Is Turkey part of Europe

[Corvus]

It´s not provocative but a question I am seriously asking myself.
From a geographical point of view just a small part of the country is on European territory
But Turkey is a member of the UEFA and seen as a potential EU Candidate?
Where do they belong to?

[MNKraut]

NO! Turkey does not belong to Europe! The turks, are a completely alien people to the white indigenous people of Europe, you can certainly observe from their behaviour and appearance. Turkey is a semitic hellhole.

[Benacer]

Well, they did have a great impact on European history, and were rather relevant geopolitically in Europe until WWI. Culturally they are very distinct, however, so I am quite mixed on this.

[Midori]

No duh :rolleyes:

[Mosov]

Well politically they are considered part of Europe. Geographically they officially have a small piece of landmass in continental Europe. Culturally, it's up for debate.

[Talvi]

Mostly Asia.

[Aramis]

http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lylcjviVti1qls6la.jpg

[Vojnik]

I think half of Turkey is. The western side.

[orangepulp]

The land of Turkey was always know as Asia Minor, only about 3% of Turkeys land lies in Europe, so it is a Eurasian country in the geographical sense.

[Corvus]

I think half of Turkey is. The western side.

But it`s not the half. According to my knowledge it`s only the small piece
of land western of the Bosporus.
Or do you count the immigrants from Turkey spread all over "western Europa".

[Albion]

Occupying east Thracia doesn't make them a part of Europe. If occupying a small area of land in another continent did that then Britain would be a part of every continent. :rolleyes2:

[Mordid]

Oh no, not this thread again...

[lepa]

Only small part of Turkey is in Europe- Eastern Thrace, which is bulgarian land in denial.

[Aivap]

How can anyrone vote "Neither Europa or Asia"?

[Aramis]

How can anyrone vote "Neither Europa or Asia"?

I did. Turkey is obviously not European. But let's be honest, neither are they on the same cultural level as Iran (the islamic republic), Saudi Arabia or Egypt.

[Olaska]

Yes I think it is, its a very nice country, lovely beaches! :D

[Loki]

How can anyrone vote "Neither Europa or Asia"?

Because geographically Turkey has always been seen as a "grey area" (we were taught that in schools) - neither Europe proper nor Asia proper, sort of inbetween.

[Europa]

Well politically they are considered part of Europe. Geographically they officially have a small piece of landmass in continental Europe. Culturally, it's up for debate.

I agree with the above.:coffee:

[riverman]

How can anyrone vote "Neither Europa or Asia"?

Easy, it's sort of inbetween the middle east and other asian countries, and with the Ottomans etc. there is some European cultural relativism.

[Queen B]

No, it isn't.

[Mosov]

It's Middle East 'lite' lol

[Onur]

Turkey is neither European nor an Asian country.

Just as represented by our geographical position in the world, Turkish people both have oriental and occidental elements in their culture. So in that sense, i can say that Turkey is an Eurasian country.

I am also quite happy to have this kind of culture. You might consider that as a bad thing but to me, having both oriental and occidental culture is an advantage and a privilege. Thats why our culture today is so rich, having influenced from many different elements. Turkey is an heaven for any ethnocultural research, whether about food, music, clothing, language, rural customs, superstitions etc. you name it.

I mean, you can see eastern Roman elements on a historical building, then turn the corner, you hear Balkan music, then go straight, you see mystical dervishes with sufi beliefs or enter a lodge of Alevi/Bektashi sect, you see their dances, quite same as shamanic, tengrist old Turkic religion or go to yoruks in aegean anatolia mountains, you can see them still using central Asian Turkic tamgas on their graves. I didn't even counted 1% of it, i can continue like that :)


Turkey is a semitic hellhole.
Thanks for the info, i didn't know that Turks are semitic !!! :confused:

[Aivap]

I did. Turkey is obviously not European. But let's be honest, neither are they on the same cultural level as Iran (the islamic republic), Saudi Arabia or Egypt.

Egypt is in Africa.

But if we speak of middle east they exist enormous differences among adjoining countries, for example Jordan can't be compared to Saudi Arabia, and Israel can't be compared to Iraq. They are all culturally different.

[Leliana]

Well, they did have a great impact on European history...
...a throughout negative one, I want to add. :rolleyes:

Turks are Asian people who are descending from the Asian tribe of Turk people who live in Azerbaidschan and Turkmenistan for the major part and from Anatolian tribes for the minor part. Turkey belongs to Asia in all imaginable aspects.

http://haus-und.heimat.eu/geographie/bilder/europa_grenze.jpg

[brunette]

3 percent of it is in Europe.

[brunette]

The hint of what part is in my icon, Pontus obviously.

[rashka]

I never considered them to be "European". I went to their stores and they had a Middle Eastern flair.

The poll does not specify by "Asian". I don't think it is a complete poll.

[Supreme American]

NO! Turkey does not belong to Europe! The turks, are a completely alien people to the white indigenous people of Europe, you can certainly observe from their behaviour and appearance. Turkey is a semitic hellhole.

Culturally they aren't European whatsoever.

