyes:

Sounds like an ex post facto redefinition of "Western Civilization" to me.

I'll help you out here, friend, before I take my leave of this thread. Look up Classical, Magian, and Faustian, and work your way from there.

Sayonara.

[Loddfafner]

Actually medieval scholasticism did cover some serious philosophical ground and effectively launched the likes of Copernicus and Newton. Also, gothic cathedrals are among our people's greatest achievements.

[Curly]

I'll help you out here, friend, before I take my leave of this thread. Look up Classical, Magian, and Faustian, and work your way from there.

Sayonara.
No thanks. You know as well as I know that Ancient Greece and Rome are considered part of Western Civilization...

[Curly]

By the same logic one could say the same thing of Homer. It's based in myth, ergo it's 'bullshit'.
Homer's work is repetitious bullshit...:coffee:

[Aces High]

The church's Security Legions are the only uniformed members. They consist of two groups:
White Rangers derive their symbolism from the "White conquerors of the North American continent" (pioneers, cowboys, Texas Rangers...) They wear a white cowboy hat and cowboy boots
White Berets derive their symbolism from the military. They wear a military beret and paratrooper boots.



Makes a change from a white dog collar i suppose.

[TheBorrebyViking]

Creativity is meh.

[GeistFaust]

Christianity is politics disguised as religion.


I can agree with this. Christianity is nothing more then a social tool to control the masses. Its just become a social tool to drug the masses, through dogmatic chicaneries. This has been one of the notable traits of Christianity throughout the ages, especially in the Middle Ages. A lot of people were blinded by their superstitious beliefs, and were eventually led to believe in the arbitrary dogmatic propositions of the clergymen.



These arbitrary dogmatic propositions were nothing more then the sensibility of power hungry clergymen who wanted to own land and assume places of power in the state. Unfortunately so many people believed this people as the voice of God, and were led into all kinds of "holy" missions which were nothing but secular movements. The odd thing is that the average Christian has this Stockhold Syndrome feeling towards their leaders.



That is the sickest part of Christianity is that their is a sense of guilt if you disagree with one of their propositions. Its complete rubbish and nonsense, and although Christianity has helped in building the civilization in Europe ironically it has been a destructive force. The direction the West is taking these days though is not any better.



All this post-modern secularist nonsense needs to stop, because its against all that is culture. You have to give credit to Christianity for desiring to preserve culture, society, and other notable traditions within the context of the West. The Renaissance for instance was a brilliant cultural movement, and it was sparked by Christianity.



We can not demonize Christianity in full, because it has a silver lining. The problem is has been misused and abused so often, and I am sick of the guilt-consciousness and resentment which Christianity breeds. Its as if people have this pathological need for someone to lead them instead of thinking for themselves and taking their own initiative.



After a while it just becomes bothersome and disturbing when some people within Christianity are validating and justifying all forms of blasphemy in the name of the "Holy" one. There are some major flaws, and I am not going to point out Christianity's flaws to try to dismiss some of its accomplishments. Christianity has at least offered us more historically then the present Post-Modern Secular world we live in where man has become this supreme God.




I am sick and tired of man trying to use science and technology to become like God, it just seems to resemble the whole tower of Babel story in the bible. At the same time I fully believe reason and science should hold a higher place over the traditional and conservative whims of religion. This is because religion in its traditional sense has created more harm than good, and it has often misused the good reason of some of its members to construct dogmatic propositions which would fit their distorted and corrupt ideologies and agendas.



Christianity today has become nothing but an extension of the Post-Modern Secular World. I suppose you can blame the Enlightenment for this, but things were definitely not better before the Enlightenment. The question is how do you avoid things become one sided. It either seems like society and politics become a pedestal for the chicaneries and chimeras of religious dogma or religion becomes enslaved to the dogma of some rabidly secular society.



Its tough to balance it all out, and the average man could not care less, because he is ignorant to the differences which are so critical to produce a balance between society and religion. In my opinion the upcoming generations needs to construct a religion which centers more on a rational and practical basis.



This might seem like a move back to the Enlightenment, but the whims and sensibilities of religious dogma do not appear like it will offer mankind any room for anything but a one sided totalitarian rule. I would rather not regress back into an age of superstitious where mankind has to deal with all kinds of spooks and fears, which will be unleashed if does not follow some kind of categorical imperative.