[Supreme American]

...a throughout negative one, I want to add. :rolleyes:

Turks are Asian people who are descending from the Asian tribe of Turk people who live in Azerbaidschan and Turkmenistan for the major part and from Anatolian tribes for the minor part. Turkey belongs to Asia in all imaginable aspects.

http://haus-und.heimat.eu/geographie/bilder/europa_grenze.jpg

Unfortunately, the Crusaders failed to kick the Turkish invaders out.

[Benacer]

...a throughout negative one, I want to add. :rolleyes:

Turks are Asian people who are descending from the Asian tribe of Turk people who live in Azerbaidschan and Turkmenistan for the major part and from Anatolian tribes for the minor part. Turkey belongs to Asia in all imaginable aspects.

http://haus-und.heimat.eu/geographie/bilder/europa_grenze.jpg

But then, certain European countries such as Hungary and Bulgaria have their founding history inspired on ancient Central Asian tribes. :eusa_eh: I don't see how that makes them any less European. And of course, "negative impact" is merely an opinion, it really is up to the observer to judge. They were a power to be considered in all major European affairs and were involved in many of the greater European wars.

[StonyArabia]

Unfortunately, the Crusaders failed to kick the Turkish invaders out.

The Crusaders attacked the Byzantines because they belonged to a different church ironically. However it was the Byzantines who imported the Turks into their relam often using them against the Arabs, and then the Turks simply ended the Byzantines once their Seljuk brothers adopted Islam. Christianity was never united

[Loddfafner]

Turkey is the successor state of Byzantium. If the Byzantine Empire was a European phenomenon, then so is Turkey. It occupies much of the historic territory of Greece and of Armenia, so if those countries are European then so is Turkey. It has been a player in the European interstate system and is certainly relevant to European culture, and not always in a bad way. Though it has played the role of the Other to Europe, I don't think it is wise to dogmatically exclude the comparisons that we might find if we categorize it as European, or at least treat that as an open question.

Turks I've worked with looked and behaved like Southern Europeans, and were resolutely secular. Negative traits and also exotic features I associate with Turkey are found in the countries to its north.

[Gaztelu]

It is neither Asian nor European.

It is simply Anatolian.

[Joe McCarthy]

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/66/Osman.jpg/280px-Osman.jpg

The nucleus of the Ottoman Empire, and thus of modern Turkey, is the above. Osman I, founder of the Ottoman Empire, leading Ghazi warriors who settled in Anatolia due to Mongol incursions driving them out of Persia and Turkistan. I dare say there is prescious little European about this bunch.

[StonyArabia]

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/66/Osman.jpg/280px-Osman.jpg

The nucleus of the Ottoman Empire, and thus of modern Turkey, is the above. Osman I, founder of the Ottoman Empire, leading Ghazi warriors who settled in Anatolia due to Mongol incursions driving them out of Persia and Turkistan. I dare say there is prescious little European about this bunch.

Osman I looked Mongoloid and so did his armies, they were basically Turkmen tribes from Turkmenistan. The Ottoman dynasty began to look more European/Anatolian due to their intermarriage with European/Anatolian/Caucasus women.

However the Central Asian genetic impact is rather weak shown by most scientific and genetic studies, it's simply that the locals moved from one culture and langauge to another it was a cultural transition.

[Joe McCarthy]

Osman I looked Mongoloid and so did his armies, they were basically Turkmen tribes from Turkmenistan. The Ottoman dynasty began to look more European/Anatolian due to their intermarriage with European/Anatolian/Caucasus women.

However the Central Asian genetic impact is rather weak shown by most scientific and genetic studies, it's simply that the locals moved from one culture and langauge to another it was a cultural transition.

The key factor here is that though the Ottomans 'changed race' as Spengler put it, they remained Turks in identity. They didn't get subsumed into the preexistent pool. Rather, they imposed themselves on it. The modern Turk is the product of Osman and the Borg-like assimilation policies of him and his successors.

[riverman]

Who voted that it's part of Europe, is there some reasoning behind this? I've never heard that Turkey was part of Europe.

[Foxy]

For me it's Asia, and as an other user wrote, the fact that they occupy Asia Minor does not make Turks European.


But then, certain European countries such as Hungary and Bulgaria have their founding history inspired on ancient Central Asian tribes. :eusa_eh: I don't see how that makes them any less European.

Hungary and Bulgaria have both absorbed a lot of European blood, today they look European and culturally, due also to their geographical position, they have received European influences from every directions.
You really can't compare Hungary with Turkey.

Budapest
http://www.google.it/search?hl=it&rlz=1C1GGGE_itIT394IT394&q=budapest&ix=seb&ion=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.,cf.osb&biw=1280&bih=685&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbm=isch&source=og&sa=N&tab=wi&ei=-nN1T8DzFIXUtAbLr9zDAw

Istambul
http://www.google.it/search?hl=it&rlz=1C1GGGE_itIT394IT394&q=istambul&ix=seb&ion=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.,cf.osb&biw=1280&bih=685&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbm=isch&source=og&sa=N&tab=wi&ei=BHR1T7zIJY3jtQalhYHDAw

Europe & Asia at first glance...

[orangepulp]

For me it's Asia, and as an other user wrote, the fact that they occupy Asia Minor does not make Turks European.


The way you wrote that sentence is as if Asia Minor is European territory, geographically Asia Minor is Western Asia not Europe hence why it is called Asia Minor. Just because Greeks occupied those lands at some point in history, it doesn't make Asia Minor European land. Another point, present day Turks are dominantly preTurkic, we don't genetically know what the native population of Asia Minor was like but genetic tests show that Turks cluster similarly with other West Asians such as Armenians, Georgians, Assyrians, Kurds, Persians only with a minor Turkic input. So they are just as much native to the region as other West Asians.

[Mordid]

Part of Turkey is in Europe. Most of Istanbul is in Europe, and everything West of that. The rest is in Asia. Most of Turkey is in what is called 'Asia Minor'.

[Anarch]

NO! Turkey does not belong to Europe! The turks, are a completely alien people to the white indigenous people of Europe, you can certainly observe from their behaviour and appearance. Turkey is a semitic hellhole.

Turkey is neither semetic nor a hellhole. Turkey is the most economically, socially and politically advanced of the Turkic societies. However, as you've correctly observed, they are not European.


Well, they did have a great impact on European history, and were rather relevant geopolitically in Europe until WWI. Culturally they are very distinct, however, so I am quite mixed on this.

There's nothing to be mixed about. Turks killed and enslaved millions of Europeans, becoming the nemesis of Europe that very significantly helped us forge a common identity. The Ottoman Empire collapsed at the end of WWI and was carved up by Europeans, and Kemal Atatürk took over what was left and forcibly secularised it and modernised it in line with modern (i.e. Western) principles. Its people, however, remain Muslim and Turkish, and therefore most definitely not European.


Well politically they are considered part of Europe. Geographically they officially have a small piece of landmass in continental Europe. Culturally, it's up for debate.

I'm sure the Greeks and Cypriots would agree. They, by the way, are most definitely European.


But then, certain European countries such as Hungary and Bulgaria have their founding history inspired on ancient Central Asian tribes. :eusa_eh: I don't see how that makes them any less European. And of course, "negative impact" is merely an opinion, it really is up to the observer to judge. They were a power to be considered in all major European affairs and were involved in many of the greater European wars.

The destruction of the Byzantine Empire, the invasion, occupation and enslavement of the European Balkans, the invasion of Italy, Romania, Hungary, Slovakia, Poland and Corsica is testament enough to their 'negative impact', as you so diplomatically decided to label it. There is no comparison with the thoroughly racially and culturally absorbed peoples of Hungary and Bulgaria. This is not a matter of opinion. For fourteen hundred years, Islam has been an existential threat to Europe. For a fair amount of that time, that threat has been in the form of the Turks.


Turkey is the successor state of Byzantium. If the Byzantine Empire was a European phenomenon, then so is Turkey. It occupies much of the historic territory of Greece and of Armenia, so if those countries are European then so is Turkey. It has been a player in the European interstate system and is certainly relevant to European culture, and not always in a bad way. Though it has played the role of the Other to Europe, I don't think it is wise to dogmatically exclude the comparisons that we might find if we categorize it as European, or at least treat that as an open question.

Turks I've worked with looked and behaved like Southern Europeans, and were resolutely secular. Negative traits and also exotic features I associate with Turkey are found in the countries to its north.

Turkey annihilated and supplanted Byzantium. Your personal impression of westernised Turks does not alter the fact that they are not European. There are more than a handful of thoroughly westernised Japanese in Greater Europe (by which I mean Europe and its predominantly European-descended colonies) and they are certainly not European. Russia being a European nation is an open question. Turkey is not.

[cmd_]

No, it is not part of Europe. Only 3%(?) of the land is.


Turkey is a semitic hellhole.Really? I didn't know that. Thanks mr. knowledge man!


Turks are Asian people who are descending from the Asian tribe of Turk people who live in Azerbaidschan and Turkmenistan for the major part and from Anatolian tribes for the minor part. Turkey belongs to Asia in all imaginable aspects.The Anatolian Turkish (of modern definition), are native peoplem We are predominate Caucasoids with very little mongoloid admix. However, this will soon fade away in each new generation to come, we're becoming more racially pure.

The only alien about us, is our language. Our race, our culture has nothing to do with central or east Asia. Only delusional Turanists believe so.

[brunette]

No, it is not part of Europe. Only 3%(?) of the land is.

Really? I didn't know that. Thanks mr. knowledge man!

The Anatolian Turkish (of modern definition), are native peoplem We are predominate Caucasoids with very little mongoloid admix. However, this will soon fade away in each new generation to come, we're becoming more racially pure.

The only alien about us, is our language. Our race, our culture has nothing to do with central or east Asia. Only delusional Turanists believe so.

F yeah, I agree 100 percent.