Religion has a tendency to justify cruelty on the basis of so many transcendental illusions, which it devises to deceive the masses into believing something which does not have any application to reality or its objects. It is this tendency which makes me think that avoiding a one sided nature in religion is an impossibility, and will only be used as a means to justify an illegitimate authority which does not process from the laws of reason and logic.



It is best for society if secularism and reason retains a higher emphasis in the mind of people, because religion has a tendency to control and manipulate these when it assumes power. This will continue to naturally occur, and the only way to retain a balance between society and religion is to put a higher emphasis on reason and secularism. The problem is in today's democratic and plutocratic society that is virtually an impossibility.

[GeistFaust]

Western Civilization didn't exist in the Classical era. That's why it was the Classical. :rolleyes:



No, a lot of today's Western culture is shaped by the Classical Era. Western Civilization is Graeco-Roman in its nature, and it has a great influence on the intellectual movements in Christianity.

Augustine was inspired a great deal by Plato, and Aquinas was inspired by Aristotle to a great extent.

The classical era shaped and formed the original sketch for Western tradition, which we are ineffably glued to. All Western traditions and cultures have delienated and projected themselves with this original sketch.

[GeistFaust]

Erm, Duns Scotus? Aquinas? Ignatius of Loyola? Calvin? The King James Bible? Anselm? St. Augustine of Hippo?

Duns Scotus and Aquinas were very constructive in terms of the Western world, but even they got blinded by a lot of theological and religious superstition. Calvin was also quite an interesting character, and was probably one of the most rational characters of the Reformation, but unfortunately a lot of his followers took the context of his ideas out of context. Anslem has been critized to a great extent, because he lacks in originality, and his Ontological Argument was a logical fallacy.



The Ontological Argument might sound like a sound logical syllogism, but there are many underlying flaws. Theoretically the Ontological Argument might appear to have some merit to it, but in a practical sense it holds no merit. Logical propositions should be sound both in theory and practice in order for them to be of firm build. This is the problem with a lot of these intellectuals and theologians throughout the course of Christianities history.



They have used intellectual propositions and sound logic to disguise the fragile conclusions, which they were trying to safeguard against on the basis of reality(Phenomenal World). They could never pass beyond this phenomenal world or verify it, but merely fell into a trap, which was constructed by their rational and logical patterns, schemes, and frameworks. They got caught up in over rationalizing those things which were merely void transcendental illusions.



This is they were dealing with mere chimeras and chicaneries, which could not be proven within the context of the phenomenal world or applies to its objects. They could not rid their system of reason or dogma from the errors superimposed on it by metaphysics.


A logical conclusion is fallacious either if the premise does not accord itself properly with the conclusion or if the premises are trying to validate things which are mere chimeras or chicaneries.



That is the case when they have no basis in reality and no application to the objects of the phenomenal world. Augustine also had some serious flaws, much like Plato, which I many theologians and dogmaticist ignore, and ironically through rational and logical propositions

[Curly]

Actually medieval scholasticism did cover some serious philosophical ground and effectively launched the likes of Copernicus and Newton. Also, gothic cathedrals are among our people's greatest achievements.
Such accomplishments are attributable not to Christianity, but to the superiority of the White race.

[Der Steinadler]

Such accomplishments are attributable not to Christianity, but to the superiority of the White race.

That's the truth.

All the accomplishments in west are a product of its people, not any ideology. In fact, they are.... in-spite of ....christianity.

[GeistFaust]

Such accomplishments are attributable not to Christianity, but to the superiority of the White race.


Also you have to remember that the Medieval Age suppressed and oppressed a lot of scientific innovations and discoveries if it did not accord with their dogmatic structure. This of course led to the Reformation and Enlightenment, because Christianity during the Middle Ages was too totalitarian. It had control over large sections of society, the military, and academia.



Once people became exploring for themselves they realized just how many fallacies and flaws Medieval Christianity resided on. The Renaissance was an important movement in trying to separate the individual from the totalitarian nature of Medieval Christianity. A form of Christianity which was rooted in all kinds of superstitious creeds, and which concocted up all these spooks to instill fear into people.



Unfortunately the Medieval Creed of religion still predominates to a great extent in the mind of Catholicism. It is here that we still see the guilt-consciousness and mentality of resentment still in place. Cruelty is justified and validated in the name of holy dogma and doctrine, which have been hacked and abused by so many religious intellectuals and theologians.