[Mosov]

@Anarch

Wtf mate? I never said that lol

[Anarch]

@Anarch

Wtf mate? I never said that lol
My apologies for misquoting you. It got complicated :p

[Mosov]

I think asking if any group of people/nation is European is a bit black and white. One has to divide into three categories.

Culturally/Historically European
Geographically European
Politically European

[bella1407]

No it`s part of Asia

[Corvus]

In the meantime I came to the conclucsion that it is an Eurasian country. It is belonging to both continents but only partially. It is a kind of special status

[Damião de Góis]

It's transcontinental like Russia.

[Arthas]

Anatolia is a part of Europe.

Unfortunately though, the vast majority of its inhabitants are not European.

[Hochmeister]

Kazakhstan also has a part of European land. But, LOL, Kazakhstan isn't Europe.
To be a European does mean to share the European culture, Asian guest workers are not Europeans either, but they are located in Europe too.

[morski]

Anatolia is a part of Europe.


Not.

[Dengizik]

Not.

Ai siktir.

[Siberian Cold Breeze]

No thanks..Never

[Peyrol]

Nope. It's part of south-west Asia (''Mideast'') geographically, and culturally a ''bridge'' between Mideast and some balkan states.

[legolasbozo]

i'm really wondering, cyprus is a part of europe?

[Corvus]

i'm really wondering, cyprus is a part of europe?

Some say Israel is a part of Europe too. Same with Kazakhstan and Armenia. All their national teams are eligible for European Championships. Europe is an elastic term. It is not tied to strict geographical boundaries.

[Onur]

In the meantime I came to the conclucsion that it is an Eurasian country. It is belonging to both continents but only partially. It is a kind of special status

It's transcontinental like Russia.
After 10s of different "Turkey is European or not" threads with 1000s of responses and nonstop arguments about that during the past year, finally some people started to understand what is Turkey.

Thanks to both of you ;)

[Insuperable]

It's transcontinental like Russia.

Only geographically since the emphasis here I guess is not solely on that. To put Russia and Turkey in the same sentence is a blasphemy.

Using similar definition Turkey would be more European than Australia and the United States.

[Damião de Góis]

Only geographically since the emphasis here I guess is not solely on that. To put Russia and Turkey in the same sentence is a blasphemy.

Yes of course, aren't we talking about Geography here? What else is to be taken into account?


By similar definition Turkey is more European than Australia and the United States.

Of course it is, Australia and United States are on other continents.

[Insuperable]

Yes of course, aren't we talking about Geography here? What else is to be taken into account?



Of course it is, Australia and United States are on other continents.

If we are talking about geography solely fine by me but it is my impression that Nordlicht was not thinking about geography as the sole factor.
If he was than my apologies.

[Partizan]

I guess members like Solin talk about historical and cultural part. Apart from 3% of Turkey being in Europe, Anatolia hosted many European tribes in antiquity. Ancient Hellenes, Galatians, Phrygians, Romans and more. However, for around 1000 years, Oghuz Turks are the dominant ones, which we Turks rather prefer link ourselves to.

As you can see, Anatolia is transcontinental, historically and culturally.

[finþaų]

Most of it is not.

[Damião de Góis]

If we are talking about geography solely fine by me but it is my impression that Nordlicht was not thinking about geography as the sole factor.
If he was than my apologies.

Europe is a continent, and i thought continents were defined by geography. Unless some people don't consider Bosnians to be Europeans but consider Uruguayans to be, but i'm not sure about what other people take into account to define continents. I only take geography.

[Peyrol]

Culturally, also most part of Mideast was ''western'' until 700 A.D. (Arabic expansion)...

[Insuperable]

Well if we are talking about geography the answer should be quite simple - it is a transcontinetal country. I simply assumed that if we take solely geography for this to define it would be quite a lame thread.

[legolasbozo]

Some say Israel is a part of Europe too. Same with Kazakhstan and Armenia. All their national teams are eligible for European Championships. Europe is an elastic term. It is not tied to strict geographical boundaries.

not beat around the bush, i m asking cyprus is a part of europe? Culturally, geographically, politically? Or your criterias about "being europe" is just religion?

[Damião de Góis]

not beat around the bush, i m asking cyprus is a part of europe? Culturally, geographically, politically? Or your criterias about "being europe" is just religion?

It's not geographically, don't know about the rest.

[Incal]

Well then, Holland must be a caribbean country since it has those tiny spots Aruba, Curaçao and Bonaire in the west indies.

[Dengizik]

Well then, Holland must be a caribbean country since it has those tiny spots Aruba, Curaçao and Bonaire in the west indies.

:picard2:

:picard1:

http://at.unp.im/wp-content/uploads/2010/03/Third-party-facepalm.jpg

[legolasbozo]

Well then, Holland must be a caribbean country since it has those tiny spots Aruba, Curaçao and Bonaire in the west indies.

i m suspicious about you ever checked european map.

İ'm not asking holland, denmark or england is european country, i m asking Cyprus.

[B01AB20]

Well then, Holland must be a caribbean country since it has those tiny spots Aruba, Curaçao and Bonaire in the west indies.

and Spain is an african country with our Canary Islands in the deep of african coast.

Well, it was true what they say after all :D.

[Incal]

i m suspicious about you ever checked european map.

İ'm not asking holland, denmark or england is european country, i m asking Cyprus.

I wasn't addressing you to start with.

Second, Cyprus is benefited by its geography being an Island, that way it doesn't have borders with the Middle East. Thou I'd consider Cyprus in some kind of limbo geographically speaking, its people are definitely European/Western oriented. Same with Malta.

[legolasbozo]

I wasn't addressing you to start with.

Second, Cyprus is benefited by its geography being an Island, that way it doesn't have borders with the Middle East. Thou I'd consider Cyprus in some kind of limbo geographically speaking, its people are definitely European/Western oriented. Same with Malta.

İt doesn't have borders with middle east!!! Omg, according to you Turkey is middle eastern so Greece and Bulgaria too, hahahahaha.

-cyprus is european
+But there are native turks in cyprus, not immigrants, are they european too?
-Nooo, they are not european culturally!!

Ok, no more argue with you.

[Damião de Góis]

-cyprus is european
+But there are native turks in cyprus, not immigrants, are they european too?
-Nooo, they are not european culturally!!

Ok, no more argue with you.

Europe maps don't inculde Cyprus.

[Gaijin]

rBoBTdh9oa4

[legolasbozo]

Europe maps don't inculde Cyprus.


that's what i am trying to say, but it is really weird that cyprus is not in europe but they took over EU presidency in 2012, Turkey is not even in Europe but we are member candidate for European Union. :confused::loco:

[Damião de Góis]

that's what i am trying to say, but it is really weird that cyprus is not in europe but they took over EU presidency in 2012, Turkey is not even in Europe but we are member candidate for European Union. :confused::loco:

EU is not a geographical entity, but a political union.. kind of like UEFA, which Israel is a part of. I've heard talks of inviting Morocco to EU as well...

[Partizan]

rBoBTdh9oa4

A part-Jew, part-Gypsy (http://www.rferl.org/content/Name_Sarkozy_Hugely_Popular_Among_Roma_In_Eastern_ Europe/2159784.html) says it :rolleyes:

[Incal]

İt doesn't have borders with middle east!!! Omg, according to you Turkey is middle eastern so Greece and Bulgaria too, hahahahaha.

-cyprus is european
+But there are native turks in cyprus, not immigrants, are they european too?
-Nooo, they are not european culturally!!

Ok, no more argue with you.

Then what are Syria, Irak and so forth? Oceania I guess.

[legolasbozo]

Then what are Syria, Irak and so forth? Oceania I guess.


Your criterias for "being european" culturelly, ethnically, politically, geographically right? Than can you show any clue about these countries relation with Europe?

[Graus]

The Turks were always and will always be aliens to Europe.

[Lathander]

No,Turkey is not a european country for sure!

Geographically not,linguistically not,culturally not.The best word for Turkey and turks is "west asian"

[legolasbozo]

The Turks were always and will always be aliens to Europe.

Don't worry, all i care is football. Schalke-Galatasaray, nice draw. You gonna see aliens :coffee:

[Gaijin]

...Turkey is not even in Europe but we are member candidate for European Union. :confused::loco:

"...Turkey is not even in Europe..."
Your words...

Anyway, Turkey has been awaiting for an open door, since 1987.

EU is not a geographical entity, but a political union.. kind of like UEFA, which Israel is a part of. I've heard talks of inviting Morocco to EU as well...

The EU is Geo-political.
Morocco was instantly rejected in 1987.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/timeline/6e785769cd195c835b516ab90c62c328.png


A part-Jew, part-Gypsy (http://www.rferl.org/content/Name_Sarkozy_Hugely_Popular_Among_Roma_In_Eastern_ Europe/2159784.html) says it :rolleyes:

Hehe, I didn't know Sarkozy had a gypsy name.
The discussion within the video is quite interesting, nonetheless.

[Graus]

Don't worry, all i care is football. Schalke-Galatasaray, nice draw. You gonna see aliens :coffee:

Such a thing as a nice draw doesnt exist.

[Hesperión]

The modern concept of Europe is irrelevant since it doesn't define any historical and spiritual unity or continuum. Europe is just a club of merchants without any meaningful defined boundaries.

So whether Turkey is or not European is irrelevant and up to how each single individual wants to see it.

[legolasbozo]

My

"...Turkey is not even in Europe..."
Your words...

Anyway, Turkey has been awaiting for an open door, since 1987.


The EU is Geo-political.
Morocco was instantly rejected in 1987.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/timeline/6e785769cd195c835b516ab90c62c328.png

take off your shoes and tell me honestly, Cyprus is european or not one way or another? İ don't mean European Union. i guess you got me clear. Culturally, geographically etc. All anti-turks claim that turks are not european. i m definitely agree with them, but according to you cyprus is european in all any aspects. And balcans are european or not? Because when you deceptive and hypocrite peoples talk about "Turks" , balcan countries belongs to your holly european culture, they are your allies but when things changes, when we talk about immigrants, labor, unemployement stuff and like that they are just piece of s**. You treated Romanians, bulgarians, albanians, polish like a rat, pimp, criminal. So i can't imagine, whether if had we never ever existed, what would you do.