If anything the intellectual movements in the Middle Ages were built on either false premises or transcendental illusions, which were merely chicaneries or chimeras which were used to bolster up the necessity and validation of dogma in the mind of people.



It was innovative and anti-dogmatic type of people who helped the West progress forwards and reach any form of objectivity, something which religion seems like it can never deliever to the common man.

[GeistFaust]

That's the truth.

All the accomplishments in west are a product of its people, not any ideology. In fact, they are.... in-spite of ....christianity.

They merely just coincided with a certain ideology, which some people claimed to belief, when in a theoretical and practical sense it was an impossibility. This was because a lot of the dogmatic beliefs of Christianity were constructed on the basis of transcendental illusions and chimeras. Unfortunately people give a reason to the coincidence of a certain ideology with the accomplishments in the Western world.

[Aemma]

My race is my religion. What do people think about this religion?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creativity_%28religion%29

Not much!

[Aemma]

Christianity is politics disguised as religion.

This problem is not endemic to Christianity itself however.

[Norse Sword]

Christianity has a serious intellectual legacy and is one of the foundation stones of Western Civilization.

And currently being utilized to inundate the West with every form of third world scum imaginable, all of under the banner of "cultural and ethnic Christian tolerance".

[GeistFaust]

This problem is not endemic to Christianity itself however.

This is true, and perhaps we focus too much on the problems of Christianity regarding this problem, because of our Western heritage. Judaism and Islam have done far more offensive things than Christianity could have dreamed of doing.

This does not negate the insidious nature of Christianity, but there are other religions which are far worse than that found in the variety of Christian religions.


A lot of the problems with Christianity is in that its substratum is too far affected by the Semitic mentality. A lot of Westerners are ignorant and underestimate the affects the Semitic mentality has had on Christian theology and such.

[Aemma]

And currently being utilized to inundate the West with every form of third world scum imaginable, all of under the banner of "cultural and ethnic Christian tolerance".

Currently? There is nothing current about it. Christianity has always been a proselytising religion. It excels at this.

[GeistFaust]

And currently being utilized to inundate the West with every form of third world scum imaginable, all of under the banner of "cultural and ethnic Christian tolerance".



Christianity has become nothing short then a tool or extension of the Plutocratic elites in society. A good deal of Christians don't realize how far they have strayed from the original schemework of the intellectual progenitors of Christianity. They have abandoned a great deal of the intellectual history of Christianity, and this happened to a great extent, after the Post World War period under the form of the Vatican 2.



So when you speak about the "cultural and ethnic Christian tolerance" it usually applies more specifically to Catholicism. That said the diseases in today's secular society has filtered and distilled themselves in all various forms of Christianity. Christianity fails to utilize its original intellectual schemeworks and frameworks the way they were meant to be used to this day.


They have just picked up some general ideas from particular intellectual traditions in Christianity for their own secularist agendas and ideologies. This agendas and ideologies revolve around the Plutocratic mentality of today's society which puts a high emphasis on crass materialism, hyper-secularism, and hyper-consumerism

[Norse Sword]

Currently? There is nothing current about it. Christianity has always been a proselytising religion. It excels at this.

Even more reason to dismiss it as a NON EUROPEAN practice. It only does the bidding of its current masters, and they have no interest in protecting Europe's people or culture.

[GeistFaust]

Currently? There is nothing current about it. Christianity has always been a proselytising religion. It excels at this.



Yes, but I think he is talking in reference to a specific movement in today's culture. Christianity has taken a back seat since the Enlightenment period, and for good reasons also. Before this time frame Christianity represented a Leviathan which had a strangle hold over the political, cultural, and academic affairs of Europe.


They even went so far to use their dogmatic obsession to incite the remnant Viking/Warrior spirit into endless military operations against the Saracens into the Middle East all in the name of "God." I don't think the Crusades were necessarily bad from a cultural standpoint, but its completely ridiculous to say it was inspired by God.


The people of the Enlightenment straightened this twisted and distorted mentality, and put Christianity in its proper place. Christianity was very repressive and oppressive at one point, and even the few healthy intellectuals that existed within its bounds were largely misinterpreted by those within their respected time frame.


The scary thing is that despite the totalitarian nature of Christianity its not nearly as bad as some of the sects of Judaism and Islam. It is rather horrifying that Christianity might allow for more freedom than those specific religions under certain circumstances.