[ficuscarica]

It is quite obviously fully non-European. The votings show this as well. Technically it is part of Asia, culturally part of the Middle East.

This question is similar to asking: "Is a wolf pack part of the sheep flock just because it has kept killing and attacking the sheeps for centuries?"

[Gaijin]

take off your shoes and tell me honestly, Cyprus is european or not one way or another?

I didn't say anything about Cyprus.
My opinion remains neutral, without a vote. Both for Turkey and Cyprus.


All anti-turks claim that turks are not european. i m definitely agree with them, but according to you cyprus is european in all any aspects.

Wow, hold the horses there...
I'm not anti-Turk, if that's what you are insinuating.
I didn't even express anything against Turkey or Turks. Much less did I manifest my views towards the country as a (Non)European state.

Again, I didn't say a thing about Cyprus.


And balcans are european or not? Because when you deceptive and hypocrite peoples talk about "Turks" , balcan countries belongs to your holly european culture, they are your allies but when things changes, when we talk about immigrants, labor, unemployement stuff and like that they are just piece of s**. You treated Romanians, bulgarians, albanians, polish like a rat, pimp, criminal. So i can't imagine, whether if had we never ever existed, what would you do.

I don't know much about Eastern Europe. In fact, I don't really think much about them ..
(Greeks are great people though, couldn't care less about the rest.)

Either way, it seems to me that you have a problem against them, for bringing them in into discussion.
This thread is about Turkey.

PS: I think your questions were misdressed to me.:D

[MfA_]

Turks have been a part of Europe geographically since the arrival in the eleventh century; economically since the expansion of trade routes in the sixteenth century; and diplomatically since the inclusion of the Ottoman Empire in the Concert of Europe in 1856.. They were separated by religion, culture and politics, and they were constantly at war..

In a nutshell Turkey and Europe is undivided but not united at the same time.. Either you accept this or keep butthurt-state, these were for both sides..

[Hesperión]

The EU is Geo-political.
Morocco was instantly rejected in 1987.Morocco nowadays enjoys a free trade agreement with the EU that's more advantageous than being a member of the EU, since they don't have to comply with the complex and often unnecessarily expensive bureacratic production regulations that EU members have to comply with.

[Salem]

Turkey is Turkish.

[Onur]

not beat around the bush, i m asking cyprus is a part of europe? Culturally, geographically, politically? Or your criterias about "being europe" is just religion?

Europe maps don't inculde Cyprus.
After Cyprus became an EU member, it magically appeared on maps of Europe. Turkey was present in the old Euro coin design but EU even changed the design of Euro coins back in 2007 by totally excluding Turkey and adding Cyprus on it by altering the geography, pulling the island from Syrian and Lebanese coasts and showing it like it`s supposedly close by the Greece.

This was a good example of what Europe and EU is; a purely political nonsense, never reflects the reality. Here i found an article from google;


Turkey cut out of new euro coins map
Member states have modified the original version of a new euro coin design - already in circulation - by cutting Turkey off the map aimed at representing larger Europe.

Initially, the European Commission had proposed to change the map of Europe currently seen on the ten-cent to two-euro coins into a larger one going east to the Caspian Sea and including Turkey, the Financial Times wrote on Tuesday (25 September).

But while it does go further East and includes part of Russia, the map on the "new" euro does not include Turkey.

But some see the removal of Turkey from the new euro coin as politically motivated.

"The council [the member states' body] has deliberately and secretly wiped Turkey from the new face of the euro", said Marco Cappato and Marco Pannella, Italian Liberal MEPs, in a statement.

"Dictatorships, such as Belarus" do figure on the new euro coins' map, but not "a democratic country like Turkey with whom accession talks are ongoing", they said.

The current euro coin shows a map of the EU as it used to be before 12 new countries joined in enlargements in 2004 and 2007.

Consequently, a new design was agreed upon in 2005 "to reflect an enlarged EU" and "to avoid to have to change the design too frequently", the commission said.

http://euobserver.com/economic/24840

[Queen B]

not beat around the bush, i m asking cyprus is a part of europe? Culturally, geographically, politically? Or your criterias about "being europe" is just religion?

Culturally and politically, yes, geographically, no.

[Albion]

Europe maps don't inculde Cyprus.

It is, on most maps from the UK anyway. We also include that bit of Kazakhstan, Northern Georgia and Turkey's scrap of European land.


After Cyprus became an EU member, it magically appeared on maps of Europe. Turkey was present in the old Euro coin design but EU even changed the design of Euro coins back in 2007 by totally excluding Turkey and adding Cyprus on it by altering the geography, pulling the island from Syrian and Lebanese coasts and showing it like it`s supposedly close by the Greece.

This was a good example of what Europe and EU is; a purely political nonsense, never reflects the reality. Here i found an article from google;

It's not on there because it's not in Europe and wouldn't fit on the coins.

[Graham]

Turkeys included in some British maps, on others Turkey isn't. Like Encyclopædia Britannica doesn't include Turkey on its website.

http://media-3.web.britannica.com/eb-media/67/367-004-30A41CF4.jpghttp://media-2.web.britannica.com/eb-media/83/1983-004-8030CB3A.jpghttp://media-1.web.britannica.com/eb-media/37/23337-004-B08A4728.jpg

[Beratt]

When I was in primary school i have learned that half of Turkey belonged to Europe.By the way the region has very old historical bagage on itself. The city of the troy is too located at the turkey.

[Hesperión]

Israel has had until not long ago an interest in supporting the accession of Turkey into European Union membership (which it's been pursued by the U.S. on Israel's behalf):


Israel should back Turkey’s quest for membership in the EU. Anchoring Turkey in Europe would strengthen the process of secularization, thereby decreasing the potentially negative influence of extreme religious elements on the Turkish state and society. It would improve the standard of living, reducing the radical Islamic influence on the weakest economic sectors. A Turkey associated with the EU (as well as NATO) would contribute to the Eastern Mediterranean economic and political stability and security, counterbalancing Iran.

The willingness of a country with a predominantly Muslim society to espouse a “Western” system of values, and especially a system of governance based on democracy, the rule of law and peaceful dialogue with its neighbors and partners, constitutes a positive model for other states in the region (though EU membership is certainly not an option for these states). As such, Turkey could prove that it is possible to combine a Muslim (at least a Sunni and moderate Muslim) society with membership in a “Western” organization. Such a partnership and the consequences arising from it should be, from Israel’s point of view, a most welcome development.

Source: Israel Council on Foreign Relations (https://www.google.com/url?q=http://israelcfr.com/documents/issue5_turkey1.pdf&sa=U&ei=bAzhUObHN-jb0QW4t4GQBQ&ved=0CDIQFjAHOAo&sig2=N-282TltRbaX_a-BQJTlzw&usg=AFQjCNH-vk1i0Bt_jAe5nguMigOtglW0Cg) (pdf)

However, more recent developments have made Israel reconsider their support for Turkey's bid.

On a side note, the linked document should help understand what lies behind the "western" concept to which many Jews subscribe, such as the member of this forum Anglojew.

[eeroli]

Turkey is surprise surprise ASIA.

[RussiaPrussia]

I did. Turkey is obviously not European. But let's be honest, neither are they on the same cultural level as Iran (the islamic republic), Saudi Arabia or Egypt.

so is iran which speaks persia and has shia islam

[Žołnir]

Altho i think Turks are alright as people i don't consider them European but neither true Asian. Only small part of Turkey, a broad Carigrad area, is actualy Europe from geographical point of view. I also hope Turkey stays Kemalist. It's the only way. :)

[Pontios]

It is 100% part of Asia, they do not belong in Europe. Take away Constantinople from them and they don't even touch Europe.

[Baldur]

Is Armenia, Azerbaijan and Georgia european then?

[cro magnon]

Western part of Anatolia were easily part of Europe before the Black Sea deluge.

[Lathander]

It is 100% part of Asia, they do not belong in Europe. Take away Constantinople from them and they don't even touch Europe.

But we don't have a place called constantinople:)

[Leliana]

But we don't have a place called constantinople:)
No, you don't have such a place, because your real place are the steppes of Turkmenistan and Azerbaidschan.

[SKYNET]

this is the world

http://www.firewallhardware.it/en/images/world_not_europe.jpg


Europe & not Europe :)

[Vojnik]

this is the world

http://www.firewallhardware.it/en/images/world_not_europe.jpg


Europe & not Europe :)

So western Russia isn't Europe in your opinion?

[SKYNET]

So western Russia isn't Europe in your opinion?



in opinion of a map creator :rolleyes:

[Vojnik]

in opinion of a map creator :rolleyes:

Well you obviously agree with it for you to have posted it.

This is Europe.

http://i47.tinypic.com/al2ovo.png

[Linet]

Are you serious? :eusa_eh:
Of course Some parts of Turkey are European :smilie_flagge3::smilie_flagge12::smilie_flagge21: :smilie_flagge8::smilie_flagge14: etc
.... Smirni and Constantinoupolis will soon be Greek :eyes....
Are you planning to tell us that half our country wont be in Europe :icon_mad:?

Some parts of Turkey are European :chin:...Turks are not :heh:

[Pretan]

Geographical Europe according to Encyclopedia Britannica:

http://media.web.britannica.com/eb-media/39/74839-004-B7AEB5C8.gif

[Vojnik]

Are you serious? :eusa_eh:
Of course Some parts of Turkey are European :smilie_flagge3::smilie_flagge12::smilie_flagge21: :smilie_flagge8::smilie_flagge14: etc
.... Smirni and Constantinoupolis will soon be Greek :eyes....
Are you planning to tell us that half our country wont be in Europe :icon_mad:?