[GeistFaust]

Even more reason to dismiss it as a NON EUROPEAN practice. It only does the bidding of its current masters, and they have no interest in protecting Europe's people or culture.


Well Christianity in its true form is just a Westernized form of an Eastern religion. Its nothing more than this. If people do not want to admit that Christianity is basically used as an ideology or agenda to bolster Western ideas they are completely ignorant. The terrible thing about it is sometimes Christianity has advocated for the utility of Western principles to undermine the schemata of Western civilization itself.



Christianity is nothing but the projection of Western ideologies and mentalities, which are pagan at their root. In a sense Christianity has never got past its pagan roots in regards to Europe it just expresses itself under new forms to pretend it has. Also the mentality of Christianity has allowed for Eastern parasites to infilitrate subtly into the framework of the West, and other unwanted elements in society.


I just think this is a self-destructive mentality, which is baseless and groundless in reality. This is why I express concern regarding the Semitic/Middle Eastern substratum that lies hidden within the bosom of the Christian West. Its insidious nature can only be kept in check by the force of reason, which will put the supersitition and transcendental illusions of Christianity into its proper place.

[Turkey]

^ Zeus was often known as the god of Vagrants. If you din't help a beggar who came to your door then you risked offending Zeus. And he was the main God.

I don't think that doing unto each other as you would have them do unto you started with Christianity. If Christianity ever was a middle eastern religion it wasn't long until we changed it to a European one.

[GeistFaust]

^ Zeus was often known as the god of Vagrants. If you din't help a beggar who came to your door then you risked offending Zeus. And he was the main God.

I don't think that doing unto each other as you would have them do unto you started with Christianity. If Christianity ever was a middle eastern religion it wasn't long until we changed it to a European one.


A lot of things that Christianity claims to be its own are just things they have borrowed and loaned from other religions. Some of the intellectual traditions of Christianity have allowed for some originality to arise within the context of Christianity. Other for this then though a lot of Christianity is constructed off of old religious ideologies and mentalities. Its interesting to note the parallels with the insidious religions of the Caananite region with Christianity.



It seems like the whole do unto the other what you want to do mentality is just a blanket idea to try to cover up the true insidious and ruthless nature of Christianity. A nature which has made itself self evident by trying to impose spooks and fears on people if they don't follow along with every command of the dogmatic propositions posited by a collection of old haggered men.



Too many times these dogmatic propositions have justified multiple forms of cruelty in the name of some divine being. You will also realize that Christianity converted the blood libel and human sacrifice of the Caananite religions into Metaphoric or Anagolous expressions. Thes expressions manifest themselves in certain symbols and forms, which are tangible.


In a sense Christianity has tried to tame the demonic nature of the old Caananite religions with its pornographic and phallic nature, but I too often see the subtle insidious nature of Christianity.


Christianity has tried to push its substratum under the carpet, but this has not reduced the inhumane and criminal nature which Christianity is willing to assert in the name of the "Holy" one.

[Aemma]

^ Zeus was often known as the god of Vagrants. If you din't help a beggar who came to your door then you risked offending Zeus. And he was the main God.

Indeed! The same can be said of Odin in Norse mythology and Wotan in continental Germanic mythology.


If Christianity ever was a middle eastern religion it wasn't long until we changed it to a European one.

To be sure. In some theological circles the argument has been made that Christianity is more of a Pauline religion (that is based on Paul's interpretations of the Gospels), hence Roman, than anything else.

[Amapola]

Western Civilization reached its peak in the Classical Age of (pagan) Greece and Rome. .

The heritage of the Classical Age is one of the pillars of the Western Civilization, certainly. Actually, Christianity, another pillar of it, also drank from its bottle, from the valuable crossbreeding of cultures we call Romanity, especially Helenism.

But this old world collapsed because of its own mistakes (as it happens in every age): the intellectual flowering of the first Hellenistic generations, who started from an extraordinarily valuable heritage, could not remain once Rome had homogenized the Mediterranean population that it's referred to as empire. Technology was imposed on itself as prime way/formula, taking over from human thought. There was official efforts- glorious buildings and plenty of libraries-, but no masters or systems were produced to be compared with Plato and Aristotele's (always invoked as true and epicentral masters). Philosophy surrendered to pragmatism, as it happens with humanities amongst us, searching for solutions that allow the material advance; the doctrines of immanence always run the risk of exhausting in a sort of blind alley. Likewise, stoicism and epicureanism turned in withdrawal phenomena, as if the fundamental deal was theaching their interlocutors that, doing without the big abstract questions, they should only take care of the accommodating of the short days of the existance to an easy, pleasant situation, worthy and without pain. Seneca's supreme dignity was euthanasia. ;)

Eventually, Christianity could achieve the recognition of the need of change for this decrepit pessimistic materialism and invited the very empire (reaching its final stage) to convert from materialism into spirituality, from immanence into trascendence. Thanks to this, the Empire of the East could survive other 600 years.


Christianity ushered in a thousand years of darkness.
Erm... no. :mmmm:

The building of the European civilization started, with their empires (Holy Roman empire, etc..), nations, men of art/religion/science, dimensions of the new citizenships, reformations of all sorts, big changes of intellect and feelings, the birth of general studies, universities, the classes societies and so forth.

Appart from this, as much as the old Helenistic masters were great wisemen, they fostered a certain contempt towards manual work-which they considered "menial", this is, worthy of slaves- and towards technical advances. Discoveries such as the pulley, the block and tackle or the waterwheel' s use were held back not to modify social structures.

The Greek cosmos was superior to man, something quasi-divine, so man could not dare to do racionally founded experiments; while the Christian world is at man's service for him to explore and cultivate. This was very important for science advance. For example, Nicholas of Cusa, gives an idea
and covers all modern thought in "in nucleo": trascendental metaphysics, ecumenical union of religions and nations (arghh), the experiment and exact measure as base of "mathematization" in physics, and even the theory of relativity and the elemental particles, as we conceive them nowadays. It is not exaggerated that the historiography of science in our century are ever inclined to believe that the Cusan thought could have made philosophy and modern sciences emerge in XV century if it had had congenial disciples. :thumb001:

Wikpedia on him:


Nicholas of Kues (1401 – August 11, 1464), also referred to as Nicolaus Cusanus and Nicholas of Cusa, was a cardinal of the Catholic Church from Germany (Holy Roman Empire), a philosopher, theologian, jurist, mathematician, and an astronomer. He is widely considered one of the great geniuses and polymaths of the 15th century. He is today recognized for significant spiritual, scientific and political contributions in European history, notable examples of which include his mystical or spiritual writings on 'learned ignorance' (and mathematical ideas expressed in related essays), as well as his participation in power struggles between Rome and the German states of the Holy Roman Empire

Pity, he didn't have successors expect perhaps the Valencian Juan Luis Vives, a real humanist.

A bit of wiki on him:


Vives imagined and described a comprehensive theory of education; he may have directly influenced the essays of Michel Eyquem de Montaigne.[4] He was admired by Thomas More and Erasmus, who wrote that Vives "will overshadow the name of Erasmus."[5]

Vives is considered the first scholar to analyze the psyche directly. He did extensive interviews with people, and noted the relation between their exhibition of affect, and the particular words and issues they were discussing. While it is unknown if Freud was familiar with Vives's work, historian of psychiatry Gregory Zilboorg considered Vives a godfather of psychoanalysis. (A History of Medical Psychology, 1941) and the father of father of modern psychology by Foster Watson (1915.)

Vives taught monarchs. His idea of a diverse and concrete children's education long preceded Jean Jacques Rousseau, and may have indirectly influenced Rousseau through Montaigne. Vives altered classical rhetoric to express his own sort of pro-virginity half-feminism - which remains of interest to historians of gender.[6][7] Among 16th century Spain's numerous "treatises for and against women," Vives "steers a middle path" (p. xxiv-xxv), neither misogynist nor sanctifying.[8]
:thumb001: He deserves more attention that he's given, obviously.


bla bla bla Reinassance
Vives and Nicholas are simple practical examples that Renaissance was not the period where modern science were bred.

nobody can't objectively reject the arguments with which the Dutch mathematitian, physicist and historian Eduard Jan Dijksterhuis justifies the delay that science suffered in the centuries XV and XVI until the total renovation by the genious, Galilei:
1) The retrospective position of humanism, which saw its ideal in the Ancient world- in comparison with the vangardist spirit of Bradwardine's Oxford