Some parts of Turkey are European :chin:...Turks are not :heh:

Soon? how soon? Greece hasn't got the capability to do such a thing in a thousound years. I would love to see Greece try and occupy Istanbul :icon_lol: It would be hilarious to see how fast you fall.

[Linet]

Good plans need time :strokebeard:

[rhiannon]

I think an argument can be made for either option.

There are aspects of Turkey that still retain a link with Europe. Geographically speaking, Turkey bridges both Europe and Asia. Culturally speaking, Turkey is more Asian, IMO.

[SKYNET]

Well you obviously agree with it for you to have posted it.

This is Europe.

http://i47.tinypic.com/al2ovo.png




geographically they are indeed an Europeans but you'll see cultural differences between both sides if you'll be in Russia for no more than one week, I guess. :)

[Incal]

Some parts of Turkey are European :chin:...Turks are not :heh:

/Thread.

[Hesperión]

Geographical Europe according to Encyclopedia Britannica:

http://media.web.britannica.com/eb-media/39/74839-004-B7AEB5C8.gifThat's geographical but the idea of Europe is not monolithic and it derives largely from the time of the Roman Empire through the concept of Civilisation, back when regions (and peoples) who are not included today in Europe they were part of Civilisation and, conversely, regions (and peoples) who are included today in Europe were not part of Civilisation.

http://www.romanscotland.org.uk/pages/infrastructure/maps/RE395adL.jpg

[Pontios]

Soon? how soon? Greece hasn't got the capability to do such a thing in a thousound years. I would love to see Greece try and occupy Istanbul :icon_lol: It would be hilarious to see how fast you fall.

:lol: We were capable of destroying their empire when we were just slaves. I am sure we can do much more now with weapons. Turkey has more enemies than it can imagine. Just the Kurds that will use the chance to attack them and get some land is enough already. Turkey will be attacked from both sides and ripped up from the inside by the Kurds. It will be hilarious how fast you will fall :lol: We already were close to capturing Constantinople. Just look at where our border between Greece-Turkey is. It is aimed for towards our great city. We try to get till the day the earth is destroyed.

[gregorius]

That's geographical but the idea of Europe is not monolithic and it derives largely from the time of the Roman Empire through the concept of Civilisation, back when regions (and peoples) who are not included today in Europe they were part of Civilisation and, conversely, regions (and peoples) who are included today in Europe were not part of Civilisation.

http://www.romanscotland.org.uk/pages/infrastructure/maps/RE395adL.jpg

why is azerbaijan not on the map? :fponder:

[Hayalet]

We were capable of destroying their empire when we were just slaves.
Eh? Get your facts straight, mister. All you did was to roam in western Anatolia for some time while the Ottoman army was being disbanded. When nationalist Turks formed a new army, you were summarily kicked out. :)

[Nurr]

No it is not part of Europa!!but because of the politics,some influential circles impose such opinion and attitude

[Ivan Kramskoï]

Europe is not something geographic.Being part of Europe needs 2 things :being a white european and posses culture which is European.
Turkey does not absolutely respect the second point and not the first either because even in west turkey many people are european in appearance (descendants of balkans) in the east most not.
So ... no

[Smeagol]

No.

[riverman]

technically much of it is, however currently it isn't

[Bobby Martnen]

3% of it is geographically, but nothing else about it is European.

[Chocolate_Hound]

Compared to actual Middle Eastern countries south of them, I'd say Turkey is pretty European. They always felt more Mediterranean to me than Arab.

[kevinmac]

everyone knows at least half of turkey is europe.

[chinshen]

No, Turkey is mostly in Asia and part of Middle East, only a small part of it is in Europe which is Thrace.

[Tsuin]

No

[Mixdguy17]

From the Western half of Istanbul to its border with Bulgaria and Greece, it is.

[Renekton]

Part of Asia

[Sora]

Again, a huge NO! Only 3%, insignificant part. Even Kazakhstan is more European country than Turkey, cus Kazakhstan has 10% of its lands in Europe

[Mejgusu]

Even Thrace is just geographically European. If you enter Turkey you clearly feel the difference, the vibes from another culture. It is a very nice country, but never was and never will be European.

[Azvarohi]

Geographically it has a part of European soil. Culturally it is Asian, more specifically Middle Eastern/Near East/West Asian.

[gültekin]

MENA

Meanwhile Middle Eastern/Near East/West Asian

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qVx-41aXJBc

[coolfrenchguy]

no ,they are not judeo-christianized, they are muslims and islam was never been and will never been a component of the european culture,turkish itself is an altaic language,97% of his territory is in asia ,with only 3% in europe
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/ba/Lenguas_altaicas.png/280px-Lenguas_altaicas.png


https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/4/47/Turkey-regions.svg/290px-Turkey-regions.svg.png

moyen-orient= middle-east
caucase = caucasus
only the 3%, near of greece in on the european territory

[Voskos]

Culturally it's closer to Greece/Balkans/Italy. From an ethnogenesis perspective it is more related to Turkmenistan and Iran, to a lesser extent Transcaucasian countries.

[placebo]

No

Anatolia & Caucasus have their own thing.