Merton College sheltered a group of dons devoted to natural science, mainly physics, astronomy and mathematics, rivals of the intellectuals at the University of Paris. Bradwardine was one of these Oxford Calculators, studying mechanics with William Heytesbury, Richard Swineshead, and John Dumbleton. The Oxford Calculators distinguished kinematics from dynamics, emphasizing kinematics, and investigating instantaneous velocity. They first formulated the mean speed theorem: a body moving with constant velocity travels the same distance as an accelerated body in the same time if its velocity is half the final speed of the accelerated body. They also demonstrated this theorem — the foundation of "The Law of Falling Bodies" — long before Galileo, who is generally credited with it.

and Buridanus and Oresme's Paris


Jean Buridan (in Latin, Johannes Buridanus) (ca. 1300 – after 1358) was a French priest who sowed the seeds of the Copernican revolution in Europe.[1][2] He developed the concept of impetus, the first step toward the modern concept of inertia, and an important development in the history of medieval science. His name is most familiar through the thought experiment known as Buridan's ass (a thought experiment which does not appear in his extant writings).


and Marsilius of Inghen's Heildelberg


In logic, he was an Aristotelian nominalist; in natural philosophy, an empiricist. He applied a synthesis of the new 14th century physics of Buridan, Thomas Bradwardine and Oresme in his commentaries on Aristotle. Both his theological and philosophical works are characterized by a logico-semantical approach in which he followed Buridan, combined with an eclectic use of older theories, sometimes more Aristotelian and sometimes more Neoplatonist; this fact that renders narrow the label "Ockhamist" often applied to Marsilius. He was influential on Central European philosophy of later centuries, both through his own philosophy and by the way he stimulated reform of university programmes. In the 16th century there were still references to a "Marsilian way" in logic and physics.



The Ruprecht-Karls-Universität Heidelberg (Heidelberg University, Ruperto Carola) is a public research university located in Heidelberg, Baden-Württemberg, Germany. Founded in 1386, it is the oldest university in Germany and was the third university established in the Holy Roman Empire. Heidelberg has been a coeducational institution since 1899. Today the university consists of twelve faculties and offers degree programmes at undergraduate, graduate and postdoctoral levels in some 100 disciplines


2) The unilateral tendency towards classical philology, the contempt to craftmanship and technique, and the lack of maths formation. Even a person that look so humanist to us like Leonardo Da vinci, in his physics works, especially of mechanics, he continues with the Medieval tradition, appart from the Schools of Oxford and Paris, and German mathematitian and physicist Jordanus Nemorarius and his school.


Jordanus de Nemore was a thirteenth-century European mathematician who wrote treatises on at least 6 different important mathematical subjects: the science of weights; “algorismi” treatises on practical arithmetic; pure arithmetic; algebra; geometry; and stereographic projection. Most of these treatises exist in several versions or reworkings from the Middle Ages. We know nothing about him personally, other than the approximate date of his work.

The thing is that without this, humanists could have not made science advance. What Zabarella, Ficino would have done without Domingo de Soto (the first who gave an exact formulation to the gravity: a body in free fall experiments a contast acceleration---> essential base for Galileo and Newtow. :cool:

And so forth...

[Curly]

I never said that Europeans did not make great accomplishments under Christianity, but the idea that Christianity is an essential part of European/White identity is refuted by the fact that the greatest European civilizations (Classical Greece and the Roman Republic) were not Christian.

[Curly]

http://www.counter-currents.com/2011/07/william-gayley-simpsons-which-way-western-man/


The other apostates I have mentioned, and many that are now forgotten, together with almost all of the anti-Christians of recent centuries, exemplify the operation of what may be called the law of cultural residues. In all civilized societies, when a long-established and generally accepted belief is found to be incredible, good minds abandon it, but they commonly retain derivative beliefs that were originally deduced from the creed they have rejected and logically must depend on it. Thus it happened that modern enemies of Christianity rejected the mythology, but uncritically retained faith in the social and ethical superstitions derived from it — a faith which they oddly call rational but hold with a religious fervor.

They laugh at the silly story about Adam and his spare rib, but they continue to believe in a “human race” descended from a single pair of ancestors and hence in a “brotherhood of man.” They speak of “all mankind,” giving to the term an unctuous and mystic meaning with which they do not invest corresponding terms, such as “all marsupials” or “all ungulates.” They prate about the “rights of man,” although a moment’s thought should suffice to show that, in the absence of a decree from a supernatural monarch, there can be no rights other than those which the citizens of a stable and homogeneous society have, by covenant or established custom, bestowed on themselves; and that while the citizens may show kindness to aliens, slaves, and dogs, such beings obviously can have no rights.

They do not believe that one-third of a god became incarnate in the most squalid region on earth to associate with illiterate peasants, harangue the rabble of a barbarian race, and magically exalt the ignorant and uncouth to “make folly of the wisdom of this world,” so that “the last shall be first” — that they do not believe, but they cling to the morbid hatred of superiority that makes Christians dote on whatever is lowly, inferior, irrational, debased, deformed, and degenerate.

They gabble about the “sanctity of human life” — especially the vilest forms of it — without reflecting that it takes a god creator to make something sacred. And they frantically agitate for a universal “equality” that can be attained only by reducing all human beings to the level of the lowest, evidently unaware that they are merely echoing the Christians’ oft-expressed yearning to become sheep (the most stupid of all mammals) herded by a good shepherd, which is implicit in all the tales of the New Testament, although most bluntly expressed in another gospel, which reports Jesus as promising that after he has tortured and butchered the more civilized populations of the earth, there will be a Resurrection, and his ovine pets will pop out of their graves, all of the same age, all of the same sex, all of the same stature, and all having indistinguishable features, so that they will be as identical as the bees in a swarm.[2]

Although the “Liberal” and Marxist cults have doctrinal differences as great as those that separate Lutherans from Baptists, they are basically the same superstition, and whether or not we should call them religions depends on whether we restrict the word to belief in supernatural persons or extend it to include all forms of blind faith based on emotional excitement instead of observed facts and reason. When those “atheistic” cults scream out their hatred of “Fascists” and “Nazis,” they obviously must believe that those wicked persons are possessed of the Devil and should therefore be converted or exterminated to promote holiness and love. And when they see “racists,” who impiously substitute fact and reason for unthinking faith in approved fairy stories, their lust to extirpate evil is as great as that of the Christian mob that dragged the fair and too intelligent Hypatia from her carriage and lovingly used oyster shells to scrape the flesh from her bones while she was still alive.

With very few exceptions, the anti-Christians, no doubt unwittingly, retained in their minds a large part of Christian doctrine, and they even revived the most poisonous elements of the primitive Bolshevism of Antiquity, which had been attenuated or held in abeyance by the established churches in the great days of Christendom. And today, professed atheists do not think it odd that, on all social questions, they are in substantial agreement with the howling dervishes and evangelical shamans who, subsidized with lavish publicity by the Organized Jewry who control the boob-tubes and other means of communication, greedily participate in the current drive to reduce Americans to total imbecility with every kind of irrational hoax, from astrology to “pyramid power.”

[Curly]

Vives and Nicholas are simple practical examples that Renaissance was not the period where modern science were bred.
When did I say it was?

nobody can't objectively reject the arguments with which the Dutch mathematitian, physicist and historian Eduard Jan Dijksterhuis justifies the delay that science suffered in the centuries XV and XVI until the total renovation by the genious, Galilei:
There's powerful irony in this statement because, after all, Galileo was persecuted by the Roman Catholic Church for questioning geocentrism.

1) The retrospective position of humanism, which saw its ideal in the Ancient world- in comparison with the vangardist spirit of Bradwardine's Oxford....
Just because certain clergymen may have made scientific contributions doesn't mean that Christianity itself is responsible for those accomplishments. The priesthood was a very high-status occupation in the Middle Ages; it doesn't necessarily indicate great religiosity, and even if it did...so what? Religion was imposed by force. It wasn't until the Enlightenment that people began questioning the basic assumptions of Christianity.

Most sub-Saharan Africans are Christian...what scientific achievements have they made?

[Curly]

http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/jim_meritt/bible-contradictions.html

"The Bible is riddled with repetitions and contradictions, things that the Bible bangers would be quick to point out in anything that they want to criticize. For instance, Genesis 1 and 2 disagree about the order in which things are created, and how satisfied God is about the results of his labors. The flood story is really two interwoven stories that contradict each other on how many of each kind of animal are to be brought into the Ark--is it one pair each or seven pairs each of the "clean" ones? The Gospel of John disagrees with the other three Gospels on the activities of Jesus Christ (how long had he stayed in Jerusalem--a couple of days or a whole year?) and all four Gospels contradict each other on the details of Jesus Christ's last moments and resurrection. The Gospels of Matthew and Luke contradict each other on the genealogy of Jesus Christ's father; though both agree that Joseph was not his real father. Repetitions and contradictions are understandable for a hodgepodge collection of documents, but not for some carefully constructed treatise, reflecting a well-thought-out plan."

[Wayne]

Greetings, I myself am an adherent of the Creativity religion. I can see from several posts on here that plenty have a misunderstanding of my religion and feel negative towards it. Indeed, one poster stated that our fundamental religious texts are "incoherent" and contain "repetitive rants"! Well, I will take the liberty to post several links below in order for anybody interested to peruse through them to see if they agree.

http://creativityalliance.com/eBook-BenKlassen-Nature'sEternalReligion.pdf
http://creativityalliance.com/eBook-BenKlassen-TheWhiteMan'sBible.pdf

[dukeofsouls]

I have read the book Natures Eternal Religion by Ben Klassen. I consider this a must read book for Klassens brilliant and at times hilarious dismantling and critiquing of Christianity, Judaism and the old and new testament. I agree wholeheartedly with Klassen that Christianity from its very inception was a conspiracy to destroy the white race. White people lost their true culture, heritage and folk soul when Christianity was accepted in Europe. We had a religion with Gods of honor, courage, knowledge, even a sense of humor. They had a reverance for, and connection to animals and nature. All the male Gods were warriors. All the female Gods were loving, family oriented and were as noble and virtuous as the male Gods. We went from that to a religion that revolves around a self debasing Jew that teaches pacifism, that to seek knowledge is "Satanic" and that the Gods of our own Aryan pantheon were demons of the Jewish Satan. Like I said before this book is a must read for Klassens entertaining and precise dismantling of Christianity that comprises most of this book.
That being said I have major issues with Klassen and Creativity. For one the whole idea of trying to pawn off Creativity as a religion is a farce. Klassen is a militant atheist who referred to anything of the supernatural realm as being "spooks in the sky". Its not that the basic ideas of Creativity are necessarily bad (to put it in an overly simplified nutshell, whats good for the white race is the ultimate good, whats bad for the white race is the ultimate evil) but to make what is basicly a personal philosophy of a dogmatic atheist a religion is a joke. Some of the ideas for the CotC that Klassen went into in his later writings did get out and out weird, especially with his fetishizing the Roman empire to the extent of giving people in the Church of the Creator Roman titles, like Pontificus Maximus for the guy in charge and saying that whites should make Latin their universal language. He also got into this thing where people should only eat a natural diet of only fruits, vegetables and nuts, which while I think eating healthy is a good thing Klassen took the dietary laws to such an extreme that it would be unrealistic to expect to find many people that would adhere to them. Its of little wonder that the CotC has attacted so many loons over the years. He also neglects that white people had their own religious pantheon before Christianity.
Another thing about Klassen is while he points fingers at the Jews and Communism non stop in this book he says little about white capitalists who have and are doing destroying the white race with a great enthusiasm all in the name of making a buck. He should have read books like "They Were White and They Were Slaves" by Michael Hoffman to see you can't lay EVERY destructive element in the white races world at the feet of the Jews. While I will neither downplay nor excuse what the Jews have done throughout history to overlook the role that rich and powerful white scum have played in the degradation of white people is utterly retarded. Klassen himself was a highly successful capitalist in his own right, holding patents on the electric can opener and being a wheeler dealer in the real estate market so I'm sure this had a lot to do with his omision of the destruction that capitalism has caused. Another great irony in all of this is much of Klassens Jew bashing has its roots in Christian sources and Christianity itself.
Holding Hitler up as "the greatest white man who ever lived" may be the least well thought out thing in Natures Eternal Religion though. Klassen seems to overlook all the money that Hitler took from those Jew bankers and his handholding with the Japanese and Muslims, including allowing Turko-Armenian racial types into the SS! But above all what about the oceans of Aryan blood that Hitler had on his hands, as well as his hatred of white Slavs? Sorry but I can't think of anything more foolish than these people who idealize Hitler without looking at the fruits of his labors, which continue to this very day and you better believe its not white people who are benefitting from those fruits. Whether Uncle Adolf meant well or not he his legacy has become a curse to the white race.
All that being said I still consider this a must read book for the anti-Christian writings and most of the basic ideas of Creativity are good.

[Loddfafner]

I've known a few Creators, and they ended up a) in prison or b) dead by the hand of other creators, or c) overdosed on heroin. The whole culture around them is a support group for homicidal maniacs and addicts. They are embarrassments to the White race. The movement has destroyed many of those who have come in contact with them. They are a cult of the worst sort.